Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

Frank Mancuso wrote:
> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

Congrats on St. Arnold's two new medals.

Cheers,

Steve

On Sun, 02 Oct 2005 14:42:31 +0000, Steve Moore wrote:

> Frank Mancuso wrote:
>> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
>> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

not true

On Mon, 03 Oct 2005 09:16:37 -0700, david darr wrote:

> On Sun, 02 Oct 2005 14:42:31 +0000, Steve Moore wrote:
>
>> Frank Mancuso wrote:
>>> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
>>> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf
>
> not true

oops. I'm not sure how I wound up posting that... I was trying to forward
this to myself (using a new newsreader).

mea culpa from bad boy Dave

Frank Mancuso wrote:

> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

Love the Silver medal winner in Cat. 18 "European Style Pilsener"...

wrote:

> Love the Silver medal winner in Cat. 18 "European Style Pilsener"...

One wonders why people at the Sandlot would dis beer judges. They've
done quite well at the GABF over the years.

Speaking of the Sandlot. Aren't they part of the Coors organization?
Coors is Small Brewery of the Year?

Slante,

Steve

> Speaking of the Sandlot. Aren't they part of the Coors organization?

Yes.

> Coors is Small Brewery of the Year?

No. The Sandlot is. I kinda treat them as separate entities, regardless of
the affiliation. If you've never been ... I highly recommend checking it
out. Incredible lagers/pils and smoked beers. Great guys too. This is
well-deserved, IMO ... though I could easily name dozens of other worthy
contenders. I'm sure we all could.

Respect Beer.

--
Todd Alström
http://BeerAdvocate.com
--
New England Beer Fest - October 29, 2005
http://beeradvocate.com/fests/
--

Steve Moore > wrote:
wrote:
>
>> Love the Silver medal winner in Cat. 18 "European Style Pilsener"...
>
>One wonders why people at the Sandlot would dis beer judges. They've
>done quite well at the GABF over the years.

Maybe they think they should've gotten a Gold with
that beer. Heh.
--
Joel Plutchak

"I never let anything as tenuous as moral standards get in the way of
drinking beer." - Jon Binkley in rec.food.drink.beer

Frank Mancuso wrote:
> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

Who the heck voted Bigfoot the best Barleywine? Unless this batch was
spectacularly better than previous years I don't know how they'd crack
top-10.

Bill

"Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
news:32T%e.7446
> Who the heck voted Bigfoot the best Barleywine? Unless this batch was
> spectacularly better than previous years I don't know how they'd crack
> top-10.

Ah, that would be blind tasters who didn't see what the label was on each
beer, poor *******s, and only had taste and smell to go on, instead of years
of finely honed opinion and prejudgment.

--
Lew Bryson

"GOOD or SHITE?" -- Michael Jackson, "Thriller", 1982
www.lewbryson.com

Lew Bryson wrote:

> "Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
> news:32T%e.7446
>
>>Who the heck voted Bigfoot the best Barleywine? Unless this batch was
>>spectacularly better than previous years I don't know how they'd crack
>>top-10.
>
>
> Ah, that would be blind tasters who didn't see what the label was on each
> beer, poor *******s, and only had taste and smell to go on, instead of years
> of finely honed opinion and prejudgment.

Oh come on. I rather like a number of Sierra Nevada's brews, but I
know I am not alone in having found Bigfoot a rather unpleasant
experience in Barleywine. Although Heavyweight's Old Salty was not
represented, Weyerbacher and Old Dominion were (were Blithering Idiot,
Millennium or Insanity entered? They only list the breweries not the
particular beers) and I have had difficulty finishing previous years'
Bigfoots at all, to the point that I avoid them on principle, but this
years would have to be bloody spectacular to beat those two breweries,
and they didn't even place! Sorry I've "only" tried about a hundred
different brews this year (Bigfoot '05 not having been one of them) but
I have a hard time buying that as a gold medalist.

Bill

"Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
news:Tt10f.7352
> Lew Bryson wrote:
>> "Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
>>>Who the heck voted Bigfoot the best Barleywine? Unless this batch was
>>>spectacularly better than previous years I don't know how they'd crack
>>>top-10.

