When we bought our house, the home inspector said the oven temperature
was hot +25 degrees. We never thought of testing it ourselves since it
was just tested -- but recently, we called the home warranty before it
expired and had it tested again. He said it was accurate (not too hot).
He said we can test it ourselves by buying an oven thermometer, and
that we should be sure to buy a mercury one because it is more accurate
(suggesting that the inspector did not have a mercury-based one).

First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.

So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.

Thanks for any tips,
Tim

Ovens cook by hot air and air dont cook .... OOOPPPPSSS ,
what did he say ? Hot air dont cook !!!

Water cooks and oil cooks , but hot air ( not Congressional hot air ,
oven hot air )
dont cook ....

Fans in ovens force air past food , it cooks pedictably and 10 times
faster .

So why dont your oven have a fan ? Welcome to the slave camp , USA
..

The temp indicator dont do nothin .... Thats why it takes 2 hours to
cook
a 20 lb turkey .

some of the slow in oven is the thick heaters , they must be small
thin
heaters like a toaster , for better control .

Notice even the table top ovens use the wrong , thick heaters ...

I have a cheap , low quality I.R. thermo' from Harbor Fright Tool .
It records in 1/2 sec , a very accurate surface temp of anything up
to about 400 F ... Get it , learn to use it and be a Cooking Wizard
....








sdwebguy wrote:
> When we bought our house, the home inspector said the oven temperature
> was hot +25 degrees. We never thought of testing it ourselves since it
> was just tested -- but recently, we called the home warranty before it
> expired and had it tested again. He said it was accurate (not too hot).
> He said we can test it ourselves by buying an oven thermometer, and
> that we should be sure to buy a mercury one because it is more accurate
> (suggesting that the inspector did not have a mercury-based one).
>
> First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
> never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.
>
> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.
>
> Thanks for any tips,
> Tim

Wow. I didnt follow any of that.

Anyone else?

One time on Usenet, "sdwebguy" > said:

> Wow. I didnt follow any of that.

Going by your "reply to" header, you must be talking about "werty".
Ignore him/her; it's a troll, and a boring one at that. Killfile
fodder.

> Anyone else?

I didn't reply at first because I don't know enough about this. I
have a plain 'ol oven thermometer. DH brought home a fancy digital
tempurature probe from work once, and it registered about the same
as the thermometer, within a degree or two. I've never heard anything
about whether the kind you get at kitchen stores have mercury in them
or not. I tend to think your "home warranty" guy is just covering his
own ass. But like I said, I'm not an expert. Hopefully, someone who
is will jump in soon...

--
Jani in WA

sdwebguy wrote:
> Wow. I didnt follow any of that.
>
> Anyone else?

You must be new if you bothered to try to read that post. Even when
you can decipher what he or she is trying to say he's usually wrong,
but most of the time it's indecipherable. Just skip on by when you see
the name.

As to your thermometer question, there are a couple of oven
thermometers shown on this page from a kitchen supply house:
https://www.surfasonline.com/productlines/148.cfm

Even the cheap ones from the grocery store are accurate enough, imho.
-aem

sdwebguy wrote:
> Wow. I didnt follow any of that.
>
> Anyone else?

Werty has tertiary syphilis; even *he* has a hard time following himself.

A polder-style probe thermometer is easy to use and will typically have an
accuracy within plus or minus of 2 degrees..... which is plenty accurate.
Examples: http://i14.tinypic.com/2qm0sxe.jpg

Use 2 clothes pins to clamp onto the probe, and place the clothes pins on an
oven shelf like this: http://i13.tinypic.com/2na8sj8.jpg

Note to self: time to clean the oven (blush)

Probe thermometers are limited to temps no higher than about 350F. But you
can take several temperature readings from 175F (or whatever your lowest
thermostat setting is) to 350F to establish oven accuracy within that
temperature range. Remember to take your ovens temp on each self, and at the
sides, as well as the center of the oven in order to have a clearer picture
of how your oven is performing.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

"sdwebguy" > wrote

> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.

