On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:38:41 -0600, Sqwertz >
wrote:

>On 4/10/2016 11:32 AM, wrote:
>> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:28:35 -0600, Sqwertz >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 4/10/2016 11:15 AM, wrote:
>>>> even a street person is guaranteed medical attention.
>>>
>>> Which is why you hosers head to the US for care...
>>>
>> Speak for yourself, I have never had any medical treatment in the US.
>> Years ago I
>Bugger off, shrew bitch!

Is that the best you can do carnal ass ?
>

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 12:30:28 -0600, graham > wrote:

>On 10/04/2016 11:28 AM, Sqwertz wrote:
>> On 4/10/2016 11:15 AM, wrote:
>>> even a street person is guaranteed medical attention.
>>
>> Which is why you hosers head to the US for care...
>>
>Balls! What happens is that a few who are impatient or
>think the sun shines out of their collective arses go
>abroad and on their return USE THE CANADIAN SYSTEM TO
>CORRECT EVERYTHING!!!!!!!

That is one area where I think they should be told, take it back to
the person who did it.

On Sunday, April 10, 2016 at 12:41:38 PM UTC-4, graham wrote:
> On 10/04/2016 9:39 AM, Janet B wrote:
> > On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 08:18:44 -0700, "Cheri" >
> > wrote:
> >
> >> "Gary" wrote in message ...
> >>
> >> Cheri wrote:
> >>>
> >>> "Gary" wrote in message ...
> >>>
> >>> Dave Smith wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
> >>>> nothing for all that.
> >>>
> >>> My God. If that was in the USA, you would face a bill of (just
> >>> guessing) over $20K.
> >>> ===========
> >>>
> >>> Are you kidding? Well over $75,000.00 would be more like it.
> >>
> >> I believe you, Cheri. I'm just medical-billing challenged. 4 days in
> >> ICU would certainly run it up quite a bit.
> >> ==========
> >>
> >> My dh took a fall four or so years ago, he went to emergency, had a cat scan,
> >> stitches in his eye, and treatment for assorted scrapes and bruises, stayed for
> >> four hours total, the bill was $23,000.00 billed out to Medicare. Thankfully, we
> >> had a pretty small co-pay in all of it considering the size of the bill, but I
> >> spent 13 years without insurance, so I feel your pain. The only upside is that a
> >> person finds out that the body is pretty good at healing itself, and there are
> >> no hypochondriacs running to the doctor every time they sneeze among the average
> >> uninsured person. :-)
> >>
> >> Cheri
> > Your prices seem way out of line to me. I went to the Emergency Room
> > last fall because I thought I was having a DVT issue. I was there a
> > couple of hours, saw a doctor a couple of times, was hooked up for IV,
> > had a blood test and the bill was a little over $400. I don't
> > remember what the billing was when I was in the hospital one week in
> > ICU and another in the heart unit, had surgery, plenty of tests but it
> > was well under $100,000. Of course, this is a non-profit hospital --
> > maybe that makes a difference. This isn't a podunk hospital.
> > Janet US
> >
> My new grand-daughters spent time in the NICU, the younger one nearly 4
> months. With the emergency C-section my DIL had, I dread to think what
> that lot would have cost in the USA.

It might have cost your son and daughter-in-law next to nothing,
depending on their insurance.

Cindy Hamilton

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 22:09:42 +1000, Bruce > wrote:

> The bigger a country, the
>more behind they are, seems to be a universal law.

I think it isn't so much 'behind' as uncaring. Compassion, valuing
life, equality and democratic values seem to decrease proportionately
as populations increase. That's a generalisation, of course, and there
are always exceptions.

On Sunday, April 10, 2016 at 3:19:09 PM UTC-4, Brooklyn1 wrote:

> Eventually the bill came, with Medicare and my AARP
> insurance I owed $8 and change. You really ought to look into getting
> medical insurance.

We have excellent medical insurance through my husband's employer.
"Four days in the hospital resulted in some trivial co-pays".
I consider about $200 for four days in the hospital to be a trivial
expense.

Cindy Hamilton

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 10:59:05 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2016-04-10 9:45 AM, Gary wrote:
>> Dave Smith wrote:
>>>
>>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
>>> nothing for all that.
>>
>> My God. If that was in the USA, you would face a bill of (just
>> guessing) over $20K.
>
>At the time, bypass surgery here was $10,000 for those you are not
>covered by the government plan. In the US it was $20,000, and that is
>just the surgery. Hospital room and medication would be extra.

The cost of health care in the U.S is just insane. It's something like
2 to 3 times the cost of any other country.

On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:

>>>>
>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>> income?
?
>>
>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for
>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with
>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>
> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>

Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.

On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>
>>>>>
>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>> income?
> ?
>>>
>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>
>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for
>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with
>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>
>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>
>
> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.

No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
Graham

On Mon, 11 Apr 2016 06:18:15 +1000, Bruce > wrote:

>On Mon, 11 Apr 2016 06:06:11 +1000, Jeßus > wrote:
>
>>On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 22:09:42 +1000, Bruce > wrote:
>>
>>> The bigger a country, the
>>>more behind they are, seems to be a universal law.
>>
>>I think it isn't so much 'behind' as uncaring. Compassion, valuing
>>life, equality and democratic values seem to decrease proportionately
>>as populations increase. That's a generalisation, of course, and there
>>are always exceptions.
>
>Yes, maybe it's supply and demand.
>
>The more there are (people in a country), the less they're worth.

That sums it up nicely.

