On Sep 20, 1:22*pm, ChattyCathy > wrote:
> On Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:18:42 -0400, blake murphy wrote:
> > the republic of south africa has always been a little, um, different.
>
> That may well be, but so has the USA been a little, um, different.
> Citizens of the USA claim to speak "English" but they spell certain words
> differently; FFS it's "aluminium" not "aluminum".
>
> Of course the fact that many citizens in the USA also think that
> civilization stops at the USA's borders and therefore have never bothered
> to apply for a passport goes quite a way towards explaining that attitude..

And others of us just do not enjoy travel. If I could teleport, I'd
travel.
Wake up at home; teleport to some fascinating destination;
teleport home to sleep in my own bed.

Cindy Hamilton

On Sep 22, 3:15*pm, Cindy Hamilton >
wrote:
> On Sep 20, 1:22*pm, ChattyCathy > wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:18:42 -0400, blake murphy wrote:
> > > the republic of south africa has always been a little, um, different.
>
> > That may well be, but so has the USA been a little, um, different.
> > Citizens of the USA claim to speak "English" but they spell certain words
> > differently; FFS it's "aluminium" not "aluminum".
>
> > Of course the fact that many citizens in the USA also think that
> > civilization stops at the USA's borders and therefore have never bothered
> > to apply for a passport goes quite a way towards explaining that attitude.
>
> And others of us just do not enjoy travel. *If I could teleport, I'd
> travel.
> Wake up at home; teleport to some fascinating destination;
> teleport home to sleep in my own bed.
>
> Cindy Hamilton


Sounds perfect to me - I quit flying with the advent of the "come to
the airport 2 hours early" security lines. I don't miss it. When
teleporting is available, Cindy, just let me know, 'kay? LOL.

N.

In article >,
ChattyCathy > wrote:

> J. Clarke wrote:

> > Uh, why does a lack of desire to spend 110 dollars on a piece of paper
> > that is likely to expire before one uses it indicative of a belief
> > that "civilization stops at the USA's borders"?
>
It's not a piece of paper, IT'S A WHOLE BOOK!!!

:-)

> 110 *US* dollars?
>
> Heh. The cost of getting a passport in South Africa is the equivalent of
> USD27.00 - and it's valid for 10 years from date of issue. So I'd say
> you're either getting ripped off or exaggerating somewhat.

Here's the info:

http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html

If I understand it correctly, it's US$165 for the whole works, good for
ten years.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

Nancy2 > wrote in news:030594b3-422c-4e62-9512-
:

> On Sep 21, 4:00*pm, Aussie >
> wrote:
>> Nancy2 > wrote in news:ede60c45-1030-4b17-b2da-
>> :
>>
>>
>>
>> > It's very expensive for some people to travel outside the US - it's
>> > not exactly the small size of many European countries or even the
>> > British Isles. *It's not realistic to expect USA citizens to apply fo
> r
>> > a passport, just for the sake of having one. *
>>
>> Strange. I carry my passport with me wherever I go, and have done so
sinc
> e
>> the mid 80's. You just never know when one might get the urge to jump
on
> a
>> plane and take off somewhere :-)
>>
>> > It's not like someone on
>> > one coast can just hop,skip and jump over to the other coast to
depart
>> > for foreign parts on a whim. *If I lived in England and could chunnel
>> > to France, and then take a train to Switzerland, Italy, Spain or
other
>> > parts -
>>
>> Visiting most of those countries doesn't require a passport (if you're
a
>> Pom), although they do recommend that you carry one..... passport, that
i
> s.
>>
>> Living on an Island (Australia) most Aussies have passports.
>>
>> > not at all the same as traveling from the US to a European
>> > jumping-off point. *If you know what I mean. *I envy Europeans beca
> use
>> > other cultures are so (relatively) close. *Whereas, here, they are
>> > not
>>
>> You have Mexico, and South America........ Oh!! And not to forget
Canadia
> !!

>
> I'm mid-country - nothing foreign is "close."


I thought your internal flights were as cheep as chips??

$99 to go anywhere internal USA?? (Or is that just a special deal they
give to us Aussies to travel more over there?)


>
> As for passports, they are an expense to get and keep up - for a lot
> of us, for no reason at all, other than some cache that might be
> attached to having one....a driver's license works just as well for
> identification. I had a passport when I was married and we traveled
> regularly; but there's no point for me to have one now, just to have
> one. Most people don't just decide on a whim to suddenly take a
> foreign trip, at least people I know and know of.



Well, we're having a bit of a 'problem' with our drivers licences over
here..... seems they are the easiest in the world to copy/ID steal etc,
and new ones are on the way.

A lot of places here will ask for up to 4 items of ID in some cases when
you go to apply for something. A passport gets you maximum points in any
ID check.


--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania

The act of feeding someone is an act of beauty,
whether it's a full Sunday roast or a jam sandwich,
but only when done with love.

