Nancy Young wrote:

> "P.Aitken" > wrote
>
wrote:
>>
>>>Nancy Young wrote:
>
>
>>>>I guess they hadn't gotten around to the lesson where you don't
>>>>order everything on the menu when someone else is paying?
>
>>>He was making sure that they felt free to order whatever they wanted.
>>> Serves him right
>>>
>>>The cost really didn't bother him, rather he was shocked I think he was
>>>expecting the Kids Menu hamburger.
>
>>I think it is weird to take people to dinner, offering to pay, at a
>>restaurant where a lot of the menu items are too expensive and you expect
>>your guests to somehow know they should order only the less expensive
>>items.
>
>
> Adults should know, and kids should too. You take your
> cue from what other people are ordering, it's only polite.
>

How exactly does this work? How does the first person to order - who is
almost never the host - decide what to order? How is this person to know
what the host expects in terms of expenses?

If I treat people to a meal, the point is to enjoy ourselves and, to a
lesser extent, to express my regard for these people through my
generosity. I do not want anyone worrying about what to order or the
cost, I want them to choose what they like and enjoy it. If I cannot
afford it, I don't do it in the first place. That seems pretty simple to me.

> If I'm eating out, I order whatever I want. I don't care if it's
> the 5 most expensive items from column A B & C. It never
> is, but that's not the point. If I'm eating out and someone else
> is paying, yes, I'm careful to order along the lines of what they
> order, pricewise. Or lower. And the number of courses
> they order, as well.

You automatically assume that your host is a cheapskate who cares more
about the cost of the meal than the enjoyment of his guests. I would be
insulted to have my guests think of me that way.

> Never too young to teach children to think of others.

I agree. Better to think of your host as a generous person concerned
with your enjoyment than a pinchpenny who offered to pay for dinner but
does not really want to part with any of his money.

> It
> should be brought to their attention that you might order
> differently when grandpa is paying vs mom and dad.

Why on earth would parents or grandparents take kids to a restaurant
they could not afford? And then expect the kids to figure out that they
really do not want to pay for anything but the cheapest items on the menu?

> It's just manners, that's all.

Saying "it's just manners" is usually - and certainly in this case - a
way of saying that people should do things your way without providing
any valid justification.
>
>>No, guests should not order the most expensive menu item,
>
> And here, you admit there is some line somewhere.

Yes, and the line is just below those most expensive items. Most
restaurants have a few luxury items that stand out in terms of cost -
and I agree that those should be avoided when someone else is paying
(unless it's Donald Trump!). But I repeat, if a host takes people to a
restaurant and then objects to them ordering typical menu items, then it
is totally the host's fault.

> People who don't pay attention to that wind up being the
> ones bitched about who order expensive meals all the time
> then just split the bill with the others at the table, apparently
> unaware everyone is chipping in for their meal.

Totally unrelated. We are talking about a situation where a host has
agreed to pay for your meal. Splitting the bill equally is a different
situation.

I have a strong aversion to cheapness - which is different from having a
limited budget. If you cannot afford something, fine, I have been (and
will be) in that situation many times. Say so, no problem. "We can't go
the Chez Fancy." But trying to play the generous host (by offering to
pay for dinner) and then objecting when your guests take you at your
word is petty and sleazy.

Peter