I have just returned from 12 days in California and have some
impressions I would like to share. First of all, I have to say that I
can see why there are so many people there. I can understand why people
tolerate the population density, the high prices, the traffic, the water
restrictions. Physically, and even with the drought, it is beautiful.

We had lots of great food. I had long been interested in heuvos
rancheros. My first sampling was at our hotel in Newport Beach. They
were great. I had them again in Monterey and they were much better.
However, it is way too much breakfast for me. It should be a lunch or
even a supper.

We spent a night in Santa Barbara. We ate supper at Chuck's Hawaiian
Steak House. It wasn't very Hawaiian but we were there for the early
bird special and I had an open face beef tenderloin tip with blue
cheese. I was expectitn

Supper on Fisherman's Wharf in Monterey was a disappointment. The
seafood grill with salmon, swordfish and shrimp was okay, but no wow
factor. I could get as good or better here.

We spent three days in Monterey and on the first day we had breakfast at
First Awakenings. It was so good that there was no question about us
going there every day we were there.


In San Francisco I was reluctant to have Chinese food, not being sure
how it might react with my system, but when we were hungry and unable to
find anything else we ended up eating at Dong Bei Mama on Geary St. and
had Chicken Kung Pow and Crispy Fried Lamb and they set a whole new bar
for rating Chinese food. The next night we were in Palo Alto and ate at
an Iranian place where I had gyros that also set the bar for Middle
Eastern food.

On 2015-09-16 23:18:08 +0000, Dave Smith said:

> I have just returned from 12 days in California and have some
> impressions I would like to share. First of all, I have to say that I
> can see why there are so many people there. I can understand why
> people tolerate the population density, the high prices, the traffic,
> the water restrictions. Physically, and even with the drought, it is
> beautiful.
>
> We had lots of great food. I had long been interested in heuvos
> rancheros. My first sampling was at our hotel in Newport Beach. They
> were great. I had them again in Monterey and they were much better.
> However, it is way too much breakfast for me. It should be a lunch or
> even a supper.

I wish I'd known you were in the area--I always pick up the drink tab
for out-of-towners! Regarding huevos rancheros, there are bigger and
lesser orders of everything. I've had them many times, but usually at
smaller mom-and-pop joints and they were quite manageable, and I'm a
fairly light eater.

> We spent a night in Santa Barbara. We ate supper at Chuck's Hawaiian
> Steak House. It wasn't very Hawaiian but we were there for the early
> bird special and I had an open face beef tenderloin tip with blue
> cheese. I was expectitn

Yes? Yes, yes?

> Supper on Fisherman's Wharf in Monterey was a disappointment. The
> seafood grill with salmon, swordfish and shrimp was okay, but no wow
> factor. I could get as good or better here.

Such places are usually a little touristy--Where did you get your
restaurant picks from, local friends, yelp, travel sections of
newspapers?

> We spent three days in Monterey and on the first day we had breakfast
> at First Awakenings. It was so good that there was no question about us
> going there every day we were there.

I don't do breakfasts much and don't put a lot of emphasis on it in
life or on vacations. On the other hand it's really great to find a
quick, easy, tasty breakfast solution near the hotel. Really makes it
easy to get the day going--and we do the same: Find one and stick to it.

> In San Francisco I was reluctant to have Chinese food, not being sure
> how it might react with my system, but when we were hungry and unable
> to find anything else we ended up eating at Dong Bei Mama on Geary St.
> and had Chicken Kung Pow and Crispy Fried Lamb and they set a whole new
> bar for rating Chinese food. The next night we were in Palo Alto and
> ate at an Iranian place where I had gyros that also set the bar for
> Middle Eastern food.

Glad you had a good time. Come back soon with more money!

On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:18:08 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>I have just returned from 12 days in California and have some
>impressions I would like to share. First of all, I have to say that I
>can see why there are so many people there. I can understand why people
>tolerate the population density, the high prices, the traffic, the water
>restrictions. Physically, and even with the drought, it is beautiful.

