I'm making a "Penne w/Tomato-Cream Sauce" recipe from Bon Appetit but
I want to skip the heavy cream (I know that the cream is a main part
of the recipe!).

How does this sound as an alternative?

- first put in some corn starch for thickener and bring to a light
boil to cook the starch & thicken

- bring back down to a simmer (so I don't ruin the milk) then put in
1/2 cup of whole milk (recipe calls for 1/2 cup of h-cream)

Any feedback/opinions would be welcomed.

Mike - Toronto, Canada

"mikem" > wrote in message
om...
> I'm making a "Penne w/Tomato-Cream Sauce" recipe from Bon Appetit but
> I want to skip the heavy cream (I know that the cream is a main part
> of the recipe!).
>
> How does this sound as an alternative?
>
> - first put in some corn starch for thickener and bring to a light
> boil to cook the starch & thicken
>
> - bring back down to a simmer (so I don't ruin the milk) then put in
> 1/2 cup of whole milk (recipe calls for 1/2 cup of h-cream)
>
> Any feedback/opinions would be welcomed.
>

If you really don't want to use heavy cream, you could probably get away
with half-and-half, instead. That would be preferable (imo) to using
cornstarch. I would probably even try using milk without the cornstarch if
I were very keen on lowering the fat content.

rona

--
***For e-mail, replace .com with .ca Sorry for the inconvenience!***

In article >,
(mikem) wrote:

> I'm making a "Penne w/Tomato-Cream Sauce" recipe from Bon Appetit but
> I want to skip the heavy cream (I know that the cream is a main part
> of the recipe!).
>
> How does this sound as an alternative?
>
> - first put in some corn starch for thickener and bring to a light
> boil to cook the starch & thicken
>
> - bring back down to a simmer (so I don't ruin the milk) then put in
> 1/2 cup of whole milk (recipe calls for 1/2 cup of h-cream)
>
> Any feedback/opinions would be welcomed.
>
> Mike - Toronto, Canada

If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free non-dairy
creamer! :-P

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

Katra > wrote in news:Katra-07973D.00435211012004
@corp.supernews.com:

> In article >,
> (mikem) wrote:
>
>> I'm making a "Penne w/Tomato-Cream Sauce" recipe from Bon Appetit but
>> I want to skip the heavy cream (I know that the cream is a main part
>> of the recipe!).
>>
>> How does this sound as an alternative?
>>
>> - first put in some corn starch for thickener and bring to a light
>> boil to cook the starch & thicken
>>
>> - bring back down to a simmer (so I don't ruin the milk) then put in
>> 1/2 cup of whole milk (recipe calls for 1/2 cup of h-cream)
>>
>> Any feedback/opinions would be welcomed.
>>
>> Mike - Toronto, Canada
>
> If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free non-dairy
> creamer! :-P
>
> K.
>

Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is the US
Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost undetectable
from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee, and cereals all the
time.

Wayne

In article >,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> Katra > wrote in news:Katra-07973D.00435211012004
> @corp.supernews.com:
>
> > In article >,
> > (mikem) wrote:
> >
> >> I'm making a "Penne w/Tomato-Cream Sauce" recipe from Bon Appetit but
> >> I want to skip the heavy cream (I know that the cream is a main part
> >> of the recipe!).
> >>
> >> How does this sound as an alternative?
> >>
> >> - first put in some corn starch for thickener and bring to a light
> >> boil to cook the starch & thicken
> >>
> >> - bring back down to a simmer (so I don't ruin the milk) then put in
> >> 1/2 cup of whole milk (recipe calls for 1/2 cup of h-cream)
> >>
> >> Any feedback/opinions would be welcomed.
> >>
> >> Mike - Toronto, Canada
> >
> > If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free non-dairy
> > creamer! :-P
> >
> > K.
> >
>
> Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is the US
> Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost undetectable
> from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee, and cereals all the
> time.
>
> Wayne

Works well huh? :-)
I've used the carnation brand non-fat powdered creamer in smoothies.