>> Ah, that would be blind tasters who didn't see what the label was on each
>> beer, poor *******s, and only had taste and smell to go on, instead of
>> years of finely honed opinion and prejudgment.
>
> Oh come on. I rather like a number of Sierra Nevada's brews, but I know I
> am not alone in having found Bigfoot a rather unpleasant experience in
> Barleywine. Although Heavyweight's Old Salty was not represented,
> Weyerbacher and Old Dominion were (were Blithering Idiot, Millennium or
> Insanity entered? They only list the breweries not the particular beers)
> and I have had difficulty finishing previous years' Bigfoots at all, to
> the point that I avoid them on principle, but this years would have to be
> bloody spectacular to beat those two breweries, and they didn't even
> place! Sorry I've "only" tried about a hundred different brews this year
> (Bigfoot '05 not having been one of them) but I have a hard time buying
> that as a gold medalist.

Bill, take a look at who judges these beers. Over half the judges come from
Colorado and west (Mountain state judges are always the biggest group, no
real surprise). The East Coast (New England and the mid-Atlantic region)
puts up about 15% of the judges (really, I have the numbers, I'm not
guessing). I'm NOT saying that the judges are in a conspiracy, but what I am
saying is that people gravitate towards liking what they drink on a steady
basis. Western site for the festival, Western judges drinking Western beers
(and they do, much more so than we in the East drink solely Eastern beers),
Western beers win medals. I do not think that it's any surprising
coincidence that Denver and Boulder together have --over the entire history
of the GABF -- won more medals than any other city. Conspiracy? No,
inevitable playing of the odds.

--
Lew Bryson

Their clothes are weird, their music sucks and they drink
malternatives. And now you tell me they probably don't think Sierra
Nevada is cool? This is what the passage of years does to you: It
makes everyone around you more stupid. -- Michael Stewart 6/24/02

www.lewbryson.com

Lew Bryson > wrote:
: "Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
: news:Tt10f.7352
:> Lew Bryson wrote:
:>> "Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
:>>>Who the heck voted Bigfoot the best Barleywine? Unless this batch was
:>>>spectacularly better than previous years I don't know how they'd crack
:>>>top-10.
:
:>> Ah, that would be blind tasters who didn't see what the label was on each
:>> beer, poor *******s, and only had taste and smell to go on, instead of
:>> years of finely honed opinion and prejudgment.
:>
:> Oh come on. I rather like a number of Sierra Nevada's brews, but I know I
:> am not alone in having found Bigfoot a rather unpleasant experience in
:> Barleywine. Although Heavyweight's Old Salty was not represented,
:> Weyerbacher and Old Dominion were (were Blithering Idiot, Millennium or
:> Insanity entered? They only list the breweries not the particular beers)
:> and I have had difficulty finishing previous years' Bigfoots at all, to
:> the point that I avoid them on principle, but this years would have to be
:> bloody spectacular to beat those two breweries, and they didn't even
:> place! Sorry I've "only" tried about a hundred different brews this year
:> (Bigfoot '05 not having been one of them) but I have a hard time buying
:> that as a gold medalist.
:
: Bill, take a look at who judges these beers. Over half the judges come from
: Colorado and west (Mountain state judges are always the biggest group, no
: real surprise). The East Coast (New England and the mid-Atlantic region)
: puts up about 15% of the judges (really, I have the numbers, I'm not
: guessing). I'm NOT saying that the judges are in a conspiracy, but what I am
: saying is that people gravitate towards liking what they drink on a steady
: basis. Western site for the festival, Western judges drinking Western beers
: (and they do, much more so than we in the East drink solely Eastern beers),
: Western beers win medals. I do not think that it's any surprising
: coincidence that Denver and Boulder together have --over the entire history
: of the GABF -- won more medals than any other city. Conspiracy? No,
: inevitable playing of the odds.
:

Of course there's no possibility that SN brewed up a small batch of
Bigfoot just to enter at GABF, is there? Only the little brewpubs do
that -- you know, the guys who never have the beer that won their gold
medal when you seek them out. SN wouldn't do that now, would they?

