"hahabogus" > wrote in message
...
> Julia Altshuler > wrote in
> :
>
>> Goomba wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm not convinced a half cup of tea did all that. Perhaps she just
>>> wasn't tired, or was stimulated by the night out or having had a
>>> piece of chocolate cake, or hitting that age where women often have
>>> difficulty sleeping.... who the hell knows?
>>> It almost sounds a tad neurotic to take one isolated minor event and
>>> tag it with such import, IMO. If you want to prove it, do some more
>>> controlled tests.
>>
>>
>> You're mixing up 2 case studies.
>>
>>
>> In my case, it was half a cup of tea and a single sleepless night. No
>> other symptoms.
>>
>>
>> In the other poster's case, it was 3 quarts of ice tea and enough
>> symptoms to land her in the emergency room.
>>
>>
>> --Lia
>>
>>
>
> So I work evenings and get home after midnight. I drink coffee at work
> maybe 1-1.5 pots in my 8 hr shift (I've cut back) and I drink coffee
> while I relax at home prior to bed maybe 2-3 cups before I go to bed
> around 2 am. I Sleep like a baby. Well I snore enough so the cat leaves
> the room but I have no trouble getting to sleep. Worry or guilt is a big
> cause of not sleeping. If fact those 2 make up the majority of the self
> imposed mental health issues today. So like the song says Don't
> worry...be happy (BTW the composer killed himself). A fixed bedtime
> routine works wonders, works kinda like self hypnosis.

What's a "self imposed mental health issue?"

"Mark Thorson" > wrote in message
...
> Julia Altshuler wrote:
>>
>> hahabogus wrote:
>> > So like the song says Don't
>> > worry...be happy (BTW the composer killed himself). A fixed bedtime
>> > routine works wonders, works kinda like self hypnosis.
>>
>> I googled on "Don't worry be happy" and learned from Wikipedia that the
>> song is by musician Bobby McFerrin. McFerrin is still living. The
>> phrase is an expression often used by Meher Baba. He was injured in a
>> car wreck which caused him considerable pain. He died in 1968. While
>> he did engage in seclusion, meditation, and fasting, and while these may
>> have contributed to his death in some way, no mention was made of
>> suicide.
>
> Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
>
> http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
>
> Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
> wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
> Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.

Urban legend??!! Oh my God, do you mean McFerrin walks around with random
strangers thinking he killed himself already?

hahabogus wrote on Sat, 12 Jul 2008 14:31:56 GMT:

>> hahabogus wrote:
>>> So like the song says Don't
>>> worry...be happy (BTW the composer killed himself). A fixed
>>> bedtime routine works wonders, works kinda like self
>>> hypnosis.
>>
>> I googled on "Don't worry be happy" and learned from
>> Wikipedia that the song is by musician Bobby McFerrin.
>> McFerrin is still living. The phrase is an expression often
>> used by Meher Baba. He was injured in a car wreck which
>> caused him considerable pain. He died in 1968. While he did
>> engage in seclusion, meditation, and fasting, and while these
>> may have contributed to his death in some way, no mention was
>> made of suicide.
>>
>> --Lia
>>
> I stand corrected, I mistakingly believed McFerrin did himself
> in.

Have a look at the Wiki entry:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_M...Bobby_McFerrin

He is an absolutely remarkable musician in popular, jazz and classical
music! I've heard him and he's hard to believe!

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

The UnInmate wrote:
>
> "Mark Thorson" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
> >
> > http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
> >
> > Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
> > wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
> > Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.
>
> Urban legend??!! Oh my God, do you mean McFerrin walks around
> with random strangers thinking he killed himself already?

It's a famous story, hence it's an urban legend.

By the way, Felix Powell (who committed suicide)
only wrote the music for "Pack Up Your Troubles
in Your Old Kit Bag and Smile, Smile, Smile".
His brother George wrote the words. There's
a short biography of them he

http://www.nationaltheatre.org.uk/?lid=18283

Julia Altshuler wrote:
> Goomba wrote:
>>
>> I'm not convinced a half cup of tea did all that. Perhaps she just
>> wasn't tired, or was stimulated by the night out or having had a piece
>> of chocolate cake, or hitting that age where women often have
>> difficulty sleeping.... who the hell knows?
>> It almost sounds a tad neurotic to take one isolated minor event and
>> tag it with such import, IMO. If you want to prove it, do some more
>> controlled tests.
>
>
> You're mixing up 2 case studies.
>
>
> In my case, it was half a cup of tea and a single sleepless night. No
> other symptoms.
>
>
> In the other poster's case, it was 3 quarts of ice tea and enough
> symptoms to land her in the emergency room.
>
>
> --Lia
>
Yes, I didn't realize I mixed up two stories. Mea culpa!