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 18:38:22 +0100, "Ophelia" >
wrote:

>
>
>"Brooklyn1" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 09:45:29 -0400, Gary > wrote:
>>
>>>Dave Smith wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
>>>> nothing for all that.
>>>
>>>My God. If that was in the USA, you would face a bill of (just
>>>guessing) over $20K.
>>>
>>>That night 7.5 years ago that I had severe asthma and was stuck
>>>sitting on the toilet all night - very labored breathing and even a 7
>>>step walk to the phone to call for help would have killed me. After
>>>spending about 8 hours on the damn toilet with very labored breathing
>>>all night, I was finally healed enough to get up, dressed, and I drove
>>>to a "minor emergency clinic." Very labored breathing even for that.
>>>
>>>As soon as they heard that I had no insurance, they treated me quite
>>>shabbily (imo). They didn't want me there and acted like I was some
>>>bum off the street after free medical care. I was told that the doctor
>>>was running a bit late and I should go to the emergency room.
>>
>> A clinic would not have told you to drive to the ER, they would have
>> called an ambulance.
>>
>>>I told
>>>them that I was doing ok just sitting there and waiting but to get up
>>>again would be a hardship. I'm not leaving.
>>>
>>>So then she told me, "You know, this could be expensive"
>>>I told her, "I've got money, I'll pay for this today"
>>>She still didn't seem convinced. Again, I was made to feel like some
>>>bum.
>>>
>>>So I finally got to see the doctor. They treated me there and I was
>>>good to go plus I got prescriptions. Funny how just 1/2 hour treatment
>>>in the doctors office fixed me when I really almost died of asthma
>>>attack
>>
>> That's why you need medication at home, you should have an Albuterol
>> Sulphate inhaler on you at all times, and a nebulizer at home... with
>> a neb treatment at home you'd be fine in ten minutes.
>
>Yes, I have all those things and have never got into difficulties the way
>Gary did. As soon as I have a problem I have everything I need to treat
>myself instantly!
>
>I hope Gary will take better care of himself now. What he suffered and the
>way he was treated was dreadful.

Essentially it was Gary's own doing. Nebulizers cost very little,
$50-$80, they can even be obtained for free. Albuterol sulphate
ampules are dirt cheap, they cost no more than smelling salts, usually
free from ones doctor. If his primary care physcian knows he has no
insurance and can't aford medication a plan can be set up with the
pharmaceutical company to provide meds for free from a local pharmacy,
plus doctors have lots of free samples, just need to ask. Gary was
really nutso to sit in his toilit all night because he had no
medication on hand that could save his life, what a low IQ jerk. If
the story he told is true (which I doubt) he's very lucky to have
lived, Asthma exacerbations don't get better by waiting, they become
worse. Gary, if you are truly an Asthmatic, get educated, if you're
lying STFU.

On 4/10/2016 4:29 PM, graham wrote:
> On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>> income?
>> ?
>>>>
>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320
>>>> for
>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents
>>>> with
>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>
>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>
>>
>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>
> No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
> Graham

Cost of services, yes. But what is the cost of insurance? The cost
quoted above is about the same. No one has put a dollar figure that you
actually pay. The money comes out of your pocket someplace.

On 2016-04-10 11:52 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

>
> That was the idea, but it did not work out that way. A few people
> benefited, many did not. Many low income people are forced to either pay
> a premium they cannot afford or pay a penalty for having no insurance.
> Varies by state, but if you have no income you are usually covered by
> Medicaid.
>
> The plan was based on incorrect suppositions. They assumed that the
> healthy 20 and 30 year olds would sign up, pay premiums, subsidize
> others. They found it was cheaper to pay a $400 penalty than to buy
> $6000 insurance.
>
> In another thread I mentioned situations like my son. He needs a knee
> operation that under the old plan would have been a $500 copay but is
> now $6000. He is paying the same premium, less coverage. Many people
> have run into that.

That same operation here..... no copay.... no charge.

On 10/04/2016 3:15 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 4/10/2016 4:29 PM, graham wrote:
>> On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>>> income?
>>> ?
>>>>>
>>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320
>>>>> for
>>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents
>>>>> with
>>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>>
>>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>>
>> No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
>> Graham
>
> Cost of services, yes. But what is the cost of insurance? The cost
> quoted above is about the same. No one has put a dollar figure that you
> actually pay. The money comes out of your pocket someplace.

I should have said expenditure! Yours is about double per capita than
Canada's.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...e_per_ capita

On 2016-04-10 11:58 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 4/10/2016 9:17 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
>
>>
>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
>> nothing for all that.
>>
>>
>
> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on income?
>

That's hard to say. Those with a taxable income under $20,000 pay no
premium. For those with income higher than that there is a premium
ranging from $300 to $900 per year (for those with more than $200,000
taxable income). Of course the program is subsidized from general tax
revenues, and our overall tax rate is actually lower than the US. Those
with more money will be paying higher income taxes, and we all know how
the rich like make sure they pay their income tax. Those with higher
income live in nicer homes and pay higher property tax, and they buy
more goods and services and pay more sales tax.

Given that those who have to pay for their own health insurance are
paying $500-900 per month, I can guarantee you that the average person
is not paying that much more in taxes for their "free" health care.

