I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
(nausea, headaches, etc).

Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
isn't so hot...

TIA, Naz

"Naztazia" > wrote in message
...
>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>
> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
> isn't so hot...
>
> TIA, Naz


Our government inspects a tiny fraction of the food entering this country.
So, using stuff from China or anywhere else is a roll of the dice.

"Naztazia" > wrote in message
...
>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>
> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
> isn't so hot...
>
> TIA, Naz

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m...1/ai_n19439037

Naztazia > wrote:

>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>(nausea, headaches, etc).

>Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>isn't so hot...

You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.

Steve

"Steve Pope" > wrote in message
...
> Naztazia > wrote:
>
>>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>(nausea, headaches, etc).
>
>>Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>isn't so hot...
>
> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
> mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.
>
> Steve

But Steve...look at the excerpt from this article:

"It wasn't clear how the contaminated batch got into the United States.
Christopher said he relied on his importer, Modern Trading Inc., to ensure
that the ginger was safe. An employee at Modern Trading, based in Los
Angeles County, said she assumed that Chinese authorities had tested it
before it was shipped overseas. The importer bought the ginger from Juxian
Modern Organic Ginger Co. of China."


The contaminated ginger came from an organic ginger company. If we can't
trust the Chinese, who can we trust?

{SMIRK}

Steve Pope wrote:
>
>
> >Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
> >I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
> >isn't so hot...
>
> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
> mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.

Would organic ginger not include that which is fertilized with human or
other excrement?

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> Steve Pope wrote:
>>
>>
>> >Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>> >I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>> >isn't so hot...
>>
>> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
>> mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.
>
> Would organic ginger not include that which is fertilized with human or
> other excrement?


Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine is NOT
fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
>
> >> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
> >> mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.
> >
> > Would organic ginger not include that which is fertilized with human or
> > other excrement?
>
> Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine is NOT
> fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.


It is not an indirect answer because there was no question. You suggested
that one can mitigate most of the risk by buying organic ginger. One of
the problems with organic produce is that it is fertilized with improperly
composted manure .... or human excrement, which makes it a lot more
dangerous than some chemically fertilized produce.

Dave Smith > scripsit in
:

> Steve Pope wrote:
>>
>>
>> >Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the
>> >cookies. I have nothing against China per se, just their
>> >food track record isn't so hot...
>>
>> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe.
>> You can mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic
>> ginger.
>
> Would organic ginger not include that which is fertilized with
> human or other excrement?

Not the Nine O'Clock News had a song about that, something about
all the weasel bits the harvester cut off...

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>>
>> >> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
>> >> mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.
>> >
>> > Would organic ginger not include that which is fertilized with human or
>> > other excrement?
>>
>> Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine is NOT
>> fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.
>
>
> It is not an indirect answer because there was no question. You suggested
> that one can mitigate most of the risk by buying organic ginger.

Actually, no. I said no such thing.


> One of
> the problems with organic produce is that it is fertilized with improperly
> composted manure .... or human excrement, which makes it a lot more
> dangerous than some chemically fertilized produce.


Before we continue, would you like to amend your sentence above so it says
"...is that it is sometimes fertilized with improperly..."??? The other
option is for you to appear silly and uninformed.

Choose, please. Fix, or appear silly.

"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in
:

> "Naztazia" > wrote in message
> news:e0b71712-b79f-4116-93a9-458b181f9e15
@s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com.
> ..
>>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>
>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>> isn't so hot...
>>
>> TIA, Naz
>
>
> Our government inspects a tiny fraction of the food entering this
> country. So, using stuff from China or anywhere else is a roll of the
> dice.
>
>
>

Frankly, given the actual insepction rate of many food products made
here in the US, maybe we shouldn't eat anything at all...

