Dave Smith wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> >
> >>> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians
separate
> >>> fee.
> >> It is a shame that you don't have government health insurance like we
> >> have in Canada. Everyone is eligible regardless of pre-exisitng
> >> conditions.
> >
> > I suspect it's coming. My main concern with Socialized health care is
> > what it's going to cost us.
> >
> > Nothing is free. Only time will tell.
>
> Most of us know that it is not free. There is less spent per capita on
> health care in the US and Canadians live a little longer.


One more diff is that Canada also has a more equitable distribution of
income and so does not have a huge underclass with the requisite large
number of chronic health problems...

Decent preventative care can nip a goodly number of potentially serious
health problems in the bud, preventative care (especially pre - natal care)
in the US practically does not exist for most low - income people...


--
Best
Greg

On Sep 16, 11:10*am, Wayne Boatwright >
wrote:
> On Tue 16 Sep 2008 07:22:13a, John Kane told us...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 15, 8:41*pm, Wayne Boatwright >
> > wrote:
> >> On Mon 15 Sep 2008 04:24:33p, Dave Smith told us...
>
> >> > John Kane wrote:
>
> >> >>> I'm not against helping people in need! How many times do I have to
> s
> > ay
> >> >>> that? *I have a problem with deliberate freeloaders! *There are t
> > hose
> >> >>> that even feel that welfare recipients should be drug screened...
>
> >> >> What freeloaders? *The press may talk about 'freeloaders' but I bet
> >> >> they're awfully hard to find on the ground.
>
> >> > I don't know that many people on welfare, but I can think of a few who
> >> > were definite abusers. I spoke before of a family I knew on welfare
> who
> >> > spent most of their time online. Every in the family had a their own
> >> > computer, all state of the art.The father sabotaged every job he
> >> > eventually got. One daughter got student welfare because he could not
> >> > live with her family, but spent most of her time at home with the
> famil
> > y
> >> > she could not live with, and the older daughter set out to get
> pregnant
> >> > during her first *year of college.
>
> >> > Then there is one of the kids who got caught breaking into my house.
> He
> >> > came from a welfare family, but at the age of 17 had his own car. Not
> t
> > o
> >> > mention one of his his burglary buddies, living on student welfare.
>
> >> > When I was working in commercial vehicle I came across a guy driving
> >> > under suspension. He was on his way to the local welfare office to
> pick
> >> > up his welfare cheque. He had a truck with NY plates *and a NY driver
> >> > licence, and he is in Ontario to pick up his welfare cheque? I called
> >> > the welfare office to tell him that a NY resident was on his way in to
> >> > pick up a welfare cheque. They didn't want to know about it until I
> >> > asked if they preferred that I call the local newspaper.
> >> >> Perhaps you should call your local welfare office and ask?
>
> >> > See above.
>
> >> I can remember a time, many years ago in Cleveland, where it was common
> t
> > o
> >> see many welfare recipients pulling up to the welfare offices in their
> ne
> > w
> >> Cadillacs to pick up their checks.
>
> > You have pictures? *I really find this hard, well damn near impossible
> > to believe.
>
> No, John, I don't. *It was over 40 years ago and I wasn't interested in
> taking pictures of it. *I don't know how old you are, but I do know that
> things were very different in Cleveland in those days.

Old enough to remember those days but I've never been to Cleveland.

I've also never seen a welfare recipient driving a new Cadillac even
back then.

>
> >> I know things aren't quite like that now, but it's an image one doesn't
> >> forget.
> > John Kane Kingston ON Canada

On Sep 16, 11:12*am, Wayne Boatwright >
wrote:
> On Tue 16 Sep 2008 07:23:44a, John Kane told us...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Sep 15, 4:27*pm, blake murphy > wrote:
> >> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 11:45:18 GMT, Saerah Gray wrote:
> >> > Omelet > fnord
> >> >news
>
> >> >> In article > ,
> >> >> *T > wrote:
>
> >> >>> So tell me since you're the expert, what reforms would you make to
> >> >>> the welfare system?
>
> >> >> Government work programs. *I already stated that.
>
> >> >> Give them the welfare they need, but make them work for it.
> >> >> It really is that simple...
>
> >> >> I believe in helping people, just not in giving them a totally free
> >> >> ride. I work hard for the money I make.
>
> >> > So will the government pay for child care under your program, too?
>
> >> > An overhaul of the system is needed, certainly. What kind of jobs are
> w
> > e
> >> > going to give these people so that they can get off welfare and make a
> >> > living that is enough to support their family?
>
> >> > It's more complicated than "have them work for the money". Basically,
> >> > you would have these people work for *less* than minimum wage. And
> >> > that's not a solution.
>
> >> well, then, they'll just have to starve! *problem solved!
>
> >> (dibs on their big-screen t.v.'s.)
>
> > I get the Cadillacs.
>
> They'd probabaly rust buckets by now, given the age and how much salt
> Cleveland used to use on their roads in those days. *Otherwise, they might
> be nice vintage cars.
>
> > John Kane Kingston ON Canada
>
I know a few collectors who probably would go for them anyway

cybercat wrote:

>
> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 10:09:28 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>>
>>> In article >,
>>> "cybercat" > wrote:
>>>
>>>> "kilikini" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> Nancy Young wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> One thing not mentioned, if you don't have dependents, it's not
>>>>>> easy to get benefits. If you can, I don't know. You lose your
>>>>>> job, you're SOL. I imagine that varies by state, too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> nancy
>>>>>
>>>>> That's one of the reasons I had so many problems getting Medicaid.
>>>>> I'm
>>>>> married, no children, and I'm white. Without dependents, it's a
>>>>> much harder struggle to receive anything; you get scrutinized so
>>>>> much more.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So you are saying that they descriminate against WHITE people,
>>>> kili??
>>>
>>> Where have YOU been?
>>
>> you're saying 'they' do? complete and utter bullshit. cite, please.
>>
>
> And why is this stupid bitch still addressing me when I have her
> killfiled?

