Steve Pope wrote:
> Goomba38 > wrote:

>>> I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
>>> return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.
>
>> That is contrary to everything I've ever read or seen.
>> http://www.realtor.org/press_room/ne...value2005.html

> Perhaps my information is old then; the above article says
> in 2002 a kitchen remodel would return only $0.66 on the
> dollar; but it's improved since then.
> Thanks for the data.
> Steve

I dream of redoing my kitchen. I just have to be careful of how much I
put into it because we're already at the higher end of our neighborhood
as far as improvements go. I sometimes watch or read the home
improvement shows/magazines and think the "before" pictures are
sometimes better looking than I have now and those people are changing
it yet again!??! Then again I see some photographs of folks kitchens
when they post food pics and I think "oh I sooooo do not have it that
bad!" so it all is relative, eh?

My cabinets are so well made (built on site, incredibly sturdy solid
wood construction) but so dated looking and with some wasted space. I
wish I could keep the boxes, improve on the wasted corners a bit and
reface them. My counters are a dreadful formica "butcher block" that I
want to replace but until I decide what to do about the cabinets I
can't. I feel a bit paralyzed by indecision. <sigh>

Nancy Young wrote:
>
> I hear realtors say that kitchens and bathrooms sell houses. I can
> see that because those are costly remodels that home buyers might
> not want to do. I think if you have a hell hole in place of a kitchen,
> it might be worth putting some money into it if you want to sell above
> fixer-upper prices.

More likely, superficial changes will have a higher
return for your money, which is called "home staging".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Home_staging

A friend of a friend does this by fabricating fake
furniture from boxes and upholstery, and creating
fake abstract art from housepaint. She does such
a good job that home buyers often want to keep the
fake stuff when they buy houses she's staged.

Sheldon wrote:
> On Dec 12, 2:26�pm, Goomba38 > wrote:
>> Steve Pope wrote:
>>> I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
>>> return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.
>> That is contrary to everything I've ever read or seen.http://www.realtor.org/press_room/ne...ostvsvalue2005....
>
> Your article says you lose money on a kitchen remodel.
>
> "Many homeowners who complete midrange bathroom remodels can expect to
> make money; the cost on a national average for this project is
> $10,499, and the return is $10,727, or 102.2 percent, compared with
> 87.5 percent in 2002. On average, major midrange kitchen remodels cost
> $43,862 and return $39,920, or 91 percent of the costs to remodel."
>
I'm willing to "lose" 9% of the cost for the pleasure and enjoyment in
it. I think a 91% return is pretty damn good since it would give me what
*I* want.

On Dec 12, 2:44�pm, (Steve Pope) wrote:
> Sheldon > wrote:
> > Goomba writes
> >> Steve Pope wrote:
> >>> I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
> >>> return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.
> >> That is contrary to everything I've ever read or
> >> seen.http://www.realtor.org/press_room/ne...ostvsvalue2005....
> >Your article says you lose money on a kitchen remodel.
> >"Many homeowners who complete midrange bathroom remodels can expect to
> >make money; the cost on a national average for this project is
> >$10,499, and the return is $10,727, or 102.2 percent, compared with
> >87.5 percent in 2002. On average, major midrange kitchen remodels cost
> >$43,862 and return $39,920, or 91 percent of the costs to remodel."
>
> Right, the article basically says the return on a kitchen remodel
> improved from negative 40% in 2002 to negative 10% in 2005.
> But since 2005 was the middle of the boom, any sort of return
> measured that year is inflated. �The historical number and long-term
> average is probably more like the negative 40% figure.
>
> Steve

Of course, everything in a kitchen depreciates, rapidly. All
appliances are worth about half the day they leave the showroom. The
kitchen sink regardless you paid a grand for fancy schmancy, once used
is worth maybe 10pct what you paid. Flooring, once walked on has the
same value as any kind of flooring.. flooring is real easy to change.
Cabinets are really furniture, no one pays much for used furniture
unless it's a rare antique. No used countertop is worth more than
another used countertop... anyone with a few thou extra can buy new
granite... and a lot of the price is labor, labor ain't too much
different regardless the material.