But you missed the most beautiful parts, the sierras are gorgeous (you
missed L. Tahoe), as are the coastal redwood forests, the southern
deserts... actually the Frisco area is the least picturesque part of
CA., it's primarilly a crowded tourist trap/dump. You could have
eaten much better a lot closer to home, you're only a hop, skip, and a
jump from NYC, heck, Toronto and the Peg have better food than CA.
Brooklyn has the finast array of food on the planet (the best of
*every* ethnicity is represented), and is far more picturesque than
Frisco, especially if you're into bridges and sea coast. If you want
to see real gorgeous vistas next trip explore the Canadian Rockies...
there's fine food there too, from superb retro diners to magnificent
hotels. Visit Banff's Lake Louise, spectacular scenery and dining,
the area around the Fairmont is other worldly, I've hiked and canoed
the area several times, of course I was younger, it's rugged country,
it takes a good half day to hike the lake's perimeter but well worth
it, you'll never forget:
http://www.fairmont.com/lake-louise/



>We had lots of great food. I had long been interested in heuvos
>rancheros. My first sampling was at our hotel in Newport Beach. They
>were great. I had them again in Monterey and they were much better.
>However, it is way too much breakfast for me. It should be a lunch or
>even a supper.
>
>We spent a night in Santa Barbara. We ate supper at Chuck's Hawaiian
>Steak House. It wasn't very Hawaiian but we were there for the early
>bird special and I had an open face beef tenderloin tip with blue
>cheese. I was expectitn
>
>Supper on Fisherman's Wharf in Monterey was a disappointment. The
>seafood grill with salmon, swordfish and shrimp was okay, but no wow
>factor. I could get as good or better here.
>
>We spent three days in Monterey and on the first day we had breakfast at
>First Awakenings. It was so good that there was no question about us
>going there every day we were there.
>
>
>In San Francisco I was reluctant to have Chinese food, not being sure
>how it might react with my system, but when we were hungry and unable to
>find anything else we ended up eating at Dong Bei Mama on Geary St. and
>had Chicken Kung Pow and Crispy Fried Lamb and they set a whole new bar
>for rating Chinese food. The next night we were in Palo Alto and ate at
>an Iranian place where I had gyros that also set the bar for Middle
>Eastern food.
>

On 2015-09-16, Dave Smith > wrote:

> I can understand why people tolerate the population density, the
> high prices, the traffic, the water restrictions. Physically, and
> even with the drought, it is beautiful.

Glad you had a good time, but not everyone agrees.

"....since 1990, according to the U.S. Census, 3,642,490 people, net,
have left California."

I have, as have two of my closest friends, and Ima CA boy, born n'
bred. I'll never return.

nb

On 2015-09-17 00:41:48 +0000, notbob said:

> On 2015-09-16, Dave Smith > wrote:
>
>> I can understand why people tolerate the population density, the
>> high prices, the traffic, the water restrictions. Physically, and
>> even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>
> Glad you had a good time, but not everyone agrees.
>
> "....since 1990, according to the U.S. Census, 3,642,490 people, net,
> have left California."

And were replaced by almost 9 million, theoretically leaving about 30
million who seemed satisfied enough. According the U.S. Census (stated
in millions):

2014 - 38.8
2013 - 38.4
2012 - 38.1
2011 - 38.07
2010 - 37.35
2009 - 36.96
2008 - 36.6
2007 - 36.25
2006 - 36.02
2005 - 35.83
2004 - 35.57
2003 - 35.25
2002 - 34.87
2001 - 34.48
2000 - 33.99
1999 - 33.5
1998 - 32.9
1997 - 32.49
1996 - 32.02
1995 - 31.7
1994 - 31.48
1993 - 31.27
1992 - 30.97
1991 - 30.47
1990 - 29.95

I moved here in 1990.

> I have, as have two of my closest friends, and Ima CA boy, born n'
> bred. I'll never return.

What's the complaint? You can't even stop by to say hi to your old pals?

On 2015-09-16 17:40, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:18:08 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> I have just returned from 12 days in California and have some
>> impressions I would like to share. First of all, I have to say that I
>> can see why there are so many people there. I can understand why people
>> tolerate the population density, the high prices, the traffic, the water
>> restrictions. Physically, and even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>
> But you missed the most beautiful parts, the sierras are gorgeous (you
> missed L. Tahoe), as are the coastal redwood forests, the southern
> deserts... actually the Frisco area is the least picturesque part of
> CA., it's primarilly a crowded tourist trap/dump.



