I have been making sugar free chocolate by melting 100% cacao bars and then
mixing in the artifical sweetener, pouring directly to the molds. That
works fine. Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I got
a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
to use honey instead of sucrose.

--
W

"W" > wrote in message
...
>I have been making sugar free chocolate by melting 100% cacao bars and then
> mixing in the artifical sweetener, pouring directly to the molds. That
> works fine. Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I
> got
> a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
> frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
> water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
> rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
> the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
> to use honey instead of sucrose.

I've never heard of honey sweetened molded chocolate and I doubt that it can
be done. Honey is a liquid.

Use almond milk.

N.

On Saturday, January 24, 2015 at 12:49:19 AM UTC-5, W wrote:
> Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I got
> a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
> frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
> water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
> rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
> the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
> to use honey instead of sucrose.

It's called "seizing" the chocolate. Any water or water containing liquid will do that when you're trying to temper solid chocolate. If you can dehydrated honey, and I don't even know if such exists, that would probably work.

Bill Ranck
Blacksburg, VA

On Sat, 24 Jan 2015 06:17:27 -0800 (PST), "
> wrote:

>On Saturday, January 24, 2015 at 12:49:19 AM UTC-5, W wrote:
>> Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I got
>> a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
>> frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
>> water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
>> rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
>> the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
>> to use honey instead of sucrose.
>
>It's called "seizing" the chocolate. Any water or water containing liquid will do that when you're trying to temper solid chocolate. If you can dehydrated honey, and I don't even know if such exists, that would probably work.

http://www.honey.com/images/uploads/...driedhoney.pdf

On Fri, 23 Jan 2015 22:25:12 -0800, "Julie Bove"
> wrote:

>
>"W" > wrote in message
...
>>I have been making sugar free chocolate by melting 100% cacao bars and then
>> mixing in the artifical sweetener, pouring directly to the molds. That
>> works fine. Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I
>> got
>> a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
>> frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
>> water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
>> rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
>> the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
>> to use honey instead of sucrose.
>
>I've never heard of honey sweetened molded chocolate and I doubt that it can
>be done. Honey is a liquid.

Honeyand cacao would certainly yield a syrup.

John Kuthe...

---
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> Honeyand cacao would certainly yield a syrup.

It created something more like a thick frosting. The melted cacao became
very viscous, it thickened, was drying rapidly, etc.

--
W

"W" > wrote in message
...
>> Honeyand cacao would certainly yield a syrup.
>
> It created something more like a thick frosting. The melted cacao became
> very viscous, it thickened, was drying rapidly, etc.

I have since looked it up and there are a few companies selling chocolate
sweetened with honey so apparently it can be done. But the only recipe I
saw involved cocoa powder and some kind of fat so that wouldn't yield what
you want either. You might want to develop a taste for straight on cocoa
nibs and just eat those for the health benefits.

On Saturday, January 24, 2015 at 6:17:32 AM UTC-8, wrote:
> On Saturday, January 24, 2015 at 12:49:19 AM UTC-5, W wrote:
> > Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I got
> > a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
> > frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
> > water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
> > rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
> > the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
> > to use honey instead of sucrose.
>
> It's called "seizing" the chocolate. Any water or water containing liquid will do that when you're trying to temper solid chocolate. If you can dehydrated honey, and I don't even know if such exists, that would probably work.
>

I have a couple opened jars of honey here that don't pour any more.
Most of the honey inside has crystallized. I just dig it out with a
grapefruit spoon when I want to use some.
h

On 2015-01-25 3:41 PM, wrote:

>
> I have a couple opened jars of honey here that don't pour any more.
> Most of the honey inside has crystallized. I just dig it out with a
> grapefruit spoon when I want to use some.
> h
>


You can set the jar in a pot with some water and heat it up. The honey
will revert to liquid.

If you are lactose intolerant, try using Dairy Ease milk. I use it in any recipe that calls for milk. It comes in whole milk to 100% fat free.

Denise in NH

On 1/23/2015 11:49 PM, W wrote:
> I have been making sugar free chocolate by melting 100% cacao bars and then
> mixing in the artifical sweetener, pouring directly to the molds. That
> works fine. Today I wanted to try using honey as the sweetener, and I got
> a surprise. The chocolate goes from liquid consistency to almost like a
> frosting, and it would be impossible to pour. I loosened it up with just
> water, and that sort of worked, but the resulting mixture still dries hard
> rapidly. I cannot use milk because of a lactose intolerance. What is
> the recommended mixture if you want the chocolate to pour easily? I want
> to use honey instead of sucrose.
>

http://chocolatealchemy.com/chocolate-and-water-faq/

“If I use just a little bit of water, shouldn’t I be able to dissolve
the sugar and mix it with the chocolate and then I don’t need the
Melanger?”

Variations of this are “can I use honey, or agave syrup or something
like that?”

My basic answer to these questions are “No, it just doesn’t quite work
that way. If you add water to chocolate in general it will seize and
you will end up with a thick fudge like chocolate product, but not
really standard chocolate than can be tempered”.

