In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 02:47:02 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>
> > In article > ,
> > Saerah Gray > wrote:
> >
> >> How do you differentiate between use and abuse of the system?
> >
> > I think that's the entire basis of this discussion babe. :-(
>
> maybe so; you assume most recipients are unworthy and i do not.
>
> your pal,
> blake

Did I ever say that? Even ONCE???
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
"kilikini" > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> >
> > I'm looking forward to getting my EMS unit. ;-) You may want to look
> > at one of those too. They are the gods...
> >
> > And affordable now that you no longer need a prescription to get one!
> > The Chiro' told me that an EMS unit was better for me than a TENS unit
> > so that's what I ordered.
>
> I've got to make a couple of Dr.'s appointments in the next few weeks, so
> I'll ask about one of those. I'm still too weak to even get up off the
> toilet without help many times so if I can stimulate muscles, I'm all for
> it! I'll see what my PCP says. Thanks. I wouldn't have thought of that.
>
> kili

Most welcome hon'. I've read a Lot of good about them and my Chiro'
recommends the EMS over the TENS unit for me. He says it is better at
long term pain control, helps with muscle toning, and will help stop the
muscle spasms that have been causing most of my pain.

The 15 minute treatment I get at his office lasts me for hours.

Mine is running me around $80.00.

Swimming would still be good, if you can somehow swing it.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 09:29:54 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>
> > In article >,
> > "kilikini" > wrote:
> >
> >> Omelet wrote:
> >>> In article > ,
> >>> Saerah Gray > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I feel very, very privileged to have low-cost health insurance
> >>>> provided to me by my employer.
> >>>
> >>> So do I, and I still can't afford it. ;-)
> >>>
> >>> The health care issue is a whole 'nuther topic. Regulation adds a
> >>> considerable expense to it. Since I work in health care, I see it
> >>> first hand.
> >>>
> >>> And by the way, no federally subsidized ER (like ours) can refuse
> >>> basic and emergency health care to anyone. We care for plenty of
> >>> homeless in our ER...
> >>
> >> What happens in regards to recurring medical treatment? Someone may
> >> become
> >> sick and initially go to the ER, but what if the situation is serious and
> >> the individual needs lots of follow-up appointments?
> >
> > They keep coming back to the ER usually. We have a lot of "frequent
> > flyers". I know some of the more compassionate MD's that even do
> > volunteer work not only here, but third world countries too.
> >
> >> How does a person with
> >> no insurance receive that? That was the situation I found myself in. I
> >> initially got help for a private cancer agency, but when it came to
> >> multiple
> >> surgeries and the myriad of doctor's appointments, I was stuck. Luckily,
> >> I
> >> qualified for Medicaid. I wish it was available to everyone; it certainly
> >> should be. All my tests are covered, all my follow-ups and all my
> >> surgeries. If I had private insurance, most of the tests (partly due to
> >> the
> >> frequency of the tests) would probably not be covered.
> >>
> >> kili
> >
> > Heh! Tell me about it! That's what I'm running into right now. Insurance
> > is not always a good thing. I'm supposed to see a cardiologist and get
> > regular physical therapy, but cannot afford it even with insurance!
>
> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
>
> your pal,
> blake

Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
fee.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 02:45:58 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>
> > In article 7>,
> > Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
> >
> >> I'm not insinuating anything. I'm *stating* that welfare *abusers*
> >> (abusers for any reason) should have either severely limited or no
> >> benefits
> >> at all.
> >
> > Welfare ABUSERS are the problem and the issue.
> >
> > I'll say again, I have no problem with helping people that need help!
> > It's those that go out of their way to earn a free living that are the
> > entire problem!
>
> and what percentage of the awful, awful one percent of your taxes do they
> absorb?
>
> christ, you begrudge these people the crumbs off your table. how
> compassionate.
>
> blake

You have no clu' Blake. A good 10% of my NET income right now goes out
to both family members and a good friend that needs the money. I could
do the work I pay her to do for me, but her PRIDE makes her want to work
for what she gets.

She never outright asked me for money. She asked if I had any work she
could help me with.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 02:44:36 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>
> > In article > ,
> > T > wrote:
> >
> >>> What is your income tax rate?
> >>
> >> Oh, about 40% when you add up state and federal plus the various dips
> >> for SSI, etc.
> >>
> >> I need to buy property so I get the interest and tax write offs.
> >
> > A 40% income tax rate would have me living in subsidized housing and
> > eating top ramen.
> >
> > Mine is around 25% and that's bad enough. (That includes SSI tax).
>
> omgomg!!! jackbooted i.r.s. men are snatching the food from your mouth!
> better stock up on canned goods and ammo.
>
> blake

I'm glad you are rolling around in Caviar Blake. I'm eating chicken feet
and rice.

And can barely afford the freakin' gas for my commutes to work.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

Omelet wrote:
>
>>>
>> really, being poor is a lot of work. it's not surprising these folks don't
>> have time to hold down a job.
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
> Disability is also not the same as Welfare... Kili has nothing to be
> ashamed of.