On 4/10/2016 5:23 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-04-10 11:52 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
>>
>> That was the idea, but it did not work out that way. A few people
>> benefited, many did not. Many low income people are forced to either pay
>> a premium they cannot afford or pay a penalty for having no insurance.
>> Varies by state, but if you have no income you are usually covered by
>> Medicaid.
>>
>> The plan was based on incorrect suppositions. They assumed that the
>> healthy 20 and 30 year olds would sign up, pay premiums, subsidize
>> others. They found it was cheaper to pay a $400 penalty than to buy
>> $6000 insurance.
>>
>> In another thread I mentioned situations like my son. He needs a knee
>> operation that under the old plan would have been a $500 copay but is
>> now $6000. He is paying the same premium, less coverage. Many people
>> have run into that.
>
> That same operation here..... no copay.... no charge.
>

But at what cost? Aside from Huffington Post no one has said what they
are actually paying for coverage.

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 16:28:28 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

>On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>
>>>>>
>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>> income?
>?
>>>
>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for
>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with
>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>
>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>
>
>Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.

I know that sometimes the GST (tax on purchases) hurts but by the same
token I have zero worries about being sick and needing medical help.
When David retired because Blue Cross knew what his problems were they
offered us additional coverage for $300 per month. We told them where
to go because in essence all they offered was a private room if you
were hospitalized.

He never lacked medical care until he died and at 65 I went on to
Pharmacare (our provincial system) for $434 per year, that subsidizes
drug costs which could be enormous.

Since that time I have had a knee replaced, a thumb joint replacement
and been treated for migranal vertigo, none of which has cost me a
penny. So I don't really know but you will be able to judge for
yourself. I have had friends who have had all sorts of problems
compared to me and they are still solvent.

On 2016-04-10 12:44 PM, graham wrote:

>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>> income?
>>
> Nothing directly out of pocket. It's government funded, therefore it
> comes out of tax revenue.
> It's far more efficient and cheaper that way.

Not anymore in Ontario. Thanks to the integrity of the provincial
Liberals who promised no new taxes, we now have a small annual premium.
Thanks to my retirement benefits package my former employer pays my
annual premium, but it is a taxable benefit.

On 2016-04-10 12:48 PM, Roy wrote:
> On Sunday, April 10, 2016 at 10:35:40 AM UTC-6, Sqwertz wrote:
>> On 4/10/2016 7:17 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
>>> nothing for all that.
>>
>> So all your fellow citizens could pony up...
>
> And I was proud to contribute taxes so that he could get medi-care.
> One for all and all for one, we are our brother's keeper.

I paid a lot into it during my salad years when I only went to the
doctor once every 4-5 years.

On 10/04/2016 3:51 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-04-10 12:44 PM, graham wrote:
>
>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>> income?
>>>
>> Nothing directly out of pocket. It's government funded, therefore it
>> comes out of tax revenue.
>> It's far more efficient and cheaper that way.
>
> Not anymore in Ontario. Thanks to the integrity of the provincial
> Liberals who promised no new taxes, we now have a small annual premium.
> Thanks to my retirement benefits package my former employer pays my
> annual premium, but it is a taxable benefit.
>
>
There isn't a premium in Alberta, that was stopped when we were awash in
oil royalties.
As a senior, my prescriptions are heavily subsidized by the Alberta
Govt. Last week I paid $11.82 for a $40 prescription.
Graham

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 17:15:52 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

>On 4/10/2016 4:29 PM, graham wrote:
>> On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>>> income?
>>> ?
>>>>>
>>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320
>>>>> for
>>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents
>>>>> with
>>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>>
>>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>>
>> No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
>> Graham
>
>Cost of services, yes. But what is the cost of insurance? The cost
>quoted above is about the same. No one has put a dollar figure that you
>actually pay. The money comes out of your pocket someplace.

Because it mostly comes through GST (sort of purchase tax) it does
mean that the more you have to spend, the more you pay. Seems a
simple way to sort the chicken from the geese.

I suppose to give you an actual figure for myself I would have to
record money spent for a year. Not all purchases incur the tax, food
for example, does not. Kids clothing does not and there are several
other unavoidable spends that don't incur the tax.

I may like to grumble occasionally but in the long run, I love
universal healthcare, am completely satisfied with the care I receive,
and am willing to bet no insurance company offers as good a deal.

On 2016-04-10 1:16 PM, sf wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 07:42:41 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:

>> Of course, if you have good insurance, health care in the U.S. is quite
>> reasonably priced. Four days in the hospital for my husband resulted in
>> some trivial co-pays. It probably didn't amount to more than $200 all told.
>> I have no idea how much the stay cost the insurance company, as we never
>> saw a bill that didn't say "You own $50" or somesuch.
>>
> Fortunately we haven't had a need to hospital care in years, but our
> medication bill tells us how much we've saved right on the receipt.
> Hubby makes a small co-pay for one drug that is $400 a refill.


Our government program is for medical care and does not apply to
prescriptions until you are over 65, which am now. I just picked up the
next three months worth of cholesterol meds, which cost me about $5.

On 4/10/2016 1:44 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:37:25 -0600, Sqwertz >
> wrote:
>>>
>>
>> http://news.heartland.org/newspaper-...us-health-care
>>
>> A top Canadian politician attracted national attention when he decided
>> to abandon his country’s health care system, which has been suggested as
>> a model for reforms in the United States, to cross the border in seeking
>> treatment for a heart condition.
>>
>> Newfoundland and Labrador Premier Danny Williams traveled to the United
>> States in February to undergo heart surgery. The 59-year-old millionaire
>> is set to spend over three months in America recovering from the operation.
>>
>
> Danny Williams is sooooo wealthy he didn't even take

He's a ****ing HYPOCRITE!

And u are 2, rich bitch.

