I'm trying to decide on what type of wok to get for when I get married
in a few months, and there seems to be a bit of a debate about whether
the sides of a wok should be hot or not. I was looking at this
carbon-steel wok on cooking.com:

http://www.cooking.com/products/shprodde.asp?SKU=179458

There is a review on that page which says that a real wok is supposed to
get hot in the sides, and this one does not, which creates a possibility
of food-poisoning. I have also read that cast-iron woks can be good
because they heat evenly all over, including the sides (of course there
is the downside of their weight, and the fact that they are less
responsive when you want to turn down the heat).

On the other hand, I have read (in some newsgroup postings and in a
book) that the sides of a wok are *not* supposed to be as hot as the
bottom, because that way you can push certain ingredients to the side
while you are cooking other ingredients. Personally, I have never used
this technique myself, and I'm not sure why it would be beneficial. It
seems to me that if you are using certain ingredients that you don't
want to cook as long, you would just add them in later, rather than
pushing them up the sides. But maybe I'm wrong - I've only stir-fried a
few times, using a large flat pan that belongs to my mother.

So my question is, is it better to get a wok that gets hot on the sides,
or one that doesn't? And which material would be best for this purpose?
(I'm assuming cast-iron if I want it to heat all over, and carbon steel
if I want cooler sides?) My fiance has an electric stove, so I will need
something with a flat bottom.

-Jaclyn

"Jaclyn" > wrote in message
...

>
> http://www.cooking.com/products/shprodde.asp?SKU=179458
>
> There is a review on that page which says that a real wok is supposed to
> get hot in the sides, and this one does not, which creates a possibility
> of food-poisoning.

No, it will not cause food poisoning. You have to keep things moving
properly in a wok to cook them. Properly cooked foods will not poison yo
and the short time they are in a wok is not long enough to induce anything.

> I have also read that cast-iron woks can be good because they heat evenly
> all over, including the sides (of course there is the downside of their
> weight, and the fact that they are less responsive when you want to turn
> down the heat).

Go to China and see what they use. It will be hammered still, not cast iron.

>
> On the other hand, I have read (in some newsgroup postings and in a book)
> that the sides of a wok are *not* supposed to be as hot as the bottom,
> because that way you can push certain ingredients to the side while you
> are cooking other ingredients. Personally, I have never used this
> technique myself, and I'm not sure why it would be beneficial.

Not everything cooks at the same rate. It gives you control. You want to
keep some items warm while fast cooking others.

Believe it or not, as much as I love cast iron, it is most definitely NOT a
good idea for a wok.
The best woks are made from relatively low carbon steel, and rust is a major
problem that must be constantly avoided but more often overcome.
In wok materials, "cheaper" is better (up to a reasonable point, of course).
I own many woks and carbon steel is king.

The sides of the wok do get hot, but nowhere near as hot as the bottom of
the wok and this is considered a vital feature to almost any oriental chef.
This property provides the instantaneous heat control needed for many wok
dishes and allows some oil to cling to the sides instead of just falling
into a pool at the bottom of the wok. You may notice that most recipes
using a wok, use very high heat and the food is in quickly and out quickly,
with most foods pre-cut to provide roughly equal cooking times.

However, that is not practical for some dishes, and the slightly cooler
sides of a good wok allow some control of the process.
By-the-way, Teflon and other non-stick woks are considered garbage by most
chefs and a very bad choice because they do not allow the food to stay up on
the sides thereby preventing this important feature. There are also woks
made for non-flame stoves (electric, induction etc.) and they have a flatter
bottom. I am told they are needed for good cooking but do not behave as
well as a round bottom wok.
For other dishes (steamed, boiled, etc.) this heat control feature is less
important or of no concern whatsoever.

If you have any doubts about this, just go to a few oriental restaurants and
you will see that they all use carbon steel woks of many sizes from 9-inch
to 36-inch and larger, but you will never see a plastic coated or electric
wok and almost never see cast iron.

The real debate in wok design is about handles (wood, metal, long, short,
one, two, etc.) That one depends on the type of cooking and personal
preference, in my never to be humble opinion.

Go carbon steel, avoid cast iron and forgo plastic non-stick garbage. One
size does not fit all in wok cooking. Be particularly careful to get the
proper size cooking implements, as they should match the curvature of the
wok for best food control and to avoid scratching, gouging, or damaging the
wok surface. It is also a good idea to file down any sharp edges even on
the proper size cooking implements for the same reason.