I think that several of us who have commented on this thread have
indicated that we are in favour of helping those in need. People who are
sick and or disabled deserve assistance. It is the people who are too
lazy to work that we resent abusing the system.

In article >,
"Michael \"Dog3\"" > wrote:

> blake murphy >
> : in rec.food.cooking
>
> >
> > Drug Rehab Need By Employment
> >
> > * Current employment status also correlated with addiction
> > treatment
> > need in 2000. An estimated 7.7 percent of unemployed adults aged 18 or
> > older needed addiction treatment for illicit drugs, while only 1.6
> > percent of full-time employed adults needed addiction treatment for an
> > illicit drug problem.
> > * Most of the adult population needing addiction treatment for an
> > illicit drug problem in 2000 was employed. Of the estimated 3.6
> > million persons aged 18 or older who needed addiction treatment, 1.9
> > million were employed full time and 0.6 million were employed part
> > time. Thus, an estimated 70 percent of adults needing addiction
> > treatment were employed. An estimated 359,000 unemployed adults needed
> > addiction treatment.
> >
> > <http://www.drug-rehab-referral.org/d...treatment.html
>
> It has been my understanding that the vast majority of people addiction
> issues, be it alcohol, pharmaceuticals or both, are functioning addicts.
> Most are employed as you've pointed out above. I don't know where people
> get the stereotypical idea that an alcoholic/addict is a homeless person
> laying in the gutter clutching a bottle or a needle. That is simply not
> the truth. Sure, many, many homeless and unemployed people have
> addiction issues but the surest way to find one is most likely next door
> (so to speak).
>
> Michael

Seconded.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

Omelet wrote:
>
>>>> How do you differentiate between use and abuse of the system?
>>> I think that's the entire basis of this discussion babe. :-(
>> maybe so; you assume most recipients are unworthy and i do not.
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
> Did I ever say that? Even ONCE???

I don't recall you saying that. It is just a cheap attempt to make you
look cheap and uncaring, and unwarranted attack your credibility. The
fact is that there are people who are too lazy to work and who abuse the
system that is meant to help those in need.

Omelet wrote:


>>> Heh! Tell me about it! That's what I'm running into right now. Insurance
>>> is not always a good thing. I'm supposed to see a cardiologist and get
>>> regular physical therapy, but cannot afford it even with insurance!
>> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
> fee.

It is a shame that you don't have government health insurance like we
have in Canada. Everyone is eligible regardless of pre-exisitng
conditions. In Ontario we pay a yearly OHIP fee and employers pay a
health tax per employee. It is also funded through other tax revenues.
It costs me nothing to go to a doctor. It costs me nothing to go to
emergency. It costs nothing for X rays or other tests. Prescriptions
drugs are not covered, but there is supplemental health insurance
available for that. It isn't a perfect system, but people don't face
financial crisis because of medical care.

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> Omelet wrote:
>>
>>>>> How do you differentiate between use and abuse of the system?
>>>> I think that's the entire basis of this discussion babe. :-(
>>> maybe so; you assume most recipients are unworthy and i do not.
>>> your pal,
>>> blake
>>
>> Did I ever say that? Even ONCE???
>
> I don't recall you saying that. It is just a cheap attempt to make you
> look cheap and uncaring, and unwarranted attack your credibility. The fact
> is that there are people who are too lazy to work and who abuse the system
> that is meant to help those in need.

You two cretins are on the same side of the dickhead fence. Enjoy each
other.

"Orlando Enrique Fiol" > wrote in message
.. .
> wrote:
>>What did she do? She and her girls lived out of her car until she found a
>>single guy with money who she didn't care about, but sucked up enough to,
>>for him to let her move in with the kids. Sad.
>
> Sounds downright practical to me. Deep down, I bet that guy understands
> how much she needs him and takes comfort in that, knowing she probably
> will never leave him as long as he provides for her. More relationships
> should be based on that kind of need.
>

Okay, now THAT is sick.

"Orlando Enrique Fiol" > wrote in message
.. .
> wrote:
>>Do YOU tango?
>
> No, but I adore Astor Piazzola's tangos and am teaching myself chromatic
> button accordion because I already play a mean piano. Does any of that
> count?
>

All of it! You're a one-man party!

On Sep 16, 10:28*am, Orlando Enrique Fiol > wrote:
> wrote:
> >Therein lies the main problem. Jails are full of uneducated *guys and
> >some will jump on the low education rates in jails to claim that
> >educating people would better equip them to live a productive live.
> >Most of them had the opportunity to attend school and get a proper
> >education but they weren't interested. They skipped classes, fooled
> >around in class, neglected their studies and dropped out. *They were
> >given the opportunity but they weren't interested. They would rather
> >have a good time than sit in school. Let's face it, people of some
> >cultures have place much more value in education than others.
>
> Most other cultures anticipate that not everyone will want to be
> educated. The problem with the American paradigm is that we seem to
> think education is the solution to all problems. I know plenty of
> college educated people who are barely getting by, which was not the end
> their high school recruiters promised.

