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Barbecue (alt.food.barbecue) Discuss barbecue and grilling--southern style "low and slow" smoking of ribs, shoulders and briskets, as well as direct heat grilling of everything from burgers to salmon to vegetables. |
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In talking to a co-worker, I've learned there is some method of cramming a
beer can into a whole chicken and cooking if for a bout a day. The co-worker said the chicken is really good, though they never made it themselves so details are missing. I'm *sure* this group knows all about this, but I'm having trouble finding info on it in google. Probably because I'm not serching for the correct term. Can anyone share any info and experiences/tips on this? It sounds interesting to say the least =) Mike |
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![]() "Michael C. Neel" < wrote in message > In talking to a co-worker, I've learned there is some method of cramming a > beer can into a whole chicken and cooking if for a bout a day. The > .. Probably because I'm not serching for the correct > term. Can anyone share any info and experiences/tips on this? It sounds > interesting to say the least =) > > Mike > It's a real gimmicky way to cook a bird, IMHO, Mike. This is generally called "beer-can chicken". There is no advantage in having that beer can in the bird as opposed to a vertical chicken rack. I don't believe the steaming beer in any way effects the flavor of the bird. Just doesn't work. Sort of an urban myth. What does work is spatchcocking, AKA butterflying. The tricky thing about chicken is to get the dark meat done while not overcooking the breasts. Using kitchen shears you can cut out the backbone of the chicken, marinate it and then plop it on a grill or on a smoker. Cooks much more evenly. BTW, no one cooks a chicken all day. There are two ways to go with chicken: you can smoke low (225-250) and slow for about 2 hours, which gives you a lovely smokey product, perfect for sliced chick sammichs. You do get a rubbery skin tho, best discarded. If you want chicken to eat right off the grill, take the pit up to 325-350 for about 45minutes (YMMV) and the skin will crisp nicely. John in Austin |
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Curse me, I just made a big reply to this and accidentally
email-replied rather than following up to the group; apologies. Short form: I cook beer-can chicken on a semiregular basis--less for the "self-basting" idea (I agree that the steaming beer probably doesn't do THAT much, if anything, for flavor or texture) but for the simple pragmatic reason that standing the chickens up takes less room, and I already have a can or so handy from making the injection liquid (beer, oil, and rub). The injection liquid makes for a very pleasant flavor to the bird; I actually don't like drinking beer (sacrelige, I know) but it makes a terriffic spice. Removing the cans can be a bit tricky (the sight of me hopping around the kitchen trying to extract a can from a bird when both are very hot is pretty funny) but it works OK. A standard smoker-load for a good-sized group dinner is a couple racks of ribs, a bunch of sausage, and 2-3 beer-can chickens. I do butterfly chickens for roasting, and it's a terriffic way to get even heat distribution so that everything comes out about the right level of doneness and much faster than a whole bird. I've never tried it on a grill, although it should work just fine (typically when I grill chicken, I want pieces anyway, so I wimp out and just buy a whole cut up fryer or the dubiously-named "Pick of Chick" at the supermarket). When smoking, I usually do go 2-3 hours or sometimes more if convenient. If it's too long, you do get dry chicken despite the injection (a pity). A good long slow-cooked bird wil be tender enough that "carving" is almost a misnomer because it will fall apart (you can just pull the legs off), which makes it less-suitable for bone-gnawing but very good for pulling bits of meat off and dipping them in sauce... mmm. -->VPutz |
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![]() "JakBQuik" > wrote in message ... > > "Michael C. Neel" < wrote in message > > In talking to a co-worker, I've learned there is some method of cramming a > > beer can into a whole chicken and cooking if for a bout a day. The > > > . Probably because I'm not serching for the correct > > term. Can anyone share any info and experiences/tips on this? It sounds > > interesting to say the least =) > > > > Mike > > > It's a real gimmicky way to cook a bird, IMHO, Mike. This is generally > called "beer-can chicken". There is no advantage in having that beer can in > the bird as opposed to a vertical chicken rack. I don't believe the > steaming beer in any way effects the flavor of the bird. Just doesn't work. > Sort of an urban myth. On the other hand...I have a ceramic "cup" shaped like one of those coffee cups for putting on the dash of your car..the cup with the broad base without the "ear" . I sometimes half fill it with a red wine and some fresh herb. Stick it up the rear of the bird on the grilldome (or gas grill..gasp). The chicken does pick up the wine taste and the herbs.Usually comes out purty good. Smells good cookin' too. Jack |