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

Katra > wrote in
:

> In article >,
> Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>> > If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free
>> > non-dairy creamer! :-P
>> >
>> > K.
>> >
>>
>> Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is the
>> US Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost
>> undetectable from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee, and
>> cereals all the time.
>>
>> Wayne
>
> Works well huh? :-)
> I've used the carnation brand non-fat powdered creamer in smoothies.
>
> K.

I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This stuff
is good enough to eat on cereal.

In article >,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> Katra > wrote in
> :
>
> > In article >,
> > Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
> >> > If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free
> >> > non-dairy creamer! :-P
> >> >
> >> > K.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is the
> >> US Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost
> >> undetectable from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee, and
> >> cereals all the time.
> >>
> >> Wayne
> >
> > Works well huh? :-)
> > I've used the carnation brand non-fat powdered creamer in smoothies.
> >
> > K.
>
> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This stuff
> is good enough to eat on cereal.
>

Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

Katra > wrote in
:

> In article >,
> Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
>> Katra > wrote in
>> :
>>
>> > In article >,
>> > Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>> >> > If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free
>> >> > non-dairy creamer! :-P
>> >> >
>> >> > K.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is
>> >> the US Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost
>> >> undetectable from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee,
>> >> and cereals all the time.
>> >>
>> >> Wayne
>> >
>> > Works well huh? :-)
>> > I've used the carnation brand non-fat powdered creamer in
>> > smoothies.
>> >
>> > K.
>>
>> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
>> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This
>> stuff is good enough to eat on cereal.
>>
>
> Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
> What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
>
> K.
>

Sorry, I don't know the carbs, but not only is it fat-free, it is
extremely low in calories. By that I would guess that it is probably
low in carbs, but I'm not sure. I usually have it on hand, but used the
last this morning, otherwise I'd go look. (Don't want to traipse out to
the garbage can at 2am. <G>

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 , Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>Katra wrote:
>> (mikem) wrote:

<low fat cream substitutions>

>Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is the US
>Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost undetectable
>from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee, and cereals all the
>time.

<snip>

I know the product you mean. I've tried it, and it is good.
Nothing similar available up here.

Go with addition of cornstarch Mike. I've been doing it for a long
time. If you are cooking for someone who is can't tolerate corn,
tapicoa flour will have the same effect.

Shirley Hicks
Toronto, Ontario

Katra writes:
>
>If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free non-dairy
>creamer! :-P

Get real... fat free evap.


---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
````````````
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 02:12:26 -0600, Katra >
wrote:


>> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
>> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This stuff
>> is good enough to eat on cereal.
>>
>
>Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
>What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
>
>K.

For low cards, just use heavy cream.Its lower then half and half and
milk. According to the packages.
Pan Ohco

In article >,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> Katra > wrote in
> :
>
> > In article >,
> > Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
> >
> >> Katra > wrote in
> >> :
> >>
> >> > In article >,
> >> > Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
> >> >> > If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free
> >> >> > non-dairy creamer! :-P
> >> >> >
> >> >> > K.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> Agreed... I don't know what's available in Toronto, but here is
> >> >> the US Land-o-Lakes makes a fat-free Half and Half that's almost
> >> >> undetectable from the real thing. I use it in cooking, coffee,
> >> >> and cereals all the time.
> >> >>
> >> >> Wayne
> >> >
> >> > Works well huh? :-)
> >> > I've used the carnation brand non-fat powdered creamer in
> >> > smoothies.
> >> >
> >> > K.
> >>
> >> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
> >> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This
> >> stuff is good enough to eat on cereal.
> >>
> >
> > Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
> > What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
> >
> > K.
> >
>
> Sorry, I don't know the carbs, but not only is it fat-free, it is
> extremely low in calories. By that I would guess that it is probably
> low in carbs, but I'm not sure. I usually have it on hand, but used the
> last this morning, otherwise I'd go look. (Don't want to traipse out to
> the garbage can at 2am. <G>

<grins> That's ok. :-)
I can just read the package label before purchasing.

Thanks for the hints! I was not familiar with that product.

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

In article >,
(PENMART01) wrote:

> Katra writes:
> >
> >If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free non-dairy
> >creamer! :-P
>
> Get real... fat free evap.
>
> Sheldon

Yeah, that would work, but I've had trouble finding it unsweetened. :-P

Ick.

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

In article > ,
Dog3 > wrote:

> (PENMART01) deliciously posted in
> :
>
> > Katra writes:
> >>
> >>If you are _that_ worried about fat, just use some fat free non-dairy
> >>creamer! :-P
> >
> > Get real... fat free evap.
> >
>
> Yep and I was also thinking low fat/fat free yogurt thinned a bit with some
> milk might also work. I use a lot of fat free evap and yogurt in recipes
> these days. Both seem to work well.
>
> Michael

How about fat free sour cream?
Sour cream in many recipes is delish'.

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

Katra says:
>
>How about fat free sour cream?

Spackle.


---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
````````````
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."