"J. Clarke" > wrote in
:

> On 9/21/2010 5:00 PM, Aussie wrote:
>> > wrote in news:ede60c45-1030-4b17-b2da-
>> :
>>
>>
>>>
>>> It's very expensive for some people to travel outside the US - it's
>>> not exactly the small size of many European countries or even the
>>> British Isles. It's not realistic to expect USA citizens to apply for
>>> a passport, just for the sake of having one.
>>
>>
>> Strange. I carry my passport with me wherever I go, and have done so
>> since the mid 80's. You just never know when one might get the urge to
>> jump on a plane and take off somewhere :-)
>
> Must be nice to be that kind of rich.



Don't have to be rich!! A plane ride to the US is around $900 depending on
who you fly with.

Bali, you can get a deal for under $1K for flights and accomodation.

I can even go to Canadia for $1,200.......


http://www.flightcentre.com.au/


Here in Oz, sometimes it's cheaper to fly o/s, than it is to fly
internally.



>> You have Mexico, and South America........ Oh!! And not to forget
>> Canadia!!
>
> Google "Darien Gap". From a transportation viewpoint, anywhere in South
> America is as far from the US as London.


No way in the frikken world would I drive down there!!!!


http://nakedmaninthetree.wordpress.c...he-darien-gap/


I do remember flights from LAX down to Cabo and Cancun were relatively
cheap when I was over there.


--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania

The act of feeding someone is an act of beauty,
whether it's a full Sunday roast or a jam sandwich,
but only when done with love.

Cindy wrote:

> And others of us just do not enjoy travel. If I could teleport, I'd
> travel. Wake up at home; teleport to some fascinating destination;
> teleport home to sleep in my own bed.

I don't enjoy *air* travel. Trains, cars, or ships are much more enjoyable.

Bob

Captain Peter Swallows revealed:

> Well, we're having a bit of a 'problem' with our drivers licences over
> here..... seems they are the easiest in the world to copy/ID steal etc,
> and new ones are on the way.
>
> A lot of places here will ask for up to 4 items of ID in some cases when
> you go to apply for something. A passport gets you maximum points in any
> ID check.

Sounds like fraud is rampant. No wonder you haven't been caught yet!

Bob

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:33:34 +0200, ChattyCathy
> wrote:

>I'm not denying that English is a difficult language to learn to spell
>(and often pronounce) if it's not one's "home language" However, the
>fact that words such as "neighbour" and "labour" are spelled
>as "neighbor" and "labor" in American English doesn't improve matters
>much, IMO. I enjoy eating doughnuts and a lot of Americans enjoy eating
>doughnuts too - but some Americans prefer eating "donuts". Surely it
>wouldn't do any harm to standardise/standardize the spelling of the
>aforementioned words?

Maybe you guys could start by leaving unnecessary letters out of
words.


--
I love cooking with wine.
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:12:08 -0700, "Steve B"
> wrote:

>
>This isn't your Mother's Army. Just because someone slams it on my platter,
>I DO NOT have to eat it.

We were talking about a restaurant.

--
I love cooking with wine.
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

"Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
...
> On Sep 20, 1:22 pm, ChattyCathy > wrote:
>> On Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:18:42 -0400, blake murphy wrote:
>> > the republic of south africa has always been a little, um, different.
>>
>> That may well be, but so has the USA been a little, um, different.
>> Citizens of the USA claim to speak "English" but they spell certain words
>> differently; FFS it's "aluminium" not "aluminum".
>>
>> Of course the fact that many citizens in the USA also think that
>> civilization stops at the USA's borders and therefore have never bothered
>> to apply for a passport goes quite a way towards explaining that
>> attitude.
>
> And others of us just do not enjoy travel. If I could teleport, I'd
> travel.
> Wake up at home; teleport to some fascinating destination;
> teleport home to sleep in my own bed.

Heh! If only I'm done with long haul flights...even fairly short haul
these days.
--
--
https://www.shop.helpforheroes.org.uk/

On Sep 22, 8:18*pm, Aussie >
wrote:

> > I'm mid-country - nothing foreign is "close."
>
> I thought your internal flights were as cheep as chips??
>
> $99 to go anywhere internal USA?? (Or is that just a special deal they
> give to us Aussies to travel more over there?)

I'm in mid-country, too. I just went to delta.com to see what it
would cost to fly to Los Angeles, stay a week, and come home,
planning a month ahead. The fare was at least $288. (Additional
baggage charges may apply, they said. I imagine if I stayed
a week, I'd be hit up for extra baggage.) Las Vegas, even
though it's closer, costs $317.

New York to LA is $278. Apparently airline pricing is not
rational.

I might be able to save some money by using a different
airline or airport, but for this exercise, that's enough data.

When I rule the world, they're going to have to figure out
how much it costs per passenger-mile, and base their
fares on that.

