"Bruce" wrote in message
T...

In article >, sf says...
>
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:28:40 +1100, Bruce >
> wrote:
>
> > You could shop online and have your groceries delivered. That way,
> > you're never far from your towel warmer
>
> Have you ever grocery shopped online? What a nightmare.

Only wine.

==================

Our big stores will deliver but I prefer to choose my veg et al myself.

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

"U.S. Janet B." wrote in message
...

On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 20:57:57 -0800, sf > wrote:

>On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:26:28 +1100, Bruce >
>wrote:
>
>> In article >, Jeßus says...
>> >
>> > On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 22:10:07 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>> >
>> > >On 12/18/2016 5:58 PM, Je?us wrote:
>> > >> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 17:33:12 -0500, Ed Pawlowski >
>> > >> wrote:
>> > >>
>> > >>> On 12/18/2016 2:10 PM, Je?us wrote:
>> > >>>
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>> Is your version of self serve just the bagging or do you also scan
>> > >>>> your own items, pay and then bag them? Australia has the latter
>> > >>>> and I
>> > >>>> won't use them. I'd rather the store a employ cashier.
>> > >>>>
>> > >>>
>> > >>> I agree, but it is not always that simple. I asked the manager of
>> > >>> out
>> > >>> local supermarket. He'd like to have more cashiers at times but
>> > >>> cannot
>> > >>> find enough qualified people to cover all the hours.
>> > >>
>> > >> Well, maybe they should consider training them? Of course they
>> > >> wouldn't do that though.
>> > >>
>> > >
>> > >Yes, they do train. You need to have an IQ above room temperature
>> > >though.
>> >
>> > I'm sure such people could be found.
>>
>> Are you sure? Half the country voted for Trump.
>
>Actually, Hillary got 2 million more in the popular vote - so he got
>less than half.

you've been out of touch. It's 2.8 million and continues to grow.
Janet US

=================

I was hearing that the Electoral College meet today to ratify the election.
I know many people are voting against Trump and they hope the EC will change
things. They also said that it is not likely.



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

On 12/18/2016 11:12 PM, Ophelia wrote:
> "U.S. Janet B." wrote in message
> ...
>
> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 20:57:57 -0800, sf > wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:26:28 +1100, Bruce >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> In article >, Jeßus says...
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 22:10:07 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>> >
>>> > >On 12/18/2016 5:58 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>> > >> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 17:33:12 -0500, Ed Pawlowski >
>>> > >> wrote:
>>> > >>
>>> > >>> On 12/18/2016 2:10 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>>>
>>> > >>>> Is your version of self serve just the bagging or do you also
>>> scan
>>> > >>>> your own items, pay and then bag them? Australia has the latter
>>> > >>>> and I
>>> > >>>> won't use them. I'd rather the store a employ cashier.
>>> > >>>>
>>> > >>>
>>> > >>> I agree, but it is not always that simple. I asked the manager of
>>> > >>> out
>>> > >>> local supermarket. He'd like to have more cashiers at times but
>>> > >>> cannot
>>> > >>> find enough qualified people to cover all the hours.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Well, maybe they should consider training them? Of course they
>>> > >> wouldn't do that though.
>>> > >>
>>> > >
>>> > >Yes, they do train. You need to have an IQ above room temperature
>>> > >though.
>>> >
>>> > I'm sure such people could be found.
>>>
>>> Are you sure? Half the country voted for Trump.
>>
>> Actually, Hillary got 2 million more in the popular vote - so he got
>> less than half.
>
> you've been out of touch. It's 2.8 million and continues to grow.
> Janet US
> =================
>
> I was hearing that the Electoral College meet today to ratify the election.
> I know many people are voting against Trump and they hope the EC will
> change
> things. They also said that it is not likely.
>
>
>

This nation is so deeply divided that if the EC didn't vote Trump in, it
could possibly mean another US Civil War. It's something unthinkable but
I thought it alright.

In article >, Ophelia says...
>
> "Bruce" wrote in message
> T...
>
> In article >, sf says...
> >
> > On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:28:40 +1100, Bruce >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > You could shop online and have your groceries delivered. That way,
> > > you're never far from your towel warmer
> >
> > Have you ever grocery shopped online? What a nightmare.
>
> Only wine.
>
> ==================
>
> Our big stores will deliver but I prefer to choose my veg et al myself.

I'd prefer that too. But supermarkets etc don't deliver here, in the
sticks, anyway. We even have to go to town to pick up our wine
'delivery' half the time.

On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 9:51:40 PM UTC-5, sf wrote:
> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 04:05:18 -0800 (PST), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> > On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 2:59:34 AM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
> > > In article >, sf says...
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, 17 Dec 2016 13:51:24 -0000, Janet > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > When Aldi and Lidl first came to UK, the combination of low price and
> > > > > minimal service meant they were at first perceived as "low-end market".
> > > > > Since then their fresh-foods quality and range has improved so much
> > > > > (prices still low) that now they have captured a large chunk of upmarket
> > > > > shoppers too.
> > > >
> > > > We don't have Aldi here, but they won't get my business if they insist
> > > > on self checkout. We have Trader Joe's, which is an Aldi subsidiary
> > > > (Aldi is following their model as far as going organic, non-GMO).
> > > > TJ's has lots of checkers and they have my business.
> > >
> > > I couldn't care less what kind of checkout they have. What a strange
> > > thing to hold against a place.
> >
> > Agreed. My usual store has a carousel so the cashier fills bags as
> > he/she scans items, but when I got to a store that has the belt, I'm
> > not above bagging my own things, especially when they don't have a
> > bagger for every lane. It gets me out of there faster.
> >
> Not me. I let the checkers do their job.

What is your problem with me letting the cashier scan the items while
I bag? It's not like I'm doing them out of a job. The grocery store
will never hire more baggers. I might as well get myself home faster,
since I hate grocery shopping.

Cindy Hamilton

On Monday, December 19, 2016 at 12:37:22 AM UTC-5, wrote:
> On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 8:52:57 PM UTC-6, sf wrote:
> >
> > On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 11:20:21 -0800 (PST), "
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 12:56:38 PM UTC-6, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> > > >
> > > > As for Aldi, I've only been there a few times. They have crappy
> > > > injected meats and limited selection of other items. I've never been
> > > > impressed by them.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > Unless you are butchering your own animals all your meats are
> > > injected.
> >
> > Sounds like you shop at crappy stores.
> >
> >
> Nope, you're just not paying attention to your packaged meats
> such as pork.

I don't buy packaged meats. (Cryovac'd primals notwithstanding.)

I'm quite careful about where I shop for meat. If there isn't a
guy cutting meat on the premises, I go elsewhere.

Cindy Hamilton

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> sf wrote:
> > Not me. I let the checkers do their job.
>
> What is your problem with me letting the cashier scan the items while
> I bag? It's not like I'm doing them out of a job. The grocery store
> will never hire more baggers. I might as well get myself home faster,
> since I hate grocery shopping.

I like grocery shopping. That's the only shopping that I do like. Other
shopping, I put off as long as possible. Just look at my old wardrobe.


I'm like you though and I'll start bagging my groceries while the
cashier is still scanning my things. It's only to help them out and make
the line go quicker for shoppers behind me in line. Once all the
groceries are scanned, I'll stop and do the debit card process while the
cashier finishes up the bagging.

On 2016-12-19 9:11 AM, l not -l wrote:
> On 18-Dec-2016, sf > wrote:

>> Self-checkout is fine for only a few items, but I am not self-checking
>> more than a handful... it takes me way too long and I leave feeling
>> angry.
> Regional differences are interesting to me. Here (STL), the supermarkets I
> frequent prominently label self-check lanes as "20 items or fewer". Besides
> Aldi, we have one. larger, chain that requires shoppers to bag their own.
> The two major regional chains seem to compete for which can do the most for
> the shopper; bag it and take it to, and load it in, your car.

I don't think there is a limit on items a self checkout here. I can't be
sure because I won't use them.

Most places bag your stuff. They have racks for bags and usually scan
them and stick them directly into back, or pass them on down the
conveyor and do them later, or you can bag them yourself as they are
being checked out. One of the discount stores I go to is pack your own.
That's fine by me. I get to pack them the way I want them. I use my own
bags and they are sturdy enough to hold a lot. They may be heavier to
carry but there are fewer to deal with.

"Bruce" wrote in message
T...

In article >, Ophelia says...
>
> "Bruce" wrote in message
> T...
>
> In article >, sf says...
> >
> > On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:28:40 +1100, Bruce >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > You could shop online and have your groceries delivered. That way,
> > > you're never far from your towel warmer
> >
> > Have you ever grocery shopped online? What a nightmare.
>
> Only wine.
>
> ==================
>
> Our big stores will deliver but I prefer to choose my veg et al myself.

I'd prefer that too. But supermarkets etc don't deliver here, in the
sticks, anyway. We even have to go to town to pick up our wine
'delivery' half the time.

=====

OH noooooooooooo, hard luck ;-)


--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

"Cindy Hamilton" wrote in message
...

On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 9:51:40 PM UTC-5, sf wrote:
> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 04:05:18 -0800 (PST), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> > On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 2:59:34 AM UTC-5, Bruce wrote:
> > > In article >, sf says...
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, 17 Dec 2016 13:51:24 -0000, Janet > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > When Aldi and Lidl first came to UK, the combination of low price
> > > > > and
> > > > > minimal service meant they were at first perceived as "low-end
> > > > > market".
> > > > > Since then their fresh-foods quality and range has improved so
> > > > > much
> > > > > (prices still low) that now they have captured a large chunk of
> > > > > upmarket
> > > > > shoppers too.
> > > >
> > > > We don't have Aldi here, but they won't get my business if they
> > > > insist
> > > > on self checkout. We have Trader Joe's, which is an Aldi subsidiary
> > > > (Aldi is following their model as far as going organic, non-GMO).
> > > > TJ's has lots of checkers and they have my business.
> > >
> > > I couldn't care less what kind of checkout they have. What a strange
> > > thing to hold against a place.
> >
> > Agreed. My usual store has a carousel so the cashier fills bags as
> > he/she scans items, but when I got to a store that has the belt, I'm
> > not above bagging my own things, especially when they don't have a
> > bagger for every lane. It gets me out of there faster.
> >
> Not me. I let the checkers do their job.

What is your problem with me letting the cashier scan the items while
I bag? It's not like I'm doing them out of a job. The grocery store
will never hire more baggers. I might as well get myself home faster,
since I hate grocery shopping.

Cindy Hamilton

===================

+1 Some folk need to learn that there is *NOT* only one way!



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

On 2016-12-18, Jeßus > wrote:

> That seems strange, I thought there was unemployment in the U.S,
> generally speaking?

THere is.

All too often, unemployment stats are jes a measure of who is claiming
unemployment benefits. Once bennies are used up, ppl are no longer
counted. Do they have a job. Prolly not, but at least they are no
longer getting bennies, so are not counted in employment stats.

> Why are there no takers for jobs?

All to often, sed job pays less than required to support one's self.

Also depends on where you live. CA's Mexican population ensures there
are no resto jobs wanting. I now live in CO Rockies, where there are
few Mexicans for ANY job. Which is why my last job was as a
dishwasher in a small resto. Ima white geezer.

nb

On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 07:41:38 -0500, Gary > wrote:

>Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>
>> sf wrote:
>> > Not me. I let the checkers do their job.
>>
>> What is your problem with me letting the cashier scan the items while
>> I bag? It's not like I'm doing them out of a job. The grocery store
>> will never hire more baggers. I might as well get myself home faster,
>> since I hate grocery shopping.
>
>I like grocery shopping. That's the only shopping that I do like. Other
>shopping, I put off as long as possible. Just look at my old wardrobe.

Clothes shopping is very easy, I buy all clothing on line, even shoes.
No hassels with sales people and I get exactly what I want, I don't
have to settle because a store is out of stock... and by shopping the
same web sites everything always fits perfectly.

On 12/18/2016 10:41 PM, l not -l wrote:
> On 18-Dec-2016, Jeßus > wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 22:10:07 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>
>>> On 12/18/2016 5:58 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 17:33:12 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:10 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Is your version of self serve just the bagging or do you also scan
>>>>>> your own items, pay and then bag them? Australia has the latter and I
>>>>>> won't use them. I'd rather the store a employ cashier.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree, but it is not always that simple. I asked the manager of out
>>>>> local supermarket. He'd like to have more cashiers at times but
>>>>> cannot
>>>>> find enough qualified people to cover all the hours.
>>>>
>>>> Well, maybe they should consider training them? Of course they
>>>> wouldn't do that though.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, they do train. You need to have an IQ above room temperature
>>> though.
>>
>> I'm sure such people could be found.
> In a couple of stores I shop, the baggers are people with Downs Syndrome.
> They do a very good job of bagging; not too heavy, things packed carefully -
> no smashed bread, no cracked eggs. They are very well trained and seem very
> happy doing the task.
>
Ditto. My local Publix supermarket employs several people with Downs
Syndrome to bag groceries. They do a very good job. One such woman has
been working there for well over 10 years and is very proud of it.

This young woman did tell me something rather horrific. Her mother made
her get her "tubes tied" so she couldn't get pregnant. I was
flabbergasted. Honestly, what do you say if someone tells you something
like that?! (I think I stammered, "Oh, I'm sorry"... I was truly at a
loss for words.)

Jill

On 12/19/2016 9:11 AM, l not -l wrote:
> Regional differences are interesting to me. Here (STL), the supermarkets I
> frequent prominently label self-check lanes as "20 items or fewer". Besides
> Aldi, we have one. larger, chain that requires shoppers to bag their own.
> The two major regional chains seem to compete for which can do the most for
> the shopper; bag it and take it to, and load it in, your car.
>
I appreciate someone being there to bag the groceries for me. I don't
need help taking them to the car or putting the bags in the trunk.
Sometimes they *insist* on taking them out for me, which leads me to
believe they just want to get outside for a while. I've often joked,
are you planning to follow me home and unload them for me once I get
there?

Jill

On 12/18/2016 10:46 PM, sf wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 06:12:52 +1100, Bruce >
> wrote:
>
>> In article >, Dave Smith says...
>>>
>>> On 2016-12-18 10:46 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:59 AM, Bruce wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I couldn't care less what kind of checkout they have. What a strange
>>>>> thing to hold against a place.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Why not? I dislike self checkout and I'd not go for the same reason.
>>>> Aldi is self packing but has a cashier.
>>>
>>>
>>> I won't do self checkout. I prefer some human contact. I pity the people
>>> who are assigned to talking people into using self checkout and helped
>>> customers to screw the cashiers out of jobs. They are like Judas goats.
>>
>> You must be against automation too.
>
> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
> of us are not.
>
>
Bill Burr:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxINJzqzn4w

I don't work here!

Jill

On 12/19/2016 12:01 AM, sf wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:33:32 +1100, Bruce >
> wrote:
>
>> In article >, sf says...
>>>
>>> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 06:12:52 +1100, Bruce >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In article >, Dave Smith says...
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2016-12-18 10:46 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:59 AM, Bruce wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> I couldn't care less what kind of checkout they have. What a strange
>>>>>>> thing to hold against a place.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why not? I dislike self checkout and I'd not go for the same reason.
>>>>>> Aldi is self packing but has a cashier.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I won't do self checkout. I prefer some human contact. I pity the people
>>>>> who are assigned to talking people into using self checkout and helped
>>>>> customers to screw the cashiers out of jobs. They are like Judas goats.
>>>>
>>>> You must be against automation too.
>>>
>>> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
>>> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
>>> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
>>> of us are not.
>>
>> Self checkout can be faster if there are no queues there. I wouldn't do
>> it with a full trolley.
>
> I don't mind doing it with one or two items. That's my limit. If
> there's a line, I'd rather stand in a line with a checker.
>
I rarely go into a supermarket and only pick up one or two items. (Then
again, there isn't a supermarket right around the corner.) I do a big
stocking up shopping trip about once a month. I definitely wind up with
a cart/trolley full of items. No way am I going to scan all that stuff
myself and bag it, too.

Jill

On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 10:04:14 -0500, jmcquown >
wrote:

>On 12/18/2016 10:41 PM, l not -l wrote:
>> On 18-Dec-2016, Jeßus > wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 22:10:07 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 12/18/2016 5:58 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 17:33:12 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:10 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Is your version of self serve just the bagging or do you also scan
>>>>>>> your own items, pay and then bag them? Australia has the latter and I
>>>>>>> won't use them. I'd rather the store a employ cashier.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I agree, but it is not always that simple. I asked the manager of out
>>>>>> local supermarket. He'd like to have more cashiers at times but
>>>>>> cannot
>>>>>> find enough qualified people to cover all the hours.
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, maybe they should consider training them? Of course they
>>>>> wouldn't do that though.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yes, they do train. You need to have an IQ above room temperature
>>>> though.
>>>
>>> I'm sure such people could be found.
>> In a couple of stores I shop, the baggers are people with Downs Syndrome.
>> They do a very good job of bagging; not too heavy, things packed carefully -
>> no smashed bread, no cracked eggs. They are very well trained and seem very
>> happy doing the task.
>>
>Ditto. My local Publix supermarket employs several people with Downs
>Syndrome to bag groceries. They do a very good job. One such woman has
>been working there for well over 10 years and is very proud of it.
>
>This young woman did tell me something rather horrific. Her mother made
>her get her "tubes tied" so she couldn't get pregnant. I was
>flabbergasted. Honestly, what do you say if someone tells you something
>like that?! (I think I stammered, "Oh, I'm sorry"... I was truly at a
>loss for words.)
>
>Jill

I don't find that horrific. Friends had two sons then a Downs
daughter. The day she was born their lives changed completely. She
was always going to be a responsibility and they did not want her to
become a financial responsibility for her brothers.

The years passed and they never took the trips they had talked about,
everything went into the Sara fund. She actually was not a 'sweet'
Downs person, she was pretty violent and particularly where her mother
was concerned. It came to the point where he felt if he was unlucky
he might be struck down with a heart attack and then she would be at
risk of Sara clocking her one.

To that end they looked at many full time care homes for her. She
went on trial to several who rejected her as being too violent for
their staff (but two oldies could manage it seems!) and finally they
found one and were able to put the money in trust for her fees etc.

Sara had her tubes tied before it became fashionable to not do that,
at least it was one worry they didn't have. If Sara had a child they
would have been the ones who had to look after it, Sara would have
just tossed it across the room if it annoyed her.

It's a good thing to put oneself in the parents place in those
circumstances.

On 12/19/2016 12:49 AM, wrote:
> On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 9:46:05 PM UTC-6, sf wrote:
>>
>> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
>> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
>> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
>> of us are not.
>>
>>
> Oh please, get of your high horse and drop the sanctimonious
> attitude. It's very unbecoming and makes you look like a
> complete idiot.
>
No, she has a point. Making you ring up your own items *and* bag them
is the same thing as being an unpaid employee.

John and I were at Walmart a few years back, he bought a couple of
shirts. They only had a couple of checkout lanes open with an actual
cashier and people were lined up in those lanes. He opted for the self
checkout. There was an employee parked on a chair who was supposed to
be available to help. My SO is technologically challenged (doesn't own
a computer, doesn't want one.) He asked her for assistance. She truly
did not want to drag her butt off the chair. She acted like it was a
*huge* inconvenience to show him how to get one of the items to scan.

Give me an actual person who is doing the job they are paid to do, every
time.

Jill

"Bruce" > wrote in message
T...
> In article >, Cheri says...
>>
>> "sf" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>> > If I am required to bag my groceries, it means I'm acting as an unpaid
>> > worker and I am not going to subsidize a multi-national corporation
>> > like Aldi. They're making money hand over fist, so they will only get
>> > my business if/when they provide good customer service. They can
>> > begin with bagging my groceries. If they don't want my business,
>> > there are plenty of other stores that do - and that's where I'll shop.
>>
>> I'm with you there, I don't want to bag my groceries and I won't unless
>> there was no other choice. I also dislike the self-checkouts.
>
> Poor little princess



I'm not poor.

Cheri

"Bruce" > wrote in message
T...

> I'd prefer that too. But supermarkets etc don't deliver here, in the
> sticks, anyway. We even have to go to town to pick up our wine
> 'delivery' half the time.

Poor little pauper, I'd hire someone to pick it up for me.

Cheri

On 12/19/2016 12:02 AM, sf wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:28:40 +1100, Bruce >
> wrote:
>
>> You could shop online and have your groceries delivered. That way,
>> you're never far from your towel warmer
>
> Have you ever grocery shopped online? What a nightmare.
>
>
You also have to live in an area that can actually *deliver* groceries
that are ordered online. I'm talking FRESH food. Of course, if all you
buy is *canned* food it's probably fine. I keep some canned vegetables
in the pantry but for the most part most of what I cook and eat does not
come out of a can.

Jill

On 12/19/2016 4:08 AM, Ophelia wrote:
> "Bruce" wrote in message
> T...
>
> In article >, sf says...
>>
>> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:28:40 +1100, Bruce >
>> wrote:
>>
>> > You could shop online and have your groceries delivered. That way,
>> > you're never far from your towel warmer
>>
>> Have you ever grocery shopped online? What a nightmare.
>
> Only wine.
>
> ==================
>
> Our big stores will deliver but I prefer to choose my veg et al myself.
>
Exactly! Even if I had the option of buying groceries online, or having
groceries delivered (which isn't an option) I want to select the
vegetables and fruit myself.

Jill

On 12/19/2016 10:20 AM, wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 10:04:14 -0500, jmcquown >
> wrote:
>
>> On 12/18/2016 10:41 PM, l not -l wrote:
>>> On 18-Dec-2016, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 22:10:07 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 12/18/2016 5:58 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 17:33:12 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:10 PM, Je?us wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Is your version of self serve just the bagging or do you also scan
>>>>>>>> your own items, pay and then bag them? Australia has the latter and I
>>>>>>>> won't use them. I'd rather the store a employ cashier.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree, but it is not always that simple. I asked the manager of out
>>>>>>> local supermarket. He'd like to have more cashiers at times but
>>>>>>> cannot
>>>>>>> find enough qualified people to cover all the hours.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well, maybe they should consider training them? Of course they
>>>>>> wouldn't do that though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, they do train. You need to have an IQ above room temperature
>>>>> though.
>>>>
>>>> I'm sure such people could be found.
>>> In a couple of stores I shop, the baggers are people with Downs Syndrome.
>>> They do a very good job of bagging; not too heavy, things packed carefully -
>>> no smashed bread, no cracked eggs. They are very well trained and seem very
>>> happy doing the task.
>>>
>> Ditto. My local Publix supermarket employs several people with Downs
>> Syndrome to bag groceries. They do a very good job. One such woman has
>> been working there for well over 10 years and is very proud of it.
>>
>> This young woman did tell me something rather horrific. Her mother made
>> her get her "tubes tied" so she couldn't get pregnant. I was
>> flabbergasted. Honestly, what do you say if someone tells you something
>> like that?! (I think I stammered, "Oh, I'm sorry"... I was truly at a
>> loss for words.)
>>
>> Jill
>
> I don't find that horrific. Friends had two sons then a Downs
> daughter. The day she was born their lives changed completely. She
> was always going to be a responsibility and they did not want her to
> become a financial responsibility for her brothers.
>
> The years passed and they never took the trips they had talked about,
> everything went into the Sara fund. She actually was not a 'sweet'
> Downs person, she was pretty violent and particularly where her mother
> was concerned. It came to the point where he felt if he was unlucky
> he might be struck down with a heart attack and then she would be at
> risk of Sara clocking her one.
>
> To that end they looked at many full time care homes for her. She
> went on trial to several who rejected her as being too violent for
> their staff (but two oldies could manage it seems!) and finally they
> found one and were able to put the money in trust for her fees etc.
>
> Sara had her tubes tied before it became fashionable to not do that,
> at least it was one worry they didn't have. If Sara had a child they
> would have been the ones who had to look after it, Sara would have
> just tossed it across the room if it annoyed her.
>
> It's a good thing to put oneself in the parents place in those
> circumstances.
>
I'm not saying I don't understand the mother's reasoning - it would be
yet another child to care for, and yes, to worry about when she (the
grandmother) died. The young woman I am talking about obviously isn't
violent, otherwise she wouldn't be holding down a long term job at the
supermarket. I just did not know how to react to her telling me
something like this. She's without guile. She told me something I
really didn't need to know and I didn't know how to reply.

Jill

"jmcquown" wrote in message news
On 12/18/2016 10:46 PM, sf wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 06:12:52 +1100, Bruce >
> wrote:
>
>> In article >, Dave Smith says...
>>>
>>> On 2016-12-18 10:46 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:59 AM, Bruce wrote:
>>>
>>>>> I couldn't care less what kind of checkout they have. What a strange
>>>>> thing to hold against a place.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Why not? I dislike self checkout and I'd not go for the same reason.
>>>> Aldi is self packing but has a cashier.
>>>
>>>
>>> I won't do self checkout. I prefer some human contact. I pity the people
>>> who are assigned to talking people into using self checkout and helped
>>> customers to screw the cashiers out of jobs. They are like Judas goats.
>>
>> You must be against automation too.
>
> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
> of us are not.
>
>
Bill Burr:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxINJzqzn4w

I don't work here!

Jill

=========================

Don't you get fed up of being described as 'stupid'?

I do!

--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

"jmcquown" wrote in message news
On 12/19/2016 12:49 AM, wrote:
> On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 9:46:05 PM UTC-6, sf wrote:
>>
>> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
>> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
>> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
>> of us are not.
>>
>>
> Oh please, get of your high horse and drop the sanctimonious
> attitude. It's very unbecoming and makes you look like a
> complete idiot.
>
No, she has a point. Making you ring up your own items *and* bag them
is the same thing as being an unpaid employee.

John and I were at Walmart a few years back, he bought a couple of
shirts. They only had a couple of checkout lanes open with an actual
cashier and people were lined up in those lanes. He opted for the self
checkout. There was an employee parked on a chair who was supposed to
be available to help. My SO is technologically challenged (doesn't own
a computer, doesn't want one.) He asked her for assistance. She truly
did not want to drag her butt off the chair. She acted like it was a
*huge* inconvenience to show him how to get one of the items to scan.

Give me an actual person who is doing the job they are paid to do, every
time.

Jill

====

We only use the 'self' checkout when we have just a couple of things. The
people overseeing that are great. They are helpful and often funny They
are a pleasure to deal with



--
http://www.helpforheroes.org.uk

On 12/17/2016 5:52 PM, l not -l wrote:
>
> Next visit to STL and Soulard, if a bbq fan, try Bogarts Smokehouse across
> the street from the west end of the market space. Excellent bbq.
> http://bogartssmokehouse.com/

Thanks for the heads-up about the bbq place near the Soulard Market!
Alas, I have no clue when I'll next be in the STL area :/

Sky

================================
Kitchen Rule #1 - Use the timer!
Kitchen Rule #2 - Cook's choice!
================================

On 12/19/2016 12:06 PM, Ophelia wrote:
> "jmcquown" wrote in message news >
> On 12/18/2016 10:46 PM, sf wrote:
>> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 06:12:52 +1100, Bruce >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> In article >, Dave Smith says...
>>>>
>>>> On 2016-12-18 10:46 AM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:59 AM, Bruce wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> I couldn't care less what kind of checkout they have. What a strange
>>>>>> thing to hold against a place.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Why not? I dislike self checkout and I'd not go for the same reason.
>>>>> Aldi is self packing but has a cashier.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I won't do self checkout. I prefer some human contact. I pity the
>>>> people
>>>> who are assigned to talking people into using self checkout and helped
>>>> customers to screw the cashiers out of jobs. They are like Judas
>>>> goats.
>>>
>>> You must be against automation too.
>>
>> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
>> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
>> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
>> of us are not.
>>
>>
> Bill Burr:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxINJzqzn4w
>
> I don't work here!
>
> Jill
>
> =========================
>
> Don't you get fed up of being described as 'stupid'?
>
> I do!
>
I don't pay much attention to it. <shrug> It's Usenet. These people
don't actually know me. I've only ever met in person one or two people
"met" online and they were perfectly nice people.

I don't like self-checkouts because they do in fact eliminate some jobs.

Jill

In article >,
says...
>
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 10:04:14 -0500, jmcquown >
> wrote:
>
> >On 12/18/2016 10:41 PM, l not -l wrote:
> >> On 18-Dec-2016, Jeßus > wrote:
> >>
> >>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 22:10:07 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> On 12/18/2016 5:58 PM, Je?us wrote:
> >>>>> On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 17:33:12 -0500, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 12/18/2016 2:10 PM, Je?us wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Is your version of self serve just the bagging or do you also scan
> >>>>>>> your own items, pay and then bag them? Australia has the latter and I
> >>>>>>> won't use them. I'd rather the store a employ cashier.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I agree, but it is not always that simple. I asked the manager of out
> >>>>>> local supermarket. He'd like to have more cashiers at times but
> >>>>>> cannot
> >>>>>> find enough qualified people to cover all the hours.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Well, maybe they should consider training them? Of course they
> >>>>> wouldn't do that though.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Yes, they do train. You need to have an IQ above room temperature
> >>>> though.
> >>>
> >>> I'm sure such people could be found.
> >> In a couple of stores I shop, the baggers are people with Downs Syndrome.
> >> They do a very good job of bagging; not too heavy, things packed carefully -
> >> no smashed bread, no cracked eggs. They are very well trained and seem very
> >> happy doing the task.
> >>
> >Ditto. My local Publix supermarket employs several people with Downs
> >Syndrome to bag groceries. They do a very good job. One such woman has
> >been working there for well over 10 years and is very proud of it.
> >
> >This young woman did tell me something rather horrific. Her mother made
> >her get her "tubes tied" so she couldn't get pregnant. I was
> >flabbergasted. Honestly, what do you say if someone tells you something
> >like that?! (I think I stammered, "Oh, I'm sorry"... I was truly at a
> >loss for words.)
> >
> >Jill

At least you're a woman. Imagine if she strikes up such personal
conversation with men she doesn't know? Being unable to judge
appropriate verbal boundaries, might extend to other inappropriate
trust, making her very vulnerable to exploitation.

Parents with Downs have up to 50% chance of having a baby which
also has Downs. A high proportion of Downs people also have congenital
physical problems, and women with Downs are more likely to miscarry,
have premature babies etc.

All those risks are a big burden for someone with Downs to take on.
Very worrying for their parents.


Janet UK



Janet UK

On 2016-12-19 10:04 AM, jmcquown wrote:
> On 12/18/2016 10:41 PM, l not -l wrote:

> Ditto. My local Publix supermarket employs several people with Downs
> Syndrome to bag groceries. They do a very good job. One such woman has
> been working there for well over 10 years and is very proud of it.
>
> This young woman did tell me something rather horrific. Her mother made
> her get her "tubes tied" so she couldn't get pregnant. I was
> flabbergasted. Honestly, what do you say if someone tells you something
> like that?! (I think I stammered, "Oh, I'm sorry"... I was truly at a
> loss for words.)

Think how things could be for her had she not had her tubes tied. She
could have had a number of children that she would not likely be able to
provide for and may have a hard time nurturing them intellectually. Then
there is the high risk of their children also having Down's some other
developmental disability.

On 2016-12-19 10:49 AM, jmcquown wrote:
> On 12/19/2016 12:02 AM, sf wrote:

> You also have to live in an area that can actually *deliver* groceries
> that are ordered online. I'm talking FRESH food. Of course, if all you
> buy is *canned* food it's probably fine. I keep some canned vegetables
> in the pantry but for the most part most of what I cook and eat does not
> come out of a can.

My mother used to have some of her groceries delivered when she was
unable to drive anymore. She was generally dissatisfied with the quality
of fruits and vegetables. Forget about ice cream. It won't make it there
before it is melted.

On 2016-12-19 10:51 AM, jmcquown wrote:

> Exactly! Even if I had the option of buying groceries online, or having
> groceries delivered (which isn't an option) I want to select the
> vegetables and fruit myself.

You probably don't remember having fruit and vegetable vendors. They
were before my time, but remember having bread delivery when I was a
kid, and we had milk delivery here until about 35 years ago.
My father in law worked for a fruit vendor in Chicago when he was a kid.
That would have been around 1910.

In article >, says...
> >
> I'm not saying I don't understand the mother's reasoning - it would be
> yet another child to care for, and yes, to worry about when she (the
> grandmother) died. The young woman I am talking about obviously isn't
> violent, otherwise she wouldn't be holding down a long term job at the
> supermarket. I just did not know how to react to her telling me
> something like this. She's without guile. She told me something I
> really didn't need to know and I didn't know how to reply.


IME, people who confide inappropriate intimacies to strangers in a
public place, are in their own bubble, unaware of the effect the
revelation may have on a third party OR the consequences for themselves.
In effect, they are telling themselves their own story over and over
again to themselves. The audience response doesn't even register.

Janet UK

On 12/19/2016 1:51 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2016-12-19 10:51 AM, jmcquown wrote:
>
>> Exactly! Even if I had the option of buying groceries online, or having
>> groceries delivered (which isn't an option) I want to select the
>> vegetables and fruit myself.
>
> You probably don't remember having fruit and vegetable vendors. They
> were before my time, but remember having bread delivery when I was a
> kid, and we had milk delivery here until about 35 years ago.
> My father in law worked for a fruit vendor in Chicago when he was a kid.
> That would have been around 1910.

Nope, I'm not old enough (or lived anywhere near) where there were
vendors selling their wares up and down the street.

I did live in a charming little apartment building (it is no longer
there) that had a butler's pantry with a small door for the milk man to
deliver dairy products. It was built in the 1920's.

Jill

On 2016-12-19 10:20 AM, wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 10:04:14 -0500, jmcquown >
> wrote:

> I don't find that horrific. Friends had two sons then a Downs
> daughter. The day she was born their lives changed completely. She
> was always going to be a responsibility and they did not want her to
> become a financial responsibility for her brothers.

I don't find it horrific either. I think that it is the responsible
thing to do. My wife worked in a school for the mentally retarded for a
while, and FWIW it was actually called School for the Trainable Mentally
Retarded because in the 1980s it was still a valid label for those with
developmental delays. Like most other developmental handicaps there is
a wide range of function. Some of the Down's kids were almost capable of
doing regular school work, but some of them were pretty slow to catch on
to even the simplest things.

About half of women with Down's are fertile, but there is also close to
50% chance that their children will have Down's or some other
developmental handicap.

One characteristic of Down's teens is that they can be uninhibited in a
lot of ways, and sexuality is one of them.

> To that end they looked at many full time care homes for her. She
> went on trial to several who rejected her as being too violent for
> their staff (but two oldies could manage it seems!) and finally they
> found one and were able to put the money in trust for her fees etc.

Parents won't be around forever, and the kids aren't likely to be able
to care for themselves. Some can, and goodness knows the press likes to
run stories about the few successes.


>
> Sara had her tubes tied before it became fashionable to not do that,
> at least it was one worry they didn't have. If Sara had a child they
> would have been the ones who had to look after it, Sara would have
> just tossed it across the room if it annoyed her.

My wife had one student whose parents had arranged for her to have her
tubes tied and some social worker intervened and threatened to take the
doctor to court, so he wanted nothing to do with it. This was a rather
low functioning woman. I suspected that the social worker was just
trying to feather her bed. A woman like that reproducing would likely
result in enough special needs kids to keep her in a job forever.




> It's a good thing to put oneself in the parents place in those
> circumstances.

We have friends who have a child (now 42?) who was diagnosed as mentally
retarded and autistic. He is still a handful. The father is now in is
late 70s and has had some health issues. The mother walked away years
ago but the step mother has been a saint, but she has health issues too.
They arranged for him to live in a home because they know it is just a
matter of time for them and that he would be screwed without the support.

In article >,
Cindy Hamilton says...
>
> On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 9:51:40 PM UTC-5, sf wrote:
> > On Sun, 18 Dec 2016 04:05:18 -0800 (PST), Cindy Hamilton
> > > wrote:
> >
> > > Agreed. My usual store has a carousel so the cashier fills bags
> > > as he/she scans items, but when I got to a store that has the
> > > belt, I'm
> > > not above bagging my own things, especially when they don't have a
> > > bagger for every lane. It gets me out of there faster.
> > >
> > Not me. I let the checkers do their job.
>
> What is your problem with me letting the cashier scan the items while
> I bag? It's not like I'm doing them out of a job. The grocery store
> will never hire more baggers. I might as well get myself home faster,
> since I hate grocery shopping.

To me baggers are hidden unemployment. It would be the same if the
council employed people who go from door to door to tie people's
shoelaces.

On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 10:27:04 -0500, jmcquown >
wrote:

>On 12/19/2016 12:49 AM, wrote:
>> On Sunday, December 18, 2016 at 9:46:05 PM UTC-6, sf wrote:
>>>
>>> Self-checkout is exactly the same as going though a normal checkout
>>> line (same machine), except you're the unpaid checker. You and Joan
>>> might be stupid enough to subsidize a gigantic corporation, but some
>>> of us are not.
>>>
>>>
>> Oh please, get of your high horse and drop the sanctimonious
>> attitude. It's very unbecoming and makes you look like a
>> complete idiot.
>>
>No, she has a point. Making you ring up your own items *and* bag them
>is the same thing as being an unpaid employee.
snip
>Jill

You are being paid through the lower cost of groceries and the variety
of groceries and other amenities made available to you. The average
net profit margin for supermarkets in the US is between 1.5 and 2.0%.
Grocery stores, even in the old Mom and Pop days, has never been a
high profit business. Grocery stores need to turn over all the extra
inventory that you want and do it quickly as much of it is perishable.
We're talking in terms of days. If they can speed your travel
through the cashier area by having you participate, you are helping to
keep jobs within the store because if the profit margin drops too low
people loose jobs.
If your self image won't allow you to shop where you need to bag, then
you should shop elsewhere. In my area, women loaded with bling,
dressed to the nines and obviously wealthy, have no compunction about
self checking or bagging.
Janet US

On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 07:41:38 -0500, Gary > wrote:

>Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>
>> sf wrote:
>> > Not me. I let the checkers do their job.
>>
>> What is your problem with me letting the cashier scan the items while
>> I bag? It's not like I'm doing them out of a job. The grocery store
>> will never hire more baggers. I might as well get myself home faster,
>> since I hate grocery shopping.
>
>I like grocery shopping. That's the only shopping that I do like.

The only thing I like about grocery shopping is it's a great place to
meet women Apart from that, I can't wait to have it unpacked at
home. Not really a fan of any kind of shopping.

In article >, Ophelia says...
>
> "Bruce" wrote in message
> T...
>
> In article >, Ophelia says...
> >
> > "Bruce" wrote in message
> > T...
> >
> > In article >, sf says...
> > >
> > > On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 15:28:40 +1100, Bruce >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > You could shop online and have your groceries delivered. That way,
> > > > you're never far from your towel warmer
> > >
> > > Have you ever grocery shopped online? What a nightmare.
> >
> > Only wine.
> >
> > ==================
> >
> > Our big stores will deliver but I prefer to choose my veg et al myself.
>
> I'd prefer that too. But supermarkets etc don't deliver here, in the
> sticks, anyway. We even have to go to town to pick up our wine
> 'delivery' half the time.
>
> =====
>
> OH noooooooooooo, hard luck ;-)

Well, yes. I pay the same as everybody else for delivery. Except I have
to go get it myself because they don't deliver it

On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 09:58:49 -0500, Brooklyn1
> wrote:

>Clothes shopping is very easy, I buy all clothing on line, even shoes.

You'd only need to buy your raincoats in bulk, no wonder you think
clothes shopping is easy.

On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 12:23:37 -0700, U.S. Janet B. >
wrote:

>On Mon, 19 Dec 2016 10:27:04 -0500, jmcquown >
>wrote:

>>>
>>No, she has a point. Making you ring up your own items *and* bag them
>>is the same thing as being an unpaid employee.
>snip
>>Jill
>
>You are being paid through the lower cost of groceries and the variety
>of groceries and other amenities made available to you. The average
>net profit margin for supermarkets in the US is between 1.5 and 2.0%.
>Grocery stores, even in the old Mom and Pop days, has never been a
>high profit business. Grocery stores need to turn over all the extra
>inventory that you want and do it quickly as much of it is perishable.
>We're talking in terms of days. If they can speed your travel
>through the cashier area by having you participate, you are helping to
>keep jobs within the store because if the profit margin drops too low
>people loose jobs.
>If your self image won't allow you to shop where you need to bag, then
>you should shop elsewhere. In my area, women loaded with bling,
>dressed to the nines and obviously wealthy, have no compunction about
>self checking or bagging.
>Janet US

I think you're right, personally I nearly always use the self
checkouts, have got to know the girls who run herd on them and we
usually have a laugh or two. I find it almost more personal than the
regular checkouts.