Okay, I never grew beans before. Just thought it would be
a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
to grow vegetables.

It's been fun. So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.

I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. Maybe
that's them (some teensy green weed). I don't know.

Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
Damn, did something dig up my beans??

No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!

nancy

On Jun 11, 12:34 pm, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> Okay, I never grew beans before. Just thought it would be
> a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
> to grow vegetables.
>
> It's been fun. So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
> eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>
> I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
> I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. Maybe
> that's them (some teensy green weed). I don't know.
>
> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!
>
> nancy

Yeah, it is fun watching them. If you plant the beans after soaking
them for some 12 hours, they will pop out of the ground within a day,
if the weather is warm and sunny. Do you have climbers? If not: Make
sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
moist days will make the stems start to rot.

Cookseasonal wrote:
> On Jun 11, 12:34 pm, "Nancy Young" > wrote:

>> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
>> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
>> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>>
>> No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
>> plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!

> Yeah, it is fun watching them. If you plant the beans after soaking
> them for some 12 hours, they will pop out of the ground within a day,
> if the weather is warm and sunny.

Thanks! I don't know why I didn't think of that, I have soaked
other seeds. I just followed the directions on the packet.

> Do you have climbers? If not: Make
> sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
> moist days will make the stems start to rot.

Thanks for that tip. I planted them according to directions and
now I have to thin the plants. These are the bush type.

nancy

> > Do you have climbers? If not: Make
> > sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
> > moist days will make the stems start to rot.
>
> Thanks for that tip. I planted them according to directions and
> now I have to thin the plants. These are the bush type.

I experienced that horror 2 years ago.. lost some 200 plants in one
week of night-time rains, cloudy days, and 24deg celcius. in the end I
started pulling all the infected plants, and was left with a pathetic
looking half-empty field. But then again.. I have never been good at
reading the instructions, and just plant so that it 'feels right'

Just came back from 2 weeks project, and am now stuffing myself with
sugar snaps, which grew half a meter and each plant carries some 10
pods. Hm.. Stir-fry tonight!

J

"Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio
. ..
> Cookseasonal wrote:
>> Do you have climbers? If not: Make
>> sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
>> moist days will make the stems start to rot.
>
> Thanks for that tip. I planted them according to directions and
> now I have to thin the plants. These are the bush type.

I plant my bush beans every 4" each way. Thay form a shade structure that
keeps weeds away and they do very well. My old friend George in WV taught
me that.

The lack of sun made my beans come up, look around and then stall. They
want 60°F around the clock or samned close.

Cookseasonal wrote:
>>> Do you have climbers? If not: Make
>>> sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
>>> moist days will make the stems start to rot.
>>
>> Thanks for that tip. I planted them according to directions and
>> now I have to thin the plants. These are the bush type.
>
> I experienced that horror 2 years ago.. lost some 200 plants in one
> week of night-time rains, cloudy days, and 24deg celcius. in the end I
> started pulling all the infected plants, and was left with a pathetic
> looking half-empty field. But then again.. I have never been good at
> reading the instructions, and just plant so that it 'feels right'

(laugh) You're one of those green thumb people, I have to read
the directions and even then my success rate is way low. I would
not make a success of farming.

Sorry about your crop, that's no laughing matter. I just do it
for fun.

> Just came back from 2 weeks project, and am now stuffing myself with
> sugar snaps, which grew half a meter and each plant carries some 10
> pods. Hm.. Stir-fry tonight!

Now that makes it all worth it. I'm already planning to expand my tiny
garden next spring and sugar snaps would have a place for sure.

nancy

Giusi wrote:
> "Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio

>> Thanks for that tip. I planted them according to directions and
>> now I have to thin the plants. These are the bush type.
>
> I plant my bush beans every 4" each way. Thay form a shade structure
> that keeps weeds away and they do very well. My old friend George in
> WV taught me that.

I'm planting another row this weekend. The spacing is so close,
I believe 6 inches, that I thought How's this going to work? You
say even closer, so that's just how it is.

> The lack of sun made my beans come up, look around and then stall. They
> want 60°F around the clock or samned close.

Yikes, so far I've given them 95. Today it's a balmy 75 ... so far.

nancy

"Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio
. ..
> Giusi wrote:
>> The lack of sun made my beans come up, look around and then stall. They
>> want 60°F around the clock or samned close.
>
> Yikes, so far I've given them 95. Today it's a balmy 75 ... so far.
>
> nancy

Misstated: they want 60°F MIN everything over that happily accepted with an
appropriate amount of water.

On Jun 11, 8:02�am, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> Cookseasonal wrote:
> > On Jun 11, 12:34 pm, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> >> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> >> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> >> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> >> No. �I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> >> plant! �By the next morning they were an inch high. �Freaky!!
> > Yeah, it is fun watching them. If you plant the beans after soaking
> > them for some 12 hours, they will pop out of the ground within a day,
> > if the weather is warm and sunny.
>
> Thanks! �I don't know why I didn't think of that, I have soaked
> other seeds. �I just followed the directions on the packet.
>
> > Do you have climbers? If not: Make
> > sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
> > moist days will make the stems start to rot.
>
> Thanks for that tip. �I planted them according to directions and
> now I have to thin the plants. �These are the bush type.