We did see redwoods in Big Basin... incredible. I was not impressed
with SF. There is a nice park and incredible museum, but the rest of
it..... not impressed.


> You could have
> eaten much better a lot closer to home, you're only a hop, skip, and a
> jump from NYC, heck, Toronto and the Peg have better food than CA.
> Brooklyn has the finast array of food on the planet (the best of
> *every* ethnicity is represented), and is far more picturesque than
> Frisco, especially if you're into bridges and sea coast. If you want
> to see real gorgeous vistas next trip explore the Canadian Rockies...
> there's fine food there too, from superb retro diners to magnificent
> hotels. Visit Banff's Lake Louise, spectacular scenery and dining,
> the area around the Fairmont is other worldly, \

Have been there. It is hard to beat the scenery of the Canadian Rockies.

It has been a few years, but best mountain scenery and food combo was in
Whistler.

"notbob" > wrote in message
...
> On 2015-09-16, Dave Smith > wrote:
>
>> I can understand why people tolerate the population density, the
>> high prices, the traffic, the water restrictions. Physically, and
>> even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>
> Glad you had a good time, but not everyone agrees.
>
> "....since 1990, according to the U.S. Census, 3,642,490 people, net,
> have left California."
>
> I have, as have two of my closest friends, and Ima CA boy, born n'
> bred. I'll never return.

I am one who did not care for most of CA. I did like Susanville but we were
only there for the night. I might not want to live there. The food was
good. I don't remember getting too many bad meals there. Probably my
favorite place was the Buttercup Kitchen in Oakland. But they had huge
portions. So that was a drawback for me. Angela and I would split a meal
and it would look like we hadn't eaten anything. If my husband came with
us, the three of us could split something and he could add a cup or soup or
a dessert and it was just the right amount.

On Wednesday, September 16, 2015 at 5:40:34 PM UTC-7, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:18:08 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
> >I have just returned from 12 days in California and have some
> >impressions I would like to share. First of all, I have to say that I
> >can see why there are so many people there. I can understand why people
> >tolerate the population density, the high prices, the traffic, the water
> >restrictions. Physically, and even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>
> But you missed the most beautiful parts, the sierras are gorgeous (you
> missed L. Tahoe), as are the coastal redwood forests, the southern
> deserts... actually the Frisco area is the least picturesque part of
> CA., it's primarilly a crowded tourist trap/dump.

Yes, any city sandwiched between coastal redwood forests has to be
a dump.

> You could have
> eaten much better a lot closer to home, you're only a hop, skip, and a
> jump from NYC, heck, Toronto and the Peg have better food than CA.
> Brooklyn has the finast array of food on the planet (the best of
> *every* ethnicity is represented), and is far more picturesque than
> Frisco,

Shoot, I forgot to tell Dave how close he was to the best bagels
in North America -- House of Bagels on Geary, just east of 15th
Avenue.

"Brooklyn1" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2015 19:18:08 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>>I have just returned from 12 days in California and have some
>>impressions I would like to share. First of all, I have to say that I
>>can see why there are so many people there. I can understand why people
>>tolerate the population density, the high prices, the traffic, the water
>>restrictions. Physically, and even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>
> But you missed the most beautiful parts, the sierras are gorgeous (you
> missed L. Tahoe), as are the coastal redwood forests, the southern
> deserts... actually the Frisco area is the least picturesque part of


There are a lot of fires going on right now in some areas, but...you
couldn't find a prettier place anywhere than the Monterey area and Big Sur.

Cheri

"notbob" > wrote in message
...
> On 2015-09-16, Dave Smith > wrote:
>
>> I can understand why people tolerate the population density, the
>> high prices, the traffic, the water restrictions. Physically, and
>> even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>
> Glad you had a good time, but not everyone agrees.
>
> "....since 1990, according to the U.S. Census, 3,642,490 people, net,
> have left California."
>
> I have, as have two of my closest friends, and Ima CA boy, born n'
> bred. I'll never return.
>
> nb

I'm one who doesn't agree. I love the Pacific Northwest, Oregon and
Washington and wish we had never left there. I had hoped that we would go
back when we retired, but it didn't work out that way.