Goomba38 > wrote:

>I dream of redoing my kitchen. I just have to be careful of how much I
>put into it because we're already at the higher end of our neighborhood
>as far as improvements go. I sometimes watch or read the home
>improvement shows/magazines and think the "before" pictures are
>sometimes better looking than I have now and those people are changing
>it yet again!??! Then again I see some photographs of folks kitchens
>when they post food pics and I think "oh I sooooo do not have it that
>bad!" so it all is relative, eh?
>
>My cabinets are so well made (built on site, incredibly sturdy solid
>wood construction) but so dated looking and with some wasted space. I
>wish I could keep the boxes, improve on the wasted corners a bit and
>reface them. My counters are a dreadful formica "butcher block" that I
>want to replace but until I decide what to do about the cabinets I
>can't. I feel a bit paralyzed by indecision. <sigh>

There is some wasted space in our kitchen as well -- the water
heater is in one corner, and behind it is some dead space
including the original (smaller) water heater cabinet.
A remodel would move the water heater out, add about six feet of
L-shaped counter/cabinets, replacing a yellow formica table
that now sits near the corner.

I would want to match the existing 20's-era tile counters, if
that is at all possible, but I've never checked into the
feasibility of this. I suspect it's difficult.

Steve

Steve Pope > wrote:

> I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
> return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.

I have heard both that kitchen remodels never pay for themselves
at resale time, and that they can easily pay for themselves.
Both opinions from supposed experts in the field. Personally,
I'd only do a kitchen upgrade for myself. Not for some possible
future buyer. Of course, I don't plan to move any time soon
if ever. The value of my house will increase almost no matter
what I do, but I will redo the kitchen eventually because *I*
want it different, not as part of some misguided attempt to
increase my house value. What counter tops will I put in?
I don't know. I kind of like granite, but I might change
my mind about that. Formica is OK, if done right, but I just
don't know if that is what I will want. Maybe a mix with
some granite "landing zones" near the stove and Formica
elsewhere.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, Va.

Janet Baraclough wrote:
>
> Granite and corian, will be old hat in a decade or so. Retro kitchens
> from the 50's and 60's, are already on their way back in.. and guess
> what, they have new formica tops fitted.


A cute story on this. My parents' home had the gas stove/oven from the
1950s when the house was built. It was working fine. A fire behind the
stove caused them to do considerable refurbishing and redecorating.
They bought a new stove, a fancy one that, to my eye, looks very new and
snazzy. The man who did a lot of the installing and building and
handiwork was in charge of disposing of the old one. He told them that
their old 1950s stove was probably worth a fair amount to someone
interested in the retro look. My parents took him seriously, considered
the money they might make selling the old stove, and asked him if he'd
like the old stove as a tip. He was delighted.


--Lia

On Dec 12, 3:47�pm, Janet Baraclough >
wrote:
> The message >
> from jay > contains these words:
>
> > On Sun, 9 Dec 2007 19:06:47 GMT, Janet Baraclough wrote:
> > > The message
> > > >
> > > from rosie > contains these words:
>
> > >> Most homes today are built with either granite or
> > >> some sort of corian type material.
>
> > > � �Really? �Which planet are you posting from?
>
> > > � � Janet.
> > You must not get out much. �Even in the UK they have some granite don't
> > they?
>
> � �Of course; but �that's a long, long way from claiming "MOST homes
> today are built with either granite or corian " kitchen surfaces, as the
> OP did. Those materials are too expensive here, to be fitted in MOST
> homes.


Actually there are compartively few homes in the US with granite and
other costly custom counters... the vast, vast majority of folks have
ordinary plastic laminate counters like they sell at Home Depot...
don't let the BSers fool you. Most people in the US don't own their
own home, most rent and I haven't seen any ordinary working folks
rentals with designer kitchens. And of those who do have their own
homes the vast, vast majority are very ordinary abodes, typical cookie
cutter tract homes are the norm... kitchens are functional but nothing
to put in House Beautiful.