"Sarah Gray" > wrote in message
. 17.102...
> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in
> :
>
>> "Naztazia" > wrote in message
>> news:e0b71712-b79f-4116-93a9-458b181f9e15
> @s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com.
>> ..
>>>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>>
>>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>> isn't so hot...
>>>
>>> TIA, Naz
>>
>>
>> Our government inspects a tiny fraction of the food entering this
>> country. So, using stuff from China or anywhere else is a roll of the
>> dice.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Frankly, given the actual insepction rate of many food products made
> here in the US, maybe we shouldn't eat anything at all...


At least here, there are some "knowns". Farmers can't get their hands on
banned pesticides (pretty much), and due to increasing interest in
integrated pest management concepts, abuses aren't as much a concern as in
places like China and Latin America.

"Sarah Gray" > wrote in message
. 17.102...
> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in
> :
>
>> "Naztazia" > wrote in message
>> news:e0b71712-b79f-4116-93a9-458b181f9e15
> @s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com.
>> ..
>>>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>>
>>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>> isn't so hot...
>>>
>>> TIA, Naz
>>
>>
>> Our government inspects a tiny fraction of the food entering this
>> country. So, using stuff from China or anywhere else is a roll of the
>> dice.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Frankly, given the actual insepction rate of many food products made
> here in the US, maybe we shouldn't eat anything at all...


I had to think the same thing the other day -- I don't know how many
hamburgers I have a year -- possibly five at the very most? I had a
hamburger Saturday night -- Sunday I heard that there had been another
recall of hamburger due to ecoli.

I see now at Costco the red/yellow/orange peppers are now labeled Product of
Canada and Mexico -- no, I don't buy them now. Make up your mind --
covering your bases or covering your asses! Grrrhhh!

I was noticing in a email I had written quite a while back about my
preference for Italian-made products. My Lello Gelato maker came in the
mail today. Geez -- they don't even put "Made in China" on it -- it says,
"Made in PRC."

Say, honey! Where do you think that this here thang were made -- the PRC? --
is that anything like Garmany? Well -- goll-lee.

Dee Dee

In article
>,
Naztazia > wrote:

> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>
> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
> isn't so hot...

Buy ginger from Australia -- the brand to look for is Buderim.

Miche (not an Australian)

--
Electricians do it in three phases

Dave Smith > wrote:

>Steve Pope wrote:

>> >Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>> >I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>> >isn't so hot...

>> You are not being paranoid. Ginger is sometimes not safe. You can
>> mitigate most (not all) of the risk by buying organic ginger.

>Would organic ginger not include that which is fertilized with human or
>other excrement?

Yes, organic farming uses animal manure.

Only recently has human manure been used in the U.S., and then
only after lots of processing. I'm not sure if organic farmers
use it. It mostly goes on pasture.

Steve

On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 13:14:59 -0800 (PST), Naztazia
> wrote:

>I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>(nausea, headaches, etc).
>
>Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>isn't so hot...
>
Ginger? Lemme tell you that most of the commercial garlic around here
is from China. Why China and not South America or Mexico, I dunno....
but it's from China - so ask before you buy.


--
See return address to reply by email
remove the smiley face first

Naztazia wrote:
> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
> store is too.


To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
> (nausea, headaches, etc).

The good news is, nobody died. The pesticide was;

aldicarb sulfoxide

Aldicarb is a systemic pesticide that has a dark grey to black,
granule_like appearance. It is applied to soil and taken up by plant
roots, but it is illegal to use aldicarb on certain crops because it can
be incorporated in the flesh of the fruit. Aldicarb is one of the most
toxic pesticides known, and as already said, its toxicity can be
expressed as a lethal dose (LD50) of about 6 mg/kg body mass orally.


trivia: this aldicarb has become popular in So. Africa. Burglars put it
in meat, to kill watchdogs. Supposedly, it only takes a few grams to
kill a rhino. Potent stuff.

