"sf" wrote:

> Yeah - like ox tails, which used to be sold for pennies, now
> cost as much as a good steak per pound.

Speaking of oxtails, don't they contain prions, and therefore constitute a
possible vector for BSE ("Mad Cow Disease")?

I cheerfully admit that I don't know the fact of the matter, but it seems to
me that any part of the spinal cord will contain prions.

Can some knowledgeable person dispel my veil of ignorance on this matter?

Bob

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 19:00:15 -0800, sf > wrote:

>Of course you DO use Lea & Perrins... don't you??? If not,
>that could be a problem!

Absotively!

Carol
--
"Years ago my mother used to say to me... She'd say,
'In this world Elwood, you must be oh-so smart or oh-so pleasant.'
Well, for years I was smart.... I recommend pleasant. You may quote me."

*James Stewart* in the 1950 movie, _Harvey_

In article >,
"Bob" > wrote:

> Speaking of oxtails, don't they contain prions, and therefore constitute a
> possible vector for BSE ("Mad Cow Disease")?
>
> I cheerfully admit that I don't know the fact of the matter, but it seems to
> me that any part of the spinal cord will contain prions.


It may go further than that:
<http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn6907>


"Inflammation can cause the deformed proteins that cause prion diseases,
such as BSE, to invade organs that normally resist infection. If the new
research in mice holds true for cattle, it could mean that some organs
previously thought to be safe to eat are not - with significant
implications for BSE testing programmes."

....
"'People in countries with BSE still eat steak because the authorities
say if you stay away from the brain and lymphoid tissue, you should be
safe," [Adriano Aguzzi, at the University Hospital of Zurich,
Switzerland] told New Scientist. However, the experiments to find out
where BSE prions lurk in cattle incubating the disease have been done in
otherwise healthy animals, he says: 'If you have a sick cow, these rules
may no longer apply.'"

--
to respond (OT only), change "spamless.invalid" to "optonline.net"

<http://www.thecoffeefaq.com/>

On 29 Jan 2005 21:08:03 -0600, "Bob"
> wrote:

> "sf" wrote:
>
> > Yeah - like ox tails, which used to be sold for pennies, now
> > cost as much as a good steak per pound.
>
> Speaking of oxtails, don't they contain prions, and therefore constitute a
> possible vector for BSE ("Mad Cow Disease")?
>
> I cheerfully admit that I don't know the fact of the matter, but it seems to
> me that any part of the spinal cord will contain prions.
>
> Can some knowledgeable person dispel my veil of ignorance on this matter?
>
There's no way I can even fake knowing anything about that.
But... I'm far as concerned about getting Mad Cow from ox
tails as I am from every day steak, if that helps any.

The only Mad Cow scare in my area I was aware of didn't
involve spinal chord, it was a leg.

sf

"Bob" > wrote in message
...
> "sf" wrote:
>
>> Yeah - like ox tails, which used to be sold for pennies, now
>> cost as much as a good steak per pound.
>
> Speaking of oxtails, don't they contain prions, and therefore constitute a
> possible vector for BSE ("Mad Cow Disease")?
>
> I cheerfully admit that I don't know the fact of the matter, but it seems
> to
> me that any part of the spinal cord will contain prions.
>
> Can some knowledgeable person dispel my veil of ignorance on this matter?
>
> Bob
>
>

I do not claim to know which parts of the animal may and may not contain
prions. I do know, however, that the spinal cord does not extend into the
tail. In any case, I buy my ox tails from Niman ranch which does not feed
any animal byproducts to their cattle.

I agree about ox tails - a real treat. We just had them last night. If you
like ox tails you ought to try beef checks.

Here's the recipe I made up as I went along.

2 lb oxtails, trimmed of excess fat, rinsed, and patted dry.
4 TB bacon fat
1 c diced onion
1 c diced celery
1/2c diced carrot
2 or more garlic cloves, peeled and sliced.
2c of a good pinot noir
2 TB tomato paste

In a heavy Dutch oven, brown the tails in 2 TB of the bacon fat. Brown them
well on all sides - this will take 10-15 minutes. Remove from pan. Add
remaining bacon fat and cook the veg, stirring, unitl softened and just
starting to brown. Return the tails to the pan and add the wine, tomato
paste, a good dose of black pepper, and some salt (go light on the salt for
now). Bring to a simmer and simmer slowly in a 325 over or on the stovetop
for 2 hours. Turn the tails over and, if needed, add some water to keep at
least 2" of liquid in the pan. Simmer another 2 hrs. Add salt as needed,
skim off excess fat if desired, and serve with egg noodles, rice, or mashed
spuds, sprinkling with chopped fresh parsley.