Your presumption that ingredients needing a shorter cooking time should
simply be added later, is NOT valid for many (most?) dishes, as the order of
ingredients is almost always overlooked as a vital component of the cooking
process. For example, when you add sugar (beginning, middle, or end) makes
a world of difference in the final product. The same is true for
flavorings, seasonings, and many other components. That is why the
ingredients of most recipes are written in the order they should be
incorporated and not randomly. When I worked as a Food Chemist, (vacation
job, just for change of pace), this was one of the most important
considerations we worried about, as cooking is, after all , chemistry at its
best, and the order in which you combine ingredients results in totally
different reactions when added at different places within the process. The
order of ingredients is much more important than even our competitors
understood and that alone can account for the difference between a good
product and a great one!

Just my two cents worth.

Bob
Los Angeles, Calif.


"Jaclyn" > wrote in message
...
> I'm trying to decide on what type of wok to get for when I get married
> in a few months, and there seems to be a bit of a debate about whether
> the sides of a wok should be hot or not. I was looking at this
> carbon-steel wok on cooking.com:
>
> http://www.cooking.com/products/shprodde.asp?SKU=179458
>
> There is a review on that page which says that a real wok is supposed to
> get hot in the sides, and this one does not, which creates a possibility
> of food-poisoning. I have also read that cast-iron woks can be good
> because they heat evenly all over, including the sides (of course there
> is the downside of their weight, and the fact that they are less
> responsive when you want to turn down the heat).
>
> On the other hand, I have read (in some newsgroup postings and in a
> book) that the sides of a wok are *not* supposed to be as hot as the
> bottom, because that way you can push certain ingredients to the side
> while you are cooking other ingredients. Personally, I have never used
> this technique myself, and I'm not sure why it would be beneficial. It
> seems to me that if you are using certain ingredients that you don't
> want to cook as long, you would just add them in later, rather than
> pushing them up the sides. But maybe I'm wrong - I've only stir-fried a
> few times, using a large flat pan that belongs to my mother.
>
> So my question is, is it better to get a wok that gets hot on the sides,
> or one that doesn't? And which material would be best for this purpose?
> (I'm assuming cast-iron if I want it to heat all over, and carbon steel
> if I want cooler sides?) My fiance has an electric stove, so I will need
> something with a flat bottom.
>
> -Jaclyn

"Jaclyn" > wrote in message
...
> I'm trying to decide on what type of wok to get for when I get married
> in a few months, and there seems to be a bit of a debate about whether
> the sides of a wok should be hot or not. I was looking at this
> carbon-steel wok on cooking.com:
>
> http://www.cooking.com/products/shprodde.asp?SKU=179458
>
> There is a review on that page which says that a real wok is supposed to
> get hot in the sides, and this one does not, which creates a possibility
> of food-poisoning. I have also read that cast-iron woks can be good
> because they heat evenly all over, including the sides (of course there
> is the downside of their weight, and the fact that they are less
> responsive when you want to turn down the heat).
>
> On the other hand, I have read (in some newsgroup postings and in a
> book) that the sides of a wok are *not* supposed to be as hot as the
> bottom, because that way you can push certain ingredients to the side
> while you are cooking other ingredients. Personally, I have never used
> this technique myself, and I'm not sure why it would be beneficial. It
> seems to me that if you are using certain ingredients that you don't
> want to cook as long, you would just add them in later, rather than
> pushing them up the sides. But maybe I'm wrong - I've only stir-fried a
> few times, using a large flat pan that belongs to my mother.
>
> So my question is, is it better to get a wok that gets hot on the sides,
> or one that doesn't? And which material would be best for this purpose?
> (I'm assuming cast-iron if I want it to heat all over, and carbon steel
> if I want cooler sides?) My fiance has an electric stove, so I will need
> something with a flat bottom.
>
> -Jaclyn

I hate to throw a wet blanket on your enthusiasm, but I think this is all
academic. I doubt that any wok on any electric range (with the possible
exception of induction) is going to perform well. The wok simply won't get
hot enough and you end-up steaming the food. As soon as the first portion
of food is put in the wok, the temperature drops and the burner doesn't put
out enough heat to let the temperature of the wok recover. The same is true
of most gas ranges. Some commercial style ranges have very high BTU wok
burners that MAY approach the performance that is necessary for proper wok
cooking. Then, you also have to have very good ventilation to cope with the
smoke that will be produced.

My opinion is that the sides of the wok are not suppose to be smoking hot.
You "park" the food there and then add more ingredients to the bottom. But
as discussed above, the bottom won't really be all that hot, so it is a moot
point. I think you are better off getting a cast iron skillet smoking hot
and stir frying the ingredients in that. You can cook them in states and
then combine them at the end when you make the sauce to reheat.