Mark Thorson wrote:
>
> Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
>
> http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
>
> Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
> wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
> Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.


This, is a nutshell, is why I love usenet despite all the reasons not to
love it. Thread drift brings us to interesting tangents. Something
inaccurate is posted. One person alone doesn't correct the
misconception. It's a group effort. Together, we even get to the
bottom of where the misconception came from. (Well, I mean, in as much
as discovering that something is a widely known urban legend is getting
to the bottom. No one ever knows who started the rumor.) Thanks.


--Lia

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 11:25:25 -0700, Mark Thorson
> wrote:

>> Urban legend??!! Oh my God, do you mean McFerrin walks around
>> with random strangers thinking he killed himself already?
>
>It's a famous story, hence it's an urban legend.

Howdy,

So "urban" means "famous?"

But seriously, if it is a "famous story" why is it not
simply a "legend."

What's "urban" about it?

(It is odd how the phrase "urban legend" passed into the
language. I know that there was a book by that title "Urban
Legends" years ago, but many of the legends in the book were
not "urban" at all. I thought at the time that the title
might better have been "Modern Legends.")

All the best,
--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

Kenneth wrote:
>
> But seriously, if it is a "famous story" why is it not
> simply a "legend."
>
> What's "urban" about it?

Probably to distinguish them from folk legends,
commonly held by backwoods rubes.

"Julia Altshuler" > wrote in message
...
> Mark Thorson wrote:
>> Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
>>
>> http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
>>
>> Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
>> wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
>> Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.
>
>
> This, is a nutshell, is why I love usenet despite all the reasons not to
> love it. Thread drift brings us to interesting tangents. Something
> inaccurate is posted. One person alone doesn't correct the misconception.
> It's a group effort. Together, we even get to the bottom of where the
> misconception came from. (Well, I mean, in as much as discovering that
> something is a widely known urban legend is getting to the bottom. No one
> ever knows who started the rumor.) Thanks.
>
>
> --Lia

What I love most is that, at least on this NG, people don't react to the
original poster of inaccurate information with "Oh you a***hole dumbf***
you're worthless!" and then stitch a scarlet letter onto his bare tit and
all killfile him. It eliminates the need for a lot of bowing and scraping
when people can just correct something that's wrong without getting
personal. So double thanks. :-)

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:36:23 -0400, "The UnInmate"
> wrote:


>What I love most is that, at least on this NG, people don't react to the
>original poster of inaccurate information with "Oh you a***hole dumbf***
>you're worthless!" and then stitch a scarlet letter onto his bare tit and
>all killfile him. It eliminates the need for a lot of bowing and scraping
>when people can just correct something that's wrong without getting
>personal. So double thanks. :-)
>

Oh, it does happen here from time to time. But just ignore it..

And by the way, welcome to the group.

Christine

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 17:18:26 -0700, Mark Thorson
> wrote:

>Kenneth wrote:
>>
>> But seriously, if it is a "famous story" why is it not
>> simply a "legend."
>>
>> What's "urban" about it?
>
>Probably to distinguish them from folk legends,
>commonly held by backwoods rubes.

Well, that was the confusing thing about the book that was
the source of the phrase:

Many of the stories, or "legends" were from, and about rural
folks.

All the best,
--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 09:05:27 -0700, Mark Thorson >
wrote:

>Julia Altshuler wrote:
>>
>> hahabogus wrote:
>> > So like the song says Don't
>> > worry...be happy (BTW the composer killed himself). A fixed bedtime
>> > routine works wonders, works kinda like self hypnosis.
>>
>> I googled on "Don't worry be happy" and learned from Wikipedia that the
>> song is by musician Bobby McFerrin. McFerrin is still living. The
>> phrase is an expression often used by Meher Baba. He was injured in a
>> car wreck which caused him considerable pain. He died in 1968. While
>> he did engage in seclusion, meditation, and fasting, and while these may
>> have contributed to his death in some way, no mention was made of suicide.
>
>Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
>
>http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
>
>Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
>wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
>Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.