Yes, thin them. Actually if each seed is spaced according to
directions there's no need to thin, beans typically all germinate so
there's really no need to plant extra, and bean seedlings don't
transplant well, so it's best to just toss them. At first it may seem
that there is too much space between plants but they will grow rapidly
to fill in all empty space... and you'll have a larger more robust
crop when plants are spaced a bit further apart instead of crowded, in
other words you will get more from fewer plants, it's false economy to
plant any vegetables close together thinking you'll get more per
space, you wont, and it will also be more difficult to harvest and
you'll miss a lot of beans on crowded plants. Once they begin to put
out beans harvest every day, even twice a day. Beans grow very
quickly, so what looks like a 1" long bean in the morning will be
ready to pick 24 hours later... pick when 3-4 inches long and no
more... you'll have better quality beans and more of them, the more
you pick the more the plant will put out... plants are merely trying
to reproduce, if you allow the fruits to become too mature so that
they go to seed the plant will go into a done-its-job mode and cease
further production. Smaller/less mature beans will be much easier to
prepare, they wouldn't have developed those pesky strings yet which
presents most of the prep labor to remove, the seeds will not have
matured either, so very little cooking will be needed... green beans
less than 3" can be quickly stir fried... 2" beans can be used raw in
salads. Just pinch off the stem (use no knife), always leave the
pointy end. During peak production period (about 4 weeks) one packet
of seed gives me 10 pounds of young beans every day... you'll need
people to share, you'll get tired of eating them. No matter how
diligent your harvesting regimen you will still miss a lot. Those 6"
beans can be de-strung and sliced into 1" lengths and frozen in zip-
locs, they are great in winter stews as they hold up well to long slow
cooking.

Giusi wrote:
> "Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio
> . ..
>> Giusi wrote:
>>> The lack of sun made my beans come up, look around and then stall.
>>> They want 60°F around the clock or samned close.
>>
>> Yikes, so far I've given them 95. Today it's a balmy 75 ... so far.

> Misstated: they want 60°F MIN everything over that happily accepted
> with an appropriate amount of water.

Ooops. Sorry about that, I shouldn't have taken it so literally.
What a dummy.

nancy

Sheldon wrote:
> On Jun 11, 8:02�am, "Nancy Young" > wrote:

>> Thanks for that tip. �I planted them according to directions and
>> now I have to thin the plants. �These are the bush type.
>
> Yes, thin them. Actually if each seed is spaced according to
> directions there's no need to thin, beans typically all germinate

This I noticed. I thought Next time I will only plant one bean,
not three, because I don't think one failed to come up.

> people to share, you'll get tired of eating them. No matter how
> diligent your harvesting regimen you will still miss a lot. Those 6"
> beans can be de-strung and sliced into 1" lengths and frozen in zip-
> locs, they are great in winter stews as they hold up well to long slow
> cooking.

Thanks for all that information, and taking the time to spell it
out for me. I appreciate it. So far this has been more fun even
than tomatoes.

nancy

"Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio
...
> Sheldon wrote:
, you'll get tired of eating them.

It can happen! I plant a 3 foot by 4 foot of my closely planted beans and
will again near to autumn when I plant the winter greens. Even an extra
handful of green beans is easily blanched and tossed into a sack for the
freezer. I also can if pressed make many green bean dishes because they are
my DD's favorite vegetable. They are great as tempura or blanched and used
almost raw.

Given good sun, they're almost foolproof.

> nancy

On Jun 11, 8:26�am, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> Giusi wrote:
> > "Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio
> >> Thanks for that tip. �I planted them according to directions and
> >> now I have to thin the plants. �These are the bush type.
>
> > I plant my bush beans every 4" each way. �Thay form a shade structure
> > that keeps weeds away and they do very well. �My old friend George in
> > WV taught me that.
>
> I'm planting another row this weekend. �The spacing is so close,
> I believe 6 inches, that I thought How's this going to work? �You
> say even closer, so that's just how it is.

Eight to ten inches apart in the row is fine but you need more space
between rows... plants are not all above ground, they have roots too,
the roots need more space than foliage... and you'll need space to
walk when you harvest, if you grow beans in rows all jamed together
you will have a lesser crop due to root crowding and you'll need to
step on plants when harvesting.. if rows are too close you will alos
be compressing soil over roots when harvsting, the crop will suffer...
leave plenty of space to walk. My garden is now all planted, over
many years of gardening I've learned not to crowd plants.... and there
are far better methods for controling weeds, crowding is the worst,
teh weeds will still grow, right between the plants where you won't
notice untll they're well established, and then you'll disturb the
bean plant roots when pulling the mature weeds. Crowded plants also
shade themselves, space between rows lets light in, vegetable plants
don't grow well without full sun. With space between plants it's very
easy to weed with shallow hoing/cultivating.