May I remind you that just because you can't see her, it doesn't mean
that she can't see you...
--
Cheers
Chatty Cathy

cybercat wrote:

> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 10:09:28 -0500, Omelet wrote:
> >
> >> In article >,
> >> "cybercat" > wrote:
> >>
> >>> "kilikini" > wrote in message
> >>> ...
> >>>> Nancy Young wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> One thing not mentioned, if you don't have dependents, it's not
> >>>>> easy to get benefits. If you can, I don't know. You lose your
> >>>>> job, you're SOL. I imagine that varies by state, too.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> nancy
> >>>>
> >>>> That's one of the reasons I had so many problems getting Medicaid.
I'm
> >>>> married, no children, and I'm white. Without dependents, it's a much
> >>>> harder struggle to receive anything; you get scrutinized so much
more.
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> So you are saying that they descriminate against WHITE people, kili??
> >>
> >> Where have YOU been?
> >
> > you're saying 'they' do? complete and utter bullshit. cite, please.
> >
>
> And why is this stupid bitch still addressing me when I have her
killfiled?
>


Still *another* thoughtful contri from the cybershrill...

Lol...

As misguided as I think some of blake's statements are in this thread, at
least he puts some thought into what he writes. If you want to disagree, go
ahead, but cheap insults such as yours above will only serve to make you
look, well, CHEAP...


--
Best
Greg

" I find Greg Morrow lowbrow, witless, and obnoxious. For him to claim that
we are some
kind of comedy team turns my stomach."
- "cybercat" to me on rec.food.cooking

On Sep 16, 12:00*pm, Omelet > wrote:
> In article >,
> *blake murphy > wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 09:04:54 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>
> > > In article > ,
> > > *Saerah Gray > wrote:
>
> > >> Omelet > fnord
> > >>news
>
> > >>> In article > ,
> > >>> *Saerah Gray > wrote:
>
> > >>>> Of course, you won't define "refuse to work". Are you aware of how
> > >>>> expensive childcare is? If you're making a thousand dollars a month,
> > >>>> and half or more goes to childcare, what are you supposed to live on?
>
> > >>> That is why work at home programs would be the practical answer to
> > >>> that.
>
> > >> What kind of work do you suggest they do (for the government, right?) at
> > >> home?
>
> > > Sewing, clerical work, etc. Now with the internet, even some businesses
> > > have people doing computer work from home.
>
> > yep, all you have to do is buy a computer and pay for internet access. *no
> > problem there.
>
> > your pal,
> > blake
>
> <sigh>
>
> The employer generally pays for the tools, and the training...

Reputable ones do but many such companies, at least in Ontario, insist
that you buy everything, sometimes even charge for training and then
pretend that you're a sub-contractor not an employee so that they do
not have to provide any employee benefits. I'd be surprised if the
same does not happen in the USA.

John Kane Kingston ON Canada

On Sep 16, 12:13*pm, Dave Smith > wrote:
> Omelet wrote:
>
> >> really, being poor is a lot of work. *it's not surprising these folks don't
> >> have time to hold down a job.
>
> >> your pal,
> >> blake
>
> > Disability is also not the same as Welfare... *Kili has nothing to be
> > ashamed of.
>
> I think that several of us who have commented on this thread have
> indicated that we are in favour of helping those in need. People who are
> sick and or disabled deserve assistance. It is the people who are too
> lazy to work that we resent abusing the system.

The problem is that a number of participants have started out with the
assumption that ALL welfare recipients are abusing the system and then
say "Well not in that case" when they hear about a real case.

It is almost certain that some people are abusing the system but the
number is almost certainly very low ( I'm open to stats, not anecdotes
that contradict this). I suspect that it gets difficult fairly
quickly to find all those abusers.

And as I mentioned earlier it is probably cheaper to tolerate a few
aabusers than to try to police the system to such an extend that you
catch almost all of them. The paperwork and workload just would cost
too much to justify it.

BTW Dave, check into just how easy it is to get classifed as Disabled
in Ontario or
Alberta. Rumour is that a first application is automatically
rejected. This can leave the truely disabled on welfare, not because
they are abusing the system but rather because the government is
abusing the system.

John Kane Kingston.

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 14:57:25 -0500, "Gregory Morrow" >
wrote:

>
>
>Dave Smith wrote:
>
>> Omelet wrote:
>> >
>> >>> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians
>separate
>> >>> fee.
>> >> It is a shame that you don't have government health insurance like we
>> >> have in Canada. Everyone is eligible regardless of pre-exisitng
>> >> conditions.
>> >
>> > I suspect it's coming. My main concern with Socialized health care is
>> > what it's going to cost us.
>> >
>> > Nothing is free. Only time will tell.
>>
>> Most of us know that it is not free. There is less spent per capita on
>> health care in the US and Canadians live a little longer.
>
>
>One more diff is that Canada also has a more equitable distribution of
>income and so does not have a huge underclass with the requisite large
>number of chronic health problems...

Not huge, but nevertheless, First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples in
Canada have much worse health than the rest of the pop..
>
>Decent preventative care can nip a goodly number of potentially serious
>health problems in the bud, preventative care (especially pre - natal care)
>in the US practically does not exist for most low - income people...

Or, apparently available or utilized well enough for the First
Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples.


Boron

blake murphy wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 19:27:12 -0400, Dave Smith wrote:
>
> > blake murphy wrote:
> >>
> >> and what percentage of the awful, awful one percent of your taxes do
they
> >> absorb?
> >>
> >> christ, you begrudge these people the crumbs off your table. how
> >> compassionate.
> >
> > One percent for that, one percent for another thing and one percent for
> > something else. If they won't give 1%, why should the rest of us? If we
> > all tried to live off the system there would not be any tax revenue to
> > use to help those who need it.
>
> oh, i don't know, why not bitch about the 21% of the federal budget that
> goes to defense? the chart here is from o.m.b. figures:
>
> <http://www.cbpp.org/4-10-07tax2.htm>
>
> is there a reason that we spend as much as *the rest of the world
combined*
> on defense?


Yup, we have a LOT of defense responsibilites and obligations ALL around the
world, blake...60+ years on we still have large numbers of troops in Japan,
Germany, not to mention places like Korea. We have a huge naval fleet
patrolling most all of the seas and oceans of the world...many bases ALL
over the world. And the majority of the peeps in the world are GLAD to have
us...

Don't forget that we provided the majority of NATO's "nuclear umbrella
shield" during the Cold War years, not to mention helping to ensure
stability in the Korean peninsula, the Far East...we only pulled our
occupying troops out of West Berlin in 1991...

Then there's the Middle East...

Just so you know this has all served to help "preserve the peace" in our
volatile post - WWII world...and it's STILL required. Otherwise you have
all kinds of assorted miscreants and pukes running all over the joint trying
to cause "trouble". The fact that we are the #1 military power in the world
does a LOT to put the kibbosh on some of the plans the Bad Guys would LOVE
to see come to fruition...


> why not bitch about farm subsidies and other corporate welfare that give
> money to people who already have plenty of it?