a case of justifiable suicide.

your pal,
blake
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:10:23 -0400, Kenneth
> wrote:

>On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 11:25:25 -0700, Mark Thorson
> wrote:
>
>>> Urban legend??!! Oh my God, do you mean McFerrin walks around
>>> with random strangers thinking he killed himself already?
>>
>>It's a famous story, hence it's an urban legend.
>
>Howdy,
>
>So "urban" means "famous?"
>
>But seriously, if it is a "famous story" why is it not
>simply a "legend."
>
>What's "urban" about it?
>
>(It is odd how the phrase "urban legend" passed into the
>language. I know that there was a book by that title "Urban
>Legends" years ago, but many of the legends in the book were
>not "urban" at all. I thought at the time that the title
>might better have been "Modern Legends.")
>
>All the best,

*snopes* actually has a reun-down of the term:

Urban legends are best described as cautionary or moralistic tales
passed along by those who believe (or claim) the incidents befell
either folks they know personally or acquaintances of friends or
family members.

Whereas the setting of more traditional legends places them in the
realm of long ago, urban legends are set against the backdrop of
contemporary times — the stories take place in shopping malls and coed
dormitories and feature such up-to-date bogeymen as terrorists, AIDS,
and inner-city gangs. Though some of these tales go back a century or
more, their details are continually being updated to keep them current
with the times; the horse and buggy of bygone days becomes the BMW of
today.

<http://www.snopes.com/info/ul-def.asp>

jan brunvand, who wrote the book of which you speak and a couple
sequels, emphasized that the tales were usually first told by a
'friend of a friend' (f.o.a.f., or 'my brother-in-law's boss, etc.)
who was the victim or present when the occurrence happened.

sometimes there's an element of the story (like the pill that changes
water to gasoline) being 'suppressed' by the big-money boys and
mainstream media.

but you're right, the term has been stretched somewhat since jan wrote
his book (which is pretty entertaining).

your pal,
blake


your pal,
blake
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 09:05:27 -0700, Mark Thorson >
> wrote:
>
>>Julia Altshuler wrote:
>>>
>>> hahabogus wrote:
>>> > So like the song says Don't
>>> > worry...be happy (BTW the composer killed himself). A fixed bedtime
>>> > routine works wonders, works kinda like self hypnosis.
>>>
>>> I googled on "Don't worry be happy" and learned from Wikipedia that the
>>> song is by musician Bobby McFerrin. McFerrin is still living. The
>>> phrase is an expression often used by Meher Baba. He was injured in a
>>> car wreck which caused him considerable pain. He died in 1968. While
>>> he did engage in seclusion, meditation, and fasting, and while these may
>>> have contributed to his death in some way, no mention was made of
>>> suicide.
>>
>>Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
>>
>>http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
>>
>>Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
>>wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
>>Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.
>
> a case of justifiable suicide.

Not if you're one of his loved ones and spend the rest of your life
wondering what you could have done to prevent it. Of course the "you" here
is rhetorical because accusing you, b.m., of having normal human feelings
would be silly.

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:10:23 -0400, Kenneth
> > wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 11:25:25 -0700, Mark Thorson
> wrote:
>>
>>>> Urban legend??!! Oh my God, do you mean McFerrin walks around
>>>> with random strangers thinking he killed himself already?
>>>
>>>It's a famous story, hence it's an urban legend.
>>
>>Howdy,
>>
>>So "urban" means "famous?"
>>
>>But seriously, if it is a "famous story" why is it not
>>simply a "legend."
>>
>>What's "urban" about it?
>>
>>(It is odd how the phrase "urban legend" passed into the
>>language. I know that there was a book by that title "Urban
>>Legends" years ago, but many of the legends in the book were
>>not "urban" at all. I thought at the time that the title
>>might better have been "Modern Legends.")
>>
>>All the best,
>
> *snopes* actually has a reun-down of the term:
>
> Urban legends are best described as cautionary or moralistic tales
> passed along by those who believe (or claim) the incidents befell
> either folks they know personally or acquaintances of friends or
> family members.
>
> Whereas the setting of more traditional legends places them in the
> realm of long ago, urban legends are set against the backdrop of
> contemporary times - the stories take place in shopping malls and coed
> dormitories and feature such up-to-date bogeymen as terrorists, AIDS,
> and inner-city gangs. Though some of these tales go back a century or
> more, their details are continually being updated to keep them current
> with the times; the horse and buggy of bygone days becomes the BMW of
> today.
>
> <http://www.snopes.com/info/ul-def.asp>
>
> jan brunvand, who wrote the book of which you speak and a couple
> sequels, emphasized that the tales were usually first told by a
> 'friend of a friend' (f.o.a.f., or 'my brother-in-law's boss, etc.)
> who was the victim or present when the occurrence happened.
>
> sometimes there's an element of the story (like the pill that changes
> water to gasoline) being 'suppressed' by the big-money boys and
> mainstream media.
>
> but you're right, the term has been stretched somewhat since jan wrote
> his book (which is pretty entertaining).