> wrote in message ...
> Steve Pope > wrote:
>
>> I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
>> return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.
>
> I have heard both that kitchen remodels never pay for themselves
> at resale time, and that they can easily pay for themselves.
> Both opinions from supposed experts in the field. Personally,
> I'd only do a kitchen upgrade for myself. Not for some possible
> future buyer. Of course, I don't plan to move any time soon
> if ever. The value of my house will increase almost no matter
> what I do, but I will redo the kitchen eventually because *I*
> want it different, not as part of some misguided attempt to
> increase my house value. What counter tops will I put in?
> I don't know. I kind of like granite, but I might change
> my mind about that. Formica is OK, if done right, but I just
> don't know if that is what I will want. Maybe a mix with
> some granite "landing zones" near the stove and Formica
> elsewhere.
>
> Bill Ranck
> Blacksburg, Va.


Someone may benefit from these figures on different choices. Last fall I
had approx. 52 sf countertops replaced. These price comparisons were done
by one company, and each comparison is of my choice of granite, zodiak,
Corian, Solaris and Cambria, not what someone else would choose in those
different products. I was not under any price restrictions, DH said to
chose what I wanted.

I just looked at my order to make sure I am posting correctly.

My choice of granite was within the $3600 to $5400 range.
My choice of Zodiak was withing the $3900 to $5000 range.

My choice of Corian was $3,200 to $5,800, although it was not something I
really wanted. It was just given as a comparison point.
My choice of Solaris was $3200-$3700. I can't remember what that was except
the quartz engineering, possibly.

My choice was Cambria which fell within the middle price of first two above:
granite and Zodiak.


We are not thinking of resale either. It needed done.

HTH anyone,
Dee Dee

Janet Baraclough wrote:

> The message >
> from "Nancy Young" > contains these words:
>
>
> > I hear realtors say that kitchens and bathrooms sell houses.
>
> Here, they say that a house sells (or not) on the front doorstep
> and in the first minute after entry. First impressions are the
> deciding factor. House groomers pay a lot of attention to the
> approach to the front door, the front door, and the entrance hall.

"They" say a lot of things.




Brian

--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)

wrote:

> Steve Pope > wrote:
>
> > I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
> > return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.
>
> I have heard both that kitchen remodels never pay for themselves
> at resale time, and that they can easily pay for themselves.

A lot depends on the market. If, like my area, 3 bed/2 bath ranches go
for about $150k, a $30k kitchen remodel ain't gonna get you $180k.




Brian

--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)

"Default User" > wrote in message
...
> Janet Baraclough wrote:
>
>> The message >
>> from "Nancy Young" > contains these words:
>>
>>
>> > I hear realtors say that kitchens and bathrooms sell houses.
>>
>> Here, they say that a house sells (or not) on the front doorstep
>> and in the first minute after entry. First impressions are the
>> deciding factor. House groomers pay a lot of attention to the
>> approach to the front door, the front door, and the entrance hall.
>
> "They" say a lot of things.
>
>
>
>
> Brian


We've owned 5 houses and I thought about what you said about first
impressions.


1st house -- walking into the house- wow! the plan and the view once I was
in.
2nd house -- walking onto the property - wow! gorgeous.
3rd house -- house was total wood, outside was the beach! both got me - wow!
4th house -- individual owner plan -- I loved his plan -- wow! loved the
huge mudroom entrance -- got me!
5th house -- walking onto the property - pure country with a decent house

Dee Dee

jay wrote:

> Your wish can come true. Leave the bases and reface the cabinet doors and
> drawers. Solid surface counter tops add a great appearance and work
> surface..and they don't even have to be granite. Formica actually sells
> solid surface material and -- http://www.icestone.biz/new/ --- in
> Brooklyn, NY has some fantastic looking solid slabs. On my next kitchen I
> will most likely use the icestone product.