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![]() .. > > On the other hand...I have a ceramic "cup" shaped like one of those coffee > cups for putting on the dash of your car..the cup with the broad base > without the "ear" . I sometimes half fill it with a red wine and some fresh > herb. Stick it up the rear of the bird on the grilldome (or gas > grill..gasp). The chicken does pick up the wine taste and the herbs.Usually > comes out purty good. Smells good cookin' too. > Jack > > I have one of these: http://www.hollandgrill.com/accessor...astinpost.html Works real well. It has a large diameter base, which makes it stable and also protects the chickens butt and legs from direct heat. Spud |
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![]() "Jack Sloan" <wrote > On the other hand...I have a ceramic "cup" shaped like one of those coffee > cups for putting on the dash of your car..the cup with the broad base > without the "ear" . I sometimes half fill it with a red wine and some fresh > herb. Stick it up the rear of the bird on the grilldome (or gas > grill..gasp). The chicken does pick up the wine taste and the herbs.Usually > comes out purty good. Smells good cookin' too. > Jack > Sounds good to me. I never woulda thought you could add some of the taste of the steaming liquid. Learn something new every day. I'll try it, particulary with rosemary and merlot. Thanks, Jack. John in Austin |
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Spud wrote:
> I have one of these: > http://www.hollandgrill.com/accessor...astinpost.html Here is another vertical roaster. I have one for turkey. These things are quite well made and very stable. http://www.spanek.com/ROASTE~1.HTM Dave |
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JakBQuik wrote:
> BTW, no one cooks a chicken all day. There are two ways to go with chicken: > you can smoke low (225-250) and slow for about 2 hours, which gives you a > lovely smokey product, perfect for sliced chick sammichs. You do get a > rubbery skin tho, best discarded. To save the skin, you can slap the chicken into a very hot oven for a short while, it will crisp up the outside. Of course, if part of your goal in cooking it outdoors was to keep from heating up the oven, then that won't help. Brian Rodenborn |
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On 2004-05-26, Dave Bugg <> wrote:
> Spud wrote: > >> I have one of these: >> http://www.hollandgrill.com/accessor...astinpost.html > > Here is another vertical roaster. I have one for turkey. These things are > quite well made and very stable. > http://www.spanek.com/ROASTE~1.HTM Hmm. I guess that sort of thing would work fine, and probably a bit more stable. But heck, $15 for a vertical roaster doohickey vs a couple of bucks for a can of beer that I woulda bought anyway for the injection liquid/mop... gotta go with the can. Don't have to put it away, afterward, either, 'cept for the recycling aspect. But then, I'm a cheap *******. I do admit cans are more unstable, but I've never had one fall over while cooking once you get it upright with its legs stabilizing it a bit. And trust me--it's tasty. -->VPutz |
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Michael C. Neel wrote:
> I'm *sure* this group knows all about this, but I'm having trouble finding > info on it in google. Probably because I'm not serching for the correct > term. Can anyone share any info and experiences/tips on this? It sounds > interesting to say the least =) I'm not sure what you were searching on, because if I type 'beer chicken' (without the quotes) into Google I get a metric whack of sites that describe the whole process. Good luck to you, I have not yet tried this method. |
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On Wed, 26 May 2004 18:28:05 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand
Default User > : >JakBQuik wrote: > >> BTW, no one cooks a chicken all day. There are two ways to go with chicken: >> you can smoke low (225-250) and slow for about 2 hours, which gives you a >> lovely smokey product, perfect for sliced chick sammichs. You do get a >> rubbery skin tho, best discarded. > > >To save the skin, you can slap the chicken into a very hot oven for a >short while, it will crisp up the outside. Of course, if part of your >goal in cooking it outdoors was to keep from heating up the oven, then >that won't help. > >Brian Rodenborn couldn't this be done in your last phase of cooking in the smoker... raise the heat up to crisp up the skin? If so, that would alleviate the turning on the oven... |
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Michael C. Neel wrote:
> In talking to a co-worker, I've learned there is some method of > cramming a beer can into a whole chicken and cooking if for a bout a > day. The co-worker said the chicken is really good, though they > never made it themselves so details are missing. Here's how I do beer while I cook chicken. Simple yet foolproof. 1) Drink a beer or 3. 2) Spatchcock da chicken. 3) Drink more beer while ya cook da chicken. 4) Drink more beer while ya eat da chicken. 5) Belch loudly when ya done with da chicken and you're headin to da fridge for a few more beers. -- -frohe Life is too short to be in a hurry |
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"Victor B. Putz" > wrote in message
news ![]() > I guess that sort of thing would work fine, and probably a bit more > stable. But heck, $15 for a vertical roaster doohickey vs a couple of > bucks for a can of beer that I woulda bought anyway for the injection > liquid/mop... gotta go with the can. Don't have to put it away, > afterward, either, 'cept for the recycling aspect. > > But then, I'm a cheap *******. I do admit cans are more unstable, but > I've never had one fall over while cooking once you get it upright with > its legs stabilizing it a bit. > > And trust me--it's tasty. > > -->VPutz > I've got a chicken roaster from Vick's Flaming Pig: http://www.flamingpigsauce.com. I sell his sauces, and he gave me a roaster to try out. It works very well. I don't sell gadgets, so go ahead and get it from him if you want one. The other down side of a beer can is that odd things can happen to an aluminum can when subjected to corrosive ingredients such as vinegar in bbq sauces and high temperatures. The stainless stell gadgets don't impart a metalic taste to the bird. In my experience, the steaming beer really does make the chicken taste better. There's definitely a beer taste, so that's got to be coming from somewhere. I also have had good success with wine and garlic as the mixture. If you're just worried about the can tipping over, Walmart has a $5 rack that holds the can in place. Lately, I've been brining chicken quarters and haven't gone the beer can route. -- Greg Leman Carolina Sauce Company, Inc. http://www.carolinasauce.com A wide variety of sauces and specialty foods over the web. |
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frohe wrote:
> Here's how I do beer while I cook chicken. Simple yet foolproof. > 1) Drink a beer or 3. > 2) Spatchcock da chicken. > 3) Drink more beer while ya cook da chicken. > 4) Drink more beer while ya eat da chicken. > 5) Belch loudly when ya done with da chicken and you're headin to da > fridge for a few more beers. This is exactly the same recipe I use when I do beer chicken! It's amazing how similar this is to how I do wine when I cook chicken (I also use the same recipe for beef and pork with excellent results). 1) Open a bottle of wine and drink a glass 2) Prepare the meat as appropriate 3) Drink more wine while meat is cooking. 4) Drink more wine while eating meat 5) If wine was sparkling, belch as necessary. Very versatile recipe. Dana |
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The question of how to deal with chicken skin when smoking the bird,
when fully solved, will probably lead directly to a complete solution of the question of the meaning of life. In the meantime, being both philosophically and financially challenged, I've found a handy way of dealing with those leg quarters that show up so often in 10lb bags for about half a buck per pound. It requires a kettle grill, briquettes (I'm only a lump charcoal purist when smoking something that takes longer than 4 or 5 hours), and a charcoal chimney with some surface other than your kettle grill on which you can safely light a new batch of coals while already cooking on the kettle grill. The trick that's working wonders with these leg quarters is to cook them till they're done with the skin on, then pull the skin off, sauce them, and cook them a little more. Leg quarters, remember, aren't only cheap. They also don't suffer a whit from being overcooked. Leaving the skin on for most of the cooking process doesn't seem to stop them from soaking up smoke flavor, and keeps them moist and adds flavor. Discarding the skins near the end of the process means that you don't have to solve the great BBQ mystery, and better yet, even if you *have* solved it, you don't have to deal with the disappointment of seeing your perfectly crisped skin turn to rubber when you re-heat yesterday's chicken in the microwave. These leg quarters reheat every bit as tasy as they were when hot off the grill. I fire up about 1/2 of a Weber charcoal chimney of Kingsford briquettes (I'm mentioning brand names because chimney sizes and briquette properties vary) - about 60 briquettes - and when they're ashed over, I put them on the charcoal grate of the kettle grill on either side, about 30 to a pile. I put 6 unlit briquettes on top of each pile - I'm aiming to extend the ability of this first batch of coals to keep my grill