Wow, musta cost you a fortune to hire a typist to transcribe an entire
webpage for you. Next time how about having her summarize it in a few of her
own words and just post a link. No use having the poor lady look pompous.

The wrote on Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:35:06 -0400:


Kenneth
>> > wrote:
>>
>> *snopes* actually has a reun-down of the term:
>>
>> Urban legends are best described as cautionary or moralistic
>>>> Clipping<<<<<<<
>> <http://www.snopes.com/info/ul-def.asp>

> Wow, musta cost you a fortune to hire a typist to transcribe an entire
> webpage for you. Next time how about having her summarize it
> in a few of her own words and just post a link. No use having the poor
> lady look pompous.

..
It's unfortunately very easy to get the whole of Snopes with a few
clicks

Click and drag to highlight the whole thing.(You could use CTRL-A but
you'd have to edit after pasting)
CTRL-C to copy
Click Puretext to unformat (a very useful add in)
CTRL-V to paste it.

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 11:21:10 -0400, blake murphy
> wrote:

>>SNIP<<
>
>jan brunvand, who wrote the book of which you speak and a couple
>sequels, emphasized that the tales were usually first told by a
>'friend of a friend' (f.o.a.f., or 'my brother-in-law's boss, etc.)
>who was the victim or present when the occurrence happened.
>
>sometimes there's an element of the story (like the pill that changes
>water to gasoline) being 'suppressed' by the big-money boys and
>mainstream media.
>
>but you're right, the term has been stretched somewhat since jan wrote
>his book (which is pretty entertaining).
>
>your pal,
>blake
>
>
>your pal,
>blake
>** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

Hi Blake,

So, based upon Snopes, (or otherwise), might you have a
thought about my question, that is, why Brunvand chose to
call these tales "Urban" legends?

Urban means "from, or of the _city_" and there is nothing
"urban" whatever about the topic of the books.

I know what the books are about, and found them
entertaining...

It's the title that I can't figure out (together with the
fact that this truly odd construction has caught on so
completely.)

All the best,
--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

Kenneth wrote:
>
> So, based upon Snopes, (or otherwise), might you have a
> thought about my question, that is, why Brunvand chose to
> call these tales "Urban" legends?
>
> Urban means "from, or of the _city_" and there is nothing
> "urban" whatever about the topic of the books.

He meant "urbane", but the spellchecker didn't catch it.

On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:35:06 -0400, "The UnInmate"
> wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 20:10:23 -0400, Kenneth
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 11:25:25 -0700, Mark Thorson
> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Urban legend??!! Oh my God, do you mean McFerrin walks around
>>>>> with random strangers thinking he killed himself already?
>>>>
>>>>It's a famous story, hence it's an urban legend.
>>>
>>>Howdy,
>>>
>>>So "urban" means "famous?"
>>>
>>>But seriously, if it is a "famous story" why is it not
>>>simply a "legend."
>>>
>>>What's "urban" about it?
>>>
>>>(It is odd how the phrase "urban legend" passed into the
>>>language. I know that there was a book by that title "Urban
>>>Legends" years ago, but many of the legends in the book were
>>>not "urban" at all. I thought at the time that the title
>>>might better have been "Modern Legends.")
>>>
>>>All the best,
>>
>> *snopes* actually has a reun-down of the term:
>>
>> Urban legends are best described as cautionary or moralistic tales
>> passed along by those who believe (or claim) the incidents befell
>> either folks they know personally or acquaintances of friends or
>> family members.
>>
>> Whereas the setting of more traditional legends places them in the
>> realm of long ago, urban legends are set against the backdrop of
>> contemporary times - the stories take place in shopping malls and coed
>> dormitories and feature such up-to-date bogeymen as terrorists, AIDS,
>> and inner-city gangs. Though some of these tales go back a century or
>> more, their details are continually being updated to keep them current
>> with the times; the horse and buggy of bygone days becomes the BMW of
>> today.
>>
>> <http://www.snopes.com/info/ul-def.asp>
>>
>> jan brunvand, who wrote the book of which you speak and a couple
>> sequels, emphasized that the tales were usually first told by a
>> 'friend of a friend' (f.o.a.f., or 'my brother-in-law's boss, etc.)
>> who was the victim or present when the occurrence happened.
>>
>> sometimes there's an element of the story (like the pill that changes
>> water to gasoline) being 'suppressed' by the big-money boys and
>> mainstream media.
>>
>> but you're right, the term has been stretched somewhat since jan wrote
>> his book (which is pretty entertaining).
>
>Wow, musta cost you a fortune to hire a typist to transcribe an entire
>webpage for you. Next time how about having her summarize it in a few of her
>own words and just post a link. No use having the poor lady look pompous.
>