My tomato plants are doing well, as you can see I believe in space
between plants and my method of weed control works well.. high quality
weed block cloth from Lee Vally lasts more than ten years. I leave it
down all winter too, just roll it up in spring so I can till and lay
it back down again... the extra holes are from previous year's plants,
after a while I may use some extra holes to put in other plants,
perhaps even flowers:
http://i27.tinypic.com/mwsjgw.jpg

I have four fruit trees to plant (2 plum, 2 apple), but it's been much
too hot to dig holes, maybe today:
http://i30.tinypic.com/5cmx6q.jpg


In a couple of weeks that will be a lush garden. My beans are in that
far corner, just coming up. Some crops work better with bare ground,
I may use corrogated cardboard between rows later, I use cardbord for
walkways, it simply decomposes and I add new. As you can see I can
make my garden a lot larger, but that 2,500 sq ft plot is more than
enough for any three families, which is why I already devoted about a
third to blueberries... there's a small stream in that depression
along the right side, I rarely need to water:
http://i31.tinypic.com/2ecoxv9.jpg

hehe, planting too close you said?
Just walked into my garden.. Planted a few cabbages, at about 1 foot
(30cm) apart.. Two weeks ago before I left they had plenty of space.
Now the leaves are pushing against eachother, and summer is still to
start. I only did put in 2 rows of 5 plant.. What is your idea: Should
I remove every second plant? Or will they eventually 'hang' off to the
sides?

"Sheldon" > ha scritto nel messaggio
and there
are far better methods for controling weeds, crowding is the worst,
teh weeds will still grow, right between the plants where you won't
notice untll they're well established, and then you'll disturb the
bean plant roots when pulling the mature weeds.

My experience varies widely from your conjecture. This method works best
for people who aren't growing bushels of anything, but it does work and is
considered a very good organic way to grow beans.

I also grow tagetes or marigold around most vegetables for insect control.

On Jun 11, 9:31�am, Cookseasonal > wrote:
> hehe, planting too close you said?
> Just walked into my garden.. Planted a few cabbages, at about 1 foot
> (30cm) apart.. Two weeks ago before I left they had plenty of space.
> Now the leaves are pushing against eachother, and summer is still to
> start. I only did put in 2 rows of 5 plant.. What is your idea: Should
> I remove every second plant? Or will they eventually 'hang' off to the
> sides?

Head cabbage really needs at least two feet between plants... the dark
green outter leaves become huge and those are what catch the sun to
get energy to grow the head... if not too large yet dig out two from
each row with a large earth clump and plant elsewhere.. dig the new
holes first so you'll be ready to plant each in turn immediately, and
water each well. I plant head cabbge 2 1/2 feet apart and I get solid
heads the size of basketballs... always remember plants have roots,
they need room too. typically the root systam is larger than the above
ground plant.... plants need space if they are to fully develop.

On Jun 11, 2:42 pm, Sheldon > wrote:
> Head cabbage really needs at least two feet between plants... the dark
> green outter leaves become huge and those are what catch the sun to
> get energy to grow the head... if not too large yet dig out two from
> each row with a large earth clump and plant elsewhere.. dig the new
> holes first so you'll be ready to plant each in turn immediately, and
> water each well. I plant head cabbge 2 1/2 feet apart and I get solid
> heads the size of basketballs... always remember plants have roots,
> they need room too. typically the root systam is larger than the above
> ground plant.... plants need space if they are to fully develop.

ok, cool. Will wait for some cooler & wetter wheather. Perhaps
tomorrow.

Was wondering: Would you guys be interested in helping me fill up a
website with info on growing ingredients & cooking fresh food?

On Jun 11, 6:32*am, "Giusi" > wrote:
> "Sheldon" > ha scritto nel messaggio
> *and there
> are far better methods for controling weeds, crowding is the worst,
> teh weeds will still grow, right between the plants where you won't
> notice untll they're well established, and then you'll disturb the
> bean plant roots when pulling the mature weeds.
>
> My experience varies widely from your conjecture. *This method works best
> for people who aren't growing bushels of anything, but it does work and is
> considered a very good organic way to grow beans.
>
> I also grow tagetes or marigold around most vegetables for insect control.

Both methods work. Your close planting is usually accompanied by
raised beds and more soil preparation and hand weeding. Googling on
"intensive gardening" or "biodynamis gardening" brings up many
references, and "square foot gardening" is a variant on it. We used
to use Sheldon's traditional methods and plant spacings and his
recommendations are well suited for it. Then we built a couple small
raised beds and mostly follow the square foot gardening
guidelines. -aem

Personally I prefer to start runner beans in pots and then replant under
the frame that will be supporting them at the right time, that way there
are no surprises.

Amazingly bad year for germination, only 3 out of 14 seeds actually
germinated and I was too late to redo them

Steve

Cookseasonal wrote:
>Do you have climbers? If not: Make
> sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
> moist days will make the stems start to rot.

On Wed, 11 Jun 2008 04:49:05 -0700 (PDT), Cookseasonal
> wrote:

>On Jun 11, 12:34 pm, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
>> Okay, I never grew beans before. Just thought it would be
>> a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
>> to grow vegetables.
>>
>> It's been fun. So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
>> eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>>
>> I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
>> I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. Maybe
>> that's them (some teensy green weed). I don't know.
>>
>> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
>> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
>> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>>
>> No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
>> plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!
>>
>> nancy
>
>Yeah, it is fun watching them. If you plant the beans after soaking
>them for some 12 hours, they will pop out of the ground within a day,
>if the weather is warm and sunny. Do you have climbers? If not: Make
>sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
>moist days will make the stems start to rot.


