jmcquown wrote:
> Gabby wrote:
> > "rosie" > wrote in message
> > ups.com...
> >> airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
> >> their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
> >>
> >> Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
> >> thing driving the price of oil.
> >>
> >> I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
> >
> > Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
> > evacuating the area.
> >
> > Gabby
>
> No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean they
> are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens eruption, "I
> won't leave, they can't make me".

No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
evacuate on their own is overwhelming.

Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
own the same. Too bad it isn't true.

Sandi

On Mon 29 Aug 2005 05:02:40a, Sandi wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
> dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
> the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
> area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
> empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
> evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>
> Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
> who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
> Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
> assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
> own the same. Too bad it isn't true.

Sandi, while all of those conditions exist and there are people in that
predicament, there is also an element who want to "brave it out" and an
element who want to have hurricane "parties". Examples of that are
reported during/after every major hurricane. I feel very sorry for those
who, for whatever reason, cannot leave, but I don't give a damn about those
who are too stupid to leave.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

My doctor told me to stop having intimate dinners for four,
unless there are three other people.

On 29 Aug 2005 14:25:59 +0200, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> Sandi, while all of those conditions exist and there are people in that
> predicament, there is also an element who want to "brave it out" and an
> element who want to have hurricane "parties". Examples of that are
> reported during/after every major hurricane. I feel very sorry for those
> who, for whatever reason, cannot leave, but I don't give a damn about those
> who are too stupid to leave.
>


Erik and I were fortunate enough to visit New Orleans last year, it's
a lovely city and (of course!) it has fantastic food. A lovely lady who ran a
B&B and several other properties there was a gracious host, and couldn't have
been more friendly. Unlike many in NOLA, she does have a car and the
resources to leave... but if she had stranded guests, I'm sure she would not
want to leave them behind, and she doesn't have a vehicle that can transport
that many and their belongings. Erik also has distant relations who live
in the area who are older, and may or may not have their own transportation
or the good health to make possible an evacuation. As of yet, we have no
news.


I don't really have a problem with when people have less empathy for
people who could leave but don't, for the reasons you stated above. The
problem occurs when people imply that those are the ONLY reasons why people
wouldn't leave New Orleans. That assumption is just plain ignorant and could
be easily avoided by thinking before one speaks. You would not dream of doing
such a thing, I know, but others don't always offer the same courtesy.

Ariane
--
Incompetence: When you earnestly believe you can compensate for a lack of
skill by doubling your efforts, there's no end to what you can't do.
http://www.despair.com/demotivators/incompetence.html

Ariane Jenkins > said:

> Erik and I were fortunate enough to visit New Orleans last year, it's
> a lovely city and (of course!) it has fantastic food. A lovely lady who ran a
> B&B and several other properties there was a gracious host, and couldn't have
> been more friendly. Unlike many in NOLA, she does have a car and the
> resources to leave... but if she had stranded guests, I'm sure she would not
> want to leave them behind, and she doesn't have a vehicle that can transport
> that many and their belongings. Erik also has distant relations who live
> in the area who are older, and may or may not have their own transportation
> or the good health to make possible an evacuation. As of yet, we have no
> news.

Our prayers are with them all, Ariane. This is just terrible.

We just saw on the news that they're projecting that the storm will pass
through western Tennessee and the Ohio River Valley. I have no idea if
you're in that part of Ohio, but if you are, I hope it's basically reduced
to heavy rains when it reaches you.

Hang in there - everyone who's affected.

Carol
--
http://tinyurl.com/9hjxt

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> Ariane Jenkins > said:
>
>> Erik and I were fortunate enough to visit New Orleans last year, it's
>> a lovely city and (of course!) it has fantastic food. A lovely lady
>> who ran a B&B and several other properties there was a gracious
>> host, and couldn't have been more friendly. Unlike many in NOLA,
>> she does have a car and the resources to leave... but if she had
>> stranded guests, I'm sure she would not want to leave them behind,
>> and she doesn't have a vehicle that can transport that many and
>> their belongings. Erik also has distant relations who live
>> in the area who are older, and may or may not have their own
>> transportation or the good health to make possible an evacuation.
>> As of yet, we have no news.
>
> Our prayers are with them all, Ariane. This is just terrible.
>
> We just saw on the news that they're projecting that the storm will
> pass through western Tennessee and the Ohio River Valley. I have no
> idea if
> you're in that part of Ohio, but if you are, I hope it's basically
> reduced
> to heavy rains when it reaches you.
>
> Hang in there - everyone who's affected.
>
> Carol

We're just getting mild rain here in west TN so far. The predicted high
winds haven't come this way yet; might take a day. I heard on the radio
this morning some of the casinos in Tunica, MS have set up emergency
shelters in their ballrooms. Bally's and The Grand Hotel were mentioned.
The Red Cross is there to help FEMA with what is needed to get people
temporarily housed, start the damage claim filing process, etc., although of
course no one knows yet what the damage will be.

