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In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote: > OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote: > > In article >, > > Wayne > wrote: > > > >>OmManiPadmeOmelet > wrote in > : > > > >>>In article >, > >>> Dog3 <dognospam@adjfkdla;not> wrote: > > >>>Hint: For food that you KNOW is going to not agree with you, drink > >>>about 1/3 of a bottle of Magnesium Citrate after your meal. It > >>>promotes rapid emptying of the stomach and will drive it thru your > >>>system faster. ;-) > >> > >>Good Lord! Be careful with that stuff. It can blow you another hole! > >> > > ONLY if you over-use it! > > > > A small dose can really help you if you have a slow moving gut and > > digetion issues. Drink a whole bottle and you can't get away from the > > toilet for a few hours..... > > > > Some's good, more's better attitude with it does not work. ;-) > > Brioschi (Italian, pronounced bree-oh-skee) is the brand that lived on > my grandparents' windowsill. My grandmother was a wonderful person and > one of the lousy cooks of all time. She had her repertoire of winners, > but the losers outnumbered them, unfortunately. It was a sort of > after-dinner drink for my grandfather. I'd say 3 nights out of 7. > > He frowned a lot. > > Pastorio > <lol> I can imagine...... ;-D It's not always easy to get. Tends to sell out quickly locally! Guess it's more common than one would think. Honestly, I only suggested it to him as he seems to have some problems, and it DOES work! I've got some food sensitivity issues as well and if I eat something that I know is going to make me sick otherwise, that beverage prevents it better than Pepto, and it tastes better IMHO. Om. -- "See, the problem is that God gives men a brain and a penis, and only enough blood to run one at a time." -Robin Williams |
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"Dog3" <dognospam@adjfkdla;not> wrote in message 4... > "Bob (this one)" > : > > > zxcvbob wrote: > >> PENMART01 wrote: > >> > >>>> Levelwave writes: > >>>> > >>>> PENMART01 wrote: > >>>> > > Ohhhh... I like this. Thanks for the info. I never thought of larding it > before. Do you think I can lard it before searing or should that come > after. I do a light sear on the roast after seasoning it and using a lot of > garlic. Not enough to crust the spices, just enough to sear in the juices, > which there is not much of. > > Michael > > -- I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? I'm getting ahead of myself........... kili |
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"Dog3" <dognospam@adjfkdla;not> wrote in message 4... > "Bob (this one)" > : > > > zxcvbob wrote: > >> PENMART01 wrote: > >> > >>>> Levelwave writes: > >>>> > >>>> PENMART01 wrote: > >>>> > > Ohhhh... I like this. Thanks for the info. I never thought of larding it > before. Do you think I can lard it before searing or should that come > after. I do a light sear on the roast after seasoning it and using a lot of > garlic. Not enough to crust the spices, just enough to sear in the juices, > which there is not much of. > > Michael > > -- I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? I'm getting ahead of myself........... kili |
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>Sheldon, what's
>the need to tie it every 2 inches? Does that hold in moisture? > >kili I ususally roast an entire eye round. The way muscle fibers run in eye round tying helps keep it from warping/twisting... it's mostly an esthetic thingie. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>Sheldon, what's
>the need to tie it every 2 inches? Does that hold in moisture? > >kili I ususally roast an entire eye round. The way muscle fibers run in eye round tying helps keep it from warping/twisting... it's mostly an esthetic thingie. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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Dog3 wrote:
> "Bob (this one)" > = om: >=20 >=20 >>zxcvbob wrote: >> >>>PENMART01 wrote: >>> >>> >>>>>Levelwave writes: >>>>> >>>>>PENMART01 wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>This is not really possible... chuck is from the shoulder=20 >>>>>>(fore quarter) and round is from the ass (hind quarter). >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Oops, you're right. It's 'Eye of Round' not 'Chuck' and tubular >>>>> as you said @ $4.99 per pound. I bought 'Chuck' last week for=20 >>>>>my pot roast - that's where I got confused. >>>>> >>>>>My only problem if I choose to roast this is that I don't own a >>>>> rack yet for my roasting pan (necessary?). I suppose I could=20 >>>>>fabricate one out of carrots... >>>> >>>>You can fabricate a rack of sorts from crumpled aluminum foil...=20 >>>>but eye round being so lean you really don't need a rack. >> >>For roasting, it should be up off the pan. Otherwise, it's frying on >>the hot metal. That results in a tough shell on the bottom. >> >> >>>>Remove any silver skin but leave all the fat, hopefully the >>>>butcher left some. Tie every 2 inches, season with s n' p and >>>>coat lightly with oil. Preheat oven to 375F. Place roast fat >>>>side up on center shelf. Then after 10 minutes lower temperature >>>>to 325F. For med-rare roast 25 minutes per pound. Let stand 15 >>>>minutes and then with a sharp knife slice thin... no thicker than >>>>1/32". Do not over cook. Well done eye round becomes shoe >>>>leather. >> >>The eye of the round is an internal cut with virtually no fat in its >>natural state. In the case of a solid muscle, there's no good reason >>to tie it as butcher's ties are to hold together loose pieces of meat. >>Since there's little internal marbling nd no real fat cap, it will >>profit from added fat. Both barding and larding can