I grow all my bush beans in pots. Nothing too large, either. 8"-10
inches, max, some even smaller. I put at least 6 to 10 plants/beans
per pot. I have never, ever had any rot. Good enriched rich soil, some
Epsom salts and Osmocote is all I use. I have at least 5 varieties
growing this year.

I grow a lot of veggies in pots and tubs. My deck is sunnier than the
main garden. In pots and tubs I have:

13 tomato plants of various varieties, from grape and cherry to huge
beefsteaks
3 kinds of cukes
spinach
several lettuce/mesclun mixes
baby bok choi
broccoli
several types of radish
green beans
strawberries
yellow squash
the usual and unusual assortments of herbs
dwarf peaches
an olive tree
Meyer lemon
other citrus

Then there are the roses and other flowers, shrubs and trees I have in
pots and tubs. It is a terrific way to grow things.

The lower "real" garden has:
more tomatoes
acorn squash
garlic
more herbs
corn

Boron

On Jun 11, 8:31*am, Boron Elgar > wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Jun 2008 04:49:05 -0700 (PDT), Cookseasonal
>
>
>
>
>
> > wrote:
> >On Jun 11, 12:34 pm, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> >> Okay, I never grew beans before. *Just thought it would be
> >> a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
> >> to grow vegetables.
>
> >> It's been fun. *So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
> >> eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>
> >> I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
> >> I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. *Maybe
> >> that's them (some teensy green weed). *I don't know.
>
> >> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> >> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> >> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> >> No. *I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> >> plant! *By the next morning they were an inch high. *Freaky!!
>
> >> nancy
>
> >Yeah, it is fun watching them. If you plant the beans after soaking
> >them for some 12 hours, they will pop out of the ground within a day,
> >if the weather is warm and sunny. Do you have climbers? If not: Make
> >sur eyou get plnety of air between the plants, otherwise a few warm
> >moist days will make the stems start to rot.
>
> I grow all my bush beans in pots. Nothing too large, either. 8"-10
> inches, max, some even smaller. I put at least 6 to 10 plants/beans
> per pot. I have never, ever had any rot. Good enriched rich soil, some
> Epsom salts and Osmocote is all I use. I have at least 5 varieties
> growing this year.
>
> I grow a lot of veggies in pots and tubs. My deck is sunnier than the
> main garden. In pots and tubs I have:
>
> 13 tomato plants of various varieties, from grape and cherry to huge
> beefsteaks
> 3 kinds of cukes
> spinach
> several lettuce/mesclun mixes
> baby bok choi
> broccoli
> several types of radish
> green beans
> strawberries
> yellow squash
> the usual and unusual assortments of herbs
> dwarf peaches
> an olive tree
> Meyer lemon
> other citrus
>
> Then there are the roses and other flowers, shrubs and trees I have in
> pots and tubs. It is a terrific way to grow things.
>
> The lower "real" garden has:
> more tomatoes
> acorn squash
> garlic
> more herbs
> corn
>
> Boron- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I'm so glad I read your post! I was wondering about planting beans in
pots as the deck is the best place for sun(if we ever get any!!) in my
shady yard. I have a heck of a time with tomatoes, altho we usually
get a few. But I would love to have some beans, too. I recently had
surgery on my foot, so I have to wear a stupid boot thing for another
6 weeks, making it hard to go & try to dig in my yard. Containers
sound like my best bet!

Nancy Young said...

> Okay, I never grew beans before. Just thought it would be
> a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
> to grow vegetables.
>
> It's been fun. So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
> eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>
> I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
> I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. Maybe
> that's them (some teensy green weed). I don't know.
>
> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!
>
> nancy


Brush off yer climbing shoes! Isn't the goose that lays golden eggs up
there?

Too tired to care but good luck.

Andy
Giant

On Jun 11, 4:49 pm, merryb > wrote:

> I'm so glad I read your post! I was wondering about planting beans in
> pots as the deck is the best place for sun(if we ever get any!!) in my
> shady yard. I have a heck of a time with tomatoes, altho we usually
> get a few. But I would love to have some beans, too. I recently had
> surgery on my foot, so I have to wear a stupid boot thing for another
> 6 weeks, making it hard to go & try to dig in my yard. Containers
> sound like my best bet!

Hey Merry,

Why do you not get many tomatoes? I used to grow them in containers
all the time, and at the moment I have them in 2*2*6ft planter. Loads
of fruit. Just make sure you give them load of rooting space & water
very frequently, and you should get the stems loaded with bright right
bubbles of sunny flavour!

On Jun 11, 8:57*am, Cookseasonal > wrote:
> On Jun 11, 4:49 pm, merryb > wrote:
>
> > I'm so glad I read your post! I was wondering about planting beans in
> > pots as the deck is the best place for sun(if we ever get any!!) in my
> > shady yard. I have a heck of a time with tomatoes, altho we usually
> > get a few. But I would love to have some beans, too. I recently had
> > surgery on my foot, so I have to wear a stupid boot thing for another
> > 6 weeks, making it hard to go & try to dig in my yard. Containers
> > sound like my best bet!
>
> Hey Merry,
>
> Why do you not get many tomatoes? I used to grow them in containers
> all the time, and at the moment I have them in 2*2*6ft planter. Loads
> of fruit. Just make sure you give them load of rooting space & water
> very frequently, and you should get the stems loaded with bright right
> bubbles of sunny flavour!