Education will solve plenty of problems, especially if "education" is
defined
as basic literacy and numeracy. However, even that is poorly valued,
and
you can see that in the grade schools, before kids even think about
what
they're going to do when they growup.

> As for young men goofing off and
> skipping class, try putting yourself in their mindset. If you saw all
> around you how unstable the job market is and how difficult it is to get
> and keep jobs, combined with bloated school bureaucracies and
> disinterested teachers, wouldn't having fun with your friends make more
> sense in the short run? Bottom line, people who choose not to stay in
> school should be able to make a living too.

What value do they have to employers? If they have no skills or
discipline,
what is the point in hiring them? Most jobs have wages commensurate
with their difficulty; people who can only do simple jobs can only
draw meager
wages.

I'm not saying that everything is the fault of the kids--I'm saying
that everything
is the fault of everyone:

parents, for not emphasizing the importance of education
schools, for teaching poorly and spending money foolishly
kids, for taking the easy way out
the media, for denigrating intelligence and education and glorifying
mediocrity
government, for wasting its money and resources

Cindy Hamilton

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> >
> >>>
> >> really, being poor is a lot of work. it's not surprising these folks don't
> >> have time to hold down a job.
> >>
> >> your pal,
> >> blake
> >
> > Disability is also not the same as Welfare... Kili has nothing to be
> > ashamed of.
>
>
> I think that several of us who have commented on this thread have
> indicated that we are in favour of helping those in need. People who are
> sick and or disabled deserve assistance. It is the people who are too
> lazy to work that we resent abusing the system.

THANK you!
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> >
> >>>> How do you differentiate between use and abuse of the system?
> >>> I think that's the entire basis of this discussion babe. :-(
> >> maybe so; you assume most recipients are unworthy and i do not.
> >>
> >> your pal,
> >> blake
> >
> > Did I ever say that? Even ONCE???
>
> I don't recall you saying that. It is just a cheap attempt to make you
> look cheap and uncaring, and unwarranted attack your credibility. The
> fact is that there are people who are too lazy to work and who abuse the
> system that is meant to help those in need.

;-)
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
>
>
> >>> Heh! Tell me about it! That's what I'm running into right now. Insurance
> >>> is not always a good thing. I'm supposed to see a cardiologist and get
> >>> regular physical therapy, but cannot afford it even with insurance!
> >> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
> >>
> >> your pal,
> >> blake
> >
> > Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
> > fee.
>
> It is a shame that you don't have government health insurance like we
> have in Canada. Everyone is eligible regardless of pre-exisitng
> conditions.

I suspect it's coming. My main concern with Socialized health care is
what it's going to cost us.

Nothing is free. Only time will tell.

> In Ontario we pay a yearly OHIP fee and employers pay a
> health tax per employee. It is also funded through other tax revenues.
> It costs me nothing to go to a doctor. It costs me nothing to go to
> emergency. It costs nothing for X rays or other tests. Prescriptions
> drugs are not covered, but there is supplemental health insurance
> available for that. It isn't a perfect system, but people don't face
> financial crisis because of medical care.

That is a big deal. Since I do the nightly audits, I know what it
costs. 15 days in the ICU can cost in excess of 100K.

That is not affordable by anyone in the middle class.

IMHO tho', the ideal solution would be to somehow bring down that cost.
A lot of the cost is compliance and regulation. Being a section
supervisor in the lab, I have a LOT of experience with compliance
regulations!

A perfect example is the EMS unit I want to use for pain control in
place of drugs. (I've already turned down a Vicodin Rx from my main
doc'. I have no desire to become addicted to opiates).

Once upon a time, one cost about $800.00. Now that they are deregulated
and I no longer need an Rx., I just ordered one for $80.00...

And it's the same machine.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
"cybercat" > wrote:

> "Orlando Enrique Fiol" > wrote in message
> .. .
> > wrote:
> >>What did she do? She and her girls lived out of her car until she found a
> >>single guy with money who she didn't care about, but sucked up enough to,
> >>for him to let her move in with the kids. Sad.
> >
> > Sounds downright practical to me. Deep down, I bet that guy understands
> > how much she needs him and takes comfort in that, knowing she probably
> > will never leave him as long as he provides for her. More relationships
> > should be based on that kind of need.
> >
>
> Okay, now THAT is sick.

Are you really that naive?

Pitiful.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article
>,
Cindy Hamilton > wrote:

> I'm not saying that everything is the fault of the kids--I'm saying
> that everything
> is the fault of everyone:
>
> parents, for not emphasizing the importance of education
> schools, for teaching poorly and spending money foolishly
> kids, for taking the easy way out
> the media, for denigrating intelligence and education and glorifying
> mediocrity
> government, for wasting its money and resources
>
> Cindy Hamilton

Our school systems seem to play up mediocrity sometimes. They cater to
the lowest common denominator. Which is why illiteracy is rampant in
high school graduates.

