"<RJ>" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 13:27:06 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>
>
> >
> >The exception always invalidates the rule. The simple fact is Wal-Mart
> >engages in predatory capitalism. The same kind that was pioneered by he
> >likes of J. Paul Getty. Monolithic corporations like Wal-Mart routinely
> >engage in business practices which are aimed at stifling competition,
> >forcing out competitors, presenting barrier to new competition and fixing
> >prices. None of this is good for anyone but the monopolistic corps.
> >
> >Every Wal-Mart I have visited is a filthy dump with garbage filled
parking
> >lots, staffed with brain dead idiots, brow-beaten managers, and filled
with
> >shoddy goods imported from China. I bought dish rags from a Wal-Mart
once
> >and they fell apart after a few washes. My Lands End towels are 10 years
> >old and going strong.
> >
> >Paul
> >
> Sounds like something you'd read in a union organizers hand-out.

Wal-Mart even shut down an entire store when their employees threatened to
unionize and the city council weans backing the,m Shut the whole store down
and fired everyone. Unions are the only form of collective bargaining there
is. Perhaps you might read up on what life was like before them. And as it
is now, we're heading back to those days in a hurry.

You assume a completely level playing field. Which this is anything but.
When you own all the cards, you don't even have to stack them.

And consumers are stupid. And a lot of others are poor, and getting poorer
so every penny counts and they go where the price is the lowest regardless
of the consequences.

Paul

Paul M. Cook" wrote:
>
> Wal-Mart even shut down an entire store when their employees threatened to
> unionize and the city council weans backing the,m Shut the whole store down
> and fired everyone. Unions are the only form of collective bargaining there
> is. Perhaps you might read up on what life was like before them. And as it
> is now, we're heading back to those days in a hurry.

I just read a news report today that WalMart has a number of class action
law suits against it for forcing employees to work without pay, either
during breaks or off the clock.

> And consumers are stupid. And a lot of others are poor, and getting poorer
> so every penny counts and they go where the price is the lowest regardless
> of the consequences.

Yes indeed. The consumers will take substandard products for a slight
savings while the might retail empire helps to send manufacturing jobs
overseas. If WalMart likes Chinese products so much, let the Chinese buy
them. I will try to support home grown products and retailers.

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> Paul M. Cook" wrote:
>>
>> Wal-Mart even shut down an entire store when their employees threatened
>> to
>> unionize and the city council weans backing the,m Shut the whole store
>> down
>> and fired everyone. Unions are the only form of collective bargaining
>> there
>> is. Perhaps you might read up on what life was like before them. And as
>> it
>> is now, we're heading back to those days in a hurry.
>
> I just read a news report today that WalMart has a number of class action
> law suits against it for forcing employees to work without pay, either
> during breaks or off the clock.
>
>> And consumers are stupid. And a lot of others are poor, and getting
>> poorer
>> so every penny counts and they go where the price is the lowest
>> regardless
>> of the consequences.
>
> Yes indeed. The consumers will take substandard products for a slight
> savings while the might retail empire helps to send manufacturing jobs
> overseas. If WalMart likes Chinese products so much, let the Chinese buy
> them. I will try to support home grown products and retailers.

You can try, but the choices are getting less and less. We bought a Martha
Stewart table and six chairs, from China, at K-Mart six years ago for some
$600.00. The webbiing in the chairs looked bad so I took them to a local
upholsterer, a good and honest man, who showed me others that he had
reconditioned. He replaced the plastic, cracking tubes with coated wire,
and I picked the cloth from a catalog, and it would take only two weeks to
get some from New England. He spent thirty minutes coming up with an
estimate of $600.00 for the six chairs. On a hunch, I left and went back to
the K-Mart, where they had the same six chairs on sale, marked down from
$350.00 to $250.00. So I had to cancel repairing the old chairs, and he
understood, saying something to the effect that it was cheaper to buy
anything from China than it was to repair it here. I gave him three of the
chairs, and took the others to the dump, to the metal bin. I was not very
happy doing this.

On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 00:52:02 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"<RJ>" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 13:27:06 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>>
>>
>> >
>> >The exception always invalidates the rule. The simple fact is Wal-Mart
>> >engages in predatory capitalism. The same kind that was pioneered by he
>> >likes of J. Paul Getty. Monolithic corporations like Wal-Mart routinely
>> >engage in business practices which are aimed at stifling competition,
>> >forcing out competitors, presenting barrier to new competition and fixing
>> >prices. None of this is good for anyone but the monopolistic corps.
>> >
>> >Every Wal-Mart I have visited is a filthy dump with garbage filled
>parking
>> >lots, staffed with brain dead idiots, brow-beaten managers, and filled
>with
>> >shoddy goods imported from China. I bought dish rags from a Wal-Mart
>once
>> >and they fell apart after a few washes. My Lands End towels are 10 years
>> >old and going strong.
>> >
>> >Paul
>> >
>> Sounds like something you'd read in a union organizers hand-out.
>
>Wal-Mart even shut down an entire store when their employees threatened to
>unionize and the city council weans backing the,m Shut the whole store down
>and fired everyone. Unions are the only form of collective bargaining there
>is. Perhaps you might read up on what life was like before them. And as it
>is now, we're heading back to those days in a hurry.
>
>You assume a completely level playing field. Which this is anything but.
>When you own all the cards, you don't even have to stack them.
>
>And consumers are stupid. And a lot of others are poor, and getting poorer
>so every penny counts and they go where the price is the lowest regardless
>of the consequences.
>
>Paul
>

The end is near.....
The End Is Near......
THE END IS NEAR

And it's all caused by these "stupid Americans"
who are trying to stretch their buying dollar
to pay their taxes, pay their bills, and raise a family.