On 10/04/2016 3:59 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 17:15:52 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>> On 4/10/2016 4:29 PM, graham wrote:
>>> On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>>>> income?
>>>> ?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents
>>>>>> with
>>>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>>>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>>>
>>> No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
>>> Graham
>>
>> Cost of services, yes. But what is the cost of insurance? The cost
>> quoted above is about the same. No one has put a dollar figure that you
>> actually pay. The money comes out of your pocket someplace.
>
> Because it mostly comes through GST (sort of purchase tax) it does
> mean that the more you have to spend, the more you pay. Seems a
> simple way to sort the chicken from the geese.
>
> I suppose to give you an actual figure for myself I would have to
> record money spent for a year. Not all purchases incur the tax, food
> for example, does not. Kids clothing does not and there are several
> other unavoidable spends that don't incur the tax.
>
> I may like to grumble occasionally but in the long run, I love
> universal healthcare, am completely satisfied with the care I receive,
> and am willing to bet no insurance company offers as good a deal.
>

I think we should emphasise that health care in Canada is a provincial
responsibility and each province has its own way of financing it.
Graham

On 4/10/2016 1:46 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 13:38:16 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>> On 4/10/2016 12:44 PM, graham wrote:
>>> On 10/04/2016 9:58 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> On 4/10/2016 9:17 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
>>>>> nothing for all that.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>> income?
>>>>
>>> Nothing directly out of pocket. It's government funded, therefore it
>>> comes out of tax revenue.
>>> It's far more efficient and cheaper that way.
>>> Graham
>>
>> So, you have no idea what that translates to in dollars?
>>
>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for
>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with
>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381. As a result of
>> lower average incomes and differences in taxation, the bills are smaller
>> for the average unattached individual ($3,780), for the average
>> one-parent-one-child family ($3,905), and the average one-parent
>> two-child family ($3,387). But no matter the family type, the bill is
>> not small, much less free.
>>
>> And it gets worse. Changing demographics mean Canada's health care
>> system has a funding gap of $537 billion. While health care is costly
>> and underperforming today, in the absence of reform the future will
>> either hold large increases in taxes, further reductions in the
>> availability of medical services, further erosion of non-health care
>> government services, or all of the above.
>>
>> Canadians pay a substantial amount of money for their universal health
>> care system each year through the tax system but get a fairly poor deal
>> in return. Reforming Canadian health care based on lessons from other,
>> more successful, universal access health care systems is the key to
>> solving that problem.
>
> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>

Brilliant rebuttal, your "doubt" is worth as much as your crotch rot, ****.

On 4/10/2016 1:48 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:38:41 -0600, Sqwertz >
> wrote:
>
>> On 4/10/2016 11:32 AM, wrote:
>>> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 11:28:35 -0600, Sqwertz >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 4/10/2016 11:15 AM, wrote:
>>>>> even a street person is guaranteed medical attention.
>>>>
>>>> Which is why you hosers head to the US for care...
>>>>
>>> Speak for yourself, I have never had any medical treatment in the US.
>>> Years ago I
>> Bugger off, shrew bitch!
>
> Is that the best you can do carnal ass ?

You want some carnal ass?

Really?

On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 17:44:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

>On 4/10/2016 5:23 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2016-04-10 11:52 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> That was the idea, but it did not work out that way. A few people
>>> benefited, many did not. Many low income people are forced to either pay
>>> a premium they cannot afford or pay a penalty for having no insurance.
>>> Varies by state, but if you have no income you are usually covered by
>>> Medicaid.
>>>
>>> The plan was based on incorrect suppositions. They assumed that the
>>> healthy 20 and 30 year olds would sign up, pay premiums, subsidize
>>> others. They found it was cheaper to pay a $400 penalty than to buy
>>> $6000 insurance.
>>>
>>> In another thread I mentioned situations like my son. He needs a knee
>>> operation that under the old plan would have been a $500 copay but is
>>> now $6000. He is paying the same premium, less coverage. Many people
>>> have run into that.
>>
>> That same operation here..... no copay.... no charge.
>>
>
>But at what cost? Aside from Huffington Post no one has said what they
>are actually paying for coverage.

As I said, I would have to keep track of all my taxable expenditures
per year to arrive at that.

On 4/10/2016 1:55 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 12:30:28 -0600, graham > wrote:
>
>> On 10/04/2016 11:28 AM, Sqwertz wrote:
>>> On 4/10/2016 11:15 AM, wrote:
>>>> even a street person is guaranteed medical attention.
>>>
>>> Which is why you hosers head to the US for care...
>>>
>> Balls! What happens is that a few who are impatient or
>> think the sun shines out of their collective arses go
>> abroad and on their return USE THE CANADIAN SYSTEM TO
>> CORRECT EVERYTHING!!!!!!!
>
> That is one area where I think they should be told, take it back to
> the person who did it.

http://watchdog.org/208299/canadians-flee-health-care/
\
Right to care doesn’t mean one gets it

Notwithstanding this exceptional case, Quebec and Canada perform rather
poorly in health outcomes. In fact, those outcomes are inferior to those
measured in the U.S.

For example, remission rates for breast and prostate cancer are higher
in the U.S. than Canada, and the at-risk population doesn’t get
preventive screening as often in Canada.

It’s easy to understand why: it’s Economics 101 at work. Since medical
care is “free” in Canada–making up about 50 percent of provincial
budgets–governments have to ration care in order to control costs. This
rationing explains why medical imaging machines are used less
frequently, both for hours of operation and on a per capita basis in
Canada compared to the U.S., but also why waiting times are dangerously
long in the E.R.–an average of 17 hours, compared to eight hours in Utah.

