Rodney Myrvaagnes > wrote:

> The study in question is by J. Augustin, E. Augustin, R. Cutrufelli,
> S. Hagen, and C. Teitzel in "Alcohol retention in food preparation,"
> Journal Of The American Dietetic Association, Vol 92, No. 4, April
> 1992.
> ***************end of paste
>
> It doesn't sound worth looking for, if it doesn't identify starting
> points, or is the above referring to a different paper?

The study used to be available online; it no longer is. From what I
remember of it, it used scientific methods, meaning all the necessary
measurements, starting and otherwise, were done. Real-life recipes were
used, one of them by Escoffier, IIRC.

Victor

On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:30:29 +0100, Victor Sack wrote:

> Rodney Myrvaagnes > wrote:
>
>> The study in question is by J. Augustin, E. Augustin, R. Cutrufelli, S.
>> Hagen, and C. Teitzel in "Alcohol retention in food preparation,"
>> Journal Of The American Dietetic Association, Vol 92, No. 4, April 1992.
>> ***************end of paste
>>
>> It doesn't sound worth looking for, if it doesn't identify starting
>> points, or is the above referring to a different paper?
>
> The study used to be available online; it no longer is. From what I
> remember of it, it used scientific methods, meaning all the necessary
> measurements, starting and otherwise, were done. Real-life recipes were
> used, one of them by Escoffier, IIRC.

"All the necessary measurements" is not easily compatible with "real
life recipes".

Alcohol/water mixtures boil fairly predictably, the boiling temperature
and the vapor mix are tightly dependent on the proportions in the liquid.
Unless some separation technique is occurring (an oddly shaped pan lid
or fortunate configuration of an aluminum foil cover is acting as a
reflux head) the amount of alcohol remaining should be perfectly
predicted by the percentage of alcohol at the start, and the percentage
of liquid boiled away (or remaining). ANY cooking method that cooks off
at least half the liquid will essentially eliminate the alcohol.
Conversely, a cooking method that retains all of the liquid should fail
to eliminate much of the alcohol. The referenced study identified neither
the starting percentage of alcohol nor the proportinon of liquid
evaporated during the cooking.

Martin
--
Martin Golding | Anyone who eats three meals a day should understand
DoD #236 | why cookbooks outsell sex books three to one.

Martin Golding > wrote:

> On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 01:30:29 +0100, Victor Sack wrote:
>
> > Rodney Myrvaagnes > wrote:
> >
> >> The study in question is by J. Augustin, E. Augustin, R. Cutrufelli, S.
> >> Hagen, and C. Teitzel in "Alcohol retention in food preparation,"
> >> Journal Of The American Dietetic Association, Vol 92, No. 4, April 1992.
> >> ***************end of paste
> >>
> >> It doesn't sound worth looking for, if it doesn't identify starting
> >> points, or is the above referring to a different paper?
> >
> > The study used to be available online; it no longer is. From what I
> > remember of it, it used scientific methods, meaning all the necessary
> > measurements, starting and otherwise, were done. Real-life recipes were
> > used, one of them by Escoffier, IIRC.
>
> "All the necessary measurements" is not easily compatible with "real
> life recipes".
>
> Alcohol/water mixtures boil fairly predictably, the boiling temperature
> and the vapor mix are tightly dependent on the proportions in the liquid.
> Unless some separation technique is occurring (an oddly shaped pan lid
> or fortunate configuration of an aluminum foil cover is acting as a
> reflux head) the amount of alcohol remaining should be perfectly
> predicted by the percentage of alcohol at the start, and the percentage
> of liquid boiled away (or remaining). ANY cooking method that cooks off
> at least half the liquid will essentially eliminate the alcohol.

So, if you boil some wine until half of it is cooked off, all the
alcohol is eliminated?

> Conversely, a cooking method that retains all of the liquid should fail
> to eliminate much of the alcohol. The referenced study identified neither
> the starting percentage of alcohol nor the proportinon of liquid
> evaporated during the cooking.

Do you have an access to the study, or do you go by memory? I seem to
remember - and my memory is notoriously unreliable - that those
percentages were identified...

Victor