I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
think) used in beer brewing.

I've read that you cook a starch/water mixture, keeping it at 150 F
somehow (what's a good way to keep a constant temperature?) and at pH
about 5.5-5.6. I guess i could lower the pH with cream of tartar if
necessary.

I'm allergic to corn & somewhat fructose intolerant, and syrup
from starch should have very little fructose in it.

laura

You do not need pancreatic enzymes. Amylases are present in germinating
grains - like malted barley. That is how rice syrup is made - there are
no simple sugars in rice, before you add malt to break down the rice
starch.

Please note that complete enzymatic hydrolysis would take ridiculous
quantity of enzyme or time (it would get mouldy faster). So what you
would get is actualy a mix of glucose, maltose and higher oligos,
called maltodextrin.

You can do hydrolysis of starch by heating it with diluted sulfuric
acid. To get the acid out, you neutralise with powdered CaCO3 and
filter.


Lacustral wrote:
> I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody
help
> me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases -
they
> use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
> from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I

> think) used in beer brewing.
>
> I've read that you cook a starch/water mixture, keeping it at 150 F
> somehow (what's a good way to keep a constant temperature?) and at
pH
> about 5.5-5.6. I guess i could lower the pH with cream of tartar if
> necessary.
>
> I'm allergic to corn & somewhat fructose intolerant, and syrup
> from starch should have very little fructose in it.
>
> laura

muha ) wrote:
>You do not need pancreatic enzymes. Amylases are present in germinating
>grains - like malted barley. That is how rice syrup is made - there are
>no simple sugars in rice, before you add malt to break down the rice
>starch.

I can't eat grains, so I'm planning to start with a non-grain starch, like
tapioca starch or arrowroot starch. So I need to add some kind of amylase
enzyme.

Does the hydrolysis with sulfuric acid that you mentioned, leave residues
that are inedible?

thanks
Laura

>Lacustral wrote:
>> I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody
>help
>> me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases -
>they
>> use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
>> from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I

>> think) used in beer brewing.
>>
>> I've read that you cook a starch/water mixture, keeping it at 150 F
>> somehow (what's a good way to keep a constant temperature?) and at
>pH
>> about 5.5-5.6. I guess i could lower the pH with cream of tartar if
>> necessary.
>>
>> I'm allergic to corn & somewhat fructose intolerant, and syrup
>> from starch should have very little fructose in it.
>>
>> laura

Lacustral wrote:
> Does the hydrolysis with sulfuric acid that you mentioned, leave
residues
> that are inedible?

It would leave behind some calcium sulfate, i.e. gypsum.

Lacustral wrote:
> I can't eat grains, so I'm planning to start with a non-grain starch, like
> tapioca starch or arrowroot starch. So I need to add some kind of amylase
> enzyme.
>
> Does the hydrolysis with sulfuric acid that you mentioned, leave residues
> that are inedible?
>
> thanks
> Laura
>
Is your problem with grains the gluten, i.e., celiac disease? If so,
there are a number of resources out there about brewing gluten free
beers. Generally these involve using malted white sorgum, malted
buckwheat, and sometimes rice syrup. You might try this site:
http://www.mrgoodbeer.com/gf/

Hope this helps.

Wayne
Bugeater Brewing Company

Wayne wrote:
> Lacustral wrote:
>
>> I can't eat grains, so I'm planning to start with a non-grain starch,
>> like
>> tapioca starch or arrowroot starch. So I need to add some kind of
>> amylase
>> enzyme.
>> Does the hydrolysis with sulfuric acid that you mentioned, leave residues
>> that are inedible?
>>
>> thanks
>> Laura
>>
> Is your problem with grains the gluten, i.e., celiac disease? If so,
> there are a number of resources out there about brewing gluten free
> beers. Generally these involve using malted white sorgum, malted
> buckwheat, and sometimes rice syrup. You might try this site:
> http://www.mrgoodbeer.com/gf/
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Wayne
> Bugeater Brewing Company


Malted sorghum? I thought that contained lethal amounts of cyanic
glucosides. The levels of cyanide might be reduced to safe levels during
fermentation (I don't know, this is the first time I've heard of using
malted sorghum to make beer), but the original poster is not planning to
ferment it but instead to make syrup. It could be extremely dangerous.