--
Peter Aitken

Remove the crap from my email address before using.

>I do not claim to know which parts of the animal may and may not contain
>prions.

I claim to know that anyone still worried about whether normal dining habits
will put that at any significant risk of mad cow disease (1) has not enough to
worry about and (2) is getting too much blowback from the anti-import lobby.

If you've got to worry about something, worry about whether McDonald's coffee
is too hot.

Neil

On Sun, 30 Jan 2005 17:17:52 GMT, "Peter Aitken"
> wrote:

>"Bob" > wrote in message
...
>> "sf" wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah - like ox tails, which used to be sold for pennies, now
>>> cost as much as a good steak per pound.
>>
>> Speaking of oxtails, don't they contain prions, and therefore constitute a
>> possible vector for BSE ("Mad Cow Disease")?
>>
>> I cheerfully admit that I don't know the fact of the matter, but it seems
>> to
>> me that any part of the spinal cord will contain prions.
>>
>> Can some knowledgeable person dispel my veil of ignorance on this matter?
>>
>> Bob
>>
>>
>
>I do not claim to know which parts of the animal may and may not contain
>prions. I do know, however, that the spinal cord does not extend into the
>tail. In any case, I buy my ox tails from Niman ranch which does not feed
>any animal byproducts to their cattle.
>
>I agree about ox tails - a real treat. We just had them last night. If you
>like ox tails you ought to try beef checks.
>
>Here's the recipe I made up as I went along.
>
>2 lb oxtails, trimmed of excess fat, rinsed, and patted dry.
>4 TB bacon fat
>1 c diced onion
>1 c diced celery
>1/2c diced carrot
>2 or more garlic cloves, peeled and sliced.
>2c of a good pinot noir
>2 TB tomato paste
>
>In a heavy Dutch oven, brown the tails in 2 TB of the bacon fat. Brown them
>well on all sides - this will take 10-15 minutes. Remove from pan. Add
>remaining bacon fat and cook the veg, stirring, unitl softened and just
>starting to brown. Return the tails to the pan and add the wine, tomato
>paste, a good dose of black pepper, and some salt (go light on the salt for
>now). Bring to a simmer and simmer slowly in a 325 over or on the stovetop
>for 2 hours. Turn the tails over and, if needed, add some water to keep at
>least 2" of liquid in the pan. Simmer another 2 hrs. Add salt as needed,
>skim off excess fat if desired, and serve with egg noodles, rice, or mashed
>spuds, sprinkling with chopped fresh parsley.


Sounds good. I wonder if Bison have similar tails? We have a man who
grows pastured bison and comes to the greenmarket. I am going to ask
about tails the next time he shows up.



Rodney Myrvaagnes NYC J36 Gjo/a


"Nuke the *** whales for Jesus" -- anon T-shirt

sf wrote:

>
> Yeah - like ox tails, which used to be sold for pennies, now
> cost as much as a good steak per pound.
>

Ain't that the truth. When I was first married (my god 32 years ago) we used to
get a real feed of oxtails or beef short ribs for less than 30 cents. We'd have
leftovers. The last time I bought oxtails I had to buy two packages and it was
about $14. We could have had beef tenderloin and got four times as much meat on
them for a lot less than that. Forget about short ribs. It would be about $20 to
get a decent feed of them. My wife does a great job on ox tails and short ribs,
but I find it difficult to spend that much money on meat and then have to spend
so much time to cook it so that it is tasty and tender.