Cindy Hamilton

Cindy Hamilton > wrote in news:0fabed45-2006-
:

> On Sep 22, 8:18*pm, Aussie >
> wrote:
>
>> > I'm mid-country - nothing foreign is "close."
>>
>> I thought your internal flights were as cheep as chips??
>>
>> $99 to go anywhere internal USA?? (Or is that just a special deal they
>> give to us Aussies to travel more over there?)
>
> I'm in mid-country, too. I just went to delta.com to see what it
> would cost to fly to Los Angeles, stay a week, and come home,
> planning a month ahead. The fare was at least $288. (Additional
> baggage charges may apply, they said. I imagine if I stayed
> a week, I'd be hit up for extra baggage.) Las Vegas, even
> though it's closer, costs $317.


Baggage charges...... if you want rip-off baggage charges, fly Air Asia,
they have the rip off down to a fine art :-/


>
> New York to LA is $278. Apparently airline pricing is not
> rational.
>
> I might be able to save some money by using a different
> airline or airport, but for this exercise, that's enough data.
>
> When I rule the world, they're going to have to figure out
> how much it costs per passenger-mile, and base their
> fares on that.
>


I remember awhile back, there was a story going around that airlines were
thinking of charging passengers per kg of body weight..... plus whatever
baggage they took on.

Which I think sounds pretty fair.




--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania

The act of feeding someone is an act of beauty,
whether it's a full Sunday roast or a jam sandwich,
but only when done with love.

sf wrote:

> On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:33:34 +0200, ChattyCathy
> > wrote:
>
>>I'm not denying that English is a difficult language to learn to spell
>>(and often pronounce) if it's not one's "home language" However, the
>>fact that words such as "neighbour" and "labour" are spelled
>>as "neighbor" and "labor" in American English doesn't improve matters
>>much, IMO. I enjoy eating doughnuts and a lot of Americans enjoy
>>eating doughnuts too - but some Americans prefer eating "donuts".
>>Surely it wouldn't do any harm to standardise/standardize the spelling
>>of the aforementioned words?
>
> Maybe you guys could start by leaving unnecessary letters out of
> words.
>
>
<Cathy thwaps sf with a wet noodle>

Hey, we like those letters right where they are ;-)
--
Cheers
Chatty Cathy

On 9/22/2010 3:50 PM, ChattyCathy wrote:
> J. Clarke wrote:
>
>> On 9/20/2010 1:22 PM, ChattyCathy wrote:
>>> On Mon, 20 Sep 2010 12:18:42 -0400, blake murphy wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> the republic of south africa has always been a little, um,
>>>> different.
>>>
>>> That may well be, but so has the USA been a little, um, different.
>>> Citizens of the USA claim to speak "English" but they spell certain
>>> words differently; FFS it's "aluminium" not "aluminum".
>>
>> Standing outside the theater after "District 9" listening to the
>> viewers attempt to place Wikus' accent was a riot.
>
> Ah, "District 9"... BTW, are you any relation to the "Julian Clarke" who
> edited that piece of crap, um, I mean SF masterpiece?
>
>>
>>> Of course the fact that many citizens in the USA also think that
>>> civilization stops at the USA's borders and therefore have never
>>> bothered to apply for a passport goes quite a way towards explaining
>>> that attitude.
>>
>> Uh, why does a lack of desire to spend 110 dollars on a piece of paper
>> that is likely to expire before one uses it indicative of a belief
>> that "civilization stops at the USA's borders"?
>
>
> 110 *US* dollars?
>
> Heh. The cost of getting a passport in South Africa is the equivalent of
> USD27.00 - and it's valid for 10 years from date of issue. So I'd say
> you're either getting ripped off or exaggerating somewhat.

Not exaggerating at all.
<http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html>. And it's
actually $135. I forgot about the execution fee. And there's another
10 bucks or so to get a picture taken. So it's more than $140 all up.

Note that the $30 "passport card" listed on that site is good _only_ for
travel to and from Canada and Mexico by road, rail, or foot--it's not
good for air travel or for going anywhere other than Mexico or Canada.

>> Remember that until recently no passport was needed for Canada or
>> Mexico,
>
> Might be applicable if I lived in the USA, but I don't.

The point is that to go to the most common non-US destinations to which
American citizens travel, no passport was needed, so why have one?

>> and anywhere else one goes, if one is going to get discounted
>> fares one must book far enough in advance that there's plenty of time
>> to get a passport.
>
> If you say so.

Check the lead times for discounted air fares and the lead times for
passports and tell me I'm wrong.
>

On 9/22/2010 5:48 PM, Dan Abel wrote:
> In >,
> > wrote:
>
>> J. Clarke wrote:
>
>>> Uh, why does a lack of desire to spend 110 dollars on a piece of paper
>>> that is likely to expire before one uses it indicative of a belief
>>> that "civilization stops at the USA's borders"?
>>
> It's not a piece of paper, IT'S A WHOLE BOOK!!!
>
> :-)
>
>> 110 *US* dollars?
>>
>> Heh. The cost of getting a passport in South Africa is the equivalent of
>> USD27.00 - and it's valid for 10 years from date of issue. So I'd say
>> you're either getting ripped off or exaggerating somewhat.
>
> Here's the info:
>
> http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html
>
> If I understand it correctly, it's US$165 for the whole works, good for
> ten years.