OB Food: Squash again. It's a good thing I love squash.

Jill

"jmcquown" > said:

> We're just getting mild rain here in west TN so far. The predicted high
> winds haven't come this way yet; might take a day. I heard on the radio
> this morning some of the casinos in Tunica, MS have set up emergency
> shelters in their ballrooms. Bally's and The Grand Hotel were mentioned.
> The Red Cross is there to help FEMA with what is needed to get people
> temporarily housed, start the damage claim filing process, etc., although of
> course no one knows yet what the damage will be.

It's good to see communities pulling together like this. Thanks for
letting us know what's going on in Tennessee!

Carol
--
http://tinyurl.com/9hjxt

"jmcquown" > wrote

> We're just getting mild rain here in west TN so far. The predicted high
> winds haven't come this way yet; might take a day. I heard on the radio
> this morning some of the casinos in Tunica, MS have set up emergency
> shelters in their ballrooms. Bally's and The Grand Hotel were mentioned.
> The Red Cross is there to help FEMA with what is needed to get people
> temporarily housed, start the damage claim filing process, etc., although
> of
> course no one knows yet what the damage will be.

Of course, all of this was covered who knows how long ago by
the disaster planning people. I know it was a pain in the neck just
at work planning for a disaster, unfortunately sometimes it comes
to pass.

(laugh) Somehow I'm suddenly reminded of hiding under my school
desk in case of enemy airplanes from Russia attacking.

nancy

"Nancy Young" > said:

> (laugh) Somehow I'm suddenly reminded of hiding under my school
> desk in case of enemy airplanes from Russia attacking.

You're younger than me, and we never did that! I guess the powers that be
in the brand new subdivision in Minnesota where I grew up felt that the
Russians wouldn't bother with us.

I'm glad that the overt hostility is over.

Carol
--
http://tinyurl.com/9hjxt

On Mon 29 Aug 2005 10:03:23a, Ariane Jenkins wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> Erik and I were fortunate enough to visit New Orleans last year, it's
> a lovely city and (of course!) it has fantastic food. A lovely lady who
> ran a B&B and several other properties there was a gracious host, and
> couldn't have been more friendly. Unlike many in NOLA, she does have a
> car and the resources to leave... but if she had stranded guests, I'm
> sure she would not want to leave them behind, and she doesn't have a
> vehicle that can transport that many and their belongings. Erik also
> has distant relations who live in the area who are older, and may or may
> not have their own transportation or the good health to make possible an
> evacuation. As of yet, we have no news.
>
>
> I don't really have a problem with when people have less empathy
> for
> people who could leave but don't, for the reasons you stated above. The
> problem occurs when people imply that those are the ONLY reasons why
> people wouldn't leave New Orleans. That assumption is just plain
> ignorant and could be easily avoided by thinking before one speaks. You
> would not dream of doing such a thing, I know, but others don't always
> offer the same courtesy.
>
> Ariane
>

Yes, I agree with you Ariane.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974

Ariane Jenkins wrote:
> On 29 Aug 2005 14:25:59 +0200, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
> > Sandi, while all of those conditions exist and there are people in that
> > predicament, there is also an element who want to "brave it out" and an
> > element who want to have hurricane "parties". Examples of that are
> > reported during/after every major hurricane. I feel very sorry for those
> > who, for whatever reason, cannot leave, but I don't give a damn about those
> > who are too stupid to leave.

>
> I don't really have a problem with when people have less empathy for
> people who could leave but don't, for the reasons you stated above. The
> problem occurs when people imply that those are the ONLY reasons why people
> wouldn't leave New Orleans. That assumption is just plain ignorant and could
> be easily avoided by thinking before one speaks. You would not dream of doing
> such a thing, I know, but others don't always offer the same courtesy.
>

I have no emptathy for fools who commit suicide by hurricane....that
was my second paragraph which it seems people didn't bother to read.

Sandi

On 29 Aug 2005 16:12:48 -0700, Sandi > wrote:
>
> I have no emptathy for fools who commit suicide by hurricane....that
> was my second paragraph which it seems people didn't bother to read.

Don't sweat it, Sandi... I had no problems comprehending your post and
had no quarrel with it.

Ariane

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Mon 29 Aug 2005 05:02:40a, Sandi wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
> > No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
> > dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
> > the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
> > area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
> > empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
> > evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
> >
> > Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
> > who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
> > Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
> > assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
> > own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>
> Sandi, while all of those conditions exist and there are people in that
> predicament, there is also an element who want to "brave it out" and an
> element who want to have hurricane "parties". Examples of that are
> reported during/after every major hurricane. I feel very sorry for those
> who, for whatever reason, cannot leave, but I don't give a damn about those
> who are too stupid to leave.

