"S Viemeister" > wrote in message
...
> On 6/15/2012 12:11 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 15/06/2012 8:29 AM, Janet wrote:
>>
>>> In my climate I just run the cold tap a minute until the water coming
>>> out is *really* cold from deep underground.
>>
>> My water comes from a well and sits in the tank in the water pressure
>> system. Unless I flush with 5 gallons, it is more likely to be room
>> temperature. From my experience I think that is good enough. Putting a
>> couple tablespoons of water into three cups of flour and shortening is
>> going to warm up the water instantly anyway. The important thing is to
>> use at least cool, not hot water.
>
> I measure out my water, then pop it in the fridge or freezer while I weigh
> out the other ingredients.


I always have a container of ice water in the fridge, I drink lots of water.

Cheri

On 15/06/2012 2:18 PM, Kalmia wrote:

>
> I went thru a 5 lb. bag of flour one night trying to make decent crust
> - never again. So now I buy it, or make a graham cracker crust - but
> usually just don't make pies - period. Too many other dessert choices
> out there.

Sorry to hear that. I have never wasted a whole batch of dough. I have
always been in the habit of saving the trimmings with vague plans to do
something with them, but after a few weeks in the fridge I end up
throwing them out.

While my mother thinks that she taught me how to make pies when I was a
kid. I give the real credit to my older brother. I used to go there for
a beer or three in the afternoon and he always had rhubarb plants in the
yard, and in the spring months we would spend the afternoon making pies.
He showed me how to work the pastry and how to roll it out. With the
basics down pat I figured out some stuff on my own.

To tell you the truth, if you are doing it right it is easy.... easy as pie.

- measure two cups of flour into a mixing bowl and stir in 3/4 tsp. salt
..... sift it you feel you must, I don't.

- using pastry cutter or large fork, cut in 1 cup Crisco. You can also
use butter or lard. NOTE..... cut it only ot looks like coarse
cornmeal. You need pieces of shortening in there to melt out and make
it flaky.

- beat one egg and add 2 Tblsp. cold water and 1 Tblsp vinegar.

- stir the liquid to the flour and shortening mixture and mix until it
forms a clump. Divide the ball into two equal pieces, roll into balls,
flatten out slightly by hand, wrap them with plastic wrap or waxed paper
and shove them into the fridge for a few minutes while you prepare the
fruit.

- Take the dough discs out of the fridge, sprinkle some flour on the
rolling surface (I prefer a pastry cloth). Dust the top of the disc
generously with flour and dust your rolling pin.

-Start near the centre and roll out, then in the centre and roll it in
the opposite direction, turn the pin or the dough 90 and repeat, then
continue rolling out, rotating a few degrees each time so that it is
rolling out into an approximate circle and a little larger than you pie
pan.


- transfer your rolled pastry to the pan, making sure to allow it to
drop to the bottom of the pan.

- roll out the second pastry ball

- pour your fruit mixture into the pastry lined pan, transfer the second
piece to cover. Dab with bits of butter Run a sharp knife around the
outside lip of the pie pan then roll and crimp the top and bottom crust,
and poke some holes in the top to vent steam.

Bake

On 15/06/2012 1:08 PM, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 6/15/2012 12:11 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 15/06/2012 8:29 AM, Janet wrote:
>>
>>> In my climate I just run the cold tap a minute until the water coming
>>> out is *really* cold from deep underground.
>>
>> My water comes from a well and sits in the tank in the water pressure
>> system. Unless I flush with 5 gallons, it is more likely to be room
>> temperature. From my experience I think that is good enough. Putting a
>> couple tablespoons of water into three cups of flour and shortening is
>> going to warm up the water instantly anyway. The important thing is to
>> use at least cool, not hot water.
>
> I measure out my water, then pop it in the fridge or freezer while I
> weigh out the other ingredients.

You can measure the water and add an ice cube. If you are working at a
reasonable speed it is not going to affect the volume of water much.

On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 09:38:05 -0800, (Judy Haffner)
wrote:

>
>John Kuthe wrote:
>
>>Always make my own. Here's my recipe:
>
>>2 cups Swans Down flour
>>1.5 sticks butter (cool but room temp)
>>1 tsp salt
>
>>Cut together with two forks. Breakup as
>< many butter lumps as you can by
>> squeezing between fork tines in flour.
>> Takes time. When well incorporated,
>> add:
>>1/4 cup cold cream, plus a dash of cold
>> water as needed to swiftly stir together
>> and bring together as dough.
>
>>Put in plastic wrap, fold over plastic wrap
>> and squeeze together as dough mass.
>> Let rest ion cool place for several hours
>> to overnight.
>
>>Can put in refrigerator but let come to
>> room temp to roll out.
>
>I've never heard of using cream before for pie crust...hmmmmmm?

