Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.

BTW, this is OT.

Well, no. Yes. Maybe. Definitely. I don't know. Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On 2010-07-19, Steve B > wrote:
> Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
> brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.

I brew ....or have brewed. Not brewing currently.

There are two basic forms of brewing. Extract and whole grain.
Extracts are usually "kits" or separate components and use "malt
extracts", which are thick molasses-like liquids that are basically
barley and sometimes hops that have already been partially processed.
Jes add water to the syrup and boil to finish the brewing process.
The other, "whole grain", uses real whole barley and other grains and
hops and water (the 3 main ingredients) and requires more steps to
extract the starch from the grain. Both work just fine, but whole
grain will provide a superior beer. Extract is easier and cheaper and
probably the best place to begin if you don't have a real live brewing
mentor to teach you the ropes, but I won't claim it's the only way to
begin. I was fortunate enough to have a mentor and have never done
extract brewing.

This is the hands down RECOMMENDED-BY-ALL authority on home brewing,
both basic and advanced. As an extra bonus, it's absolutely FREE!!:

http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html

Read the entire book at least once before you even think of brewing.
Pay close attention to sanitation!! Whether you do extract or whole
grain, sanitation is as critical as in any hospital operating room.
Poor sanitation practices can completely hose a batch of beer and ruin
mucho hours of hard work.

I almost forgot "yeast", one last requirement and essential in either
extract or whole grain brewing. I should have said four main
ingredients. It's an absolute requirement, but not so difficult to
deal with. After you've boiled the wort ....read the book!.... jes
toss in the yeast as a last step before fermentation. No biggie.

Here's my favorite brewing supply website:

http://morebeer.com/

I'm not saying you can't find cheaper, or shouldn't look, specially
when shipping costs become an issue, but this is a good reliable
source of information for all things beer and a good place to get a
lay of the land. They have absolutely everything you would ever need
to brew beer. I've dealt with them often, as they custom built my
brewing kegs, so I know them to be honest and reliable folks, should
you decide to deal with them.

Good luck and feel free to ask any more questions.

nb

notbob wrote:
> On 2010-07-19, Steve B > wrote:
>> Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
>> brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
>> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
> I brew ....or have brewed. Not brewing currently.
>
> There are two basic forms of brewing. Extract and whole grain.
> Extracts are usually "kits" or separate components and use "malt
> extracts", which are thick molasses-like liquids that are basically
> barley and sometimes hops that have already been partially processed.
> Jes add water to the syrup and boil to finish the brewing process.
> The other, "whole grain", uses real whole barley and other grains and
> hops and water (the 3 main ingredients) and requires more steps to
> extract the starch from the grain. Both work just fine, but whole
> grain will provide a superior beer. Extract is easier and cheaper and
> probably the best place to begin if you don't have a real live brewing
> mentor to teach you the ropes, but I won't claim it's the only way to
> begin. I was fortunate enough to have a mentor and have never done
> extract brewing.
>
> This is the hands down RECOMMENDED-BY-ALL authority on home brewing,
> both basic and advanced. As an extra bonus, it's absolutely FREE!!:
>
> http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html
>
> Read the entire book at least once before you even think of brewing.
> Pay close attention to sanitation!! Whether you do extract or whole
> grain, sanitation is as critical as in any hospital operating room.
> Poor sanitation practices can completely hose a batch of beer and ruin
> mucho hours of hard work.
>
> I almost forgot "yeast", one last requirement and essential in either
> extract or whole grain brewing. I should have said four main
> ingredients. It's an absolute requirement, but not so difficult to
> deal with. After you've boiled the wort ....read the book!.... jes
> toss in the yeast as a last step before fermentation. No biggie.
>
> Here's my favorite brewing supply website:
>
> http://morebeer.com/
>
> I'm not saying you can't find cheaper, or shouldn't look, specially
> when shipping costs become an issue, but this is a good reliable
> source of information for all things beer and a good place to get a
> lay of the land. They have absolutely everything you would ever need
> to brew beer. I've dealt with them often, as they custom built my
> brewing kegs, so I know them to be honest and reliable folks, should
> you decide to deal with them.
>
> Good luck and feel free to ask any more questions.
>
> nb
>


I haven't brewed in a few years; I used to do a whole-grain mash,
and then supplement it with malt syrup. I still have all the
equipment, bottles, and even a few pounds of malt syrup in the
freezer. (I have yeast and hops in the freezer too, but those
probably should be thrown out by now and replaced when I'm ready to
start a new batch.) Once I got to where I could consistently brew
*really good* strongish ales, I lost interest in it (because I can
buy good beer up here) and moved on to other hobbies. It will cycle
back around eventually.

Bob

"Steve B" > wrote in message
...
> Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
> brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
> BTW, this is OT.
>
> Well, no. Yes. Maybe. Definitely. I don't know. Steve

You may want to try rec.beer or alt.beer or one of the other many beer
groups.

MY son has made it, but I've only made wine. I don't drink enough beer in a
year to justify the time or equipment.

Try to find a good brew store too. The one I go to for supplies has both
beer and wine for customers to taste, chat about, etc. Always a fun visit.

It's an easy start if you're a strong ale fan. Lagers take a little more TLC (bottom fermented beers require chilling: lauter tun, fridge). Strong dark ales are made with good appeal even with malt extract (please use at least 6-9 lbs. and don't skimp; you'll thank me.) You can save money and attain better taste with all malt. Just depends on where you live.

