Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
General Cooking (rec.food.cooking) For general food and cooking discussion. Foods of all kinds, food procurement, cooking methods and techniques, eating, etc. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
"At the funeral in North Carolina at the weekend of Sergeant Marvin Miller,
the mourners were furious. Miller, who spent 18 years in the army, was shot dead in the Iraqi town of Balad. 'It stinks,' his aunt, Annie Miller, told reporters. 'The president got us into something he doesn't know how to get out of. It seems like the more killing that goes on over there, the more troops he's sending.'" Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone Suzanne Goldenberg in Washington Tuesday April 13, 2004 The Guardian A grieving father, mourning the death in Baghdad of his soldier daughter, yesterday begged the Pentagon to send her two sisters home from the war, saying the family could not bear another loss. Few American families with US military personnel serving in Iraq had as much to lose as the Witmers, from New Berlin, Wisconsin. Until Michelle was killed in an ambush on April 9, they had three daughters in Iraq: Rachel, 24, and twins Michelle and Charity, 20. The lives of the sisters, who served in the Wisconsin National Guard, were chronicled on the family website, which posted their letters and email messages, and photographs of all three in fatigues. In a posting to the site last July, Michelle sent out her wishlist for Baghdad's hot summers. It included family photographs, flip-flops and chocolate, and "anything that is frivolous like a self-heating face mask or stuff along those lines ... I like to feel like a girl again sometimes". The latest posting on the website was grim. "We regret to inform you that Michelle Witmer was killed in action." Private Witmer, who died when her Humvee was ambushed in Baghdad, had served in a military police unit alongside her older sister, Rachel. Charity, who arrived in Iraq earlier this year, is a medic and also serving in the Baghdad area. Their father, John Witmer, told the Associated Press: "I can't live another year like I've lived this one. The sacrifice that this family's made can never be understood by someone who hasn't gone through it ... It's a burden I can't bear. My family can't bear it." For the Witmers, the heartbreak of Michelle's death was deepened by the knowledge that she and Rachel were overdue to leave Iraq. In February, Michelle told the family to stop shipping care packages because they were due to pull out. "This is a REALLY GOOD SIGN!!" she wrote in an email. "The redeployment process (though it may be long) is finally beginning! There is finally a light at the end of the tunnel!" Instead, Michelle and Rachel's duty was extended for three months as the Pentagon scrambled for more troops to put down an increasingly bloody insurrection. Charity arrived in Iraq earlier this year. The two surviving Witmer sisters were expected to arrive home yesterday with Michelle's coffin after being granted permission to attend the funeral tomorrow. Their father is determined that the two should be transferred out of the war zone. Joan Apt, a spokeswoman for the family, said the request had been forwarded to the Pentagon. "We trust that those in charge of making such a decision will realise that we have already sacrificed enough and that our family must not be asked to bear such an impossible burden," she said in a statement. The Pentagon would not comment on the request yesterday, saying it was a matter for the Wisconsin National Guard. Under military rules the loss would not automatically qualify the surviving siblings for a discharge. Military families traditionally are stoic, but with more than 665 US troops dead in Iraq - 23 of them in the last three days alone - reserves of strength are wearing down across America. At the funeral in North Carolina at the weekend of Sergeant Marvin Miller, the mourners were furious. Miller, who spent 18 years in the army, was shot dead in the Iraqi town of Balad. "It stinks," his aunt, Annie Miller, told reporters. "The president got us into something he doesn't know how to get out of. It seems like the more killing that goes on over there, the more troops he's sending." Michelle, one of five children who were home-schooled together, followed her sister Rachel into the National Guard, in part to finance her college studies. In her emails and letters, Michelle said night shift at the local police station was like "being in the worst ghetto you can ever imagine, at night, in the dark. I hear gunfire all the time; it's so unnerving!" On September 17 she recounted an encounter with a roadside bomb. "Quite honestly, it's a miracle I'm alive right now." In more private email exchanges with her twin, Charity, she was more direct. "I hate this place more and more every day," she said. http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story...190669,00.html -=- This message was posted via two or more anonymous remailing services. |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
"The Outlaw Salome Wales" > wrote in message ... > > > > > Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > > > > America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > > ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone > > > Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given > permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military service > out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide > whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. -- "Look at any 'democratic' country, like America. In these countries the real business of 'state' is carried on by departments, staffs, and bureaus...Parliaments are only places where chattering goes on with the purpose of fooling the 'common people'." V.I. Lenin |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
|
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
The Sullivan brothers were in the Navy during WWII, and went down on the USS
Juneau in 1942. No official military "act" or congressional order has been passed, it is an "accomodation" the military provides that siblings have the option of not serving together in a war zone together. > Haven't you seen Saving Private Ryan?? This is actually a rule in the > military. They aren't bending anything. The rule says that siblings don't > have to serve in war together, b/c no parent should have to lose all their > children for the sake of the military. > |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
> > Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > > America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military service out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
In article >, The Outlaw
Salome Wales > wrote: > Haven't you seen Saving Private Ryan?? This is actually a rule in the > military. They aren't bending anything. The rule says that siblings don't > have to serve in war together, b/c no parent should have to lose all > their children for the sake of the military. Reference the five Sullivan brothers; all died on the same ship in Guadalcanal in WWII. -- -Barb, <www.jamlady.eboard.com> updated 3-29-04. |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