Because those subsidies help to assure our PROSPERITY, blake...they
eventually more often than not produce WEALTH...natcherly being a leftist
you wouldn't understand the concepts of "prosperity" and "wealth"...

And since we live in a FREE and CAPITALIST society you too have the
potential to be wealthy and successful and happy if you work hard enuf and
play yer cards right...maybe you're just ****ed off that you're NOT,
eh...???


> you strain at a gnat and swallow a camel.


Anyways you sound like some of the shrill and willfully ignorant American -
hating Europukes I've encountered elsewheres on Usenet, blake...so SHAME on
ya, you're smarter and better than that...

You are hereby DISMISSED, sonny boy...don yer dunce cap and go stand in the
corner with yer fellow communist Michel Boucher, heehee...and READ some
HISTORY, fer crying out loud...!!!


:-P


--
Best
Greg

Mike Pearce wrote:

> "Omelet" wrote in message
> news
> > "Mike Pearce" wrote:
> >
> >> "Omelet" wrote in message
> >> > Dave Smith wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> What do you do in a case like that. He is a woman who was raised
> >> >> on
> >> >> welfare, whose college education subsidized and received student
> >> >> grants,
> >> >> who had the opportunity to get education and training to help
> >> >> her
> >> >> find
> >> >> meaningful employment. But she knew that the system would
> >> >> support
> >> >> her,
> >> >> so she intentionally got herself pregnant knowing that she could
> >> >> stay
> >> >> home and not have to work. That was the way she was raised, and
> >> >> there is
> >> >> a good chance that her kid will grow up with the same mind set.
> >> >
> >> > That appears to be the problem in New Orleans...
> >>
> >> I would like to see an example as described above happening in New
> >> Orleans.
> >>
> >> -Mike
> >
> > <cough>
> >
> > I guess you were not the recipient in your state of a large number
> > of
> > Katrina refugees...
>
> I didn't really expect that you'd show me an example. My state
> (Louisiana) had a lot of Katrina "refugees." What do Katrina refugees
> have to do with the question I asked other than the fact that many of
> them happened to come from New Orleans?


Are you being "ironic", or...???

The poorest of the Katrina refugees are a a largely shifteless and criminal
welfare underclass...go to any of the nabes in the cities where some of them
settled (Houston...) and you'll see...NO one wants them, either as neighbors
or co - workers because of their assorted ghetto pathologies.


--
Best
Greg

Omelet wrote:

> In article >,
> "cybercat" > wrote:
>
> > "blake murphy" > wrote :
> > >
> > > well, there are soap operas, and she may be becoming the star of one
now.
> > >
> > >
> >
> > She's sounding a bit like Ross Perot when he went paranoid, over this
> > investigation of her dealings with her brother-in-law. It did not
take
> > long for the fruitcake factor to come front and center.
>
> You are just running scared.


Yup, read the details of the contretemps, any reasonable person would do
pretty much the same as Palin did in a similar sitch...

--
Best
Greg

blake murphy wrote:

>>> christ, you begrudge these people the crumbs off your table. how
>>> compassionate.
>> One percent for that, one percent for another thing and one percent for
>> something else. If they won't give 1%, why should the rest of us? If we
>> all tried to live off the system there would not be any tax revenue to
>> use to help those who need it.
>
> oh, i don't know, why not bitch about the 21% of the federal budget that
> goes to defense? the chart here is from o.m.b. figures:


What can I say? The military-industrial complex is a major part of the
US economy. Your government often says that Canada does not put enough
money into its military and isn't carrying its share in defence.
Itonically, there is only one country that has invaded us.... several
times, and that is the US.

"cybercat" > wrote in
:

>> > I know things aren't quite like that now, but it's an image one
>> > doesn't forget.
>>
>> what are you, ronald reagan risen from the grave?
>>
>> 'it was common to see'? how many times did you see this yourself?
>
>>>I`d say never.
>
> http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-welfarequeen.htm
>
> So *this* is where the dumbasses get this stuff! hahaha!

Proves their whole schtick is a tissue of lies and innuendo aimed at
vilifying those they know won't vote for them.

Windsor Star 11 Sep 2008 (on the election trail)

[...] Prime Minister Stephen Harper had more troubles Thursday as the
party suspended Ryan Sparrow, the Conservative's director of
communications, after he sent a one-line e-mail to a television producer.

The message pointed out Jim Davis, who had appeared on television
criticizing Harper's position on Afghanistan, was a Liberal supporter.

"Note this guy is an Iggy supporter," read Sparrow's e-mail, suggesting
support for Liberal Michael Ignatieff.

Davis whose son, Cpl. Paul Davis, was killed in March 2006, said he did
not want Canada to pull out of Afghanistan if it would mean his son died
in vain.

-----

Apologies were provided, but these people clearly lack a filter from
brain to keyboard/mouth. The problem is they think they're smarter than
everybody else (when actually their brains would turn to ink there
wouldn't be enough to make a period) and the stupid greedy electorate
plays right into that...hey, tax cuts...ya...

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Tue 16 Sep 2008 11:00:20a, Omelet told us...
>
>> In article 7>,
>> Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>>
>>>>> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so
>>>>> peachy?
>>>>>
>>>>> your pal,
>>>>> blake
>>>>
>>>> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians
>>>> separate fee.
>>>
>>> That was exactly my plight recently when my b/p suddenly went out of
>>> control. When I called the cardiologist's office they suggested
>>> that I go the the ER. I told them I could afford their $30 co-pay
>>> but not the ER $100 co-pay. I got into their office in a couple of
>>> hours.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Wayne Boatwright
>>
>> Good doc. ;-)
>>
>> I'm finally on Beta Blockers when mine hit 142 one night. I went to
>> work, told my co-worker what was happening and took my first Beta
>> Blocker, then waited. Took 3 hours to come down to 100.
>>
>> Now resting is running around 82.
>>
>> It's scary... I think mine was due to an OD of Thyroid Armour generic
>> tho'. I've cut the dose and it has not happened since.
>> Figuring out a proper thyroid med dose can be iffy, and takes weeks.
>
> Yes, it's scary. I woke up last Wednesday feeling rather dizzy.
> Took my b/p and it was 210/105. I was alsready on 2 b/p meds, so
> took my usual morning pill along with the one I take at night. It
> came down to normal range, so thought it was a fluke. The next
> morning it was 195/100. That's when I called the cardiologist. He
> put me on a third medication (each works differently in lowering the
> presure), and yesterday I went for a kidney ultrasound to rule out
> any narrowing or blockage of the renal arteries. That was clear. I
> go back on Friday for a followup.
>
> Figuring out most drug combinations and dosages are often difficult.

