On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:08:17 GMT, blake murphy
> wrote:

>On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:00:46 -0600, Chemiker wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 18:56:59 GMT, blake murphy
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 00:01:32 -0500, Goomba wrote:
>>
>> Now THAT's risk management!
>>
>> Alex
>
>why **** around?

An admirably direct approach, say I. Calls to mind a cartoon
I saw some years back. A line of Russians (?) waiting to be
hanged, one at a time. Off to the side, a desk at which sat
a commisar holding a pistol. The sign on the desk said
"Express line". Ron White made a similar point when he
pointed out that, while other states are limiting executions,
Texas was setting up an express line. He referred to a
proposal that, in case of a capital crime, if there come forward
3 witnesses to the fact, the murderer gets VIP treatment and
goes to the head of the line.

OBFOOD: Ron White drinks *cheap* Scotch.

blake murphy wrote:
>
> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:09:31 -0700, Arri London wrote:
>
> > Chemiker wrote:

<snip>

> >
> > And what was their advertising budget for that year?
>
> i was going to say something like that. i'm under the impression the
> advertising budget is greater than that for r & d.
>
> hmm, looks like i'm right:
>
> ScienceDaily (Jan. 7, 2008) €” A new study by two York University
> researchers estimates the U.S. pharmaceutical industry spends almost twice
> as much on promotion as it does on research and development, contrary to
> the industrys claim.
>
> The researchers estimate is based on the systematic collection of data
> directly from the industry and doctors during 2004, which shows the U.S.
> pharmaceutical industry spent 24.4% of the sales dollar on promotion,
> versus 13.4% for research and development, as a percentage of US domestic
> sales of US$235.4 billion.
>
> The research is co-authored by PhD candidate Marc-André Gagnon, who led the
> study with Joel Lexchin, a long-time researcher of pharmaceutical
> promotion, Toronto physician, and Associate Chair of Yorks School of
> Health Policy & Management in the Faculty of Health.
>
> <http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/01/080105140107.htm>
>
> your pal,
> blake


Nodding. Had a contract with one of the Swiss pharmaceutical companies
some years ago. Same thing; much more spent on marketing than on R & D.
They contract out to universities cos they don't have to pay as much for
the same talent as they would for inhouse staff.

Chemiker wrote:
>
> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:09:31 -0700, Arri London >
> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >Chemiker wrote:
> >>
> >> On Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:38:55 -0700, Pennyaline
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> > I don't care when they go on and on about how much
> >> >money is invested in R&D, because it pales by comparison to how much the
> >> >CEO takes home.
> >>
> >> I think you might have a decimal point error in their somewhere. FE:
> >> Hank McKinnell is CEO of Pfizer. Regardless of which figure you use
> >> for his comp., including the $83 Million one-time retirement
> >> package, the number is small compared to the Research and Development
> >> expense each year. For 2007, the last audited annual report for
> >> Pfizer, R&D accounted for 8.08 BILLION dollars. This is $8,080
> >> Million, a tad more than CEO McKinnel makes, I think.
> >>
> >> Alex
> >
> >
> >And what was their advertising budget for that year?
>
> Depends on whit you call "advertising". What we think of under
> that term is consolidated with related other expenses in an
> annual report. There is usually a line that consolidates all
> expenses related to marketing, including salaries, consulting,
> marketing contractors, and, within the rules of GAAP,
> expenses related to actual sales.
>
> Not that it matters a lot. I was responding to a comparison
> of CEO compensation and R&D expense. You are welcome
> to download the annuall report of (pick your own company)
> and look at the financials (not the balance sheet, which is
> assets/liabilities), including unaudited recent quarterly
> reports. Go for it. Test your assumptions.
>
> Alex, not for hire.


As mentioned above, BTDT when working for a Swiss pharmaceutical
company. No surprises there; more spent for marketing than for R & D.

Kathleen wrote:
>
> Arri London wrote:
>
> >
> > blake murphy wrote:
> >
> >>On Wed, 11 Feb 2009 11:33:33 -0700, Gloria P wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Dimitri wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>Have you seen the newest Enbrel commercial?
> >>>>
> >>>>It opens with a woman saying, "I knew rheumatoid arthritis was painful,
> >>>>but I didn't know it could attack my joints!"
> >>>
> >>>Yes, DOH! They get worse and worse.
> >>>
> >>>AFAIAC the most insulting is any one that tells you to "ask"
> >>>your doctor for a Rx for a new med. Why bother to go to a doctor?
> >>>Just steal a prescription pad and prescribe them all for yourself.
> >>>
> >>>I much prefer to go to the doctor informed but let HIM do the
> >>>diagnosing and prescribing, after I ask a few questions. He's
> >>>never steered me wrong so far.
> >>>
> >>>gloria p
> >>
> >>hot damn! oxycontin, here we come!
> >>
> >>your pal,
> >>rush
> >
> >
> > LOL. Hey in the hospital, had a scrip for oxycontin (or one of its
> > relatives) given to me (by a doctor who never saw me) to take home. That
> > was after being there for two weeks needing no pain reliever stronger
> > than paracetamol/acetominophen. Very nearly filled the Rx with the
> > intent of going out on the main drag and selling it
>
> In breaking news, a local veterinary clinic was burgularized last night,
> the perpetrators making off with an undetermined number of vials of
> oxytocin.
>
> The suspects were described as white males in their early twenties, with
> sensitive nipples and nurturing personalities.