I've considered it for sure.. I wish I knew someone who'd done it so I
could see it first hand...?
I'll check out the icestone. I've never heard of it before?

"Dee.Dee" wrote:
>
> Someone may benefit from these figures on different choices. �Last fall I
> had approx. 52 sf countertops replaced. �These price comparisons were done
> by one company, and each comparison is of my choice of granite, zodiak,
> Corian, Solaris and Cambria, not what someone else would choose in those
> different products. � I was not under any price restrictions, DH said to
> chose what I wanted.
>
> I just looked at my order to make sure I am posting correctly.
>
> My choice of granite was within the $3600 to $5400 range.

Is that all 52 sq ft of granite costs... what are folks getting so all
worked up and uppity about.. that's peanuts for that much new counter
top. I never seriously priced granite but with the way people are
carrying on I'm thinking it must cost like 15-20 thousand dollars for
granite counters... 3-5 grand for counters that will last an entire
lifetime is chicken feed... I spent that much on my PC... people
spend more on a mediocre TV system that will be obsolete in five
years.

SHELDON

On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:51:00 +0000 (UTC),
(Steve Pope) wrote:
>
>We spent just $2000 fixing up our kitchen, but in retrospect
>I should have hired a pro to do the wallpaper. I will never,
>ever do wallpaper again. ;-)
>
I tried it once and was disappointed to discover that it's a lot
harder than people would like you to believe.

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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:54:07 -0500, "Dee.Dee" >
wrote:

>
>"Default User" > wrote in message
...
>> Janet Baraclough wrote:
>>
>>> The message >
>>> from "Nancy Young" > contains these words:
>>>
>>>
>>> > I hear realtors say that kitchens and bathrooms sell houses.
>>>
>>> Here, they say that a house sells (or not) on the front doorstep
>>> and in the first minute after entry. First impressions are the
>>> deciding factor. House groomers pay a lot of attention to the
>>> approach to the front door, the front door, and the entrance hall.
>>
>> "They" say a lot of things.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Brian
>
>
>We've owned 5 houses and I thought about what you said about first
>impressions.
>
>
>1st house -- walking into the house- wow! the plan and the view once I was
>in.
>2nd house -- walking onto the property - wow! gorgeous.
>3rd house -- house was total wood, outside was the beach! both got me - wow!
>4th house -- individual owner plan -- I loved his plan -- wow! loved the
>huge mudroom entrance -- got me!
>5th house -- walking onto the property - pure country with a decent house
>

IMO: To motivate a buyer, it's all "curb appeal"... to get them to
sign on the dotted line takes more. In this day and age, most people
want a turn key home - so a decent upgrade is worthwhile when they are
spending serious money. Spend the money and do a decent remodel
(which fits into the neighborhood prices) or don't and call it a fixer
upper.

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On Tue, 11 Dec 2007 20:19:07 GMT, Janet Baraclough
> wrote:

>The message >
>from Goomba38 > contains these words:
>
>
>>Supposedly almost every penny put into a good kitchen
>> makeover will come back to you, perhaps 1.5 to 2 times so even.
>
> Not necessarily. It depends on what you spend on the kitchen
>proportional to the value of the building and similar ones nearby.
>Installing a luxury kitchen costing 100,000 into one small cheap house
>in a development of identical small cheap houses, will not increase the
> market value of that house by 200,000.
>
A $50,000 kitchen remodel in a $1,000,000 home *will* return 100% of
your investment.

Because you want to think of impossible scenarios, I will say:
Provided it was owned long enough to have some equity or it was bought
below market for the neighborhood.

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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:55:18 -0500, Goomba38 >
wrote:

>I sometimes watch or read the home
>improvement shows/magazines and think the "before" pictures are
>sometimes better looking than I have now and those people are changing
>it yet again!??!


You too? I thought I was the only one. LOL!

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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:55:18 -0500, Goomba38 >
wrote:

>My cabinets are so well made (built on site, incredibly sturdy solid
>wood construction) but so dated looking and with some wasted space. I
>wish I could keep the boxes, improve on the wasted corners a bit and
>reface them.