Hi Cookie!!
I think it's because we just don't get much sun- 4-5 hours a day. I
actually thought about putting containers on our roof, but what a pain
it would be to water!! I have access to lots of tomato plants as my
mom starts a few hundred every year. The last 2 years, all the romas
got blight. So I have 2 on my deck, but no more as I hate to be
disappointed again...

On Jun 11, 5:14 pm, merryb > wrote:
> On Jun 11, 8:57 am, Cookseasonal > wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jun 11, 4:49 pm, merryb > wrote:
>
> > > I'm so glad I read your post! I was wondering about planting beans in
> > > pots as the deck is the best place for sun(if we ever get any!!) in my
> > > shady yard. I have a heck of a time with tomatoes, altho we usually
> > > get a few. But I would love to have some beans, too. I recently had
> > > surgery on my foot, so I have to wear a stupid boot thing for another
> > > 6 weeks, making it hard to go & try to dig in my yard. Containers
> > > sound like my best bet!
>
> > Hey Merry,
>
> > Why do you not get many tomatoes? I used to grow them in containers
> > all the time, and at the moment I have them in 2*2*6ft planter. Loads
> > of fruit. Just make sure you give them load of rooting space & water
> > very frequently, and you should get the stems loaded with bright right
> > bubbles of sunny flavour!
>
> Hi Cookie!!
> I think it's because we just don't get much sun- 4-5 hours a day. I
> actually thought about putting containers on our roof, but what a pain
> it would be to water!! I have access to lots of tomato plants as my
> mom starts a few hundred every year. The last 2 years, all the romas
> got blight. So I have 2 on my deck, but no more as I hate to be
> disappointed again...

hm.. Blight.. You'll have to help me there.. Is that the fungus? I
read somewhere that rain & day temperatures over 22 deg celcius are
the killer. So placing them under a little roof would help enormously.
But yeah.. They are sunlovers.. I try to grow them in full soil, and
some summers they just jump up (Like in the Godfathers' garden,
tomatoe stalks of 1/12, 2m (5-7ft) tall!

On Jun 11, 9:27*am, Cookseasonal > wrote:
> On Jun 11, 5:14 pm, merryb > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Jun 11, 8:57 am, Cookseasonal > wrote:
>
> > > On Jun 11, 4:49 pm, merryb > wrote:
>
> > > > I'm so glad I read your post! I was wondering about planting beans in
> > > > pots as the deck is the best place for sun(if we ever get any!!) in my
> > > > shady yard. I have a heck of a time with tomatoes, altho we usually
> > > > get a few. But I would love to have some beans, too. I recently had
> > > > surgery on my foot, so I have to wear a stupid boot thing for another
> > > > 6 weeks, making it hard to go & try to dig in my yard. Containers
> > > > sound like my best bet!
>
> > > Hey Merry,
>
> > > Why do you not get many tomatoes? I used to grow them in containers
> > > all the time, and at the moment I have them in 2*2*6ft planter. Loads
> > > of fruit. Just make sure you give them load of rooting space & water
> > > very frequently, and you should get the stems loaded with bright right
> > > bubbles of sunny flavour!
>
> > Hi Cookie!!
> > I think it's because we just don't get much sun- 4-5 hours a day. I
> > actually thought about putting containers on our roof, but what a pain
> > it would be to water!! I have access to lots of tomato plants as my
> > mom starts a few hundred every year. The last 2 years, all the romas
> > got blight. So I have 2 on my deck, but no more as I hate to be
> > disappointed again...
>
> hm.. Blight.. You'll have to help me there.. Is that the fungus? I
> read somewhere that rain & day temperatures over 22 deg celcius are
> the killer. So placing them under a little roof would help enormously.
> But yeah.. They are sunlovers.. I try to grow them in full soil, and
> some summers they just jump up (Like in the Godfathers' garden,
> tomatoe stalks of 1/12, 2m (5-7ft) tall!- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Yes, it starts on the bottom of the fruit. I try to be careful when I
water so that it doesn't splash on the plant, but still have that
problem. I know lots of people in this area (Western Washington) that
have the same issues as I do. The weather is just not hot enough here.

aem wrote:
>"Giusi" wrote:
> > "Sheldon" wrote:
> >
> > �and there
> > are far better methods for controling weeds, crowding is the worst,
> > the weeds will still grow, right between the plants where you won't
> > notice until they're well established, and then you'll disturb the
> > bean plant roots when pulling the mature weeds.
>
> > My experience varies widely from your conjecture. �

There's no conjecture about it... I actually have a garden that anyone
can see, and I've tried the method you only write about, it sucks. A
lot of folks here give a lot of big talk about their perfect/best
gardens but I haven't seen ANY yet.


> >This method works best for people who aren't growing bushels
> > of anything, but it does work

Any quantity can be grown by any method... there is no "best", only
what's best for the individual... there are too many factors to say
any kind of gardening is best.

> > and is considered a very good organic way to grow beans.

Organic, wtf does organic have to do with it, any gardening method can
be organic... whatever that is... I don't believe there is any such
thing, except in a laboratory clean room.