there's this new miracle thing called 'cut and paste.'

your pal,
blake
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:32:18 -0400, "The UnInmate"
> wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sat, 12 Jul 2008 09:05:27 -0700, Mark Thorson >
>> wrote:
>>
>>>Julia Altshuler wrote:
>>>>
>>>> hahabogus wrote:
>>>> > So like the song says Don't
>>>> > worry...be happy (BTW the composer killed himself). A fixed bedtime
>>>> > routine works wonders, works kinda like self hypnosis.
>>>>
>>>> I googled on "Don't worry be happy" and learned from Wikipedia that the
>>>> song is by musician Bobby McFerrin. McFerrin is still living. The
>>>> phrase is an expression often used by Meher Baba. He was injured in a
>>>> car wreck which caused him considerable pain. He died in 1968. While
>>>> he did engage in seclusion, meditation, and fasting, and while these may
>>>> have contributed to his death in some way, no mention was made of
>>>> suicide.
>>>
>>>Snopes has a full debunking of this urban legend:
>>>
>>>http://www.snopes.com/music/artists/mcferrin.asp
>>>
>>>Although McFerrin didn't commit suicide, the guy who
>>>wrote "Pack Up Your Troubles in Your Old Kit Bag and
>>>Smile, Smile, Smile" did in fact commit suicide.
>>
>> a case of justifiable suicide.
>
>Not if you're one of his loved ones and spend the rest of your life
>wondering what you could have done to prevent it. Of course the "you" here
>is rhetorical because accusing you, b.m., of having normal human feelings
>would be silly.
>

that's me all over. inhuman beast, more animal than man. it's a
wonder all the wimmen can keep me downtrodden.

blake
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 15:48:29 -0400, Kenneth
> wrote:

>On Sun, 13 Jul 2008 11:21:10 -0400, blake murphy
> wrote:
>
>>>SNIP<<
>>
>>jan brunvand, who wrote the book of which you speak and a couple
>>sequels, emphasized that the tales were usually first told by a
>>'friend of a friend' (f.o.a.f., or 'my brother-in-law's boss, etc.)
>>who was the victim or present when the occurrence happened.
>>
>>sometimes there's an element of the story (like the pill that changes
>>water to gasoline) being 'suppressed' by the big-money boys and
>>mainstream media.
>>
>>but you're right, the term has been stretched somewhat since jan wrote
>>his book (which is pretty entertaining).
>>
>>your pal,
>>blake
>>
>>
>>your pal,
>>blake
>>** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
>
>Hi Blake,
>
>So, based upon Snopes, (or otherwise), might you have a
>thought about my question, that is, why Brunvand chose to
>call these tales "Urban" legends?
>
>Urban means "from, or of the _city_" and there is nothing
>"urban" whatever about the topic of the books.
>

most of the tales take place in urban settings, not trolls under
bridges and woodcutters run amok.

your pal,
blake
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

On Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:24:29 -0400, blake murphy
> wrote:

>
>>Urban means "from, or of the _city_" and there is nothing
>>"urban" whatever about the topic of the books.
>>
>
>most of the tales take place in urban settings, not trolls under
>bridges and woodcutters run amok.
>
>your pal,
>blake
>** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

Hi Blake,

That is not my recollection of the original book, but, of
course, you may be right...

All the best,
--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."