I had the opportunity to be a steward at the World Beer Cup -- got to be
in a room with a hell of a lot of bottles from a hell of a lot of
places. I saw and handled bottles from well known commercial breweries
with contents representing their well known flagship brews and said
bottles had handwritten labels on them. So, at a minimum, some special
care in handling was taken. I can only speculate as to whether the
contents were drawn from a "regular" batch on not.

Last October my vacation conincided with the release of the GABF winners
list. We made side trips to a lot of the winners sites and asked for he
specific beers that had won medals. If memory serves me correctly I
think maybe 30 to 40 percent of the beers we specifically asked for were
unavailable.

--
Bill
AT DOT
reply to bbenzel adelphia net

> Bill, take a look at who judges these beers. Over half the judges come
> from Colorado and west (Mountain state judges are always the biggest
> group, no real surprise). The East Coast (New England and the mid-Atlantic
> region) puts up about 15% of the judges (really, I have the numbers, I'm
> not guessing). I'm NOT saying that the judges are in a conspiracy, but
> what I am saying is that people gravitate towards liking what they drink
> on a steady basis. Western site for the festival, Western judges drinking
> Western beers (and they do, much more so than we in the East drink solely
> Eastern beers), Western beers win medals. I do not think that it's any
> surprising coincidence that Denver and Boulder together have --over the
> entire history of the GABF -- won more medals than any other city.
> Conspiracy? No, inevitable playing of the odds.
>
*And in that neat summation, Lew has nicely quantified why I pay almost no
attention to the GABF. Ever.

For those that don't know, Lew also wrote an article for American Brewer
Magazine comparing beer festival entry conditions--for example,
festivals/competitions that pay for the beer they pour versus competitions
that make the brewers GIVE them the beer and then still charge them an entry
fee! Very interesting and illuminating article--Lew, maybe you have it
online or want to summarize it for us?

I find it notable that nearly all the "best" brewpubs and small breweries
I've sampled beer from--i.e. places with a chance to win big at GABF--can't
or won't enter the GABF. They either can't afford to (and if they did, what
chances would they have against, say, 102 other "American IPAs" or 54
hefeweizens?) or are really cheesed off at the entry conditions. As one
brewer told me, "I make beer to SELL, not give away at a party where they
charge for it!" Now, certainly, there are exceptions to that "rule" of
non-entry--Flossmoor, New Glarus, Dogfish, and Victory come to mind--but
still, much of the best beer in the nation (Selin's Grove Brewing in Pa.,
anyone?) will never get a GABF medal.

Alexander D. Mitchell IV
Baltimore columnist, Mid-Atlantic Brewing News--next issue on the presses
momentarily........

Lew Bryson wrote:

> "Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
> news:Tt10f.7352
>
>>Lew Bryson wrote:
>>
>>>"Bill Bradley" > wrote in message
>>>
>>>>Who the heck voted Bigfoot the best Barleywine? Unless this batch was
>>>>spectacularly better than previous years I don't know how they'd crack
>>>>top-10.
>
>
>>>Ah, that would be blind tasters who didn't see what the label was on each
>>>beer, poor *******s, and only had taste and smell to go on, instead of
>>>years of finely honed opinion and prejudgment.
>>
>>Oh come on. I rather like a number of Sierra Nevada's brews, but I know I
>>am not alone in having found Bigfoot a rather unpleasant experience in
>>Barleywine. Although Heavyweight's Old Salty was not represented,
>>Weyerbacher and Old Dominion were (were Blithering Idiot, Millennium or
>>Insanity entered? They only list the breweries not the particular beers)
>>and I have had difficulty finishing previous years' Bigfoots at all, to
>>the point that I avoid them on principle, but this years would have to be
>>bloody spectacular to beat those two breweries, and they didn't even
>>place! Sorry I've "only" tried about a hundred different brews this year
>>(Bigfoot '05 not having been one of them) but I have a hard time buying
>>that as a gold medalist.
>
>
> Bill, take a look at who judges these beers. Over half the judges come from
> Colorado and west (Mountain state judges are always the biggest group, no
> real surprise). The East Coast (New England and the mid-Atlantic region)
> puts up about 15% of the judges (really, I have the numbers, I'm not
> guessing). I'm NOT saying that the judges are in a conspiracy, but what I am
> saying is that people gravitate towards liking what they drink on a steady
> basis. Western site for the festival, Western judges drinking Western beers
> (and they do, much more so than we in the East drink solely Eastern beers),
> Western beers win medals. I do not think that it's any surprising
> coincidence that Denver and Boulder together have --over the entire history
> of the GABF -- won more medals than any other city. Conspiracy? No,
> inevitable playing of the odds.