If there was any practical way to get water into chocolate, it would
be done commercially on a mass basis. Water is cheap and nutritionally
perfect. Water in a chocolate system raises a lot of complex concerns:

1) Blending water and oil means you’re making an emulsion. This means
the opacity of the chocolate and viscosity will be affected. Think
about mayonnaise.

2) Cacao is a rich source of insoluble but water absorbent fibers
(cellulose, primarily) which tends to cause the particles to draw in
the water and swell up, further disrupting the texture. The cacao
particles then tend to push away the cocoa butter.

3) Adding water means many new enzymes that were perhaps previously
inactive due to lack of water can become active - remember, many
enzymes work in non-aqueous systems with as little as 3-5% water.
Adding a large amount of water (or water in the absence of sugar)
could lead to issues with water activity and microbial concerns.

4) The presence of liquids will weaken or disrupt the tempering
process and alter the texture of the cooled product. Depending on the
amount and size of the water droplets, this can vary from making the
chocolate softer to totally crumbly and impossible to temper to making
ganache.

Adding emulsifiers can help blend the water with the oil better,
keeping it in smaller particles. This helps reduce problems 2 and 4 a
lot, but tends to cause an increase in the viscosity of the system,
potentially worsening problem 1. For these purposes, lecithin is an
alright emulsifier, PGPR works even better, and there are tons of
there emulsifiers out there (mono & diglycerides, datem, etc. come to
mind as solid water in oil emulsifiers). If you can add the liquid
directly to the fat and emulsifier and blend agressively, sans cacao
solids, it is better as you break the water up into smaller particles.

Using liquids that are mostly dissolved solids is also a good move, as
they are slightly less lipophobic. This is where corn syrup, honey,
etc. come in. The added viscosity also can tend to make the solution
more stable, by interfering with surface tension and making it more
difficult for droplets to re-agglomerate. Just think about trying
tomix honey and butter versus water and butter.

But, bottom line, it IS possible to make a sort dark chocolate like
substance using something like a thick agave syrup. You use a lot more
cocoa butter and not too much agave syrup, and the end chocolate is
softer and doesn’t develop a true temper/snap as you’d like… but it
DOES work, and it sot of tempers. The same concept applies to any kind
of similar syrup. The trick is careful incorporation, not using too
much and understanding that the chocolate is going to be fundamentally
different in nature. You also want to use plenty of lecithin here.

***

How to make 84% dark chocolate from scratch using honey

It has been a real challenge to make this but I was able to make an
84% dark chocolate using raw organic honey, cacao butter, raw cacao
powder and vanilla. The chocolate does not melt at room temperature,
it has a sheen and snaps. The real challenge with making this was the
fact that I used honey instead of powder sugar. Honey contains water
which makes chocolate seize. Another important factor in making this
chocolate is that it has to be tempered. This is the process that
produces a smooth, crisp and shiny chocolate...

http://livinghealthywithchocolate.co...ing-honey-699/

On 2015-01-25, > wrote:

> Quick shot in the nuker will melt the crystals.

I've found many honey containers, even plastic, have metallic embossed
labels, which spark and sputter severely when nuked. Either soak off
the label, first, or put the bottle/jar in a slow/rice cooker.

nb

On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 11:27:39 -0800, "Julie Bove"
> wrote:

>
>"W" > wrote in message
...
>>> Honeyand cacao would certainly yield a syrup.
>>
>> It created something more like a thick frosting. The melted cacao became
>> very viscous, it thickened, was drying rapidly, etc.
>
>I have since looked it up and there are a few companies selling chocolate
>sweetened with honey so apparently it can be done. But the only recipe I
>saw involved cocoa powder and some kind of fat so that wouldn't yield what
>you want either. You might want to develop a taste for straight on cocoa
>nibs and just eat those for the health benefits.

Yeah, cocoa butter or cocoa fat is weird and sort of difficult to get
to harden into that crisp snap of a setup state we are accustomed to.
I know, I've inadvertently learned to temper chocolate in my Chocolate
Covered Cherry making experience. Industrially, we as a species
mastered tempering chocolate, of course. But it's tricky and fickle to
do by hand.

John Kuthe...

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On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 03:07:27 -0800, "W" >
wrote:

>> Honeyand cacao would certainly yield a syrup.
>
>It created something more like a thick frosting. The melted cacao became
>very viscous, it thickened, was drying rapidly, etc.

Liquid or dried honey used?

John Kuthe...

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"John Kuthe" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 25 Jan 2015 03:07:27 -0800, "W" >
> wrote:
>
> >> Honeyand cacao would certainly yield a syrup.
> >
> >It created something more like a thick frosting. The melted cacao
became
> >very viscous, it thickened, was drying rapidly, etc.
>
> Liquid or dried honey used?

I used liquid honey, and the consensus seems to be that water is a big no-no
for chocolate tempering. See Moe's post, which contains the important
insight that:

"Cacao is a rich source of insoluble but water absorbent fibers (cellulose,
primarily) which tends to cause the particles to draw in the water and swell
up, further disrupting the texture. The cacao particles then tend to push
away the cocoa butter."

So it looks like I need to dry out any honey that gets used to sweeten
chocolate.

--
W