"Karen eichorst" > wrote in message ... > in article , The Outlaw Salome Wales > at wrote on 4/15/04 8:17 AM: > > > > >> > >> Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > >> > >> America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > >> ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone > > > > > > Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given > > permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military service > > out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide > > whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. > > > > It sounds like the parents want the Pentagon to make the decision first, > effectively removing the remaining daughters' right to choose for > themselves. I understand the emotions but it strikes me as somewhat > controlling. > That was my impression as well, he wants the Pentagon to force the girls to return home they may be too Hooah to do so. Their choice. > |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
> > I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their > > daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules > > to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain > > soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. > > > Haven't you seen Saving Private Ryan?? This is actually a rule in the > military. They aren't bending anything. dude, it's obvious i didn't know what the rule was and was asking for clarification. -- "Look at any 'democratic' country, like America. In these countries the real business of 'state' is carried on by departments, staffs, and bureaus...Parliaments are only places where chattering goes on with the purpose of fooling the 'common people'." V.I. Lenin |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
Hecubus wrote:
> Awake wrote: > > > A grieving father, mourning the death in Baghdad of his soldier > > daughter, yesterday begged the Pentagon to send her two sisters home > > from the war, saying the family could not bear another loss. > > This story is already way behind the times. The National Guard has already > sataed that the two remaining daughters have the choice of staying > stateside or returning to the middle east. The choice is entirely theirs. It says much about the personal honor of these women that they did not immediately make that request. Even though no one would ever put any blame on them for electing to stay in the US, one or both still might chose duty over safety. Impressive. But I read this on rec.food.cooking. What's the recipe for a good ethnic recipe popular in Baghdad? |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
> From: "StephenJ" > > Organization: Cox Communications > Newsgroups: > alt.gossip.celebrities,alt.politics.bush,rec.sport .golf,rec.sport.tennis,rec.f > ood.cooking > Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 07:15:41 -0500 > Subject: Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives > > > "The Outlaw Salome Wales" > wrote in message > ... >> >>> >>> Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon >>> >>> America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad >>> ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone >> >> >> Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given >> permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military service >> out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide >> whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. > > I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their > daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules > to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain > soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. Haven't you seen Saving Private Ryan?? This is actually a rule in the military. They aren't bending anything. The rule says that siblings don't have to serve in war together, b/c no parent should have to lose all their children for the sake of the military. |
|
|||
|
|||
Stop trolling!
If you idiots are going to continue responding to this f***ing troll, please have the g*****ed courtesty to snip the other newsgroups out of your replies! |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
The Outlaw Salome Wales > wrote in message >...
> > > > Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > > > > America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > > ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone > > > Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given > permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military service > out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide > whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. Giving them a choice is not really a "choice." The reason they are not hopping on the next plane to NY is because their tour is technically not over and it's obviously tough for them to leave their compatriotes behind. These people are selected and trained to have a high sense of duty and loyalty so giving them this choice only makes their situation more difficult, even if they are ordered to return home. |
|
|||
|
|||
Stop trolling!
On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:49:49 -0700, DJD
> wrote: > > If you idiots are going to continue responding to this f***ing troll, > please have the g*****ed courtesty to snip the other newsgroups out of > your replies! It was just an elaborate ploy to get you to post! We increase our readership any way we can these days because there are enough people who enjoy food and gossip actively participating in rfc. I can tell you're not the shy type, thanks for dropping by. BTW: Your free trial will end in 5 days... after that you'll have to pony up. sf rfc membership chair Practice safe eating - always use condiments |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
|
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
"StephenJ" > wrote in message news:02vfc.7612$55.7115@lakeread02... > > "The Outlaw Salome Wales" > wrote in message > ... > > > > > > > > Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > > > > > > America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > > > ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone > > > > > > Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given > > permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military service > > out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide > > whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. > > I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their > daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules > to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain > soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. what's good for the goose..........there is no draft in USA, if you're a female in the military, hopefully you enlisted to do more than get in shape, get paid, get free college and get free meals..you should be asked to serve in same capacity as men, since you chose it.. bob |
|
|||
|
|||
Stop trolling!
