"B. Server" > wrote

> In short, I don't see how the vacuum process makes any difference. Can
> someone post a cogent explanation?

In my brief experience and intellect, I really think we are talking about
different things here.

First of all, and mainly vacuum. We all have experience, training, and
schooling to one degree or another on vacuum. What it is, etc, etc, etc.

My training is in gases, and that in two areas. One is gases dissolved in
body tissues, and the other in gases related to industrial processes, and
their applications thereto. I Really think that true vacuum devices do not
come into play in current meat preparation, and that deep vacuum pressures
are used.

In my life, I have seen different "vacuum" devices. Seal a Meal comes to
mind. to me, Seal A Meal is not a true vacuum, it just removes most of the
air so that freezer burn is lessened.

Then I saw those things that had glass jars, and the vacuum pump was applied
to the airspace between the top of the food and the lid. More approaching a
vacuum than Seal a Meal, yet not a true vacuum.

From what I know, for a real vacuum to work, it would have to be applied in
force and for some time, so that not only the bubbles and pockets and porous
foods could offgas their gas pockets, but also that the gases that were
dissolved in the meats would offgas. In other words, a heavy vacuum for a
long time.

Now is where it gets conflicting for me, at least. In my experiences with
Seal A Meal, when all the air is gone, the vacuum pump then starts sucking
out the liquid, as it is squeezed out of the package. If one used liquid
marinade, it would all be sucked out. If one used powdered spice marinade,
it would not be sucked out nearly as much.

I really don't know how it works about drawing the marinade into the meat
during the refrigeration time, or whether it is sucked up when the vacuum is
relaxed.

I just do know that I have had good luck with PARTIAL vacuum sealing of meat
and marinades in bags. Perhaps it provides a small amount of negative
pressure so the marinade goes into the meat. Perhaps just the encasement of
the meat in marinade and the elimination of air pockets improves things a
lot.

Surely, this is not an answer, Shirley. But just a couple of thoughts on
the subject.

Steve

On 16-Apr-2012, "Steve B" > wrote:

> "B. Server" > wrote
>
> > In short, I don't see how the vacuum process makes any difference. Can
> > someone post a cogent explanation?
>
> In my brief experience and intellect, I really think we are talking about
> different things here.
>
> First of all, and mainly vacuum. We all have experience, training, and
> schooling to one degree or another on vacuum. What it is, etc, etc, etc.
>
> My training is in gases, and that in two areas. One is gases dissolved in
>
> body tissues, and the other in gases related to industrial processes, and
> their applications thereto. I Really think that true vacuum devices do
> not
> come into play in current meat preparation, and that deep vacuum pressures
>
> are used.
>
> In my life, I have seen different "vacuum" devices. Seal a Meal comes to
> mind. to me, Seal A Meal is not a true vacuum, it just removes most of
> the
> air so that freezer burn is lessened.
>
> Then I saw those things that had glass jars, and the vacuum pump was
> applied
> to the airspace between the top of the food and the lid. More approaching
> a
> vacuum than Seal a Meal, yet not a true vacuum.
>
> From what I know, for a real vacuum to work, it would have to be applied
> in
> force and for some time, so that not only the bubbles and pockets and
> porous
> foods could offgas their gas pockets, but also that the gases that were
> dissolved in the meats would offgas. In other words, a heavy vacuum for a
>
> long time.
>
> Now is where it gets conflicting for me, at least. In my experiences with
>
> Seal A Meal, when all the air is gone, the vacuum pump then starts sucking
>
> out the liquid, as it is squeezed out of the package. If one used liquid
> marinade, it would all be sucked out. If one used powdered spice
> marinade,
> it would not be sucked out nearly as much.
>
> I really don't know how it works about drawing the marinade into the meat
> during the refrigeration time, or whether it is sucked up when the vacuum
> is
> relaxed.
>
> I just do know that I have had good luck with PARTIAL vacuum sealing of
> meat
> and marinades in bags. Perhaps it provides a small amount of negative
> pressure so the marinade goes into the meat. Perhaps just the encasement
> of
> the meat in marinade and the elimination of air pockets improves things a
> lot.
>
> Surely, this is not an answer, Shirley. But just a couple of thoughts on
> the subject.
>
> Steve

I wasn't satisfied with Steve's posted explanation, but quickly found
out that I couldn't explain vacuum packaging much better. I did find
a good source for information on the subject. Check out this site in
the UK. Never mind their brands, just absorb the various pros and
cons of each type of equipment.

http://www.culinaryinnovations.co.uk/index.cfm

I currently have two two types of vacuum machine, a foodsaver
type external vac which requires pattern/quilted/embossed/
channel bags and a chamber vac which uses plain bags. I
have been vacuum packaging foods at thome for more then
fifteen years using a foodsaver at first, then a snorkel type
external sealer and finally a chamber machine. They all have
their pros and cons, but price of bags is significant for those
who use their machine every day. I just received another
1000 pint bags for $40.08 delivered to my door. You won't
find that price for channel bags anywhere.

--
Brick(Youth is wasted on young people)