I don't think that oven thermometers are especially reliable, and I've
seen advice to buy more than one and test the oven with them.

Are you having problems with whatever it is you're cooking in your
oven? I would think baking a cake would tell you pretty well if your
oven is off by a lot. Follow the directions with a mix and see what
happens.

nancy

On Tue, 5 Dec 2006 12:40:01 -0500, "Nancy Young" >
wrote:

>
>"sdwebguy" > wrote
>
>> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
>> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.
>
>I don't think that oven thermometers are especially reliable, and I've
>seen advice to buy more than one and test the oven with them.
>
>Are you having problems with whatever it is you're cooking in your
>oven? I would think baking a cake would tell you pretty well if your
>oven is off by a lot. Follow the directions with a mix and see what
>happens.
>
>nancy
>

I just got a new stove that you can adjust the thermostat reading on.
Their suggestion is to see how your recipes do at the temp you
normally use and then adjust if necessary. They seem to think that
this is better than using thermometers.

--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

On Dec 5, 11:46 am, "sdwebguy" > wrote:
>
> First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
> never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.

Cheapies use a metallic strip, and are generally recognized as
innacurate.
There are all sorts of thermometers. The red liquid in most stick-type
ones is Alcohol. I don't think you can find Alcohol based oven
thermometers, though.

>
> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.
>

I found mercury ones online for as little as $9.50 US. Also found a
Digital one by Maverick.
Are you having trouble with your oven? Bake a batch of cookies. If
they're not burning, don't worry. This is an especially good test
because it results in both Data and Cookies.

Greg Zywicki

"Zywicki" > wrote

> Are you having trouble with your oven? Bake a batch of cookies. If
> they're not burning, don't worry. This is an especially good test
> because it results in both Data and Cookies.

(laugh) That's funny.

nancy

One time on Usenet, "Nancy Young" > said:
> "Zywicki" > wrote

> > Are you having trouble with your oven? Bake a batch of cookies. If
> > they're not burning, don't worry. This is an especially good test
> > because it results in both Data and Cookies.
>
> (laugh) That's funny.

And a good idea, too... :-)

--
Jani in WA

"Little Malice" > wrote

> One time on Usenet, "Nancy Young" > said:
>> "Zywicki" > wrote
>
>> > Are you having trouble with your oven? Bake a batch of cookies. If
>> > they're not burning, don't worry. This is an especially good test
>> > because it results in both Data and Cookies.
>>
>> (laugh) That's funny.
>
> And a good idea, too... :-)

The reason I said cake was because if you follow the directions
and use the right size pan, it's controlled, whereas cookies, who makes
them bigger, smaller, closer together, whatever.

nancy

One time on Usenet, "Nancy Young" > said:
> "Little Malice" > wrote
> > One time on Usenet, "Nancy Young" > said:
> >> "Zywicki" > wrote

> >> > Are you having trouble with your oven? Bake a batch of cookies. If
> >> > they're not burning, don't worry. This is an especially good test
> >> > because it results in both Data and Cookies.
> >>
> >> (laugh) That's funny.
> >
> > And a good idea, too... :-)
>
> The reason I said cake was because if you follow the directions
> and use the right size pan, it's controlled, whereas cookies, who makes
> them bigger, smaller, closer together, whatever.

Oh, yours was an excellent idea, Nancy, and yes, more accurate. I just
like cookies better than cake... ;-)

Jani (Who can't have either right now, and is just teasing)

--
Jani in WA

Mmmm cookies.

When the inspector said it was too hot, I guess we have been adjusting
the temp down and not really thinking about it. I think the cookie test
is a good one--in fact, one test just isnt enough. Maybe a daily test
for a little while will prove most accurate.

Thanks!