Sarah Gray wrote:
> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in
> :
>
>> "Naztazia" > wrote in message
>> news:e0b71712-b79f-4116-93a9-458b181f9e15
> @s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com.
>> ..
>>> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>>
>>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>> isn't so hot...
>>>
>>> TIA, Naz
>>
>> Our government inspects a tiny fraction of the food entering this
>> country. So, using stuff from China or anywhere else is a roll of the
>> dice.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Frankly, given the actual insepction rate of many food products made
> here in the US, maybe we shouldn't eat anything at all...

It's not just the low inspection rate, but the fact that they're not
inspected for the multitudes of possible illegal chemicals.

That Robbins guy, (of ice cream fame), who became a health nut/author,
cited an EPA memo in one of his books, admitting that the majority of
our chemical intake is thru meat, not fruits/veggies.



"You are what you eat.....and what the animals ate" ~ Jon L

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
> >> Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine is NOT
> >> fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.
> >
> >
> > It is not an indirect answer because there was no question. You suggested
> > that one can mitigate most of the risk by buying organic ginger.
>
> Actually, no. I said no such thing.

You are correct. It was Steve Pope who said that. When I asked a question
about ginger being considered organic if it was fertilized with human
excrement you said that it was an indirect answer.

It was not an indirect answer. It was a question.

>
> Before we continue, would you like to amend your sentence above so it says
> "...is that it is sometimes fertilized with improperly..."??? The other
> option is for you to appear silly and uninformed.
>
> Choose, please. Fix, or appear silly.


I will leave it, so you can look silly.

Steve Pope wrote:
>
>
>
> Yes, organic farming uses animal manure.
>
> Only recently has human manure been used in the U.S., and then
> only after lots of processing. I'm not sure if organic farmers
> use it. It mostly goes on pasture.

They use treated sewage around here. It is applied in farms and orchards.
I came across an article a year or so ago about the risk of e-coli
contamination in organic produce because some of the organic farmers use
improperly composted manure. When properly composted, manure builds up a
lot of heat and that heat destroys the bacteria. if it is not properly
composted the little buggers are still very active and get into the
produce.

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>> >> Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine is
>> >> NOT
>> >> fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.
>> >
>> >
>> > It is not an indirect answer because there was no question. You
>> > suggested
>> > that one can mitigate most of the risk by buying organic ginger.
>>
>> Actually, no. I said no such thing.
>
> You are correct. It was Steve Pope who said that. When I asked a question
> about ginger being considered organic if it was fertilized with human
> excrement you said that it was an indirect answer.
>
> It was not an indirect answer. It was a question.
>
>>
>> Before we continue, would you like to amend your sentence above so it
>> says
>> "...is that it is sometimes fertilized with improperly..."??? The other
>> option is for you to appear silly and uninformed.
>>
>> Choose, please. Fix, or appear silly.
>
>
> I will leave it, so you can look silly.


Then, you appear to be claiming that ALL organic produce is fertilized with
improperly treated manure, and that is an absurd thing to say.

Dave Smith wrote:
> Steve Pope wrote:
>>
>>
>> Yes, organic farming uses animal manure.
>>
>> Only recently has human manure been used in the U.S., and then
>> only after lots of processing. I'm not sure if organic farmers
>> use it. It mostly goes on pasture.
>
> They use treated sewage around here. It is applied in farms and orchards.
> I came across an article a year or so ago about the risk of e-coli
> contamination in organic produce because some of the organic farmers use
> improperly composted manure. When properly composted, manure builds up a
> lot of heat and that heat destroys the bacteria. if it is not properly
> composted the little buggers are still very active and get into the
> produce.

We used to buy treated waste from the city (Virginia Beach) for
gardening purposes. The only problem seemed to be that tomato seeds were
often still present and would occasionally sprout... somehow they
survived the treatment. Whatever the treatment entailed?