<rj>

"<RJ>" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 00:52:02 GMT, "Paul M. Cook"
>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"<RJ>" > wrote in message
> .. .
> >> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 13:27:06 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >The exception always invalidates the rule. The simple fact is
Wal-Mart
> >> >engages in predatory capitalism. The same kind that was pioneered by
he
> >> >likes of J. Paul Getty. Monolithic corporations like Wal-Mart
routinely
> >> >engage in business practices which are aimed at stifling competition,
> >> >forcing out competitors, presenting barrier to new competition and
fixing
> >> >prices. None of this is good for anyone but the monopolistic corps.
> >> >
> >> >Every Wal-Mart I have visited is a filthy dump with garbage filled
> >parking
> >> >lots, staffed with brain dead idiots, brow-beaten managers, and filled
> >with
> >> >shoddy goods imported from China. I bought dish rags from a Wal-Mart
> >once
> >> >and they fell apart after a few washes. My Lands End towels are 10
years
> >> >old and going strong.
> >> >
> >> >Paul
> >> >
> >> Sounds like something you'd read in a union organizers hand-out.
> >
> >Wal-Mart even shut down an entire store when their employees threatened
to
> >unionize and the city council weans backing the,m Shut the whole store
down
> >and fired everyone. Unions are the only form of collective bargaining
there
> >is. Perhaps you might read up on what life was like before them. And as
it
> >is now, we're heading back to those days in a hurry.
> >
> >You assume a completely level playing field. Which this is anything but.
> >When you own all the cards, you don't even have to stack them.
> >
> >And consumers are stupid. And a lot of others are poor, and getting
poorer
> >so every penny counts and they go where the price is the lowest
regardless
> >of the consequences.
> >
> >Paul
> >
>
> The end is near.....
> The End Is Near......
> THE END IS
NEAR
>
> And it's all caused by these "stupid Americans"
> who are trying to stretch their buying dollar
> to pay their taxes, pay their bills, and raise a family.

Believe it or not, right there in your rather typical response, is exactly
the point I was making. Can you see it?

Paul

"<RJ>" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:31:27 -0400, Stan Horwitz >
> wrote:
>
> >Actually, your neighbors killed those supermarkets by not shopping there
> >enough. Evidently, they felt the lower prices Wal-Mart offers offset any
> >disadvantages one has by shopping there.
>
> Consumers vote with their purchasing dollars !
>
> I got "sticker shock" when we moved to Southern Az.
> The local FRYs and SuperValue charge .10 > .50 more per item !
>
> It's actually worth it to make a monthly 70 mile drive
> to Tucson WalMart for dry-goods.

So you'd drive a 140 mile round trip to save what, a few bucks? Sure hope
you drive a Prius.

Paul

"Scott" > wrote in message
...
> Mitch wrote:
> > Jewel announced today they will be closing the doors in Sept. because
> > of the newest Super WalMart.
> >
> > That sucks.
> >
> > The produce at WalMart sucks, the meat is horrible (Solution), the
> > chicken breast is always $4.99/pound. What joke. I never pay more
> > than $1.89 at Kroger.
> >
> > WalMart killed our Eagle, and now Jewel.
> >
> > I can't even buy horseradish at WalMart. Only mayo "sauce" with a
> > slight horseradish flavoring.
>
>
> It won't be long before walmart invades iraq and all of the middle east.

No, they are smarter than that. India just passed a law forbidding Wal-Mart
to open stores in the whole country. They know that some 96% of their
economy is small shopkeepers and they know the disaster that Wal-Mart would
bring to their country. Wal-Mart does not increase choices, it eliminates
them and at that point they dictate prices, quality and selection. You have
no choice left but to take it or go without.

Paul

In article >,
"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:

> "Shawn Hirn" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article > ,
> > "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote:
> >
> >> "Mitch" <Mitch@...> wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > Jewel announced today they will be closing the doors in Sept. because
> >> > of the newest Super WalMart.
> >> >
> >> > That sucks.
> >>
> >> It has nothing to do with Wal Mart. In the history of the chain, they
> >> have
> >> never closed another store. It is the lack of customers that causes
> >> stores
> >> to close. Wal Mart meats and produce are junk, IMO, so you need to move
> >> to
> >> a neighborhood that has people of good taste.
> >
> > Right. I live near Cherry Hill, NJ. There's a Wal-Mart only a mile from
> > three other supermarkets in that area. The Wegman's is the newest of
> > those supermarkets. That place is always packed! The other two
> > supermarkets feared Wegman's, not Wal-Mart. Wegman's took a good deal of
> > the other two supermarkets' business away from them, but fortunately,
> > the quality of selection at Wegman's is incredible, which is probably
> > why they are doing so well.
>
> What are the other two supermarkets?

There's a Pathmart and a ShopRite within a mile or two of the Cherry
Hill Wal-Mart, plus a Wegman's. About three miles away, there's also an
Acme.

In article >,
Steve Wertz > wrote:

> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 03:08:44 GMT, Blair P. Houghton wrote:
>
> > But competition is GOOD for the consumer...
>
> Price isn't the only factor, and the majority of consumers suck
> at buying decent food.