BOB wrote:
> kilikini wrote:
>> BOB wrote:
>>> kilikini wrote:
>>>> BOB wrote:
>>>>> kilikini wrote:
>>>>>> I love a broccoli/spinach/mushroom lasagna in a white
>>>>>> sauce, or how about a seafood lasagna? It's all good!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> kili
>>>>>
>>>>> Use that same idea on a pizza. Well, both of them.
>>>>> Veggies plus the white sauce, or seafood and white
>>>>> sauce. Or both.
>>>>>
>>>>> BOB
>>>>
>>>> BOB, we're going to have to get together here soon and
>>>> have our own little mini cook-in with WSM's. I so want
>>>> to try a pizza on one.
>>>>
>>>> kili
>>>
>>> Sounds like a plan...I'm still not supposed to drive
>>> much, but the time is coming. I can't cook on a WSM any
>>> more, my Kamados have spoiled me. Maybe I'll have to
>>> bring one or two (and some pizza stones).
>>>
>>> BOB
>>
>> Sounds wonderful! I'm up for it! Besides, it's time we
>> all got together anyway, since you missed Big Jim's New
>> Year's fest.
>>
>> kili
>
> Yeah, sorry about that. Just a quick...I know I could look it up, but
> what's the diameter of the WSM grill?
>
> BOB
> who still owes you and TFM® a wedding present


Shoots, I think it's either 16 or 18", BOB, but I'm not sure. I'll have to
look it up too. <g>

kili

kilikini wrote:
> BOB wrote:
>>
>> Yeah, sorry about that. Just a quick...I know I could
>> look it up, but what's the diameter of the WSM grill?
>>
>> BOB
>> who still owes you and TFM® a wedding present
>
>
> Shoots, I think it's either 16 or 18", BOB, but I'm not
> sure. I'll have to look it up too. <g>
>
> kili

Close enough, unless it's smaller than 16.

BOB

BOB wrote:
> kilikini wrote:
>=20
>>BOB wrote:
>>
>>>Yeah, sorry about that. Just a quick...I know I could
>>>look it up, but what's the diameter of the WSM grill?
>>>
>>>BOB
>>>who still owes you and TFM=AE a wedding present
>>
>>
>>Shoots, I think it's either 16 or 18", BOB, but I'm not
>>sure. I'll have to look it up too. <g>
>>
>>kili
>=20
>=20
> Close enough, unless it's smaller than 16.
>=20
> BOB=20
>=20
>=20

18.5" diameter BOB.

--=20
Steve

Ever wonder about those people who spend $2.00 apiece on those little
bottles of Evian water? Try spelling Evian backwards...

Steve Calvin wrote:
> BOB wrote:
>> kilikini wrote:
>>> BOB wrote:
>>>> Yeah, sorry about that. Just a quick...I know I could
>>>> look it up, but what's the diameter of the WSM grill?
>>>> BOB
>>>> who still owes you and TFM® a wedding present
>>> Shoots, I think it's either 16 or 18", BOB, but I'm not
>>> sure. I'll have to look it up too. <g>
>>> kili
>> Close enough, unless it's smaller than 16.
>> BOB
>
> 18.5" diameter BOB.
>
Thanks, Steve. I can continue my scheming now.
8-)

BOB

"Puester" > wrote in message
...
> Bob wrote:
>>
>> Once when I was on temporary assignment to Virginia I had to do without a
>> salad spinner, the corporate apartment *did* have lots of clean bed
>> linens.
>> You can put wet salad greens into a pillowcase, take it outside, and
>> swing
>> it around your head to dry the greens; I think it actually works BETTER
>> than
>> a salad spinner. (Lots more centrifugal force.) Who cares what the
>> neighbors think when they see you whirling a greens-laden pillowcase
>> around?
>> If you see them watching, you can act like you're doing some kind of
>> martial
>> arts training: Stamp and kick your feet, swing the pillowcase in
>> figure-eights, and every now and then belt out a hearty "Hi-YAH!" You'll
>> soon see them treating you with new respect. :-)
>>
>
>
> You only think it's respect. Actually they are trying to humor you till
> the men in the white coats arrive with the straitjacket....
>
> ;-)
> gloria p
==========

< SNORT >

Yeah, that's more like it... geez, it's hard to type when you're laughing so
hard!
Cyndi

"Damsel" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 16:49:55 -0500, Steve Calvin >
> wrote:
>
>>Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>><snipped>
>>>
>>> < recipe snipped for brevity >
>>>
>>> Carol, your mom's recipe is pretty much the way I make lasagna.
>>> However, I
>>> obey the law! <g>
>>>
>>> Wayne
>>
>>Pretty close to mine as well... but cottage cheese, Lady? ;-D
>
> Tryyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy it, you'll liiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiike it!
>
> Carol
> --
>==================

Well... I only obey the laws that I want to... or the ones I don't think I
can get away with. LOL

That being said - YES, Cottage Cheese! Everytime I've tried making it with
Ricotta it turns out BLAND!! And that's with doing everything the exact,
same way (well, as exact as possible). I've even tried a half and half
blend of ricotta and cottage... semi-bland. <shrug> Yep, gotta have
cottage cheese.