There's just not enough butter in it yet, yano? ;-)


>Is that All-Purpose flour? I don't see that brand around here, but was
>thinking mom bought it years ago and was cake flour?

It's what my mother used, and it's what I use.


>Some interesting pie crust methods in this group...am learning a lot
>(even at my ol' age!)
>
>Judy

Just goes to show, it all works!

John Kuthe...

On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 09:26:31 -0800, (Judy Haffner)
wrote:

>
>Jim wrote:
>
>>Marie and I are good friends-
>
>That brand of frozen food is pretty darn good alright...the frozen lemon
>meringue pie is pretty hard to beat and the meringue doesn't get "weepy"
>on top and the crust doesn't get soggy and the lemon flavor is tart and
>not overly sweet.
>
>Now they have the little frozen pies (have you seen those) that are the
>size of the little pot pies.

Haven't seen them- but I don't get all that excited about pies-- so
they might be in the store.

We love the chicken pot pies, though.

They are my 'I don't want to cook, so nuke yourself a pot-pie'
salvation. Every so often someone will say-- 'Could you *not* cook
tonight-- we want pot pies.'

She used to make a Tuna pot pie that my wife would kill for if she
ever saw one again.

Jim

"Christopher M." wrote:
>
> There's plenty of great pie crusts at the supermarket.
> No reason to struggle with fancy techniques like using ice water.

Name one and I'll give it a try. I've never had a decent store or bakery
pie crust.

Gary

Judy Haffner wrote:
>
> Gary wrote:
>
> >I always make my own, and I use Crisco
> > and the Crisco recipe. For savory pies I
> > use lard instead of Crisco.
>
> Good for you, making your own crust, Gary.

Hi Judy,

Thank you for the compliment as I do make my own crust.
That was "Dave Smith" that wrote what you responded to though, not me.
Please congratulate him too! :-D

Gary

Dave Smith wrote:
>
> On 15/06/2012 8:29 AM, Janet wrote:
>
> > In my climate I just run the cold tap a minute until the water coming
> > out is *really* cold from deep underground.
>
> My water comes from a well and sits in the tank in the water pressure
> system. Unless I flush with 5 gallons, it is more likely to be room
> temperature. From my experience I think that is good enough. Putting a
> couple tablespoons of water into three cups of flour and shortening is
> going to warm up the water instantly anyway. The important thing is to
> use at least cool, not hot water.

Perhaps putting flour and shortening in fridge would help solve this cold
water issue?

Gary

On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 00:01:05 -0700 (PDT), "
> wrote:

> The trouble most people have with homemade pie crust is they don't
> know when to leave it alone. First, they cut the shortening in too
> much so the crust comes out mealy rather than flaky. If you want a
> flaky crust you need to leave large chunks of shortening. Second,
> people tend to over mix the dough. If it's not coming together and
> seems dry, don't be afraid to add a few more drops of water.

My problem was that I added too much water. It didn't look like it
was coming together, so I'd add more water. It was tough and awful.
As soon as I found the FP recipe, my pie crust mojo changed for the
better and I'd rather make my own now. I use the +1T extra water
option and it's right every time.

> Once
> the dough comes together, knead it lightly maybe 5 or 6 times so it
> stays together, wrap it up, and refrigerate it for at least 30
> minutes.

Nope. I keep my paws off it except the amount of handling it needs to
make it a nice disk with even edges.

> The third mistake people make is they try to roll out the
> crust as soon as they take it out of the refrigerator. Let it warm up
> 5 - 10 minutes. You'll be able to roll it out without overstretching
> it. One trick I always do is roll the dough out on waxed paper. That
> way I can pick up the waxed paper with the rolled out crust on it,
> flip it over into the pie pan, and then simply peel it off.

I roll it around my rolling pin or fold it into quarters, which works
for me - but my kitchen is cool, so I don't need to worry about the
crust sticking to anything.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 04:22:37 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

> I use crisco, cold water, pinch of salt, and pinch of baking powder. Usually get rave reviews. Start with recipe on crisco can. Don't mess with it very much.