And it's so wrong.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

On 15 Sep 2008 18:10:04 GMT, Michael "Dog3" wrote:

> Omelet >
> news > rec.food.cooking
>
>>> some people just have a problem living in a free society, or, more
>>> precisely, a society where *other* people are also free.
>>>
>>> your pal,
>>> blake
>>
>> They need to move to Russia.
>
> GAWD!!! Then they'd have Sarah Palin spying on them with her opera glasses
> from her living room window. Well... maybe not. I doubt Palin knows what
> an opera is.
>
> Michael <- ducking but couldn't help himself

well, there are soap operas, and she may be becoming the star of one now.

your pal,
blake

On Tue 16 Sep 2008 09:07:37a, Omelet told us...

> In article >,
> blake murphy > wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 09:29:54 -0500, Omelet wrote:
>>
>> > In article >,
>> > "kilikini" > wrote:
>> >
>> >> Omelet wrote:
>> >>> In article > ,
>> >>> Saerah Gray > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> I feel very, very privileged to have low-cost health insurance
>> >>>> provided to me by my employer.
>> >>>
>> >>> So do I, and I still can't afford it. ;-)
>> >>>
>> >>> The health care issue is a whole 'nuther topic. Regulation adds a
>> >>> considerable expense to it. Since I work in health care, I see it
>> >>> first hand.
>> >>>
>> >>> And by the way, no federally subsidized ER (like ours) can refuse
>> >>> basic and emergency health care to anyone. We care for plenty of
>> >>> homeless in our ER...
>> >>
>> >> What happens in regards to recurring medical treatment? Someone may
>> >> become
>> >> sick and initially go to the ER, but what if the situation is
>> >> serious and the individual needs lots of follow-up appointments?
>> >
>> > They keep coming back to the ER usually. We have a lot of "frequent
>> > flyers". I know some of the more compassionate MD's that even do
>> > volunteer work not only here, but third world countries too.
>> >
>> >> How does a person with
>> >> no insurance receive that? That was the situation I found myself
>> >> in. I initially got help for a private cancer agency, but when it
>> >> came to multiple
>> >> surgeries and the myriad of doctor's appointments, I was stuck.
>> >> Luckily, I
>> >> qualified for Medicaid. I wish it was available to everyone; it
>> >> certainly should be. All my tests are covered, all my follow-ups
>> >> and all my surgeries. If I had private insurance, most of the tests
>> >> (partly due to the
>> >> frequency of the tests) would probably not be covered.
>> >>
>> >> kili
>> >
>> > Heh! Tell me about it! That's what I'm running into right now.
>> > Insurance is not always a good thing. I'm supposed to see a
>> > cardiologist and get regular physical therapy, but cannot afford it
>> > even with insurance!
>>
>> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
> fee.

That was exactly my plight recently when my b/p suddenly went out of
control. When I called the cardiologist's office they suggested that I go
the the ER. I told them I could afford their $30 co-pay but not the ER
$100 co-pay. I got into their office in a couple of hours.

--
Wayne Boatwright

*******************************************
Date: Tuesday, 09(IX)/16(XVI)/08(MMVIII)
*******************************************
Countdown till Veteran's Day
7wks 6dys 13hrs 22mins
*******************************************
It is ten o'clock; do you know where
your processes are?
*******************************************

"blake murphy" > wrote :
>
> well, there are soap operas, and she may be becoming the star of one now.
>
>

She's sounding a bit like Ross Perot when he went paranoid, over this
investigation of her dealings with her brother-in-law. It did not take
long for the fruitcake factor to come front and center.

On 16 Sep 2008 00:42:42 GMT, Michael "Dog3" wrote:

> blake murphy >
> : in rec.food.cooking
>
>>
>> Drug Rehab Need By Employment
>>
>> * Current employment status also correlated with addiction
>> treatment
>> need in 2000. An estimated 7.7 percent of unemployed adults aged 18 or
>> older needed addiction treatment for illicit drugs, while only 1.6
>> percent of full-time employed adults needed addiction treatment for an
>> illicit drug problem.
>> * Most of the adult population needing addiction treatment for an
>> illicit drug problem in 2000 was employed. Of the estimated 3.6
>> million persons aged 18 or older who needed addiction treatment, 1.9
>> million were employed full time and 0.6 million were employed part
>> time. Thus, an estimated 70 percent of adults needing addiction
>> treatment were employed. An estimated 359,000 unemployed adults needed
>> addiction treatment.
>>
>> <http://www.drug-rehab-referral.org/d...treatment.html
>
> It has been my understanding that the vast majority of people addiction
> issues, be it alcohol, pharmaceuticals or both, are functioning addicts.
> Most are employed as you've pointed out above. I don't know where people
> get the stereotypical idea that an alcoholic/addict is a homeless person
> laying in the gutter clutching a bottle or a needle. That is simply not
> the truth. Sure, many, many homeless and unemployed people have
> addiction issues but the surest way to find one is most likely next door
> (so to speak).
>
> Michael

let's just put it this way: betty ford and cindy mccain weren't living on
the streets when they were addicts. and if you throw in people habituated
to alcohol, well...