My b/p is usually about 117/72 or so. When I was in the hospital a few
weeks ago I saw it go as low as 86/64. I called the nurse in because I was
like, WHOA! Am I still alive? (I went in literally half-dead, I'm not
kidding. They had to give me 6 units of blood because I was internally
bleeding and hemorrhaging.) The nurse laughed at me and she said I have a
naturally low, resting b/p. She said it was good, but she wouldn't want it
to get any lower. She told me to watch it and if it gets any lower, call
her back in. Luckily, I had to get up to pee shortly after and I was back
up to normal. LOL.

kili

John Kane wrote:
>
> BTW Dave, check into just how easy it is to get classifed as Disabled
> in Ontario or
> Alberta. Rumour is that a first application is automatically
> rejected. This can leave the truely disabled on welfare, not because
> they are abusing the system but rather because the government is
> abusing the system.
>
> John Kane Kingston.

It took me 3 times to qualify for Disability. Here in the U.S. they
automatically deny you the first time, too. If you don't fight it, I guess
you really don't need it, huh? I fought it, reapplied and I got it - the
third time. Of course that was after 2 surgeries and I had medical records
about 100 pages long. LOL.

kili

wrote:
>Imagine how much worse it could be for them without the education.

It already is.

>While a high school diploma or a college degree is not a guarantee of a
>successful and financially rewarding career, it is generally a requirement.

It's only a requirement meant to weed out candidates. Many jobs clearly
do not require college education to perform. Employers only insist on
educational prerequisites to decrease the applicant pool.

>Sure, some people will see that an feel that they are wasting their time
>because there is nothing out there for them. Other's will be inspired to
>work that much harder to get out of that situation.

You make it sound like everyone can get out of vicious poverty cycles.
If it were simply a matter of determination, we would have far fewer
poor people than we currently do. There are schools where students don't
even have textbooks and have to eat lunch in shifts because of
overcrowding. There are schools in which students are never taught the
pleasures of critical thinking, whose libraries are not stocked with
philosophy and poetry, where no high school plays and musicals are
annually staged. I don't think you realize how run down many American
public schools actually are, especially in non-white communities.

>Some are bright enough to realize that in order to win they at least have to try. Every
>year thousands of people compete in the Boston Marathon, but only one of
>them is going to win. You don't have any chance at all if you don't try.

What I'm trying to get you to see is that many people are excluded from
the game regardless of how much they'd like to try to win. Consider, for
instance, how colleges routinely reject students with low SAT scores and
poor parents who will likely not afford tuition. Consider how expensive
even community college tuition is. For a student requiring remedial work
in writing and mathematics, part time study and employment are
unrealistic.

>Not all teachers are disinterested, but who can blame some of those who
>become that way after years of dealing with students who don't care and
>who disrespect their teachers.

I'm not at all in favor of hooligans disrespect their teachers.
Regardless of what these kids plan to do with their lives, they have to
learn respect for authority, rather than fear of authority. Respect
connotes admiration. If disrespect teachers can't get through to their
charges and foster admiration, no amount of fear will foster respect.

>They should be able to "make a living" as in working to earn a wage, or
>they should be able to sit back and collect money from the government
>because they are unemployable?

If we want them to make a living while acknowledging that they are not
employable in fields requiring higher education, we have to make that
possible by keeping more menial low wage labor in America rather than
farming it out to other countries. We have to be willing to pay more for
everything we consume if those increases will be passed on to the
payment of living wages to our work force. Failure to make these
sacrifices is tantamount to the most despicable hypocrisy.

Orlando

"Gregory Morrow" wrote in message
m...
>

> The poorest of the Katrina refugees are a a largely shifteless and
> criminal
> welfare underclass...go to any of the nabes in the cities where some
> of them
> settled (Houston...) and you'll see...NO one wants them, either as
> neighbors
> or co - workers because of their assorted ghetto pathologies.
>

Who would want to live near shiftless and criminal types? Those kind
of folks can be found just about anywhere. New Orleans has no monopoly
on scumbags.

-Mike

"Mike Pearce" > wrote

> Who would want to live near shiftless and criminal types? Those kind of
> folks can be found just about anywhere. New Orleans has no monopoly on
> scumbags.
>
For real. Chicago obviously has the biggest one--Queen Greg.

Orlando Enrique Fiol > fnord
:

> wrote:
>>Imagine how much worse it could be for them without the education.
>
> It already is.
>
>>While a high school diploma or a college degree is not a guarantee of
>>a successful and financially rewarding career, it is generally a
>>requirement.
>
> It's only a requirement meant to weed out candidates. Many jobs
> clearly do not require college education to perform. Employers only
> insist on educational prerequisites to decrease the applicant pool.
>

I completely agree.

>>Sure, some people will see that an feel that they are wasting their
>>time because there is nothing out there for them. Other's will be
>>inspired to work that much harder to get out of that situation.
>
> You make it sound like everyone can get out of vicious poverty cycles.
> If it were simply a matter of determination, we would have far fewer
> poor people than we currently do. There are schools where students
> don't even have textbooks and have to eat lunch in shifts because of
> overcrowding. There are schools in which students are never taught the
> pleasures of critical thinking, whose libraries are not stocked with
> philosophy and poetry, where no high school plays and musicals are
> annually staged. I don't think you realize how run down many American
> public schools actually are, especially in non-white communities.
>

I have to add here, that there are plenty of poverty-stricken majority
white communities, too. run down schools are run down schools, and it is
a disgrace that many people graduate high school barely literate.


>>Some are bright enough to realize that in order to win they at least
>>have to try. Every year thousands of people compete in the Boston
>>Marathon, but only one of them is going to win. You don't have any
>>chance at all if you don't try.
>
> What I'm trying to get you to see is that many people are excluded
> from the game regardless of how much they'd like to try to win.
> Consider, for instance, how colleges routinely reject students with
> low SAT scores and poor parents who will likely not afford tuition.
> Consider how expensive even community college tuition is. For a
> student requiring remedial work in writing and mathematics, part time
> study and employment are unrealistic.
>

Well, low SAT scores are a result of poor education. Colleges do not
want to accept students who will flunk out.