Sounds pretty much like what my friend's MIL does and her crust is
fantastic.


--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 15:12:42 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

> I have never wasted a whole batch of dough. I have
> always been in the habit of saving the trimmings with vague plans to do
> something with them, but after a few weeks in the fridge I end up
> throwing them out.

You don't make pie crust cookies? Just sprinkle with cinnamon sugar
and bake.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On Jun 15, 11:08*am, Dave Smith > wrote:
> On 15/06/2012 8:38 AM, S Viemeister wrote:
>
> > I use my food processor for pie crust - mine is just as good as my
> > mother's but much faster, so I do it more often.
>
> What does that say about your mother's pie crust?
> I have made hundreds of pies over the years. I have got away with using
> a mixer or a food processor, but you have to be careful not to overdo
> it. *You want chunks of shortening in the pastry.

Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.

--Bryan

On 15/06/2012 8:25 PM, sf wrote:

>
> My problem was that I added too much water. It didn't look like it
> was coming together, so I'd add more water. It was tough and awful.
> As soon as I found the FP recipe, my pie crust mojo changed for the
> better and I'd rather make my own now. I use the +1T extra water
> option and it's right every time.

You could probably have got away with it by using extra bench flour when
rolling it out.

> Nope. I keep my paws off it except the amount of handling it needs to
> make it a nice disk with even edges.

Egg Zachary.
Start off with a reasonably round disc, a little bench flour on the
surface and on the pin and roll out from the centre, rolling out the
shortest edges to try to keep an even diameter and the result should be
reasonably round.
..

On 15/06/2012 8:29 PM, sf wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 15:12:42 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> I have never wasted a whole batch of dough. I have
>> always been in the habit of saving the trimmings with vague plans to do
>> something with them, but after a few weeks in the fridge I end up
>> throwing them out.
>
> You don't make pie crust cookies? Just sprinkle with cinnamon sugar
> and bake.
>

I have.. I have also made little turnovers. They aren't quite as good as
those with puff pastry but a regular pie dough turnover is a hell of a
lot better than no turnover at all/

Bryan wrote:

> Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.

That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?

On Jun 15, 8:29*pm, George M. Middius > wrote:
> Bryan wrote:
> > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
>
> That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
> people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?

No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. Tobacco
doesn't kill in the short term either.

--Bryan

On Jun 15, 9:45*pm, Bryan > wrote:
> On Jun 15, 8:29*pm, George M. Middius > wrote:
>
> > Bryan wrote:
> > > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> > > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
>
> > That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
> > people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
>
> No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
> coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. *Tobacco
> doesn't kill in the short term either.
>
> --Bryan

You're gonna die of something so you may as well stop worrying about
whether something is bad for you. Whether you live to be 58 or 98, in
the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter.

On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 20:49:27 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

> I have.. I have also made little turnovers. They aren't quite as good as
> those with puff pastry but a regular pie dough turnover is a hell of a
> lot better than no turnover at all/

That reminds me of some person in the UK group who asked for an apple
Danish recipe. I gave him an option that sounded goood, but it wasn't
like the "real thing".

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

In article >,
says...
>
> On 15/06/2012 8:29 PM, sf wrote:
> > On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 15:12:42 -0400, Dave Smith
> > > wrote:
> >
> >> I have never wasted a whole batch of dough. I have
> >> always been in the habit of saving the trimmings with vague plans to do
> >> something with them, but after a few weeks in the fridge I end up
> >> throwing them out.
> >
> > You don't make pie crust cookies? Just sprinkle with cinnamon sugar
> > and bake.
> >
>
> I have.. I have also made little turnovers. They aren't quite as good as
> those with puff pastry but a regular pie dough turnover is a hell of a
> lot better than no turnover at all/

I often use the leftover pastry to make a little turnover or custard
tart for elderly single friends.. most of them don't bother home-baking
for themselves.

Janet

Janet wrote:
>
> I often use the leftover pastry to make a little turnover or custard
> tart...

I did that once and filled the shells with lemon flavored yogurt.
It worked well - just like eating a tiny lemon pie.

Gary

wrote:

> > > > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> > > > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
> >
> > > That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
> > > people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
> >
> > No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
> > coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. *Tobacco
> > doesn't kill in the short term either.

> You're gonna die of something so you may as well stop worrying about
> whether something is bad for you. Whether you live to be 58 or 98, in
> the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter.

Fatalism is incompatible with Type A micromanagement.