Ummm.....isn't that exactly what the SECOND paragraph says? Those who
chose to stay because they think it is cool are fools - committing
suicide by hurrican I think is the phrase I used.

I lived in FL for 15 years and I've spent my share of time in hurricane
shelters including a fun filled time in a shelter with a Bosnaian
family, a Serbian family and a Herzogovinian family all in the same
place. We had deputy sheriff to prevent Kosovo 2 from occuring. We
also had an Alzheimers patient who wandered out in the peak of the
storm when his daughter fell asleep from exhaustion. All of us able
bodied were pressed into service to go out and search for him during
the storm. I'm real aware of storms and the problems that are incurred
by those who cannot evacuate - like special needs people. My mother was
a special needs case and I needed to go to the shelter with her since
she was a recent amputee.

Sandi

Sandi

"Sandi" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> jmcquown wrote:
>> Gabby wrote:
>> > "rosie" > wrote in message
>> > ups.com...
>> >> airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>> >> their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>> >>
>> >> Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>> >> thing driving the price of oil.
>> >>
>> >> I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>> >
>> > Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>> > evacuating the area.
>> >
>> > Gabby
>>
>> No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean they
>> are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens eruption,
>> "I
>> won't leave, they can't make me".
>
> No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
> dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
> the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
> area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
> empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
> evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>
> Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
> who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
> Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
> assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
> own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>
> Sandi

Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some of
their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
electronics....
Dee Dee


Dee Dee

Dee Randall wrote:
> "Sandi" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>>jmcquown wrote:
>>
>>>Gabby wrote:
>>>
>>>>"rosie" > wrote in message
egroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>>airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>>>>>their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>>>>>
>>>>>Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>>>>>thing driving the price of oil.
>>>>>
>>>>>I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>>>>
>>>>Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>>>>evacuating the area.
>>>>
>>>>Gabby
>>>
>>>No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean they
>>>are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens eruption,
>>>"I
>>>won't leave, they can't make me".
>>
>>No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
>>dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
>>the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
>>area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
>>empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
>>evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>>
>>Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
>>who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
>>Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
>>assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
>>own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>>
>>Sandi
>
>
> Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some of
> their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
> electronics....
> Dee Dee
>
>
> Dee Dee
>
>

Unfortunately, you are wrong. I've heard people say: "Give me your cell
number, . . ," assuming the other person has a cell. Likewise for e-mail
addy and so on. We ALL make assumptions sometime.


jim

"JimLane" > wrote in message
...
> Dee Randall wrote:
>> "Sandi" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>>>jmcquown wrote:
>>>
>>>>Gabby wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>"rosie" > wrote in message
legroups.com...
>>>>>
>>>>>>airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>>>>>>their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>>>>>>thing driving the price of oil.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>>>>>
>>>>>Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>>>>>evacuating the area.
>>>>>
>>>>>Gabby
>>>>
>>>>No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean
>>>>they
>>>>are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens
>>>>eruption, "I
>>>>won't leave, they can't make me".
>>>
>>>No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
>>>dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
>>>the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
>>>area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
>>>empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
>>>evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>>>
>>>Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
>>>who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
>>>Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
>>>assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
>>>own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>>>
>>>Sandi
>>
>>
>> Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some
>> of their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
>> electronics....
>> Dee Dee
>>
>>
>> Dee Dee
>
> Unfortunately, you are wrong. I've heard people say: "Give me your cell
> number, . . ," assuming the other person has a cell. Likewise for e-mail
> addy and so on. We ALL make assumptions sometime.
>
>
> jim

"everyone in the world"?
Whoo Hoo!
Dee Dee

Dee Randall wrote:
> "JimLane" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Dee Randall wrote:
>>
>>>"Sandi" > wrote in message
egroups.com...
>>>
>>>
>>>>jmcquown wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Gabby wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>"rosie" > wrote in message
glegroups.com...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>>>>>>>their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>>>>>>>thing driving the price of oil.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>>>>>>evacuating the area.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Gabby
>>>>>
>>>>>No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean
>>>>>they
>>>>>are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens
>>>>>eruption, "I
>>>>>won't leave, they can't make me".
>>>>
>>>>No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
>>>>dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
>>>>the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
>>>>area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
>>>>empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
>>>>evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>>>>
>>>>Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
>>>>who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
>>>>Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
>>>>assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
>>>>own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>>>>
>>>>Sandi
>>>
>>>
>>>Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some
>>>of their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
>>>electronics....
>>>Dee Dee
>>>
>>>
>>>Dee Dee
>>
>>Unfortunately, you are wrong. I've heard people say: "Give me your cell
>>number, . . ," assuming the other person has a cell. Likewise for e-mail
>>addy and so on. We ALL make assumptions sometime.
>>
>>
>>jim
>
>
> "everyone in the world"?
> Whoo Hoo!
> Dee Dee
>
>