> > I also grow tagetes or marigold around most vegetables for insect control.

A very debatable practice... my experience is some types of marigolds
will only keep mosquitoes somewhat at bay... mosquitoes don't harm
crops, so big whoop. I plant some flowers in my garden because they
look nice; I usually have extras that won't fit into my beds, and some
just pop up in an out of the way spot so why disturb them... I leave
the wild flowers, daisys are nice perennials and require no care, not
even watering.

> Both methods work. �Your close planting is usually accompanied by
> raised beds and more soil preparation and hand weeding. �Googling on
> "intensive gardening" or "biodynamics gardening" brings up many
> references, and "square foot gardening" is a variant on it. �We used
> to use Sheldon's traditional methods and plant spacings and his
> recommendations are well suited for it. �Then we built a couple small
> raised beds and mostly follow the square foot gardening
> guidelines. � � -aem

Square foot gardening was devised for use by people who haven't much
gardening space. The premise is to grow plants upward... I wouldn't
consider bush beans for square foot gardening when I can quadruple my
crop by planting pole beans... then I can plant some low growing crop,
like lettuce, carrots, or herbs at the base of the pole beans. Square
foot gardening works well if certain tenets are adhered to but I think
it's a lot more labor intensive than traditional methods... but it
works well when there's lack of gardening space or if someone just
prefers to have say a small raised bed or two, say in an arid area
whre water is a problem and/or soil is poor... some times people have
handicaps that permit them to work a small raised bed garden when
otherwise they couldn't garden. I have much more space than I can
possibly use so raised beds have no advantage for me... however my
next door neighbor has just as much space but he does both, actually
his house is built into a hill so he does terrace gardening too... my
neighbor is the garlic king here, he has big raised beds chock full of
garlic. At his request I took pictures of him in front of his gardens
with his arms loaded up with fresh pulled garlic, but I'm not going to
post his picture here. But anyone who has a garden I'd be pleased to
see pictures, if you got it post it.

Nancy Young wrote:

> Okay, I never grew beans before. Just thought it would be
> a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
> to grow vegetables.
>
> It's been fun. So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
> eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>
> I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
> I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. Maybe
> that's them (some teensy green weed). I don't know.
>
> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!
>


You know, I'm going to buy some to plant in pots for foliage "house plants",
very cheap and I need to fill in some spaces in my indoor "garden". This
is in addition to the ginger and elephant ears/taro I'll grow from "bulbs" I
bought at the Asian market...

Fastest thing I've ever seen grow are some caladium bulbs I planted during
very hot weather, you could literally watch them grow, almost a foot in a
day...

Also, growing up in a rural area, corn plants did the same thing...

It's good weather for ducks (rain!) - and also for growing plants, all this
heat and humidity...great to see things thrive after such a cold winter.

--
Best
Greg

In article >,
"Nancy Young" > wrote:

> Okay, I never grew beans before. Just thought it would be
> a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
> to grow vegetables.
>
> It's been fun. So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
> eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>
> I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
> I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. Maybe
> that's them (some teensy green weed). I don't know.
>
> Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> No. I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> plant! By the next morning they were an inch high. Freaky!!
>
> nancy

If, by some chance, you bought pole beans rather than bush beans, make
sure they have something to climb. Now leave them alone in peace, will
ya? Quit pokin'!

--
-Barb, Mother Superior, HOSSSPoJ
Huffy and Bubbles Do France: http://www.jamlady.eboard.com

On Jun 11, 6:00�pm, Melba's Jammin' >
wrote:
> In article >,
> �"Nancy Young" > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > Okay, I never grew beans before. �Just thought it would be
> > a fun thing to do this year since I suddenly have a small place
> > to grow vegetables.
>
> > It's been fun. �So far; I hope they hang in there (as in not be
> > eaten) until I can get some beans out of the deal.
>
> > I now get where the Jack and his magical beans story came from.
> > I looked at where I planted them a couple days ago. �Maybe
> > that's them (some teensy green weed). �I don't know.
>
> > Two hours later, I do not lie, I looked again and see some
> > weird disturbance in the earth, all these mounds of soils.
> > Damn, did something dig up my beans??
>
> > No. �I moved a piece of dirt aside and there it was, a bean
> > plant! �By the next morning they were an inch high. �Freaky!!
>
> > nancy � �
>
> If, by some chance, you bought pole beans rather than bush beans, > make sure they have something to climb. �

Fe Fi Fo Fum, I smell the blood of a Minisotan!

On Jun 11, 8:48�am, "Nancy Young" > wrote:
> Giusi wrote:
> > "Nancy Young" > ha scritto nel messaggio
> ...
> >> Giusi wrote:
> >>> The lack of sun made my beans come up, look around and then stall.
> >>> They want 60�F around the clock or samned close.
>
> >> Yikes, so far I've given them 95. �Today it's a balmy 75 ... so far.
> >
> > Misstated: they want 60�F MIN everything over that happily accepted
> > with an appropriate amount of water.
>
> Ooops. �Sorry about that, I shouldn't have taken it so literally.
> What a dummy.


