I made some sourdough starter this afternoon, or perhaps just started it
since it won't actually be ready for 2-3 days. The recipe called for skim
milk, buttermilk, white flour, and whole wheat flour, I would have to look
in the cookbook that I used to get the exact proportions. I had everything
but the buttermilk, but when I actually started making it, I got a little
worried that the skim milk I had might be going bad. Not just "soured", but
actually starting to spoil. Luckily, it wasn't, so I just went ahead and
used it.

If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option would
have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been the best as
the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have almost a quart of
buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.

Adding water instead of the skim milk would not really work. At least I
dont think it would because I think that the flavor of sourdough comes from
the lactic acid in milk being metabolized by the natural yeast into
whatever.

I am not certain whether soy milk would have worked at all, as it does not
have any lactic acid, or at least I don't think it does.

Probably the best is to use some water mised with about 1/3 cup dry skim
milk, but I don't have any powdered milk, so I would have had to run to the
store a second time to get some. If I did that, I might as well buy some
skim milk that the recipe called for in the first place.

Also, most "buttermilk bread" recipes seem to be just standard bread recipes
with buttermilk instead of water, so could I just use the recipe I usually
use, but instead of using 1-1/4 cups water using 1-1/4 cups buttermilk, so
as to use some of the buttermilk I bought for the starter.

Brian Christiansen

"Brian Christiansen" > wrote in
:

> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option
> would have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been
> the best as the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have
> almost a quart of buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.
>

Go to one of those scoop and weigh places...they sell powdered buttermilk.
That way you aren't stuck with stuff to use up.

--

The house of the burning beet-Alan

A man in line at the bank kept falling over...when he got to a teller he
asked for his balance.

On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 04:00:21 GMT, hahabogus > wrote:

>"Brian Christiansen" > wrote in
:
>
>> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option
>> would have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been
>> the best as the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have
>> almost a quart of buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.
>>
>
>Go to one of those scoop and weigh places...they sell powdered buttermilk.
>That way you aren't stuck with stuff to use up.

Sadly, I haven't seen buttermilk sold that way in years. In fact,
I've put it on the shopping list several times and hubby swears the
biggest Safeways in my area don't have it (boxed) on a shelf. I need
to make a grocery store visit soon to check this out first hand.

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Brian Christiansen wrote:
> I made some sourdough starter this afternoon, or perhaps just started it
> since it won't actually be ready for 2-3 days. The recipe called for skim
> milk, buttermilk, white flour, and whole wheat flour, I would have to look
> in the cookbook that I used to get the exact proportions. I had everything
> but the buttermilk, but when I actually started making it, I got a little
> worried that the skim milk I had might be going bad. Not just "soured", but
> actually starting to spoil. Luckily, it wasn't, so I just went ahead and
> used it.
>
> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option would
> have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been the best as
> the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have almost a quart of
> buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.
>
> Adding water instead of the skim milk would not really work. At least I
> dont think it would because I think that the flavor of sourdough comes from
> the lactic acid in milk being metabolized by the natural yeast into
> whatever.
>


IIRC, real sourdough starter is just flour and water. No milk, no
sugar, and no yeast. It takes a while to get going. If you have it,
use some rye flour in the initial starter, then you can feed it with
wheat flour once it gets going.

Bob

Brian Christiansen wrote:
> I made some sourdough starter this afternoon, or perhaps just started
> it since it won't actually be ready for 2-3 days. The recipe called
> for skim milk, buttermilk, white flour, and whole wheat flour, I
> would have to look in the cookbook that I used to get the exact
> proportions. I had everything but the buttermilk, but when I
> actually started making it, I got a little worried that the skim milk
> I had might be going bad. Not just "soured", but actually starting
> to spoil. Luckily, it wasn't, so I just went ahead and used it.
snip
>
> Brian Christiansen

Real sourdough doesn't use anything but flour and water. Rye flour or whole
wheat flour will give the quickest results and then you may go on to move
the culture to white flour if you wish. The recipe you describe is making a
"sour" dough so if your milk has gone off I would think it would put you
ahead of the game. What do you think is going to happen to the milk in the
recipe over the next several days -- it's going to sour.
Janet

In article >, sf wrote:

> On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 04:00:21 GMT, hahabogus > wrote:
>
> >"Brian Christiansen" > wrote in
> :
> >
> >> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option
> >> would have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been
> >> the best as the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have
> >> almost a quart of buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.
> >>
> >
> >Go to one of those scoop and weigh places...they sell powdered buttermilk.
> >That way you aren't stuck with stuff to use up.
>
> Sadly, I haven't seen buttermilk sold that way in years. In fact,
> I've put it on the shopping list several times and hubby swears the
> biggest Safeways in my area don't have it (boxed) on a shelf. I need
> to make a grocery store visit soon to check this out first hand.