I don't understand the comment about the food poising. Properly cooked food
can be held at room temperature for up to two hours without a problem
according to the USDA. To hold food for service for a longer time, it must
be held either below 40F or above 140F.

On 2006-01-07, Jaclyn > wrote:
> I'm trying to decide on what type of wok to get for when I get married
> in a few months, and there seems to be a bit of a debate about whether
> the sides of a wok should be hot or not. I was looking at this
> carbon-steel wok on cooking.com:
[...]

I can't really answer your question, as I haven't used true woks much
and am not an expert on Asian cooking, but I can offer some related
advice: skip the wok, unless you do a lot of serious Asian cooking.
You can stir-fry in other types of pans, such as the flat pan you said
you've used before, and you will save yourself clutter in the kitchen
by not having a pan of every conceivable size and shape. Most
manufacturers these days are offering flat-bottomed pans with curved,
high sides. These are variously labeled "chef's pan", "everyday pan",
"saucier", "sauteuse evasee", or "fait tout". I have an 11" Calphalon
Commercial Everyday Pan (pretty cheap on Amazon) and a smaller Chefs
Pan from the same line, both of which can stir-fry well enough in my
experience. They can also do everything a saute pan can do, and
paella as well, plus pan sauces and reductions. I'm no longer a fan
of anodized aluminum interiors, so I'd suggest you look for
stainless-lined pans in similar shapes.

A fried of mine has a very old and well-used All-Clad flat-bottomed,
deep pan (looks very much like a wok), which is stainless inside and
anodized aluminum outside. I go over to his house for dinner often,
and I've seen him use it for just about everything, including
stir-fries, browning meat, pan sauces, etc. I envy that pan. I think
it's very similar to what they're currently selling as the LTD 12"
Chef's Pan, though I'm not sure that's exactly it:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00005AL3W

Not exactly cheap! But that's a very versatile shape, and the size is
good for cooking for a group. It will heat more evenly and
responsively than either cast iron or carbon steel, meaning that it
will indeed get hot all the way up the sides. I can't say that this
is ideal for traditional Asian cooking, but I can say that this
feature makes it a tremendously versatile pan. The Master Chef line
from All-Clad probably has a similar pan slightly cheaper, which will
have the same performance, but the exterior will be harder to keep
looking good.

Consider also that a cast iron wok, in addition to being
extraordinarily heavy, may provide somewhat even heat, but only if you
pre-heat it for a very long time. And the heat will still be quite a
bit lower on the sides, unless you pre-heat in the oven or use gas and
let the flames creep up the sides. I think is how traditional Asian
wok cooking works -- over a fire, which applies heat to the sides of
the pan as well as the bottom. Again, I'm no expert, but it seems to
me that if you're going to go with a traditional pan, you might need a
traditional heat source as well, or something which approximates it.
(High-end ranges sometimes offer high-power gas "wok rings".)

--
Randall

"Vox Humana" > wrote in message
>
> My opinion is that the sides of the wok are not suppose to be smoking hot.
> You "park" the food there and then add more ingredients to the bottom.


To add to this, the hammered steel wok is supposed to be best because it
leaves some texture on the side, making it possible to park the food there
and not have it slide back to the bottom.

As for temperature, they originated from using very small, concentrated
sources of heat such a burned coals from wood. That is what makes
traditional wok cooking different than other forms. Newfangled designs, flat
bottoms for electric, are just watering down a technique for the purpose of
making money selling inferior equipment to the gullible, yet trendy, public.
It bears no resemblance to real wok cooked foods.

I'd recommend steering clear of woks. They just don't work that well.
Try using a large, flat-bottomed pan/pot and see if how your recipes
turn out. It'll save you a lot of room in your kitchen to boot.

wrote:
> I'd recommend steering clear of woks.

I have seen many people having wok, carbon steel kind as well as
nonstick.

It seems to work quite well for them. I have no patience to lubricate
the carbon steel form rusting and by the time I saw my friend's
non-stick one working well, I already had a calphalon professional
everyday - wish I got the one with cooler handle - pan which I paid
like $80-90 about 6 years ago at Linen N Things. Mine is quite heavy
though.

With calphalon, I was told to heat it for 1 min before adding anything
to the pan. I bought mine to do stiry fry. The main thing is even heat
distribution.

Personally, I wouldn't want a wok because that can only be used for
stiry fry.



> They just don't work that well.
> Try using a large, flat-bottomed pan/pot and see if how your recipes
> turn out. It'll save you a lot of room in your kitchen to boot.