Zywicki wrote:
> On Dec 5, 11:46 am, "sdwebguy" > wrote:
> >
> > First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
> > never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.
>
> Cheapies use a metallic strip, and are generally recognized as
> innacurate.
> There are all sorts of thermometers. The red liquid in most stick-type
> ones is Alcohol. I don't think you can find Alcohol based oven
> thermometers, though.
>
> >
> > So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> > feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.
> >
>
> I found mercury ones online for as little as $9.50 US. Also found a
> Digital one by Maverick.
> Are you having trouble with your oven? Bake a batch of cookies. If
> they're not burning, don't worry. This is an especially good test
> because it results in both Data and Cookies.
>
> Greg Zywicki

Sure, there are dial-type oven thermometers that work with "bi-metal"
strips, where two different metals are sandwiched together. One metal
expands at a different rate than the other when heated, causing torque,
which moves a pointer on a temperature scale. They can be calibrated
pretty well when new, but tend to get gunked up and stop working
accurately (or at all) over time if they're left in the oven during
cooking.

Oven thermometers based on a column of mercury are usually more
accurate, but the scales can also get gunked up and become unreadable if
they're left in the oven all the time.

Get a good dial or mercury thermometer, use it to check your oven at the
various settings you usually use for various tasks, then remove it so it
doesn't get gunked up as described above. KitchenAid makes a decent
dial oven thermometer with a big scale and big numbers, which is helpful
when the light (or the eyesight) is poor. Taylor makes all sorts of
good thermometers, mercury and dial, including a mercury model that
folds up into its own stainless steel case. This is the one that the
service people, inspectors, etc. *should* be using.

Do a search on Amazon for "oven thermometer" and you'll get a good idea
what's available. I'd stick with a good dial or mercury model for your
purposes, and stay away from the electronic/digital models, which are
more expensive and often finicky and unreliable.

Bob
=======================
In article . com>,
says...
>
> First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
> never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.
>
> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.
>
> Thanks for any tips,
>
>

sdwebguy wrote:
> When we bought our house, the home inspector said the oven temperature
> was hot +25 degrees. We never thought of testing it ourselves since it
> was just tested -- but recently, we called the home warranty before it
> expired and had it tested again. He said it was accurate (not too hot).
> He said we can test it ourselves by buying an oven thermometer, and
> that we should be sure to buy a mercury one because it is more accurate
> (suggesting that the inspector did not have a mercury-based one).
>
> First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
> never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.
>
> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.

Rectal thermometer.

> Thanks for any tips,

Vaselene.

"sdwebguy" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> When we bought our house, the home inspector said the oven temperature
> was hot +25 degrees. We never thought of testing it ourselves since it
> was just tested -- but recently, we called the home warranty before it
> expired and had it tested again. He said it was accurate (not too hot).
> He said we can test it ourselves by buying an oven thermometer, and
> that we should be sure to buy a mercury one because it is more accurate
> (suggesting that the inspector did not have a mercury-based one).
>
> First, I didnt know thermometers could NOT work without mercury -- I
> never see thermometers advertised as "mercury-based' or otherwise.
>
> So what do you suggest for testing the oven temp? We were left with the
> feeling of having to prove the home warranty guy wrong.

Where you put the thermometer in the chamber, and with what, will vary the
reading. The temperature at the front will be different than near the back,
the temperature along the walls different than in the middle, and the
temperature near the top different than near the bottom.

So to check the oven itself, one puts the thermometer near the middle of
the middle rack in an empty oven.
To check how the oven bakes the particular food, one puts the thermometer
near the food you are baking. (FWIW, the oven does not bake things at the
exact middle of the chamber - that space is almost always taken up by food,
preventing air from ever being at the dead middle)

You could measure the temperature to a tenth of a degree - but why? The
food needs heat to cook vis-a-vis temperature, and a few degrees one way or
the other in the air temperature of the oven is not nearly as significant as
other parameters food preparation, ore even of the oven.
The metal coil type thermometers are bascially averaging
devices -averaging measurement devices are designed to be slow to respond
because they measure the average temperature across a period of time.
Instant measuring devices measure at a point in time, and are thus much
faster - but for measuring an average oven temperature with one of these,
you need to take several readings across a relatively long period of time
and chart the temperatures.