Actually beans prefer cooler temperature... they can be planted in
early spring as soon as the soil is workable without clumping, and
beans welcome light frost. There are many vegetables that grow best
at cooler temperatures.

aem wrote:
> "Giusi" wrote:
> > "Sheldon" wrote:
> > �and there
> > are far better methods for controling weeds, crowding is the worst,
> > teh weeds will still grow, right between the plants where you won't
> > notice untll they're well established, and then you'll disturb the
> > bean plant roots when pulling the mature weeds.
>
> > My experience varies widely from your conjecture. �This method works best
> > for people who aren't growing bushels of anything, but it does work and is
> > considered a very good organic way to grow beans.
>
> > I also grow tagetes or marigold around most vegetables for insect control.
>
> Both methods work. �Your close planting is usually accompanied by
> raised beds and more soil preparation and hand weeding. �Googling on
> "intensive gardening" or "biodynamis gardening" brings up many
> references, and "square foot gardening" is a variant on it. �We used
> to use Sheldon's traditional methods and plant spacings and his
> recommendations are well suited for it. �Then we built a couple small
> raised beds and mostly follow the square foot gardening
> guidelines. � �

Yesterday the weather was finally cool enough to work outside, was
still a little warm (low 80s) but I magaged to plant those two plum
trees... after teh job is done it doesn't look like a lot of hard work
but digging those holes by hand is no simple matter... of course I
also need to keep them deer proof for a few years while they grow...
my fencing system works well.

One is a green gage (my favorite), the other a Mt. Royal... both are
self pollenating but for a better crop it's best to plant a different
plum.

http://i27.tinypic.com/s5e8so.jpg

http://i31.tinypic.com/16gk3f9.jpg

Now I need to find the energy to plant the two apple trees.

Sheldon

On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 08:04:16 -0700 (PDT), Sheldon >
wrote:

>Yesterday the weather was finally cool enough to work outside, was
>still a little warm (low 80s) but I magaged to plant those two plum
>trees... after teh job is done it doesn't look like a lot of hard work
>but digging those holes by hand is no simple matter... of course I
>also need to keep them deer proof for a few years while they grow...
>my fencing system works well.
>
>One is a green gage (my favorite), the other a Mt. Royal... both are
>self pollenating but for a better crop it's best to plant a different
>plum.
>
>http://i27.tinypic.com/s5e8so.jpg
>
>http://i31.tinypic.com/16gk3f9.jpg
>
>Now I need to find the energy to plant the two apple trees.

Nice yard Shemp. Trees aren't for those who need instant
gratification. I planted 5 of them 6 years ago. This year they're
looking beautiful. The ornamental pear is close to 25' tall. The
cherry is about 12' and I might actually get something off it if I can
beat the birds. I'll bet those cages are a pita to mow around.

Anyway, grate job.

Lou

Lou Decruss wrote:
> On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 08:04:16 -0700 (PDT), Sheldon >
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >Yesterday the weather was finally cool enough to work outside, was
> >still a little warm (low 80s) but I magaged to plant those two plum
> >trees... after teh job is done it doesn't look like a lot of hard work
> >but digging those holes by hand is no simple matter... of course I
> >also need to keep them deer proof for a few years while they grow...
> >my fencing system works well.
>
> >One is a green gage (my favorite), the other a Mt. Royal... both are
> >self pollenating but for a better crop it's best to plant a different
> >plum.
>
> >http://i27.tinypic.com/s5e8so.jpg
>
> >http://i31.tinypic.com/16gk3f9.jpg
>
> >Now I need to find the energy to plant the two apple trees.
>
> Nice yard Shemp. �Trees aren't for those who need instant
> gratification. �I planted 5 of them 6 years ago. �This year they're
> looking beautiful. �The ornamental pear is close to 25' tall. �The
> cherry is about 12' and I might actually get something off it if I can
> beat the birds. �I'll bet those cages are a pita to mow around.

Actually I designed them that way to make them easy to mow... if you
notice there's a one foot space at the bottom of the chicken wire,
which also adds a foot of height to keep the deer from nibbling up
above (I never saw any deer attempt to crawl underneath). After
mowing close with a riding mower that space enables me to periodically
slide a push mower underneath, and it's easy to string trim around the
fence posts. Oh, and soon there will be weed block cloth pinned down
in there just past the outside of that fence. I don't bother with
the pretty pine bark nuggets anymore as they just seem to scatter
about and make more work picking them up and putting them back, plus
they're an added expense for nothing as from those distances no one
can see what's under there. Early on I had the chicken wire fence
right to the ground with other trees I had planted, now that is a
horror to mow and weed... I quickly changed those. Naturally it's all
work, everytime something new is added there's more to mow around.

I have a couple of ornamental pear I planted five years ago, those are
about 25 feet tall now too. The ones in blossom... in that row is a
linden, hawthorn, beech, yellowwood, and dawn two redwood. Of course
they're not all possible to see in this picture, that row extends some
twelve hundred feet, and a couple were behind me when I snapped this:
http://i30.tinypic.com/291n6gl.jpg

---

On Jun 13, 3:43 pm, Sheldon > wrote:

> Actually beans prefer cooler temperature... they can be planted in
> early spring as soon as the soil is workable without clumping, and
> beans welcome light frost. There are many vegetables that grow best
> at cooler temperatures.