surface at 250 degrees F, and willing to trade off whatever tiny bit of off-flavor might result from the addition of raw coals. Of course, don't throw in raw "Match-Light" coals. I split a fistful of unsoaked hickory chips between the two piles, put the greased grill on top, and set the 8 to 10 leg quarters packed tightly down the center of the grill so that none are directly over the coals. I set the leg quarters skin side up. I let the chicken cook this way for one and a half hours, grill lid closed but all vents wide open, adding another fistful of unsoaked chips after 20 minutes, and another after 40 minutes. When I add the chips I hold the lid of the grill off long enough to let the coals get an extra blast of oxygen - maybe as much as 3 to 5 minutes. Otherwise, coals loving company as they do and these coals being relatively lonely, they tend to peter out. When the chicken has been cooking this way for 1 hour, I light another half-chimney of briquettes (about 60 Kingsford briquettes) and let it ash over. When it's ready, I have a helper lift the grill with the chicken off of the kettle and add the new coals, spreading them and what remains of the old coals evenly across the charcoal grate for direct cooking. This sometimes causes a lively flare-up as chicken grease in the bottom of the kettle ignites. Once I've doused that with the vent-closed lid, I *grill* the chicken direct over these coals for about half an hour, spreading it out over the whole grill surface and turning the pieces frequently (about every 10 minutes). Lid on or lid off during this part of the process, either way, just don't let the coals start to wink out by too much lid-on time. The drumstick part of the leg quarters gets falling-apart tender and pulls up from the end of the bone during this process, that's OK. Then, with tongs and a fork, I remove the skin from the leg quarters - it comes off very easily. (At this point I usually just set the skins in a pile on a unused corner of the grill, the coals are slow by this time). Finally I brush both sides of the chicken with my finishing sauce of choice (I've been using Kraft's newfangled "Brown Sugar" one lately, with good results), cover the grill (all vents open), and let it cook 10 minutes. Then I brush both sides a second time, and let it cook another 10 minutes, with whatever side faced up from the fire, facing down toward the fire this time. This chicken comes out delightful every time - I've never had better. |
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Douglas Barber wrote:
> The question of how to deal with chicken skin when smoking the bird, > when fully solved, will probably lead directly to a complete solution of > the question of the meaning of life. Well, you just need to help me figure out how "chicken skin" leads to "42"... ;-) OK, time to tell the truth - unlike 99.9% of Usenet posts I choose to read, I printed this one out for later reference. Thanks - Dana |
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Michael C. Neel wrote:
> > I'm *sure* this group knows all about this, but I'm having trouble finding > info on it in google. Huh? I did a Google search "beer +chicken" and got over a million hits and, from looking at the first couple of pages, half of them are for "beer can (or butt) chicken". http://tinyurl.com/2r2pr |
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![]() "Lewzephyr" > wrote in message ... > On Wed, 26 May 2004 18:28:05 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand > Default User > : > > >JakBQuik wrote: > > > >> BTW, no one cooks a chicken all day. There are two ways to go with chicken: > >> you can smoke low (225-250) and slow for about 2 hours, which gives you a > >> lovely smokey product, perfect for sliced chick sammichs. You do get a > >> rubbery skin tho, best discarded. > > > > > >To save the skin, you can slap the chicken into a very hot oven for a > >short while, it will crisp up the outside. Of course, if part of your > >goal in cooking it outdoors was to keep from heating up the oven, then > >that won't help. > > > >Brian Rodenborn > > couldn't this be done in your last phase of cooking in the smoker... > raise the heat up to crisp up the skin? If so, that would alleviate > the turning on the oven... That's exactly the way I do it. About 3 hours in the smoker at 250-270 and then convert the smoker to its grill setting and grill for no more than a minute or two and eureka, crispy skin every time. I used this method yesterday and there is a pic on the binary group if your interested. If freezing any chicken, then I would reheat it in the oven every time to achieve a crispy skin. Graeme .. |
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Graeme... in London wrote:
> "Lewzephyr" > wrote in message > ... > >>On Wed, 26 May 2004 18:28:05 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand >>Default User > : >> >> >>>JakBQuik wrote: >>> >>> >>>>BTW, no one cooks a chicken all day. There are two ways to go with > > chicken: > >>>>you can smoke low (225-250) and slow for about 2 hours, which gives you > > a > >>>>lovely smokey product, perfect for sliced chick sammichs. You do get a >>>>rubbery skin tho, best discarded. >>> >>> >>>To save the skin, you can slap the chicken into a very hot oven for a >>>short while, it will crisp up the outside. Of course, if part of your >>>goal in cooking it outdoors was to keep from heating up the oven, then >>>that won't help. >>> >>>Brian Rodenborn >> >>couldn't this be done in your last phase of cooking in the smoker... >>raise the heat up to crisp up the skin? If so, that would alleviate >>the turning on the oven... > > > That's exactly the way I do it. About 3 hours in the smoker at 250-270 and > then convert the smoker to its grill setting and grill for no more than a > minute or two and eureka, crispy skin every time. I used this method > yesterday and there is a pic on the binary group if your interested. If > freezing any chicken, then I would reheat it in the oven every time to > achieve a crispy skin. > > Graeme You can also accomplish this effect in a few seconds with a propane torch. Chicken brulee. |
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On Thu, 27 May 2004 13:20:47 +0100, I needed a babel fish to
understand "Graeme... in London" > : >"Lewzephyr" > wrote in message .. . >> On Wed, 26 May 2004 18:28:05 GMT, I needed a babel fish to understand >> Default User > : >> couldn't this be done in your last phase of cooking in the smoker... >> raise the heat up to crisp up the skin? If so, that would alleviate >> the turning on the oven... > >That's exactly the way I do it. About 3 hours in the smoker at 250-270 and >then convert the smoker to its grill setting and grill for no more than a >minute or two and eureka, crispy skin every time. I used this method >yesterday and there is a pic on the binary group if your interested. If >freezing any chicken, then I would reheat it in the oven every time to >achieve a crispy skin. > >Graeme Ohhh... I went and had a look see..... that looks delicious... got my mouth all watering |
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Dana Myers wrote:
> Douglas Barber wrote: > >> The question of how to deal with chicken skin when smoking the bird, >> when fully solved, will probably lead directly to a complete solution >> of the question of the meaning of life. > > Well, you just need to help me figure out how "chicken skin" leads > to "42"... > > ;-) > > OK, time to tell the truth - unlike 99.9% of Usenet posts I choose > to read, I printed this one out for later reference. Dang, beat me to the punch (line). -- Aloha, Nathan Lau San Jose, CA #include <std.disclaimer> |
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"Graeme... in London" wrote:
> > "Lewzephyr" > wrote in message > ... > > couldn't this be done in your last phase of cooking in the smoker... > > raise the heat up to crisp up the skin? If so, that would alleviate > > the turning on the oven... My only objection to this is that you need that heat for a relatively short time, and a lot of charcoal to achieve it. Of course, with the WSM removing the water pan would get temps up, so it might not need that much. > That's exactly the way I do it. About 3 hours in the smoker at 250-270 and > then convert the smoker to its grill setting and grill for no more than a > minute or two and eureka, crispy skin every time. I used this method > yesterday and there is a pic on the binary group if your interested. If > freezing any chicken, then I would reheat it in the oven every time to > achieve a crispy skin. That would work well for butterflied or chicken parts, not so easily for whole chickens. Grilling those would be a bit tough. All good suggestions though. Brian Rodenborn |
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![]() "Dana Myers" > wrote in message m... > frohe wrote: > > > Here's how I do beer while I cook chicken. Simple yet foolproof. > > 1) Drink a beer or 3. > > 2) Spatchcock da chicken. > > 3) Drink more beer while ya cook da chicken. > > 4) Drink more beer while ya eat da chicken. > > 5) Belch loudly when ya done with da chicken and you're headin to da > > fridge for a few more beers. > > This is exactly the same recipe I use when I do > beer chicken! > > It's amazing how similar this is to how I > do wine when I cook chicken (I also use the > same recipe for beef and pork with excellent > results). > > 1) Open a bottle of wine and drink a glass > 2) Prepare the meat as appropriate > 3) Drink more wine while meat is cooking. > 4) Drink more wine while eating meat > 5) If wine was sparkling, belch as necessary. > > Very versatile recipe. > > Dana Same here Dana except with Jack Daniels. Except I throw in a couple of more #3's. _________ ht_redneck |
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Tyler Hopper wrote:
> "Dana Myers" > wrote in message > m... > >>frohe wrote: >>>Here's how I do beer while I cook chicken. Simple yet foolproof. >>>1) Drink a beer or 3. >>>2) Spatchcock da chicken. >>>3) Drink more beer while ya cook da chicken. >>>4) Drink more beer while ya eat da chicken. >>>5) Belch loudly when ya done with da chicken and you're headin to da >>>fridge for a few more beers. >> >>This is exactly the same recipe I use when I do >>beer chicken! >> >>It's amazing how similar this is to how I >>do wine when I cook chicken (I also use the >>same recipe for beef and pork with excellent >>results). >> >>1) Open a bottle of wine and drink a glass >>2) Prepare the meat as appropriate >>3) Drink more wine while meat is cooking. >>4) Drink more wine while eating meat >>5) If wine was sparkling, belch as necessary. >> >>Very versatile recipe. >>Dana > > Same here Dana except with Jack Daniels. Except I throw in a couple of more > #3's. Truly an amazingly versatile recipe. I'll bet it even works for grillin' veggies. It's almost like world peace. Dana |
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> Huh? I did a Google search "beer +chicken" and got over a million hits
> and, from looking at the first couple of pages, half of them are for > "beer can (or butt) chicken". Yea, but many pages are mostly pics, and the ones that have details are sketchy. Plus the group has provided more helpful info in a few posts than what came back in google. I now know that the restuarant at the end of the universe serves slow cooked chicken with amazing textured skin. I've placed my penny in the bank in anticipition! Mike |
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![]() On 26-May-2004, "Dave Bugg" <deebuggatcharterdotnet> wrote: > Spud wrote: > > > I have one of these: > > http://www.hollandgrill.com/accessor...astinpost.html > > Here is another vertical roaster. I have one for turkey. These things are > quite well made and very stable. > http://www.spanek.com/ROASTE~1.HTM > > Dave I have that set including the skewers, but I can't find the top ring. Don't even remember ever seeing it. I doubt I'd ever use the skewers suspended in a vertical position anyway. I do use the racks from time to time. They eliminate any possibility of my bird sticking to the grate and ruining the looks. In an oven pan it keeps the bird out of the drippings as well. -- M&M ("When You're Over The Hill You Pick Up Speed") |
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"Michael C. Neel" wrote:
> > > Huh? I did a Google search "beer +chicken" and got over a million hits > > and, from looking at the first couple of pages, half of them are for > > "beer can (or butt) chicken". > > Yea, but many pages are mostly pics, and the ones that have details are > sketchy. Generally you get better google hits if you through "recipe" into the search. Brian Rodenborn |
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On Fri, 28 May 2004 18:08:47 GMT, Default User
> wrote: >"Michael C. Neel" wrote: >> >> > Huh? I did a Google search "beer +chicken" and got over a million hits >> > and, from looking at the first couple of pages, half of them are for >> > "beer can (or butt) chicken". >> >> Yea, but many pages are mostly pics, and the ones that have details are >> sketchy. > > >Generally you get better google hits if you through "recipe" into the >search. > Good suggestion. Another tip for searching out recipes: insert the following into your search terms -restaurant -menu That helps prevent getting back a bunch of hits pointing to the web sites of restaurants. -- Kevin S. Wilson Tech Writer at a university somewhere in Idaho "Who put these fingerprints on my imagination?" |
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On Fri, 28 May 2004 14:48:54 -0600, Kevin S. Wilson >
wrote: >Good suggestion. Another tip for searching out recipes: insert the >following into your search terms > >-restaurant >-menu > >That helps prevent getting back a bunch of hits pointing to the web >sites of restaurants. A clarification: Include the hyphen before the two words. They're not bullet points here (which is what they look like). Instead, they're necessary to tell google to ignore those words. -- Kevin S. Wilson Tech Writer at a university somewhere in Idaho "Who put these fingerprints on my imagination?" |
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Kevin S. Wilson > wrote:
> On Fri, 28 May 2004 14:48:54 -0600, Kevin S. Wilson > > wrote: > > >Good suggestion. Another tip for searching out recipes: insert the > >following into your search terms > > > >-restaurant > >-menu > > > >That helps prevent getting back a bunch of hits pointing to the web > >sites of restaurants. > > A clarification: Include the hyphen before the two words. They're not > bullet points here (which is what they look like). Instead, they're > necessary to tell google to ignore those words. and a space preceding the hyphen, e.g. yatayata recipe -restaurant -menu -- Intuitive insights from Nick, Retired in the San Fernando Valley http://operationiraqichildren.org/ |
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