That gets you book and card. You don't really _need_ the card for
anything--it's just a convenience for people who live in border towns.
You can save 30 bucks by not getting the card.

Dan Abel wrote:

> In article >,
> ChattyCathy > wrote:
>
>> J. Clarke wrote:
>
>> > Uh, why does a lack of desire to spend 110 dollars on a piece of
>> > paper that is likely to expire before one uses it indicative of a
>> > belief that "civilization stops at the USA's borders"?
>>
> It's not a piece of paper, IT'S A WHOLE BOOK!!!
>
> :-)
>
>> 110 *US* dollars?
>>
>> Heh. The cost of getting a passport in South Africa is the equivalent
>> of USD27.00 - and it's valid for 10 years from date of issue. So I'd
>> say you're either getting ripped off or exaggerating somewhat.
>
> Here's the info:
>
> http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html
>
> If I understand it correctly, it's US$165 for the whole works, good
> for ten years.
>
That's much pricier than what we pay here - but on reflection, that's
only $16.50 per year. Some people spend (almost) that per month to
access Usenet, so I don't think it would exactly break the bank - and
at least if an urgent need arose to have a passport (death of a family
member elsewhere in the world, for example), one wouldn't have the
hassle (and extra expense) of applying for an emergency travel
document/passport.
--
Cheers
Chatty Cathy

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 00:29:13 GMT, Aussie
> wrote:

>"J. Clarke" > wrote in
:
>
>> On 9/21/2010 5:00 PM, Aussie wrote:
>>> > wrote in news:ede60c45-1030-4b17-b2da-
>>> :
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> It's very expensive for some people to travel outside the US - it's
>>>> not exactly the small size of many European countries or even the
>>>> British Isles. It's not realistic to expect USA citizens to apply for
>>>> a passport, just for the sake of having one.
>>>
>>>
>>> Strange. I carry my passport with me wherever I go, and have done so
>>> since the mid 80's. You just never know when one might get the urge to
>>> jump on a plane and take off somewhere :-)
>>
>> Must be nice to be that kind of rich.
>
>
>
>Don't have to be rich!!

Didn't say "rich"... said "that kind of rich"... huge distinction.

> A plane ride to the US is around $900.

Many folks don't have THAT KIND of disposable income... a $900 plane
ride might mean the family doesn't eat for 2-3-4 months.

Personally I could well afford it, but I wouldn't spend $900 to fly to
Australia, in fact I wouldn't fly to Australia if you bought my
ticket.

On 9/22/2010 8:18 PM, Aussie wrote:
> > wrote in news:030594b3-422c-4e62-9512-
> :
>
>> On Sep 21, 4:00 pm, >
>> wrote:
>>> > wrote in news:ede60c45-1030-4b17-b2da-
>>> :
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> It's very expensive for some people to travel outside the US - it's
>>>> not exactly the small size of many European countries or even the
>>>> British Isles. It's not realistic to expect USA citizens to apply fo
>> r
>>>> a passport, just for the sake of having one.
>>>
>>> Strange. I carry my passport with me wherever I go, and have done so
> sinc
>> e
>>> the mid 80's. You just never know when one might get the urge to jump
> on
>> a
>>> plane and take off somewhere :-)
>>>
>>>> It's not like someone on
>>>> one coast can just hop,skip and jump over to the other coast to
> depart
>>>> for foreign parts on a whim. If I lived in England and could chunnel
>>>> to France, and then take a train to Switzerland, Italy, Spain or
> other
>>>> parts -
>>>
>>> Visiting most of those countries doesn't require a passport (if you're
> a
>>> Pom), although they do recommend that you carry one..... passport, that
> i
>> s.
>>>
>>> Living on an Island (Australia) most Aussies have passports.
>>>
>>>> not at all the same as traveling from the US to a European
>>>> jumping-off point. If you know what I mean. I envy Europeans beca
>> use
>>>> other cultures are so (relatively) close. Whereas, here, they are
>>>> not
>>>
>>> You have Mexico, and South America........ Oh!! And not to forget
> Canadia
>> !!
>
>>
>> I'm mid-country - nothing foreign is "close."
>
>
> I thought your internal flights were as cheep as chips??
>
> $99 to go anywhere internal USA?? (Or is that just a special deal they
> give to us Aussies to travel more over there?)

Nope. There are heavy discounts available on specific routes by
discounted airlines, but for general travel no. For example I can go
from Boston to Las Vegas for 90 bucks, but not from Hartford to Atlanta.

>> As for passports, they are an expense to get and keep up - for a lot
>> of us, for no reason at all, other than some cache that might be
>> attached to having one....a driver's license works just as well for
>> identification. I had a passport when I was married and we traveled
>> regularly; but there's no point for me to have one now, just to have
>> one. Most people don't just decide on a whim to suddenly take a
>> foreign trip, at least people I know and know of.
>
>
>
> Well, we're having a bit of a 'problem' with our drivers licences over
> here..... seems they are the easiest in the world to copy/ID steal etc,
> and new ones are on the way.
>
> A lot of places here will ask for up to 4 items of ID in some cases when
> you go to apply for something. A passport gets you maximum points in any
> ID check.