i knew a guy who had a heroin addiction while working at a bank. he would
take a 'maintenance' dose before work (and possibly at lunchtime), and
waited until evening to get high. they're out there.

your pal,
blake

Omelet wrote:
>
>>> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
>>> fee.
>> It is a shame that you don't have government health insurance like we
>> have in Canada. Everyone is eligible regardless of pre-exisitng
>> conditions.
>
> I suspect it's coming. My main concern with Socialized health care is
> what it's going to cost us.
>
> Nothing is free. Only time will tell.

Most of us know that it is not free. There is less spent per capita on
health care in the US and Canadians live a little longer.


> That is a big deal. Since I do the nightly audits, I know what it
> costs. 15 days in the ICU can cost in excess of 100K.

My father spent the last month of his life in the. His supplemental
health insurance covered the extra for a semi private room, which is
only about $15 per day extra. When he died we got no bill. About 5 years
ago my mother spent two weeks in hospital, then last year she was taken
by ambulance to the ER and was admitted, spending five days in the
hospital before she died. The cost twas zero. It was all covered by OHIP.

The downside is that we lose doctors to the US because it is much more
profitable to practice down there.


> IMHO tho', the ideal solution would be to somehow bring down that cost.
> A lot of the cost is compliance and regulation. Being a section
> supervisor in the lab, I have a LOT of experience with compliance
> regulations!

Good luck. Health care is a very lucrative business in the US, and they
have well funded lobby that tries hard to convince the government that
government run day care reeks of communism and will be the ruin of the
health care industry. It will certainly have an impact on the money to
be made by private hospitals and health insurance business.

>

In article 7>,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> >> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
> >>
> >> your pal,
> >> blake
> >
> > Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
> > fee.
>
> That was exactly my plight recently when my b/p suddenly went out of
> control. When I called the cardiologist's office they suggested that I go
> the the ER. I told them I could afford their $30 co-pay but not the ER
> $100 co-pay. I got into their office in a couple of hours.
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright

Good doc. ;-)

I'm finally on Beta Blockers when mine hit 142 one night. I went to
work, told my co-worker what was happening and took my first Beta
Blocker, then waited. Took 3 hours to come down to 100.

Now resting is running around 82.

It's scary... I think mine was due to an OD of Thyroid Armour generic
tho'. I've cut the dose and it has not happened since.
Figuring out a proper thyroid med dose can be iffy, and takes weeks.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
"cybercat" > wrote:

> "blake murphy" > wrote :
> >
> > well, there are soap operas, and she may be becoming the star of one now.
> >
> >
>
> She's sounding a bit like Ross Perot when he went paranoid, over this
> investigation of her dealings with her brother-in-law. It did not take
> long for the fruitcake factor to come front and center.

You are just running scared.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> > IMHO tho', the ideal solution would be to somehow bring down that cost.
> > A lot of the cost is compliance and regulation. Being a section
> > supervisor in the lab, I have a LOT of experience with compliance
> > regulations!
>
> Good luck. Health care is a very lucrative business in the US, and they
> have well funded lobby that tries hard to convince the government that
> government run day care reeks of communism and will be the ruin of the
> health care industry. It will certainly have an impact on the money to
> be made by private hospitals and health insurance business.

Greed plays a big part. I know that.
I've seen it here when a group of docs opened their own imaging center
to insured patients only. It hurt the hospital enough, they had to sell
it...

and guess who whined the most? <g>

We are now owned by the Christus Health System. It's huge.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

On Tue 16 Sep 2008 11:00:20a, Omelet told us...

> In article 7>,
> Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
>> >> why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
>> >>
>> >> your pal,
>> >> blake
>> >
>> > Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians
separate
>> > fee.
>>
>> That was exactly my plight recently when my b/p suddenly went out of
>> control. When I called the cardiologist's office they suggested that I
go
>> the the ER. I told them I could afford their $30 co-pay but not the ER
>> $100 co-pay. I got into their office in a couple of hours.
>>
>> --
>> Wayne Boatwright
>
> Good doc. ;-)
>
> I'm finally on Beta Blockers when mine hit 142 one night. I went to
> work, told my co-worker what was happening and took my first Beta
> Blocker, then waited. Took 3 hours to come down to 100.
>
> Now resting is running around 82.
>
> It's scary... I think mine was due to an OD of Thyroid Armour generic
> tho'. I've cut the dose and it has not happened since.
> Figuring out a proper thyroid med dose can be iffy, and takes weeks.