>>Not all teachers are disinterested, but who can blame some of those
>>who become that way after years of dealing with students who don't
>>care and who disrespect their teachers.
>
> I'm not at all in favor of hooligans disrespect their teachers.
> Regardless of what these kids plan to do with their lives, they have
> to learn respect for authority, rather than fear of authority. Respect
> connotes admiration. If disrespect teachers can't get through to their
> charges and foster admiration, no amount of fear will foster respect.
>
>>They should be able to "make a living" as in working to earn a wage,
>>or they should be able to sit back and collect money from the
>>government because they are unemployable?
>
> If we want them to make a living while acknowledging that they are not
> employable in fields requiring higher education, we have to make that
> possible by keeping more menial low wage labor in America rather than
> farming it out to other countries. We have to be willing to pay more
> for everything we consume if those increases will be passed on to the
> payment of living wages to our work force. Failure to make these
> sacrifices is tantamount to the most despicable hypocrisy.


Most people are not willing to make those sacrifices. It's not in their
personal self-interest, short term wise.


--
Saerah

"Welcome to Usenet, Biatch! Adapt or haul ass!"
- some hillbilly from FL

"kilikini" > fnord
:

>
> My b/p is usually about 117/72 or so. When I was in the hospital a
> few weeks ago I saw it go as low as 86/64. I called the nurse in
> because I was like, WHOA! Am I still alive? (I went in literally
> half-dead, I'm not kidding. They had to give me 6 units of blood
> because I was internally bleeding and hemorrhaging.) The nurse
> laughed at me and she said I have a naturally low, resting b/p. She
> said it was good, but she wouldn't want it to get any lower. She told
> me to watch it and if it gets any lower, call her back in. Luckily, I
> had to get up to pee shortly after and I was back up to normal. LOL.
>
> kili
>
>
>

When I was pregnant, the nurse who took my bp was always shocked at how
low it was. I dont think my systolic ever went over 115.

--
Saerah

"Welcome to Usenet, Biatch! Adapt or haul ass!"
- some hillbilly from FL

cybercat barks:

> "Mike Pearce" > wrote
>
> > Who would want to live near shiftless and criminal types? Those kind of
> > folks can be found just about anywhere. New Orleans has no monopoly on
> > scumbags.
> >
> For real. Chicago obviously has the biggest one--Queen Greg.
>


Shut up and fix my din - din*, be - YOTCH...I'll TELL you when you can open
yer feelthy TRAP...heehee...

[* or better yet, DON'T, since yer "cooking" wouldn't pass muster with a
starving Darfurian...]


:-)


--
Best
Greg

Mike Pearce wrote:

> "Gregory Morrow" wrote in message
> m...
> >
>
> > The poorest of the Katrina refugees are a a largely shifteless and
> > criminal
> > welfare underclass...go to any of the nabes in the cities where some
> > of them
> > settled (Houston...) and you'll see...NO one wants them, either as
> > neighbors
> > or co - workers because of their assorted ghetto pathologies.
> >
>
> Who would want to live near shiftless and criminal types? Those kind
> of folks can be found just about anywhere. New Orleans has no monopoly
> on scumbags.


Nope, but they have a LOT of 'em, Mike...which is why NO is one of America's
Turd World hellholes, same as Dee - troit, St. Louis/East St. Louis, Gary
IN, vast swaths of Chicawgo, etc...


--
Best
Greg

In article >,
says...
> In article > ,
> Saerah Gray > wrote:
>
> > > Don't have babies you cannot support. I know that sounds ruthless, but
> > > people need to grow the hell up.
> > >
> >
> > Sometimes not being able to support a child happens after that child is
> > born. A minimum wage job is barely enough to support one adult, let
> > alone an adult and a child. What do you propose for people who are laid
> > off from their jobs?
> >
> > Unemployment is at 6% right now. Are you proposing that 6% of the
> > population should starve?
>
> No babe I'm not. Support them but also help educate them so they can
> achieve a better paying job. Just throwing money at the problem won't
> fix it.
>
> I feel that _employing_ them is a better answer. Have them do something
> for the money they get from the govt.
>

Oh yes, lets educate them. I'm educated out the wazoo in the Infotech
field yet it took me 11 months to find my last job.

Are you proposing I go back to school, learn something else and pay for
it too, to the tune of about $50K? No thanks.

In article >,
says...
> In article > ,
> Saerah Gray > wrote:
>
> > Minimum wage doesn't pay the bills. I am barely paying the bills on 13
> > an hour; which is twice the federal minimum wage.
> >
> > I am all for education, but without a *college* education, or a lot of
> > on-the job training and promotions, (which takes a long time) it's
> > *very* difficult to find a job that can support a family on one income.
> > Even a family of two.
> >
> > --
> > Saerah
> >
> > "Welcome to Usenet, Biatch! Adapt or haul ass!"
> > - some hillbilly from FL
>
> Sometimes even having a college education is no guarantee of a good
> wage... $14.00 per hour should be a living wage for my relatives, but
> it's not. Not with today's economy. :-(
>

$80 an hour seems to cover it. When we negotiated I almost fell out of
my chair when they accepted my per hour rate.

Going from unemployment insurace to this sure is nice.

In article >,
says...
> In article >,
> Dave Smith > wrote:
>
> > Omelet wrote:
> > > In article
> > > >,
> > > John Kane > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Reform the education system, put a lot , and I mean a lot, of money
> > >> into neo-natal cre and early childhood education, change some of the
> > >> labour and welfare laws that usually work to make it better to stay on
> > >> welfare, institute a decent health care system that covers the working
> > >> poor.
> > >>
> > >> Try spending money on programs to rehabilitate prisonners, rather than
> > >> warehousing them. Include real vocational training.
> > >
> > > Wouldn't that be nice... :-)
> >
> > It sounds good in theory, except that you're often dealing with people
> > who dropped out because they were not interested in education.
>
> Motivate them.
>

There is no motivating some people. I've known some like that and no
matter what you did, even physically kick them in the ass, you could not
motivate them.

There are just some out there who have a 70 IQ for a reason.

What else do you propose we do with them?