On 21 Jan 2006 10:58:09 -0800, "
> wrote:
>Personally, I wouldn't want a wok because that can only be used for
>stiry fry.
---

Tell that to millions of Chinese. The wok is also a great large
capacity steamer and deep fat fryer.
------------
There are no atheists in foxholes
or in Fenway Park in an extra inning
game.
____

Cape Cod Bob

Delete the two "spam"s for email

Cape Cod Bob wrote:
> On 21 Jan 2006 10:58:09 -0800, "
> > wrote:
> >Personally, I wouldn't want a wok because that can only be used for
> >stiry fry.
> ---
>
> Tell that to millions of Chinese. The wok is also a great large
> capacity steamer and deep fat fryer.

I can't see the wok we get here to be used as a steamer.Deeo fry, I
don' t do.



> ------------
> There are no atheists in foxholes
> or in Fenway Park in an extra inning
> game.
> ____
>
> Cape Cod Bob
>
> Delete the two "spam"s for email

wrote:
> wrote:
> > I'd recommend steering clear of woks.
>
> I have seen many people having wok, carbon steel kind as well as
> nonstick.
>
> It seems to work quite well for them. I have no patience to lubricate
> the carbon steel form rusting and by the time I saw my friend's
> non-stick one working well, I already had a calphalon professional
> everyday - wish I got the one with cooler handle - pan which I paid
> like $80-90 about 6 years ago at Linen N Things. Mine is quite heavy
> though.
>
> With calphalon, I was told to heat it for 1 min before adding anything
> to the pan. I bought mine to do stiry fry. The main thing is even heat
> distribution.
>
> Personally, I wouldn't want a wok because that can only be used for
> stiry fry.
>

I should mention that I haven't been doing much stir fry for the about
3 1/2 years prior to the last 9 months. I have statred using it again
about 9 months ago but just a little bit and recenty, I paied attention
and noticed the discoloration of the inside.

I didn't save the receipt to get life time warranty. Also, one of the
utensils I recently bought made some scratch. Before I only had tupper
ware utensils and wooden ones and may be that's why it didn't scratch.
Don't know. I do feel that the food doesn't taste as good as it used to
be when I first bought it.

> wrote in message
> . I bought mine to do stiry fry. The main thing is even heat
> distribution.
>
> Personally, I wouldn't want a wok because that can only be used for
> stiry fry.

Actually you are wrong on both counts. The wok is supposed to be much
hotter on the bottom than the sides. It is also a very versatile cooker
used for many other facets of cooking in China from steaming veggies to deep
frying.

You would probably get much more satisfaction from the tool if you know its
intended use and how to use it.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
> > wrote in message
> > . I bought mine to do stiry fry. The main thing is even heat
> > distribution.
> >
> > Personally, I wouldn't want a wok because that can only be used for
> > stiry fry.
>
> Actually you are wrong on both counts. The wok is supposed to be much
> hotter on the bottom than the sides. It is also a very versatile cooker
> used for many other facets of cooking in China from steaming veggies to deep
> frying.
>
> You would probably get much more satisfaction from the tool if you know its
> intended use and how to use it.

I owned a wok briefl, giving it away to someone - it was stil new -
because I didn't have time to go shop.

On 21 Jan 2006 11:18:50 -0800, "
> wrote:

>I saw my friend's
>> non-stick one working well, I already had a calphalon professional
>> everyday - wish I got the one with cooler handle - pan which I paid
>> like $80-90 about 6 years ago at Linen N Things. Mine is quite heavy
>> though.

Calaphon and non-stick woks. Eek!
$80-90 for a wok! Quadruple eek! Their favorite Asian restaurant
cooks are amazed.

I bet they both have make believe profession stoves too.
------------
There are no atheists in foxholes
or in Fenway Park in an extra inning
game.
____

Cape Cod Bob

Delete the two "spam"s for email

Cape Cod Bob wrote:
> On 21 Jan 2006 11:18:50 -0800, "
> > wrote:
>
> >I saw my friend's
> >> non-stick one working well, I already had a calphalon professional
> >> everyday - wish I got the one with cooler handle - pan which I paid
> >> like $80-90 about 6 years ago at Linen N Things. Mine is quite heavy
> >> though.
>
> Calaphon and non-stick woks. Eek!
> $80-90 for a wok! Quadruple eek! Their favorite Asian restaurant
> cooks are amazed.

I don't think wok are $80. I paid cephlaon as much as I did only
because I was buying it from a pricey store and didn't know better. I
bought it because it's life time warranty.

> I bet they both have make believe profession stoves too.
> ------------
> There are no atheists in foxholes
> or in Fenway Park in an extra inning
> game.
> ____
>
> Cape Cod Bob
>
> Delete the two "spam"s for email