People in this country tend to overdue the hops, hiding an often inferior malt profile. There are good malts to be had here and that's the essence of da beer. Before you buy grain malt, ask for a bit, go home, steep it, taste it. That will be a strong/sweetened version of the final product. You'll add hops for bitterness and preservation; but people I've known who started out tend to overhop. Beers that friends of mine have commented on as being unreal are extinct recipes for English strong ale that highlight the character of dark malt with scant, complimentary hops.

Our microbrews have dry-hopped and overhopped without even thinking about the essence of the beer:malt. Even certain extracts taste much better than some of the sad grain malts I've tasted. Trust YOUR tastebuds with the malt, and you'll be okay, man.

The steps are easy. You'll do it. Find some good ingredients as close to home as you can. I've even found good malt in Texas, where I thought it impossible prior.

If you live near a city, check out the homebrew store. If not, check online for malt extract recipes. I doubt it would be good to send whole grain through the mail. There goes any savings.

Strong ales are also very forgiving of the yeast used. I made one batch out of just leftover dark extracts (7 lbs) and added just a pinch of hops and used bread yeast. Turned out unreal. Just a ghetto batch I had little pride in and put into 2 ltr. soda bottles. Friends who think Guiness is the shmit smiled like they'd tried real beer for the first time.

Just don't go corn sugar with anything, bud. It will have alcohol, but poor flavor. Spend money on the malt and you'll have something. Refine with different yeasts and hop combos. No need to be intimidated by liquid yeast when you get rolling. The starter is child's play and you can really change the beer with yeast/hop/malt combos. Good water, though, is too oft forgotten.

It's all junk without good water.

You can use a food grade bucket for a primary fermentor. You may want to throw the money into a glass carboy and a handle for it; along with a fermentation lock with the rubber cork that fits the carboy and has a hole matching the fermentation lock. You can use this as your primary and seconday fermentor. After primary fermentation, just transfer the beer into your 5-6 gallon steel, or enaml on steel (not aluminum) brew pot with the tubing, add the needed amount of malt to "sugarfy" and , in months, carbonate the brew. A bottle cleaner you hook up to the faucet is money well-spent, too. Good tubing and a capper (you can use 2 liter bottles that have been sanitized, though) and you just need to drink enough pryoffs to get bottles. This is about all the New Belgium Brewery products are good for: cool bottles.

Get rolling and it's fun. The smell is great. Just have patience. Oooo that first batch is hard to wait for. A strong ale, though, is easy to make. Brown ale is also a great starter beer; good as Newcastle. friends who like real ale will be impressed your first batch, even if you just go extract. Just use malt as your sugar and little else. (Honey, ferments like crazy and all the way through, though. Adds a crispness.) Enjoy.

zxcvbob wrote:
>
> notbob wrote:
> > On 2010-07-19, Steve B > wrote:
> >> Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
> >> brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
> >> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
> >
> > I brew ....or have brewed. Not brewing currently.
> >
> > There are two basic forms of brewing. Extract and whole grain.
> > Extracts are usually "kits" or separate components and use "malt
> > extracts", which are thick molasses-like liquids that are basically
> > barley and sometimes hops that have already been partially processed.
> > Jes add water to the syrup and boil to finish the brewing process.
> > The other, "whole grain", uses real whole barley and other grains and
> > hops and water (the 3 main ingredients) and requires more steps to
> > extract the starch from the grain. Both work just fine, but whole
> > grain will provide a superior beer. Extract is easier and cheaper and
> > probably the best place to begin if you don't have a real live brewing
> > mentor to teach you the ropes, but I won't claim it's the only way to
> > begin. I was fortunate enough to have a mentor and have never done
> > extract brewing.
> >
> > This is the hands down RECOMMENDED-BY-ALL authority on home brewing,
> > both basic and advanced. As an extra bonus, it's absolutely FREE!!:
> >
> > http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html
> >
> > Read the entire book at least once before you even think of brewing.
> > Pay close attention to sanitation!! Whether you do extract or whole
> > grain, sanitation is as critical as in any hospital operating room.
> > Poor sanitation practices can completely hose a batch of beer and ruin
> > mucho hours of hard work.
> >
> > I almost forgot "yeast", one last requirement and essential in either
> > extract or whole grain brewing. I should have said four main
> > ingredients. It's an absolute requirement, but not so difficult to
> > deal with. After you've boiled the wort ....read the book!.... jes
> > toss in the yeast as a last step before fermentation. No biggie.
> >
> > Here's my favorite brewing supply website:
> >
> > http://morebeer.com/
> >
> > I'm not saying you can't find cheaper, or shouldn't look, specially
> > when shipping costs become an issue, but this is a good reliable
> > source of information for all things beer and a good place to get a
> > lay of the land. They have absolutely everything you would ever need
> > to brew beer. I've dealt with them often, as they custom built my
> > brewing kegs, so I know them to be honest and reliable folks, should
> > you decide to deal with them.
> >
> > Good luck and feel free to ask any more questions.
> >
> > nb
> >
>
> I haven't brewed in a few years; I used to do a whole-grain mash,
> and then supplement it with malt syrup. I still have all the
> equipment, bottles, and even a few pounds of malt syrup in the
> freezer. (I have yeast and hops in the freezer too, but those
> probably should be thrown out by now and replaced when I'm ready to
> start a new batch.) Once I got to where I could consistently brew
> *really good* strongish ales, I lost interest in it (because I can
> buy good beer up here) and moved on to other hobbies. It will cycle
> back around eventually.
>
> Bob

The few times I've done the homebrew thing, I used a "True Brew" brown
ale kit, which is a partial mash kit. I had great results each time, but
I just don't drink enough beer for it to be practical and I ended up
having to distribute a lot to friends so it would be consumed while
fresh.