Perhaps, but we are in America, where a grease burger and salty french
fries at McDonalds is a great meal to many people.

"Stan Horwitz" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:
>
>> "Shawn Hirn" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > In article > ,
>> > "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote:
>> >
>> >> "Mitch" <Mitch@...> wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> > Jewel announced today they will be closing the doors in Sept.
>> >> > because
>> >> > of the newest Super WalMart.
>> >> >
>> >> > That sucks.
>> >>
>> >> It has nothing to do with Wal Mart. In the history of the chain, they
>> >> have
>> >> never closed another store. It is the lack of customers that causes
>> >> stores
>> >> to close. Wal Mart meats and produce are junk, IMO, so you need to
>> >> move
>> >> to
>> >> a neighborhood that has people of good taste.
>> >
>> > Right. I live near Cherry Hill, NJ. There's a Wal-Mart only a mile from
>> > three other supermarkets in that area. The Wegman's is the newest of
>> > those supermarkets. That place is always packed! The other two
>> > supermarkets feared Wegman's, not Wal-Mart. Wegman's took a good deal
>> > of
>> > the other two supermarkets' business away from them, but fortunately,
>> > the quality of selection at Wegman's is incredible, which is probably
>> > why they are doing so well.
>>
>> What are the other two supermarkets?
>
> There's a Pathmart and a ShopRite within a mile or two of the Cherry
> Hill Wal-Mart, plus a Wegman's. About three miles away, there's also an
> Acme.

That explains a lot. Those other supermarkets will either improve very fast,
or they'll be gone very soon. I've only seen one chain in the Northeast
improve that fast: King Kullen in Long Island.

"Paul M. Cook" > wrote in message
news:PQuui.4446$zg3.643@trnddc04...
>
> "<RJ>" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:31:27 -0400, Stan Horwitz >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Actually, your neighbors killed those supermarkets by not shopping there
>> >enough. Evidently, they felt the lower prices Wal-Mart offers offset any
>> >disadvantages one has by shopping there.
>>
>> Consumers vote with their purchasing dollars !
>>
>> I got "sticker shock" when we moved to Southern Az.
>> The local FRYs and SuperValue charge .10 > .50 more per item !
>>
>> It's actually worth it to make a monthly 70 mile drive
>> to Tucson WalMart for dry-goods.
>
> So you'd drive a 140 mile round trip to save what, a few bucks? Sure hope
> you drive a Prius.
>
> Paul


Either RJ is the perfect WM customer, or he/she buys a shitload of toilet
paper on one of those money saving trips.

"Paul M. Cook" > wrote in message
news:9Ouui.4445$zg3.2377@trnddc04...

>>
>> And it's all caused by these "stupid Americans"
>> who are trying to stretch their buying dollar
>> to pay their taxes, pay their bills, and raise a family.
>
> Believe it or not, right there in your rather typical response, is exactly
> the point I was making. Can you see it?
>
> Paul
>
>

You're right, but your comments don't apply to all market areas. In most
locations, supermarkets are almost as pathetic as Wal Mart. They're totally
at the mercy of their customers, who can be drawn away by nothing more than
bullshit (advertising). In rare locations, supermarkets do such a good job
of keeping customers that nothing will draw them away, except for those with
the lowest IQs. Unfortunately, the vast majority of supermarket execs do not
believe it's possible to rise above mediocrity.

Paul M. Cook wrote:

> "Scott" > wrote in message
>
> ...
>
>
>
>
>
> > Mitch wrote:
> > > Jewel announced today they will be closing the doors in Sept. because
> > > of the newest Super WalMart.
>
> > > That sucks.
>
> > > The produce at WalMart sucks, the meat is horrible (Solution), the
> > > chicken breast is always $4.99/pound. What joke. I never pay more
> > > than $1.89 at Kroger.
>
> > > WalMart killed our Eagle, and now Jewel.
>
> > > I can't even buy horseradish at WalMart. Only mayo "sauce" with a
> > > slight horseradish flavoring.
>
> > It won't be long before walmart invades iraq and all of the middle east.
>
> No, they are smarter than that. India just passed a law forbidding Wal-Mart
> to open stores in the whole country. They know that some 96% of their
> economy is small shopkeepers and they know the disaster that Wal-Mart would
> bring to their country.


Interestingly, I read an article a whiles back about the burgeoning of
modern supermarkets in India. Middle - class Indian consumers now
have more money to spend and so are more and more frequenting shiny
new clean air - conditioned Western - style supermarkets with frozen
foods, packaged produce, coffee bars, etc. This is putting a number
of the traditional street stall food vendors out of business...

The majority of Indians are still very poor, so most buy their food at
the street stalls, but modern Western retailing concepts are gaining
ground amongst the affluent classes in bigger towns and cities...the
affluent now see shopping as a chic leisure activity, not the drudgery
it once was. I guess people are the same all over...

I predict that Indians will get their own style and sort of Walmart
eventually...perhaps the Indian gov't. was simply in "protective mode"
when they outlawed Walmarts.

Speaking of "small shopkeepers", another recent article I read spoke
of the HUGE amount of 7 - 11's in Taiwan (more per capita than
anywhere else), some city blocks have several, some right across from
each other. They are used as bill payment centers, package shipping
and receiving centers, etc...but IIRC the article said the Taiwan
stores don't yet offer the Big Gulp. ;-)


--
Best
Greg

"big fish" > wrote in message
...