LOL. They must have been dyslexic in addition to being brainless.

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:25:12 GMT, notbob > fired up
random neurons and synapses to opine:

<snip>

>Now annoying: Nothing, not even Billie Mays, is as annoying as Geico. Gawd,
>I hate those commercials.

<more snip>

Here in SoCal, the absolutely *worst* gawdawful annoying commercial is
for some mattress company. While Annoying Person #1 pitches the
prices, Annoying Person #2 finishes it with, "You're killing me
Larry...!!!" In the MOST obnoxious New York-ese accent on the planet.

Back in Denver, however, there was a bearded guy who ran a gun shop
and, while waving a handgun around, smirked, "I don't want to make
money! I just looooove to sell guns! Heh, heh, heh, heh!" Made me want
to pound my head on the desk and throw up.

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd

--

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "meatloaf" with "cox"

Chemiker wrote:
> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:31:25 -0700, Pennyaline
> > wrote:
>> You neglected to mention just how much he is paid each year.
>>
>> <and, all things considered these days, are we really expected to
>> believe the annual report?>
>
> Ah! Distrust everything..... Well then, why should I even bother to
> discuss this with you? One Enron and, I expect, you hung a red
> flag on your bedroom wall<G>... If you don't trust anything, you
> must accept that your accusations and doubts are based on no
> actual knowledge. If you really give a damn, read the reports
> yourself. If your math isn;t that good, find someone who can.
> If you're nihilistic about the whole thing, go find yourself a
> commune somewhere and get a log hut.

If you don't know the answer, all you have to do is say so.

On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:02:08 -0700, Arri London wrote:

> blake murphy wrote:
>>
>> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:09:31 -0700, Arri London wrote:
>>
>>> Chemiker wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>>>
>>> And what was their advertising budget for that year?
>>
>> i was going to say something like that. i'm under the impression the
>> advertising budget is greater than that for r & d.
>>
>> hmm, looks like i'm right:
>>
>> ScienceDaily (Jan. 7, 2008) €” A new study by two York University
>> researchers estimates the U.S. pharmaceutical industry spends almost twice
>> as much on promotion as it does on research and development, contrary to
>> the industrys claim.
>>
>> The researchers estimate is based on the systematic collection of data
>> directly from the industry and doctors during 2004, which shows the U.S.
>> pharmaceutical industry spent 24.4% of the sales dollar on promotion,
>> versus 13.4% for research and development, as a percentage of US domestic
>> sales of US$235.4 billion.
>>
>> The research is co-authored by PhD candidate Marc-André Gagnon, who led the
>> study with Joel Lexchin, a long-time researcher of pharmaceutical
>> promotion, Toronto physician, and Associate Chair of Yorks School of
>> Health Policy & Management in the Faculty of Health.
>>
>> <http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/01/080105140107.htm>
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
> Nodding. Had a contract with one of the Swiss pharmaceutical companies
> some years ago. Same thing; much more spent on marketing than on R & D.
> They contract out to universities cos they don't have to pay as much for
> the same talent as they would for inhouse staff.

that's another aspect of the scandal: in the u.s., n.i.h. gives research
grants to the universities, universities license out patents to drug
companies, and everyone pays out the nose until the drugs go generic.

your pal,
blake

On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 10:42:07 -0700, SteveB wrote:

> "Denise in NH" > wrote in message
> ...
>> LM said:
>> The one that comes to mind is the Budweiser Clydesdale commercials from
>> the superbowl. I love them. They make me want to see them, and I feel
>> good about buying their products
>> ________________________________
>> Some of the Clydesdales live down the street from me. We have a
>> Budweiser plant here in So.NH and some of the teams live here
>> permanently. They are magnificent in person, and when they have a new
>> baby we all go visiting. I love watching them graze in the field behind
>> their stalls, you can walk through their grooming areas and get up
>> close. You can also tour the bottling plant and sample the different
>> types of beer. Unfortunately I hate beer, I also hate the smell of beer
>> which lingers in the air on hot humid days.
>>
>> Denise
>
> "Beer is proof God loves us." - Benjamin Franklin -

you left out my favorite part of the quote:

´Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.¡

i read somewhere that it may be apocryphal, but google isn't helping me run
that down.

your pal,
blake

On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 20:41:19 GMT, blake murphy
> wrote:

>On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 10:42:07 -0700, SteveB wrote:
>
>> "Denise in NH" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> LM said:
>>> The one that comes to mind is the Budweiser Clydesdale commercials from
>>> the superbowl. I love them. They make me want to see them, and I feel
>>> good about buying their products
>>> ________________________________
>>> Some of the Clydesdales live down the street from me. We have a
>>> Budweiser plant here in So.NH and some of the teams live here
>>> permanently. They are magnificent in person, and when they have a new
>>> baby we all go visiting. I love watching them graze in the field behind
>>> their stalls, you can walk through their grooming areas and get up
>>> close. You can also tour the bottling plant and sample the different
>>> types of beer. Unfortunately I hate beer, I also hate the smell of beer
>>> which lingers in the air on hot humid days.
>>>
>>> Denise
>>
>> "Beer is proof God loves us." - Benjamin Franklin -
>
>you left out my favorite part of the quote:
>
>´Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.¡
>
>i read somewhere that it may be apocryphal, but google isn't helping me run
>that down.

Beer is proof god knows ugly people need to get laid too.

Lou

Chemiker wrote:
> Ah! Distrust everything..... Well then, why should I even bother to
> discuss this with you? One Enron and, I expect, you hung a red
> flag on your bedroom wall<G>.

It was black crepe, actually.

On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:10:26 -0600, Lou Decruss wrote:

> On Sat, 14 Feb 2009 20:41:19 GMT, blake murphy
> > wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 10:42:07 -0700, SteveB wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> "Beer is proof God loves us." - Benjamin Franklin -
>>
>>you left out my favorite part of the quote:
>>
>>´Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.¡
>>
>>i read somewhere that it may be apocryphal, but google isn't helping me run
>>that down.
>
> Beer is proof god knows ugly people need to get laid too.
>
> Lou

there is that.

your pal,
blake

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:41:21 -0700, Pennyaline
> wrote:

>jmcquown wrote:
>> "Pennyaline" > wrote

> By the same token, the risks of using erectile
>dysfunction medications are NOT worth the risks associated with them.
>Okay, personal priorities have something to do with that opinion, and I
>believe resolutely that it is far more important for me to breathe than
>for some old geezer to get it up. I'm just sayin'.

Your position is clear, sweets. Of course, *some* may disagree
that your ability to breath is worth all that much.

Alex, running away. He doesn't like black crepe either.

On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:05:18 -0700, Arri London >
wrote:

>

>> In breaking news, a local veterinary clinic was burgularized last night,
>> the perpetrators making off with an undetermined number of vials of
>> oxytocin.
>>
>> The suspects were described as white males in their early twenties, with
>> sensitive nipples and nurturing personalities.
>
>
>LOL. They must have been dyslexic in addition to being brainless.

No, Arri. <G> She had it right. THey're trying to terminate a
*condition*, don't you know. Altho, I must agree, as our
young are taught these days, you may be more right than
I imagine.

Alex

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:41:21 -0700, Pennyaline
> wrote:

>By the same token, the risks of using erectile
>dysfunction medications are NOT worth the risks associated with them.
>Okay, personal priorities have something to do with that opinion, and I
>believe resolutely that it is far more important for me to breathe than
>for some old geezer to get it up. I'm just sayin'.

If you were the only option to share that erection with then you are
correct. Not worth the risk.

Lou

On Sun, 15 Feb 2009 17:31:43 -0600, Chemiker
> wrote:

>On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:41:21 -0700, Pennyaline
> wrote:
>
>>jmcquown wrote:
>>> "Pennyaline" > wrote
>
>> By the same token, the risks of using erectile
>>dysfunction medications are NOT worth the risks associated with them.
>>Okay, personal priorities have something to do with that opinion, and I
>>believe resolutely that it is far more important for me to breathe than
>>for some old geezer to get it up. I'm just sayin'.
>
>Your position is clear, sweets. Of course, *some* may disagree
>that your ability to breath is worth all that much.

<snork>

Lou

Lou Decruss wrote:

> On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:41:21 -0700, Pennyaline
> > wrote:
>
> >By the same token, the risks of using erectile
> >dysfunction medications are NOT worth the risks associated with them.
> >Okay, personal priorities have something to do with that opinion, and I
> >believe resolutely that it is far more important for me to breathe than
> >for some old geezer to get it up. I'm just sayin'.
>
> If you were the only option to share that erection with then you are
> correct. Not worth the risk.