One piece of advise - bottling is the most work in the process, use
bigger bottles (I used 650ml size) to reduce your bottling effort. Also
recommend one of the bottle filler wands with the push actcuated valve
at the end, makes consistent filling a lot easier.

On Jul 18, 5:59*pm, "Steve B" > wrote:
> Does anyone here make beer? *I believe I will get the stuff together and
> brew some this winter. *I would like to hear just from people who have
> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
> BTW, this is OT.
>
> Well, no. *Yes. *Maybe. *Definitely. *I don't know. Steve
>

rec.crafts.brewing is your friend.

The HomeBrew Digest email listserv, also gatewayed to r.c.b, goes back
to 1988.

"Ed Pawlowski" > wrote in message
news
>
> "Steve B" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
>> brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
>> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>>
>> BTW, this is OT.
>>
>> Well, no. Yes. Maybe. Definitely. I don't know. Steve
>
> You may want to try rec.beer or alt.beer or one of the other many beer
> groups.
>
> MY son has made it, but I've only made wine. I don't drink enough beer in
> a year to justify the time or equipment.
>
> Try to find a good brew store too. The one I go to for supplies has both
> beer and wine for customers to taste, chat about, etc. Always a fun
> visit.

In Utah? I don't think so, Ed.

I went to the store the other day, and found that they had removed Pina
Colada yogurt from their inventory. They also do not sell Amaretto flavored
coffee flavoring. I guess pina colada yogurt and amaretto coffee creamer
could be considered gateway drugs by SOME people. Anything that is liquor
flavored, they will not sell.

I'm so happy. Who knows where those gateway drugs could have taken me.

Steve

On Sun, 18 Jul 2010 17:59:44 -0700, "Steve B"
> wrote:

>Does anyone here make beer?

Yep.

> I believe I will get the stuff together and
>brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
>actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.

Do you intend starting from scratch (prep your own grains, etc) or use
a 'kit' that has the wurt pre made? Nothing at all wrong with the
latter, IMO. I use the kits all the time, as there are many good
brands out there and I really don't think I can improve on them to any
appreciable extent. And they are one *hell* of a time saver, without
necessarily compromising on quality.

I have just received three hops rhizomes (Pride of Ringwood), which
will be planted this week. Look forward to having my own fresh hops
(which is not particularly cheap)

Basically, I've found that if you follow the instructions to the
letter, take your time, and use common sense - you'll get a great
result every time. Almost all commercial beers taste like crap to me
now

The *one* thing I've done 'wrong' thus far is not use any kind of
sterilising agent on any of the equipment. After about 40 brews -
never had a problem... I simply clean everything with a worn nylon
scouring pad and rain water.

>BTW, this is OT.
>
>Well, no. Yes. Maybe. Definitely. I don't know. Steve

Nectar of the Gods is food AFAIAC

On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 01:05:19 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2010-07-19, Steve B > wrote:
>> Does anyone here make beer? I believe I will get the stuff together and
>> brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
>> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
>I brew ....or have brewed. Not brewing currently.
>
>There are two basic forms of brewing. Extract and whole grain.
>Extracts are usually "kits" or separate components and use "malt
>extracts", which are thick molasses-like liquids that are basically
>barley and sometimes hops that have already been partially processed.
>Jes add water to the syrup and boil to finish the brewing process.
>The other, "whole grain", uses real whole barley and other grains and
>hops and water (the 3 main ingredients) and requires more steps to
>extract the starch from the grain. Both work just fine, but whole
>grain will provide a superior beer. Extract is easier and cheaper and
>probably the best place to begin if you don't have a real live brewing
>mentor to teach you the ropes, but I won't claim it's the only way to
>begin. I was fortunate enough to have a mentor and have never done
>extract brewing.

You should at least try using a quality wurt/extract at least once.

I personally do not completely agree with you that starting with whole
grain necessarily results in a superior product. It most certainly
can, but then that all depends on what you're looking for, assuming
you have a clear idea in your mind as to what your'e trying to
achieve.

I reckon for a beginner, a kit/extract is the best way to start. Gives
you a chance to become familiar with the whole process (apart from
preparing your own grain - which is very time consuming).

>This is the hands down RECOMMENDED-BY-ALL authority on home brewing,
>both basic and advanced. As an extra bonus, it's absolutely FREE!!:
>
>http://www.howtobrew.com/intro.html
>
>Read the entire book at least once before you even think of brewing.
>Pay close attention to sanitation!! Whether you do extract or whole
>grain, sanitation is as critical as in any hospital operating room.
>Poor sanitation practices can completely hose a batch of beer and ruin
>mucho hours of hard work.
>
>I almost forgot "yeast", one last requirement and essential in either
>extract or whole grain brewing. I should have said four main
>ingredients. It's an absolute requirement, but not so difficult to
>deal with. After you've boiled the wort ....read the book!.... jes
>toss in the yeast as a last step before fermentation. No biggie.
>
>Here's my favorite brewing supply website:
>
>http://morebeer.com/
>
>I'm not saying you can't find cheaper, or shouldn't look, specially
>when shipping costs become an issue, but this is a good reliable
>source of information for all things beer and a good place to get a
>lay of the land. They have absolutely everything you would ever need
>to brew beer. I've dealt with them often, as they custom built my
>brewing kegs, so I know them to be honest and reliable folks, should
>you decide to deal with them.
>
>Good luck and feel free to ask any more questions.

Good looking linkages... I'll have to check them out myself, thanks.

