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Vodka sauce question.
Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa
place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian food in the area. I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. However, my questions a 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? 2 The ETOH of the vodka evaporates during cooking; and considering that vodka is 40% ETOH by volume, what is left is H20 and some residual unfermentable sugars, et cetera. 3 I can see adding a nice splash to a sauce already made; but the recipes I've seen, don't call for that. Any opinions on the matter? Regards, Rich -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 02:37:07 GMT, Richard Periut
> wrote: > Any opinions on the matter? > I don't think "vodka" sauce is anything special. I have the same objections to it that I have against most restaurant tomato sauces served over pasta... it's too bland to order again. Practice safe eating - always use condiments |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut wrote: > Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa > place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian > food in the area. > > I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. > However, my questions a > > 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > > 2 The ETOH of the vodka evaporates during cooking; and considering that > vodka is 40% ETOH by volume, what is left is H20 and some residual > unfermentable sugars, et cetera. > > 3 I can see adding a nice splash to a sauce already made; but the > recipes I've seen, don't call for that. > > Any opinions on the matter? > > Regards, > > Rich Rich, The vodka is present courtesy of a local contest in Italy where recipes were to contain some vodka (guess who sponsored the contest?). Stop trying to rationalize what was never intended. It was never designed to do anything. And it does it so well!!! -- Alan "If you reject the food, ignore the customs, fear the religion, and avoid the people, you might better stay home." --James Michener |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut wrote:
> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > The theory behind using vodka is that it dissolves the alcohol soluble compounds and disperses them throughout the sauce. I'd say the jury is still out on this one. -- Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot) com |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut wrote:
> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? Vodka is not tasteless, what brand do you drink? I do admit it has less taste than whiskey, for example, but it is hardly tasteless. > Any opinions on the matter? I think if you're going to cook with alcohol, use it where it counts and will be tasted. For example, I cook ground sirloin with a little bourbon to add flavor. The meat absorbs some of the bourbon, and I can taste it in the finished product (usually pasta sauce or chili). Vodka in cream sauce has a unique taste, but it's nothing special, and certainly not strong enough to matter. -- John Gaughan http://www.johngaughan.net/ |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut wrote:
> Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa > place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian > food in the area. > > I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. > However, my questions a > > 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? The alcohol isn't tasteless. Vodka doesn't have congeners to add flavor like whiskies, but it certainly can be tasted. > 2 The ETOH of the vodka evaporates during cooking; and considering that > vodka is 40% ETOH by volume, what is left is H20 and some residual > unfermentable sugars, et cetera. Not much of the alcohol actually evaporates in the short cook time of most vodka sauces. Here's a pickup from <http://www.canoe.ca/HealthMayeMuskColumns/011009.html> There's more info on the page, but this is the crux of it. Preparation method Percent retained Alcohol added to boiling liquid & removed from heat 85% Alcohol flamed 75% No heat, stored overnight 70% Baked, 25 minutes, alcohol not stirred into mixture 45% Baked/simmered, alcohol stirred into mixture 15 minutes 40% 30 minutes 35% 1 hour 25% 1.5 hours 20% 2 hours 10% 2.5 hours 5% Depending on your method of cooking, expect 45 - 75% alcohol in the final dish. Bob |
Vodka sauce question.
On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 04:44:26 GMT, alzelt
> wrote: > >Richard Periut wrote: >> I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. >> However, my questions a >> >> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > >The vodka is present courtesy of a local contest in Italy where recipes >were to contain some vodka (guess who sponsored the contest?). Stop >trying to rationalize what was never intended. It was never designed to >do anything. And it does it so well!!! This sounds like the most likely explanation to me. I recently read an interesting article (which I did not bookmark) by a (newspaper? magazine?) food writer who felt a little guilty about joining a flock of food writers accepting an all expense paid trip and presentations sponsored by, I think, olive oil companies. The next month all the food pages were full of OO recipes and comparisons and suggestions to taste and compare. Beware when a flood of anchovie recipes and articles appear! |
Vodka sauce question.
John Gaughan wrote:
> Richard Periut wrote: > >> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > > > Vodka is not tasteless, what brand do you drink? I do admit it has less > taste than whiskey, for example, but it is hardly tasteless. > >> Any opinions on the matter? > > > I think if you're going to cook with alcohol, use it where it counts and > will be tasted. For example, I cook ground sirloin with a little bourbon > to add flavor. The meat absorbs some of the bourbon, and I can taste it > in the finished product (usually pasta sauce or chili). Vodka in cream > sauce has a unique taste, but it's nothing special, and certainly not > strong enough to matter. > I stand corrected; Vodka has some taste, but very subtle-and forget about tasting it diluted in a sauce that has been heated (the ETOH evaporates very quickly, and whatever compounds are left are I think not appreciated.) I enjoy gray goose & Ketel One (very cold and straight) every now and then, but I'm a scotch (single malt) guy. Rich -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
Bob wrote:
> Richard Periut wrote: > >> Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa >> place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best >> Italian food in the area. >> >> I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. >> However, my questions a >> >> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > > > The alcohol isn't tasteless. Vodka doesn't have congeners to add flavor > like whiskies, but it certainly can be tasted. > >> 2 The ETOH of the vodka evaporates during cooking; and considering >> that vodka is 40% ETOH by volume, what is left is H20 and some >> residual unfermentable sugars, et cetera. > > > Not much of the alcohol actually evaporates in the short cook time of > most vodka sauces. Here's a pickup from > <http://www.canoe.ca/HealthMayeMuskColumns/011009.html> > > There's more info on the page, but this is the crux of it. > > Preparation method Percent retained > > Alcohol added to boiling > liquid & removed from heat 85% > > Alcohol flamed 75% > > No heat, stored overnight 70% > > Baked, 25 minutes, alcohol > not stirred into mixture 45% > > Baked/simmered, alcohol > stirred into mixture > 15 minutes 40% > 30 minutes 35% > 1 hour 25% > 1.5 hours 20% > 2 hours 10% > 2.5 hours 5% > > Depending on your method of cooking, expect 45 - 75% alcohol in the > final dish. > > Bob > Interesting, I hope my muslim friends never find out about this; I had a hard time convincing them to eat ; ) Funny that they did not feel it; or maybe they did and never told me ; ) Rich -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut > wrote:
> Any opinions on the matter? Posted a few years ago: Here's what Arthur Schwartz writes at <http://www.thefoodmaven.com/radiorecipes/penne.html>. <quote> This is not a traditional Italian recipe. I know because I was there -- more or less -- at its invention. It was the early 1970s and vodka was a relatively new spirit to Italians. To promote the consumption of vodka in Italy, vodka distillers provided restaurants with gizmos that kept both the vodka and vodka glasses chilled and they held recipe contests among Italian chefs. This dish was the rage in fashion-conscious Italian circles in the mid '70s. I never see it anymore in Italy. But Americans are entranced by the idea, even though it is nothing more than a tomato cream sauce with hot pepper and a good dose of vodka, which, to be frank, is hardly detectable in the finished dish. </quote> Victor |
Vodka sauce question.
In article >,
Richard Periut > wrote: >1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? The idea is to release flavor components in the tomatoes that aren't water-soluble. The vodka itself isn't supposed to impart much flavor to the sauce. -- Mark Shaw contact info at homepage --> http://www.panix.com/~mshaw ================================================== ====================== "Grown men are not comfortable explaining why they want to use the sniper rifle on fictional dogs with speech impediments." -James Lileks |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut wrote:
> Bob wrote: >> Depending on your method of cooking, expect 45 - 75% alcohol in the >> final dish. >> >> Bob >> > Interesting, I hope my muslim friends never find out about this; I had a > hard time convincing them to eat ; ) Funny that they did not feel it; or > maybe they did and never told me ; ) A zillion years ago, a teetotaling acquaintance who took great pride in never having tasted alcohol ate 5 or 6 creme de menthe parfaits from a rather elegant dinner we were both at. He became very voluble and much more cheerful than usual. Asked me how they were made. I told him I didn't know. Dodged that bullet. Bob |
Vodka sauce question.
On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 03:40:49 GMT, sf > wrote:
>On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 02:37:07 GMT, Richard Periut > wrote: > >> Any opinions on the matter? >> >I don't think "vodka" sauce is anything special. > >I have the same objections to it that I have against most >restaurant tomato sauces served over pasta... it's too bland >to order again. I am baffled. Is vodka sauce the same at all restaurants? Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a "Be careful. The toe you stepped on yesterday may be connected to the ass you have to kiss today." --Former mayor Ciancia |
Vodka sauce question.
On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 21:54:05 -0500, Rodney Myrvaagnes
> wrote: > On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 03:40:49 GMT, sf > wrote: > > >On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 02:37:07 GMT, Richard Periut > > wrote: > > > >> Any opinions on the matter? > >> > >I don't think "vodka" sauce is anything special. > > > >I have the same objections to it that I have against most > >restaurant tomato sauces served over pasta... it's too bland > >to order again. > > I am baffled. Is vodka sauce the same at all restaurants? > <thanks for asking> A: I have absolutely NO idea! I live in a big city which is famed for Italian food (originally, Sicilian - now we have more regions). I tried it at a local restaurant which is famed for Vodka Sauce but I didn't think the dish lived up to its mystique. I was SO dissapointed, it didn't rate a retry (anywhere) for me. Please don't let my opinion color your thinking, because I don't like most restaurant produced tomato based sauces (yes, I'm picky). The mystique of vodka sauce completely escapes me, but maybe you will find a nuance that I've missed. I have my opinion, but you are free to have a different one. :-) Practice safe eating - always use condiments |
Vodka sauce question.
sf > wrote in
: > On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 21:54:05 -0500, Rodney Myrvaagnes > > wrote: > >> On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 03:40:49 GMT, sf > wrote: >> >> >On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 02:37:07 GMT, Richard Periut >> > wrote: >> > >> >> Any opinions on the matter? >> >> >> >I don't think "vodka" sauce is anything special. >> > >> >I have the same objections to it that I have against most >> >restaurant tomato sauces served over pasta... it's too bland >> >to order again. >> >> I am baffled. Is vodka sauce the same at all restaurants? >> > > <thanks for asking> A: I have absolutely NO idea! > > I live in a big city which is famed for Italian food > (originally, Sicilian - now we have more regions). I tried > it at a local restaurant which is famed for Vodka Sauce but > I didn't think the dish lived up to its mystique. I was SO > dissapointed, it didn't rate a retry (anywhere) for me. > > Please don't let my opinion color your thinking, because I > don't like most restaurant produced tomato based sauces > (yes, I'm picky). The mystique of vodka sauce completely > escapes me, but maybe you will find a nuance that I've > missed. > > I have my opinion, but you are free to have a different one. > >:-) About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody mary or in orange or grapefruit juice. Otherwise, it simply tastes like rubbing alcohol to me and I've never understood it's strong attraction to so many. I doubt that I'd have even bothered trying a vodka sauce. It certainly doesn't offer the much flavor (apart from the alcohol taste) like other liquors. JMO Wayne |
Vodka sauce question.
(snip) > I am baffled. Is vodka sauce the same at all restaurants? > > > > Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a > > > "Be careful. The toe you stepped on yesterday may be connected to the ass you have to kiss today." --Former mayor Ciancia That's a good question! One of the best cheaper Italian Restaurants here on Maui (Marco's) has a FABULOUS vodka sauce. Theirs is a pink colored, tomato-cream sauce with pancetta bits served over a ziti-like pasta. It's wonderful! They have a lunch appetizer for about $12.00 that I can get two meals out of. Their dinner portion sells for about $28.00 and I can get 4 meals out of that. It's so rich and good. kili |
Vodka sauce question.
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Vodka sauce question.
"Richard Periut" > wrote in message ... > Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa > place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian > food in the area. > > I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. > However, my questions a > > 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? Nope - There are many flavors of vodka athough the basic flavor for me is lemon zest (very subtle). > 2 The ETOH of the vodka evaporates during cooking; and considering that > vodka is 40% ETOH by volume, what is left is H20 and some residual > unfermentable sugars, et cetera. see above - The et cetra is where the flavor is. > 3 I can see adding a nice splash to a sauce already made; but the > recipes I've seen, don't call for that. IMHO One of the advantages is you can make a tomato cream sauce with a lemon background withoug breaking the cream. |
Vodka sauce question.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 00:21:16 GMT, "Dimitri" >
wrote: >Nope - There are many flavors of vodka athough the basic flavor for me is >lemon zest (very subtle). > Howdy, No expert I, but it was my understanding that in Russia, if there were detectable flavors, the distillate of fermented potatoes could not be sold as "vodka." All the best, -- Kenneth If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS." |
Vodka sauce question.
Dimitri wrote:
> "Richard Periut" > wrote in message > ... > >>Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa >>place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian >>food in the area. >> >>I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. >>However, my questions a >> >>1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > > > Nope - There are many flavors of vodka athough the basic flavor for me is > lemon zest (very subtle). > > Sure, if you are drinking Citron : ) > >>2 The ETOH of the vodka evaporates during cooking; and considering that >>vodka is 40% ETOH by volume, what is left is H20 and some residual >>unfermentable sugars, et cetera. > > > see above - The et cetra is where the flavor is. > > Gee, I wish I had your superbuds, that can detect these nuances mixed in a cream sauce. > > >>3 I can see adding a nice splash to a sauce already made; but the >>recipes I've seen, don't call for that. > > > IMHO One of the advantages is you can make a tomato cream sauce with a lemon > background withoug breaking the cream. > > -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 06:11:58 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote: > sf > wrote in > : > > > On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 21:54:05 -0500, Rodney Myrvaagnes > > > wrote: > >> > >> I am baffled. Is vodka sauce the same at all restaurants? > >> > > > > <thanks for asking> A: I have absolutely NO idea! > > About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody mary > or in > orange or grapefruit juice. Otherwise, it simply tastes like > rubbing alcohol to me and I've never understood it's strong attraction > to so many. I doubt that I'd have even bothered trying a vodka > sauce. It certainly doesn't offer the much flavor (apart from the > alcohol taste) like other liquors . OH, Wayne... have you bought into the current "alternative" martinis? They are like the modern daiquiris and margaritas. Try Absolute Orange with a "splash" of Grand Marnier (or Triple Sec, to be frugal). It's Absolutely to die for!!!!! Alternatively, try Absolute Kurrant with a splash of Chambord... which you can dilute with cranberry juice, if you wish. It's not as good as the orange (IMO), but far better than an appletini. Practice safe eating - always use condiments |
Vodka sauce question.
sf > wrote in
: > On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 06:11:58 GMT, Wayne Boatwright > > wrote: > >> sf > wrote in >> : >> >> > On Sun, 08 Feb 2004 21:54:05 -0500, Rodney Myrvaagnes >> > > wrote: > >> >> >> >> I am baffled. Is vodka sauce the same at all restaurants? >> >> >> > >> > <thanks for asking> A: I have absolutely NO idea! > >> >> About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody mary >> or in >> orange or grapefruit juice. Otherwise, it simply tastes like >> rubbing alcohol to me and I've never understood it's strong >> attraction to so many. I doubt that I'd have even bothered trying a >> vodka sauce. It certainly doesn't offer the much flavor (apart from >> the alcohol taste) like other liquors . > > OH, Wayne... have you bought into the current "alternative" > martinis? They are like the modern daiquiris and > margaritas. > > Try Absolute Orange with a "splash" of Grand Marnier (or > Triple Sec, to be frugal). It's Absolutely to die for!!!!! > > Alternatively, try Absolute Kurrant with a splash of > Chambord... which you can dilute with cranberry juice, if > you wish. It's not as good as the orange (IMO), but far > better than an appletini. Now those sound good! I would definitely be willing to try them, especially the Kurrant. But my "real" martinis must be with either Bombay, Tanqueray, or Beefeater gin, never vodka. As to "vodka", I was referring to just plain vodka, even the best of brands, which all taste like rubbing alcohol to me. Maybe it's genetic. I love beets! <G> Wayne |
Vodka sauce question.
"Rodney Myrvaagnes" > wrote in message ... <snip> > I don't believe, without further evidence, that a large fraction of > the alcohol remains after cooking. If that were true, stills wouldn't > work in a reasonable period of time. .. > Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a A flat-earther eh Rodney? <grin> The alcohol certainly remains in my favorite recipe as it goes in at the end of cooking. So here is a no-question-about-it alcoholic pasta! Charlie PENNE A LA VODKA Source: San Diego Union, date unknown 3/4 lb. penne 1 tbs. olive oil 2 tbs. butter 1 onion, finely chopped 1/2 lb. tomatoes, peeled and chopped 4 tbs. heavy cream coarse salt to taste freshly ground pepper to taste 4 tbs. vodka, steeped overnight or longer with 1 tbs. hot red pepper flakes freshly grated Parmesan to taste Cook penne to al dente and drain. Meanwhile make the sauce. Heat olive oil and butter in a skillet. Soften the onions without browning and add the tomatoes. Cook for about 5 minutes. Add the cream and cook for 1 minute. Season with salt and pepper. Add the vodka and simmer for 2 minutes. Toss the penne with the sauce in a heated bowl and serve with the cheese. |
Vodka sauce question.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:42:57 GMT, "Charles Gifford"
> wrote: > >"Rodney Myrvaagnes" > wrote in message .. . ><snip> >> I don't believe, without further evidence, that a large fraction of >> the alcohol remains after cooking. If that were true, stills wouldn't >> work in a reasonable period of time. >. >> Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a > >A flat-earther eh Rodney? <grin> The alcohol certainly remains in my >favorite recipe as it goes in at the end of cooking. So here is a >no-question-about-it alcoholic pasta! > >Charlie > >PENNE A LA VODKA > >Source: San Diego Union, date unknown > >3/4 lb. penne >1 tbs. olive oil >2 tbs. butter >1 onion, finely chopped >1/2 lb. tomatoes, peeled and chopped >4 tbs. heavy cream >coarse salt to taste >freshly ground pepper to taste >4 tbs. vodka, steeped overnight or longer with 1 tbs. hot red pepper flakes >freshly grated Parmesan to taste > > >Cook penne to al dente and drain. Meanwhile make the sauce. Heat olive oil >and butter in a skillet. Soften the onions without browning and add the >tomatoes. Cook for about 5 minutes. Add the cream and cook for 1 minute. >Season with salt and pepper. Add the vodka and simmer for 2 minutes. Toss >the penne with the sauce in a heated bowl and serve with the cheese. > > Sounds pleasant enough, but doesn't address what I said. Your 4 tbsp of vodka contains about 4 tsp of alcohol, depending on proof, when you put it in. You simmer for 2 minutes near the boiling point of water, or about 20 deg C above the boiling point of the vodka (water-alcohol mix ca 40% by wt.) One could devise an experiment to measure the alcohol loss in 2 minutes, but unless there is some reputable published measurement, I don't consider that amount worth bothering about. The rest of the sauce amounts to about a pint, so before simmering you have about 5% by vol--like beer. In no way comparable to a creme-de-menthe parfait. Rodney Myrvaagnes J36 Gjo/a "That idiot Leibniz, who wants to teach me about the infinitesimally small! Has he therefore forgotten that I am the wife of Frederick I? How can he imagine that I am unacquainted with my own husband?" |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut wrote:
> Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa > place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian > food in the area. > > I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. > However, my questions a > > 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > <snip> As other people have said, tomatoes contain a few compounds that are alcohol-soluble. Adding alcohol to a tomato-based sauce will release those flavor compounds into the sauce. Vodka is commonly used because, while not completely tasteless, has a fairly neutral flavor. Other sauces might use white wine. I would avoid red wines as they often are too complex to just add to a recipe that is already fairly well balanced, especially if the sauce will be reduced further. You should try it yourself. When I first heard that tomatoes have alcohol-soluble flavors, I made a fairly simple tomato sauce and split it in half when it was done. I added a shot of vodka to one and let them both continue to simmer for another 5 minutes. I could definitely taste the difference, and it was not vodka I was tasting. The sauce just seemed to have a wider range of flavors. - Adam -- Adam Fineman (Reverse domain name to reply.) |
Vodka sauce question.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 10:46:21 -0500, Rodney Myrvaagnes
> wrote: >Sounds pleasant enough, but doesn't address what I said. Your 4 tbsp >of vodka contains about 4 tsp of alcohol, depending on proof, when you >put it in. You simmer for 2 minutes near the boiling point of water, >or about 20 deg C above the boiling point of the vodka (water-alcohol >mix ca 40% by wt.) Ah hah! I used to be of the "all the alcohol boils off/cooks out" persuasion, 'til the figures were presented (and once again in a recent thread here). Consider: Water boils at 212F (at sea level). Does this mean when you bring a pot of water to the boil, all of it instantantly evaporates? Of course not. That'd make steaming green beans *extremely* treacherous. Warm water, then !poof! bare pot over high flame! Alcohol indeeds boils/evaporates at a lower temperature than water, but that *doesn't* mean it all disappears at around 78C. I very much doubt that 4Tblsp of 60-proof (30%) alcohol in a pot of pasta sauce simmered for 20 minutes would intoxicate even a small child, but there is *some* alcohol remaining. Now whether it was ever enough to be a superior solvent for releasing certain flavors is, IMHO, rather questionable. |
Vodka sauce question.
Rodney Myrvaagnes > wrote in message >. ..
> On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 11:42:57 GMT, "Charles Gifford" > > wrote: > > > > >"Rodney Myrvaagnes" > wrote in message > .. . > ><snip> > >> I don't believe, without further evidence, that a large fraction of > >> the alcohol remains after cooking. If that were true, stills wouldn't > >> work in a reasonable period of time. > . Shankar posted a reference to a refereed, published article over ten years ago. Here's a pointer to his reference: <http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&rnum=16&selm=43778%40rnd.GBA.NYU.EDU> > >> Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a -bwg |
Vodka sauce question.
On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 06:11:58 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote: > >About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody mary >or in >orange or grapefruit juice. >Wayne give it a whack with pineapple juice sometime. your pal, blake |
Vodka sauce question.
Adam Fineman wrote:
> Richard Periut wrote: > >> Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa >> place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best >> Italian food in the area. >> >> I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. >> However, my questions a >> >> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? >> <snip> > > > As other people have said, tomatoes contain a few compounds that are > alcohol-soluble. Adding alcohol to a tomato-based sauce will release > those flavor compounds into the sauce. Vodka is commonly used because, > while not completely tasteless, has a fairly neutral flavor. Other > sauces might use white wine. I would avoid red wines as they often are > too complex to just add to a recipe that is already fairly well > balanced, especially if the sauce will be reduced further. > > You should try it yourself. When I first heard that tomatoes have > alcohol-soluble flavors, I made a fairly simple tomato sauce and split > it in half when it was done. I added a shot of vodka to one and let > them both continue to simmer for another 5 minutes. I could definitely > taste the difference, and it was not vodka I was tasting. The sauce > just seemed to have a wider range of flavors. > > - Adam > I'm gonna give it a try. Thanks for the responses from you all. Rich -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:09:43 -0500, Adam Fineman
> wrote: >Richard Periut wrote: >> Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa >> place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian >> food in the area. >> >> I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. >> However, my questions a >> >> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? >> <snip> > >As other people have said, tomatoes contain a few compounds that are >alcohol-soluble. Adding alcohol to a tomato-based sauce will release >those flavor compounds into the sauce. Vodka is commonly used because, >while not completely tasteless, has a fairly neutral flavor. Other >sauces might use white wine. I would avoid red wines as they often are >too complex to just add to a recipe that is already fairly well >balanced, especially if the sauce will be reduced further. > >You should try it yourself. When I first heard that tomatoes have >alcohol-soluble flavors, I made a fairly simple tomato sauce and split >it in half when it was done. I added a shot of vodka to one and let >them both continue to simmer for another 5 minutes. I could definitely >taste the difference, and it was not vodka I was tasting. The sauce >just seemed to have a wider range of flavors. > Thanks, Adam. You actually contributed something helpful to the discussion. Rodney Myrvaagnes J36 Gjo/a "That idiot Leibniz, who wants to teach me about the infinitesimally small! Has he therefore forgotten that I am the wife of Frederick I? How can he imagine that I am unacquainted with my own husband?" |
Vodka sauce question.
blake murphy > wrote in
: > On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 06:11:58 GMT, Wayne Boatwright > > wrote: >> >>About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody mary >>or in >>orange or grapefruit juice. > >>Wayne > > give it a whack with pineapple juice sometime. > > your pal, > blake > Actually, I have, and it's good. Thanks, Blake. I just need something to mix it with that overpowers the "rubbing alcohol" flavor. <G> Wayne |
Vodka sauce question.
Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> blake murphy > wrote in > : > > >>On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 06:11:58 GMT, Wayne Boatwright > wrote: >> >>>About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody > > mary > >>>or in >>>orange or grapefruit juice. >> >>>Wayne >> >>give it a whack with pineapple juice sometime. >> >>your pal, >>blake >> > > > Actually, I have, and it's good. Thanks, Blake. I just need > something to mix it with that overpowers the "rubbing > alcohol" flavor. <G> > > Wayne Actually,if you ever tasted Gray Goose or Ketel One, or any of the premium vodkas, take it straight and very chilled, you'll pick up certain nuances and it shouldn't taste like rubbing ETOH. I've had Stoli, and IMO, doesn't come close to the aforementioned ones. Absolut is not bad, Chopin and Belvedere are also excellent. Want to make it interesting, add some allspice and cloves to it; you can experiment with other spices. It's like plain rice, by itself it really tastes bland. But combine it with sacues, cheese, et cetera, and you have a base on which to build a mountain of recipes. Rich -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
Richard Periut > wrote in
: > Wayne Boatwright wrote: > >> blake murphy > wrote in >> : >> >> >>>On Mon, 09 Feb 2004 06:11:58 GMT, Wayne Boatwright > wrote: >>> >>>>About the only way I can enjoy vodka is in a spicy bloody >> >> mary >> >>>>or in >>>>orange or grapefruit juice. >>> >>>>Wayne >>> >>>give it a whack with pineapple juice sometime. >>> >>>your pal, >>>blake >>> >> >> >> Actually, I have, and it's good. Thanks, Blake. I just need >> something to mix it with that overpowers the "rubbing >> alcohol" flavor. <G> >> >> Wayne > > Actually,if you ever tasted Gray Goose or Ketel One, or any of the > premium vodkas, take it straight and very chilled, you'll pick up > certain nuances and it shouldn't taste like rubbing ETOH. I've had > Stoli, and IMO, doesn't come close to the aforementioned ones. Absolut > is not bad, Chopin and Belvedere are also excellent. > > Want to make it interesting, add some allspice and cloves to it; you > can experiment with other spices. It's like plain rice, by itself it > really tastes bland. But combine it with sacues, cheese, et cetera, > and you have a base on which to build a mountain of recipes. > > Rich > Admittedly, I have never tried anything but Stoli and some lesser brands, so will certainly take your comments and suggestions under advisement. None I've tried were flavored, and the Stoli was taken directly from the freezer, plain. The spice additions do sound interesting. Thanks, Wayne |
Vodka sauce question.
Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> Richard Periut > wrote in > : >>Want to make it interesting, add some allspice and cloves to it; you >>can experiment with other spices. It's like plain rice, by itself it >>really tastes bland. But combine it with sacues, cheese, et cetera, >>and you have a base on which to build a mountain of recipes. >> >>Rich >> > Admittedly, I have never tried anything but Stoli and some lesser > brands, so will certainly take your comments and suggestions under > advisement. None I've tried were flavored, and the Stoli was taken > directly from the freezer, plain. > > The spice additions do sound interesting. For this past X_mas, I made 5 different infused vodkas. I used bottom of the line stuff because it's all either grain neutral spirits filtered through a mile of charcoal to get *everything* out of it or potato or other alcohol filtered through a mile of charcoal to get *everything* out of it - and then diluted with water to standard proof ratings. I kept a wide range of vodkas in my bars and restaurants and through a long string of blind taste tests, nobody ever identified their favorites compared to others more and less expensive. Anyway, I infused vodka separately with lemon, orange and lime peels. Also hot peppers (habs and others) and pomegranate seeds. They're all wonderful. Much more strongly flavored than the commercial stuff. The hot pepper vodka is a killer. Add to bloody mary with a dash of lemon vodka. WOW> The orange with a dash of Grand Marnier is stunning. The lime added to a margarita made with dark tequila is amazing. Pomegranate and cassis in champagne is sparkling (sorry). Pastorio |
Vodka sauce question.
Bob wrote:
> Wayne Boatwright wrote: > >> Richard Periut > wrote in >> : > > >>> Want to make it interesting, add some allspice and cloves to it; you >>> can experiment with other spices. It's like plain rice, by itself it >>> really tastes bland. But combine it with sacues, cheese, et cetera, >>> and you have a base on which to build a mountain of recipes. >>> >>> Rich >>> >> Admittedly, I have never tried anything but Stoli and some lesser >> brands, so will certainly take your comments and suggestions under >> advisement. None I've tried were flavored, and the Stoli was taken >> directly from the freezer, plain. >> The spice additions do sound interesting. > > > For this past X_mas, I made 5 different infused vodkas. I used bottom of > the line stuff because it's all either grain neutral spirits filtered > through a mile of charcoal to get *everything* out of it or potato or > other alcohol filtered through a mile of charcoal to get *everything* > out of it - and then diluted with water to standard proof ratings. I > kept a wide range of vodkas in my bars and restaurants and through a > long string of blind taste tests, nobody ever identified their favorites > compared to others more and less expensive. You chill Gray Goose and Ketel One, along with others, and I and other people that I know will distinguish them apart. > > Anyway, I infused vodka separately with lemon, orange and lime peels. > Also hot peppers (habs and others) and pomegranate seeds. > > They're all wonderful. Much more strongly flavored than the commercial > stuff. The hot pepper vodka is a killer. Add to bloody mary with a dash > of lemon vodka. WOW> The orange with a dash of Grand Marnier is > stunning. The lime added to a margarita made with dark tequila is > amazing. All that is great, when you are using cheap vodka and tequila. I myself enjoy Sotol Reposado from Chihuahua, Mexico--it's similar to a tequila but not quite, because it's not made from the blue agave as tequila is, but rather, from a similar species which is native only to Chihuahua--See: http://www.nightclub.com/magazine/June01/spirits.html .. These are to be consumed neat; for mixing them is to destroy the subtle nuances which they exhibit. Rich Pomegranate and cassis in champagne is sparkling (sorry). > > Pastorio > -- --------------------------------------------------------------------- Dum spiro, spero. (Cicero) As long as I breathe, I hope. |
Vodka sauce question.
"Rodney Myrvaagnes" > wrote in message ... > On Tue, 10 Feb 2004 13:09:43 -0500, Adam Fineman > > wrote: > > >Richard Periut wrote: > >> Recently I tasted a vodka sauce recipe from a local Italian Ma & Pa > >> place. The place is very good; byob, quick service, and the best Italian > >> food in the area. > >> > >> I ordered a Penne a la Vodka as a side dish, and found it quite good. > >> However, my questions a > >> > >> 1 Vodka is pretty much tasteless, so what does it give the dish? > >> <snip> > > > >As other people have said, tomatoes contain a few compounds that are > >alcohol-soluble. Adding alcohol to a tomato-based sauce will release > >those flavor compounds into the sauce. Vodka is commonly used because, > >while not completely tasteless, has a fairly neutral flavor. Other > >sauces might use white wine. I would avoid red wines as they often are > >too complex to just add to a recipe that is already fairly well > >balanced, especially if the sauce will be reduced further. > > > >You should try it yourself. When I first heard that tomatoes have > >alcohol-soluble flavors, I made a fairly simple tomato sauce and split > >it in half when it was done. I added a shot of vodka to one and let > >them both continue to simmer for another 5 minutes. I could definitely > >taste the difference, and it was not vodka I was tasting. The sauce > >just seemed to have a wider range of flavors. > > > Thanks, Adam. You actually contributed something helpful to the > discussion. That sounds like a major put-down Rodney. And after I shared my favorite recipe with you. Tut. Charlie > > > > Rodney Myrvaagnes J36 Gjo/a |
Vodka sauce question.
On Wed, 11 Feb 2004 10:00:01 GMT, "Charles Gifford"
> wrote: >> >taste the difference, and it was not vodka I was tasting. The sauce >> >just seemed to have a wider range of flavors. >> > >> Thanks, Adam. You actually contributed something helpful to the >> discussion. > >That sounds like a major put-down Rodney. And after I shared my favorite >recipe with you. Tut. > Sorry, Charlie, I thanked you for the recipe, but it didn't answer my question, for the reason you pointed out yourself. Anyhow, Pastorio pointed to web sites that actually contained an answer. I know, USDA is not a refereed journal either, except by lobbyists and congressmen. If anyone actually knows the reference to Akbar's journal article, I might be able to look it up. Rodney Myrvaagnes J36 Gjo/a "That idiot Leibniz, who wants to teach me about the infinitesimally small! Has he therefore forgotten that I am the wife of Frederick I? How can he imagine that I am unacquainted with my own husband?" |
Vodka sauce question.
Rodney Myrvaagnes > wrote:
> If anyone actually knows the reference to Akbar's journal article, I > might be able to look it up. I don't know who or what "Akbar" is, but see <http://groups.google.com/groups?&selm=1ewf80l.4y16vq1f6n09hN%25sackv%40uni-duesseldorf.de> and <http://groups.google.com/groups?&selm=Xns90DD9A7B6FF5sbhattacatattnet%40204 .127.36.1>. Victor |
Vodka sauce question.
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