Best regards,
Bob

> Malted sorghum? I thought that contained lethal amounts of cyanic
> glucosides. The levels of cyanide might be reduced to safe levels during
> fermentation (I don't know, this is the first time I've heard of using
> malted sorghum to make beer), but the original poster is not planning to
> ferment it but instead to make syrup. It could be extremely dangerous.

For almost 100% malted sorghum beer, check out:
http://www.bardsbeer.com/

On Wed, 18 May 2005 14:00:31 -0500, zxcvbob >
wrote:
>Malted sorghum? I thought that contained lethal amounts of cyanic
>glucosides. The levels of cyanide might be reduced to safe levels during
>fermentation (I don't know, this is the first time I've heard of using
>malted sorghum to make beer), but the original poster is not planning to
>ferment it but instead to make syrup. It could be extremely dangerous.

Through Googling, I don't think this is a problem. I have found
references that during malting, the cyanide-problem areas -- the new
shoots -- are removed. This seems to solve most of the problem. As an
example, per one set of scientists, HCN content is reduced by more
than 90% just by removing the shoots. Fermentation furthermore reduces
it by 70%. Since I don't have access to a bunch of university library
scientific papers or time, I can't look up how much cyanide is reduced
by additional malt kilning, or the one hour boil that you would
normally do during brewing.

Given that the cassava root, a plant that contains a bit more cyanide
ppm when mature, is consumed just fine via simple techniques like
toasting or fermentation, I'd speculate that the levels of cyanide one
is talking about in sorghum beer are so minimal as to actually be a
nutrient.

References:
http://www.fao.org/documents/show_cd...e/T0818E09.htm
and a Google Scholar search on Dada and Dendy.
___________
To reply by email, chop off the head!

The problem here seems to food intollerances - corn and fructose.
You say you can't eat grains - does that mean all grains or just some of
them?

Mashing a starch with enzymes (need both alpha and beta amylases), is
not a very good solution as there are some problems.

First - a mixture of sugars will be produced, including fructose and
fructans.

Second - And you need to consider the gelatinisation temperature of the
starch and this varies with its source. Rice has a high gelatinisation
temperature, tapioca and potato have low gelatinisation temperatures.
The starch needs to be gelatinised before the enzymes can easily convert
the starches to sugars.


Glucose syrup is mainly produced by acid hydrolysis of corn or wheat
starch, but can use any starch. You can find information about the
process on the web.

Some sugars in Europe are produced from sugar beet, so it may be
possible to locate a glucose syrup made from this.

Making glucose syrup yourself is not going to be easy.


Lacustral wrote:
>
> I can't eat grains, so I'm planning to start with a non-grain starch, like
> tapioca starch or arrowroot starch. So I need to add some kind of amylase
> enzyme.
>
> Does the hydrolysis with sulfuric acid that you mentioned, leave residues
> that are inedible?
>
> thanks
> Laura
>
>
>>Lacustral wrote:
>>
>>>I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody
>>help
>>>me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases -
>>they
>>>use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
>>>from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
>>>think) used in beer brewing.
>>>
>>>I've read that you cook a starch/water mixture, keeping it at 150 F
>>>somehow (what's a good way to keep a constant temperature?) and at
>>
>>pH
>>
>>>about 5.5-5.6. I guess i could lower the pH with cream of tartar if
>>>necessary.
>>>
>>>I'm allergic to corn & somewhat fructose intolerant, and syrup
>>>from starch should have very little fructose in it.
>>>
>>>laura
>
>

muha ) wrote:

>You can do hydrolysis of starch by heating it with diluted sulfuric
>acid. To get the acid out, you neutralise with powdered CaCO3 and
>filter.

How does this exactly work, like how hot, what concentration sulfuric
acid, etc.? And can one get sulfuric acid, CaCO3 (calcium carbonate?)
that one would be OK with eating the end product? (no carcinogenic
contaminants etc.?