help. Larding is >>putting fat *inside* the meat. I do it any of several ways, but an >>easy one is to cut strips of bacon in half both length and widthwise. >>Lay a few of them on plastic wrap on a cookie sheet and freeze them >>hard. Clean your sharpening steel and poke holes all the way through >>the meat about 2" apart from side to side. When the bacon is frozen, >>simply push the sticks of it through the roast. Barding is putting fat >>on the outside. Bacon or fatback or any other fat slices or strips >>will work for this. Drape them over the roast to cover and leave them >>there through the whole cook. When it's done, drain most of the fat >>from the roasting pan and pour in a little wine to deglaze and use >>that for pan gravy, thickened or not. Chop the cooked bacon and add it >>to the gravy. >> >>Cooking to time is absurd. The variables include the starting temp of >>the meat, the accuracy of the oven, the nature of the cooking vessel, >>how many times the door is opened, etc. >> >>For med rare, cook to 125-130=B0 measured in the center, preferably wit= h >>a quick read thermometer. >> >>Almost nobody can cut consistent 1/32" cuts with home equipment. And >>it's a silly and needless suggestion. The meat will be somewhat chewy, >>but hardly worthy of this kind of hyperfastidious treatment. >> >>>If the butcher trimmed it too lean, and ~john doesn't have a=20 >>>larding needle, do you think draping bacon over the top before=20 >>>roasting would help much? >> >>Yep. It sure would. >> >>Pastorio >> > Ohhhh... I like this. Thanks for the info. I never thought of larding= it=20 > before. Do you think I can lard it before searing or should that come = > after.=20 It's part of the prep and should be done before any cooking. > I do a light sear on the roast after seasoning it and using a lot of=20 > garlic. Not enough to crust the spices, just enough to sear in the juic= es,=20 > which there is not much of. The juices stay or leave based on the degree of doneness, not the=20 sear. Searing the surface doesn't keep juices in. Pastorio |
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Dog3 wrote:
> "Bob (this one)" > = om: >=20 >=20 >>zxcvbob wrote: >> >>>PENMART01 wrote: >>> >>> >>>>>Levelwave writes: >>>>> >>>>>PENMART01 wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>This is not really possible... chuck is from the shoulder=20 >>>>>>(fore quarter) and round is from the ass (hind quarter). >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Oops, you're right. It's 'Eye of Round' not 'Chuck' and tubular >>>>> as you said @ $4.99 per pound. I bought 'Chuck' last week for=20 >>>>>my pot roast - that's where I got confused. >>>>> >>>>>My only problem if I choose to roast this is that I don't own a >>>>> rack yet for my roasting pan (necessary?). I suppose I could=20 >>>>>fabricate one out of carrots... >>>> >>>>You can fabricate a rack of sorts from crumpled aluminum foil...=20 >>>>but eye round being so lean you really don't need a rack. >> >>For roasting, it should be up off the pan. Otherwise, it's frying on >>the hot metal. That results in a tough shell on the bottom. >> >> >>>>Remove any silver skin but leave all the fat, hopefully the >>>>butcher left some. Tie every 2 inches, season with s n' p and >>>>coat lightly with oil. Preheat oven to 375F. Place roast fat >>>>side up on center shelf. Then after 10 minutes lower temperature >>>>to 325F. For med-rare roast 25 minutes per pound. Let stand 15 >>>>minutes and then with a sharp knife slice thin... no thicker than >>>>1/32". Do not over cook. Well done eye round becomes shoe >>>>leather. >> >>The eye of the round is an internal cut with virtually no fat in its >>natural state. In the case of a solid muscle, there's no good reason >>to tie it as butcher's ties are to hold together loose pieces of meat. >>Since there's little internal marbling nd no real fat cap, it will >>profit from added fat. Both barding and larding can help. Larding is >>putting fat *inside* the meat. I do it any of several ways, but an >>easy one is to cut strips of bacon in half both length and widthwise. >>Lay a few of them on plastic wrap on a cookie sheet and freeze them >>hard. Clean your sharpening steel and poke holes all the way through >>the meat about 2" apart from side to side. When the bacon is frozen, >>simply push the sticks of it through the roast. Barding is putting fat >>on the outside. Bacon or fatback or any other fat slices or strips >>will work for this. Drape them over the roast to cover and leave them >>there through the whole cook. When it's done, drain most of the fat >>from the roasting pan and pour in a little wine to deglaze and use >>that for pan gravy, thickened or not. Chop the cooked bacon and add it >>to the gravy. >> >>Cooking to time is absurd. The variables include the starting temp of >>the meat, the accuracy of the oven, the nature of the cooking vessel, >>how many times the door is opened, etc. >> >>For med rare, cook to 125-130=B0 measured in the center, preferably wit= h >>a quick read thermometer. >> >>Almost nobody can cut consistent 1/32" cuts with home equipment. And >>it's a silly and needless suggestion. The meat will be somewhat chewy, >>but hardly worthy of this kind of hyperfastidious treatment. >> >>>If the butcher trimmed it too lean, and ~john doesn't have a=20 >>>larding needle, do you think draping bacon over the top before=20 >>>roasting would help much? >> >>Yep. It sure would. >> >>Pastorio >> > Ohhhh... I like this. Thanks for the info. I never thought of larding= it=20 > before. Do you think I can lard it before searing or should that come = > after.=20 It's part of the prep and should be done before any cooking. > I do a light sear on the roast after seasoning it and using a lot of=20 > garlic. Not enough to crust the spices, just enough to sear in the juic= es,=20 > which there is not much of. The juices stay or leave based on the degree of doneness, not the=20 sear. Searing the surface doesn't keep juices in. Pastorio |