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
> "Dave Smith" > wrote in message
> ...
> > JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >>
> >> >> Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine is
> >> >> NOT
> >> >> fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It is not an indirect answer because there was no question. You
> >> > suggested
> >> > that one can mitigate most of the risk by buying organic ginger.
> >>
> >> Actually, no. I said no such thing.
> >
> > You are correct. It was Steve Pope who said that. When I asked a question
> > about ginger being considered organic if it was fertilized with human
> > excrement you said that it was an indirect answer.
> >
> > It was not an indirect answer. It was a question.
> >
> >>
> >> Before we continue, would you like to amend your sentence above so it
> >> says
> >> "...is that it is sometimes fertilized with improperly..."??? The other
> >> option is for you to appear silly and uninformed.
> >>
> >> Choose, please. Fix, or appear silly.
> >
> >
> > I will leave it, so you can look silly.
>
> Then, you appear to be claiming that ALL organic produce is fertilized with
> improperly treated manure, and that is an absurd thing to say.


I do? I never used the word "all". I asked "Would organic ginger not
include that which is fertilized with human or other excrement?" which,
BTW, is a question, not an indirect answer.

The fact is that in some parts of the world, particularly Asia, they have
been known to use human shit for fertilizer, and some organic farmers use
improperly composted animal manure, and that can be very dangerous.

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>> "Dave Smith" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >> Indirect answer: Which of your NON-organic produce do you imagine
>> >> >> is
>> >> >> NOT
>> >> >> fertilized with animal manure? Give me a list.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > It is not an indirect answer because there was no question. You
>> >> > suggested
>> >> > that one can mitigate most of the risk by buying organic ginger.
>> >>
>> >> Actually, no. I said no such thing.
>> >
>> > You are correct. It was Steve Pope who said that. When I asked a
>> > question
>> > about ginger being considered organic if it was fertilized with human
>> > excrement you said that it was an indirect answer.
>> >
>> > It was not an indirect answer. It was a question.
>> >
>> >>
>> >> Before we continue, would you like to amend your sentence above so it
>> >> says
>> >> "...is that it is sometimes fertilized with improperly..."??? The
>> >> other
>> >> option is for you to appear silly and uninformed.
>> >>
>> >> Choose, please. Fix, or appear silly.
>> >
>> >
>> > I will leave it, so you can look silly.
>>
>> Then, you appear to be claiming that ALL organic produce is fertilized
>> with
>> improperly treated manure, and that is an absurd thing to say.
>
>
> I do? I never used the word "all". I asked "Would organic ginger not
> include that which is fertilized with human or other excrement?" which,
> BTW, is a question, not an indirect answer.
>
> The fact is that in some parts of the world, particularly Asia, they have
> been known to use human shit for fertilizer, and some organic farmers use
> improperly composted animal manure, and that can be very dangerous.


You said:

"One of
the problems with organic produce is that it is fertilized with improperly
composted manure .... or human excrement, which makes it a lot more
dangerous than some chemically fertilized produce."

Looks like an all-inclusive claim to me.

Dee.Dee wrote:
> "Sarah Gray" > wrote in message
> . 17.102...
>> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> "Naztazia" > wrote in message
>>> news:e0b71712-b79f-4116-93a9-458b181f9e15
>> @s19g2000prg.googlegroups.com.
>>> ..
>>>> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>>>
>>>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>>> isn't so hot...
>>>>
>>>> TIA, Naz
>>>
>>> Our government inspects a tiny fraction of the food entering this
>>> country. So, using stuff from China or anywhere else is a roll of the
>>> dice.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> Frankly, given the actual insepction rate of many food products made
>> here in the US, maybe we shouldn't eat anything at all...
>
>
> I had to think the same thing the other day -- I don't know how many
> hamburgers I have a year -- possibly five at the very most? I had a
> hamburger Saturday night -- Sunday I heard that there had been another
> recall of hamburger due to ecoli.
>
> I see now at Costco the red/yellow/orange peppers are now labeled Product of
> Canada and Mexico -- no, I don't buy them now. Make up your mind --
> covering your bases or covering your asses! Grrrhhh!
>
> I was noticing in a email I had written quite a while back about my
> preference for Italian-made products. My Lello Gelato maker came in the
> mail today. Geez -- they don't even put "Made in China" on it -- it says,
> "Made in PRC."
>
> Say, honey! Where do you think that this here thang were made -- the PRC? --
> is that anything like Garmany? Well -- goll-lee.
>
> Dee Dee
>
>
PRC *is* China.