>
> One of the biggest problems with Wal-Fart has been their check-out LINES
> and I mean LINES. It can be a Sunday afternoon and the store was plenty of
> shoppers yet they have only three cash registers open. It is a running
> joke in our area about doing the Wal-Fart shuffle at the check-out. You
> know how that goes, the line is long and you just keeping shuffling up to
> the cash register humped over your cart.


I read that WM is trying to develop software to help them manage long lines
at the registers. Yep. You heard it he software. :-) What morons.

"big fish" > wrote

> made an attempt to rearrange my hair. The Gestapo door greeter stopped me
> and told me I had to check my hat. My reaction was WHAT!!!! The answer was
> that I was returning the hat and had to check it. I had to argue with this
> person for five minutes to convince her that the hat was mine. Just
> because I am female, that doesn't mean I never wear a hat in bad weather.
> I had the same thing happen the next time I went for cat litter but this
> time it was my purse that had to be checked because they thought I was
> returning it.

I guess it's easy for me to say, but I would have walked out. Maybe if
they were the only store around selling litter and I was desperate. I
have an aversion to being bossed around by store employees. Heh.

Does remind me a little of looking for a wallet once. This was in a nice
store and these wallets were expensive. Unacceptably so, to me, but I
really needed a wallet. But I needed to see if it fit into my purse.
That's
all I need, a shoplifting charge. I told a nearby clerk what I was doing
and
she thought I was some kind of nut, obviously. (laugh) Guess I would have
fit in at WalMart.

nancy

"Stan Horwitz" > wrote in message
...

> Actually, your neighbors killed those supermarkets by not shopping there
> enough. Evidently, they felt the lower prices Wal-Mart offers offset any
> disadvantages one has by shopping there.

Our local Wal-Fart is the worst place to shop. Thankfully, they have never
expanded that junky place to a Super Store. The aisles are always full of
merchandize carts with stuff that should be on the shelves. Plus, there is
always merchandize on the floor. I have never found their prices for really
junky stuff to be all that low. Why buy something cheap that you will have
to replace within a month or so? Pay a little bit more and get something
that will last. The Target and Meier's stores are always clean, staffed with
friendly people, and full of customers.

All we get at Wal-Fart is completely brain-dead customer service. I only go
to Wal-Fart when I need cat litter. Other than that, I never pass through
their doors. One windy day, I went to Wal-Fart to get the cat litter. I had
a ballcap on at the time. As I walked through the door, I removed it and
made an attempt to rearrange my hair. The Gestapo door greeter stopped me
and told me I had to check my hat. My reaction was WHAT!!!! The answer was
that I was returning the hat and had to check it. I had to argue with this
person for five minutes to convince her that the hat was mine. Just because
I am female, that doesn't mean I never wear a hat in bad weather. I had the
same thing happen the next time I went for cat litter but this time it was
my purse that had to be checked because they thought I was returning it.

One of the biggest problems with Wal-Fart has been their check-out LINES and
I mean LINES. It can be a Sunday afternoon and the store was plenty of
shoppers yet they have only three cash registers open. It is a running joke
in our area about doing the Wal-Fart shuffle at the check-out. You know how
that goes, the line is long and you just keeping shuffling up to the cash
register humped over your cart.

That is why my husband and I avoid Wal-Fart. Once the cat is no longer with
me, my reason to subject myself to the Wal-Fart torture will be over. My
shopping dollars go to Target and Meier's.

Billzz wrote:
>
>
> >
> > Yes indeed. The consumers will take substandard products for a slight
> > savings while the might retail empire helps to send manufacturing jobs
> > overseas. If WalMart likes Chinese products so much, let the Chinese buy
> > them. I will try to support home grown products and retailers.
>
> You can try, but the choices are getting less and less. We bought a Martha
> Stewart table and six chairs, from China, at K-Mart six years ago for some
> $600.00. The webbiing in the chairs looked bad so I took them to a local
> upholsterer, a good and honest man, who showed me others that he had
> reconditioned. He replaced the plastic, cracking tubes with coated wire,
> and I picked the cloth from a catalog, and it would take only two weeks to
> get some from New England. He spent thirty minutes coming up with an
> estimate of $600.00 for the six chairs. On a hunch, I left and went back to
> the K-Mart, where they had the same six chairs on sale, marked down from
> $350.00 to $250.00. So I had to cancel repairing the old chairs, and he
> understood, saying something to the effect that it was cheaper to buy
> anything from China than it was to repair it here. I gave him three of the
> chairs, and took the others to the dump, to the metal bin. I was not very
> happy doing this.


Well there you go folks. Hell of a bargain at only $250. That it is the
rationale of the average shopper. It is impossible to resist the lure of
the cheap merchandise. It originally cost $600, and when it came time for
the $600 repair to the $600 replacement it was cheaper to replace with the
$250 special. So now the set has cost $850. That is typical of everything
that comes from China, too cheap to bother repairing, but it will need
replacing in a short time.

On 2007-08-09, Nancy Young > wrote:

> I guess it's easy for me to say, but I would have walked out.

