Your own extracellular fluid contains .9%NaCl by weight, or very roughly
1 tsp table salt/quart of water. Anything more than
that tastes salty. 1 oz or 6 tsp salt/quart tastes quite salty, and is
suitable for brining. 2 oz or 12 tsp salt/quart tastes very salty, and
at some point will make what you are brining taste too salty, especially
if you leave it in the brine a long time.
Cheers,
Kent

Bob Pastorio wrote:
>
> Kent H. wrote:
>
> >
> > Bob Pastorio wrote:
> >
> >>Kent H. wrote:
> >
> >>>Normal saltiness or iso osmolarity occurs with one tsp of table
> >>>salt/quart of brine. 1/4 cup of salt/quart of brine is 12 times normal
> >>>saltiness. That's very salty.
> >>
> >>"Normal" saltiness and iso-osmolarity are utterly irrelevant to the
> >>issue of culinary flavor brining.
> >
> > You are incorrect. You lack the basics about your salt content, and what
> > you eat, as it relates to that.
>
> Is this your idea of a rational reply? You post your opinion, it's
> replied to at some length with reasonable references and you offer an
> unsupported contradiction and a vague and opaque insult in return?
>
> Thanks.
>
> Pastorio
>
> >>The functional capacities of diffusion and osmosis are the issues.
> >>
> >> > Half that or 1 oz table salt per quart of
> >>
> >>>brine is salty enough to brine, and allows you to brine a longer time to
> >>>fully penetrate the fowl or pork you are trying to alter.
> >>
> >>In tests done by Russ Parsons, he established that a a 5% to 7% salt
> >>solution (up to 2/3 cup salt per gallon) was a good level. "How to
> >>Read a French Fry." Good book. And he posts to a mailing list I hang
> >>out on and we've discussed it.
> >>
> >>Alton Brown makes several variant brines that a 1) 2 quarts liquid
> >>to 1/2 cup kosher salt and 1/4 cup sugar. Or, 2) 2 gallons of liquid
> >>to 1 1/2 cups kosher salt and 1/2 cup brown sugar and a 6-ounce
> >>container of frozen orange juice. Or, for brining and braising short
> >>ribs, 3) 1/2 gallon dark beer, 1 quart ice water, 2 quarts beef stock,
> >>1/2 cup red wine, 1 pound brown sugar (ca 2 1/4 cups), 1 cup kosher
> >>salt, mirepoix. This last is brine (without the stock and mirepoix)
> >>and cooking liquid which he suggests reducing to serve with the meat.
> >>Apparently not too salty at this concentration or in reduction. "I'm
> >>Just Here For The Food." Good book.
> >>
> >>Shirley Corriher has another view, she puts a cup of salt into her
> >>somewhat more loosely-defined brine. She says to put the chicken into
> >>a pot just large enough to hold it, put in the cup of salt and ice
> >>water to cover. I just measured what that would be on one of my pots
> >>and it came to around 3 quarts of water. "Cookwise." Great book.
> >>
> >>Penetration doesn't seem to be a problem to these people or to me in
> >>the literally hundreds of chickens and other meats I've brined.
> >>
> >>Brining longer with a lower concentration doesn't seem like a benefit
> >>to me. And others say it doesn't work very well. Here's a quote from
> >>the Weber site that quotes Cook's Illustrated magazine where the
> >>current passion for brining came from:
> >>
> >><<<<<<<<<< quote >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>Low-Salt Brining Doesn't Work
> >>Some people find that flavor brined meat is just too salty for their
> >>tastes. Will a flavor brine still work if you cut the amount of salt
> >>in half? Not according to the November/December 2002 issue of Cook's
> >>Illustrated magazine.
> >>
> >>Cook's brined shrimp, pork chops, and whole chicken in a full-strength
> >>solution and a half-strength solution for 1 hour per pound. After
> >>cooking and tasting, they found that the meats brined at half-strength
> >>were a lot less salty than those brined at full-strength, but the
> >>improvement in moisture content was marginal, at best. In fact, for
> >>shrimp and chicken, Cook's felt that there was no point in flavor
> >>brining at half-strength at all.
> >>
> >>http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/brining.html
> >><<<<<<<<<< end quote >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>
> >>>Sugar adds to
> >>>the solute load, and helps you to attain a curing effect with less salt.
> >>
> >>Flavor brining isn't a curing process. Curing is generally defined as
> >>a preservation process. Brining as done for flavor enhancement at
> >>these concentrations isn't preservative.