On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 23:05:50 -0000, Dog3
<dognospam@adjfkdla;not> wrote: > sf > poured a drink and posted > : > > > On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 08:49:49 -0700, DJD > > > wrote: > > > >> > >> If you idiots are going to continue responding to this f***ing troll, > >> please have the g*****ed courtesty to snip the other newsgroups out of > >> your replies! > > > > It was just an elaborate ploy to get you to post! We > > increase our readership any way we can these days because > > there aren't enough people who enjoy food and gossip actively > > participating in rfc. > > > > I can tell you're not the shy type, so thanks for dropping by. > > > > BTW: Your free trial will end in 5 days... after that you'll > > have to pony up. > > > > sf > > rfc membership chair > > > > > > Practice safe eating - always use condiments > > > > Congratulations sf, you have just slapped a net nanny. > LOL! I get it now. Practice safe eating - always use condiments |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
John Halliburton wrote:
> > The Sullivan brothers were in the Navy during WWII, and went > down on the USS Juneau in 1942. All seven (?) brothers. To this day they are held up as Naval heroes together with John Paul Jones. Their tale was told to me in Navy boot camp in 1978 and it was told to my younger daughter when she went through in 2001. There was even a wartime propaganda movie about them "The Fighting Sullivans" but the final scene of them all taking their duffle bags into heaven was too depressing and the movie is rarely shown. I recorded it from a movies-all-night marathon years ago once but didn't keep the tape. USS The Sullivans was built in their honor and was eventually retired from service. It is now a museum ship in Buffalo, NY. > No official military "act" or congressional order has been > passed, it is an "accomodation" the military provides that siblings have the > option of not serving together in a war zone together. It is not a law but it has been US military policy ever since. The policy was taught to my daughter and me in Navy boot camp separated by two decades. I'm sure the "Saving Private Ryan" scenario is the one taught in Army boot camp; gotta use your own fallen heroes. |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
|
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
"bob" > wrote in message .com>...
> "StephenJ" > wrote in message > news:02vfc.7612$55.7115@lakeread02... > > > > "The Outlaw Salome Wales" > wrote in message > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > > > > > > > > America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > > > > ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone > > > > > > > > > Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given > > > permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military > service > > > out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide > > > whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. > > > > I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their > > daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules > > to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain > > soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. > > what's good for the goose..........there is no draft in USA, if you're a > female in the military, hopefully you enlisted to do more than get in shape, > get paid, get free college and get free meals..you should be asked to serve > in same capacity as men, since you chose it.. > > bob Bob, Males get the same option. If the woman who died had two brothers instead of two sisters, they would face the same choice. But I'm continually heartened by the way you can find sexism in almost every article. It's encouraging that those blinders function 24/7!! |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
Steve Jaros wrote:
> > > The parent's position is both (a) entirely understandable (they are > crushed by grief and fear greatly another loss), but would also be (b) > a terrible precendent to set. It would mean that from now on, whenever > any soldier is killed, their siblings in the armed forces would > automatically be ordered home, regardless of circumstances or their > desires. That makes no sense from a military POV. > But that was done all the time during the Vietnam War and if I remember correctly, it happened automatically. It was called having "SSS status" (sole surviving son) and the survivor was sent home to stateside duty. gloria p |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
"scooter34" > wrote in message
om... > "bob" > wrote in message .com>... > > "StephenJ" > wrote in message > > news:02vfc.7612$55.7115@lakeread02... > > > > > > "The Outlaw Salome Wales" > wrote in message > > > ... > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bereaved father in plea to Pentagon > > > > > > > > > > America's grief laid bare as family who lost daughter in Baghdad > > > > > ambush begs US army to send her two sisters home from war zone > > > > > > > > > > > > Whoa. According to every news report I have heard, the Pent *has* given > > > > permission for the girls to stay home and continue their military > > service > > > > out of the war zone. It's the girls themselves who are trying to decide > > > > whether they want to return to the war or stay in the States. > > > > > > I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their > > > daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules > > > to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain > > > soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. > > > > what's good for the goose..........there is no draft in USA, if you're a > > female in the military, hopefully you enlisted to do more than get in shape, > > get paid, get free college and get free meals..you should be asked to serve > > in same capacity as men, since you chose it.. > > > > bob > > Bob, > > Males get the same option. If the woman who died had two brothers > instead of two sisters, they would face the same choice. But I'm > continually heartened by the way you can find sexism in almost every > article. It's encouraging that those blinders function 24/7!! i believe the law is for when all but one brother was killed in action, to a llow the last brother out of military service to keep the last brother alive to be able to carry on the family name? what does this have to do with ONE female soldier being killed when her TWO sisters are alive? if ANOTHER sister was killed (i sure hope not) then i'd certainly apply the law...how the hell is that sexist? are you nuts? bob |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