sf wrote:
> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 13:14:59 -0800 (PST), Naztazia
> > wrote:
>
>> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>
>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>> isn't so hot...
>>
> Ginger? Lemme tell you that most of the commercial garlic around here
> is from China. Why China and not South America or Mexico, I dunno....
> but it's from China - so ask before you buy.
>
>
Why China? Probably because it's cheaper.

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 10:42:03 -0500, flitterbit >
wrote:

>sf wrote:
>> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 13:14:59 -0800 (PST), Naztazia
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>>
>>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>> isn't so hot...
>>>
>> Ginger? Lemme tell you that most of the commercial garlic around here
>> is from China. Why China and not South America or Mexico, I dunno....
>> but it's from China - so ask before you buy.
>>
>>
>Why China? Probably because it's cheaper.


When I started seeing garlic from China, I started growing my own -
not because of any particular health concerns, but because there is
something ecologically sinful about importing garlic from China.

Think global, buy local.

Boron

Dave Smith > wrote:

>Steve Pope wrote:

>> Only recently has human manure been used in the U.S., and then
>> only after lots of processing. I'm not sure if organic farmers
>> use it. It mostly goes on pasture.

>They use treated sewage around here. It is applied in farms and orchards.
>I came across an article a year or so ago about the risk of e-coli
>contamination in organic produce because some of the organic farmers use
>improperly composted manure.

Sounds like BS to me.

Seriously, I believe the contamination problems have been from
farms adjacent to the organic farms -- specifically pasture (which
is more likely to get the humanure) next to vegetable farms.

Steve

Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 10:42:03 -0500, flitterbit >
> wrote:
>
>> sf wrote:
>>> On Mon, 26 Nov 2007 13:14:59 -0800 (PST), Naztazia
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I was ready to make ginger snap cookies this evening and a friend
>>>> tells me that most ginger is grown in China. I said get out of town.
>>>> So I call up McC spices and sure enough, their powdered ginger is
>>>> indeed grown in China. Apparently even "fresh" ginger in my grocery
>>>> store is too. To top it off, my friend said there was a big recall
>>>> back in July because of pesticides used on ginger products from China
>>>> (nausea, headaches, etc).
>>>>
>>>> Am I being paranoid, or should I just go ahead and make the cookies.
>>>> I have nothing against China per se, just their food track record
>>>> isn't so hot...
>>>>
>>> Ginger? Lemme tell you that most of the commercial garlic around here
>>> is from China. Why China and not South America or Mexico, I dunno....
>>> but it's from China - so ask before you buy.
>>>
>>>
>> Why China? Probably because it's cheaper.
>
>
> When I started seeing garlic from China, I started growing my own -
> not because of any particular health concerns, but because there is
> something ecologically sinful about importing garlic from China.
>
> Think global, buy local.
>
> Boron
>
I agree entirely about the environmental issues associated with
importing food from so far away. However, given China's sanitation,
pollution and food safety issues, I'm not comfortable buying anything
edible from there for the foreseeable future.

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:20:15 -0500, flitterbit >
wrote:

>Boron Elgar wrote:

>>
>> When I started seeing garlic from China, I started growing my own -
>> not because of any particular health concerns, but because there is
>> something ecologically sinful about importing garlic from China.
>>
>> Think global, buy local.
>>
>> Boron
> >
>I agree entirely about the environmental issues associated with
>importing food from so far away. However, given China's sanitation,
>pollution and food safety issues, I'm not comfortable buying anything
>edible from there for the foreseeable future.

You're likely consuming it without knowing it. Few food manufacturers
make known the sources of all their ingredients and that is one reason
why.

