"TexMex" > wrote in message
...
> Zakhar wrote:
> >>>>>>That would apply to all food borne illnesses, not just those
received
> >>>>>>from eating onions. You could say the same thing about meat, for
> >>>>>>instance.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Yes, very true. There's shit on meat too, that normally comes from
the
> >>>>>animal's intestinal tract.
> >>>>
> >>>>There's more shit on vegetables and mushrooms.
> >>>
> >>>Evidence?
> >>
> >> From a food safety advocacy website:
> >>
> >>While it might seem strange that fruit and vegetables would come
> >>in contact with the human and animal feces that often harbors
> >>pathogenic bacteria, there are many routes by which this can
> >>happen. Wild animals whether small, such as rodents or birds, or
> >>large such as deer, can often gain access to a farm or orchard
> >>during the growing season and can contaminated produce with
> >>their feces and even other animals' feces with which they've
> >>come into contact. The water with which produce comes into
> >>contact while growing should be clean; yet, well water or nearby
> >>streams can become contaminated and rainwater runoff can bring
> >>contamination from land higher up, thereby contaminating the
> >>crops. Lastly, the application of manure from cattle or poultry
> >>can easily introduce pathogens. There are no federal rules or
> >>regulations regarding the use of fresh manure as a fertilizer
> >>for produce. As of February, 1998, voluntary organic standards
> >>for delaying the application of raw manure recommended not
> >>applying it within 60 days of harvest. Yet, E. coli O157:H7 and
> >>Salmonella have been shown to survive for many months in soil.
> >>
> >>The location of the farm or orchard or processing facilities
> >>near other farm animals can also result in contamination. It is
> >>believed that some bacteria can form spores and be blown in dust
> >>onto nearby produce or into water used for rinsing. Birds, as
> >>well, have been know to carry pathogens such as Campylobacter
> >>and E. coli O157:H7, so proximity can be an issue.
> >>
> >>Harvesting introduces the human element. Unclean hands can
> >>contaminate fresh produce with human pathogens such as hepatitis
> >>A. Workers can walk through contaminated dirt and climb up
> >>ladders placing their hands on rungs they have just soiled.
> >>Often, workers sit on their picking bags while taking a break.
> >>Baskets are placed on the ground and can easily get contaminated
> >>soil in them. Thus, previously pristine produce can be
> >>subsequently contaminated during harvest.
> >>
> >>The processing facility itself can be left open to contamination
> >>from dust or animals. Dirt floors can contribute to the risk of
> >>contamination. In the processing shed, produce can be rinsed
> >>with unclean water, whether contaminated by dust or animals or
> >>previous produce passing through the process. Tools such as
> >>filters, knives or fingernails may not be sterilized between
> >>processes or may left in a place where they can again become
> >>contaminated via dust, nonpotable water or animals. A part may
> >>fall on the floor, be picked up and put back into the process
> >>again without being properly cleaned. Lastly, the final
> >>packaging materials, cartons, etc. can be contaminated by
> >>previous fruit or tainted water, by being set on contaminated
> >>ground tainted by manure, or by being transported in a vehicle
> >>that previously held animals.
> >>http://tinyurl.com/vd0z
> >
> > I asked for evidence. This is just a list of "can this and can that".
>
> Take it up with food safety advocates, pendejo estupido. It can and DOES
> happen. Want me to show you lists of outbreaks related to unpasteurized
> juices, unwashed produce, and other vegetarian fare?

I know it happens. Let me remind you:

You wrote:

>>There's more shit on vegetables and mushrooms.

I wrote:

>Evidence?

Let me spell it out. Where's the evidence that there is more shit on
vegetables?

>
> >>>>Mushrooms are grown in shit.
> >>>
> >>>Not true. It might contain shit, but is not shit.
> >>>http://www.americanmushroom.org/compost.htm
> >>
> >>Composted manure is still *manure* no matter how much straw or sawdust
> >>or other material is added.
> >
> > Compost is compost dummy.
>
> Netherlands info...
> Two formulas are in use now, one for horse manure compost and
> one for synthetic (= straw) compost. A tonne of horse manure is
> supplemented with 100 kg of chicken manure and 25 kg of gypsum.
>
> I'll let you do the math and tell me what percentage of that is manure.
>
> The amount of water to be added varies from 200–800 l per tonne.
> This results in 900–1300 kg of compost.
>
> In other words, they make a bunch of shit wet.
>
> For synthetic compost preferably wheat or rye straw is used. Per
> tonne 600–900 kg of chicken manure, 75 kg of gypsum and about
> 5000 l of water are added, resulting in 3000 kg of compost. The
> straw is first mixed with 2/3 of the chicken manure, watered en
> gets heated for 7–10 days. The purpose of this pretreatment is
> to make a product similar to horse manure as it leaves the
> stables.
>
> Again, I'll let you do the math. The straw is a fairy inert part, at
> least bioactively. It's the shit that matters.
>
> http://www.actahort.org/books/172/172_27.htm

This is 20 year-old data, that you've incorrectly / incompletely quoted
(lied about):

"The most important basic material is *straw-bedded* manure. If this is not
available in sufficient quantity, *straw compost* is used."