On Jul 18, 7:59*pm, "Steve B" > wrote:
> Does anyone here make beer? *I believe I will get the stuff together and
> brew some this winter. *I would like to hear just from people who have
> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
> BTW, this is OT.
>
> Well, no. *Yes. *Maybe. *Definitely. *I don't know. Steve
>
> visit my blog athttp://cabgbypasssurgery.com


I've made five gallon batches of beer a bunch of times. It's not
complicated, but don't spend too much time on homebrewing websites
looking for advice. They'll have you running around in circles,
chasing your own tail and not knowing what to do or which way is up.
They'll tell you to buy all sorts of weird crap that you don't really
need, do things you don't really need to do and worry about things you
don't really need to worry about. Homebrewing websites will boggle
your mind as often as they give helpful advice. I started out with
extracts, which are just a can of liquid malt and a can of flavored
"base" that you pour into a stainless steel pot with a gallon of
distilled water and heat it up to just under the boiling point. Pour
it into your nice sterile fermenter, add the other four room
temperature gallons, add your yeast, seal that bad boy up and wait for
your airlock to bubble, which it should within 12 hours or so. Some
people will tell you to boil it for an hour. Don't, because there are
delicate aromatic oils from the hops in there that you'll lose because
they can't handle boiling. The only advice everybody always gives
that's consistently right is make sure everything that comes in
contact with your wort after you heat it up is completely sterilized,
otherwise you'll end up with beer that tastes like you added malt
vinegar to it. Don't try to punch up the alcohol content by adding
sugar, either because that also creates weird, off flavors. I do
either kits or partial extracts because all grain requires all sorts
of extra stuff. There are a lot of logistical issues involved in
heating five gallons of water and ten pounds of malted barley to a
precise temperature and keeping it there for an hour, then draining
off the water, sparging (pouring water over) the mass of sticky barley
to get all the residual sugar, boiling the five gallons of sweet water
for an hour, then getting it down to a temperature low enough to pitch
before unwanted, wild yeasties find their way into it. There's no way
to really explain it, other than to say that the more you do it the
more you understand it and the easier it gets.

There is the beef in beer.

Slices or chunks of beef, sauted or 'browned' in oil on top of the stove.

Then the beer is added.

And the beef and any onions one has set to stew with the beef....garlic ....
--

Mr. Joseph Paul Littleshoes Esq.

Domine, dirige nos.

Let the games begin!
http://fredeeky.typepad.com/fredeeky.../sf_anthem.mp3

On Sun, 18 Jul 2010 23:25:26 -0500, "Pete C." >
wrote:

<snip>

>One piece of advise - bottling is the most work in the process, use
>bigger bottles (I used 650ml size) to reduce your bottling effort. Also
>recommend one of the bottle filler wands with the push actcuated valve
>at the end, makes consistent filling a lot easier.

Whilst using the bigger bottles cuts down on washing, cleaning, etc,
it really all depends on how much you drink as to what size bottle to
use, IMO.

For example, I'm generally not a big drinker, so one of our
(Australian) tall bottles (750ml) is usually too much for me. I'd only
end up wasting half the bottle most times.
So I do 95% of my bottling using 'stubbies' (375ml).

Although in the past couple of weeks, I've gone from one or two
stubbies per day to six or eight, only because I'm in the process of
cutting and burning approx. 50 Blue Gum trees... hot and heavy work
requires extra sustenance. That's my excuse anyway.

The wand you mention is almost indispensable, I reckon.

One thing that really IS golden advice IMO is to AVOID those hand held
bottle cappers... the once you use a hammer to tap the lid on. Every
last person I know who used one (not 'used') had nothing but
expletives to say about them Instead, spend a bit more and get a
decent lever actuated bottle capper...

On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 01:28:29 -0700 (PDT), Christopher Helms
> wrote:

<snip>
>I've made five gallon batches of beer a bunch of times. It's not
>complicated, but don't spend too much time on homebrewing websites
>looking for advice. They'll have you running around in circles,
>chasing your own tail and not knowing what to do or which way is up.

Now that is a wise bit of information! And generally true.
When I was looking around for some cider/perry recipes... well, it
just confused the hell out of me, because there was *no* consistency
in the recipes and methods used (that goes one-hundred-fold for root
beer!!).

>They'll tell you to buy all sorts of weird crap that you don't really
>need, do things you don't really need to do and worry about things you
>don't really need to worry about. Homebrewing websites will boggle
>your mind as often as they give helpful advice. I started out with
>extracts, which are just a can of liquid malt and a can of flavored
>"base" that you pour into a stainless steel pot with a gallon of
>distilled water and heat it up to just under the boiling point. Pour
>it into your nice sterile fermenter, add the other four room
>temperature gallons, add your yeast, seal that bad boy up and wait for
>your airlock to bubble, which it should within 12 hours or so. Some
>people will tell you to boil it for an hour.

Boil it for an hour??? What on earth for???

> Don't, because there are
>delicate aromatic oils from the hops in there that you'll lose because
>they can't handle boiling.

Exactly.

Actually, I don't even heat the extract a great deal - I soak the can
in boiling water for a few minutes, add some fairly hot water to the
fermenter (maybe 3 litres or so) - pour the extract in and stir. I use
more hot water to rinse the remnants of extract out of the can... once
the malts are also dissolved in that, then I just add cold water to
take it up to 24 litres - the overall temp then usually sites around
24 °C, which is about optimal for most yeasts.

> The only advice everybody always gives
>that's consistently right is make sure everything that comes in
>contact with your wort after you heat it up is completely sterilized,
>otherwise you'll end up with beer that tastes like you added malt
>vinegar to it.

