FoodBanter.com - View Single Post

Jeßus[_3_]

In article >,
said...
:
:Jeßus wrote:
:> Doug Freyburger wrote:
<snip>
:> Up until 10000 years ago - which is only a millisecond in terms of
:> evolution - man never ate grass seed (grains).
:
:Take an anthropology course and see some films of hunter gatherer
:cultures. They do eat grains, just tiny amounts compared to civilized
:folks. They may have a loaf of bread the size of a small hamburger bun
:several times in the same year.

That amount would certainly do no harm. Thanks for the correction on my
claim that we didn't eat grains at all until agriculture, I have to
admit I based that on a documentary and nothing more

:The transistion to herding was closer to 20K years ago so in between 20K
:and 10K ago the eating of grain would have gradually increased.

Yep.

:It's still a tiny length of time in terms of evolution. Folks still
:have diabetes from eating high carb foods decade after decade. The
:evolutionary pressure is extremely high because early onset diabetes
:causes very low fertility. There are tribes that span the US/Mexican
:border that weren't separated until a century ago. On one side there's
:unlimited grain in their diet and diabetes rates near 90%. On the other
:side there's root veggies much less carby than potatoes and very low
:diabetes rates.

Indeed, that cause and effect has been demonstrated time and time again
across the world.

:> That only came about due to climate change which prompted the advent of
:> agriculture.
:
:The trigger isn't known.

Again, my cite was a doco on this... ah well.

:Folks went from nomads following the herds to

lanting grain for the herds to eating the grain themselves. The timing
:is suggestive, though. Before 20K years ago there were vast herds of
:grass eaters on the plains near the glaciers. Humans likely drove many
:to extinction before learning to herd the types that were still around.
:As the millenia passed game continued to be less common and the glaciers
:continues to be farther away. What caused what is pretty speculative.
:
:> Thus, we're not really designed for such a diet, although many do manage
:> to be able to eat grains without any obvious issues.
:
:The word obvious is the key. How many people ever go a few weeks grain
:free then add grains back individually to see what happens?

Exactly. I had no idea that I have a grain intolerance (particularly
wheat) until I cut it out of my diet for other unrelated reasons.

After all, it is safe to say most people start eating grains as soon as
they can eat solid food - it is so ubiquitous - so how would one know if
it has any negative impact until you exclude it?

:> I do wonder how many people don't realise that grains may be
:> compromising their health. In my case, I was completely unaware of any
:> intolerance until I went on a low carb diet back in 2003 - that's when
:> it became obvious to me that I have an intolerance to wheat in
:> particular. If I eat just one meal occasionally with wheat in it, I
:> usually get away with it without any symptoms. If I eat more again the
:> next day, the symptoms will manifest themselves. So I pretty much avoid
:> grains, and wheat in particular.
:
:For my it was going on Atkins 21-Jul-1999. I didn't notice any health
:changes until a couple of weeks later the ladies told me I wasn't
:snoring any more, or that when I did snore the volume was low. All the

ther changes weren't apparent until a few months later when I followed
:the sequence and trying grain in the form of gravy with flour in it.
:Boom, symptoms rooled back. Yet it wasn't really symptoms. It was
:really what I had once considered normal but now I was no longer willing
:to tolerate.

I understand what you mean.

:The degree of reaction dropped gradually over the years. After 5 years

f active wheat avoidance and eating very low grain I could eat cream of
:veggie-du-jour soup that had some flour in it and only get some sweating
:in my scalp and some minor indigestion. A month ago after 11 years of
:active avoidance I chanced a slice of pizza including the crust and then
:chewed gum for several hours to push it quickly through the early
:digestion. The symptoms were their but more minor than in years.

Sound like you have a greater intolerance than I do. I can usually get
away with say, a wheat-based pasta dish once in a while, just as long as
I don't continue eating any grains that day, or within the next week.
Even so, it's very rare that I'd eat anything with wheat in it.

I use a lot of chick pea, almond and coconut flours here. More often
than not, with a little trial and error, one can learn to adapt it to
most common things such as muffins, cakes etc. I have not attempted
pasta as yet, but plan to at some stage.

Bread... sigh. How I miss it.
For quite a few years I bought sprouted grain breads, which are
extremely moist and require refrigeration - they're pretty good and in
fact you can come up with delicious things using it - but it's really
not a true replacement for normal bread. I am thinking of experimenting
with sourdough at some point, see what I can come up with.

:> All this means my visits to the supermarket have become very infrequent.
:
:I work in large computer data centers or offices near them so I am a big
:city boy. Food from the wild is a rare treat for me.
:
:> The only packaged/processed foods I buy in a supermarket that come to
:> mind are Ryvitas (rye and oats don't seem to affect me as much).
:
:See if they have Wasa Light Rye. It's lighter and crunchier than those
:dense Ryvitas.

Don't think we get them here in Oz, unfortunately.

:Oats don't bother me but what's ever made from oats
:without wheat other than oatmeal? Oat bread always seems to list wheat
:flour first and oat flour second.

Yeah, wheat seems to be in darn near everything...

:> NB: I do plan to try making my own prosciutto now that we are heading
:> into winter... can't wait!
:
:Color me jealous to have your own smoke house. We have a small
:dehydrator. Completely different scale.

Well, I don't actually have a smoke /house/... at least not yet anyway!
I have a small smoker that I mainly use to smoke trout, but wasn't
planning on smoking the prosciutto as such. From what I've seen,
prosciutto is really just a well aged ham, when you get right down to it
- a ham that costs over $80 per Kilo here, which is all the more reason
to have a go at it myself...

I don't know if you're familiar with Hugh Whittingstall's River Cottage
TV series - but they simply make the ham in the usual way, then hang it
to air cure for several months. And doesn't it look SO good!
That is why I decided to wait until winter kicks in here (not long now -
we've already had a mild frost), I plan to simply hang it in a 'meat
safe' on my back verandah. I might even cheat somewhat to start with,
and buy a small but decent quality ham and then proceed from there, and
see how it goes before going the whole hog (excuse the pun!).

I also use a dehydrator here, although I really don't make the most of
it. Just dried celery and onions so far.

--
The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism
by those who haven't got it - George Bernard Shaw