Laura

I cannot recommend doing this for a human consumption as a sweetener on
your own. It is not worth the effort and risks. And you would need
food-grade chemicals.

Also, you can buy glucose cheaply.

Please note that glucose is very weak sweetener - several times less
sweet than sucrose. What is wrong with using sugar, anyway? It tastes
better, too. Or you can buy fructose or use honey.

Lacustral > wrote:
>I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
>me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
>use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
>from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
>think) used in beer brewing.

I can't help with your problem, but in brewing beer
we use the naturally-occuring enzymes that are present
in malted barley (and wheat). No added enzymes are
typically used.
--
Joel Plutchak "I'm in beer class / Every Thursday night"
- "Sinister Foxx", _Title TK_, The Breeders

"Joel" > wrote in message
...
: Lacustral > wrote:
: >I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
: >me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
: >use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
: >from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
: >think) used in beer brewing.
:
: I can't help with your problem, but in brewing beer
: we use the naturally-occuring enzymes that are present
: in malted barley (and wheat). No added enzymes are
: typically used.
: --
but don't you heat in acidic conditions to make your wort?
cheers
Wazza

Wazza > wrote:
>"Joel" > wrote in message:
>: Lacustral > wrote:
>: >I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
>: >me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
>: >use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
>: >from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
>: >think) used in beer brewing.
>:
>: I can't help with your problem, but in brewing beer
>: we use the naturally-occuring enzymes that are present
>: in malted barley (and wheat). No added enzymes are
>: typically used.
>
>but don't you heat in acidic conditions to make your wort?

We heat, and many of us don't do explicit acidification--
we simply heat the grains in water and let the chips fall
where they may wrt pH.
--
Joel Plutchak "I'm in beer class / Every Thursday night"
- "Sinister Foxx", _Title TK_, The Breeders

Lacustral wrote:
>
> I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
> me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
> use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
> from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
> think) used in beer brewing.

Wouldn't it be easier just to buy the liquid glucose? Or else buy powder
glucose and make your own liquid?

In article >, Lacustral wrote:
> I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
> me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
> use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
> from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
> think) used in beer brewing.
>
> I've read that you cook a starch/water mixture, keeping it at 150 F
> somehow (what's a good way to keep a constant temperature?) and at pH
> about 5.5-5.6. I guess i could lower the pH with cream of tartar if
> necessary.
>
> I'm allergic to corn & somewhat fructose intolerant, and syrup
> from starch should have very little fructose in it.
>
> laura

Only thing that I think is even remotely possible is using koji to convert
starces to glucose. Search web with words amazake (sweet sake), sake, koji
and 'Aspergillus oryzae'.

for example http://olen.eng.ohio-state.edu/sake/Ch5.htm But I would
incubate in a lower temperature (35-40 C ?) for something like 1 day
first and then increase to 65 C for 12 hours.


seismo malm

On 18 May 2005 14:29:47 GMT, (Lacustral)
wrote:

>I'd like to make my own glucose syrup, using enzymes - can somebody help
>me with the process? Apparently you use alpha and beta amylases - they
>use them in beer brewing sometimes, but I might look for amylases
>from bacteria & fungi, rather than the pancreatic enzymes that are (I
>think) used in beer brewing.
>
>I've read that you cook a starch/water mixture, keeping it at 150 F
>somehow (what's a good way to keep a constant temperature?) and at pH
>about 5.5-5.6. I guess i could lower the pH with cream of tartar if
>necessary.
>
>I'm allergic to corn & somewhat fructose intolerant, and syrup
>from starch should have very little fructose in it.

This is a long thread, and I may have missed something, but some
thoughts...

1. Why not use ordinary sucrose? If your main concern with fructose is
the corn issue, then sucrose -- ordinary table sugar -- should be ok.

2. If you really want something extra-pure, why not get some
pharmaceutical grade glucose (dextrose). Ask your pharmacist. (If you
have connections with someone who works in biological research, you
might check with them, too.)

bob