In article >,
says...
> In article > ,
> T > wrote:
>
> > In article >,
> > says...
> > > In article 7>,
> > > Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
> > >
> > > > > In other words...... your claim that most welfare recipients are
> > > > > actually single white males is absolutely false.
> > > > >
> > > > > http://www.apa.org/pi/wpo/myths.html
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > Whatever... Maybe it's time we imposed penalties on adult welfare
> > > > recipients and limited the number of children a welfare recipient could
> > > > have to 1, also limiting the benefits they could receive. What you can't
> > > > afford to have, you shouldn't have. It's no wonder there are so many
> > > > children on the welfare rolls. One of the things that irritates me most
> > > > is
> > > > seeing an indigent family or single mother marching into the welfare
> > > > office
> > > > with 8 kids in tow, because most of these people are unemployed by choice
> > > > or lack of even the most rudimentary skills, and have no desire to work.
> > > > With our present system they know they don't have to, yet they keep
> > > > popping
> > > > out kids like it ws a hobby, and they know they'll receive additional
> > > > benefits for each child they have.
> > > >
> > > > There are some who are making every effort to pull themselves up by their
> > > > bootstraps and to work or actively seek employment. Unfortunately, they
> > > > seem to be in the vast minority.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Wayne Boatwright
> > >
> > > The welfare system rewards sloth, and fecundity.
> > >
> > > It needs a serious overhaul.
> > >
> >
> > So tell me since you're the expert, what reforms would you make to the
> > welfare system?
>
> Government work programs. I already stated that.
>
> Give them the welfare they need, but make them work for it.
> It really is that simple...
>
> I believe in helping people, just not in giving them a totally free
> ride. I work hard for the money I make.
>

There are serious flaws in your proposal. Government work programs? So
what would we have the prisoners do and what of the displacement of
people who would normally work those jobs for a living wage?

Orlando Enrique Fiol wrote:

>> While a high school diploma or a college degree is not a guarantee of a
>> successful and financially rewarding career, it is generally a requirement.
>
> It's only a requirement meant to weed out candidates. Many jobs clearly
> do not require college education to perform. Employers only insist on
> educational prerequisites to decrease the applicant pool.

I guess it is obvious that you have never been in the position to hire
people. If they want to decrease the applicant pool all they need to do
is to screen the applications. OTOH, if they hire people with higher
qualifications than are needed they will run the risk of the person
becoming dissatisfied. FWIW, I was once rejected for a position and
told that I was over qualified. Ironically, that left me working at the
lower position I already had. So much for the idea of getting one's foot
in the door and working your way up from the bottom.





>
>> Sure, some people will see that an feel that they are wasting their time
>> because there is nothing out there for them. Other's will be inspired to
>> work that much harder to get out of that situation.
>
> You make it sound like everyone can get out of vicious poverty cycles.

You make it sound like you would have said that no matter what. I never
said that everyone will break out of the poverty cycle. You have to try.
You can't just st back and blame it on racism.



> If it were simply a matter of determination, we would have far fewer
> poor people than we currently do.

There are lots of people out that you did break out of the cycle with
determination.



> There are schools where students don't
> even have textbooks and have to eat lunch in shifts because of
> overcrowding. There are schools in which students are never taught the
> pleasures of critical thinking, whose libraries are not stocked with
> philosophy and poetry, where no high school plays and musicals are
> annually staged. I don't think you realize how run down many American
> public schools actually are, especially in non-white communities.

We have different system of funding education here. It is not funded
solely from local taxation. There are good schools, good teachers and
good facilities even in poor neighbourhoods, yet certain ethnic groups
still have high drop out rates, but at the same time children from other
ethnic groups excel in those same schools.




>> are bright enough to realize that in order to win they at least have to try. Every
>> year thousands of people compete in the Boston Marathon, but only one of
>> them is going to win. You don't have any chance at all if you don't try.
>
> What I'm trying to get you to see is that many people are excluded from
> the game regardless of how much they'd like to try to win.

And meanwhile, some exclude themselves because the priorities in their
lives do no include education.

Consider, for
> instance, how colleges routinely reject students with low SAT scores

We do not have SATs here, but from my understanding it is an aptitude
test that measures critical thinking skills needed for success in
college. It does not seem unreasonable to me to make sure that students
have a chance of success before they waste the time and money to go to
college. Not everyone is meant to go to college. Not everyone has what
it takes to succeed at post secondary education.



>
>> They should be able to "make a living" as in working to earn a wage, or
>> they should be able to sit back and collect money from the government
>> because they are unemployable?
>
> If we want them to make a living while acknowledging that they are not
> employable in fields requiring higher education, we have to make that
> possible by keeping more menial low wage labor in America rather than
> farming it out to other countries.

Good idea. Then stop shopping at Walmart.

wrote:
>I think that several of us who have commented on this thread have
>indicated that we are in favour of helping those in need. People who are
>sick and or disabled deserve assistance. It is the people who are too
>lazy to work that we resent abusing the system.

How would you go about quantifying sloth? Would you administer a
questionnaire or follow people around to see if they're constitutionally
slothful?

Orlando

wrote:
>Well, low SAT scores are a result of poor education. Colleges do not
>want to accept students who will flunk out.

Low SAT scores do not necessarily portend failure. I'm using precious
little of what I studied for the math portion of the GRE. I got a
perfect score on the critical writing and scored almost 700 out of 800
on the verbal portions. However, my math score remained at 450 out of
800 for both tests, this despite months of intensive tutoring. If Penn
had rejected me because of those scores, I wouldn't have gotten a chance
to prove that I can indeed hang at an ivy league school. How many
promising students are being denied similar chances because of poor SAT
scores?

Orlando

wrote:
>Oh yes, lets educate them. I'm educated out the wazoo in the Infotech
>field yet it took me 11 months to find my last job.
>Are you proposing I go back to school, learn something else and pay for
>it too, to the tune of about $50K? No thanks.

You could probably teach yourself most of what any job market would
require of you. But, although it would definitely be cheaper, it
wouldn't pass muster with employer qualifications. So basically, unless
someone has the ability to invest tens of thousands of dollars into an
education, they're locked out of mid level jobs that require pieces of
paper showing that you paid your way. Make no mistake about it,
employers only care about what your resume says regarding your
education; they don't check to see how much you actually learned.

Orlando

wrote:
>We do not have SATs here, but from my understanding it is an aptitude
>test that measures critical thinking skills needed for success in
>college. It does not seem unreasonable to me to make sure that students
>have a chance of success before they waste the time and money to go to
>college. Not everyone is meant to go to college. Not everyone has what
>it takes to succeed at post secondary education.

Yet, our job market has pretty much mandated nominal stints with
secondary education as prerequisites for employability. In the past,
people ill suited for college could hope to work up the ranks of
manufacturing companies. Now, factories are closing in many of the very
towns and small cities that depended on them for the majority of
employment.

>Good idea. Then stop shopping at Walmart.

I don't shop there.

Orlando

T > wrote in news:MPG.233a26a86dc1107e989702
@reader.motzarella.org:

> There are just some out there who have a 70 IQ for a reason.
>
> What else do you propose we do with them?