I think if you look at "refacing", you'll be pleasantly surprised.

>My counters are a dreadful formica "butcher block" that I
>want to replace but until I decide what to do about the cabinets I
>can't. I feel a bit paralyzed by indecision. <sigh>

Hey, Formica comes in other patterns. LOL!

In any case, you live in a metropolitan area. Granite is now sold in
2'x8' lengths which include a finished edge. If you spend $300 for
the slab, that's expensive. Cuts for the sink are only $100. It's
possible now to buy slabs that are finished on 3 sides and finishing
off the 4th won't cost very much. Look around, it won't cost you
anything!

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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 22:37:36 +0000 (UTC),
(Steve Pope) wrote:

>I would want to match the existing 20's-era tile counters, if
>that is at all possible, but I've never checked into the
>feasibility of this. I suspect it's difficult.

Check it out. Retro is in full swing in this area!

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<sf> wrote in message news
> On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:51:00 +0000 (UTC),
> (Steve Pope) wrote:
>>
>>We spent just $2000 fixing up our kitchen, but in retrospect
>>I should have hired a pro to do the wallpaper. I will never,
>>ever do wallpaper again. ;-)
>>
> I tried it once and was disappointed to discover that it's a lot
> harder than people would like you to believe.
>


Years ago we decided to paper our living room and two other rooms. I still
think of that design and love it (for that house). It was around Christmas
time. DH decided he would do it, but m-i-l and f-i-l came for a visit for
Christmas and DH learned that wall-papering is not an easy deal. His father
helped him finish the job, as f-i-l had done it all his life as a side-job
for their 'traveling money.' We had company coming in Christmas and I was a
nervous nellie as to whether the rooms would get finished and so tired to
not be able to enjoy anything.

Half of our house now is papered. AFAIC, I don't care if it ever gets
re-papered. I'm sure not going to be helping or even supervising it.

Dee Dee

> wrote:

>On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 22:37:36 +0000 (UTC),

>>I would want to match the existing 20's-era tile counters, if
>>that is at all possible, but I've never checked into the
>>feasibility of this. I suspect it's difficult.

>Check it out. Retro is in full swing in this area!

Yeah, I know.

I've seen many 20's-era houses with similar kitchen tile,
but not the exact colors (although some have come close).
The primary color is a beige and the secondary a burgundy.
Plus I don't know how feasible it is to work with salvaged
tile. (I'm sure somebody has managed to do it.)

Ceramic tile isn't as durable as granite, but I don't
do things directly on the counters anyway. Things will set on
top of counters, but they are not banged into or chopped
upon.

Steve

On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:29:39 -0500, Goomba38 >
wrote:

>
>The following is the reprint of the Consumer's Reports article that ran
>recently. Pretty common sense but may be of interest to those who are
>considering any of the following...
>
>http://www.chathamjournal.com/weekly...pe-70731.shtml

CR Advice: Choose a lower-priced dishwasher that blends top cleaning
with quietness and shorter cycle times.

I don't move so my *new* dishwasher experiences are few and far
between and *I* think manufacturers go to extremes to hide the number
of minutes a cleaning cycle takes.


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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 10:31:33 -0500, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>Lou Decruss wrote:
>>
>
>> >
>> >Odd and contrary to everything I read or see about home renovations.
>> >Could it be for another reason such as overpricing the house above what
>> >the neighborhood can stand?
>>
>> Exactly. This house was in a lower middle class neighborhood.
>> Upgraded counter tops might have helped the house sell faster, but
>> would have had no influence on the price.
>
>If a house has no kitchen, adding one would increase the value. The same
>goes for bathrooms and additional facilities. Taking a shabby little
>kitchen, expanding it and putting in a proper kitchen should add some
>value, but as you say, upgrading a counter top when there already was one
>is not going to add value. For that matter, people moving in may not even
>like the countertop you put in.

That could be true if your area doesn't appreciate. It's also true if
your taste is in the toilet, so the remodel ends up like a piece of
you know what.