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>> If the butcher trimmed it too lean, and ~john doesn't have a larding
>> needle, do you think draping bacon over the top before roasting would >> help much? >> >> Bob I really don't think the flavor of roast beef benefits much from the flavor of bacon... if not enough fat one can always ask the butcher to tie on a fat cap. I usually compliment whatever fat there is by rubbing with vegetable oil. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>> If the butcher trimmed it too lean, and ~john doesn't have a larding
>> needle, do you think draping bacon over the top before roasting would >> help much? >> >> Bob I really don't think the flavor of roast beef benefits much from the flavor of bacon... if not enough fat one can always ask the butcher to tie on a fat cap. I usually compliment whatever fat there is by rubbing with vegetable oil. ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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previously in rfc, "Bob (this one)" > wrote:
> > > Brioschi (Italian, pronounced bree-oh-skee) is the brand that lived on > my grandparents' windowsill. My grandmother was a wonderful person and > one of the lousy cooks of all time. She had her repertoire of winners, > but the losers outnumbered them, unfortunately. It was a sort of > after-dinner drink for my grandfather. I'd say 3 nights out of 7. > > He frowned a lot. ROFL! Sorry. Awww. Poor guy. -Claudia |
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previously in rfc, "Bob (this one)" > wrote:
> > > Brioschi (Italian, pronounced bree-oh-skee) is the brand that lived on > my grandparents' windowsill. My grandmother was a wonderful person and > one of the lousy cooks of all time. She had her repertoire of winners, > but the losers outnumbered them, unfortunately. It was a sort of > after-dinner drink for my grandfather. I'd say 3 nights out of 7. > > He frowned a lot. ROFL! Sorry. Awww. Poor guy. -Claudia |
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Dog3 wrote:
> (PENMART01) > : > >>>>If the butcher trimmed it too lean, and ~john doesn't have a larding >>>>needle, do you think draping bacon over the top before roasting >>>>would help much? >>>> >>>>Bob >> >>I really don't think the flavor of roast beef benefits much from the >>flavor of bacon... if not enough fat one can always ask the butcher to >>tie on a fat cap. I usually compliment whatever fat there is by >>rubbing with vegetable oil. Not too many supermarkets cut meats any more, and those that do aren't very skilled. Hard to get a custom bit like this done. If not bacon, then fatback or salt pork or any other sheet fats will work. Easy to slice thinly and can be used for both barding and larding. Vegetable oil isn't a very good alternative because it heats, thins and runs off. A little bit will stay on the surface and essentially fry it. It will protect the meat slightly from dehydration, but it adds no sense of moistness to the meat, and fats do. For a different approach, an injector can be used to put fats and/or broths in the meats. The fats have to be liquid, and they come out easier than solid fats. But they're certainly a good deal better than none. Broths will add seasoning as well. Pastorio |
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Dog3 wrote:
> (PENMART01) > : > >>>>If the butcher trimmed it too lean, and ~john doesn't have a larding >>>>needle, do you think draping bacon over the top before roasting >>>>would help much? >>>> >>>>Bob >> >>I really don't think the flavor of roast beef benefits much from the >>flavor of bacon... if not enough fat one can always ask the butcher to >>tie on a fat cap. I usually compliment whatever fat there is by >>rubbing with vegetable oil. Not too many supermarkets cut meats any more, and those that do aren't very skilled. Hard to get a custom bit like this done. If not bacon, then fatback or salt pork or any other sheet fats will work. Easy to slice thinly and can be used for both barding and larding. Vegetable oil isn't a very good alternative because it heats, thins and runs off. A little bit will stay on the surface and essentially fry it. It will protect the meat slightly from dehydration, but it adds no sense of moistness to the meat, and fats do. For a different approach, an injector can be used to put fats and/or broths in the meats. The fats have to be liquid, and they come out easier than solid fats. But they're certainly a good deal better than none. Broths will add seasoning as well. Pastorio |
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Bob (this one) wrote:
> The eye of the round is an internal cut with virtually no fat in its > natural state. In the case of a solid muscle, there's no good reason > to tie it as butcher's ties are to hold together loose pieces of meat. I didn't think the twine served any purpose except to complicate the recipe, but I didn't mention it because Sheldon has been reasonable lately, and almost even *nice*. I didn't want to provoke him if he's trying to behave. Best regards, Bob |
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Bob (this one) wrote:
> The eye of the round is an internal cut with virtually no fat in its > natural state. In the case of a solid muscle, there's no good reason > to tie it as butcher's ties are to hold together loose pieces of meat. I didn't think the twine served any purpose except to complicate the recipe, but I didn't mention it because Sheldon has been reasonable lately, and almost even *nice*. I didn't want to provoke him if he's trying to behave. Best regards, Bob |