That ius not my experience. Afaik beans need 18C+ to germinate.
Otherwise they will just rot. Sugarsnaps and broadbeans on the other
can stand cold well, and I oftern pant them in fall already for early
crops

On Sat, 14 Jun 2008 08:04:27 -0700 (PDT), Cookseasonal
> wrote:

>On Jun 13, 3:43 pm, Sheldon > wrote:
>
>> Actually beans prefer cooler temperature... they can be planted in
>> early spring as soon as the soil is workable without clumping, and
>> beans welcome light frost. There are many vegetables that grow best
>> at cooler temperatures.
>
>That ius not my experience. Afaik beans need 18C+ to germinate.
>Otherwise they will just rot. Sugarsnaps and broadbeans on the other
>can stand cold well, and I oftern pant them in fall already for early
>crops


Yup...green beans like it warm and can be planted all the way through
August here in the NJ. They just will not come up in until the soil
warms a bit. I encourage them by planting mine in containers in which
the soil warms up before the regular garden does...still, they will
not germinate well, if at all, in the cold.

Boron

On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 15:30:56 -0700 (PDT), Sheldon >
wrote:

>Lou Decruss wrote:
>> On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 08:04:16 -0700 (PDT), Sheldon >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >Yesterday the weather was finally cool enough to work outside, was
>> >still a little warm (low 80s) but I magaged to plant those two plum
>> >trees... after teh job is done it doesn't look like a lot of hard work
>> >but digging those holes by hand is no simple matter... of course I
>> >also need to keep them deer proof for a few years while they grow...
>> >my fencing system works well.
>>
>> >One is a green gage (my favorite), the other a Mt. Royal... both are
>> >self pollenating but for a better crop it's best to plant a different
>> >plum.
>>
>> >http://i27.tinypic.com/s5e8so.jpg
>>
>> >http://i31.tinypic.com/16gk3f9.jpg
>>
>> >Now I need to find the energy to plant the two apple trees.
>>
>> Nice yard Shemp. ?Trees aren't for those who need instant
>> gratification. ?I planted 5 of them 6 years ago. ?This year they're
>> looking beautiful. ?The ornamental pear is close to 25' tall. ?The
>> cherry is about 12' and I might actually get something off it if I can
>> beat the birds. ?I'll bet those cages are a pita to mow around.
>
>Actually I designed them that way to make them easy to mow... if you
>notice there's a one foot space at the bottom of the chicken wire,

I did see that and I like the idea. But I still figured with that big
mower it would be a pain.

>which also adds a foot of height to keep the deer from nibbling up
>above (I never saw any deer attempt to crawl underneath). After
>mowing close with a riding mower that space enables me to periodically
>slide a push mower underneath, and it's easy to string trim around the
>fence posts. Oh, and soon there will be weed block cloth pinned down
>in there just past the outside of that fence. I don't bother with
>the pretty pine bark nuggets anymore as they just seem to scatter
>about and make more work picking them up and putting them back, plus
>they're an added expense for nothing as from those distances no one
>can see what's under there. Early on I had the chicken wire fence
>right to the ground with other trees I had planted, now that is a
>horror to mow and weed... I quickly changed those. Naturally it's all
>work, everytime something new is added there's more to mow around.

We've spent years working on making our cottage yard easier to mow.
The yard is nothing like yours in size. I think it's just over 1/3 of
an acre, but backs up to a forest. I'm the cook here and my lady is
the gardener. Her goal was to eliminate grass and replace it with
perennials. I do he grunt work, but she does all the planting of the
smaller things. At first the areas she started working on made mowing
much worse. After a few years of learning how to set things up, and
hundreds of plants in the ground, it's a breeze. As usual, she had a
good plan, and the patience to follow through with it. Yesterday we
mowed, trimmed, and blew the walks, decks, and driveway off in less
than two hours. While we were doing that I smoked 2 small meat loafs.
<----OB food

Here, they're almost done:

http://i25.tinypic.com/11wfwus.jpg

>
>I have a couple of ornamental pear I planted five years ago, those are
>about 25 feet tall now too. The ones in blossom... in that row is a
>linden, hawthorn, beech, yellowwood, and dawn two redwood. Of course
>they're not all possible to see in this picture, that row extends some
>twelve hundred feet, and a couple were behind me when I snapped this:
>http://i30.tinypic.com/291n6gl.jpg

Nice trees. My ornamental pear isn't as spread out as yours but it's
got more foliage. They are beautiful when they blossom. When it
rains and it's windy Louise says the leaves "smile." She's a nature
freak and was even recycling back in the 70's before it was vougue.

Here's the cherry tree I planted. It's got a weird split of the trunk
but it's very healthy. I love it. It might even be taller than I
thought. The raspberries behind it have been doing poorly for a few
years but it looks like they might come back this year. This is the
view from the chair I sit in on weekend mornings when I drink my
coffee. (or bloody mary's)

http://i26.tinypic.com/24zvjlt.jpg

When we started this area last summer it was a mowing nightmare. It
still needs a bit of cleaning up and we need to get the rocks for the
dry bed, but it's still nice for it's first full year. The lady here
has a bunch of these areas going. Another year and I can sell the
mower and get a goat.

http://i31.tinypic.com/dzwmqe.jpg

Lou