bob wrote:
> > I feel deeply for the father and the rest of the family that lost their > > daughter/sister, but i surely hope that the pentagon hasn't bent the rules > > to accomodate them. If the standard policy is to allow siblings of a slain > > soldier to opt out of combat zones, fine. But if not, then it's not fine. > > what's good for the goose..........there is no draft in USA, if you're a > female in the military, hopefully you enlisted to do more than get in shape, > get paid, get free college and get free meals..you should be asked to serve > in same capacity as men, since you chose it.. So true. Equal pay for equal work means equal work for equal pay. I understand that this woman was in the National Guard. I serve time with our armed forces reserves. I got the uniform and the training, and I got paid for it. I understood that if I was called up to go to war, I was expected to go. have a nephew who was called up for peace keeping duties in Bosnia. He went over and did his duty. But then I know a number of other guys who are in our reserves whose units were called up and they found excuses not to go. Sorry, but there are realities and obligations to face. As a tax payer, I resent paying for training, and paying the people to take it, and then not be able to count on them when they are needed. If I had my way, every reservist who refuses duty would immediately be drummed out of the service. |
|
|||
|
|||
Wisconsin Father pleads with Pentagon for Daughters lives
> Males get the same option. If the woman who died had two brothers
> instead of two sisters, they would face the same choice. But I'm > continually heartened by the way you can find sexism in almost every > article. It's encouraging that those blinders function 24/7!! Here's the official explanation of the law, from the Selective Service System: "Contrary to popular belief, "only sons," "the last son to carry the family name," and "sole surviving sons" must register and they can be drafted. However, they may be entitled to a peacetime deferment if there is a military death in the immediate family. Provisions regarding the survivors of veterans were written into Selective Service law after World War II. Details have varied over the years, but the basic premise remains the same; where a family member has been lost as a result of military service, the remaining family members should be protected insofar as possible. It is important to keep in mind that the provisions are directly related to service-connected deaths. The mere fact that a man is the only child or only son does not qualify him for consideration - he must be the survivor of one who died as a result of military service. The present law provides a peacetime exemption for anyone whose parent or sibling was killed in action, died in line of duty, or died later as a result of disease or injury incurred in line of duty while serving in the armed forces of the United States. Also included are those whose parent or sibling is in a captured or missing status as a result of service in the armed forces during any period of time. This is known as the "surviving son or brother" provision. A man does not have to be the only surviving son in order to qualify; if there are four sons in a family and one dies in the line of duty, the remaining three would qualify for surviving son or brother status under the present law. The surviving son or brother provision is applicable only in peacetime. It does not apply in time of war or national emergency declared by the Congress. The original law, passed in 1948, exempted the sole surviving son of a family where one or more sons or daughters died as a result of military service. No restriction existed at that time to limit the exemption to peacetime. The provision was intended to protect families which had lost a member in World War II. In 1964, recognizing that sons of World War II veterans were reaching draft age, Congress changed the law to include the sole surviving son of a family where the father, or one or more sons or daughters, died as a result of military service. At this time the peacetime-only restriction was also added to the law. A further change was made in 1971, expanding the exemption to any son, not necessarily the sole surviving son, of a family where the father, brother or sister died as a result of military service. This provision was recently expanded to include mothers. " -- "Look at any 'democratic' country, like America. In these countries the real business of 'state' is carried on by departments, staffs, and bureaus...Parliaments are only places where chattering goes on with the purpose of fooling the 'common people'." V.I. Lenin |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
SAVE MY MOM - John Kinal pleads for mercy, for justice.. please help tell the story.. | General Cooking | |||
Mexican woman pleads guilty to poisoning salsa with pesticide. | General Cooking | |||
bbq in the pentagon | Barbecue | |||
The Pentagon Germ = AIDS ! Time Sensitive, Pass it on. | General Cooking | |||
sons/daughters & wine | Wine |