>
> > It's like me stating it's composted straw.
>
> I would laugh my ass off at you if you did.

Why, it's in the site that YOU quoted, dummy?

>
> > You're nearer the composition of manure than mushroom compost.
>
> You ARE compost, shithead.

Use you own jokes dummy.

>
> >>>>Birds fly over the fields and drop loads indiscriminately. Farm
> >>>>workers relieve themselves in the fields as they collect the produce.
> >
> > Etc.
> >
> >>>You tosser, surely you can do better than this drivel.
> >>
> >>See above, ******.
> >
> > Still drivel.
>
> You lack (a) the intelligence and (b) the information required to
> overcome the burden of proof offered. That's not a compliment -- I got
> the information from an activist site rather than a technical one.

You haven't got any evidence. You got the information from a non-technical
activist site, and expect it to be used as evidence?

>
> >>>>>>There's a message here though. I hear a lot of people espousing
> >>>>>>vegetarian diets because they think it will protect them from food
> >>>>>>poisoning. Not true.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>It won't protect them, but generally will reduce the risk.
> >>>>
> >>>>Ipse dixit. Raw faddists are at higher than average risk of food-borne
> >>>>illness, especially when sprouts are consumed.
> >>>
> >>>THAT does not follow,
> >>
> >>Which would be "non sequitur," not "ipse dixit."
> >>
> >>
> >>>or "Ipse dixit" as you arrogantly claim.
> >>
> >>My claim was supported with two links, so I beg to differ that it's ipse
> >>dixit.
> >>
> >>
> >>>Raw food has never been mentioned.
> >
> > It's a red herring.
>
> No, it isn't. It's apropos since your claim is that vegetarian diets are
> inherently safer. That is simply not the case.

Generally they are.

>
> > READ what I wrote dummy "generally will reduce the risk".
>
> Ipse dixit.

Pixie and Dixie.

>
> >>Vegetarianism, though, was. Raw faddists comprise a segment of the
> >>veg-nism. The issue the OP raised was vegetarianism and food safety. My
> >>remark was apropos, dickhead.
> >>
> >>>READ what I wrote dummy "generally will reduce the risk".
> >>
> >>I did, you smelly cocksucking racist. And your comment is ipse dixit --
> >>an unsupported assertion (or "so you say"). So where's your evidence?
> >
> > You'd say something like "Why don't you go back to the old country?"
> > Wouldn't you, TexMex?
>
> Non sequitur. Stick to the issue and stop playing the race card, you
> filthy bigot.

You started the race thing, remember?

>
> > Most food borne illness is from meat.
> >
> > Start with
> > http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/fdcampy.html
>
> Note the very first sentences:
> When it comes to food poisoning, big outbreaks make headlines.
> E. coli in apple juice and alfalfa sprouts. Listeria in
> cheese...

Finshed the first paragraph with:

"But the most frequently diagnosed food-borne bacterium rarely makes the
news. The name of the unsung bug? Campylobacter."


>
> Well, pendejo, those are all vegetarian foods.

That the second unethical use of a cited reference you've done today, to my
knowledge. Still, you always copied ~~jonnies~~ shitty style. Come to think
of it, are you ~~jonnie~~?

>You've addressed one part
> of a complex issue, but you haven't exactly shown that avoiding meat
> simply reduces one's risks. Even contaminated meat isn't a cause of
> disease in humans when its properly handled and cooked; it's the
> improper handling (e.g., cross-contamination) and undercooking that
> results in food poisoning. The SAME is true for vegetables.

Meat is part of the animal being eaten as much as the shit that spills out
of its intestines during "processing". It's an intrinsic part of the food.

>
> >>I see you didn't bother commenting on the following links. You should've
> >>read them before making such a big fat ass of yourself.
> >>
> >>>>http://www.ncpa.org/iss/reg/2003/pd042103f.html
> >>>>http://www.recordonline.com/archive/2003/08/13/bz13.htm
> >
> > It's about raw food, not about the general vegetarian diet that we were
> > discussing.
>
> Yes, it is. See the OP's post:

Nothing about raw food there tex.

> >>>>>>There's a message here though. I hear a lot of people espousing
> >>>>>>vegetarian diets because they think it will protect them from food
> >>>>>>poisoning. Not true.
>
> No go eat your sprouts, pendejo. Make sure you rinse them very well in
> your chemically-treated water.

I don't eat sprouts (or bean sprouts). As far as I know my water isn't
chemically treated, as it comes from a deep underground aquifer.

>