I did a study for a client a few years ago who was looking to purchase
a major ingredient food concentrate from China and tested labeling
with various countries. China was not popular and this was way back in
the day before the major scares came up.

If China is exporting fresh garlic, they are also exporting dried,
powdered, flaked, etc and those products will be used by US
manufacturers. It isn't limited to garlic, either.

I have a package of Trader Joe's High Potency B "100" right here that
contains all sorts of things, including alfalfa powder, parsley
powder, rice bran and watercress powder. No sourcing whatsoever for
that or any of the other components of the B vitamins in the product.
All the package says is "Distributed & sold exclusively by.. Trader
Joe's...etc..

China is getting into the pharmaceutical markets in a big way, too.
You will not know if some component of the medication you are taking
or feeding your child comes from China. In many cases, the
manufacturer isn't sure where it comes from, either.

It isn' t that all Chinese exports are bad or dangerous, but this
country no longer has any sort of adequate structure to monitor
imports adequately or the food processors and manufacturers here in
the US. Where is Upton Sinclair when we need him?

Boron

"Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:20:15 -0500, flitterbit >
> wrote:

> I have a package of Trader Joe's High Potency B "100" right here that
> contains all sorts of things, including alfalfa powder, parsley
> powder, rice bran and watercress powder. No sourcing whatsoever for
> that or any of the other components of the B vitamins in the product.
> All the package says is "Distributed & sold exclusively by.. Trader
> Joe's...etc..


I've noticed "Distributed ......... Trader Joe's ...." quite a lot lately.
It makes me uncomfortable.


>
> China is getting into the pharmaceutical markets in a big way, too.
> You will not know if some component of the medication you are taking
> or feeding your child comes from China. In many cases, the
> manufacturer isn't sure where it comes from, either.


I don't know how true it is that 98% of vitamins are made in China -- yee
Gawds! Perhaps I'll just eat dog food instead.

>
> It isn' t that all Chinese exports are bad or dangerous, but this
> country no longer has any sort of adequate structure to monitor
> imports adequately or the food processors and manufacturers here in
> the US. Where is Upton Sinclair when we need him?
>
> Boron


Upton has been gone waaaaay tooo many years. The jungle has grown around
us. HELP!
Dee Dee

Steve Pope wrote:
>
>
> >They use treated sewage around here. It is applied in farms and orchards.
> >I came across an article a year or so ago about the risk of e-coli
> >contamination in organic produce because some of the organic farmers use
> >improperly composted manure.
>
> Sounds like BS to me.

LOL...... but it is more like PS or HS :-)


> Seriously, I believe the contamination problems have been from
> farms adjacent to the organic farms -- specifically pasture (which
> is more likely to get the humanure) next to vegetable farms.

Actually, the article I was referring to specifically stated that the
organic farms were applying improperly composted animal manure.

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> Steve Pope wrote:
>>
>>
>> >They use treated sewage around here. It is applied in farms and
>> >orchards.
>> >I came across an article a year or so ago about the risk of e-coli
>> >contamination in organic produce because some of the organic farmers use
>> >improperly composted manure.
>>
>> Sounds like BS to me.
>
> LOL...... but it is more like PS or HS :-)
>
>
>> Seriously, I believe the contamination problems have been from
>> farms adjacent to the organic farms -- specifically pasture (which
>> is more likely to get the humanure) next to vegetable farms.
>
> Actually, the article I was referring to specifically stated that the
> organic farms were applying improperly composted animal manure.


All organic farms?

By the way, around here, NON-organic farmers use fresh pig manure as an
adjunct to chemical fertilizers.

"Dee.Dee" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:20:15 -0500, flitterbit >
>> wrote:
>
>> I have a package of Trader Joe's High Potency B "100" right here that
>> contains all sorts of things, including alfalfa powder, parsley
>> powder, rice bran and watercress powder. No sourcing whatsoever for
>> that or any of the other components of the B vitamins in the product.
>> All the package says is "Distributed & sold exclusively by.. Trader
>> Joe's...etc..
>
>
> I've noticed "Distributed ......... Trader Joe's ...." quite a lot
> lately. It makes me uncomfortable.