That's not necessarily the case. I've never sterilised a single brew -
just paid careful attention to what I'm doing. That is all.
Any washing/rinsing is handled by an old nylon scourer and rain water.
No doubt one day I'll get a bad brew... but I've had one on the go
non-stop for the past 18 months and so far so good

> Don't try to punch up the alcohol content by adding
>sugar, either because that also creates weird, off flavors.

Agree. Actually, I'm not all that concerned about the alcohol content.

>either kits or partial extracts because all grain requires all sorts
>of extra stuff. There are a lot of logistical issues involved in
>heating five gallons of water and ten pounds of malted barley to a
>precise temperature and keeping it there for an hour, then draining
>off the water, sparging (pouring water over) the mass of sticky barley
>to get all the residual sugar, boiling the five gallons of sweet water
>for an hour, then getting it down to a temperature low enough to pitch
>before unwanted, wild yeasties find their way into it. There's no way
>to really explain it, other than to say that the more you do it the
>more you understand it and the easier it gets.

Yep. I really think an extract is the way to go for a beginner, for
all the reasons you've outlined above. There's many things to learn in
the whole process - if for your first time its possible to skip all
the grain processing part (the most time consuming part) - I say go
for it and focus on everything else.

On Mon, 19 Jul 2010 01:33:58 -0700, JL > wrote:

>There is the beef in beer.
>
>Slices or chunks of beef, sauted or 'browned' in oil on top of the stove.
>
>Then the beer is added.
>
>And the beef and any onions one has set to stew with the beef....garlic ....

Perhaps they're not beef... but I had pork and stout sausages for
dinner. Very nice they were too. Smelled great whilst still cooking in
the pan...

"Steve B" > wrote

>>
>> Try to find a good brew store too. The one I go to for supplies has both
>> beer and wine for customers to taste, chat about, etc. Always a fun
>> visit.
>
> In Utah? I don't think so, Ed.
>
> I went to the store the other day, and found that they had removed Pina
> Colada yogurt from their inventory. They also do not sell Amaretto
> flavored coffee flavoring. I guess pina colada yogurt and amaretto coffee
> creamer could be considered gateway drugs by SOME people. Anything that
> is liquor flavored, they will not sell.
>
> I'm so happy. Who knows where those gateway drugs could have taken me.
>
> Steve

Sounds like you will be viewed as Satan. Perhaps you should buy your
ingredients at one per store so t hey don't catch on to your evil plan.

"Jeßus" wrote:
>
> On Sun, 18 Jul 2010 23:25:26 -0500, "Pete C." >
> wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> >One piece of advise - bottling is the most work in the process, use
> >bigger bottles (I used 650ml size) to reduce your bottling effort. Also
> >recommend one of the bottle filler wands with the push actcuated valve
> >at the end, makes consistent filling a lot easier.
>
> Whilst using the bigger bottles cuts down on washing, cleaning, etc,
> it really all depends on how much you drink as to what size bottle to
> use, IMO.
>
> For example, I'm generally not a big drinker, so one of our
> (Australian) tall bottles (750ml) is usually too much for me. I'd only
> end up wasting half the bottle most times.
> So I do 95% of my bottling using 'stubbies' (375ml).
>
> Although in the past couple of weeks, I've gone from one or two
> stubbies per day to six or eight, only because I'm in the process of
> cutting and burning approx. 50 Blue Gum trees... hot and heavy work
> requires extra sustenance. That's my excuse anyway.
>
> The wand you mention is almost indispensable, I reckon.
>
> One thing that really IS golden advice IMO is to AVOID those hand held
> bottle cappers... the once you use a hammer to tap the lid on. Every
> last person I know who used one (not 'used') had nothing but
> expletives to say about them Instead, spend a bit more and get a
> decent lever actuated bottle capper...

I've never seen any "hammer on" bottle cappers. The most common style
here seems to be what we call a "butterfly" capper which is a handheld
unit that you place on top of the bottle and unfold two handles down on
opposite sides to crimp the cap on. Pretty easy to use, not as easy as a
stand mounted one lever unit, but close, and a lot cheaper.

JL wrote on Mon, 19 Jul 2010 01:33:58 -0700:

> Slices or chunks of beef, sauted or 'browned' in oil on top of
> the stove.

> Then the beer is added.

> And the beef and any onions one has set to stew with the
> beef....garlic .... --

>
> Mr. Joseph Paul Littleshoes Esq.

It's been around for a long time in Belgium: Carbonare (coal miner's
stew)!
--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Jul 18, 11:32*pm, "Steve B" > wrote:
> "Ed Pawlowski" > wrote in message
>
> news >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Steve B" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> Does anyone here make beer? *I believe I will get the stuff together and
> >> brew some this winter. *I would like to hear just from people who have
> >> actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
> >> BTW, this is OT.
>
> >> Well, no. *Yes. *Maybe. *Definitely. *I don't know. Steve
>
> > You may want to try rec.beer or alt.beer or one of the other many beer
> > groups.
>
> > MY son has made it, but I've only made wine. *I don't drink enough beer in
> > a year to justify the time or equipment.
>
> > Try to find a good brew store too. The one I go to for supplies has both
> > beer and wine for customers to taste, chat about, etc. *Always a fun
> > visit.
>
> In Utah? *I don't think so, Ed.
>
> I went to the store the other day, and found that they had removed Pina
> Colada yogurt from their inventory. *They also do not sell Amaretto flavored
> coffee flavoring. *I guess pina colada yogurt and amaretto coffee creamer
> could be considered gateway drugs by SOME people. *Anything that is liquor
> flavored, they will not sell.
>
> I'm so happy. *Who knows where those gateway drugs could have taken me.
>

Two brew stores in Salt Lake, and one in Ogden, according to Google.
Homebrewing became legal in UT last year:

http://www.realbeer.com/blog/?p=978

On 2010-07-19, Jeßus > wrote:

>>people will tell you to boil it for an hour.
>
> Boil it for an hour??? What on earth for???