Yes, it's scary. I woke up last Wednesday feeling rather dizzy. Took my
b/p and it was 210/105. I was alsready on 2 b/p meds, so took my usual
morning pill along with the one I take at night. It came down to normal
range, so thought it was a fluke. The next morning it was 195/100. That's
when I called the cardiologist. He put me on a third medication (each
works differently in lowering the presure), and yesterday I went for a
kidney ultrasound to rule out any narrowing or blockage of the renal
arteries. That was clear. I go back on Friday for a followup.

Figuring out most drug combinations and dosages are often difficult.

--
Wayne Boatwright

*******************************************
Date: Tuesday, 09(IX)/16(XVI)/08(MMVIII)
*******************************************
Countdown till Veteran's Day
7wks 6dys 12hrs 50mins
*******************************************
'There isn't anyone who doesn't
appreciate compassion'
*******************************************

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 19:27:12 -0400, Dave Smith wrote:

> blake murphy wrote:
>>
>> and what percentage of the awful, awful one percent of your taxes do they
>> absorb?
>>
>> christ, you begrudge these people the crumbs off your table. how
>> compassionate.
>
> One percent for that, one percent for another thing and one percent for
> something else. If they won't give 1%, why should the rest of us? If we
> all tried to live off the system there would not be any tax revenue to
> use to help those who need it.

oh, i don't know, why not bitch about the 21% of the federal budget that
goes to defense? the chart here is from o.m.b. figures:

<http://www.cbpp.org/4-10-07tax2.htm>

is there a reason that we spend as much as *the rest of the world combined*
on defense?

why not bitch about farm subsidies and other corporate welfare that give
money to people who already have plenty of it?

you strain at a gnat and swallow a camel.

your pal,
blake

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 00:41:14 GMT, Wayne Boatwright wrote:

>
> I can remember a time, many years ago in Cleveland, where it was common to
> see many welfare recipients pulling up to the welfare offices in their new
> Cadillacs to pick up their checks.
>
> I know things aren't quite like that now, but it's an image one doesn't
> forget.

what are you, ronald reagan risen from the grave?

'it was common to see'? how many times did you see this yourself?

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 16:58:39 -0400, Boron Elgar wrote:

> On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 20:31:17 GMT, blake murphy
> > wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 13:10:57 GMT, Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon 15 Sep 2008 06:02:22a, kilikini told us...
>>>
>>>> Orlando Enrique Fiol wrote:
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Food stamps buy food
>>>>>
>>>>> Not always. They're often illegally exchanged for cash to buy tobacco,
>>>>> alcohol, drugs and junk food. Also, given the high surpluses most
>>>>> farms endure, why is produce so expensive and why do few food banks
>>>>> offer plentiful produce to people whose diets so desperately need it?
>>>>>
>>>>> Orlando
>>>>
>>>> The actual paper food stamps have been long gone for years, as I recall,
>>>> and now there's a credit card called an EBT card (I don't know what EBT
>>>> means). AFAIK, you're asked for an I.D. when you use the card to ensure
>>>> that the person buying the food is the person the card has been issued
>>>> to.
>>>>
>>>> kili
>>>
>>> They have the cards here in AZ, but I've never seen them ask for an ID.
>>
>>possibly not, but they most certainly won't allow you to by non-food stamp
>>items.
>>
>>your pal,
>>blake
>
>
> There is a certain kind of fraud that can be perpetrated using the
> EBTs (and likely could have been with the old paper versions as well).
>
> Small markets, bodegas, some independent, non-chain stores are allowed
> to participate in the program if they carry a minimum number of
> acceptable/eligible foods stamp items. These stores are allowed in
> (under certain conditions) as some of those on food stamps do not live
> in areas well-served by larger markets and groceries and it provides a
> means of getting groceries.
>
> These markets, that do not have the computerized records that make
> checking food stamp sales easy, take the EBT transfer and allow some
> percentage of it to be used for tobacco, alcohol or other non-eligible
> items.
>

but such fraud requires the cooperation of the vendor.

> Even with that, the benefits to those who must honestly depend on such
> markets, can be provided.
>
> No matter what the program, be it taxes, food stamps, medical or auto
> insurance, or even vacuum sales or roofing, there will always be those
> who try to scam the system. The idea is to try to keep it to a minimum
> and hunt down through laws and punishment, those who cheat.
>
> Boron

yes. there *will* be cheats in any system. the question is, do you allow
that to make you batshit crazy and throw everyone to the wolves?

it still amounts to chicken feed compared with other frauds perpetrated on
the government and the citizens.

your pal,
blake

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 01:58:08 GMT, Saerah Gray wrote:

> blake murphy > fnord
> :
>
>> On Sun, 14 Sep 2008 19:57:15 -0400, Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> *Some* people turn to welfare as a last resort. Meanwhile, there are
>>> lots of people out there who have no problem getting pregnant and
>>> unable to support the children and living on welfare. Then they
>>> demand day care and special education and training programs to get
>>> themselves back into the work force.
>>
>> and poor people always, *always* get what they demand. they are the
>> secret powerful elite that really runs the country.
>>
>
> Wait, was that how Bush got elected twice?