I've done it. Now, I just walk by.

nb

Nancy Young wrote:
> "big fish" > wrote
>
>> made an attempt to rearrange my hair. The Gestapo door greeter
>> stopped me and told me I had to check my hat. My reaction was
>> WHAT!!!! The answer was that I was returning the hat and had to
>> check it. I had to argue with this person for five minutes to
>> convince her that the hat was mine. Just because I am female, that
>> doesn't mean I never wear a hat in bad weather. I had the same thing
>> happen the next time I went for cat litter but this time it was my
>> purse that had to be checked because they thought I was returning it.
>
> I guess it's easy for me to say, but I would have walked out. Maybe
> if they were the only store around selling litter and I was
> desperate. I have an aversion to being bossed around by store
> employees. Heh.
>
I'm with you, Nancy. You can buy cat litter at any drug store, any grocery
store, any dollar store. No one is going to question whether the hat on my
head or the purse on my shoulder is *mine* when I walk in the door. Sorry,
it's not airport security... it's WalMart.

Jill

Paul M. Cook wrote:
> "<RJ>" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:31:27 -0400, Stan Horwitz
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> Actually, your neighbors killed those supermarkets by not shopping
>>> there enough. Evidently, they felt the lower prices Wal-Mart offers
>>> offset any disadvantages one has by shopping there.
>>
>> Consumers vote with their purchasing dollars !
>>
>> I got "sticker shock" when we moved to Southern Az.
>> The local FRYs and SuperValue charge .10 > .50 more per item !
>>
>> It's actually worth it to make a monthly 70 mile drive
>> to Tucson WalMart for dry-goods.
>
> So you'd drive a 140 mile round trip to save what, a few bucks? Sure
> hope you drive a Prius.
>
> Paul

One would think online ordering and shipping charges would be cheaper

"jmcquown" > wrote in message
...
> Nancy Young wrote:
>> "big fish" > wrote
>>
>>> made an attempt to rearrange my hair. The Gestapo door greeter
>>> stopped me and told me I had to check my hat. My reaction was
>>> WHAT!!!! The answer was that I was returning the hat and had to
>>> check it. I had to argue with this person for five minutes to
>>> convince her that the hat was mine. Just because I am female, that
>>> doesn't mean I never wear a hat in bad weather. I had the same thing
>>> happen the next time I went for cat litter but this time it was my
>>> purse that had to be checked because they thought I was returning it.
>>
>> I guess it's easy for me to say, but I would have walked out. Maybe
>> if they were the only store around selling litter and I was
>> desperate. I have an aversion to being bossed around by store
>> employees. Heh.
>>
> I'm with you, Nancy. You can buy cat litter at any drug store, any
> grocery
> store, any dollar store. No one is going to question whether the hat on
> my
> head or the purse on my shoulder is *mine* when I walk in the door.
> Sorry,
> it's not airport security... it's WalMart.
>
> Jill
>
>

Aw....cut those greeters a little slack. Can you imagine how unimportant
they feel? And, WM certainly does nothing to add to their self esteem. If
they get overzealous, start removing your clothes, telling them that you're
a definite security risk and need to be searched thoroughly. :-)

jmcquown wrote:
>
> >
> I'm with you, Nancy. You can buy cat litter at any drug store, any grocery
> store, any dollar store. No one is going to question whether the hat on my
> head or the purse on my shoulder is *mine* when I walk in the door. Sorry,
> it's not airport security... it's WalMart.


Now that you mention it, that was one of the things that first turned me
off WalMart, their having a "greeter" who wants to search your bags. I
resent the assumption that I may be shoplifting. While they have reason to
be concerned about theft they have no right to search my things just
because I am in the store. If they have seen me shove something in a bag
and walk out without paying for it that is a different matter, but they
have no right to search without cause.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
>
> > I'm with you, Nancy. You can buy cat litter at any drug store, any
> > grocery
> > store, any dollar store. No one is going to question whether the hat on
> > my
> > head or the purse on my shoulder is *mine* when I walk in the door.
> > Sorry,
> > it's not airport security... it's WalMart.
> >
> > Jill
> >
> >
>
> Aw....cut those greeters a little slack. Can you imagine how unimportant
> they feel? And, WM certainly does nothing to add to their self esteem. If
> they get overzealous, start removing your clothes, telling them that you're
> a definite security risk and need to be searched thoroughly. :-)

Cutting people slack works both ways. Their self esteem is not my problem.
They have no right to search. Most of them are retired people filling in
their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of the
house.

"Dave Smith" > wrote

> Now that you mention it, that was one of the things that first turned me
> off WalMart, their having a "greeter" who wants to search your bags.

When you say greeter, you mean they search you on the way in?

> I
> resent the assumption that I may be shoplifting. While they have reason
> to
> be concerned about theft they have no right to search my things just
> because I am in the store. If they have seen me shove something in a bag
> and walk out without paying for it that is a different matter, but they
> have no right to search without cause.

I agree with you 100%. Other stores have to deal with theft also, but
they don't search your bags without cause.

nancy

Nancy Young wrote:
>
>
> > I
> > resent the assumption that I may be shoplifting. While they have reason
> > to
> > be concerned about theft they have no right to search my things just
> > because I am in the store. If they have seen me shove something in a bag
> > and walk out without paying for it that is a different matter, but they
> > have no right to search without cause.
>
> I agree with you 100%. Other stores have to deal with theft also, but
> they don't search your bags without cause.


That is because other stores respect your rights. They know they have no
right and they know that it creates a bad impression. But when it comes to
WalMart, a company that forces employees to work off the clock and through
their breaks, who spies on employees, who closes stores rather than let
their employees unionize, your rights mean nothing.