Some methods of whole grain brewing require more water to extract the
starches from the grain. When lautering is completed, boiling down
the wort is required to concentrated it. Boiling times of up to 2 hrs
are sometimes needed. This not the case with extract brewing.

nb

Jeßus wrote:
> "Steve B" > wrote:
>
>>Does anyone here make beer?
>
> Yep.

Check out rec.crafts.brewing and www.mrbeer.com.

>> I believe I will get the stuff together and
>>brew some this winter. I would like to hear just from people who have
>>actually done it, and some pointers, and sites that are good.
>
> Do you intend starting from scratch (prep your own grains, etc) or use
> a 'kit' that has the wurt pre made? Nothing at all wrong with the
> latter, IMO. I use the kits all the time, as there are many good
> brands out there and I really don't think I can improve on them to any
> appreciable extent. And they are one *hell* of a time saver, without
> necessarily compromising on quality.

I suggest starting with kits and see if you enjoy it before moving up to
the high effort of malting your own grain.

The lowest effort kit I've seen was a sack style one I bought at Trader
Joes years ago. It was a sack already filled with malt syrup and hops
extract. Add near boiling hot water, shake, let cool for an hour, add
the yeast, close the lid, wait a few weeks then drink.

I love my Mr Beer kit system. It's easy and it makes 2 gallons not 5
gallons. I don't drink enough to justify a 5 gallon set but we recently
bought a 5 gallon carbouy as decor. I'll likely make mead in it rather
than ale.

> I have just received three hops rhizomes (Pride of Ringwood), which
> will be planted this week. Look forward to having my own fresh hops
> (which is not particularly cheap)

rec.gardens.edible is the place to go.

> Basically, I've found that if you follow the instructions to the
> letter, take your time, and use common sense - you'll get a great
> result every time. Almost all commercial beers taste like crap to me
> now

If you're fussy about commercial beers that can stop being true. I've
made nut brown ale in my Mr Beer that was not quite as good as Samuel
Smith's Nut Brown Ale. They've been at it a few centuries so they make
it better than I could pull off. On the other hand the pilsner kit that
came with the Mr Beer made a brew about as good as any imported pilsner
ever gets.

About half the time I use my Mr Beer to brew ale from kits and about
half the time I use it to brew small batches of mead from scratch. So
far I've never gotten together the equipment to malt my own grain from
scratch. The racks are pretty big so plan on using most of the back
yard.

> The *one* thing I've done 'wrong' thus far is not use any kind of
> sterilising agent on any of the equipment. After about 40 brews -
> never had a problem... I simply clean everything with a worn nylon
> scouring pad and rain water.

The first time I made root beer from scratch I was not careful about
sterilsing the equipment. Most of the bottles exploded in my back yard
shed.

James Silverton wrote:

> JL wrote on Mon, 19 Jul 2010 01:33:58 -0700:
>
> > Slices or chunks of beef, sauted or 'browned' in oil on top of
> > the stove.
>
>
> > Then the beer is added.
>
>
> > And the beef and any onions one has set to stew with the
> > beef....garlic .... --
>
>
> >
> > Mr. Joseph Paul Littleshoes Esq.
>
>
> It's been around for a long time in Belgium: Carbonare (coal miner's
> stew)!

Yep, a favorite, i have even gone so far as to roast a pot of sliced
onions after i have carmalized them on top of the stove.

Once i get them nicely carmalized i put them in a 350 F oven for a nhour
or so and end up with a "mahogony" much that is added to the dish to
flavor the sauce along with more onins & other ingredients.

--

Mr. Joseph Paul Littleshoes Esq.

If you're going to try the dish, go with a dark, malty ale or lager. Pabst ain't cvuttin' it here.

You actually save beer by using bigger bottles becasue when you pout (decant) your homebrew into a glass; you have to pull up short to avoid the bottom yeast entering the vessel from which you hope to enjoy the beer. 12 oz bottle, you'll have 1/2 oz left over (save the yeast, it's pure vitamin B). When I ghettod my batch and used two liter bottle, I got maybe and once-1 1/2oz sediment. thick pint bottle are my favorite, though.

Butterfly is the capper you want to start. Order many more caps than you need. They are cheap and I bet you'll ruin about 4-10 year first 5 gallon/2.5 case batch. If you get a glass carboy; you can forget the and just use the bottle cleaner (if you get one). You may need the brush if you have a real thick batch; but the bottle cleaner and some B-brite should kill any germs and get 'er clean.

I'll confess that I didn't crack open those two liter bottles until company came over. It'd be a test to drink that much dark lager at +/- 7%. I would decant them into a large pitcher I have; and let my buds enjoy watching the layers of foam settle into the beautifully dark ale. then pour individual servings. That batch cost me like $10 because I bought closeout dark extracts and some hops I had left over from another batch.

"Gorio" > wrote

goood instructions snipped

.. (Honey, ferments like crazy and all the way through, though. Adds
> a crispness.) Enjoy.
> Gorio

I just had some HoneyMoon beer, IIRC, and it was flavored with honey and
orange peel. Very subtle, but good.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

Steve B wrote:
>
> We found his dad's bottle capper and caps. During that era, screw tops were
> not invented yet, so we had hundreds of bottles. We put a little water in
> them, a little piece of dry ice, and capped them. Then we took them out in
> a field, and shot them with our bb guns. As we were shooting them, some
> would blow up by themselves. We luckily never had one go off while doing
> it, or doing handling.