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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 04:31:20 +0000 (UTC),
(Steve Pope) wrote:

>Plus I don't know how feasible it is to work with salvaged
>tile. (I'm sure somebody has managed to do it.)

If you can find salvaged tile in your tones, go for it! The trick is
in the demolition, not the installation.

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On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 23:23:02 -0500, "Dee.Dee" >
wrote:

>Half of our house now is papered. AFAIC, I don't care if it ever gets
>re-papered. I'm sure not going to be helping or even supervising it.

Thank your lucky star that wallpaper is not the current craze.



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Oh pshaw, on Wed 12 Dec 2007 11:48:53p, meant to say...

> On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 23:23:02 -0500, "Dee.Dee" >
> wrote:
>
>>Half of our house now is papered. AFAIC, I don't care if it ever gets
>>re-papered. I'm sure not going to be helping or even supervising it.
>
> Thank your lucky star that wallpaper is not the current craze.
>
>
>

I love wallpaper, but it isn't at all popular in Arizona. Every house we
owned in Ohio was fully papered. Some of the rooms had papered ceilings.
Our oldest house, a Victorian, had upholstered walls in every room but the
kitchen and baths. I love the atmosphere wallcoverings create.

--
Wayne Boatwright

Date: December(XII) 12th(XII),2007(MMVII)

*******************************************
Countdown 'til Christmas
1wks 3dys 18hrs 40mins 22secs
*******************************************
Research causes cancer in rats.
*******************************************

On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 06:57:10 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

>I love wallpaper, but it isn't at all popular in Arizona. Every house we
>owned in Ohio was fully papered. Some of the rooms had papered ceilings.
>Our oldest house, a Victorian, had upholstered walls in every room but the

I like wallpaper too, but we're showing our "age"! Today, paint is
fashionable.

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Oh pshaw, on Thu 13 Dec 2007 12:00:42a, meant to say...

> On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 06:57:10 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> > wrote:
>
>>I love wallpaper, but it isn't at all popular in Arizona. Every house we
>>owned in Ohio was fully papered. Some of the rooms had papered ceilings.
>>Our oldest house, a Victorian, had upholstered walls in every room but
the
>
> I like wallpaper too, but we're showing our "age"! Today, paint is
> fashionable.
>

But Barbara, I don't furnish or decorate a house to be fashionable. I do
it to be comfortable and enjoy the things I like. Life's too short to
simply be "fashionable". As far as what other people think...people used
to say that I lived in a museum. But they never stopped looking around. :-)

--
Wayne Boatwright

Date: December(XII) 12th(XII),2007(MMVII)

*******************************************
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On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 07:06:25 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

>As far as what other people think...people used
>to say that I lived in a museum. But they never stopped looking around. :-)

Oh, are you the guy who had glass fronted cases full or antiques and
collectibles? I knew someone like that. My house isn't that focused,
but I could use a full time duster anyway....



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Giusi wrote:

> You've had lots of opinion, practically no experience. You might want to
> try a site where people don't HAVE to say something whether they know the
> answer or not. There must be some compaison sites somewhere.

No kidding. I was hoping for "we have soapstone countertops and we
love/hate them because...". This was a place to start. We're in the
planning stages for the new house and this is just one of many research
items on my list.

--Charlene


--
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swimming pool.


email perronnellec at earthlink . net

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote

> I love wallpaper, but it isn't at all popular in Arizona. Every house we
> owned in Ohio was fully papered. Some of the rooms had papered ceilings.
> Our oldest house, a Victorian, had upholstered walls in every room but the
> kitchen and baths. I love the atmosphere wallcoverings create.

I have a hallway covered with stringcloth I need to take down.
Bad enough it's old, when I got Moxie she found it to be a
fabulous! scratching surface. Luckily, I put it up, so I know the
walls are sized because I did it.