>
> That is because other stores respect your rights. They know they have no
> right and they know that it creates a bad impression. But when it comes to
> WalMart, a company that forces employees to work off the clock and through
> their breaks, who spies on employees, who closes stores rather than let
> their employees unionize, your rights mean nothing.


If a greeter wants to speak to me and asks me to do thus and so when I go in
Walmart, I'll turn around and leave without a word; maybe I'll kick the
tires, but I won't deal with such insanity.

If a greeter wants to stop me while I'm going out after I've shopped,
they'll have to chase me down into the parking lot and go the whole route;
but I'm not stopping for anyone at Walmart. There rules are for Walmart --
NOT ME!

Mad as hell, and not going to take it anymore,
Dee Dee

Dave Smith wrote:
(snipperdoodles)
> . . . . . Most of them are retired people filling in
> their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
> really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
> that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of the
> house.

Unfortunately, I bet a whole bunch of those geriatric greeters at Wally
World (and "Demo Dollies", too!) "have" to work that job or take other
forms of employment. It's a sad state for many elders (in the US) on
social security and/or other types of fixed pensions because they have
no choice and need to work to supplement their meager incomes.
Retirement is not an option for them, although I'm quite sure they'd
much rather enjoy their "golden years." It's unwise to assume they're
there to get out of their homes just for the fun of it, although that is
sometimes the case.

Sky, who's stepping off the soap box

--
Ultra Ultimate Kitchen Rule - Use the Timer!
Ultimate Kitchen Rule -- Cook's Choice

"jmcquown" > wrote in message
...
> Paul M. Cook wrote:
> > "<RJ>" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 07:31:27 -0400, Stan Horwitz
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >>> Actually, your neighbors killed those supermarkets by not shopping
> >>> there enough. Evidently, they felt the lower prices Wal-Mart offers
> >>> offset any disadvantages one has by shopping there.
> >>
> >> Consumers vote with their purchasing dollars !
> >>
> >> I got "sticker shock" when we moved to Southern Az.
> >> The local FRYs and SuperValue charge .10 > .50 more per item !
> >>
> >> It's actually worth it to make a monthly 70 mile drive
> >> to Tucson WalMart for dry-goods.
> >
> > So you'd drive a 140 mile round trip to save what, a few bucks? Sure
> > hope you drive a Prius.
> >
> > Paul
>
> One would think online ordering and shipping charges would be cheaper

I actually iknew a guy once who drove 250 miles round trip to buy soft
drinks. Yep, cases for the price of a six pak. It only cost him 40 bucks
in gas to save 20 bucks. He was so proud.

Paul
>
>

"Sky" > wrote in message
...
> Dave Smith wrote:
> (snipperdoodles)
>> . . . . . Most of them are retired people filling in
>> their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
>> really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
>> that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of
>> the
>> house.
>
> Unfortunately, I bet a whole bunch of those geriatric greeters at Wally
> World (and "Demo Dollies", too!) "have" to work that job or take other
> forms of employment. It's a sad state for many elders (in the US) on
> social security and/or other types of fixed pensions because they have
> no choice and need to work to supplement their meager incomes.
> Retirement is not an option for them, although I'm quite sure they'd
> much rather enjoy their "golden years." It's unwise to assume they're
> there to get out of their homes just for the fun of it, although that is
> sometimes the case.
>
> Sky, who's stepping off the soap box

Here's another 'assumption' stepping on the box ;-)
DH and I have been retired (since he was 44) and never worked since. (We
were able to plan it that way and realize not all people are able to do
this.)

We know and know of plenty of retired people that work for 'something to
do' relieve boredom, extra spending money for 'fun' things for themselves
and a lot of times for their grandchildren; money to take some small trips;
some like the idea of making money and saving it for god-knows-what; some
have a work habit, don't know how to keep themselves occupied; like to be
around new faces; some give it to charity; so many reasons for working
besides being outright poor.

You cannot tell a book by its cover (yeah, yeah, a cliche, I know -- but it
fits!)
Dee Dee

Dee Dee wrote:
>
> "Sky" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Dave Smith wrote:
> > (snipperdoodles)
> >> . . . . . Most of them are retired people filling in
> >> their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
> >> really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
> >> that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of
> >> the
> >> house.
> >
> > Unfortunately, I bet a whole bunch of those geriatric greeters at Wally
> > World (and "Demo Dollies", too!) "have" to work that job or take other
> > forms of employment. It's a sad state for many elders (in the US) on
> > social security and/or other types of fixed pensions because they have
> > no choice and need to work to supplement their meager incomes.
> > Retirement is not an option for them, although I'm quite sure they'd
> > much rather enjoy their "golden years." It's unwise to assume they're
> > there to get out of their homes just for the fun of it, although that is
> > sometimes the case.
> >
> > Sky, who's stepping off the soap box
>
> Here's another 'assumption' stepping on the box ;-)
> DH and I have been retired (since he was 44) and never worked since. (We
> were able to plan it that way and realize not all people are able to do
> this.)
>
> We know and know of plenty of retired people that work for 'something to
> do' relieve boredom, extra spending money for 'fun' things for themselves
> and a lot of times for their grandchildren; money to take some small trips;
> some like the idea of making money and saving it for god-knows-what; some
> have a work habit, don't know how to keep themselves occupied; like to be
> around new faces; some give it to charity; so many reasons for working
> besides being outright poor.
>
> You cannot tell a book by its cover (yeah, yeah, a cliche, I know -- but it
> fits!)
> Dee Dee

I don't disagree at all <G>. It's definitely never wise to assume
anything, but that's much easier said than done, of course.

