Russ Easby wrote:
> Hello, for some time now I have been trying to replicate a pizza crust one
> would find in a good NY pizzaria. Now I know most of them use high-gluten
> flour, but this is not something I have been able to find in grocery stores
> (seems to be a whole sale only item) so I started out using bread flour,
> figuring its higher protien content, while not as high as high-gluten flour, is
> close (bread flour being around 12%, where as high gluten 14% and all purpose
> 9%).
>
> So, my problem is, I have a terrible time tossing and stretching the dough made
> with bread flour, it tears easily and is not very elastic, just plain tough.
> So I gave up after many attempts.
>
> Next I tried just using all purpose flour, and the dough this produces is very
> easy to toss and stretch, but the lower protien content makes it seem to
> produce a denser less chewy crust then what I am looking for.
>
> So, I thought maybe there is another element to the bread flour that isnt in
> all purpose or high-fluten that maybe be making the dough tough? So I tried
> just adding wheat gluten to all purpose flour (at 1 tsp per cup of flour) and I
> end up with the exact same problem as when I use bread flour, tough dough thats
> impossible to stretch, toss and shape.
>
> Do I just need to break down and buy my flour 25 lbs at a time so I can get
> proper high gluten flour? Or, looking at some pizza industry web sites, I
> notice they cold rise their dough for 12 hours, does this somehow make high
> gluten flours like bread flour easier to work with then a quicker room temp
> rise?
>
> Here is the basic formula I use for making pizza dough:
>
> 3 cups flour
> 1 cup water at 115 degrees F
> 2 1/4 tsps active dry yeast
> 1/2 tsp salt
> 1/4 tsp sugar for proofing
>
> I have experimented with small amounts of oil as well, after seeing some pizza
> industry websites use it in their recipies, while it did not hurt my efforts,
> it certainly did not solve the problem.
>
> I primarly have done single rises, since not a single industry website mentions
> anything about second rises in their dough making. Though in wondering if this
> might be my problem, I have experimented with double rising, and it in no way
> helped my problem.
>
> So is the flour type my problem? By the way I primarily use King Author, but
> have tried other brands with the same results.
>
> I have been baking wonderful breads for many years with great success, proper
> NY style pizza dough is just an obstical I cannot conquor. Rolled out craker
> type crusts such as you get with chain pizza "thin crust" and deep dish
> sicilian are not a problem, just a problem with making a dough that can be
> properly hand tossed.
>
> Any help or suggestions are very welcome.
>
> Russell


I use 2 cups of bread flour, 1 cup of warm water, 1 tsp. salt, 1 tsp. driy
yeast, and 1 Tbsp. olive oil or bacon grease. I sometimes add a pich of
sugar, but usually not. I don't stir the flour before I measure it, so it
is probably a generous 2 cups. (I really should weigh it next time.)
Still, that is a much higher hydration than your recipe.

I don't toss my pizza dough; you might have to add a little more oil to
make the dough less springy, but then it will be too soft and sticky so
you'll flour its surface and flour your hands before you work it.

Hopes this helps,
Bob