evidently they were frightened by *** marriage and the dirty brown arabs.
look out!

your pal,
blake

In article 7>,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> > I'm finally on Beta Blockers when mine hit 142 one night. I went to
> > work, told my co-worker what was happening and took my first Beta
> > Blocker, then waited. Took 3 hours to come down to 100.
> >
> > Now resting is running around 82.
> >
> > It's scary... I think mine was due to an OD of Thyroid Armour generic
> > tho'. I've cut the dose and it has not happened since.
> > Figuring out a proper thyroid med dose can be iffy, and takes weeks.
>
> Yes, it's scary. I woke up last Wednesday feeling rather dizzy. Took my
> b/p and it was 210/105. I was alsready on 2 b/p meds, so took my usual
> morning pill along with the one I take at night. It came down to normal
> range, so thought it was a fluke. The next morning it was 195/100. That's
> when I called the cardiologist. He put me on a third medication (each
> works differently in lowering the presure), and yesterday I went for a
> kidney ultrasound to rule out any narrowing or blockage of the renal
> arteries. That was clear. I go back on Friday for a followup.
>
> Figuring out most drug combinations and dosages are often difficult.

I wish you well. Ideally, we can find the cause and fix it from there,
but I'd rather live.

I ran a high heart rate for a couple of years before it got that bad.
And we've been "playing" with the Thyroid levels for about as long. It
got bad tho' when the pharmacy switched me to a generic instead of the
name brand without telling me.

It can make a difference.

The tachycardia does cause High BP but I never checked that. At 100 BPM,
it was 128 over 91. Borderline high thank the gods.

Right now, Bystolic is keeping my heart rate low which keeps the BP down.

Cause or effect?

I can't afford the Cardiology consult right now.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> why not bitch about farm subsidies and other corporate welfare that give
> money to people who already have plenty of it?
>
> you strain at a gnat and swallow a camel.
>
> your pal,
> blake

I don't think anyone will argue with that. ;-) There is a lot of
Government pork.
--
Peace! Om

"If you don't read the newspaper you are uninformed; if you do read the newspaper you are misinformed." --Mark Twain

On Sep 16, 2:21*pm, blake murphy > wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 00:41:14 GMT, Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> > I can remember a time, many years ago in Cleveland, where it was common to
> > see many welfare recipients pulling up to the welfare offices in their new
> > Cadillacs to pick up their checks.
>
> > I know things aren't quite like that now, but it's an image one doesn't
> > forget.
>
> what are you, ronald reagan risen from the grave?
>
> 'it was common to see'? *how many times did you see this yourself?

I`d say never.

http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-welfarequeen.htm

On Sep 16, 2:47*pm, " > wrote:

> http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-welfarequeen.htm

Just to add to this, in 1968, I heard people in the US (yes, I was in
the US in 1968, at the same time as the Democratic convention, but not
AT said convention) claim that they knew of black families who lived
in a badly run down part of Columbus Ohio (where I was) but who drove
spanking new Cadillacs to the welfare office. Of course, when asked
to point out said families, they claimed to have heard it from
friends. Urban legends are hard to kill...

I suspect Re-again just updated it from "coloured" to "welfare" to
suit his purposes.

But...true story, my cousin had a friend who combed her hair into a
beehive and bees made a nest in it...I swear it's true! ;-)

> wrote in message
...
On Sep 16, 2:21 pm, blake murphy > wrote:
> On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 00:41:14 GMT, Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> > I can remember a time, many years ago in Cleveland, where it was common
> > to
> > see many welfare recipients pulling up to the welfare offices in their
> > new
> > Cadillacs to pick up their checks.
>
> > I know things aren't quite like that now, but it's an image one doesn't
> > forget.
>
> what are you, ronald reagan risen from the grave?
>
> 'it was common to see'? how many times did you see this yourself?

>>I`d say never.

http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-welfarequeen.htm

So *this* is where the dumbasses get this stuff! hahaha!

On Tue, 16 Sep 2008 18:32:17 GMT, blake murphy
> wrote:

>On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 16:58:39 -0400, Boron Elgar wrote:
>

>> There is a certain kind of fraud that can be perpetrated using the
>> EBTs (and likely could have been with the old paper versions as well).
>>
>snip
>>
>> These markets, that do not have the computerized records that make
>> checking food stamp sales easy, take the EBT transfer and allow some
>> percentage of it to be used for tobacco, alcohol or other non-eligible
>> items.
>>
>
>but such fraud requires the cooperation of the vendor.

There is no question the vendor is quite complicit, and may even be
the instigator.