Two liter soda bottle, empty. Screw cap. Rope and a cinder block.
Some dry ice. One of those kidney shaped pools with the round bottoms.
Get someone else to combine all of the ingredients and grin fiercely
while watching at a distance. I repeat - Get someone else to combine
all of the ingredients. The sound is deafening.

> God watches over fools and little children. Mostly.

And students who manage to get someone else to do it ...

"Jeßus" > wrote > One thing that really IS golden advice
IMO is to AVOID those hand held
> bottle cappers... the once you use a hammer to tap the lid on. Every
> last person I know who used one (not 'used') had nothing but
> expletives to say about them Instead, spend a bit more and get a
> decent lever actuated bottle capper...

When I was a kid, my best friend and I, who always had too much time on our
hands, and too little supervision, came up with an idea.

We found his dad's bottle capper and caps. During that era, screw tops were
not invented yet, so we had hundreds of bottles. We put a little water in
them, a little piece of dry ice, and capped them. Then we took them out in
a field, and shot them with our bb guns. As we were shooting them, some
would blow up by themselves. We luckily never had one go off while doing
it, or doing handling.

God watches over fools and little children. Mostly.

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

notbob wrote:
> On 2010-07-19, Jeßus > wrote:
>
>>> people will tell you to boil it for an hour.
>> Boil it for an hour??? What on earth for???
>
> Some methods of whole grain brewing require more water to extract the
> starches from the grain. When lautering is completed, boiling down
> the wort is required to concentrated it. Boiling times of up to 2 hrs
> are sometimes needed. This not the case with extract brewing.
>
> nb


From what I remember, even beer made from malt extract syrup needs a
good long boil to extract the hops bitterness and it probably
denatures the proteins in the malt so they fall out of solution or
break down into yeast nutrients or something. You add additional hops
during the last 10 minutes for flavor and aroma.

Bob

"Jeßus" > wrote

> Nectar of the Gods is food AFAIAC

"Beer is proof God loves us." - Benjamin Franklin -

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On 07/19/2010 01:59 AM, Jeßus wrote:

>
> Boil it for an hour??? What on earth for?

>> Don't try to punch up the alcohol content by adding
>> sugar, either because that also creates weird, off flavors.
>
> Agree. Actually, I'm not all that concerned about the alcohol content.

If you're starting with a can (or two!) of malt extract syrup than has
already had hops added, you don't need to boil at all. Just follow the
instructions on the can. Often all you have to do is add water, stir and
add yeast.

However, if you need to add hops, a long boil is necessary. Hops add
bitterness and flavor/aroma. Problem is, the bitterness compounds (alpha
acids) aren't soluble in water. So the heat of boiling changes
(isomerizes) them to water-soluble form. The change proceeds slowly,
taking about an hour or more, before everything is converted.

The flavor/aroma components (beta acids) do indeed boil off, so more
hops are added at ten minutes before the end for flavor, and again after
the heat has been turned off, for aroma. Hops are bred for one or the
other use, so you use Saaz hops, say, for bittering and Cascade hops for
flavor and aroma. These are just an example, but they are the
combination that Sierra Nevada uses in their Pale Ale.

Refined white table sugar only produces additional alcohol when added to
the wort. It doesn't add any off flavors at all, unless you consider
high alcohol a flavor. Every homebrewer has to try at least one
high-alcohol brew, either by adding table sugar or additional malt. It's
so easy, they usually settle down to improving other aspects of their
brew after that.

One last piece of unsolicited advice: make sure your wort is well
aerated just before adding the yeast. Yeast starts off in a respiration
phase, where it is coming out of dormancy, taking in oxygen and
nutrients from the wort, building strong cell walls, dividing, etc.
until the oxygen is pretty much used up. This may only take minutes.
Then it goes into its fermentation phase, where the sugar is turned into
alcohol and CO2. If the wort is not aerated enough, the fermentation is
weak, sluggish, and may even stop before completion (stuck
fermentation). Shake the heck out of the wort, raise some foam, do
whatever it takes to get some air into it. Your yeast will be happier
for it. A well-aerated wort might start bubbling within 15 minutes and
finish fermenting in two days. YMMV

On Jul 19, 12:35*pm, Whirled Peas > wrote:
> On 07/19/2010 01:59 AM, Jeßus wrote:
>
>
>
> > Boil it for an hour??? What on earth for?
> >> Don't try to punch up the alcohol content by adding
> >> sugar, either because that also creates weird, off flavors.
>
> > Agree. Actually, I'm not all that concerned about the alcohol content.
>
> If you're starting with a can (or two!) of malt extract syrup than has
> already had hops added, you don't need to boil at all. Just follow the
> instructions on the can. Often all you have to do is add water, stir and
> add yeast.
>
> However, if you need to add hops, a long boil is necessary. Hops add
> bitterness and flavor/aroma. Problem is, the bitterness compounds (alpha
> acids) aren't soluble in water. So the heat of boiling changes
> (isomerizes) them to water-soluble form. The change proceeds slowly,
> taking about an hour or more, before everything is converted.
>
> The flavor/aroma components (beta acids) do indeed boil off, so more
> hops are added at ten minutes before the end for flavor, and again after
> the heat has been turned off, for aroma. Hops are bred for one or the
> other use, so you use Saaz hops, say, for bittering and Cascade hops for
> flavor and aroma. These are just an example, but they are the
> combination that Sierra Nevada uses in their Pale Ale.