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>I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have
>never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a >garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? >I'm getting ahead of myself........... > >kili Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be cooked only to medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) won't even begin to melt. With oven roasted beef add a fat cap... it's not that the fat will penetrate (it won't), it's that the blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside the meat.. you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat with oil, but a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save your beef larding for long slow cooking; pot roast. And with pot roast it's a good idea to trim as much external fat as possible, otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the gravy anyway, unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Only a know-nothing, foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent differences between dry roasting and pot roasting. Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have
>never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a >garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? >I'm getting ahead of myself........... > >kili Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be cooked only to medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) won't even begin to melt. With oven roasted beef add a fat cap... it's not that the fat will penetrate (it won't), it's that the blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside the meat.. you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat with oil, but a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save your beef larding for long slow cooking; pot roast. And with pot roast it's a good idea to trim as much external fat as possible, otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the gravy anyway, unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Only a know-nothing, foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent differences between dry roasting and pot roasting. Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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>I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have
>never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a >garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? >I'm getting ahead of myself........... > >kili Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be cooked only to medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) won't even begin to melt. With oven roasted beef add a fat cap... it's not that the fat will penetrate (it won't), it's that the blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside the meat.. you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat with oil, but a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save your beef larding for long slow cooking; pot roast. And with pot roast it's a good idea to trim as much external fat as possible, otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the gravy anyway, unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Only a know-nothing, foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent differences between dry roasting and pot roasting. Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =--- ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =--- ********* "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation." Sheldon ```````````` |
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"PENMART01" > wrote in message ... > >I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have > >never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a > >garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? > >I'm getting ahead of myself........... > > > >kili > > Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be cooked only to > medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) won't even begin to melt. With > oven roasted beef add a fat cap... it's not that the fat will penetrate (it > won't), it's that the blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside > the meat.. you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat with oil, but > a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save your beef larding for long > slow cooking; pot roast. And with pot roast it's a good idea to trim as much > external fat as possible, otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the > gravy anyway, unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Only a know-nothing, > foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent differences between dry > roasting and pot roasting. > > Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare will result in > beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! > > > Okay, I'm just learning about red meat because I never really cared for it much, but am starting to like it finally. Wow, at 36 I'm finally liking beef! When I was growing up, my dad, the die-hard grillmaster that he is, always grilled steak on sundays, 36 below zero and all. I would sit at the table and refuse to eat it for hours and hours. Why? I just didn't like it! So a few years back I *had* to eat beef at a friend's house and I discovered that it wasn't all that bad. Now I'm going through the process of learning what kind of cuts are what and how you should prepare them. I'm such a newbie when it comes to beef. I know absolutely NOTHING. So this thread has been helpful to me. One thing I do know, if I eat a burger it better be raw on the inside and seared on the outside or I *still* don't like it. Oh, and I do prefer veggie spaghetti and lasagna....sorry. kili (Who's going to try her first brisket at Dave Bugg's BBQ Joint opening in Wenatchee on October 16th.) |