Does make sense. I was similarly unimpressed with Rogue's Old
Crustacean, but if that's what the Westernly folks like...

Bill

Lew Bryson wrote:
>
> Bill, take a look at who judges these beers. Over half the judges come from
> Colorado and west (Mountain state judges are always the biggest group, no
> real surprise). The East Coast (New England and the mid-Atlantic region)
> puts up about 15% of the judges (really, I have the numbers, I'm not
> guessing). I'm NOT saying that the judges are in a conspiracy, but what I am
> saying is that people gravitate towards liking what they drink on a steady
> basis. Western site for the festival, Western judges drinking Western beers
> (and they do, much more so than we in the East drink solely Eastern beers),
> Western beers win medals. I do not think that it's any surprising
> coincidence that Denver and Boulder together have --over the entire history
> of the GABF -- won more medals than any other city. Conspiracy? No,
> inevitable playing of the odds.

There's also a home field advantage in that the beers are shipped
crosstown rather than cross country. That beer is perishable stuff.

Cheers,

Steve

Sixty-nine separate categories? That's 207 winners. It seems
excessive.

Dav Vandenbroucke
davanden at cox dot net

"Dav Vandenbroucke" > wrote in
message
> Sixty-nine separate categories? That's 207 winners. It seems
> excessive.

If that seems excessive, check out a copy of All About Beer and check out
the number of "winners" in each issue in BTI's competition.

--
Lew Bryson

"As for talking shit in this NG, Lew, you're the undisputed king, and
that's no SHITE." -- Bob Skilnik, 1/31/02

www.lewbryson.com

Dav Vandenbroucke wrote:
> Sixty-nine separate categories? That's 207 winners. It seems
> excessive.

Yeh, 200 would seem more about right to me. :-)

But it looks like there are only a handfull of
catagories that had less than 10 entries.

Obviously being a BJCP judge, I'd like
to see them using BJCP catagories and guidelines. :-)

Cheers,
John

<>
> Obviously being a BJCP judge, I'd like
> to see them using BJCP catagories and guidelines. :-)

Why? They're way too strict. Maybe OK for getting a grab on a truckload of
homebrews, but for a professional brewer, it's just a terrible clamp on his
sense of creativity, on his imagination. Who needs categories? I need
imaginative brewers. And new tastes.
Joris

"Joris Pattyn" > wrote in message news:L140f.141390
> Who needs categories? I need imaginative brewers. And new tastes.

Bravo!

--
Lew Bryson

"As for talking shit in this NG, Lew, you're the undisputed king, and
that's no SHITE." -- Bob Skilnik, 1/31/02

www.lewbryson.com

Joris Pattyn wrote:
> <>
> > Obviously being a BJCP judge, I'd like
> > to see them using BJCP catagories and guidelines. :-)
>
> Why? They're way too strict. Maybe OK for getting a grab on a truckload of
> homebrews, but for a professional brewer, it's just a terrible clamp on his
> sense of creativity, on his imagination. Who needs categories? I need
> imaginative brewers. And new tastes.

>From what I've seen with commercial brewers, is that
the catagories aren't what is restricting their creativity or
imagenations.

Most commerical brewers don't take advantage of all the styles they
could:
they brew the same 3 or 4 beers all the time.

A commerical brewer is lucky if they get to brew a "seasonal" beer
once every 3 months.

I've sometimes thought of becoming a commercial brewer, but then
I've wondered if I'd be extremely bored with it.