Sierra has it ass-backwards then, because Saaz has only half the alpha
acids of Cascades. Saaz is the noblest of aroma hops, and is in short
supply. Essential for Pilsner Urquell, using Saaz for bittering only
is like using your Rolls Royce as a manure hauler. Cascades can be
used for bittering or flavor.

>
> Refined white table sugar only produces additional alcohol when added to
> the wort. It doesn't add any off flavors at all, unless you consider
> high alcohol a flavor. Every homebrewer has to try at least one
> high-alcohol brew, either by adding table sugar or additional malt. It's
> so easy, they usually settle down to improving other aspects of their
> brew after that.

Only Brits add sucrose to their beer. Americans add corn sugar.

> One last piece of unsolicited advice: make sure your wort is well
> aerated just before adding the yeast. Yeast starts off in a respiration
> phase, where it is coming out of dormancy, taking in oxygen and
> nutrients from the wort, building strong cell walls, dividing, etc.
> until the oxygen is pretty much used up. This may only take minutes.
> Then it goes into its fermentation phase, where the sugar is turned into
> alcohol and CO2. If the wort is not aerated enough, the fermentation is
> weak, sluggish, and may even stop before completion (stuck
> fermentation). Shake the heck out of the wort, raise some foam, do
> whatever it takes to get some air into it. Your yeast will be happier
> for it. A well-aerated wort might start bubbling within 15 minutes and
> finish fermenting in two days. YMMV

On 07/19/2010 12:47 PM, spamtrap1888 wrote:

> Sierra has it ass-backwards then, because Saaz has only half the alpha
> acids of Cascades. Saaz is the noblest of aroma hops, and is in short
> supply. Essential for Pilsner Urquell, using Saaz for bittering only
> is like using your Rolls Royce as a manure hauler. Cascades can be
> used for bittering or flavor.

Sierra Nevada got it right, *I* misremembered. Cascades for bittering,
Saaz for flavor/aroma. Thanks for catching it.

On 2010-07-19, zxcvbob > wrote:

> From what I remember, even beer made from malt extract syrup needs a
> good long boil to extract the hops bitterness and it probably
> denatures the proteins in the malt so they fall out of solution or
> break down into yeast nutrients or something. You add additional hops
> during the last 10 minutes for flavor and aroma.

Correct.

I didn't mean to imply extract brewed wort doesn't require any boiling
at all, only that it doesn't need to be boiled as long as lautered
whole grain wort. This to answer the question of why would anyone
boil wort longer than one hour. My mentor figured all his brewing to
a 90 min boil. In the case of Dogfish Head 120 IPA, the 120 is number
of minutes the wort is boiled.

nb

Sucrose and/or corn sugar if you hope to get a cardboard taste from your brew. Belgians, though, do add candy sugar (dark) to some beers. Probably better sucrose than corn, though. Blah! Go for the long boil just to be sure. Makes the house smell like heaven.

On Jul 19, 12:29*pm, notbob > wrote:
> On 2010-07-19, Jeßus > wrote:
>
> >>people will tell you to boil it for an hour.
>
> > Boil it for an hour??? What on earth for???


There is something called a Protein Break that some homebrewers
adamantly claim you simply must achieve with every batch of wort, no
matter what, hence boiling and boiling. I've made homebrew with and
without boiling the holy hell out of the wort and it didn't make any
difference. I've also used the packet of "shitty" yeast in the lid of
the can of flavored base and it came out fine. I have used tap water,
heated my barley water (Tea) to over 160 degrees, tossed hop pellets
directly into the fermentation vessel and once cooled my wort by
dumping a three pound bag of Home City Ice directly into the
fermentation bucket. Experts the Internet over will concur that these
are terrible, terrible abuses of beer that are guaranteed to destroy
everything you worked for. In every case, the beer came out fine. As
long as everything is clean, you have a fair amount of leeway to dick
around with making beer.

Amen! I've gone whole grain and all extract. Goo ingredients + good water=good beer. All malt (can be extract), my tap water is great and I do use sheap cascades, and I agree with using Saaz and Hallertauers as finishers only. Most pale ales I've had from US micros taste like a frickin' flower head. I guess our "brewmasters" think ales should be hopped at an excruciatingly high level. Yuck. Try some of the stuff from Scotland, and you'll taste some malt. Yum!!

On 2010-07-20, Gorio > wrote:

>> long as everything is clean, you have a fair amount of leeway to dick
>> around with making beer.

Yep. My mentor taught me the gospel of brewing, from sanitation to 1
deg F and 1 min accuracey. When he was satisfied I was sufficiently
indoctrinated, he then proceeded to regularly break about every
cardinal rule I'd learned. Shortcuts aplenty!

> finishers only. Most pale ales I've had from US micros taste like a
> frickin' flower head. I guess our "brewmasters" think ales should be
> hopped at an excruciatingly high level. Yuck.

Strangely, I can't be overdosed by hops. My fave ale is hopped to 100
ibu's and I can take more. It probably has something to do with the
fact I worked on a CA hops ranch for 3 summers when I was a teen. I
recall the very first day I came looking for a job. I got within 100
feet of the hops shed and almost lost my breakfast. It was almost as
bad as a full dose of skunk. Now, I could smear fresh buds all
ooooover my baaawdy and swim through a trainload of lupulin!

BTW, the primary protein break occurs in the first five mins of a full
boil. The rest can be filtered out or will fall out naturally if aged
properly.

nb