In the US a CCW does that.

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 20:38:19 -0700, sf > wrote:

>On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:12:08 -0700, "Steve B"
> wrote:
>
>>
>>This isn't your Mother's Army. Just because someone slams it on my platter,
>>I DO NOT have to eat it.
>
>We were talking about a restaurant.

Yeah, sounds like Steve's mother's idea of serving the family dinner
was no different from a farmer slopping the hogs.

Brooklyn1 <Gravesend1> wrote in news:c7om96he4s6a9jqq1mortpreoocbtne0q8@
4ax.com:

> On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 00:29:13 GMT, Aussie
> > wrote:
>

>
>> A plane ride to the US is around $900.
>
> Many folks don't have THAT KIND of disposable income... a $900 plane
> ride might mean the family doesn't eat for 2-3-4 months.



Sounds like you've been there, done that.


>
> Personally I could well afford it, but I wouldn't spend $900 to fly to
> Australia, in fact I wouldn't fly to Australia if you bought my
> ticket.
>


Yeah, I wouldn't bother if I was you. We get enough obnoxious Yanks over
here as it is.

It would also save you the embarrassment of not being able to gain entry,
and being put on the first flight back home.


--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania

The act of feeding someone is an act of beauty,
whether it's a full Sunday roast or a jam sandwich,
but only when done with love.

ChattyCathy wrote on Thu, 23 Sep 2010 16:16:26 +0200:

>> In article >,
>> ChattyCathy > wrote:
>>
>>> J. Clarke wrote:
>>
>> >> Uh, why does a lack of desire to spend 110 dollars on a
>> >> piece of paper that is likely to expire before one uses it
>> >> indicative of a belief that "civilization stops at the
>> >> USA's borders"?
>>>
>> It's not a piece of paper, IT'S A WHOLE BOOK!!!
>>
>> :-)
>>
>>> 110 *US* dollars?
>>>
>>> Heh. The cost of getting a passport in South Africa is the
>>> equivalent of USD27.00 - and it's valid for 10 years from
>>> date of issue. So I'd say you're either getting ripped off
>>> or exaggerating somewhat.
>>
>> Here's the info:
>>
>> http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html
>>
>> If I understand it correctly, it's US$165 for the whole
>> works, good for ten years.
>>
> That's much pricier than what we pay here - but on reflection,
> that's only $16.50 per year. Some people spend (almost) that
> per month to access Usenet, so I don't think it would exactly
> break the bank - and at least if an urgent need arose to have
> a passport (death of a family member elsewhere in the world,
> for example), one wouldn't have the hassle (and extra expense)
> of applying for an emergency travel document/passport.

I have always kept my US passport up to date since I might have to
travel to Europe on an emergency basis and you never know what the
Border personnel (both nationalities) will do in Canada. Even if the
price of a ten-year one hurts, it is not so much considered on a per
year basis.
--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Sep 23, 9:16*am, ChattyCathy > wrote:
> Dan Abel wrote:
> > In article >,
> > *ChattyCathy > wrote:
>
> >> J. Clarke wrote:
>
> >> > Uh, why does a lack of desire to spend 110 dollars on a piece of
> >> > paper that is likely to expire before one uses it indicative of a
> >> > belief that "civilization stops at the USA's borders"?
>
> > It's not a piece of paper, IT'S A WHOLE BOOK!!!
>
> > :-)
>
> >> 110 *US* dollars?
>
> >> Heh. The cost of getting a passport in South Africa is the equivalent
> >> of USD27.00 - and it's valid for 10 years from date of issue. So I'd
> >> say you're either getting ripped off or exaggerating somewhat.
>
> > Here's the info:
>
> >http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html
>
> > If I understand it correctly, it's US$165 for the whole works, good
> > for ten years.
>
> That's much pricier than what we pay here - but on reflection, that's
> only $16.50 per year. Some people spend (almost) that per month to
> access Usenet, so I don't think it would exactly break the bank - and
> at least if an urgent need arose to have a passport (death of a family
> member elsewhere in the world, for example), one wouldn't have the
> hassle (and extra expense) of applying for an emergency travel
> document/passport.
> --
> Cheers
> Chatty Cathy- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

I venture an opinion that your accusation that Americans don't think
about anything beyond their borders, might equally apply to you ....
you assume everyone has the same options as South Africans, and don't
make allowances for things you have mistaken assumptions about. But
then sweeping generalizations are easy.

N.