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"PENMART01" > wrote in message ... > >I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I would have > >never thought of it either. You could go one step farther and stuff a > >garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. Maybe a sprig of rosemary? > >I'm getting ahead of myself........... > > > >kili > > Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be cooked only to > medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) won't even begin to melt. With > oven roasted beef add a fat cap... it's not that the fat will penetrate (it > won't), it's that the blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside > the meat.. you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat with oil, but > a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save your beef larding for long > slow cooking; pot roast. And with pot roast it's a good idea to trim as much > external fat as possible, otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the > gravy anyway, unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Only a know-nothing, > foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent differences between dry > roasting and pot roasting. > > Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare will result in > beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! > > > Okay, I'm just learning about red meat because I never really cared for it much, but am starting to like it finally. Wow, at 36 I'm finally liking beef! When I was growing up, my dad, the die-hard grillmaster that he is, always grilled steak on sundays, 36 below zero and all. I would sit at the table and refuse to eat it for hours and hours. Why? I just didn't like it! So a few years back I *had* to eat beef at a friend's house and I discovered that it wasn't all that bad. Now I'm going through the process of learning what kind of cuts are what and how you should prepare them. I'm such a newbie when it comes to beef. I know absolutely NOTHING. So this thread has been helpful to me. One thing I do know, if I eat a burger it better be raw on the inside and seared on the outside or I *still* don't like it. Oh, and I do prefer veggie spaghetti and lasagna....sorry. kili (Who's going to try her first brisket at Dave Bugg's BBQ Joint opening in Wenatchee on October 16th.) |
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Dog3 wrote:
> ROFL... Well, I've got pneumonia again and I don't need the Magnesium > stuff. The Mexican was the first real meal I've had all week. I've been > living on Ensure except for the stuffed green peppers which went through > quickly enough. Apparently my immune system is still low. I have to go in > if I so much as have a sneeze. I have some of the best physicians in the > Midwest but I think they're my mother sometimes. Clucking around. I have > to take this Z pack. It's 7 pills, one pill a day. Health wise, what exactly IS wrong with you? I've always wondered... ~john |
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Dog3 wrote:
> ROFL... Well, I've got pneumonia again and I don't need the Magnesium > stuff. The Mexican was the first real meal I've had all week. I've been > living on Ensure except for the stuffed green peppers which went through > quickly enough. Apparently my immune system is still low. I have to go in > if I so much as have a sneeze. I have some of the best physicians in the > Midwest but I think they're my mother sometimes. Clucking around. I have > to take this Z pack. It's 7 pills, one pill a day. Health wise, what exactly IS wrong with you? I've always wondered... ~john |
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Dog3 wrote:
> Damned. This is one of the best threads I've read. So many ideas. Thanks, even though I didn't offer any - well... advice. ~john |
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Dog3 wrote:
> Damned. This is one of the best threads I've read. So many ideas. Thanks, even though I didn't offer any - well... advice. ~john |
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Katra wrote:
> It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying out > during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru the stab > holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork this way. You cover the roast with Cabbage? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of roasting, kinda like sticking a pan of water in the oven? ~john |
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Katra wrote:
> It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying out > during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru the stab > holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork this way. You cover the roast with Cabbage? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of roasting, kinda like sticking a pan of water in the oven? ~john |
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In article >,
Levelwave(C) > wrote: > Katra wrote: > > > It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of > > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying out > > during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru the stab > > holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork this way. > > > You cover the roast with Cabbage? Wouldn't that defeat the purpose of > roasting, kinda like sticking a pan of water in the oven? > > ~john No....... it still works out. You just put the cabbage leaves over the top of the herbs on top of the roast. It keeps the HERBS damp! If you want to crisp the top of the roast, remove them towards the end along with the cap of fresh herbs. I was more interested in the flavor. The one time I tried just topping with fresh herbs alone, they all dried out and did not soak much herbal flavor into the roast. Keeping them damp with Bok Choy leaves worked great for both pork and beef. K. -- Sprout the MungBean to reply "One man's god is another man's devil (and vice versa) as far as I'm concerned." --Delta Nine |