Very few private label products are manufactured by the store itself.
"Distributed by..." has been the norm since the birth of private label
products 50-ish years ago.

On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 20:07:57 GMT, "JoeSpareBedroom"
> wrote:

>"Dee.Dee" > wrote in message
...
>>
>> "Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:20:15 -0500, flitterbit >
>>> wrote:
>>
>>> I have a package of Trader Joe's High Potency B "100" right here that
>>> contains all sorts of things, including alfalfa powder, parsley
>>> powder, rice bran and watercress powder. No sourcing whatsoever for
>>> that or any of the other components of the B vitamins in the product.
>>> All the package says is "Distributed & sold exclusively by.. Trader
>>> Joe's...etc..
>>
>>
>> I've noticed "Distributed ......... Trader Joe's ...." quite a lot
>> lately. It makes me uncomfortable.
>
>
>Very few private label products are manufactured by the store itself.
>"Distributed by..." has been the norm since the birth of private label
>products 50-ish years ago.
>

No one says it is just coming into use, I was only saying that we are
given no info about sourcing of ingredients.

Boron

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
>
> >> Seriously, I believe the contamination problems have been from
> >> farms adjacent to the organic farms -- specifically pasture (which
> >> is more likely to get the humanure) next to vegetable farms.
> >
> > Actually, the article I was referring to specifically stated that the
> > organic farms were applying improperly composted animal manure.
>
> All organic farms?

The organic farms the article was talking about.
>
> By the way, around here, NON-organic farmers use fresh pig manure as an
> adjunct to chemical fertilizers.

Good for them.

"Dee.Dee" > wrote in
:

> I've noticed "Distributed ......... Trader Joe's ...."
> quite a lot lately. It makes me uncomfortable.

have you tried writing (or calling) to corporate & voicing
your concerns about unlabelled sourcing? it particularly helps
if you can be specific about your concerns (I do not wish to
purchase anything from China) & explain that you will be
unable to buy from them until your concerns are answered in a
satisfactory to you manner. then get as many
friends/aquaintances as possible to send similar letters or
make similar calls.
if no one says anything or stops buying unlabeled stuff, why
should they change how they operate?

> I don't know how true it is that 98% of vitamins are made
> in China -- yee Gawds! Perhaps I'll just eat dog food
> instead.

it's quite probable. however, eating dogfood is rather a
suicidal answer, given where the dogfood ingredients come
from...

>> It isn' t that all Chinese exports are bad or dangerous,
>> but this country no longer has any sort of adequate
>> structure to monitor imports adequately or the food
>> processors and manufacturers here in the US. Where is
>> Upton Sinclair when we need him?

> Upton has been gone waaaaay tooo many years. The jungle
> has grown around us. HELP!

i was told by a high school student that The Jungle is no
longer on the reading lists. my guess is that the big
businesses now are paying big bucks to have it replaced with
something more innocuous, like The Handmaiden's Tale...
lee

Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:20:15 -0500, flitterbit >
> wrote:
>
>> Boron Elgar wrote:
>
>>> When I started seeing garlic from China, I started growing my own -
>>> not because of any particular health concerns, but because there is
>>> something ecologically sinful about importing garlic from China.
>>>
>>> Think global, buy local.
>>>
>>> Boron
>>>
>> I agree entirely about the environmental issues associated with
>> importing food from so far away. However, given China's sanitation,
>> pollution and food safety issues, I'm not comfortable buying anything
>> edible from there for the foreseeable future.
>
> You're likely consuming it without knowing it. Few food manufacturers
> make known the sources of all their ingredients and that is one reason
> why.
>
Possibly, but I check labels really carefully and purchase very little
processed food. I sometimes buy "Europe's Best" brand frozen fruits and
vegetables which do specify country of origin on the back; I can only
hope they're honest.