Aren't they being used as cannon fodder in Iraq? Wars can be very
convenient in turning a potential criminal and worse, a ne'er-do-well, into
a "hero of the united states" (tm applied for).

On Wed 17 Sep 2008 05:11:33a, Michel Boucher told us...

> T > wrote in news:MPG.233a26a86dc1107e989702
> @reader.motzarella.org:
>
>> There are just some out there who have a 70 IQ for a reason.
>>
>> What else do you propose we do with them?
>
> Aren't they being used as cannon fodder in Iraq? Wars can be very
> convenient in turning a potential criminal and worse, a ne'er-do-well,
> into a "hero of the united states" (tm applied for).

Soylent Green for 3rd world countries.

--
Wayne Boatwright

*******************************************
Date: Wednesday, 09(IX)/17(XVII)/08(MMVIII)
*******************************************
Today is: Citizenship Day
Countdown till Veteran's Day
7wks 5dys 18hrs 46mins
*******************************************
'I think so, Brain, but isn't Regis
Philbin already married?' - Pinky

On Sep 16, 9:50*pm, Dave Smith > wrote:
> Orlando Enrique Fiol wrote:
> >> While a high school diploma or a college degree is not a guarantee of a
> >> successful and financially rewarding career, it is generally a requirement.
>
> > It's only a requirement meant to weed out candidates. Many jobs clearly
> > do not require college education to perform. Employers only insist on
> > educational prerequisites to decrease the applicant pool.
>
> I guess it is obvious that you have never been in the position to hire
> people. If they want to decrease the applicant pool all they need to do
> is to screen the applications.

They do. The first automatic screen is a diploma/degree/whatever in a
lot of cases. If it cuts the applicant pool form 1,000 to 100 it
probably works for the employer and still gives good candidates. It
may not be needed but it saves a lot of staff screening time. Back in
the 1980s I remember seeing companies selling résumé screening
software for companies that got thousands of applications for any
available position.

>OTOH, if they hire people with higher
> qualifications than are needed they will run the risk of the person
> becoming dissatisfied. *FWIW, I was once rejected for a position and
> told that I was over qualified. *Ironically, that left me working at the
> lower position I already had. So much for the idea of getting one's foot
> in the door and working your way up from the bottom.

It works both ways. And in Canada there is the "Canadian Experience"
requirement that often is a crock.

Unless unemployment levels are approximately zero employers often
screen on irrelevant or unneeded criteria. Then suddenly when you get
a situation like Alberta breathing is often the only requirement.

> >> Sure, some people will see that an feel that they are wasting their time
> >> because there is nothing out there for them. Other's will be inspired to
> >> work that much harder to get out of that situation.
>
> > You make it sound like everyone can get out of vicious poverty cycles.
>
> You make it sound like you would have said that no matter what. *I never
> said that everyone will break out of the poverty cycle. You have to try.
> You can't just st back and blame it on racism.
>
> > If it were simply a matter of determination, we would have far fewer
> > poor people than we currently do.
>
> There are lots of people out that you did break out of the cycle with
> determination.
>
> > There are schools where students don't
> > even have textbooks and have to eat lunch in shifts because of
> > overcrowding. There are schools in which students are never taught the
> > pleasures of critical thinking, whose libraries are not stocked with
> > philosophy and poetry, where no high school plays and musicals are
> > annually staged. I don't think you realize how run down many American
> > public schools actually are, especially in non-white communities.
>
> We have different system of funding education here. It is not funded
> solely from local taxation. There are good schools, good teachers and
> good facilities even in poor neighbourhoods, yet certain ethnic groups
> still have high drop out rates, but at the same time children from other
> ethnic groups excel in those same schools.

Yes, the Ontario system seems quite a bit better than many US states.
I am sure that some schools are a lot better than others but we don't
seem to have the really disasterous school districts the US does.



>
> >> are bright enough to realize that in order to win they at least have to try. Every
> >> year thousands of people compete in the Boston Marathon, but only one of
> >> them is going to win. *You don't have any chance at all if you don't try.
>
> > What I'm trying to get you to see is that many people are excluded from
> > the game regardless of how much they'd like to try to win.
>
> And meanwhile, some exclude themselves because the priorities in their
> lives do no include education.
>
> * Consider, for
>
> > instance, how colleges routinely reject students with low SAT scores
>
> We do not have SATs here, but from my understanding it is an aptitude
> test that measures critical thinking skills needed for success in
> college. It does not seem unreasonable to me to make sure that students
> have a chance of success before they waste the time and money to go to
> college. Not everyone is meant to go to college. Not everyone has what
> it takes to succeed at post secondary education.

I think we had them one year long ago. I wrote the SATO which as far
as I know had no effect on anything.

Some of the problem may be that 'good' schools can spare the time and
teachers to teach to the SAT ( like teaching to the old GR.13
departmentals) plus wealther parents can afford to send their children
to SAT schools where companies will teach a student how to optimally
take a SAT. Onc can teach this type of thing to some extend.

I suspect that too much emphasis is put on the SATs in the USA
nowadays but it can serve as a reasonable screening device if used
properly.




> >> They should be able to "make a living" as in working to earn a wage, or
> >> they should be able to sit back and collect money from the government
> >> because they are unemployable?
>
> > If we want them to make a living while acknowledging that they are not
> > employable in fields requiring higher education, we have to make that
> > possible by keeping more menial low wage labor in America rather than
> > farming it out to other countries.
>
> Good idea. Then stop shopping at Walmart.

Walmart? What's that? Oh, the company that is unionizing

John Kane

On Sep 16, 1:01*pm, Omelet > wrote:
>
> I suspect it's coming. *My main concern with Socialized health care is
> what it's going to cost us.

Well if you do it like most of the other OECD countries it should cost
you about 50% or less than the current US health "system". Cost per
captia in Canada $2,998, cost per capita USA $5,711.

http://www.kff.org/insurance/snapshot/chcm010307oth.cfm

On Sep 16, 4:21*pm, Boron Elgar > wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 14:57:25 -0500, "Gregory Morrow" >
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >Dave Smith wrote:
>
> >> Omelet wrote:
>
> >> >>> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians
> >separate
> >> >>> fee.
> >> >> It is a shame that you don't have government health insurance like we
> >> >> have in Canada. Everyone is eligible regardless of pre-exisitng
> >> >> conditions.
>
> >> > I suspect it's coming. *My main concern with Socialized health care is
> >> > what it's going to cost us.
>
> >> > Nothing is free. *Only time will tell.
>
> >> Most of us know that it is not free. There is less spent per capita on
> >> health care in the US and Canadians live a little longer.
>
> >One more diff is that Canada also has a more equitable distribution of
> >income and so does not have a huge underclass with the requisite large
> >number of chronic health problems...
>
> Not huge, but nevertheless, First Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples in
> Canada have much worse health than the rest of the pop..
>
>
>
> >Decent preventative care can nip a goodly number of potentially serious
> >health problems in the bud, preventative care (especially pre - natal care)
> >in the US practically does not exist for most low - income people...
>
> Or, apparently available or utilized well enough for the First
> Nations, Inuit and Métis peoples.
>
> Boron-

It is available in theory but when you live a 1hour plane flight from
the primary care station and another 2-3 hour from a hospital it is
not all that easy to access.