As a homebrewer I can brew any kind of beer I want, any time I want.
I think I've brewed just about every style in the BJCP guidelines,
and rarely brew the same thing two years in a row.

And if you don't like being restricted to the classic catagories
(or are not capable of brewing something within the classic
guidelines),
you can always brew enter into the "Specialty #23" catagory,
which is no-holds-barred:
"This is explicitly a catch-all category for any beer that does not fit

into an existing style category. No beer is ever "out of style" in
this category, unless it fits elsewhere."

Cheers,
John

Here's some great thoughts on this year's GABF ... (by Andy Crouch)

http://beeradvocate.com/forum/read.p...6627&id=567522

Respect Beer.

--
Todd Alström
http://BeerAdvocate.com
--
New England Beer Fest - October 29, 2005
http://beeradvocate.com/fests/
--

"Todd @ BeerAdvocate" > wrote in
news:BDt0f.14989$794.12792@trndny01:

> http://beeradvocate.com/forum/read.p...6627&id=567522

"Not sure what breweries enterred, or what beers were enterred,
but I do know who won."

Good source of information, that.


Scott Kaczorowski
Long Beach, CA

"Todd @ BeerAdvocate" > wrote in
news:BDt0f.14989$794.12792@trndny01:

> Respect Beer.

"Respect" beer? That is just ****ing stupid. Respect?
Beer? Beer is a beverage - nothing more. I might as well
respect the blend of gasoline in my bit o' paradise... MBHB
or...what?

Oh, I RESPECT that.

Er, no I don't. It's good for LA, but *respect*...?

I respect a color I like on a car. No, wait...I just like
that color.

I respect people and their actions. You Jason/Todd are balls
of shit. You're both self-promotional assholes. You suck.
You're selling something and yet you pretend you are
providing a service...

Jason...Todd - **** off.

PLEASE.

Really.

Please **** right the **** off.

Anyone here who RESPECTS beer - raise your hand. I *respect*
A. Scott Crossfield. Or Bob Cardenas. Or George "Wheaties"
Welch. I don't respect beer. I like it. But I don't
respect it.

"Respect." That's a big word.


Scottie Kaczorowski
Long Beach, CA

Ah ... playing the tough guy from behind your keyboard. Man what an ass you
just made of yourself.

I'll be in Long Beach in December. Let's meet up for a pint!

Respect Beer.

--
Todd Alström
http://BeerAdvocate.com
--
New England Beer Fest - October 29, 2005
http://beeradvocate.com/fests/
--

"Todd @ BeerAdvocate" > wrote in
news:QnA0f.24$gL5.13@trndny08:

> Ah ... playing the tough guy from behind your keyboard.

Yes.

> Man what an ass you just made of yourself.

You've not done the same?

> I'll be in Long Beach in December. Let's meet up for a
> pint!

Yes, let's meet up. You have one of the best beer sites on
the web, but I don't like the 'respect' thing. We can talk
about this in person.

Let's meet up, no sarcasm or other BS intended. I don't make
these stupid bullshit bully noises just on rfdb.

I'll give you a shot: The belly, not the head (I'm
soooooooooo pretty), please. Hell, I work within 10
minutes' street of LAX - I'll pick you up.


Scott Kaczorowski
Long Beach, CA









>
> Respect Beer.
>
> --
> Todd Alström
> http://BeerAdvocate.com
> --
> New England Beer Fest - October 29, 2005
> http://beeradvocate.com/fests/
> --
>
>

> You've not done the same?

Nope. I'm just posting about the GABF. My pointless trollin' on rfdb days
have been over for years.

> Yes, let's meet up. You have one of the best beer sites on
> the web, but I don't like the 'respect' thing. We can talk
> about this in person.

---------------------------------------------------
re·spect (ri-spekt')
1. To feel or show deferential regard for; esteem.
2. To avoid violation of or interference with: respect the speed limit.
3. To relate or refer to; concern.
---------------------------------------------------

Take your pick. All are more than appropriate usages. I "respect beer" ...
not asking you to, but I'd love to hear your constructive thoughts vs. this
ass-vomit-man-period talk that was just on my screen a moment ago.