Katra wrote:

>
> > Yep and I was also thinking low fat/fat free yogurt thinned a bit with some
> > milk might also work. I use a lot of fat free evap and yogurt in recipes
> > these days. Both seem to work well.
> >
> > Michael
>
> How about fat free sour cream?
> Sour cream in many recipes is delish'.

Sour cream goes well with some fruits. One of my favourite summer treats is dipping
fresh strawberries into sour cream and then a bit of brown sugar. It is also darned
good in a single crusted peach pie.

Katra wrote:

> > Get real... fat free evap.
> >
> > Sheldon
>
> Yeah, that would work, but I've had trouble finding it unsweetened. :-P
>
> Ick.

?? You can't find evaporated milk? In most of the stores where I chop there is more
evaporated milk that sweetened condensed milk. And don't scoff at that sweetened
stuff. There are a few recipes where it is magic. There are a number of recipes for
squares that involve graham cracker crusts with various ingredients drizzled with SCM.

It also makes an incredible Irish Cream Liqueur:

I pint Cream
1 can Sweetened Condensed Milk
4 eggs
1 Tblsp. chocolate syrup
10-12 oz Irish Whiskey

Put the ingredients into a blender and whizz it up.

Heavenly

"Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 02:12:26 -0600, Katra >
> wrote:
>
>
> >> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
> >> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This
stuff
> >> is good enough to eat on cereal.
> >>
> >
> >Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
> >What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
> >
> >K.
>
> For low cards, just use heavy cream.Its lower then half and half and
> milk. According to the packages.
> Pan Ohco

Attention people. I think that everyone - me included - would like our
messages to reflect at least a modest level of intelligence and education.
Well then fer chirissake PROOFEAD THEM! "low cards?" "Lower then?" :Its (for
it's?)" This sort of sloppy writing is the equivalent of going out in public
in 3 year old ketchup stained sweats. Have a little self-respect, please!!


--
Peter Aitken

Remove the crap from my email address before using.

Pan Ohco > wrote in
:

> On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 02:12:26 -0600, Katra >
> wrote:
>
>
>>> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
>>> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This
>>> stuff is good enough to eat on cereal.
>>>
>>
>>Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
>>What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
>>
>>K.
>
> For low cards, just use heavy cream.Its lower then half and half and
^^^^^^^^^^
Would that be a deuce? <G>

> milk. According to the packages.
> Pan Ohco
>

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Katra wrote:
>
> >
> > > Yep and I was also thinking low fat/fat free yogurt thinned a bit with
> > > some
> > > milk might also work. I use a lot of fat free evap and yogurt in recipes
> > > these days. Both seem to work well.
> > >
> > > Michael
> >
> > How about fat free sour cream?
> > Sour cream in many recipes is delish'.
>
> Sour cream goes well with some fruits. One of my favourite summer treats is
> dipping
> fresh strawberries into sour cream and then a bit of brown sugar. It is also
> darned
> good in a single crusted peach pie.
>
>

Goes well in meat and pasta dishes also.