After Christmas. I'd love to faux paint a linen look to replace it,
but I don't know if I can pull that one off. No pun intended.

nancy

sf wrote:
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> >
> >I love wallpaper, but it isn't at all popular in Arizona. Every house we
> >owned in Ohio was fully papered. Some of the rooms had papered ceilings.
> >Our oldest house, a Victorian, had upholstered walls in every room but the
>
> I like wallpaper too, but we're showing our "age"! Today, paint is
> fashionable.

Wallpaper in any room other than bath and kitchen negatively affects
the home's marketability... today people overwhelmingly prefer
paint... paper removal is a major job as is refinishing the wall to
accept paint, often paper removal will destroy a wall necessitating
new sheetrock. And paper must be removed before repapering or
painting. Think very carefully before papering, very few prospective
buyers will appreciate your taste. Years ago when walls were plaster
and lath papering was typical for hiding flaws but no more. Even
baths and kitchens are not typically papered anymore... the type of
covering for those rooms was not paper anyway, it was a moisture
resistant plasticized covering to protect the wall from moisture
damage, but today there is waterproof sheetrock, and in most
municipalities the building code requires with new construction or
remodels that all sheetrock in baths be of the waterproof type,
typically colored a light green.

SHELDON

jay wrote:
>
> In our area the faux finishes are being painted or papered over. Very
> expensive wallpaper with texture is becoming popular. �
>
> jay gordianno

Sure, goes with your clear plastic covered upholstered furniture...
WOP Renaissance! LOL

On Dec 12, 10:52�pm, sf wrote:
> On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 19:54:07 -0500, "Dee.Dee" >
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >"Default User" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> Janet Baraclough wrote:
>
> >>> The message >
> >>> from "Nancy Young" > contains these words:
>
> >>> > I hear realtors say that kitchens and bathrooms sell houses.
>
> >>> � �Here, they say that a house sells (or not) on the front doorstep
> >>> and in the first minute after entry. First impressions are the
> >>> deciding factor. House groomers pay a lot of attention to the
> >>> approach to the front door, the front door, and the entrance hall.
>
> >> "They" say a lot of things.
>
> >> Brian
>
> >We've owned 5 houses and I thought about what you said about first
> >impressions.
>
> >1st house -- walking into the house- wow! �the plan and the view once I was
> >in.
> >2nd house -- walking onto the property - wow! gorgeous.
> >3rd house -- house was total wood, outside was the beach! both got me - wow!
> >4th house -- individual owner plan -- I loved his plan -- wow! loved the
> >huge mudroom entrance -- got me!
> >5th house -- walking onto the property - pure country with a decent house
>
> IMO: �To motivate a buyer, it's all "curb appeal"... to get them to
> sign on the dotted line takes more. �In this day and age, most people
> want a turn key home - so a decent upgrade is worthwhile when they are
> spending serious money. �Spend the money and do a decent remodel
> (which fits into the neighborhood prices) or don't and call it a fixer
> upper. �


Dated doesn't equate to fixer upper. Many folks prefer older homes
left original. Fixer upper means in major disrepair, not old/worn.
And many people search for fixer uppers, especially building
contractors, they buy cheap, refurbish between jobs, and sell at a
large profit. Many first time home buyers will purchase a fixer upper
because it's what they can afford plus they have a good eye for
inherent value... they do all the repairs themselves over a few years
and then sell at a huge profit... many people do this all their lives
as sort of a hobby... This Old House is definitely not a new concept.
I've done the fixer upper thing myself, in two years I walked away
with a bundle. Add don't let anyone tell you there aren't great buys
out there, I find them every day.

This is a steal: http://realtyusa.com/detail.php?k=27117241&PT=38

SHELDON

Oh pshaw, on Thu 13 Dec 2007 12:52:53a, meant to say...