I used to buy powdered buttermilk all of the time. Haven't done so of
late. It's in a pink round canister with a chef's image on the label,
IIRC.

Cindy

--
C.J. Fuller

Delete the obvious to email me

In article >,
"Brian Christiansen" > wrote:

> I made some sourdough starter this afternoon, or perhaps just started it
> since it won't actually be ready for 2-3 days. The recipe called for skim
> milk, buttermilk, white flour, and whole wheat flour, I would have to look
> in the cookbook that I used to get the exact proportions. I had everything
> but the buttermilk, but when I actually started making it, I got a little
> worried that the skim milk I had might be going bad. Not just "soured", but
> actually starting to spoil. Luckily, it wasn't, so I just went ahead and
> used it.
>
> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option would
> have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been the best as
> the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have almost a quart of
> buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.
>
> Adding water instead of the skim milk would not really work. At least I
> dont think it would because I think that the flavor of sourdough comes from
> the lactic acid in milk being metabolized by the natural yeast into
> whatever.
>
> I am not certain whether soy milk would have worked at all, as it does not
> have any lactic acid, or at least I don't think it does.
>
> Probably the best is to use some water mised with about 1/3 cup dry skim
> milk, but I don't have any powdered milk, so I would have had to run to the
> store a second time to get some. If I did that, I might as well buy some
> skim milk that the recipe called for in the first place.
>
> Also, most "buttermilk bread" recipes seem to be just standard bread recipes
> with buttermilk instead of water, so could I just use the recipe I usually
> use, but instead of using 1-1/4 cups water using 1-1/4 cups buttermilk, so
> as to use some of the buttermilk I bought for the starter.
>
> Brian Christiansen

Soy milk has no lactose (milk sugar) for the yeast or bacteria to
ferment to lactic acid. Soy milk has an entirely different chemical
makeup than cows' milk. It has about 1/3 of the carbs of milk per 8
ounces, and none of them are simple sugars. (So saith my trusty Bowes &
Church's Food Values of Portions Commonly Used, 17th ed.) I have no
clue what you'd get if you used soy milk in sourdough starter. When in
doubt, don't use it.

I've had a sourdough starter going for nearly two years. Since I'm a
lazy bum, I bought sourdough starter from King Arthur and reconstituted
it. Worked like a charm.

Cindy

--
C.J. Fuller

Delete the obvious to email me

Cindy Fuller > wrote in

et:

> In article >, sf wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 04:00:21 GMT, hahabogus >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >"Brian Christiansen" > wrote in
>> :
>> >
>> >> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One
>> >> option would have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would
>> >> have been the best as the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and
>> >> I now have almost a quart of buttermilk that I really don't know
>> >> what to do with.
>> >>
>> >
>> >Go to one of those scoop and weigh places...they sell powdered
>> >buttermilk. That way you aren't stuck with stuff to use up.
>>
>> Sadly, I haven't seen buttermilk sold that way in years. In fact,
>> I've put it on the shopping list several times and hubby swears the
>> biggest Safeways in my area don't have it (boxed) on a shelf. I need
>> to make a grocery store visit soon to check this out first hand.
>
> I used to buy powdered buttermilk all of the time. Haven't done so of
> late. It's in a pink round canister with a chef's image on the label,
> IIRC.
>
> Cindy
>

Up here there are bulk stores that sell stuff outa bins...things like
dried fruit, arrowroot, various nuts, various flours,various trail mixes,
beans, bulk applebutter...that sort of thing...not sure what those places
are called where you live...Up here the names are things like Scoop and
Weigh or Bulk Barn. They carry dried buttermilk and other thing regular
supermarkets don't carry.

--

The house of the burning beet-Alan

A man in line at the bank kept falling over...when he got to a teller he
asked for his balance.

On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 12:23:11 -0700, Cindy Fuller
> wrote:

>Soy milk has no lactose (milk sugar) for the yeast or bacteria to
>ferment to lactic acid. Soy milk has an entirely different chemical
>makeup than cows' milk.

It's tastes funny too. We threw out a quart of soy ice cream that
someone brought over.