Note that temperature is only the measure of the difference necessary
for convection heat transfer.
(E.g., a bad coil can give you proper temperature on an emepoty oven in
preheat mode but it can't give you enough heat to sustain that temperature
in the chamber containing cold food for several hours - so with a weak coil,
you put the food in a proper-temp oven, the temp drops as it heats up the
food and the coil then runs steady trying to hold temperature as the
temperature slowly drops, and somewhere along the cooking process, the food
is hot enough to allow the oven to finally catch up.)

------

Basics - Non-microwave ovens use convection and radiation to heat the food
when roasting and baking.

Non-microwave ovens can be natural air convection or powered air convection.
Fans that circulate enough air so as to "scrub" the food with air, e.g.,
"convection ovens", reduce the variation of temperature in the chamber vs.
natural convection ovens (as well as speed up convection-mode heat
transfer).
Temperature is used to create a heat flow. Heat flow is created by having
air moving across coils or in heat "chutes" at the rear of the oven, and
then carrying that heat in the air to the food and transferring it by moving
heated air across the food.

The heated walls will radiate heat, radiation which aids in heating
anything of a lower temperature inside the chamber. (In broiler mode,
radiation is the primary heating mechanism.)
It takes longer for the walls to reach temperature than it does for the
air in the chamber to heat.

1) heat transfer law requires differences in the oven for it to work. Air
moves heat from the hot coils/flame pan to the cool food. Thus by the laws
of thermodynamics, a natural convection oven that works cannot have a
perfectly even temperature.

2) The gradient - The oven's temperature varies inside the chamber even when
empty: it is hotter at the coils than is the average temperature of the air;
it is hotter near the top than near the bottom; the air is hotter just above
the flame pan/coils than along the edges.
And it varies from the initial placing of the food to the final moments in
the oven, since the food heats and that change in food temperature changes
the natrual convection currents in the oven (e.g., a 300 degree cookie in a
300 degree oven results in no heat transfer, meaning the only convection
current left is from the coils to the chamber walls.)

3) Oven convection currents and size - The food and pan interaction with the
air varies with the physical size of the oven chamber - the temperature
distribution in a 30 inch oven is generally more even than it is when baking
and roasting the same item in a 24 inch oven.

4) Oven temperature controls - Oven temperature is not steady in a "brand
new perfect oven" - it varies from the "on" set point of the thermostat/oven
temp controller (jewel lite on) at the upper end, to the "off" set point of
the thermostat/oven temp controller.

5) Food does not require a "perfect temperature" to bake/roast. The
"allowed variation" depends on chamber size, wattage size, wall cleanliness,
and several parameters of the food item being prepared.

So basically, you are moving heat into varing types and shapes and masses
and heat capacities of food, using a device which is designed to vary, using
a device which must vary by the laws of physics to work - in a chamber that
always creates different variations in gradient that vary during the cooking
process.

The art of cooking....

there are a few more parameters, and there is more detail for each of these,
but you get the idea....

fwiw

>
> Thanks for any tips,
> Tim
>

On 5 Dec 2006 08:46:41 -0800, "sdwebguy" > wrote:

>When we bought our house, the home inspector said the oven temperature
>was hot +25 degrees. We never thought of testing it ourselves since it
>was just tested -- but recently, we called the home warranty before it
>expired and had it tested again. He said it was accurate (not too hot).
>He said we can test it ourselves by buying an oven thermometer, and
>that we should be sure to buy a mercury one because it is more accurate
>(suggesting that the inspector did not have a mercury-based one).
>
>Thanks for any tips,
>Tim

I use a digital "roast" thermometer.

It's a probe, a cable, and a digital readout that sits on the countertop.
They sell for about $5 now. ( thank you China )

You "adjust" oven temp by moving the OVEN dial to match the actual temperature.
1 Pick an arbitrary temp.... 350 degrees
2 Set the oven dial to 350
3. Wait 15 mins for the oven temp to stabilize.
4. If your oven thermometer reads 350... you're done.
ELSE
5 Pry off the oven dial. there's usually a setscrew underneath.
6. Loosen the setscrew, rotate dial until it matches the thermometer reading.
7. tighten the setscrew.
8..replace oven dial.
DONE

<rj>