Cyndi

"Damsel" > wrote in message
news
> On Thu, 27 Jan 2005 19:22:20 -0500, " BOB" > wrote:
>
>>Damsel wrote:
>>> Here's my mom's from-scratch recipe (except that the poor
>>> ol' broad used noodles from a <gasp!> box, and used
>>> <gasp!> cottage cheese instead of ricotta).
>>>
>>But you can't call it Lasagna Alfredo Chili if you use cottage cheese.
>><eg>
>
> How about Lasagna Chicken Scampi Alfredo Chili? Isn't there cottage
> cheese
> in Chicken Scampi?
>
<snip>

Ewwwwwwwwwwwww!! That just sounds nasty.

Cyndi

In article <WryOd.869$uc.247@trnddc01>, "Rick & Cyndi"
> wrote:

> That being said - YES, Cottage Cheese! Everytime I've tried making
> it with Ricotta it turns out BLAND!! And that's with doing
> everything the exact, same way (well, as exact as possible). I've
> even tried a half and half blend of ricotta and cottage...
> semi-bland. <shrug> Yep, gotta have cottage cheese.

I think the fault there is in the sauce. The ricotta adds a creamy
element to the lasagne I make, and the fresh mozzarella adds the
stretchy, cheesy, gooey bit, as well as the flavor, the parmesan for the
flavor more than texture. The sauce, though, makes the whole thing
worthwhile. I will be making a large pan of this for a meal sometime
soon, if will have to be a Sunday meal during Lent, though.

Regards,
Ranee

--
Remove Do Not and Spam to email

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

See my Blog at: http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/

Ranee Mueller wrote:

> I think the fault there is in the sauce. The ricotta adds a creamy
>element to the lasagne I make, and the fresh mozzarella adds the
>stretchy, cheesy, gooey bit, as well as the flavor, the parmesan for the
>flavor more than texture. The sauce, though, makes the whole thing
>worthwhile. I will be making a large pan of this for a meal sometime
>soon, if will have to be a Sunday meal during Lent, though.
>
>
I found the following recipe last week in a really old magazine in the
hospital waiting room. I made it tonight, and it didn't suck.

It certainly wasn't lasagne, but it didn't suck. I added some onions and
peppers to the ground beef, and used Italian seasoning instead of oregano.

"Impossible Lasagne Pie"
(Impossibly easy because it makes its own crust)

1/2 cup creamed cottage cheese
1 pound ground beef
1 cup shredded mozzarella cheese
1/2 tsp salt
1/2 tsp oregano
1 can (6 oz) tomato paste
1 cup milk
2 eggs
1/2 cup Bisquick baking mix

Spread cottage cheese in greased 9" pie plate. Cook ground beef; drain.
Stir in 1/2 cup mozzarella cheese, salt, oregano, and tomato paste;
spoon over cottage cheese.

Stir milk, eggs and Bisquick until blended. Pour into plate.

Bake 30 to 35 minutes or until knife inserted in center comes out clean.
Sprinkle with remaining cheese. Bake 1 to 2 minutes or until melted.