Think Stroganoff....... <G>

I agree about the fruit thing. To me, sour cream
is better on fresh and canned fruit than whipping cream. YMMV.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Katra wrote:
>
> > > Get real... fat free evap.
> > >
> > > Sheldon
> >
> > Yeah, that would work, but I've had trouble finding it unsweetened. :-P
> >
> > Ick.
>
> ?? You can't find evaporated milk? In most of the stores where I chop there
> is more
> evaporated milk that sweetened condensed milk. And don't scoff at that
> sweetened
> stuff. There are a few recipes where it is magic. There are a number of
> recipes for
> squares that involve graham cracker crusts with various ingredients drizzled
> with SCM.
>
> It also makes an incredible Irish Cream Liqueur:
>
> I pint Cream
> 1 can Sweetened Condensed Milk
> 4 eggs
> 1 Tblsp. chocolate syrup
> 10-12 oz Irish Whiskey
>
> Put the ingredients into a blender and whizz it up.
>
> Heavenly
>
>

Guess I'll have to look a little harder. ;-)
I know that sweetened condensed milk has it's uses, but unsweetened is
more useful for meat and veggie recipies.

Thing is, its kinda high in carbs so I avoid many dairy products!

K.

--
>,,<Cat's Haven Hobby >,,<
http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...user id=katra

Katra > wrote in
:

> In article >,
> Dave Smith > wrote:
>
>> Katra wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > > Yep and I was also thinking low fat/fat free yogurt thinned a bit
>> > > with some
>> > > milk might also work. I use a lot of fat free evap and yogurt in
>> > > recipes these days. Both seem to work well.
>> > >
>> > > Michael
>> >
>> > How about fat free sour cream?
>> > Sour cream in many recipes is delish'.
>>
>> Sour cream goes well with some fruits. One of my favourite summer
>> treats is dipping
>> fresh strawberries into sour cream and then a bit of brown sugar. It
>> is also darned
>> good in a single crusted peach pie.
>>
>>
>
> Goes well in meat and pasta dishes also.
>
> Think Stroganoff....... <G>
>
> I agree about the fruit thing. To me, sour cream
> is better on fresh and canned fruit than whipping cream. YMMV.
>

I sometimes add a cup of sour cream to my apple pie filling...just
apples, sugar, spices, and a cup of sour cream in a standard 2-crust pie.

I also love fresh raspberries and sour cream.

Wayne

On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:54:09 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

>Pan Ohco > wrote in
:
>
>> On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 02:12:26 -0600, Katra >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
>>>> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This
>>>> stuff is good enough to eat on cereal.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
>>>What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
>>>
>>>K.
>>
>> For low cards, just use heavy cream.Its lower then half and half and
> ^^^^^^^^^^
>Would that be a deuce? <G>
>
Yeah that would be a two.

my bad ;-)
Pan Ohco

On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:53:16 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
> wrote:

>"Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
to the packages.
>> Pan Ohco
>
>Attention people. I think that everyone - me included - would like our
>messages to reflect at least a modest level of intelligence and education.
>Well then fer chirissake PROOFEAD THEM! "low cards?" "Lower then?" :Its (for
>it's?)" This sort of sloppy writing is the equivalent of going out in public
>in 3 year old ketchup stained sweats. Have a little self-respect, please!!

Say Pete, dose anal retentive have a hyphen. :-)
Pan Ohco

"Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:53:16 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
> > wrote:
>
> >"Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
> to the packages.
> >> Pan Ohco
> >
> >Attention people. I think that everyone - me included - would like our
> >messages to reflect at least a modest level of intelligence and
education.
> >Well then fer chirissake PROOFEAD THEM! "low cards?" "Lower then?" :Its
(for
> >it's?)" This sort of sloppy writing is the equivalent of going out in
public
> >in 3 year old ketchup stained sweats. Have a little self-respect,
please!!
>
> Say Pete, dose anal retentive have a hyphen. :-)
> Pan Ohco

Lovely sweats, Pan. Apparently your messages *do* reflect your level of
intelligence and education, so I apologize for complaning.

Peter G. Aitken

On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 16:38:54 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
> wrote:

>"Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Mon, 12 Jan 2004 00:53:16 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >"Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
>> to the packages.
>> >> Pan Ohco
>> >
>> >Attention people. I think that everyone - me included - would like our
>> >messages to reflect at least a modest level of intelligence and
>education.
>> >Well then fer chirissake PROOFEAD THEM! "low cards?" "Lower then?" :Its
>(for
>> >it's?)" This sort of sloppy writing is the equivalent of going out in
>public
>> >in 3 year old ketchup stained sweats. Have a little self-respect,
>please!!
>>
>> Say Pete, dose anal retentive have a hyphen. :-)
>> Pan Ohco
>
>Lovely sweats, Pan. Apparently your messages *do* reflect your level of
>intelligence and education, so I apologize for complaning.
>
>Peter G. Aitken

Everything must be terribly difficult for you since you've had that
broomstick up your ass.