On Sep 23, 8:14*am, Cindy Hamilton >
wrote:
> On Sep 22, 8:18*pm, Aussie >
> wrote:
>
> > > I'm mid-country - nothing foreign is "close."
>
> > I thought your internal flights were as cheep as chips??
>
> > $99 to go anywhere internal USA?? (Or is that just a special deal they
> > give to us Aussies to travel more over there?)
>
> I'm in mid-country, too. *I just went to delta.com to see what it
> would cost to fly to Los Angeles, stay a week, and come home,
> planning a month ahead. *The fare was at least $288. *(Additional
> baggage charges may apply, they said. *I imagine if I stayed
> a week, I'd be hit up for extra baggage.) *Las Vegas, even
> though it's closer, costs $317.
>
> New York to LA is $278. *Apparently airline pricing is not
> rational.
>
> I might be able to save some money by using a different
> airline or airport, but for this exercise, that's enough data.
>
> When I rule the world, they're going to have to figure out
> how much it costs per passenger-mile, and base their
> fares on that.
>
> Cindy Hamilton

Fares are ridiculous....when my son wants to fly here from Virginia,
it costs upwards of $400 or more round-trip, unless there's a deal
somewhere. And I'm only halfway across the country from him. Often,
flights to either coast from anywhere are cheaper that shorter
flights.

As for passports, I don't have any relatives in any other countries,
so an "emergency" need for a passport is non-existent in my life.

N.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:00:30 -0400, "J. Clarke"
> wrote:

>Not exaggerating at all.
><http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html>. And it's
>actually $135. I forgot about the execution fee. And there's another
>10 bucks or so to get a picture taken. So it's more than $140 all up.
>
>Note that the $30 "passport card" listed on that site is good _only_ for
>travel to and from Canada and Mexico by road, rail, or foot--it's not
>good for air travel or for going anywhere other than Mexico or Canada.

So the cost of a regular passport has gone up in the last 5 years?
Ours were significantly under $100 back then... more like $50. What
costs is the extra visa you need for certain countries (I'm talking
about day trips, not a 6 month stay). Egypt was a real rip off, for
instance.

--
I love cooking with wine.
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:23:51 -0400, "J. Clarke"
> wrote:

>In the US a CCW does that.


What's that?

--
I love cooking with wine.
Sometimes I even put it in the food.

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 18:12:02 +0200, ChattyCathy wrote:

> Steve B wrote:
>
>>
>> EXCEPT IN A RESTAURANT, DO NOT SERVE MY PLATE.
>
> <snipped to save bandwidth>
>
> I thought you'd flounced out of this group in August 2010 (or
> thereabouts)?

maybe we need a 12-flouncing step program.

your pal,
blake

On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 19:12:10 +0200, ChattyCathy wrote:

> blake murphy wrote:
>
>>> Well, in that case... next time you feel the urge to wander below the
>>> Tropic of Capricorn and visit sunny South Africa just give me 24
>>> hours notice - and your flight number - and I'll pick you up at the
>>> airport.
>>
>> well, bless your thoughty bones. unlikely, but thanks for the offer.
>
> There's always the lottery/lotto. But of course, you have to be in it to
> win it.

sorry, i'm not as dumb as andy.

your pal,
blake

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 15:54:33 +0200, ChattyCathy wrote:

> sf wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:33:34 +0200, ChattyCathy
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>I'm not denying that English is a difficult language to learn to spell
>>>(and often pronounce) if it's not one's "home language" However, the
>>>fact that words such as "neighbour" and "labour" are spelled
>>>as "neighbor" and "labor" in American English doesn't improve matters
>>>much, IMO. I enjoy eating doughnuts and a lot of Americans enjoy
>>>eating doughnuts too - but some Americans prefer eating "donuts".
>>>Surely it wouldn't do any harm to standardise/standardize the spelling
>>>of the aforementioned words?
>>
>> Maybe you guys could start by leaving unnecessary letters out of
>> words.
>>
> <Cathy thwaps sf with a wet noodle>
>
> Hey, we like those letters right where they are ;-)

'donuts' just ain't right.

your pal,
blake

Nancy2 wrote:

> On Sep 23, 9:16*am, ChattyCathy > wrote:

>>
>> That's much pricier than what we pay here - but on reflection, that's
>> only $16.50 per year. Some people spend (almost) that per month to
>> access Usenet, so I don't think it would exactly break the bank - and
>> at least if an urgent need arose to have a passport (death of a
>> family member elsewhere in the world, for example), one wouldn't have
>> the hassle (and extra expense) of applying for an emergency travel
>> document/passport.

>
> I venture an opinion that your accusation that Americans don't think
> about anything beyond their borders, might equally apply to you ....

Well, not exactly. I have a passport because I actually acknowledge the
fact that there are other civilized countries beyond our borders. And
I've even been off the continent of Africa to visit relatives who
reside in UK/Europe, no less. BTW, the USA *is* still on my list
of "must see" places because I have quite a few relatives there that I
haven't seen in over 25 years - not to mention a bunch of r.f.c.-ers
who I'd dearly like to meet in RL.

> you assume everyone has the same options as South Africans, and don't
> make allowances for things you have mistaken assumptions about. But
> then sweeping generalizations are easy.

I see. But is it safe to assume that you've never felt the need to apply
for a passport or ventured further than neighboring countries where no
passport control is required?