>> Even with that, the benefits to those who must honestly depend on such
>> markets, can be provided.
>>
>> No matter what the program, be it taxes, food stamps, medical or auto
>> insurance, or even vacuum sales or roofing, there will always be those
>> who try to scam the system. The idea is to try to keep it to a minimum
>> and hunt down through laws and punishment, those who cheat.
>>
>> Boron
>
>yes. there *will* be cheats in any system. the question is, do you allow
>that to make you batshit crazy and throw everyone to the wolves?

It is something I accept. As the poor, we will have cheaters with us
always.

>it still amounts to chicken feed compared with other frauds perpetrated on
>the government and the citizens.
>
No argument.

Boron

"Omelet" wrote in message
news
> "Mike Pearce" wrote:
>
>> "Omelet" wrote in message
>> > Dave Smith wrote:
>> >
>> >> What do you do in a case like that. He is a woman who was raised
>> >> on
>> >> welfare, whose college education subsidized and received student
>> >> grants,
>> >> who had the opportunity to get education and training to help
>> >> her
>> >> find
>> >> meaningful employment. But she knew that the system would
>> >> support
>> >> her,
>> >> so she intentionally got herself pregnant knowing that she could
>> >> stay
>> >> home and not have to work. That was the way she was raised, and
>> >> there is
>> >> a good chance that her kid will grow up with the same mind set.
>> >
>> > That appears to be the problem in New Orleans...
>>
>> I would like to see an example as described above happening in New
>> Orleans.
>>
>> -Mike
>
> <cough>
>
> I guess you were not the recipient in your state of a large number
> of
> Katrina refugees...

I didn't really expect that you'd show me an example. My state
(Louisiana) had a lot of Katrina "refugees." What do Katrina refugees
have to do with the question I asked other than the fact that many of
them happened to come from New Orleans?

Thanks,
-Mike

Omelet wrote:

> In article >,
> blake murphy > wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 15 Sep 2008 09:29:54 -0500, Omelet wrote:
> >
> > > In article >,
> > > "kilikini" > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Omelet wrote:
> > >>> In article > ,
> > >>> Saerah Gray > wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> I feel very, very privileged to have low-cost health insurance
> > >>>> provided to me by my employer.
> > >>>
> > >>> So do I, and I still can't afford it. ;-)
> > >>>
> > >>> The health care issue is a whole 'nuther topic. Regulation adds a
> > >>> considerable expense to it. Since I work in health care, I see it
> > >>> first hand.
> > >>>
> > >>> And by the way, no federally subsidized ER (like ours) can refuse
> > >>> basic and emergency health care to anyone. We care for plenty of
> > >>> homeless in our ER...
> > >>
> > >> What happens in regards to recurring medical treatment? Someone may
> > >> become
> > >> sick and initially go to the ER, but what if the situation is serious
and
> > >> the individual needs lots of follow-up appointments?
> > >
> > > They keep coming back to the ER usually. We have a lot of "frequent
> > > flyers". I know some of the more compassionate MD's that even do
> > > volunteer work not only here, but third world countries too.
> > >
> > >> How does a person with
> > >> no insurance receive that? That was the situation I found myself in.
I
> > >> initially got help for a private cancer agency, but when it came to
> > >> multiple
> > >> surgeries and the myriad of doctor's appointments, I was stuck.
Luckily,
> > >> I
> > >> qualified for Medicaid. I wish it was available to everyone; it
certainly
> > >> should be. All my tests are covered, all my follow-ups and all my
> > >> surgeries. If I had private insurance, most of the tests (partly due
to
> > >> the
> > >> frequency of the tests) would probably not be covered.
> > >>
> > >> kili
> > >
> > > Heh! Tell me about it! That's what I'm running into right now.
Insurance
> > > is not always a good thing. I'm supposed to see a cardiologist and
get
> > > regular physical therapy, but cannot afford it even with insurance!
> >
> > why not go to the emergency room, since treatment there is so peachy?
> >
> > your pal,
> > blake
>
> Because the co-pay is $100.00, not to mention the ER physicians separate
> fee.


Yup, and if you blow off the bill it's "OOPS! There goes my
credit...!!!"...


--
Best
Greg

On Sep 16, 11:04*am, Dave Smith > wrote:
> John Kane wrote:
>
> > No but all you need to do is come to Canada and ask about the
> > Residential Schools scandal and you will know that that taking kids
> > away from their parents is a risky and bad business.
>
> So much for trying to provide an education to them. It seemed at the
> time to be the most practical way of providing an education to people
> who lived in tiny remote communities and to prepare them for life in the
> modern era. *Of course, those same communities are now demanding more
> access to education. Go figger.

It seemed like a good idea at the time but we have learned a bit since
them. No need repeat the same mistakes. Also if I have the approach
correct it was not so much to prepare people for life in a modern era
as much as it was to wipe out aboriginal cultures and languages.

Kids were essentially kidnapped in the old system. Now at least the
parents or tribal council sees the advantages of education. It was
not all that apparent in the late 19th or early 20th Century.

John Kane Kingston ON Canada