A+


--
Best
Greg

Chemiker wrote:
>
> On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:05:18 -0700, Arri London >
> wrote:
>
> >
>
> >> In breaking news, a local veterinary clinic was burgularized last night,
> >> the perpetrators making off with an undetermined number of vials of
> >> oxytocin.
> >>
> >> The suspects were described as white males in their early twenties, with
> >> sensitive nipples and nurturing personalities.
> >
> >
> >LOL. They must have been dyslexic in addition to being brainless.
>
> No, Arri. <G> She had it right. THey're trying to terminate a
> *condition*, don't you know.


Whew! Talk about being really really really brainless!

>Altho, I must agree, as our
> young are taught these days, you may be more right than
> I imagine.
>
> Alex

The other use would never ever have occurred to me, given the risks.

Arri London wrote:
>
> Chemiker wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 18:05:18 -0700, Arri London >
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>In breaking news, a local veterinary clinic was burgularized last night,
>>>>the perpetrators making off with an undetermined number of vials of
>>>>oxytocin.
>>>>
>>>>The suspects were described as white males in their early twenties, with
>>>>sensitive nipples and nurturing personalities.
>>>
>>>
>>>LOL. They must have been dyslexic in addition to being brainless.
>>
>>No, Arri. <G> She had it right. THey're trying to terminate a
>>*condition*, don't you know.
>
>
>
> Whew! Talk about being really really really brainless!
>
>
>>Altho, I must agree, as our
>>young are taught these days, you may be more right than
>>I imagine.
>>
>>Alex
>
>
> The other use would never ever have occurred to me, given the risks.

It was a joke...
<Shoulda used a smiley>

On Feb 11, 1:54*pm, Dave Smith
> wrote:
> Gloria P wrote:
>
> > AFAIAC the most insulting is any one that tells you to "ask"
> > your doctor for a Rx for a new med. *Why bother to go to a doctor?
> > Just steal a prescription pad and prescribe them all for yourself.
>
> > I much prefer to go to the doctor informed but let HIM do the
> > diagnosing and prescribing, after I ask a few questions. *He's
> > never steered me wrong so far.
>
> Would you prefer to get a prescription for a drug that you have been
> informed about and heard the risks of, or would you prefer to get a
> prescription for a drug from a company whose salesman just took the
> doctor out for a nice dinner, gave him some pens, mugs and a bunch of
> free samples?

http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/335/7622/694 for the New Zealand
experience. There is some international reseach ( USA--Germany?) ,
which I have not bookmarked, that suggests that diagnosis rates for
some psychiatric problems is linked to drug ads ( not just because the
ads are that dumb)

John Kane Kingston ON Canada

On Feb 11, 2:52*pm, Dave Smith
> wrote:
> Gloria P wrote:
> > Dave Smith wrote:
> >> Gloria P wrote:
>
> >>> I much prefer to go to the doctor informed but let HIM do the
> >>> diagnosing and prescribing, after I ask a few questions. *He's
> >>> never steered me wrong so far.
>
> >> Would you prefer to get a prescription for a drug that you have been
> >> informed about and heard the risks of, or would you prefer to get a
> >> prescription for a drug from a company whose salesman just took the
> >> doctor out for a nice dinner, gave him some pens, mugs and a bunch of
> >> free samples?
>
> > How "informed" do you feel after the glitzy commercials for drugs?
> > The only valid parts seem to me to be the side-effects warnings.
>
> I think that I feel well enough informed to at least ask my doctor about
> the drug.... if it deals with a condition I suffer from.-

Probably the best source of information is the annual CPS: Compendium
of Pharmaceutical & Specialties. http://mallins.ca/store/index.php?ac...od&productId=2
It is costly but most university libraries should have it plus any
doctor's office or Canadian Blood Service clinc etc will have it. If
your own doctor's office does not have an up-to-date copy get a new
doctor

I think the US equivalent is the Doctor's Desk Book. I don't know
what the UK or Au or NZ etc equivalents are.

John Kane Kingston ON Canada

On Tue, 17 Feb 2009 06:55:57 -0800 (PST), John Kane wrote:

> On Feb 11, 2:52*pm, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>>
>> I think that I feel well enough informed to at least ask my doctor about
>> the drug.... if it deals with a condition I suffer from.-
>
> Probably the best source of information is the annual CPS: Compendium
> of Pharmaceutical & Specialties. http://mallins.ca/store/index.php?ac...od&productId=2
> It is costly but most university libraries should have it plus any
> doctor's office or Canadian Blood Service clinc etc will have it. If
> your own doctor's office does not have an up-to-date copy get a new
> doctor
>
> I think the US equivalent is the Doctor's Desk Book. I don't know
> what the UK or Au or NZ etc equivalents are.
>
> John Kane Kingston ON Canada

i think the book you are referring to is *the physician's desk reference*.
there's an online version for the general public he

<http://www.drugs.com/pdr/>

your pal,
blake