--
Cheers
Chatty Cathy

On Sep 23, 11:16*am, Janet > wrote:
> In article <1d4306d0-ae31-4373-9970-1c7054806178
> @u13g2000vbo.googlegroups.com>, says...
>
> > As for passports, I don't have any relatives in any other countries,
> > so an "emergency" need for a passport is non-existent in my life.
>
> *You have no relatives who ever travel abroad, even on business?

My husband has traveled to England once or twice on business,
and I never considered getting a passport. If he had some
emergency, what good would I do? I'm not a doctor or a nurse.

Of course, the most likely thing would have been that his
helicopter crashed, thus automating his cremation.

Cindy Hamilton

On 9/23/2010 9:54 AM, ChattyCathy wrote:
> sf wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:33:34 +0200, ChattyCathy
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I'm not denying that English is a difficult language to learn to spell
>>> (and often pronounce) if it's not one's "home language" However, the
>>> fact that words such as "neighbour" and "labour" are spelled
>>> as "neighbor" and "labor" in American English doesn't improve matters
>>> much, IMO. I enjoy eating doughnuts and a lot of Americans enjoy
>>> eating doughnuts too - but some Americans prefer eating "donuts".
>>> Surely it wouldn't do any harm to standardise/standardize the spelling
>>> of the aforementioned words?
>>
>> Maybe you guys could start by leaving unnecessary letters out of
>> words.
>>
>>
> <Cathy thwaps sf with a wet noodle>
>
> Hey, we like those letters right where they are ;-)

<http://design.caltech.edu/erik/Misc/Twain_english.html>

On 9/23/2010 11:18 AM, sf wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:00:30 -0400, "J. Clarke"
> > wrote:
>
>> Not exaggerating at all.
>> <http://travel.state.gov/passport/fees/fees_837.html>. And it's
>> actually $135. I forgot about the execution fee. And there's another
>> 10 bucks or so to get a picture taken. So it's more than $140 all up.
>>
>> Note that the $30 "passport card" listed on that site is good _only_ for
>> travel to and from Canada and Mexico by road, rail, or foot--it's not
>> good for air travel or for going anywhere other than Mexico or Canada.
>
> So the cost of a regular passport has gone up in the last 5 years?
> Ours were significantly under $100 back then... more like $50. What
> costs is the extra visa you need for certain countries (I'm talking
> about day trips, not a 6 month stay). Egypt was a real rip off, for
> instance.

New fees went into effect on July 13.

On 9/23/2010 11:22 AM, sf wrote:
> On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 10:23:51 -0400, "J. Clarke"
> > wrote:
>
>> In the US a CCW does that.
>
>
> What's that?

Concealed carry permit. Since it requires a background check and police
sign-off it trumps just about anything in the ID status game.

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:12:58 -0400, blake murphy
> wrote:

>On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 18:12:02 +0200, ChattyCathy wrote:
>
>> Steve B wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> EXCEPT IN A RESTAURANT, DO NOT SERVE MY PLATE.
>>
>> <snipped to save bandwidth>
>>
>> I thought you'd flounced out of this group in August 2010 (or
>> thereabouts)?
>
>maybe we need a 12-flouncing step program.
>
>your pal,
>blake

Any *step* program would be wasted on you.

On Sep 23, 10:16*am, Janet > wrote:
> In article <1d4306d0-ae31-4373-9970-1c7054806178
> @u13g2000vbo.googlegroups.com>, says...
>
> > As for passports, I don't have any relatives in any other countries,
> > so an "emergency" need for a passport is non-existent in my life.
>
> *You have no relatives who ever travel abroad, even on business?
>
> * Janet

....can't remember the last time someone did. I don't have many close
relatives, actually. Anyway, just because a relative has an emergency
abroad, doesn't mean someone should just jump on a plane and go.

N.

"ChattyCathy" > wrote in message
...
> Default User wrote:

>> It was originally named "alumium" by Davys, then he later changed it
>> to aluminum. That's the spelling and pronounciation that became
>> established in the US and Canada. Still later, the British changed it
>> again to aluminium to make it more conforming to other names of
>> metals.
>
> Well, if the "British" you speak of founded the International Union of
> Pure and Applied Chemistry (nowadays known as IUPAC), I guess you'd be
> correct.

They adopted that in 1990. Did you expect the US and Canada to change? Also,
IUPAC accepts aluminum as a valid variant.

> However, if you think the aluminum spelling/pronunciation is more
> logical, maybe all the countries on this fine planet should switch to
> spelling sodium as "sodinum" and potassium as "potassinum" and
> magnesium as "magnesinum"? Might make it a lot more, shall we say,
> conforming - wouldn't you agree?

So you think it should be platinium too?