In more usual cases a lot of aboringial communities are still trying
to recover from years of neglect or progams like the residential
schools program so you get more drug and alchohol use, child abuse
etc, low levels of education and so on. It all adds up to poor health
in many cases. However the actual health care is usually available
except to really isolated communities.

For example if you have a handy map, patients from Moosonee ON & Moose
Factory ON recieve excellent care at a primary care level but if they
need a tertiary care facility with all the specialists & bells and
whistles the need to be flown to Kingston ON.

John Kane Kingston ON Canada

In article > ,
"Gregory Morrow" > wrote:

> > > why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
> > >
> > > your pal,
> > > blake
> >
> > Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
> > fee.
>
>
> Yup, and if you blow off the bill it's "OOPS! There goes my
> credit...!!!"...
>
>
> --
> Best
> Greg

Nah. It's just hard on my budget. I generally set up a payroll
deduction. There is an advantage to using the hospital you work at.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
ChattyCathy > wrote:

> cybercat wrote:
>
> >
> > "blake murphy" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 10:09:28 -0500, Omelet wrote:
> >>
> >>> In article >,
> >>> "cybercat" > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> "kilikini" > wrote in message
> >>>> ...
> >>>>> Nancy Young wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> One thing not mentioned, if you don't have dependents, it's not
> >>>>>> easy to get benefits. If you can, I don't know. You lose your
> >>>>>> job, you're SOL. I imagine that varies by state, too.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> nancy
> >>>>>
> >>>>> That's one of the reasons I had so many problems getting Medicaid.
> >>>>> I'm
> >>>>> married, no children, and I'm white. Without dependents, it's a
> >>>>> much harder struggle to receive anything; you get scrutinized so
> >>>>> much more.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> So you are saying that they descriminate against WHITE people,
> >>>> kili??
> >>>
> >>> Where have YOU been?
> >>
> >> you're saying 'they' do? complete and utter bullshit. cite, please.
> >>
> >
> > And why is this stupid bitch still addressing me when I have her
> > killfiled?
>
> May I remind you that just because you can't see her, it doesn't mean
> that she can't see you...

Precisely. ;-)
--
Peace, Om
Remove underscore to validate gmails.

"Politics is supposed to be the second oldest profession. I have
come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
-- Mark Twain

In article >,
ChattyCathy > wrote:

> cybercat wrote:
>
> >
> > "blake murphy" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 10:09:28 -0500, Omelet wrote:
> >>
> >>> In article >,
> >>> "cybercat" > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> "kilikini" > wrote in message
> >>>> ...
> >>>>> Nancy Young wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> One thing not mentioned, if you don't have dependents, it's not
> >>>>>> easy to get benefits. If you can, I don't know. You lose your
> >>>>>> job, you're SOL. I imagine that varies by state, too.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> nancy
> >>>>>
> >>>>> That's one of the reasons I had so many problems getting Medicaid.
> >>>>> I'm
> >>>>> married, no children, and I'm white. Without dependents, it's a
> >>>>> much harder struggle to receive anything; you get scrutinized so
> >>>>> much more.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> So you are saying that they descriminate against WHITE people,
> >>>> kili??
> >>>
> >>> Where have YOU been?
> >>
> >> you're saying 'they' do? complete and utter bullshit. cite, please.
> >>
> >
> > And why is this stupid bitch still addressing me when I have her
> > killfiled?
>
> May I remind you that just because you can't see her, it doesn't mean
> that she can't see you...

Precisely.
She's not very bright is she?
--
Peace, Om
Remove underscore to validate gmails.

"Politics is supposed to be the second oldest profession. I have
come to realize that it bears a very close resemblance to the first."
-- Mark Twain

In article > ,
"Gregory Morrow" > wrote:

> Mike Pearce wrote:
>
> > "Omelet" wrote in message
> > news
> > > "Mike Pearce" wrote:
> > >
> > >> "Omelet" wrote in message
> > >> > Dave Smith wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> >> What do you do in a case like that. He is a woman who was raised
> > >> >> on
> > >> >> welfare, whose college education subsidized and received student
> > >> >> grants,
> > >> >> who had the opportunity to get education and training to help
> > >> >> her
> > >> >> find
> > >> >> meaningful employment. But she knew that the system would
> > >> >> support
> > >> >> her,
> > >> >> so she intentionally got herself pregnant knowing that she could
> > >> >> stay
> > >> >> home and not have to work. That was the way she was raised, and
> > >> >> there is
> > >> >> a good chance that her kid will grow up with the same mind set.
> > >> >
> > >> > That appears to be the problem in New Orleans...
> > >>
> > >> I would like to see an example as described above happening in New
> > >> Orleans.
> > >>
> > >> -Mike
> > >
> > > <cough>
> > >
> > > I guess you were not the recipient in your state of a large number
> > > of
> > > Katrina refugees...
> >
> > I didn't really expect that you'd show me an example. My state
> > (Louisiana) had a lot of Katrina "refugees." What do Katrina refugees
> > have to do with the question I asked other than the fact that many of
> > them happened to come from New Orleans?
>
>
> Are you being "ironic", or...???
>
> The poorest of the Katrina refugees are a a largely shifteless and criminal
> welfare underclass...go to any of the nabes in the cities where some of them
> settled (Houston...) and you'll see...NO one wants them, either as neighbors
> or co - workers because of their assorted ghetto pathologies.

It's possible he really is that ignorant...
It's pretty well known that a lot of the worst of the Katrina refugees
were generational welfare recipients, drug addicts and sellers. They
had a serious problem down in San Antonio. Crime rates skyrocketed in
areas where they were housed and apt. complexes had drugs being sold in
the hallways.

The increase in local crime rates after Katrina is what drove me to get
off my ass and get my CCW/CHL and learn how to use a hand gun...
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain