On Saturday, November 7, 1992 at 9:45:48 AM UTC-6, John David Auwen wrote:
> This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> this newsgroup. Carol is still a major contributer to this group so
> I'd like to thank her for her good advice that I'm reposting here.
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> From rec.food.cooking Tue Oct 8 16:27:09 1991
> From: (Carol Miller-Tutzauer)
> Some time ago (1 yr), I posted my "gravy-making bible". Because I
> figured others might be interested, I decided to re-post.
> A couple comments to the person originating the request: I never
> use cornstarch for gravy. I think it only results in making a
> gravy taste "gummy." As for the color of your gravy not being
> dark enough, I recommend below making a roux -- that is, sauteeing
> flour in oil until it "cooks." The longer you cook the flour,
> the more brown it becomes. It is relatively easy to cook the
> roux until it turns the color of peanut butter. This will give
> you a very nice beige color. For beef gravy, often your pan
> drippings will add the necessary darkness. If you want something
> deep rich brown, then you must cook the roux until it is the
> color of a Hershey's milk chocolate bar. It takes a fair amount
> of skill (or, rather, practice) to be able to cook a roux that
> long without burning it. If you cook it over a VERY LOW heat,
> stirring constantly, for about 1/2 hour, you can probably get
> it pretty dark. But if it burns, you have to start over. What
> I do, as a quick fix, to darken up gravy, is to add some Kitchen
> Bouquet (or Gravy Master; found near the Worcestershire sauce
> in the grocery store). In this way, you can safely make a
> medium-color roux (peanut-butter color) and then "fix it up"
> with some Kitchen Bouquet.
> Flavor MUST come from pan drippings, and if you dilute them too
> much, your gravy will be equally flavorless. Carmelized onions
> can help, and so I recommend throwing some onion chunks into
> the roasting pan with your meat. You can also throw in some
> chunks of carrots and celery. This will help stretch your
> meat drippings, flavor-wise. Sometimes, adding some salt
> "tricks" your palate into thinking there is more meat flavor
> in the gravy. However, be careful not to add too much salt.
> Another option is to add a seasoning mixture -- my mother used
> to add about 1/2 tsp of season salt to her pork chop gravy with
> good "stretching" effects. I like to use Paul Prudhomme's
> Cajun Magic for Poultry seasoning, but it is salty, so be careful.
> Some fresh herbs added just at the end of cooking your roux
> and before adding liquid to the roux mixture can also add flavor
> and help stretch "thin" drippings.
> Anyway... here goes:
>
> =================
> Gravy-Making Tips
> =================
> For roasted meats (like roasted turkey or chicken, beef or pork roast):
> 1. When meat has finished roasting, remove from oven. Let meat sit
> for at least 20 minutes before doing anything.
> 2. Remove meat to a serving plate (or a cutting board if you want
> to carve it first before putting pieces on serving plate). Now you are
> left with the roasting pan and the "drippings."
> 3. Pour about 1/2 c of water into the pan with drippings. With a
> spoon, keep stirring the liquid around until nearly all of the "crusties"
> from the pan have dissolved in the liquid. (Note: In the case of
> poultry, don't worry about scraping up all the skin that sticks to the
> pan; just the crusted-on browned juices. Also, since turkeys are so much
> larger pieces of meat, you should probably pour off most of the grease and
> then use more water -- about 1 c to 1 1/2 c. Reserve the extra grease if
> you would like to use it; otherwise, pitch it. It's tasty to cook veggies
> in, like bacon grease; but don't overdo it -- think of your arteries!)
> 4. Now...if you want your gravy to be "clean" of meat/skin
> particles, strain the meat juice through a sieve into a bowl or other
> vessel. Set this aside. You will need it soon.
> 5. Get a heavy saucepan. Using vegetable oil (or some of the
> poured off extra grease) -- about 4 T unless you are doing turkey and then
> you should use about 1/2 c --, heat the oil in the saucepan. Now throw
> in slightly less flour than you used oil (i.e, 3 T or a little less than
> 1/2 c in the case of turkey). Fry the flour over a medium heat for a bit
> to "cook out" the raw taste of the flour. If the mixture is thick or
> gummy, just add small amounts of oil until the mixture runs to coat the
> bottom of your pan. If you want, you can let the flour brown a bit but
> be careful not to burn it. If you do, then you MUST start over. Now pour
> your reserved juice into the flour/oil mixture, stirring steadily. Cook
> until the gravy begins a gentle rolling boil.
> 6. If at this point the gravy is too thick, add some water to thin
> it. If the gravy is too thin, either lower the heat a bit and simmer away
> some of the liquid OR cook up a small amount of flour/oil mixture to add
> OR mix a bit of flour into either some solid shortening or butter and add.
>
> 7. Adjust seasonings (salt, pepper, & the like) to taste.
>
> --------------------------------------
> For a quick stovetop gravy from stock:
> --------------------------------------
> 1. Follow the same basic procedure as above, except use stock/broth
> (either fresh or canned) as the "juice".
> 2. If you want a "brown" gravy and your stock isn't very dark, then
> just be sure to slowly brown the flour/oil mixture first. Also feel free
> to quickly fry some seasonings in the roux mixture just before adding the
> stock/broth (e.g., herbs or combinations w/ salt, pepper, cayenne, dry
> mustard, whatever).
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> For a stovetop gravy from pan-fried meats (like pork chops):
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> 1. Make up your roux in a saucepan.
> 2. Remove your meat from the pan to a serving dish. Be sure to
> cover the meat with a lid or aluminum foil to keep it warm, or place in
> a warm oven on an ovenproof platter.
> 3. If the pan drippings are not already "dried onto" the pan, keep
> the pan over a medium-low heat until there is no meat liquid in the pan
> and the juices stick and brown on the pan bottom. Now "de-glaze" the pan
> by using a some water (or broth, if available).
> 4. Add the meat juice to the roux in the saucepan, heat to the
> point where gravy just starts to boil. Adjust consistency of gravy as
> explained above (cook down or add a bit more liquid). Adjust seasonings
> (salt, pepper, whatever you want to add).
>
> -------------------
> Fried Chicken Gravy
> -------------------
> 1. Remove cooked fried chicken to plate lined with paper towels or
> to a brown paper bag.
> 2. Pour off all but about 1/4 c of the oil in your pan, leaving as
> many of the "crusties" as possible.
> 3. Add somewhat less than 1/4 c flour to the pan and fry over
> medium heat for a few minutes (don't burn!).
> 4. If desired, at this point, add about 1 t of a mixed seasoning
> mix (like cajun seasoning or Mrs. Dash or other concoction of your own).
> Saute for about 30 seconds.
> 5. Add 1 large can of chicken broth (or about 1 quart of homemade
> stock -- good way to use your leftover parts & giblets). Cook until
> desired consistency is reached.
> 6. Adjust seasonings (salt, pepper, whatever).
>
> *Variation: Some people like their gravy made with milk or cream. In
> this case, use less flour and you won't need it to thicken the gravy as
> much. Also, leave less oil in the pan too, BUT KEEP THOSE CRUSTIES. You
> can also add chopped cooked giblets to the gravy. I have also (during
> oyster season), added whole fresh oysters to the gravy and served on top
> of a good cornbread dressing or on rice & lima beans for a North
> Carolina/New Orleans favorite (at least in our family).
> --------------------------
> Final note: I've tried to be explicit and detailed with this, but it
> really is quite easy. Combining oil and flour into a "roux" prevents the
> flour from caking or making lumps. Cooking the flour a bit first takes
> away the pasty raw flavor. Light rouxs are French; darker rouxs are
> Cajun.
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> From rec.food.cooking Sat Aug 22 10:08:52 1992
> From: (Nicholas J. Simicich)
> I was amazed to see, on the shelf in the store a while back, a can of
> gravy. I was surprised that something so simple to make would be
> canned as if it was hard to make. At the end of this lesson, you will
> be able to make your own gravy, from scratch, amazing your friends and
> confounding your S/O.
> You might want to be able to make gravy at any time. The ingredients
> are basically staples, that you'll be able to keep on a shelf for over
> a year. You can buy gravy fixins once, and you'll have them for a
> year, except for the milk. I'm going to give both a method and a
> philosophy of gravy below. But if you could make gravy at a moments
> notice, think about how the addition of gravy would change the six
> things you can make (no, macaroni and cheese with gravy is not an
> option).
> Things you should buy and keep:
> Wondra flour. Get the tube with the shaker top. Yep, this flour is
> really a wonder. Why? Because it dissolves without tending to form
> lumps, instead of lumping up. This phenomenon, 'lumpy gravy' was
> the bane of many moms, and the name of at least one record album.
> You still have to stir, some, but not as much.
> Boullion. I'm not a fan of boullion cubes, but they are better than
> nothing. However, these little jars of Bouvril are really good.
> Get beef and chicken. Or whatever you think you will like.
> Salt. Yep. But if you use boullion, you probably won't need it.
> Pepper. "Makes no difference if its black or white."
> Do you like dark brown gravy? Chances are that it arrives at this
> color with a concoction called "Kitchen Bouquet". This only has
> limited use in the kitchen, or so I feel. It is carmelized
> vegetables, and is the home cook's version of caramel color. But
> for making dark brown gravy without sweat, it works real well.
> Herbs. Sage helps the flavor of gravy. But you will probably be
> perfectly happy with something that you can buy called 'Poultry
> Seasoning' that contains sage and some other stuff. You can use
> this in lots of stuff, and it does well in gravy, and keeps you from
> using an herb mix that is too unbalanced.
> You've spent about 10 bucks. You can now make gravy about 20 times.
> What should prompt you to make gravy? Well, pan drippings from frying
> for one, or the liquid from cooking the fowl that you are too inept to
> cook. In fact, whenever you look at the liquid in a pan, you should
> be thinking, "Is it time for gravy? How about these burgers. What if
> I made gravy and served them open faced with hot gravy? How about
> this liver and onions? Would it taste good with gravy? Should I make
> gravy with this chicken that I wasn't supposed to cook because I was
> so inept? Instead of eggs for breakfast, how about gravy made with
> the bacon drippings over Pillsbury poppin fresh biscuits, (which can
> be made by anyone who has an oven and a timer)." One of my favorites,
> that I eat very rarely these days, is fried kidneys made in Kidney
> gravy.
> For that matter, some folks like gravy so much that they will fry
> onions until they get real brown to make onion gravy, or they will fry
> a little beef fat to make beef gravy (but that doesn't work as well).
> Step 1: Pour off most of the grease. You want only a couple of
> tablespoons of drippings to start with, unless you plan on making a
> whole couple quarts of gravy, you don't want it too greasy. If you
> don't have a couple of tablespoons of grease, supplement with
> vegetable oil. If you must, you can start with plain vegetable oil.
> Add extra boullion to the water in step two. Consider browning a
> little onion or garlic in plain oil, or a slice of bacon.
> Step 2: Prepare the stock that will go into the gravy, eventually. If
> you have non-greasy pan drippings, (or skim the grease) well, just
> warm them over low heat or zap them. If not, boil a couple of cups of
> water, and drop in your favorite boullion liquid or cube. One secret
> is to put nearly boiling liquid into the mix at the appropriate point.
> If you know you are going to make gravy, start heating your boullion
> about the same time you start your burgers, or a few minutes after you
> turn your chicken.
> Step 3: Heat the pan to slow-medium frying temperature. Put in about
> a half again as much flour as you have grease. In other words, if you
> started with two tablespoons of grease, put in three tablespoons of
> flour. Fry. Stir. The mixture should be pretty stiff. If it isn't
> stiff enough to where it seems a little dry, use the shaker top to
> shake some flour on. If you get it too dry, don't worry. Keep
> stirring. When it browns just a little, or is sticking to the pan,
> you are ready for step 3.
> Step 4: It is time to make the gravy. Real simply: Add the hot water
> a little at a time. Stir lots between additions. A whisk helps here,
> but a fork will do. You know what consistency you want your gravy to
> be. Add more liquid a little at a time, stirring between additions,
> until it approaches that consistency. At one point, you may have a
> single lump, sort of attached to your fork. Add more hot liquid, and
> stir, stir, stir. Allow it to boil. Taste it. It probably tastes
> flat. Add some pepper. Add some salt. Taste it again. If it gets
> too thick, add some more liquid. If it is too thin, add some flour.
> Too thin is better than too thick. Add some herbs, not too much.
> Maybe 1/4 tsp, then boil for a minute, then taste, then maybe add a
> little more. Let it boil, not too hard, for 3-4 minutes after you add
> flour the last time.
> Step 5: Brown gravy only --- add a couple of drops of Kitchen Bouquet
> (the jar will stick closed, hot tap water will loosen it). White
> chicken gravy should probably be finished with a dollop of milk.
> [My grandmother used to add her water a tablespoon at a time, and use
> a little soy sauce for color. Your job is much easier, because you
> have Wondra and Kitchen Bouquet on your side.]
> Now, if you were cooking stuff in the pan, probably some crud got on
> on the pan, like if you were cooking burgers, bits of browned meat
> stuck to the pan. This will boil off of the pan, and become part of
> the gravy. If you browned onions, the onions will partially dissolve
> in the gravy and add flavor. This is a feature, a desirable goal, and
> is one of the marks of an excellent gravy, unless the stuff on the pan
> was really burned black.
> Again if you are making chicken gravy, I find that adding a dollop of
> milk (not more than 1/4 cup) after I turn off the gas off and stirring
> it in helps the flavor.
> Advanced topics: If I have prepared a seasoned/herbed flour to dredge
> chicken in, I will always make the gravy with that seasoned flour.
> Cayenne pepper dresses up a gravy in moderate quantities. There are
> many other styles of gravy, but this is the one I think you are likely
> to use the most often. It is also the simplest.
> Gravy is one of the simplest things I make. Sometimes, if I'm feeling
> charitible to the dogs, I'll make gravy anyway, even though I don't
> want it, and pour it over their food. They tell me that they like it
> a little blander than I usually make it. It is so easy that it really
> doesn't take up any extra time.

Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.

--Bryan

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> On Saturday, November 7, 1992 at 9:45:48 AM UTC-6, John David Auwen wrote:
> > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > this newsgroup. Carol is still a major contributer to this group so
> > I'd like to thank her for her good advice that I'm reposting here.
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > From rec.food.cooking Tue Oct 8 16:27:09 1991
> > From: (Carol Miller-Tutzauer)
> > Some time ago (1 yr), I posted my "gravy-making bible". Because I
> > figured others might be interested, I decided to re-post.
> > A couple comments to the person originating the request: I never
> > use cornstarch for gravy. I think it only results in making a
> > gravy taste "gummy." As for the color of your gravy not being
> > dark enough, I recommend below making a roux -- that is, sauteeing
> > flour in oil until it "cooks." The longer you cook the flour,
> > the more brown it becomes. It is relatively easy to cook the
> > roux until it turns the color of peanut butter. This will give
> > you a very nice beige color. For beef gravy, often your pan
> > drippings will add the necessary darkness. If you want something
> > deep rich brown, then you must cook the

I used to make rouxs for my beef dishes, using butter and cornstarch!

Good stuff!

> Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
>
> --Bryan

Cooking the cornstarch makes the roux yummier!


John Kuthe...

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:15:44 PM UTC-5, wrote:

> Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
>
> --Bryan

That's what we prefer anyway. I've tried a roux a couple of times and it just didn't
suit us.

I must say, it was a revelation to see someone pay so much attention to gravy. I
don't care much about gravy one way or the other, and I make it only when I roast
a bird. I suppose my pot roast has a roux gravy, since I throw in a little flour
after cooking the aromatics and before adding the liquid.

I do reduction sauces fairly frequently, though.

Cindy Hamilton

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
>
> On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
>
> > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > this newsgroup.
>
*SNIP*
>
> Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
>
> --Bryan
>
LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.

On Wed, 18 Nov 2020 14:49:44 -0800 (PST), "
> wrote:

>On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
>>
>> On Saturday, ? ? ? November 7, 1992, ? ? ? John David Auwen wrote:
>>
>> > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
>> > this newsgroup.
>>
>*SNIP*
>>
>> Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
>>
>> --Bryan
>>
>LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
>quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
>the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.

Doesn't Google Groups hide quoted text from users, unless they click a
button called Show Quoted Text or something similar? Forgive them, for
they know not what they do.

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:49:50 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> >
> > On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
> >
> > > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > > this newsgroup.
> >
> *SNIP*
> >
> > Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
> >
> > --Bryan
> >
> LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
> quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
> the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.


Lol...Bryan musta been hittin' the 'ole Bud Light...

--
Best
Greg

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:49:50 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> >
> > On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
> >
> > > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > > this newsgroup.
> >
> *SNIP*
> >
> > Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
> >
> > --Bryan
> >
> LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
> quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
> the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.

I did it to get you to bitch.

--Bryan

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 5:11:21 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:49:50 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> > On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> > >
> > > On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
> > >
> > > > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > > > this newsgroup.
> > >
> > *SNIP*
> > >
> > > Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
> > >
> > > --Bryan
> > >
> > LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
> > quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
> > the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.
> I did it to get you to bitch.
>
> --Bryan


A most squalid retort...

--
Best
Greg

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 5:05:08 PM UTC-6, GM wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:49:50 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> > On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> > >
> > > On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
> > >
> > > > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > > > this newsgroup.
> > >
> > *SNIP*
> > >
> > > Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
> > >
> > > --Bryan
> > >
> > LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
> > quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
> > the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.
> Lol...Bryan musta been hittin' the 'ole Bud Light...

I saw folks complaining about others responding to old posts, and thought it would be
funny to respond to a *really* old post, but I wanted it to be something worthwhile,
and this one was. It took me some time to find something worthy of quoting..

I don't drink Bud Light, and hadn't been drinking at all when I posted that.. In the hours
since then I made dinner, and had my first beer with dinner. I just opened my third can
of https://www.swee****erbrew.com/brews/hop-hash-easy-ipa/ It comes in 15 packs
for $15.99, and is the same ABV as Bud Light, but it tastes really good, instead of
crappy like Bud Light. It's actually lower alcohol than that because I drink it over ice.
I've spent the last 30+ years drinking less and less alcohol, though it's been three
steps forward, two steps back on and off, and there have been a few times where I've
cut the alcohol more drastically, but that never lasted all that long.

I still drink more than is ideal for my physical health. I know that, but I also know that
I'm functional, happy, and I haven't driven a car impaired in many years, though a few
years ago I did ride my scooter home from a gathering of old friends in a park when I
really shouldn't have, which greatly displeased my dear wife. I haven't taken a shot
of liquor in over 21 years, and other than infrequent sips of liqueurs, I never drink
anything stronger than sweet wine, again infrequently, and also typically over ice.

My posts aren't those of a sloppy drunk. If you didn't know that before, know it now.
>
> --
> Best
> Greg

--Bryan

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 5:02:12 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>
> Doesn't Google Groups hide quoted text from users, unless they click a
> button called Show Quoted Text or something similar? Forgive them, for
> they know not what they do.
>
No.

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 5:11:21 PM UTC-6, wrote:
>
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:49:50 PM UTC-6, wrote:
>
> > On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> > >
> > > On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
> > >
> > > > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > > > this newsgroup.
> > >
> > *SNIP*
> > >
> > > Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
> > >
> > > --Bryan
> > >
> > LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
> > quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
> > the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.
>
> I did it to get you to bitch.
>
> --Bryan
>
Trying to deflect your stupidity does not make you smart. I just proves you can't
read. Like all the other Gmail users who show up here 10, 15, 20, 25+ years later
after the original post was made and replies like we've been waiting on you and
why you haven't shown up until today. Just proves most all of y'all aren't the
sharpest knife in the drawer.

On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 10:06:53 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 5:11:21 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> >
> > On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 4:49:50 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> >
> > > On Wednesday, November 18, 2020 at 3:15:44 PM UTC-6, wrote:
> > > >
> > > > On Saturday, †’ †’ †’ November 7, 1992, †� †� †� John David Auwen wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > This is the best gravy advice I've read in my 4 years of reading
> > > > > this newsgroup.
> > > >
> > > *SNIP*
> > > >
> > > > Or you could just be lazy and use a cornstarch slurry.
> > > >
> > > > --Bryan
> > > >
> > > LOTS of text deleted as to not repeat it again even though you felt the need to
> > > quote all that to add one (1) line of text. Better yet, when you are bored resist
> > > the urge to reply to twenty-eight (28) year old posts.
> >
> > I did it to get you to bitch.
> >
> > --Bryan
> >
> Trying to deflect your stupidity does not make you smart. I just proves you can't
> read. Like all the other Gmail users who show up here 10, 15, 20, 25+ years later
> after the original post was made and replies like we've been waiting on you and
> why you haven't shown up until today. Just proves most all of y'all aren't the
> sharpest knife in the drawer.

Look! The person from WebTV is actually suggesting that I unknowingly replied
to a post from 1992. Hey, isn't it fun after those years where WebTV folks were
disparaged to get to be the bully, rather than the bullied? You are a dumb ****,
Joann.

--Bryan

On Thursday, November 19, 2020 at 3:49:53 AM UTC-6, wrote:
>
> Look! The person from WebTV is actually suggesting that I unknowingly replied
> to a post from 1992. Hey, isn't it fun after those years where WebTV folks were
> disparaged to get to be the bully, rather than the bullied? You are a dumb ****,
> Joann.
>
> --Bryan
>
I'm not from WebTV, WebTV closed down years ago. It's a fake address just like
Gmail is a fake address.

You're a wannbe writer but very **** poor at it.

wrote:

> On Thursday, November 19, 2020 at 3:49:53 AM UTC-6, wrote:
> >
> > Look! The person from WebTV is actually suggesting that I unknowingly replied
> > to a post from 1992. Hey, isn't it fun after those years where WebTV folks were
> > disparaged to get to be the bully, rather than the bullied? You are a dumb ****,
> > Joann.
> >
> > --Bryan
> >
> I'm not from WebTV, WebTV closed down years ago. It's a fake address just like
> Gmail is a fake address.
>
> You're a wannbe writer but very **** poor at it.


Heehee, Joan...as Judge Judy might say to Bryan, "God gave you TWO ears and ONE mouth for a REASON...!!!"

--
Best
Greg

On Thursday, November 19, 2020 at 5:01:51 PM UTC-6, GM wrote:
> wrote:
>
> > On Thursday, November 19, 2020 at 3:49:53 AM UTC-6, wrote:
> > >
> > > Look! The person from WebTV is actually suggesting that I unknowingly replied
> > > to a post from 1992. Hey, isn't it fun after those years where WebTV folks were
> > > disparaged to get to be the bully, rather than the bullied? You are a dumb ****,
> > > Joann.
> > >
> > > --Bryan
> > >
> > I'm not from WebTV, WebTV closed down years ago. It's a fake address just like
> > Gmail is a fake address.

My Gmail address is fake?
> >
> > You're a wannbe writer but very **** poor at it.

Not just **** poor, but very **** poor. "Wannbe." Again, dumb ****.

> Heehee, Joan...as Judge Judy might say to Bryan, "God gave you TWO ears and ONE mouth for a REASON...!!!"

Only trash goes on that program. That used to be on in the break room at work. The
only one of those trash TV shows worth watching was Bait Car. You got to watch
criminals being stupid.

OH! THAT REMINDS ME! One of the mother****ers at work who went around w/o
a mask was ****ing stealing from the company. The ****ing meth mouth lowlife
was given a second chance. He was a felon. They hired him anyway, paying him
the same as they pay me, and the mother****er was stealing, and when he showed
up for work, the cops took him off in handcuffs. There won't be any bail for his ass.
I hope he dies of Covid in jail.
>
> --
> Best
> Greg

--Bryan

On Thu, 19 Nov 2020 15:56:10 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:

> I hope he dies of Covid in jail.

There there, Bryan. I thought we had come to an undiscussed agreement
about how creeped-out people get with your death wishes.

On Thursday, November 19, 2020 at 7:25:17 PM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> On Thu, 19 Nov 2020 15:56:10 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
>
> > I hope he dies of Covid in jail.
> There there, Bryan. I thought we had come to an undiscussed agreement
> about how creeped-out people get with your death wishes.

This guy is an exception. He's garbage.

--Bryan

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 01:17:44 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:

> This guy is an exception. He's garbage.

OK I suppose, it looks so just based on objective facts, and I have never
met the guy.


In any case, you do seem to have changed tone a bit regarding your many
'provocative' observations. I cannot imagine that happening by accident.

Also, as you promised, you have studiously avoided dredging up stuff from
the distant past regarding John.

Plus you are no longer posting tracts from your failed e-book on a
regular basis.


So, now you have earned a star: '*'. Just post to me when you want to
redeem it. It is worth roughly an hour or so of wordsmithing (including
poetry), JavaScript / C++ programming / bash scripting, or consulting in
math & physics, etc.

On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 8:32:56 AM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 01:17:44 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
>
> > This guy is an exception. He's garbage.
> OK I suppose, it looks so just based on objective facts, and I have never
> met the guy.
>
>
> In any case, you do seem to have changed tone a bit regarding your many
> 'provocative' observations. I cannot imagine that happening by accident.

It wasn't to appease critics. Maybe I've just been feeling mellower lately.
>
> Also, as you promised, you have studiously avoided dredging up stuff from
> the distant past regarding John.

I "promised" that over and over and over, that I would not be the one who broke
the ceasefire. Of course, since John used the magic phrase again, all Hell
could break loose, but I'm now convinced that nothing I could say or do would
affect John's future. He's already done that himself. If you Google "John Kuthe
nurse," the first result is a thread from rfc where he admits to stopping using an
illegal drug to pass a pre-employment screening. He'll never get another nursing
job.

He'll survive. He owns a house outright, and is close to the age that he could
get early Social Security. His only problem with not getting to practice nursing
is emotional. Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the chance
that he might get to see, and even touch the forbidden fruit in the doings of
his job. Now, that's clearly out of reach. He'll die without the one thing that
he wanted most. I can only imagine the grief, the sort of despair that's often
described as "that sinking feeling."
>
> Plus you are no longer posting tracts from your failed e-book on a
> regular basis.
>
There hasn't been anything that I've read here recently that I felt was
relevant to anything in the book. I can assure you that when there is, I will
post passages with the same frequency as I have in the past.

About that "failed" thing. In order to fail, there would have had to have
been parameters for success that were unmet. I'm not lying when I say
that I never intended to write a novel. I also never expected commercial
"success." I don't really need the money, and that's in spite of the fact
that the book has cost me several tens of thousands of dollars in lost
income. I'm sure that my musical projects also cost (lost) a great deal
of money, but I wouldn't change a thing. I love my book. There are
parts of it that I can't read without crying. You can't buy *that shit*.
>
> So, now you have earned a star: '*'. Just post to me when you want to
> redeem it. It is worth roughly an hour or so of wordsmithing (including
> poetry), JavaScript / C++ programming / bash scripting, or consulting in
> math & physics, etc.

You don't have anything I want. You're just one more wacky misfit in the
collection of wacky misfits (I include myself) that make this NG what it is.
In fact, one of the best things about this NG is that pretty much nobody
sucks up to anyone else to get approval, and folks don't seem to jockey
to get acceptance or popularity. There are some long-running hostilities,
and even hints at pseudo-alliances, but no cliques. Plus, the quality of
the writing here is a lot better that elsewhere on social media, and that's
not just attributable to the fact that most folks here are older. I don't
have to suppress my inner grammar cop to anywhere near the extent
that I did on FB.

--Bryan

wrote:

> On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 8:32:56 AM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> > On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 01:17:44 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
> >
> > > This guy is an exception. He's garbage.
> > OK I suppose, it looks so just based on objective facts, and I have never
> > met the guy.
> >
> >
> > In any case, you do seem to have changed tone a bit regarding your many
> > 'provocative' observations. I cannot imagine that happening by accident.
> It wasn't to appease critics. Maybe I've just been feeling mellower lately.
> >
> > Also, as you promised, you have studiously avoided dredging up stuff from
> > the distant past regarding John.
> I "promised" that over and over and over, that I would not be the one who broke
> the ceasefire. Of course, since John used the magic phrase again, all Hell
> could break loose, but I'm now convinced that nothing I could say or do would
> affect John's future. He's already done that himself. If you Google "John Kuthe
> nurse," the first result is a thread from rfc where he admits to stopping using an
> illegal drug to pass a pre-employment screening. He'll never get another nursing
> job.
>
> He'll survive. He owns a house outright, and is close to the age that he could
> get early Social Security. His only problem with not getting to practice nursing
> is emotional. Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
> As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the chance
> that he might get to see, and even touch the forbidden fruit in the doings of
> his job. Now, that's clearly out of reach. He'll die without the one thing that
> he wanted most. I can only imagine the grief, the sort of despair that's often
> described as "that sinking feeling."


Yup..."that sinking feeling" that he will no longer be able to ogle and fondle jailbait pussy whilst on a nursing gig...

--
Best
Greg

On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:24:54 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:

> Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
> As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the
> chance that he might get [...] the forbidden fruit

That's a serious accusation without any supporting evidence.

It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.


> About that "failed" thing. In order to fail, there would have had to
> have been parameters for success that were unmet.

Well, (like my e-book offering), not one person has read it and given it
a positive review. That would be a minimalist parameter, no?


> book has cost me several tens of thousands of dollars in lost income.

I believed that individuals would learn HTML and everyone would write his
own web-site. It was obvious to me that Facebook was too restrictive, and
most people would never put up with being so pigeon-holed. When I'm
wrong, I can be really wrong.


> You don't have anything I want. You're just one more wacky misfit

Well, you can trade it with someone else I guess.


> In fact, one of the best things about this NG is that pretty much nobody
> sucks up to anyone else to get approval, and folks don't seem to jockey
> to get acceptance or popularity. There are some long-running
> hostilities, and even hints at pseudo-alliances, but no cliques.

Are you deliberately leaving out the false alliances, where someone
appears to be friendly with someone else, but it is all a sham waiting
for the right time for a face-kicking?

Just kidding! I like to be a devil's advocate sometimes.

On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 11:08:02 PM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:24:54 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
>
> > Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
> > As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the
> > chance that he might get [...] the forbidden fruit
>
> That's a serious accusation without any supporting evidence.

I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
for years before we were here.
>
> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.

You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
of young girls.

> > About that "failed" thing. In order to fail, there would have had to
> > have been parameters for success that were unmet.
> Well, (like my e-book offering), not one person has read it and given it
> a positive review. That would be a minimalist parameter, no?

Here? On this NG? You know, right after I finished it, I was looking
forward to trying to get it published, and I sent out a few query letters
to agents, and I do mean a few.

> > book has cost me several tens of thousands of dollars in lost income.
> I believed that individuals would learn HTML and everyone would write his
> own web-site. It was obvious to me that Facebook was too restrictive, and
> most people would never put up with being so pigeon-holed. When I'm
> wrong, I can be really wrong.

See? I didn't believe anything other than that I had to finish the book or I
would get no peace. Having never written so much as a full page of fiction
in my life, I got this kooky idea to write some short stories where women
enjoy sex and don't suffer any negative consequences. Within a few weeks
I felt almost possessed by the story, and the only way out was to write my
way out. Strange things started happening in my life that I won't go into,
but I wanted my life and sanity back.

Don't think that I believe that there were actually supernatural forces acting
upon me, but it really did feel that way. I wasn't unhappy, but I didn't feel
mentally healthy. What I'm saying is that my feelings about the book are
not those that a normal writer would normally have about a normal book. I
just read these two paragraphs to my wife, and she said, "That was very
well put."

> > You don't have anything I want. You're just one more wacky misfit
> Well, you can trade it with someone else I guess.
> > In fact, one of the best things about this NG is that pretty much nobody
> > sucks up to anyone else to get approval, and folks don't seem to jockey
> > to get acceptance or popularity. There are some long-running
> > hostilities, and even hints at pseudo-alliances, but no cliques.
> Are you deliberately leaving out the false alliances, where someone
> appears to be friendly with someone else, but it is all a sham waiting
> for the right time for a face-kicking?

Folks don't strategize to that extent. They just react. I'm not kidding when
I say that I find that refreshing.
>
> Just kidding! I like to be a devil's advocate sometimes.

Oh, and you need to take your asterisk back because I posted an entire
chapter a couple of hours ago. Hank eggs me on you know.

--Bryan

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 8:52:57 AM UTC-6, wrote:
> On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 11:08:02 PM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> > On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:24:54 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
> >
> > > Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
> > > As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the
> > > chance that he might get [...] the forbidden fruit

I have my most nursing experience in pediatrics, then geriatrics. But I can do any nursing jobs I am properly mentored in.

No Bryan, YOU are living in the past when we were both much younger. We are both near (and I have achieved) 60 years old now so start acting like it, please.

I know you are very vitriolic and hateful towards me after I outed you as Narcissistic Personality Disorder here. Nothing as NPD sufferer hates more than being identified as such by a competent mental health professional.


John Kuthe...

wrote:

> On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 8:52:57 AM UTC-6, wrote:
> > On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 11:08:02 PM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> > > On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:24:54 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
> > >
> > > > Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
> > > > As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the
> > > > chance that he might get [...] the forbidden fruit
> I have my most nursing experience in pediatrics, then geriatrics. But I can do any nursing jobs I am properly mentored in.
>
> No Bryan, YOU are living in the past when we were both much younger. We are both near (and I have achieved) 60 years old now so start acting like it, please.
>
> I know you are very vitriolic and hateful towards me after I outed you as Narcissistic Personality Disorder here. Nothing as NPD sufferer hates more than being identified as such by a competent mental health professional.


Bryan = +1

John Kuthe = 0

lol...

--
Best
Greg

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:

> You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the
> vulvas of young girls.

He's crazy, but he's not stupid. If he does, he knows they are jail-bait,
and that micro video cameras are cheap enough to be somewhere between
likely & certain in such a work setting. Plus, if he ever gets caught red-
handed, any 'normal' male will likely beat him to within a few bruises of
permanent disfigurement.

Of course, that does not seem to be enough deterrent to stop others.


> Strange things started happening in my life that I won't go into,
> but I wanted my life and sanity back.

Now you're acting like Julie, tantalizing us with secret stuff.


> I just read these two paragraphs to my wife,
> and she said, "That was very well put."

She's probably the only one who understands you. Like I said before,
don't ever trade her up for a newer model.


> You're just one more wacky misfit.
> [...] Folks don't strategize to that extent.

It's not blatant. It's more a modulation of 'passive' vs. 'agressive'
depending on the context & target. Some people enter into that sort of
dynamic without even realizing it. What to look for is messages that
essentially say: "I was just kidding." Then examine the prior post to see
if the OP was, in fact, just kidding.


> Oh, and you need to take your asterisk back because I posted an entire
> chapter a couple of hours ago. Hank eggs me on you know.

Hank is not as simple as he makes himself out to be.

On 11/21/2020 10:49 AM, Mike Duffy wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
>
>> You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest
>
> He's crazy, but he's not stupid. If he does, he knows they are jail-bait,
(snipped crazy stuff)
>> Strange things started happening in my life that I won't go into,
>> but I wanted my life and sanity back.
>
> Now you're acting like Julie, tantalizing us with secret stuff.
>
True, but nothing tantalizing. Just boring shit like the guy left food
sitting out again. Frankly, I don't want to watch all you folks
"tantalize" yourselves in public.

>> I just read these two paragraphs to my wife,
>> and she said, "That was very well put."
>
> She's probably the only one who understands you. Like I said before,
> don't ever trade her up for a newer model.
>
>> Oh, and you need to take your asterisk back because I posted an entire
>> chapter a couple of hours ago. Hank eggs me on you know.
>
> Hank is not as simple as he makes himself out to be.
>
Why don't you ALL get a room and hash this out in private?

Jill

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 9:49:18 AM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
>
> > You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the
> > vulvas of young girls.
> He's crazy, but he's not stupid. If he does, he knows they are jail-bait,
> and that micro video cameras are cheap enough to be somewhere between
> likely & certain in such a work setting. Plus, if he ever gets caught red-
> handed, any 'normal' male will likely beat him to within a few bruises of
> permanent disfigurement.
>
> Of course, that does not seem to be enough deterrent to stop others.

I'm not saying that he would commit misconduct, but that in the course of
normal nursing practice, he might experience a major thrill. I mean,
*somebody* has to Foley catheterize 11 YO girls.

> > Strange things started happening in my life that I won't go into,
> > but I wanted my life and sanity back.
> Now you're acting like Julie, tantalizing us with secret stuff.

Nothing all that interesting. Mostly just coincidence after coincidence,
and just unlikely things.

> > I just read these two paragraphs to my wife,
> > and she said, "That was very well put."
> She's probably the only one who understands you. Like I said before,
> don't ever trade her up for a newer model.
>
We are super crazy about each other. I feel very, very lucky in that regard.
>
> > You're just one more wacky misfit.
> > [...] Folks don't strategize to that extent.
>
> It's not blatant. It's more a modulation of 'passive' vs. 'agressive'
> depending on the context & target. Some people enter into that sort of
> dynamic without even realizing it. What to look for is messages that
> essentially say: "I was just kidding." Then examine the prior post to see
> if the OP was, in fact, just kidding.
> > Oh, and you need to take your asterisk back because I posted an entire
> > chapter a couple of hours ago. Hank eggs me on you know.
> Hank is not as simple as he makes himself out to be.

He writes disparaging things about my book characters, which is funny
because they're book characters.

--Bryan

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 10:01:28 AM UTC-6, wrote:
> On 11/21/2020 10:49 AM, Mike Duffy wrote:
> > On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
> >
> >> You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest
> >
> > He's crazy, but he's not stupid. If he does, he knows they are jail-bait,
> (snipped crazy stuff)
> >> Strange things started happening in my life that I won't go into,
> >> but I wanted my life and sanity back.
> >
> > Now you're acting like Julie, tantalizing us with secret stuff.
> >
> True, but nothing tantalizing. Just boring shit like the guy left food
> sitting out again. Frankly, I don't want to watch all you folks
> "tantalize" yourselves in public.

Yes, you do. Otherwise you'd move along and ignore it.

> >> I just read these two paragraphs to my wife,
> >> and she said, "That was very well put."
> >
> > She's probably the only one who understands you. Like I said before,
> > don't ever trade her up for a newer model.
> >
> >> Oh, and you need to take your asterisk back because I posted an entire
> >> chapter a couple of hours ago. Hank eggs me on you know.
> >
> > Hank is not as simple as he makes himself out to be.
> >
> Why don't you ALL get a room and hash this out in private?

Why don't you get a room and **** yourself in the rectum with a curling iron?
>
> Jill

--Bryan

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> wrote:

>On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 11:08:02 PM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
>> On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:24:54 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
>>
>> > Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
>> > As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the
>> > chance that he might get [...] the forbidden fruit
>>
>> That's a serious accusation without any supporting evidence.
>
>I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
>for years before we were here.
>>
>> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
>> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
>> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
>> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
>
>You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
>of young girls.

You call this a ceasefire?

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> > wrote:
>
> >On Friday, November 20, 2020 at 11:08:02 PM UTC-6, Mike Duffy wrote:
> >> On Fri, 20 Nov 2020 14:24:54 -0800, Bryan Simmons wrote:
> >>
> >> > Remember how he especially wanted *pediatric* nursing jobs?
> >> > As long as he had hopes of getting those gigs, there was always the
> >> > chance that he might get [...] the forbidden fruit
> >>
> >> That's a serious accusation without any supporting evidence.
> >
> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
> >for years before we were here.
> >>
> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
> >
> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
> >of young girls.
>
> You call this a ceasefire?

John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.

--Bryan

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> wrote:

>On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
>> >for years before we were here.
>> >>
>> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
>> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
>> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
>> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
>> >
>> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
>> >of young girls.
>>
>> You call this a ceasefire?
>
>John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
>nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
>he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
>with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
>into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.

I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
one doesn't change reality.

Bruce was thinking very hard :
....
> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
> one doesn't change reality.
>
I used to be a narcissist but now look at me.

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> > wrote:
>
> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
> >> >for years before we were here.
> >> >>
> >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
> >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
> >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
> >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
> >> >
> >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
> >> >of young girls.
> >>
> >> You call this a ceasefire?
> >
> >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
> >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
> >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
> >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
> >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
>
> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
> one doesn't change reality.
>
Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
feeling*.

--Bryan

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 14:55:19 -0500, Doppelgänger >
wrote:

>Bruce was thinking very hard :
>...
>> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
>> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
>> one doesn't change reality.
>>
>I used to be a narcissist but now look at me.

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:01:12 PM UTC-6, Bryan Simmons wrote:
> On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> > On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> > > wrote:
> >
> > >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> > >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> > >> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
> > >> >for years before we were here.
> > >> >>
> > >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
> > >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
> > >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
> > >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
> > >> >
> > >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
> > >> >of young girls.
> > >>
> > >> You call this a ceasefire?
> > >
> > >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
> > >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
> > >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
> > >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
> > >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
> >
> > I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
> > narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
> > one doesn't change reality.
> >
> Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
> joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
> knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
> nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
> disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
> feeling*.

Oh look, I was so filled with joy over knowing that the greatest pleasure of
my enemy's life was becoming even slightly less enjoyable that I typed the
word "again" again.
>
> --Bryan

--Bryan

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:01:07 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> wrote:

>On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
>> >> >for years before we were here.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
>> >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
>> >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
>> >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
>> >> >
>> >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
>> >> >of young girls.
>> >>
>> >> You call this a ceasefire?
>> >
>> >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
>> >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
>> >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
>> >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
>> >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
>>
>> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
>> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
>> one doesn't change reality.
>>
>Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
>joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
>knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
>nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
>disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
>feeling*.

That has nothing to do with what I said.

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:23:19 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:01:07 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> > wrote:
>
> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
> >> >> >for years before we were here.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
> >> >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
> >> >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
> >> >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
> >> >> >of young girls.
> >> >>
> >> >> You call this a ceasefire?
> >> >
> >> >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
> >> >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
> >> >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
> >> >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
> >> >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
> >>
> >> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
> >> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
> >> one doesn't change reality.
> >>
> >Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
> >joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
> >knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
> >nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
> >disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
> >feeling*.
> That has nothing to do with what I said.

So, I don't get to hate folks who insult me? Well, hmmmph! I suppose I'm
not supposed to engage in tasteless humor either.
https://groups.google.com/g/alt.tast.../c/nyw1HLwiLog

--Bryan

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:28:36 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> wrote:

>On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:23:19 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:01:07 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
>> >> >> >for years before we were here.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
>> >> >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
>> >> >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
>> >> >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
>> >> >> >of young girls.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> You call this a ceasefire?
>> >> >
>> >> >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
>> >> >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
>> >> >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
>> >> >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
>> >> >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
>> >>
>> >> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
>> >> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
>> >> one doesn't change reality.
>> >>
>> >Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
>> >joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
>> >knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
>> >nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
>> >disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
>> >feeling*.
>> That has nothing to do with what I said.
>
>So, I don't get to hate folks who insult me? Well, hmmmph!

Is it an insult? Asshole is an insult. Narcissist is a diagnosis or an
attempt at diagnosis.

Trump's a narcissist. 70 million Americans love him!

On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:41:57 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:28:36 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> > wrote:
>
> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:23:19 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:01:07 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
> >> >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> >> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
> >> >> >> >for years before we were here.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
> >> >> >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
> >> >> >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
> >> >> >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
> >> >> >> >of young girls.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> You call this a ceasefire?
> >> >> >
> >> >> >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
> >> >> >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
> >> >> >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
> >> >> >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
> >> >> >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
> >> >>
> >> >> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
> >> >> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
> >> >> one doesn't change reality.
> >> >>
> >> >Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
> >> >joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
> >> >knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
> >> >nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
> >> >disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
> >> >feeling*.
> >> That has nothing to do with what I said.
> >
> >So, I don't get to hate folks who insult me? Well, hmmmph!
> Is it an insult? Asshole is an insult. Narcissist is a diagnosis or an
> attempt at diagnosis.
>
Asshole is part of the body. To illustrate this, I will use asshole in a sentence.
John enjoyed licking his married, Nepalese housemate's asshole.
>
> Trump's a narcissist. 70 million Americans love him!

Narcissist is an insult.

--Bryan

On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:47:02 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
> wrote:

>On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:41:57 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:28:36 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 2:23:19 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 12:01:07 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> >> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 1:27:47 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 11:06:40 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >On Saturday, November 21, 2020 at 12:39:33 PM UTC-6, Bruce wrote:
>> >> >> >> On Sat, 21 Nov 2020 06:52:52 -0800 (PST), Bryan Simmons
>> >> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >I've known him since we were teenagers. We were both on alt.punk
>> >> >> >> >for years before we were here.
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> It could be that he just gets along well with juveniles because his
>> >> >> >> >> medical / mental condition makes meaningful dialogue with them easier
>> >> >> >> >> than with most adults. Or, they are lighter to manipulate when that is
>> >> >> >> >> needed, or less disposed to become violent, etc.
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >You prefer to believe that he does not have a sexual interest in the vulvas
>> >> >> >> >of young girls.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> You call this a ceasefire?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >John wrote the magic words. He fired the first shot. I guess some other
>> >> >> >nurse is going to *get to do* the procedures that he was so hoping that
>> >> >> >he'd get to do. You know he's never gotten into a serious relationship
>> >> >> >with a girl who was older than 14. He's over 60, and he's never gotten
>> >> >> >into a serious relationship with a girl who was older than 14.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> I don't understand why you're so offended when John calls you a
>> >> >> narcissist. You are a narcissist or you're not. Whether John calls you
>> >> >> one doesn't change reality.
>> >> >>
>> >> >Look, Bruce, I'm never going to convince you that schadenfreude can be
>> >> >joyous, and you're never going to convince me it isn't. What's fun is
>> >> >knowing that John really does know that he'll never again get to pediatric
>> >> >nurse again, and that adds another barrier, another level of suspension of
>> >> >disbelief to overcome in his masturbatory fantasies. Yep, *that sinking
>> >> >feeling*.
>> >> That has nothing to do with what I said.
>> >
>> >So, I don't get to hate folks who insult me? Well, hmmmph!
>> Is it an insult? Asshole is an insult. Narcissist is a diagnosis or an
>> attempt at diagnosis.
>>
>Asshole is part of the body. To illustrate this, I will use asshole in a sentence.
>John enjoyed licking his married, Nepalese housemate's asshole.
>>
>> Trump's a narcissist. 70 million Americans love him!
>
>Narcissist is an insult.
>

Maybe to a narcissist.