> >>
> >>
> >>>I don't think 1/4 cup of sugar makes turkey or ham taste like "lunch
> >>>meat", whatever lunch meat tastes like.
> >>
> >>If you don't know what it tastes like why do you assert it doesn't
> >>taste like it? I don't believe I included ham in my comments, just
> >>turkey. I don't brine cured hams. Processed ones don't need it as it's
> >>already been done. Fresh hams I do as whole roasts that I brine
> >>lightly (concentrated but for a short time), but with very little
> >>sugar. I prefer a glaze. One man's tastes.
> >>
> >>
> >>>I use 1/8 cup table salt, or 1/4 cup kosher salt and 1/4 cup sugar per
> >>>quart of brine with good results and no "lunch meat" characteristic in
> >>>the finished product.
> >>
> >>But, as ever, Everybody'sMMV. I'm glad you like it.
> >>
> >>Pastorio
> >>
> >>
> >>>Bob Pastorio wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Kent H. wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>For one gallon of brine you need 1 cup of sugar, especially with turkey.
> >>>>>You can use half that much salt, one oz. by vol./quart or 1/2 cup if you
> >>>>>want to reduce the salty taste and brine for a longer time.
> >>>>
> >>>>My experience with that much sugar is that it makes the turkey taste
> >>>>like "lunchmeat" rather than a whole-muscle roasted or deep-fried
> >>>>turkey. In addition to the salt and sugar, I use a combination of
> >>>>other seasonings that have no effect on saltiness or sweetness. They
> >>>>include: garlic, sage, thyme, marjoram, lemon zest. Occasionally, I'll
> >>>>add other seasonings if the rest of the meal has some emphasis that
> >>>>would benefit from it - I added tarragon once when the plan was to use
> >>>>Béarnaise as a sauce instead of the more normal gravy. Another time, I
> >>>>added a good bit of lemon juice when some of the accompaniments had
> >>>>fruit in them.
> >>>>
> >>>>I've tested brines in these ratios with 1 gallon water as the base, to
> >>>>which was added:
> >>>>1 cup salt, 1 cup sugar - tasted like "turkey loaf"
> >>>>1/2 cup salt, 1 cup sugar - taste like a school lunch turkey sandwich
> >>>>1/2 cup salt, 1/2 cup sugar - turkey loaf but less strongly flavored
> >>>>1 cup salt, 1/2 cup sugar - firm meat, but tasted processed
> >>>>1 cup salt, 1/4 cup sugar - had a very slightly processed flavor, but
> >>>>it added a nice flavor note and texture was good
> >>>>1 cup salt, no sugar - had the strongest turkey flavor, meat texture a
> >>>>bit more coarse.
> >>>>
> >>>>When I dried the turkey to get a nice pellicle, it was thickest and
> >>>>most noticeable with the most sugar, but it ended up with a distant
> >>>>but detectable sweetness in the skin which I didn't like. Hung the
> >>>>birds in a large cooler and aimed a fan at them to get that shiny, dry
> >>>>surface that makes them so good. One guy's preferences.
> >>>>
> >>>>Everybody's MMV.
> >>>>
> >>>>Pastorio
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>Bob Pastorio wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>mrs_cruella wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I'm considering brining our Thanksgiving turkey this year (normally a
> >>>>>>>12-15 pound bird). I'm a little leary of trying this for the "big
> >>>>>>>day"--but I'm also one of those cooks who tries out new entrees on
> >>>>>>>guests!
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>One of the things that I'm particularly concerned about is the gravy.
> >>>>>>>I have heard from some sources that gravy made from the pan dripping
> >>>>>>>comes out very salty. Has this been your experience?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Yes. The "purge" from a brined turkey is saltier than I like to use
> >>>>>>for a gravy. I make mine from parts bought separately and/or trimmings
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>from other birds.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>>Is brining really worth it? (I cook the dressing in the crockpot,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>so brining
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>wouldn't be an issue there.)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Yes, I think it is. The birds are more moist, more tender, more
> >>>>>>forgiving of temperature variation in the oven and they cook a tad
> >>>>>>more quickly.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>I would welcome any tips, hints, and your favorite brine recipes!
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>1 gallon of water
> >>>>>>1 cup of salt
> >>>>>>1/4 cup sugar (optional)
> >>>>>>seasonings, your usual
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Figure 24 hours for every 6 to 8 pounds of bird.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Cook as usual. I've been cooking them recently in a convection oven no
> >>>>>>hotter than 225F to 160F in the thigh and let them rest for 20 minutes
> >>>>>>or so before carving.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Pastorio