That is, of course, unless one has the right connections, which happened
to me at least twice. Thanks to my mother, who was an assistant nurse at
the time, I was able to get medical imaging done on me in the evening.
Without her help, I don’t know how long I would have had to wait for
this (non-urgent) operation. She also helped me get in contact with a
surgeon for another (non-urgent) operation which, once again, could have
taken months before I got it.

In short, while “newspeak liberals” will not hear it, the Canadian
health care system is not a model to be followed for the U.S. or any
other nation. Unless one’s life is in immediate danger, one is
rightfully called “patient” in Canada since you are bound to wait for a
very, very long time: I would have had to wait three months to see my
family doctor when I last tried in 2013 for an annual checkup.

On 4/10/2016 2:29 PM, graham wrote:
> On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>> income?
>> ?
>>>>
>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320
>>>> for
>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents
>>>> with
>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>
>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>
>>
>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>
> No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
> Graham

http://watchdog.org/208299/canadians-flee-health-care/

These are two of the reasons why over 52,000 Canadian patients traveled
abroad to get health care in 2014, according to the Fraser Institute.
That’s a 25 percent increase from the previous year, where an estimated
41,000 people traveled to get health care.

And we’re not talking about plastic surgery, which accounts for barely
0.3 percent of all patients in that branch. We’re talking about
(non-urgent) neurosurgery (2.6 percent), urology and internal medicine
(1.8 percent) and even cardiovascular surgery (1.3 percent). These
figures are only estimates, based on a survey on physicians throughout
the country.

Nevertheless, they confirm a heavy trend that has plagued the
provinces–they are the ones managing the health care, not the national
government–since Canada implemented the single-payer system in the
1960s: waiting times are impeding care.

On 4/10/2016 3:29 PM, graham wrote:
> I should have said expenditure! Yours is about double per capita than
> Canada's.


Yours is so bad you FLEE to the US!


http://watchdog.org/208299/canadians-flee-health-care/

These are two of the reasons why over 52,000 Canadian patients traveled
abroad to get health care in 2014, according to the Fraser Institute.
That’s a 25 percent increase from the previous year, where an estimated
41,000 people traveled to get health care.

And we’re not talking about plastic surgery, which accounts for barely
0.3 percent of all patients in that branch. We’re talking about
(non-urgent) neurosurgery (2.6 percent), urology and internal medicine
(1.8 percent) and even cardiovascular surgery (1.3 percent). These
figures are only estimates, based on a survey on physicians throughout
the country.

Nevertheless, they confirm a heavy trend that has plagued the
provinces–they are the ones managing the health care, not the national
government–since Canada implemented the single-payer system in the
1960s: waiting times are impeding care.

On 4/10/2016 3:39 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-04-10 11:58 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> On 4/10/2016 9:17 AM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> I spend 4 days in ICU and another 3 nights in the hospital. I was billed
>>> nothing for all that.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>> income?
>>
>
> That's hard to say.

No it's not:


https://www.cihi.ca/en/spending-and-...force/spending

In 2015, total health expenditure in Canada is expected to reach $219.1
billion, or $6,105 per person. It is anticipated that, overall, health
spending will represent 10.9% of Canadas gross domestic product (GDP).

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/true-co...port-1.2525114

While many Canadians proudly boast about our countrys "free" health
care, a new study has broken down exactly how much money in many tax
dollars go into the system each year.
According to a new report by the right-leaning Fraser Institute, the
average Canadian family will contribute $11,735 in taxes for public
health insurance in 2015.

According to Statistics Canada, Canadians spent a total of $141 billion
on health care that year. The authors divided that number by the
Canadian population, concluding that, on average, each Canadian
contributes $3,961 for health care each year.
However, as the report notes, not every Canadian pays an equal amount in
taxes. Dependents and children are not responsible for paying taxes,
while high-income earners must pay more than low-income earners.
To account for this, the study broke average Canadian families down into
10 income groups, concluding that Canadas poorest families pay $477 a
year for health care, while the wealthiest earners pay $59,666 a year.
The report also found that the cost of health care is on the rise,
increasing 1.6 times faster than the average income.
Barua says that increase should tell Canadians something about the
sustainability of the system, €œand reminds us we need to be vigilant
about how these increases are trending up.€�
Barua and the studys co-authors say they hope their findings will help
Canadians "more clearly understand just how much they pay for public
health care."

On 4/10/2016 3:44 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 4/10/2016 5:23 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2016-04-10 11:52 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> That was the idea, but it did not work out that way. A few people
>>> benefited, many did not. Many low income people are forced to either pay
>>> a premium they cannot afford or pay a penalty for having no insurance.
>>> Varies by state, but if you have no income you are usually covered by
>>> Medicaid.
>>>
>>> The plan was based on incorrect suppositions. They assumed that the
>>> healthy 20 and 30 year olds would sign up, pay premiums, subsidize
>>> others. They found it was cheaper to pay a $400 penalty than to buy
>>> $6000 insurance.
>>>
>>> In another thread I mentioned situations like my son. He needs a knee
>>> operation that under the old plan would have been a $500 copay but is
>>> now $6000. He is paying the same premium, less coverage. Many people
>>> have run into that.
>>
>> That same operation here..... no copay.... no charge.
>>
>
> But at what cost? Aside from Huffington Post no one has said what they
> are actually paying for coverage.


Enjoy:

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/true-co...port-1.2525114

While many Canadians proudly boast about our countrys "free" health
care, a new study has broken down exactly how much money in many tax
dollars go into the system each year.
According to a new report by the right-leaning Fraser Institute, the
average Canadian family will contribute $11,735 in taxes for public
health insurance in 2015.
Many Canadians underestimate the cost of health care for a number of
reasons, says study co-author Bacchus Barua, a senior economist with the
Fraser Institutes Centre for Health Policy Studies.

According to Statistics Canada, Canadians spent a total of $141 billion
on health care that year. The authors divided that number by the
Canadian population, concluding that, on average, each Canadian
contributes $3,961 for health care each year.
However, as the report notes, not every Canadian pays an equal amount in
taxes. Dependents and children are not responsible for paying taxes,
while high-income earners must pay more than low-income earners.
To account for this, the study broke average Canadian families down into
10 income groups, concluding that Canadas poorest families pay $477 a
year for health care, while the wealthiest earners pay $59,666 a year.
The report also found that the cost of health care is on the rise,
increasing 1.6 times faster than the average income.
Barua says that increase should tell Canadians something about the
sustainability of the system, €œand reminds us we need to be vigilant
about how these increases are trending up.€�
Barua and the studys co-authors say they hope their findings will help
Canadians "more clearly understand just how much they pay for public
health care."

On 4/10/2016 3:49 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 16:28:28 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>> income?
>> ?
>>>>
>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for
>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with
>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>
>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>
>>
>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>
> I know that

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/true-co...port-1.2525114

While many Canadians proudly boast about our country’s "free" health
care, a new study has broken down exactly how much money in many tax
dollars go into the system each year.
According to a new report by the right-leaning Fraser Institute, the
average Canadian family will contribute $11,735 in taxes for public
health insurance in 2015.
Many Canadians underestimate the cost of health care for a number of
reasons, says study co-author Bacchus Barua, a senior economist with the
Fraser Institute’s Centre for Health Policy Studies.

On 4/10/2016 3:59 PM, graham wrote:
> On 10/04/2016 3:51 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2016-04-10 12:44 PM, graham wrote:
>>
>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>> income?
>>>>
>>> Nothing directly out of pocket. It's government funded, therefore it
>>> comes out of tax revenue.
>>> It's far more efficient and cheaper that way.
>>
>> Not anymore in Ontario. Thanks to the integrity of the provincial
>> Liberals who promised no new taxes, we now have a small annual premium.
>> Thanks to my retirement benefits package my former employer pays my
>> annual premium, but it is a taxable benefit.
>>
>>
> There isn't a premium in Alberta, that was stopped when we were awash in
> oil royalties.
> As a senior, my prescriptions are heavily subsidized by the Alberta
> Govt. Last week I paid $11.82 for a $40 prescription.
> Graham
http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/true-co...port-1.2525114

While many Canadians proudly boast about our countrys "free" health
care, a new study has broken down exactly how much money in many tax
dollars go into the system each year.
According to a new report by the right-leaning Fraser Institute, the
average Canadian family will contribute $11,735 in taxes for public
health insurance in 2015.
Many Canadians underestimate the cost of health care for a number of
reasons, says study co-author Bacchus Barua, a senior economist with the
Fraser Institutes Centre for Health Policy Studies.

According to Statistics Canada, Canadians spent a total of $141 billion
on health care that year. The authors divided that number by the
Canadian population, concluding that, on average, each Canadian
contributes $3,961 for health care each year.
However, as the report notes, not every Canadian pays an equal amount in
taxes. Dependents and children are not responsible for paying taxes,
while high-income earners must pay more than low-income earners.
To account for this, the study broke average Canadian families down into
10 income groups, concluding that Canadas poorest families pay $477 a
year for health care, while the wealthiest earners pay $59,666 a year.
The report also found that the cost of health care is on the rise,
increasing 1.6 times faster than the average income.
Barua says that increase should tell Canadians something about the
sustainability of the system, €œand reminds us we need to be vigilant
about how these increases are trending up.€�
Barua and the studys co-authors say they hope their findings will help
Canadians "more clearly understand just how much they pay for public
health care."

On 4/10/2016 3:59 PM, wrote:
> I suppose to give you an actual figure for myself I would have to
> record money spent for a year.

>
http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/true-co...port-1.2525114

While many Canadians proudly boast about our country’s "free" health
care, a new study has broken down exactly how much money in many tax
dollars go into the system each year.
According to a new report by the right-leaning Fraser Institute, the
average Canadian family will contribute $11,735 in taxes for public
health insurance in 2015.
Many Canadians underestimate the cost of health care for a number of
reasons, says study co-author Bacchus Barua, a senior economist with the
Fraser Institute’s Centre for Health Policy Studies.

According to Statistics Canada, Canadians spent a total of $141 billion
on health care that year. The authors divided that number by the
Canadian population, concluding that, on average, each Canadian
contributes $3,961 for health care each year.
However, as the report notes, not every Canadian pays an equal amount in
taxes. Dependents and children are not responsible for paying taxes,
while high-income earners must pay more than low-income earners.
To account for this, the study broke average Canadian families down into
10 income groups, concluding that Canada’s poorest families pay $477 a
year for health care, while the wealthiest earners pay $59,666 a year.
The report also found that the cost of health care is on the rise,
increasing 1.6 times faster than the average income.
Barua says that increase should tell Canadians something about the
sustainability of the system, “and reminds us we need to be vigilant
about how these increases are trending up.”
Barua and the study’s co-authors say they hope their findings will help
Canadians "more clearly understand just how much they pay for public
health care."

On 4/10/2016 4:05 PM, graham wrote:
> On 10/04/2016 3:59 PM, wrote:
>> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 17:15:52 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>
>>> On 4/10/2016 4:29 PM, graham wrote:
>>>> On 10/04/2016 2:28 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>> On 4/10/2016 3:46 PM, wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> How much does the average Canadian pay for free medical? Based on
>>>>>>>>> income?
>>>>> ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I did find this and it does not look so good.
>>>>>>> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family
>>>>>>> of two
>>>>>>> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ed pls don't pay too much attention to what the Huff Post has to say,
>>>>>> I sincerely doubt their figures are even correct.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps, but nobody else has been able to put a dollar figure on it.
>>>>> Those numbers are not much different than what we pay.
>>>>
>>>> No, Ed. Our costs are about half of yours, according to the OECD.
>>>> Graham
>>>
>>> Cost of services, yes. But what is the cost of insurance? The cost
>>> quoted above is about the same. No one has put a dollar figure that you
>>> actually pay. The money comes out of your pocket someplace.
>>
>> Because it mostly comes through GST (sort of purchase tax) it does
>> mean that the more you have to spend, the more you pay. Seems a
>> simple way to sort the chicken from the geese.
>>
>> I suppose to give you an actual figure for myself I would have to
>> record money spent for a year. Not all purchases incur the tax, food
>> for example, does not. Kids clothing does not and there are several
>> other unavoidable spends that don't incur the tax.
>>
>> I may like to grumble occasionally but in the long run, I love
>> universal healthcare, am completely satisfied with the care I receive,
>> and am willing to bet no insurance company offers as good a deal.
>>
>
> I think we should emphasise that health care in Canada is a provincial
> responsibility and each province has its own way of financing it.
> Graham

https://www.solidarity-us.org/node/1679

It is ironic though that, just when interest in the United States is
rising, the Canadian system itself has become more vulnerable. Emergency
room overcrowding has reached crisis proportions in Ontario and Quebec;
hospital closings have devastated rural communities in Saskatchewan and
Alberta; the provinces are begging for federal health care cuts to be
restored to prevent a collapse of the system.

http://www.iedm.org/fr/3015-the-case...an-health-care

A 2007 international survey of seven countries by the Commonwealth Fund
(New York) found that 72% of Canadians think their health care system
needs either fundamental changes or complete rebuilding.

A 2006 Léger Poll for the Montreal Economic Institute shows that 48% of
Canadians and 60% of Quebecers would find it acceptable if patients were
allowed to pay for health care in the private sector while still
maintaining the present free universal medicare plan.

Now that the Supreme Court of Canada has invalidated Quebec’s
legislation and has concluded that access to a private alternative
health insurance would not endanger the integrity of the public system,
it is incumbent upon Quebec and the other provinces with similar
legislation to immediately rescind these legislated infringements of the
charter rights of patients while retaining present medicare
entitlements. This will reduce the associated pain, suffering, and
sometimes death that continues to be inflicted on Canadians by this
unjust legislation.

http://www.vancouverobserver.com/pol...fragile-system

The reason health care privatization is stepping to the forefront in the
national debate is because the Canada Health Act has become a mangy,
cost-addled money trap fed by annual increases well beyond the economy’s
current abilities. The Organization for Economic Co-operation and
Development (OECD), an international policy performance gauge,
repeatedly ranks Canada as a mediocre healthcare supplier at best.

On 4/10/2016 4:09 PM, wrote:
> On Sun, 10 Apr 2016 17:44:43 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>> On 4/10/2016 5:23 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> On 2016-04-10 11:52 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> That was the idea, but it did not work out that way. A few people
>>>> benefited, many did not. Many low income people are forced to either pay
>>>> a premium they cannot afford or pay a penalty for having no insurance.
>>>> Varies by state, but if you have no income you are usually covered by
>>>> Medicaid.
>>>>
>>>> The plan was based on incorrect suppositions. They assumed that the
>>>> healthy 20 and 30 year olds would sign up, pay premiums, subsidize
>>>> others. They found it was cheaper to pay a $400 penalty than to buy
>>>> $6000 insurance.
>>>>
>>>> In another thread I mentioned situations like my son. He needs a knee
>>>> operation that under the old plan would have been a $500 copay but is
>>>> now $6000. He is paying the same premium, less coverage. Many people
>>>> have run into that.
>>>
>>> That same operation here..... no copay.... no charge.
>>>
>>
>> But at what cost? Aside from Huffington Post no one has said what they
>> are actually paying for coverage.
>
> As I said, I would have to keep track of all my taxable expenditures
> per year to arrive at that.
>

http://www.ctvnews.ca/health/true-co...port-1.2525114


While many Canadians proudly boast about our country’s "free" health
care, a new study has broken down exactly how much money in many tax
dollars go into the system each year.
According to a new report by the right-leaning Fraser Institute, the
average Canadian family will contribute $11,735 in taxes for public
health insurance in 2015.
Many Canadians underestimate the cost of health care for a number of
reasons, says study co-author Bacchus Barua, a senior economist with the
Fraser Institute’s Centre for Health Policy Studies.

According to Statistics Canada, Canadians spent a total of $141 billion
on health care that year. The authors divided that number by the
Canadian population, concluding that, on average, each Canadian
contributes $3,961 for health care each year.
However, as the report notes, not every Canadian pays an equal amount in
taxes. Dependents and children are not responsible for paying taxes,
while high-income earners must pay more than low-income earners.
To account for this, the study broke average Canadian families down into
10 income groups, concluding that Canada’s poorest families pay $477 a
year for health care, while the wealthiest earners pay $59,666 a year.
The report also found that the cost of health care is on the rise,
increasing 1.6 times faster than the average income.
Barua says that increase should tell Canadians something about the
sustainability of the system, “and reminds us we need to be vigilant
about how these increases are trending up.”
Barua and the study’s co-authors say they hope their findings will help
Canadians "more clearly understand just how much they pay for public
health care."

On 4/10/2016 4:27 PM, graham wrote:
> A few years ago, Peter Gzowski interviewed a Canadian Dr

https://www.solidarity-us.org/node/1679

It is ironic though that, just when interest in the United States is
rising, the Canadian system itself has become more vulnerable. Emergency
room overcrowding has reached crisis proportions in Ontario and Quebec;
hospital closings have devastated rural communities in Saskatchewan and
Alberta; the provinces are begging for federal health care cuts to be
restored to prevent a collapse of the system.

http://www.iedm.org/fr/3015-the-case...an-health-care

A 2007 international survey of seven countries by the Commonwealth Fund
(New York) found that 72% of Canadians think their health care system
needs either fundamental changes or complete rebuilding.

A 2006 Léger Poll for the Montreal Economic Institute shows that 48% of
Canadians and 60% of Quebecers would find it acceptable if patients were
allowed to pay for health care in the private sector while still
maintaining the present free universal medicare plan.

Now that the Supreme Court of Canada has invalidated Quebecs
legislation and has concluded that access to a private alternative
health insurance would not endanger the integrity of the public system,
it is incumbent upon Quebec and the other provinces with similar
legislation to immediately rescind these legislated infringements of the
charter rights of patients while retaining present medicare
entitlements. This will reduce the associated pain, suffering, and
sometimes death that continues to be inflicted on Canadians by this
unjust legislation.

http://www.vancouverobserver.com/pol...fragile-system

The reason health care privatization is stepping to the forefront in the
national debate is because the Canada Health Act has become a mangy,
cost-addled money trap fed by annual increases well beyond the economys
current abilities. The Organization for Economic Co-operation and
Development (OECD), an international policy performance gauge,
repeatedly ranks Canada as a mediocre healthcare supplier at best.

On 4/10/2016 4:29 PM, graham wrote:
> Yours is about double per capita


https://www.solidarity-us.org/node/1679

It is ironic though that, just when interest in the United States is
rising, the Canadian system itself has become more vulnerable. Emergency
room overcrowding has reached crisis proportions in Ontario and Quebec;
hospital closings have devastated rural communities in Saskatchewan and
Alberta; the provinces are begging for federal health care cuts to be
restored to prevent a collapse of the system.

http://www.iedm.org/fr/3015-the-case...an-health-care

A 2007 international survey of seven countries by the Commonwealth Fund
(New York) found that 72% of Canadians think their health care system
needs either fundamental changes or complete rebuilding.

A 2006 Léger Poll for the Montreal Economic Institute shows that 48% of
Canadians and 60% of Quebecers would find it acceptable if patients were
allowed to pay for health care in the private sector while still
maintaining the present free universal medicare plan.

Now that the Supreme Court of Canada has invalidated Quebecs
legislation and has concluded that access to a private alternative
health insurance would not endanger the integrity of the public system,
it is incumbent upon Quebec and the other provinces with similar
legislation to immediately rescind these legislated infringements of the
charter rights of patients while retaining present medicare
entitlements. This will reduce the associated pain, suffering, and
sometimes death that continues to be inflicted on Canadians by this
unjust legislation.

http://www.vancouverobserver.com/pol...fragile-system

The reason health care privatization is stepping to the forefront in the
national debate is because the Canada Health Act has become a mangy,
cost-addled money trap fed by annual increases well beyond the economys
current abilities. The Organization for Economic Co-operation and
Development (OECD), an international policy performance gauge,
repeatedly ranks Canada as a mediocre healthcare supplier at best.

On 2016-04-10 1:38 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:


> I did find this and it does not look so good.
> http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/nadeem-...b_3733080.html
>
> In 2013, a typical Canadian family of four can expect to pay $11,320 for
> public health care insurance. For the average family of two parents with
> one child that bill will be $10,989, and for the average family of two
> adults (without children) the bill comes to $11,381. As a result of
> lower average incomes and differences in taxation, the bills are smaller
> for the average unattached individual ($3,780), for the average
> one-parent-one-child family ($3,905), and the average one-parent
> two-child family ($3,387). But no matter the family type, the bill is
> not small, much less free.

I don't know about those figures. They look more like total taxes, and
that tax money goes toward paying a heck of a lot more than just the
health care.

>

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> On 2016-04-10 11:52 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
>>
>> That was the idea, but it did not work out that way. A few people
>> benefited, many did not. Many low income people are forced to either pay
>> a premium they cannot afford or pay a penalty for having no insurance.
>> Varies by state, but if you have no income you are usually covered by
>> Medicaid.
>>
>> The plan was based on incorrect suppositions. They assumed that the
>> healthy 20 and 30 year olds would sign up, pay premiums, subsidize
>> others. They found it was cheaper to pay a $400 penalty than to buy
>> $6000 insurance.
>>
>> In another thread I mentioned situations like my son. He needs a knee
>> operation that under the old plan would have been a $500 copay but is
>> now $6000. He is paying the same premium, less coverage. Many people
>> have run into that.
>
> That same operation here..... no copay.... no charge.

If they decide to grant it to you. And if you can get to the assigned
hospital if they do.