> Let's meet up, no sarcasm or other BS intended. I don't make
> these stupid bullshit bully noises just on rfdb.

Cool. Long Beach or the Pizza Port Strong Ale Fest (that's where I'm
headed).

> I'll give you a shot: The belly, not the head (I'm
> soooooooooo pretty), please.

I can almost guarantee that you won't want me to do this, so how about a
pint of beer instead? (take the pint, your head will thank you)

So anyway ... back to the GABF thread ... and see you in Dec.

Respect Beer.

--
Todd Alström
http://BeerAdvocate.com
--
New England Beer Fest - October 29, 2005
http://beeradvocate.com/fests/
--

You are like school on Sunday ... no class. Sad ...

--
Jason Alstrom
--
BeerAdvocate.com New England Beer Fest - October 29th 2005
http://beeradvocate.com/fests/
--
"Scott Kaczorowski" > wrote in message
...
> "Todd @ BeerAdvocate" > wrote in
> news:BDt0f.14989$794.12792@trndny01:
>
>> Respect Beer.
>
> "Respect" beer? That is just ****ing stupid. Respect?
> Beer? Beer is a beverage - nothing more. I might as well
> respect the blend of gasoline in my bit o' paradise... MBHB
> or...what?
>
> Oh, I RESPECT that.
>
> Er, no I don't. It's good for LA, but *respect*...?
>
> I respect a color I like on a car. No, wait...I just like
> that color.
>
> I respect people and their actions. You Jason/Todd are balls
> of shit. You're both self-promotional assholes. You suck.
> You're selling something and yet you pretend you are
> providing a service...
>
> Jason...Todd - **** off.
>
> PLEASE.
>
> Really.
>
> Please **** right the **** off.
>
> Anyone here who RESPECTS beer - raise your hand. I *respect*
> A. Scott Crossfield. Or Bob Cardenas. Or George "Wheaties"
> Welch. I don't respect beer. I like it. But I don't
> respect it.
>
> "Respect." That's a big word.
>
>
> Scottie Kaczorowski
> Long Beach, CA

So anyone heard off/know/seen/tried this stuff?:
Catagory: 6 Herb and Spice Beer -57 Entries
Gold: Temptation Bock, Miller Brewing Co., Milwaukee, WI

What the heck is that?

John

Frank Mancuso wrote:
> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

wrote:
> Frank Mancuso wrote:
>> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
>> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

> So anyone heard off/know/seen/tried this stuff?:
> Catagory: 6 Herb and Spice Beer -57 Entries
> Gold: Temptation Bock, Miller Brewing Co., Milwaukee, WI
>
> What the heck is that?

I was wondering that myself! Is that an error or something
they make only for the festival?
--
//*================================================= ===============++
|| Russ Perry Jr 2175 S Tonne Dr #114 Arlington Hts IL 60005 ||
|| 847-952-9729 [NEW!] VIDEOGAME COLLECTOR! ||
++================================================ ================*//

Russ Perry Jr > wrote:
> wrote:
>> Frank Mancuso wrote:
>>> Just in case you aren't there, and wanted to know who won medals:
>>> http://www.beertown.com/events/gabf/pdf/winners_05.pdf

>> So anyone heard off/know/seen/tried this stuff?:
>> Catagory: 6 Herb and Spice Beer -57 Entries
>> Gold: Temptation Bock, Miller Brewing Co., Milwaukee, WI
>>
>> What the heck is that?

> I was wondering that myself! Is that an error or something
> they make only for the festival?

Now that I mention it, what is this one?
Category: 12 Wood- and Barrel-aged Beer - 75 Entries
Gold: Cherry Stout, New Glarus Brewing Co., New Glarus, WI

Another fest-only brew?
--
//*================================================= ===============++
|| Russ Perry Jr 2175 S Tonne Dr #114 Arlington Hts IL 60005 ||
|| 847-952-9729 [NEW!] VIDEOGAME COLLECTOR! ||
++================================================ ================*//