Sky

--
Ultra Ultimate Kitchen Rule - Use the Timer!
Ultimate Kitchen Rule -- Cook's Choice

Sky wrote:
> Dave Smith wrote:
> (snipperdoodles)
>> . . . . . Most of them are retired people filling in
>> their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
>> really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
>> that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of the
>> house.
>
> Unfortunately, I bet a whole bunch of those geriatric greeters at Wally
> World (and "Demo Dollies", too!) "have" to work that job or take other
> forms of employment. It's a sad state for many elders (in the US) on
> social security and/or other types of fixed pensions because they have
> no choice and need to work to supplement their meager incomes.
> Retirement is not an option for them, although I'm quite sure they'd
> much rather enjoy their "golden years." It's unwise to assume they're
> there to get out of their homes just for the fun of it, although that is
> sometimes the case.
>
> Sky, who's stepping off the soap box
>
I know someone who is that exact position.

Years ago pensions used to be a free for all and companies held the
money and did with it as they wished. If the company disappeared so did
the pension. Then the gov't required companies to give the money to a
trustee which protected it if the company disappeared etc. Sometime in
the early 90s companies lobbied the government that they would really
like to be able to use this money and the requirements were changed to
allow that claimed since future earnings would pay for the pensions.

Fast forward a few years. A number of companies decided that they didn't
want to pay these pensions even though they agreed to do it in exchange
for being able to use the money so they filed bankruptcy which instantly
relieved them of paying. The government had to step in and divvy up the
little money that was left and add some more from the taxpayers in order
to pay a portion of the pensions.

My buddies older sister was just ready to retire and her employer filled
bankruptcy to run away from paying pensions etc. She is getting 41% of
what she was supposed to get. A 60% reduction is quite a kick in the
face. She has taken one of those jobs because the big reduction hurt
her.

On Wed, 08 Aug 2007 14:02:54 -0500, Scott > wrote:

>Mitch wrote:
>> Jewel announced today they will be closing the doors in Sept. because
>> of the newest Super WalMart.
>>
>> That sucks.
>>
>> The produce at WalMart sucks, the meat is horrible (Solution), the
>> chicken breast is always $4.99/pound. What joke. I never pay more
>> than $1.89 at Kroger.
>>
>> WalMart killed our Eagle, and now Jewel.
>>
>> I can't even buy horseradish at WalMart. Only mayo "sauce" with a
>> slight horseradish flavoring.
>
>
>It won't be long before walmart invades iraq and all of the middle east.

i hope they do a better job than we have. i'm quite certain it will
be cheaper.

your pal,
blake

On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 10:46:42 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>>
>> > I'm with you, Nancy. You can buy cat litter at any drug store, any
>> > grocery
>> > store, any dollar store. No one is going to question whether the hat on
>> > my
>> > head or the purse on my shoulder is *mine* when I walk in the door.
>> > Sorry,
>> > it's not airport security... it's WalMart.
>> >
>> > Jill
>> >
>> >
>>
>> Aw....cut those greeters a little slack. Can you imagine how unimportant
>> they feel? And, WM certainly does nothing to add to their self esteem. If
>> they get overzealous, start removing your clothes, telling them that you're
>> a definite security risk and need to be searched thoroughly. :-)
>
>Cutting people slack works both ways. Their self esteem is not my problem.
>They have no right to search. Most of them are retired people filling in
>their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
>really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
>that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of the
>house.

wtf? the pay is going to be crappy no matter who holds the job. what
do retirees have to do with anything?

your pal,
blake

On Thu, 09 Aug 2007 10:43:58 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>jmcquown wrote:
>>
>> >
>> I'm with you, Nancy. You can buy cat litter at any drug store, any grocery
>> store, any dollar store. No one is going to question whether the hat on my
>> head or the purse on my shoulder is *mine* when I walk in the door. Sorry,
>> it's not airport security... it's WalMart.
>
>
>Now that you mention it, that was one of the things that first turned me
>off WalMart, their having a "greeter" who wants to search your bags. I
>resent the assumption that I may be shoplifting. While they have reason to
>be concerned about theft they have no right to search my things just
>because I am in the store. If they have seen me shove something in a bag
>and walk out without paying for it that is a different matter, but they
>have no right to search without cause.

incorrect. wal-mart is not the government; you have no fourth
amendment rights there.

(of course, your fourth amendment rights are dwindling under the
government, but that's another story.)

do you think shoplifters have some kind of tattoos on their foreheads
that say 'search me, i'm a thief?'

whether it's good business practice to search mild-mannered citizens
such as yourself is another question. but they most certainly have
the right to do so.

your pal,
blake

blake murphy wrote:
>
>
> >Cutting people slack works both ways. Their self esteem is not my problem.
> >They have no right to search. Most of them are retired people filling in
> >their days and supplementing pensions by doing a job that someone who
> >really needs a job could be doing, and for a decent wage instead of one
> >that really doesn't matter to the old fart who just wants to get out of the
> >house.
>
> wtf? the pay is going to be crappy no matter who holds the job. what
> do retirees have to do with anything?