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Katra wrote:
> In article >,=20 > (PENMART01) wrote: >=20 >>> I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I >>> would have never thought of it either. You could go one step >>> farther and stuff a garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. >>> Maybe a sprig of rosemary? I'm getting ahead of >>> myself........... >>>=20 >>> kili >>=20 >> Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be >> cooked only to medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) >> won't even begin to melt. Sure it will. Medium is in the 140=B0-145=B0 range and fat softens and=20 melts well below 140=B0 or it wouldn't show up in the pans on buffet line= s. >> With oven roasted beef add a fat cap... >> it's not that the fat will penetrate (it won't), it's that the >> blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside the >> meat.. Get real. It protects the meat from direct heat and retards=20 evaporation. It doesn't "help hold the natural moisture inside the meat."= >> you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat >> with oil, but a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save >> your beef larding for long slow cooking; pot roast.=20 Read a book that isn't a Navy Mess Cookbook, Zippy. Barding and=20 larding are standard techniques in dry-cooked roasts and have been for=20 literally thousands of years. Rubbing oil on the outside will be a temporary thing. The oil will be=20 washed off by the juices flowing out of the meat and, further, because=20 heat will reduce the viscosity of the oil so it can flow more readily. Pot roasts (technically "braises") are traditionally larded,=20 particularly if they're the low-quality, extremely lean cuts and need=20 help being moist. But low-fat cuts that are roasted hot are also=20 larded - like hare and filet mignon. >> And with pot >> roast it's a good idea to trim as much external fat as possible, >> otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the gravy anyway, >> unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Trim *some* of the fat. You'll want some left in to use as the basis=20 for a pot liquor gravy. The basis of a roux to thicken it. >> Only a know-nothing,=20 >> foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent >> differences between dry roasting and pot roasting. Non sequitur. >> Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare >> will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! Like all those legs of lamb that are cooked to red centers, right,=20 bonehead? >> Sheldon >=20 > No... actually it does not, not if you sliver the garlic. Just > don't use whole cloves. Slice the cloves thin and shove the thin=20 > slivers into knife stabs. Just don't go too deep into the meat. Slivers are better for the application for another reason as well. The=20 cut surfaces release juices that flavor the meat a lot better than the=20 whole clove with surface membranes still intact. > It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of=20 > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying > out during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru > the stab holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork > this way. Lamb particularly benefits from this approach. I generally use caul=20 fat as the cover for the herbs. It's thin and light and it permits the=20 herbs to be heated but not scorched. > The cabbage leaves dry out slowly, but the moisture they provide > keeps the herbs wet enough, long enough, to lend their flavor to > the meat. I used rosemary, basil, thyme and just a small bit of > dittany. For those folks who can't easily get dittany - fraxinella - a bit of=20 mint or marjoram will (sorta) approximate the flavor. Pastorio |
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Katra wrote:
> In article >,=20 > (PENMART01) wrote: >=20 >>> I'm not a big meat eater, but larding it sounds wonderful! I >>> would have never thought of it either. You could go one step >>> farther and stuff a garlic clove into the hole as well. Yummy. >>> Maybe a sprig of rosemary? I'm getting ahead of >>> myself........... >>>=20 >>> kili >>=20 >> Um, larding is a waste of time with a beef roast that will be >> cooked only to medium.... at medium the larding fat (internal) >> won't even begin to melt. Sure it will. Medium is in the 140=B0-145=B0 range and fat softens and=20 melts well below 140=B0 or it wouldn't show up in the pans on buffet line= s. >> With oven roasted beef add a fat cap... >> it's not that the fat will penetrate (it won't), it's that the >> blanket of fat will help hold the natural moisture inside the >> meat.. Get real. It protects the meat from direct heat and retards=20 evaporation. It doesn't "help hold the natural moisture inside the meat."= >> you can achieve a similar result by massaging the meat >> with oil, but a fat cap is so much better, in fact do both. Save >> your beef larding for long slow cooking; pot roast.