--
See return address to reply by email
remove the smile first

<sf> wrote in message ...
> On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 12:23:11 -0700, Cindy Fuller
> > wrote:
>
>>Soy milk has no lactose (milk sugar) for the yeast or bacteria to
>>ferment to lactic acid. Soy milk has an entirely different chemical
>>makeup than cows' milk.
>
> It's tastes funny too. We threw out a quart of soy ice cream that
> someone brought over.
>
What can I say. I like the stuff, and so do a lot of other people, judging
that most stores have bothe the silk, a brand called "continental" (I think)
and a house brand on the shelves. Either that or I am the only one that
likes it and everyone else thinks it is "healthier" than cows milk. I don't
know about soy ice cream, though.

Brian Christiansen

On Sat, 08 Mar 2008 21:41:46 -0800, sf wrote:

>On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 04:00:21 GMT, hahabogus > wrote:
>
>>"Brian Christiansen" > wrote in
:
>>
>>> If it had been, I was wondering what might have been best. One option
>>> would have been to use all buttermilk. Perhaps that would have been
>>> the best as the recipe called for only about 1/4 cup and I now have
>>> almost a quart of buttermilk that I really don't know what to do with.
>>>
>>
>>Go to one of those scoop and weigh places...they sell powdered buttermilk.
>>That way you aren't stuck with stuff to use up.
>
>Sadly, I haven't seen buttermilk sold that way in years. In fact,
>I've put it on the shopping list several times and hubby swears the
>biggest Safeways in my area don't have it (boxed) on a shelf. I need
>to make a grocery store visit soon to check this out first hand.


Here is the web site for Saco Cultured Buttermilk.
http://www.sacofoods.com/culteredbuttermilkblend.html

Print out the picture and give it to your husband. Tell him if he
does not see it, ASK. He can point to the picture if he cant' figure
out how to ask for it. It will probably be with the dried milks or
in the baking section.
--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974)

On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 17:26:27 -0500, The Cook >
wrote:

>
>Here is the web site for Saco Cultured Buttermilk.
>http://www.sacofoods.com/culteredbuttermilkblend.html
>
>Print out the picture and give it to your husband. Tell him if he
>does not see it, ASK. He can point to the picture if he cant' figure
>out how to ask for it. It will probably be with the dried milks or
>in the baking section.

Thanks! That's exactly what I wanted. He claims he's had someone
looking for it too, but you and I both know that sometimes store
personnel are just as clueless as we are.

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On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 15:33:40 -0700, sf wrote:

>On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 17:26:27 -0500, The Cook >
>wrote:
>
>>
>>Here is the web site for Saco Cultured Buttermilk.
>>http://www.sacofoods.com/culteredbuttermilkblend.html
>>
>>Print out the picture and give it to your husband. Tell him if he
>>does not see it, ASK. He can point to the picture if he cant' figure
>>out how to ask for it. It will probably be with the dried milks or
>>in the baking section.
>
>Thanks! That's exactly what I wanted. He claims he's had someone
>looking for it too, but you and I both know that sometimes store
>personnel are just as clueless as we are.

And you believe that he has asked directions? Someone at the
manager's office or customer service has a list of every item that is
carried or they can get. I was trying to find a cold cuts product so
asked the meat market. He pulled out the master list for that area
and showed me that it was not on their list. So I buy them elsewhere.
--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974)

On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 19:10:32 -0500, The Cook >
wrote:

>On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 15:33:40 -0700, sf wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 09 Mar 2008 17:26:27 -0500, The Cook >
>>wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>Here is the web site for Saco Cultured Buttermilk.
>>>http://www.sacofoods.com/culteredbuttermilkblend.html
>>>
>>>Print out the picture and give it to your husband. Tell him if he
>>>does not see it, ASK. He can point to the picture if he cant' figure
>>>out how to ask for it. It will probably be with the dried milks or
>>>in the baking section.
>>
>>Thanks! That's exactly what I wanted. He claims he's had someone
>>looking for it too, but you and I both know that sometimes store
>>personnel are just as clueless as we are.
>
>And you believe that he has asked directions? Someone at the
>manager's office or customer service has a list of every item that is
>carried or they can get. I was trying to find a cold cuts product so
>asked the meat market. He pulled out the master list for that area
>and showed me that it was not on their list. So I buy them elsewhere.

Well, I went to a fancy Safeway today. Turns out that no Safeway in
this city carries it. <sigh>

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