By the way, you might want to check your spelling too.

Ever heard the phrase "hoist with your own pitard?" You might want to
try it sometime.

Lisette

On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 19:49:33 GMT, (Lisette) wrote:
>
>By the way, you might want to check your spelling too.
>
>Ever heard the phrase "hoist with your own pitard?" You might want to
>try it sometime.
>
>Lisette
>
i think that would be 'petard.'

your pal,
blake

On Tue, 20 Jan 2004 05:55:08 GMT, blake murphy >
wrote:

>On Sun, 18 Jan 2004 19:49:33 GMT, (Lisette) wrote:
>>
>>By the way, you might want to check your spelling too.
>>
>>Ever heard the phrase "hoist with your own pitard?" You might want to
>>try it sometime.
>>
>>Lisette
>>
>i think that would be 'petard.'
>
>your pal,
>blake
>
I've seen references both ways, but point well taken :-)
Humility is a good thing.

Lisette

"Peter Aitken" > wrote in message . rr.com>...
> "Pan Ohco" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Sun, 11 Jan 2004 02:12:26 -0600, Katra >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> > >> I think it's quite good, and I'm picky about cream. Since I joined
> > >> Weight Watchers I've been trying to cut all the fat corners. This
> stuff
> > >> is good enough to eat on cereal.
> > >>
> > >
> > >Awesome. I'll have to look for that. :-)
> > >What is the carb level? I'm low carbing, again.... <G>
> > >
> > >K.
> >
> > For low cards, just use heavy cream.Its lower then half and half and
> > milk. According to the packages.
> > Pan Ohco
>
> Attention people. I think that everyone - me included - would like our
> messages to reflect at least a modest level of intelligence and education.
> Well then fer chirissake PROOFEAD THEM! "low cards?" "Lower then?" :Its (for
^^^^^^^^
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


> it's?)" This sort of sloppy writing is the equivalent of going out in public
> in 3 year old ketchup stained sweats. Have a little self-respect, please!!

il Fri, 23 Jan 2004 21:28:02 -0600, Alan ha scritto:

> And, translated, one interpretation of "hoist on one's own petard" is:
>
> "Embarrassed by one's own fart."
>
> (Yes, yes, I know it originally had to do with sitting on one's
> scabbard (sp?)......)

Actually, it was to do with blowing oneself up with one's own
explosive. An 'own goal' so to speak. = "destroyed by one's own
machinations, framed for the destruction of others"

--
Brevity is the soul of wit. W.Shakespeare

On 24 Jan 2004 17:46:23 +1300, "Loki" > wrote:

>il Fri, 23 Jan 2004 21:28:02 -0600, Alan ha scritto:
>
>> And, translated, one interpretation of "hoist on one's own petard" is:
>>
>> "Embarrassed by one's own fart."
>>
>> (Yes, yes, I know it originally had to do with sitting on one's
>> scabbard (sp?)......)
>
>Actually, it was to do with blowing oneself up with one's own
>explosive. An 'own goal' so to speak. = "destroyed by one's own
>machinations, framed for the destruction of others"

Actually your both right.
It is a case for holding an explosive, and for the release of
intestinal gas.
Pan Ohco

>Pan Ohco wrties:
>
>"Loki" wrote:
>>Alan Moorman says:
>>
>>> And, translated, one interpretation of "hoist on one's own petard" is:
>>>
>>> "Embarrassed by one's own fart."
>>>
>>> (Yes, yes, I know it originally had to do with sitting on one's
>>> scabbard (sp?)......)
>>
>>Actually, it was to do with blowing oneself up with one's own
>>explosive. An 'own goal' so to speak. = "destroyed by one's own
>>machinations, framed for the destruction of others"
>
>Actually <U>your</U> both right.

Actually? So, *you're* the quibble referee. hehe




---= BOYCOTT FRENCH--GERMAN (belgium) =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
Sheldon
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"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."