"kilikini" > wrote in message
.. .
> BOB wrote:
>> Siobhan Perricone wrote:
>>> "Jill Delgado" wrote:
>>>
>>>> And remember, speaking for myself, we do not have
>>>> gourmet dinners every night. Some nights, grilled
>>>> Velvetta cheese (yes Velvetta) sandwiches are all I can
>>>> manage.
>>>
>>> Grilled velveeta sammiches is one of my favourite comfort
>>> foods. That and campbell's cream of tomato soup were
>>> something I got when I was home sick as a kid. It's very
>>> cozy to me
>>
>> Come to think of it, with grilled Velveeta® sandwiches is the only
>> way that I like Campbell's tomato soup. Yes, definitely comfort food.
>>
>> BOB
>
>
> I have *never* had a Velveeta® grilled cheese! I've never bought
> Velveeta®.
> Not that I'm a cheese snob, it just never occurred to me. Isn't that the
> plastic kine stuff that they put on nachos in stadiums and such? When I
> make a grilled cheese sandwich, I usually like to add whatever kinds of
> cheese I have in my fridge - and ALL of them! Usually it's swiss,
> monterey
> jack and cheddar on sourdough. The blend of cheeses makes it so yummy and
> you can get a cheese string about 6" long coming from the sandwich after
> your first bite! When I made my first one for my hubby, TFM, he said he
> had
> just about died and gone to heaven and I made the best one he had ever
> had.
> It's the blend of cheeses, folks, trust me. It works!
>
> kili

Kili, we're talking comfort foods here. I never knew what velveeta tasted
like till I was an adult. My dad said velveeta was fish bait and that's how
I always looked at it. Till I made a mistake at the store one day. I
intended to grab some American cheese slices for grilled burgers but grabbed
Velveeta instead.

Now I only buy Velveeta unless the wife requests otherwise. Then I buy what
she wants and velveeta.

But, for a gourmet grilled cheese, all bets are off. I'll grab 4 or 5
different cheeses to make them. Who said grilled cheese sandwiches were for
poor folk?!!?!?

Bret
<sig space still for rent>



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"Lucy" > wrote in message . com>...
> "Johnny Mc" > wrote in message
> ...
> > >"Lucy" > wrote in message
> > . com...
> >> Ok, I'm going to share my lasagna recipe with you all, that I made for
> >> dinner this evening, actually.
> >>
> >> 1 family size stouffer's lasagna
> >> sliced provolone cheese (non-smoked) (It is sold already sliced)
> >> something green and leafy that isn't strongly flavored. parsley, the
> >> green leaves from celery, or the leaves from carrot tops. (fyi.. cilantro
> >> does NOT work!)
> >>
> >> Remove lasagna from the box and let it sit on the counter for about ten
> >> minutes.. until the frozen lasagna slips easily from the plastic
> >> container. Put it into a rectangle pan of your own that you have sprayed
> >> with Pam.
> >> Bake according to package directions.
> >> Remove from oven.. top with sliced provolone, and return to oven just
> >> until the cheese melts and is bubbly.
> >> Remove from oven again, and sprinkle with mild flavored green stuff.
> >> (again.. cilantro doesn't work.. neither does fresh dill. It must be
> >> something fairly tasteless)
> >> The green stuff is important though. That, plus the sliced cheese.. gives
> >> the impression it is homemade.
> >>
> >> Serve with pepperidge farm garlic bread, and pre-packaged salad mix
> >> tossed with a couple of cut up tomatoes, and a bottled viniagrette
> >> dressing, that you pour into another bottle and shake.. giving the
> >> impression you slaved away making this.
> >>
> >> lucy (grinning broadly)
> >> p.s. Tomorrow night.. I am going to try my hand at real cooking!
> >>
> >>
> >
> > I don't know if you should get a metal or be bent over and spanked?
> >
> > --
> >
> > Just Brew It!
> > Johnny Mc
> oooooooooooh Johnny.. yer dirty!
> <evil grin>
> lucy

Bent Over And Spanked Lasagna

2 cans condensed Campbell's tomato soup
2 or 3 pepperonis
2 packages of Kraft sliced mozzerella
1 tsp black pepper
1/4 cup grated romano
1 package uncooked lasagna noodles

Boil the noodles according to the directions and then immerse in ice
water.
In an oiled lasagna pan or an 8 by 10 cake pan, smear a little of the
soup which has been mixed with the pepper, on the bottom.
Now layer rows of the noodles, soup, thinly sliced pepperoni and
cheese. Repeat.
Sprinkle the top with the romano and something green, parsely or
chives ( no cilantro).
Bake in a preheated oven at 400F for 29 minutes. The timing is
important! This may be assembled way ahead of time.
Serve with crusty rolls and a salad.

Biff