> On Thu, 13 Dec 2007 07:06:25 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> > wrote:
>
>>As far as what other people think...people used to say that I lived in a
>>museum. But they never stopped looking around. :-)
>
> Oh, are you the guy who had glass fronted cases full or antiques and
> collectibles? I knew someone like that. My house isn't that focused,
> but I could use a full time duster anyway....
>
>
>

Yes, that would pretty much be me. :-) If most things were in display
cabinets I would have a full time career as a professional duster. :-)

--
Wayne Boatwright

Date: December(XII) 12th(XII),2007(MMVII)

*******************************************
Countdown 'til Christmas
1wks 3dys 18hrs 40mins 22secs
*******************************************
Research causes cancer in rats.
*******************************************

Oh pshaw, on Thu 13 Dec 2007 06:18:18a, Nancy Young meant to say...

>
> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote
>
>> I love wallpaper, but it isn't at all popular in Arizona. Every house
we
>> owned in Ohio was fully papered. Some of the rooms had papered
ceilings.
>> Our oldest house, a Victorian, had upholstered walls in every room but
the
>> kitchen and baths. I love the atmosphere wallcoverings create.
>
> I have a hallway covered with stringcloth I need to take down.
> Bad enough it's old, when I got Moxie she found it to be a
> fabulous! scratching surface. Luckily, I put it up, so I know the
> walls are sized because I did it.
>
> After Christmas. I'd love to faux paint a linen look to replace it,
> but I don't know if I can pull that one off. No pun intended.
>
> nancy
>
>
>

I used to really love stringcloth and grasscloth. I can just imagine how
enticing stringcloth would be to a kitty!

When grasscloth aged enough to have a "tired" look, we would frequently
paint o glaze it for a wonderful texture on the wall. It takes paint well.

--
Wayne Boatwright

Date: December(XII) 12th(XII),2007(MMVII)

*******************************************
Countdown 'til Christmas
1wks 3dys 18hrs 40mins 22secs
*******************************************
Research causes cancer in rats.
*******************************************

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote

> Oh pshaw, on Thu 13 Dec 2007 06:18:18a, Nancy Young meant to say...

>> I have a hallway covered with stringcloth I need to take down.
>> Bad enough it's old, when I got Moxie she found it to be a
>> fabulous! scratching surface. Luckily, I put it up, so I know the
>> walls are sized because I did it.

> When grasscloth aged enough to have a "tired" look, we would frequently
> paint o glaze it for a wonderful texture on the wall. It takes paint
> well.

I've seen that done and look very nice. It's not out of consideration
yet, though I have removed some of the wallpaper.

nancy

On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:55:18 -0500, Goomba38 >
wrote:

>Steve Pope wrote:
>> Goomba38 > wrote:
>
>>>> I have always heard that kitchen remodeling has the lowest
>>>> return of any major upgrade, about $0.50 on the dollar.
>>
>>> That is contrary to everything I've ever read or seen.
>>> http://www.realtor.org/press_room/ne...value2005.html
>
>> Perhaps my information is old then; the above article says
>> in 2002 a kitchen remodel would return only $0.66 on the
>> dollar; but it's improved since then.
>> Thanks for the data.
>> Steve
>
>I dream of redoing my kitchen. I just have to be careful of how much I
>put into it because we're already at the higher end of our neighborhood
>as far as improvements go. I sometimes watch or read the home
>improvement shows/magazines and think the "before" pictures are
>sometimes better looking than I have now and those people are changing
>it yet again!??! Then again I see some photographs of folks kitchens
>when they post food pics and I think "oh I sooooo do not have it that
>bad!" so it all is relative, eh?
>
>My cabinets are so well made (built on site, incredibly sturdy solid
>wood construction) but so dated looking and with some wasted space. I
>wish I could keep the boxes, improve on the wasted corners a bit and
>reface them. My counters are a dreadful formica "butcher block" that I
>want to replace but until I decide what to do about the cabinets I
>can't. I feel a bit paralyzed by indecision. <sigh>

indecision is underrated. sometimes it saves you a lot of money.

your pal,
blake

On Wed, 12 Dec 2007 14:26:22 -0600, jay > wrote:

> Life is short and you can't have much fun from the grave.
>
>jay

maybe so, maybe not. i have handsomely remembered in my will a
necrophiliac just in case.

your pal,
blake