Cheri

"Cheri" > wrote in message
...
>
> "notbob" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On 2015-09-16, Dave Smith > wrote:
>>
>>> I can understand why people tolerate the population density, the
>>> high prices, the traffic, the water restrictions. Physically, and
>>> even with the drought, it is beautiful.
>>
>> Glad you had a good time, but not everyone agrees.
>>
>> "....since 1990, according to the U.S. Census, 3,642,490 people, net,
>> have left California."
>>
>> I have, as have two of my closest friends, and Ima CA boy, born n'
>> bred. I'll never return.
>>
>> nb
>
> I'm one who doesn't agree. I love the Pacific Northwest, Oregon and
> Washington and wish we had never left there. I had hoped that we would go
> back when we retired, but it didn't work out that way.
>
> Cheri

I love it here too!

On 2015-09-17 2:10 AM, wrote:

>> You could have
>> eaten much better a lot closer to home, you're only a hop, skip, and a
>> jump from NYC, heck, Toronto and the Peg have better food than CA.
>> Brooklyn has the finast array of food on the planet (the best of
>> *every* ethnicity is represented), and is far more picturesque than
>> Frisco,
>
> Shoot, I forgot to tell Dave how close he was to the best bagels
> in North America -- House of Bagels on Geary, just east of 15th
> Avenue.
> \


Oh crap. I walked right past it. On our first night we had parked on
Geary (eastbound) crossed the street, walked a couple blocks looking for
a place that was not Chinese, crossed back to the south side and walked
west and ended up eating (Chinese) at Dong Bei Mama, which is between
11th and 12th. I remember going by a bagel place. It was late and we
were tired and hungry. I was tempted to go to the Jack in the Box,
despite my aversion to franchises. As it turned out, Dong Bei Mama set
a new bar for Chinese food for me. I will never be able to eat it here
again.

On 2015-09-17, Dave Smith > wrote:

> On 2015-09-17 2:10 AM, wrote:

>> in North America -- House of Bagels on Geary, just east of 15th
>> Avenue.

I don't know about all of N. America, but they are dang good. We had
one in Santa Clara and I usta stop in for lox n' cream cheese on a
jalapeno bagel to eat at work. Yum!

> I was tempted to go to the Jack in the Box, despite my aversion to
> franchises.

Yikes! You jes revealed yer bar. I wouldn't eat JitB with yer
mouth!! Worst burger franchise in history.

> As it turned out, Dong Bei Mama set a new bar for Chinese food for
> me. I will never be able to eat it here again.

That's the one thing I miss from CA, good Chinese food, despite it
becoming worse and worse, daily. We have two Chi restos, here. One
is completely inedible (thru 2 owners), the other keeps trying to
maintain a price point, so the quality continually diminishes and I
can no longer eat there.

nb

On 2015-09-17 9:42 AM, notbob wrote:
> On 2015-09-17, Dave Smith > wrote:
>
>> On 2015-09-17 2:10 AM, wrote:
>
>>> in North America -- House of Bagels on Geary, just east of 15th
>>> Avenue.
>
> I don't know about all of N. America, but they are dang good. We had
> one in Santa Clara and I usta stop in for lox n' cream cheese on a
> jalapeno bagel to eat at work. Yum!
I had a pretty good cheese and jalapeno bagel with cream cheese at
Shirley's Bagels in Newport. It was good, but not up there with
Montreal bagels.

>
>> I was tempted to go to the Jack in the Box, despite my aversion to
>> franchises.
>
> Yikes! You jes revealed yer bar. I wouldn't eat JitB with yer
> mouth!! Worst burger franchise in history.

Like I said.... we were tired and hungry. I was reluctant to try Chinese
because around here it is often loaded with MSG which does a number on me.


>
>> As it turned out, Dong Bei Mama set a new bar for Chinese food for
>> me. I will never be able to eat it here again.
>
> That's the one thing I miss from CA, good Chinese food, despite it
> becoming worse and worse, daily. We have two Chi restos, here. One
> is completely inedible (thru 2 owners), the other keeps trying to
> maintain a price point, so the quality continually diminishes and I
> can no longer eat there.
This stuff was incredible. It was way better than any Chinese food I had
ever had before. It had a wide range of Chinese dishes, unlike the local
places that have mainly Cantonese.