That is probably the case with WalMart because the company is out to make
as much profit as possible while making sure that their employees and
suppliers get as little as possible. That is made easier for them and
others like them when there are large numbers of retired people who are
looking for something to fill their day and don't really need the money. I
wouldn't want to try to live on what they pay.

blake murphy wrote:
>
>
> >Now that you mention it, that was one of the things that first turned me
> >off WalMart, their having a "greeter" who wants to search your bags. I
> >resent the assumption that I may be shoplifting. While they have reason to
> >be concerned about theft they have no right to search my things just
> >because I am in the store. If they have seen me shove something in a bag
> >and walk out without paying for it that is a different matter, but they
> >have no right to search without cause.
>
> incorrect. wal-mart is not the government; you have no fourth
> amendment rights there.

The Fourth Amendment doesn't apply to me because I am not in the US, but
citizens cannot go around searching other citizens. In order to search
someone, they need to have authority. The only people who have the
authority work for the government. If a WalMart employee wants to search
me or my bags he or she is going to have to make a citizen's arrest, and
then they will run the risk of making an illegal arrest and that is more
trouble than they need.

> (of course, your fourth amendment rights are dwindling under the
> government, but that's another story.)

No argument there. :-(

> do you think shoplifters have some kind of tattoos on their foreheads
> that say 'search me, i'm a thief?'

Of course not, but they need probable cause, and simply carrying a bag
through their store does not constitute probable cause.


> whether it's good business practice to search mild-mannered citizens
> such as yourself is another question. but they most certainly have
> the right to do so.

They may have the right to search their employees, and I don't know US law
well enough to make a qualified statement, but they do not have the right
to do it here.

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> whether it's good business practice to search mild-mannered citizens
> such as yourself is another question. but they most certainly have
> the right to do so.
>
> your pal,
> blake
>
Show me!
Dee Dee

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> blake murphy wrote:
> >
> >
> > >Now that you mention it, that was one of the things that first turned
me
> > >off WalMart, their having a "greeter" who wants to search your bags. I
> > >resent the assumption that I may be shoplifting. While they have
reason to
> > >be concerned about theft they have no right to search my things just
> > >because I am in the store. If they have seen me shove something in a
bag
> > >and walk out without paying for it that is a different matter, but they
> > >have no right to search without cause.
> >
> > incorrect. wal-mart is not the government; you have no fourth
> > amendment rights there.
>
> The Fourth Amendment doesn't apply to me because I am not in the US, but
> citizens cannot go around searching other citizens. In order to search
> someone, they need to have authority. The only people who have the
> authority work for the government. If a WalMart employee wants to search
> me or my bags he or she is going to have to make a citizen's arrest, and
> then they will run the risk of making an illegal arrest and that is more
> trouble than they need.
>
> > (of course, your fourth amendment rights are dwindling under the
> > government, but that's another story.)
>
> No argument there. :-(
>
> > do you think shoplifters have some kind of tattoos on their foreheads
> > that say 'search me, i'm a thief?'
>
> Of course not, but they need probable cause, and simply carrying a bag
> through their store does not constitute probable cause.
>
>
> > whether it's good business practice to search mild-mannered citizens
> > such as yourself is another question. but they most certainly have
> > the right to do so.
>
> They may have the right to search their employees, and I don't know US law
> well enough to make a qualified statement, but they do not have the right
> to do it here.

OK, I can relate.

Some years ago they had Coleman coolers on sale. So I went down to Wal-Mart
to pick one up. I am standing in line with my cooler, a long line too. The
greeter/nazi is a short and dumpy woman watching the crowd while wearing her
blue bib thingie. Anyway, she makes direct eye contact with me a couple of
times. The last time was while I was writing the check for the cooler. So
I start walking out and she pulls me aside and says "show me your receipt."
I look for it in my shirt pocket and pants pocket, no deal. I had
mindlessly stuffed it in my checkbook. But before I cold finish looking she
says loudly, "UH OH!" and at that second a door to the side BLEW open like
a bomb went off and 3 thuggish guys, also in blue bib thingies come FLYING
out like a SWAT team. It was like WHOOSH WHOOSH WHOOSH!!! They practically
made a storm force wind flying out that door. They surround me and now the
greeter woman is standing like a cop with a grin on her face. I'm sure she
thought she was going to get a pat on the head for this one. At that
instant I pulled out my checkbook and lo and behold there was the receipt.
Greeter girl looked crushed, the 3 thugs meandered away and I left after
saying "better luck next time."

I never went back to that ******** ever again.

Paul

On 2007-08-10, Paul M. Cook > wrote:

> mindlessly stuffed it in my checkbook. But before I cold finish looking she
> says loudly, "UH OH!" and at that second a door to the side BLEW open like
> a bomb went off and 3 thuggish guys, also in blue bib thingies come FLYING
> out like a SWAT team. It was like WHOOSH WHOOSH WHOOSH!!! They practically
> made a storm force wind flying out that door. They surround me and now the
> greeter woman is standing like a cop with a grin on her face.

You been watching too many movies, Paul. :\

nb

"notbob" > wrote in message
. ..
> On 2007-08-10, Paul M. Cook > wrote:
>
> > mindlessly stuffed it in my checkbook. But before I cold finish looking
she
> > says loudly, "UH OH!" and at that second a door to the side BLEW open
like
> > a bomb went off and 3 thuggish guys, also in blue bib thingies come
FLYING
> > out like a SWAT team. It was like WHOOSH WHOOSH WHOOSH!!! They
practically
> > made a storm force wind flying out that door. They surround me and now
the
> > greeter woman is standing like a cop with a grin on her face.
>
> You been watching too many movies, Paul. :\


They make movies about being accosted at Wal-Mart?

Paul