> I did a study for a client a few years ago who was looking to purchase
> a major ingredient food concentrate from China and tested labeling
> with various countries. China was not popular and this was way back in
> the day before the major scares came up.
>
> If China is exporting fresh garlic, they are also exporting dried,
> powdered, flaked, etc and those products will be used by US
> manufacturers. It isn't limited to garlic, either.
>
I don't use any form of garlic other than fresh and today at my local
grocer's purchased U.S.-grown garlic rather than the Chinese.
>
> I have a package of Trader Joe's High Potency B "100" right here that
> contains all sorts of things, including alfalfa powder, parsley
> powder, rice bran and watercress powder. No sourcing whatsoever for
> that or any of the other components of the B vitamins in the product.
> All the package says is "Distributed & sold exclusively by.. Trader
> Joe's...etc..
>
> China is getting into the pharmaceutical markets in a big way, too.
> You will not know if some component of the medication you are taking
> or feeding your child comes from China. In many cases, the
> manufacturer isn't sure where it comes from, either.
>
I know; as it stands, about 80% of the Vitamin C used around the world
originates in China.
>
> It isn' t that all Chinese exports are bad or dangerous, but this
> country no longer has any sort of adequate structure to monitor
> imports adequately or the food processors and manufacturers here in
> the US. Where is Upton Sinclair when we need him?
>
> Boron
>
We have the same problem here in Canada; our government decided a number
of years ago that it was perfectly fine to let manufacturers do their
own testing and disbanded the departments that used to do the job.

I know that all Chinese-produced goods aren't bad, but given the number
of problems that have arisen in recent months and the fact that most
problems aren't revealed until they actually become more serious
problems, I figure the best I can do is at least avoid overtly
Chinese-produced foodstuffs.

Dee.Dee wrote:
> "Boron Elgar" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:20:15 -0500, flitterbit >
>> wrote:
>
>> I have a package of Trader Joe's High Potency B "100" right here that
>> contains all sorts of things, including alfalfa powder, parsley
>> powder, rice bran and watercress powder. No sourcing whatsoever for
>> that or any of the other components of the B vitamins in the product.
>> All the package says is "Distributed & sold exclusively by.. Trader
>> Joe's...etc..
>
>
> I've noticed "Distributed ......... Trader Joe's ...." quite a lot lately.
> It makes me uncomfortable.
>
>
>> China is getting into the pharmaceutical markets in a big way, too.
>> You will not know if some component of the medication you are taking
>> or feeding your child comes from China. In many cases, the
>> manufacturer isn't sure where it comes from, either.
>
>
> I don't know how true it is that 98% of vitamins are made in China -- yee
> Gawds! Perhaps I'll just eat dog food instead.
>
Given the tainted pet food scandal of this past spring, I think dog food
is one of the last products I'd trust
>
>> It isn' t that all Chinese exports are bad or dangerous, but this
>> country no longer has any sort of adequate structure to monitor
>> imports adequately or the food processors and manufacturers here in
>> the US. Where is Upton Sinclair when we need him?
>>
>> Boron
>
>
> Upton has been gone waaaaay tooo many years. The jungle has grown around
> us. HELP!
> Dee Dee
>
>

Dave Smith > wrote:

>Steve Pope wrote:

>> Seriously, I believe the contamination problems have been from
>> farms adjacent to the organic farms -- specifically pasture (which
>> is more likely to get the humanure) next to vegetable farms.

>Actually, the article I was referring to specifically stated that the
>organic farms were applying improperly composted animal manure.

I do have this nascent fear that some of these hippie-style organic
farmers don't know their shit.

However, I've been buying produce from the Berkeley Farmers Markets
for years now and haven't gotten any intestinal problems. Either
it's pretty much okay, or I'm an asymptomatic carrier.

Steve