Bryan wrote:

> > > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> > > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
> >
> > That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
> > people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
>
> No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
> coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. Tobacco
> doesn't kill in the short term either.

So what you actually meant is that coronary artery disease kills all
those people, and some unknown fraction of coronary artery disease
deaths can be traced directly to consuming hydrogenated fats.

On 16/06/2012 1:48 AM, sf wrote:
> On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 20:49:27 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> I have.. I have also made little turnovers. They aren't quite as good as
>> those with puff pastry but a regular pie dough turnover is a hell of a
>> lot better than no turnover at all/
>
> That reminds me of some person in the UK group who asked for an apple
> Danish recipe. I gave him an option that sounded goood, but it wasn't
> like the "real thing".
>

I have been to Denmark several times and had the real thing. They are
remarkable.

On Jun 16, 8:08*am, George M. Middius > wrote:
> Bryan wrote:
> > > > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> > > > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol..
>
> > > That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
> > > people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
>
> > No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
> > coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. *Tobacco
> > doesn't kill in the short term either.
>
> So what you actually meant is that coronary artery disease kills all
> those people, and some unknown fraction of coronary artery disease
> deaths can be traced directly to consuming hydrogenated fats.

Yes. That's what I meant, though the word, "directly," isn't what I'd
choose.

--Bryan

Bryan wrote:

> > > > > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
> > > > > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
> >
> > > > That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
> > > > people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
> >
> > > No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
> > > coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. *Tobacco
> > > doesn't kill in the short term either.
> >
> > So what you actually meant is that coronary artery disease kills all
> > those people, and some unknown fraction of coronary artery disease
> > deaths can be traced directly to consuming hydrogenated fats.
>
> Yes. That's what I meant, though the word, "directly," isn't what I'd
> choose.

Without asserting there's a direct causal connection, what was your
point supposed to be?

On Sat, 16 Jun 2012 10:52:28 -0400, George M. Middius
> wrote:

>Bryan wrote:
>
>> > > > > Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
>> > > > > people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
>> >
>> > > > That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
>> > > > people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
>> >
>> > > No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
>> > > coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. *Tobacco
>> > > doesn't kill in the short term either.
>> >
>> > So what you actually meant is that coronary artery disease kills all
>> > those people, and some unknown fraction of coronary artery disease
>> > deaths can be traced directly to consuming hydrogenated fats.
>>
>> Yes. That's what I meant, though the word, "directly," isn't what I'd
>> choose.
>
>Without asserting there's a direct causal connection, what was your
>point supposed to be?
>
>

Bryan is an expert in CAD, didn't you know? After all, he has the
Internet!

;-)

John Kuthe...

On 16/06/2012 9:08 AM, George M. Middius wrote:
> Bryan wrote:
>
>>>> Crisco-type shortenings have killed more people than any other thing
>>>> people deliberately consume other than tobacco, or possibly alcohol.
>>>
>>> That claim sounds outlandish. Do you believe Crisco gets caught in
>>> people's windpipes, causing them to suffocate?
>>
>> No, it gets caught in people's arteries, causing them to die from
>> coronary artery disease, high blood pressure and stroke. Tobacco
>> doesn't kill in the short term either.
>
> So what you actually meant is that coronary artery disease kills all
> those people, and some unknown fraction of coronary artery disease
> deaths can be traced directly to consuming hydrogenated fats.
>
That about sums it up. People with coronary heart disease are supposed
to avoid hydrogenated fats. FWIW, at my consultation with a cardiac
dietitian I was told that I could have the occasional piece of pie....
occasional.... and watch portion sizes. However, she did not see much
difference between lard and shortening.

I do both.

If I buy one I get it at Trader Joe's where they use actual butter and
few scary ingredients.

I prefer to make my own but sometimes things get in the way. Lately
I've been using this recipe and it's really good -
http://tinyurl.com/7yo79r3

I've also made it with half butter and half lard and that was pretty
awesome.

marcella

On 6/16/2012 6:26 PM, Marcella Peek wrote:
> I do both.
>
> If I buy one I get it at Trader Joe's where they use actual butter and
> few scary ingredients.
>
> I prefer to make my own but sometimes things get in the way. Lately
> I've been using this recipe and it's really good -
> http://tinyurl.com/7yo79r3
>
> I've also made it with half butter and half lard and that was pretty
> awesome.
>
I generally use half butter, half lard - and you're right, it's awesome!