Brian

On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 12:44:55 -0400, blake murphy
> wrote:

>On Thu, 23 Sep 2010 15:54:33 +0200, ChattyCathy wrote:
>
>> sf wrote:
>>
>>> On Wed, 22 Sep 2010 08:33:34 +0200, ChattyCathy
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>>I'm not denying that English is a difficult language to learn to spell
>>>>(and often pronounce) if it's not one's "home language" However, the
>>>>fact that words such as "neighbour" and "labour" are spelled
>>>>as "neighbor" and "labor" in American English doesn't improve matters
>>>>much, IMO. I enjoy eating doughnuts and a lot of Americans enjoy
>>>>eating doughnuts too - but some Americans prefer eating "donuts".
>>>>Surely it wouldn't do any harm to standardise/standardize the spelling
>>>>of the aforementioned words?
>>>
>>> Maybe you guys could start by leaving unnecessary letters out of
>>> words.
>>>
>> <Cathy thwaps sf with a wet noodle>
>>
>> Hey, we like those letters right where they are ;-)
>
>'donuts' just ain't right.

Uneducated mick:
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/donut

Uneducated mick:
https://www.dunkindonuts.com/

On Sep 23, 12:01*pm, ChattyCathy > wrote:
> Nancy2 wrote:
> > On Sep 23, 9:16*am, ChattyCathy > wrote:
>
> >> That's much pricier than what we pay here - but on reflection, that's
> >> only $16.50 per year. Some people spend (almost) that per month to
> >> access Usenet, so I don't think it would exactly break the bank - and
> >> at least if an urgent need arose to have a passport (death of a
> >> family member elsewhere in the world, for example), one wouldn't have
> >> the hassle (and extra expense) of applying for an emergency travel
> >> document/passport.
>
> > I venture an opinion that your accusation that Americans don't think
> > about anything beyond their borders, might equally apply to you ....
>
> Well, not exactly. I have a passport because I actually acknowledge the
> fact that there are other civilized countries beyond our borders. And
> I've even been off the continent of Africa to visit relatives who
> reside in UK/Europe, no less. BTW, the USA *is* still on my list
> of "must see" places because I have quite a few relatives there that I
> haven't seen in over 25 years - not to mention a bunch of r.f.c.-ers
> who I'd dearly like to meet in RL.
>
> > you assume everyone has the same options as South Africans, and don't
> > make allowances for things you have mistaken assumptions about. *But
> > then sweeping generalizations are easy.
>
> I see. But is it safe to assume that you've never felt the need to apply
> for a passport or ventured further than neighboring countries where no
> passport control is required?
>
> --
> Cheers
> Chatty Cathy


One thing that frequently gets overlooked in this kind of discussion
is the amount of vacation an average USian has, and an average
European has. (I don't know what South Africa is like, in terms of
annual vacation time.) Most folks here get 2 weeks a year. A
fortunate few who have been at their job a long time (10 years,
generally) get 4 weeks. It's my understanding talking with co-workers
in England and Australia that everybody gets 6 weeks, minimum. I
would travel a lot further if I could take 3-4 weeks of uninterrupted
time off - but I can't. Sometimes getting 2 weeks together is
discouraged.

If you only have a week, you're much less likely to go the long
distances required to hit other continents.

I acknowledge there are other civilized countries - I even acknowledge
that some of them are better at some things than we are. I wasn't
aware that required a passport. Does it count if I read British/Irish
novels?

On Sep 23, 3:05*pm, Janet > wrote:
> In article <3368d2c2-78c5-486a-a561-
> >,
> says...
>
>
>
> > On Sep 23, 11:16*am, Janet > wrote:
> > > In article <1d4306d0-ae31-4373-9970-1c7054806178
> > > @u13g2000vbo.googlegroups.com>, says...
>
> > > > As for passports, I don't have any relatives in any other countries,
> > > > so an "emergency" need for a passport is non-existent in my life.
>
> > > *You have no relatives who ever travel abroad, even on business?
>
> > My husband has traveled to England once or twice on business,
> > and I never considered getting a passport. *If he had some
> > emergency, what good would I do? *I'm not a doctor or a nurse.
>
> * *You might want to visit him in hospital? Keep him company till he was
> fit to return home? *Or, when he was discharged, you might want to
> support him on the long flight home.

As I said, he's much more likely to have ended up as toast than
as a hospital patient. When you're strapped into the open doorway
of a helicopter, there isn't much chance of survival if the
"collection of parts rotating around an oil leak" has a problem.

I thought I had an aerial picture of Stonehenge that he took
on that trip, but all I've got is Hoover Dam:

http://www.adi.com/~hamilton/foot.jpg

That's his own foot in the foreground. He always takes one
like that.

Cindy Hamilton

>
> I see. But is it safe to assume that you've never felt the need to apply
> for a passport or ventured further than neighboring countries where no
> passport control is required?
>
> --
> Cheers
> Chatty Cathy

Nope, you're wrong again - I used to have a passport (as I said before
in this thread) - and have done land tours in France, Italy, Monaco,
the Riviera and also cruised twice in the Mediterranean, toured
Venezuela and some Med. islands ... all back in another lifetime. I
have never been to Mexico, and have no desire to go there at least in
the foreseeable future, but I have been to Canada several times (pre-
homeland security days).

N.