=20 Read a book that isn't a Navy Mess Cookbook, Zippy. Barding and=20 larding are standard techniques in dry-cooked roasts and have been for=20 literally thousands of years. Rubbing oil on the outside will be a temporary thing. The oil will be=20 washed off by the juices flowing out of the meat and, further, because=20 heat will reduce the viscosity of the oil so it can flow more readily. Pot roasts (technically "braises") are traditionally larded,=20 particularly if they're the low-quality, extremely lean cuts and need=20 help being moist. But low-fat cuts that are roasted hot are also=20 larded - like hare and filet mignon. >> And with pot >> roast it's a good idea to trim as much external fat as possible, >> otherwise that fat will need to be skimmed from the gravy anyway, >> unless you like sucking down greazy goo. Trim *some* of the fat. You'll want some left in to use as the basis=20 for a pot liquor gravy. The basis of a roux to thicken it. >> Only a know-nothing,=20 >> foodtv addict, kitchen fraud doesn't know the inherent >> differences between dry roasting and pot roasting. Non sequitur. >> Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare >> will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! Like all those legs of lamb that are cooked to red centers, right,=20 bonehead? >> Sheldon >=20 > No... actually it does not, not if you sliver the garlic. Just > don't use whole cloves. Slice the cloves thin and shove the thin=20 > slivers into knife stabs. Just don't go too deep into the meat. Slivers are better for the application for another reason as well. The=20 cut surfaces release juices that flavor the meat a lot better than the=20 whole clove with surface membranes still intact. > It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of=20 > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying > out during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru > the stab holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork > this way. Lamb particularly benefits from this approach. I generally use caul=20 fat as the cover for the herbs. It's thin and light and it permits the=20 herbs to be heated but not scorched. > The cabbage leaves dry out slowly, but the moisture they provide > keeps the herbs wet enough, long enough, to lend their flavor to > the meat. I used rosemary, basil, thyme and just a small bit of > dittany. For those folks who can't easily get dittany - fraxinella - a bit of=20 mint or marjoram will (sorta) approximate the flavor. Pastorio |
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In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote: > Katra wrote: > > > In article >, > > (PENMART01) wrote: > > > >> Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare > >> will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! > > Like all those legs of lamb that are cooked to red centers, right, > bonehead? > > >> Sheldon > > > > No... actually it does not, not if you sliver the garlic. Just > > don't use whole cloves. Slice the cloves thin and shove the thin > > slivers into knife stabs. Just don't go too deep into the meat. > > Slivers are better for the application for another reason as well. The > cut surfaces release juices that flavor the meat a lot better than the > whole clove with surface membranes still intact. Seems to. :-) Easier to work with as well.... > > > It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of > > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying > > out during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru > > the stab holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork > > this way. > > Lamb particularly benefits from this approach. I generally use caul > fat as the cover for the herbs. It's thin and light and it permits the > herbs to be heated but not scorched. I'll have to try that. I s'pose I could get fat slices from the local butcher? Or I could trim them off of a brisket! Heaven knows that Brisket has thick enough fat on it if you get it untrimmed. <lol> > > > The cabbage leaves dry out slowly, but the moisture they provide > > keeps the herbs wet enough, long enough, to lend their flavor to > > the meat. I used rosemary, basil, thyme and just a small bit of > > dittany. > > For those folks who can't easily get dittany - fraxinella - a bit of > mint or marjoram will (sorta) approximate the flavor. Or just good old Italian Oregano, but I find Dittany to be a bit lighter. I've been lucky, the dittany patch in the herb garden is now about 3 years old! I've also dried it for incense. Cunninghams herbal has some interesting uses for Dittany. ;-) I just got a lovely Mexican Oregano going this year! They get huge and bloom profusely all year, and have a totally unique flavor/scent. I'm considering just trying the blossoms on my next roast. They are a bit lighter in flavor than the leaves. Danke! K. > > Pastorio > -- Sprout the MungBean to reply "One man's god is another man's devil (and vice versa) as far as I'm concerned." --Delta Nine |
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In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote: > Katra wrote: > > > In article >, > > (PENMART01) wrote: > > > >> Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare > >> will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! > > Like all those legs of lamb that are cooked to red centers, right, > bonehead? > > >> Sheldon > > > > No... actually it does not, not if you sliver the garlic. Just > > don't use whole cloves. Slice the cloves thin and shove the thin > > slivers into knife stabs. Just don't go too deep into the meat. > > Slivers are better for the application for another reason as well. The > cut surfaces release juices that flavor the meat a lot better than the > whole clove with surface membranes still intact. Seems to. :-) Easier to work with as well.... > > > It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of > > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying > > out during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru > > the stab holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork > > this way. > > Lamb particularly benefits from this approach. I generally use caul > fat as the cover for the herbs. It's thin and light and it permits the > herbs to be heated but not scorched. I'll have to try that. I s'pose I could get fat slices from the local butcher? Or I could trim them off of a brisket! Heaven knows that Brisket has thick enough fat on it if you get it untrimmed. <lol> > > > The cabbage leaves dry out slowly, but the moisture they provide > > keeps the herbs wet enough, long enough, to lend their flavor to > > the meat. I used rosemary, basil, thyme and just a small bit of > > dittany. > > For those folks who can't easily get dittany - fraxinella - a bit of > mint or marjoram will (sorta) approximate the flavor. Or just good old Italian Oregano, but I find Dittany to be a bit lighter. I've been lucky, the dittany patch in the herb garden is now about 3 years old! I've also dried it for incense. Cunninghams herbal has some interesting uses for Dittany. ;-) I just got a lovely Mexican Oregano going this year! They get huge and bloom profusely all year, and have a totally unique flavor/scent. I'm considering just trying the blossoms on my next roast. They are a bit lighter in flavor than the leaves. Danke! K. > > Pastorio > -- Sprout the MungBean to reply "One man's god is another man's devil (and vice versa) as far as I'm concerned." --Delta Nine |
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In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote: > Katra wrote: > > > In article >, > > (PENMART01) wrote: > > > >> Btw, stuffing garlic into beef roast that will be medium rare > >> will result in beef roast containing *raw* garlic. DUH! > > Like all those legs of lamb that are cooked to red centers, right, > bonehead? > > >> Sheldon > > > > No... actually it does not, not if you sliver the garlic. Just > > don't use whole cloves. Slice the cloves thin and shove the thin > > slivers into knife stabs. Just don't go too deep into the meat. > > Slivers are better for the application for another reason as well. The > cut surfaces release juices that flavor the meat a lot better than the > whole clove with surface membranes still intact. Seems to. :-) Easier to work with as well.... > > > It's delicious. ;-) I also top with fresh herbs then lay slabs of > > Cabbage or bok choy over the fresh herbs to keep them from drying > > out during roasting. The wet herb flavor penetrates the meat thru > > the stab holes you made for the garlic slivers. I've also done pork > > this way. > > Lamb particularly benefits from this approach. I generally use caul > fat as the cover for the herbs. It's thin and light and it permits the > herbs to be heated but not scorched. I'll have to try that. I s'pose I could get fat slices from the local butcher? Or I could trim them off of a brisket! Heaven knows that Brisket has thick enough fat on it if you get it untrimmed. <lol> > > > The cabbage leaves dry out slowly, but the moisture they provide > > keeps the herbs wet enough, long enough, to lend their flavor to > > the meat. I used rosemary, basil, thyme and just a small bit of > > dittany. > > For those folks who can't easily get dittany - fraxinella - a bit of > mint or marjoram will (sorta) approximate the flavor. Or just good old Italian Oregano, but I find Dittany to be a bit lighter. I've been lucky, the dittany patch in the herb garden is now about 3 years old! I've also dried it for incense. Cunninghams herbal has some interesting uses for Dittany. ;-) I just got a lovely Mexican Oregano going this year! They get huge and bloom profusely all year, and have a totally unique flavor/scent. I'm considering just trying the blossoms on my next roast. They are a bit lighter in flavor than the leaves. Danke! K. > > Pastorio > -- Sprout the MungBean to reply "One man's god is another man's devil (and vice versa) as far as I'm concerned." --Delta Nine |
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Katra wrote: > I'll have to try that. I s'pose I could get fat slices from the local > butcher? Or I could trim them off of a brisket! Heaven knows that > Brisket has thick enough fat on it if you get it untrimmed. <lol> > Yup...I too prefer my...uh...*brisket* untrimmed - there's more to get yer mouth around ;-p -- Best Greg |
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In article . net>,
"Gregory Morrow" > wrote: > Katra wrote: > > > I'll have to try that. I s'pose I could get fat slices from the local > > butcher? Or I could trim them off of a brisket! Heaven knows that > > Brisket has thick enough fat on it if you get it untrimmed. <lol> > > > > > Yup...I too prefer my...uh...*brisket* untrimmed - there's more to get yer > mouth around ;-p And the fat keeps it more moist during the grilling process... ;-d K. -- Sprout the MungBean to reply "One man's god is another man's devil (and vice versa) as far as I'm concerned." --Delta Nine |
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So I take it traditional Roast Beef is the only thing this cut of meat
is good for... ~john |
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So I take it traditional Roast Beef is the only thing this cut of meat
is good for... ~john |
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Levelwave© wrote:
> > So I take it traditional Roast Beef is the only thing this cut of meat > is good for... Sounds right to me, that's why I don't buy it. Once I did, and I roasted it to rare and toasted some rye bread and got some store bought roast beef gravy and made nice open faced sandwiches. They were quite good. However, I am not fond of lean cuts of beef in general. nancy |
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