Even you. Want a broader picture? Look into "self reference criterion"
and that will help explain it from a different angle. Other pertinent
information can be found researching paradigm change and so on.


jim

"JimLane" > wrote in message
...
> Dee Randall wrote:
>> "JimLane" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>Dee Randall wrote:
>>>
>>>>"Sandi" > wrote in message
legroups.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>jmcquown wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Gabby wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"rosie" > wrote in message
oglegroups.com...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>>>>>>>>their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>>>>>>>>thing driving the price of oil.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>>>>>>>evacuating the area.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Gabby
>>>>>>
>>>>>>No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean
>>>>>>they
>>>>>>are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens
>>>>>>eruption, "I
>>>>>>won't leave, they can't make me".
>>>>>
>>>>>No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
>>>>>dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
>>>>>the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
>>>>>area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
>>>>>empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
>>>>>evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>>>>>
>>>>>Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
>>>>>who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
>>>>>Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
>>>>>assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
>>>>>own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>>>>>
>>>>>Sandi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some
>>>>of their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
>>>>electronics....
>>>>Dee Dee
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Dee Dee
>>>
>>>Unfortunately, you are wrong. I've heard people say: "Give me your cell
>>>number, . . ," assuming the other person has a cell. Likewise for e-mail
>>>addy and so on. We ALL make assumptions sometime.
>>>
>>>
>>>jim
>>
>>
>> "everyone in the world"?
>> Whoo Hoo!
>> Dee Dee
>
> Even you. Want a broader picture? Look into "self reference criterion" and
> that will help explain it from a different angle. Other pertinent
> information can be found researching paradigm change and so on.
>
>
> jim

Last word! Last word! Last Word!!
Dee Dee

Dee Randall wrote:


>
> Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some of
> their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
> electronics....

You don't know how many Americans (and Europeans for that matter) I
have heard here in Honduras ask for phone numbers, cell phone numbers,
email addresses, etc. They just assume that people have these
conveniences. Many but not all, and that were the operative words in my
statement, assume people everywhere else are just like them...with all
the modern conveniences immediately at hand. It just ain't so.

A friend just got her phone number issued to her after a 4 year wait.
It will be another 6 months to a year before it is actually installed.
If she needs to make a call, she needs to find someone with phone or
walk the three miles into town to use the public phone in front of the
phone company office. Oh yeah....and for toilets and showers......her
mother has a screened off area in her yard with a hole for the toilet
and another screened off area with a 55gal drum that has a hose
attached to it as a shower. The village her mother lives in has one
phone for about 75 families. It is only accessible from 8a.m. to 8p.m.,
outgoing calls only. I knew the score before I moved here about phones,
TV, internet, etc. We'd still be waiting for a phone but the landlord
assigned one of his business lines to our house.
Americans that I've seen here are stunned when they are told there are
no private phone lines, no internet access, no TV reception, in many of
the small villages within 5 miles of town. I witness these assumptions
every time a new batch of Americans shows up in town. It's amazing
watching the show.

Sandi

Sandi at wrote on 8/29/05 7:45 PM:

>
> Dee Randall wrote:
>
>
>>
>> Americans do NOT assume that that everyone in the world, including some of
>> their fellow Americans, own cells phones, cars, have toilets, have
>> electronics....
>
> You don't know how many Americans (and Europeans for that matter) I
> have heard here in Honduras ask for phone numbers, cell phone numbers,
> email addresses, etc. They just assume that people have these
> conveniences. Many but not all, and that were the operative words in my
> statement, assume people everywhere else are just like them...with all
> the modern conveniences immediately at hand. It just ain't so.
>
> A friend just got her phone number issued to her after a 4 year wait.
> It will be another 6 months to a year before it is actually installed.
> If she needs to make a call, she needs to find someone with phone or
> walk the three miles into town to use the public phone in front of the
> phone company office. Oh yeah....and for toilets and showers......her
> mother has a screened off area in her yard with a hole for the toilet
> and another screened off area with a 55gal drum that has a hose
> attached to it as a shower. The village her mother lives in has one
> phone for about 75 families. It is only accessible from 8a.m. to 8p.m.,
> outgoing calls only. I knew the score before I moved here about phones,
> TV, internet, etc. We'd still be waiting for a phone but the landlord
> assigned one of his business lines to our house.
> Americans that I've seen here are stunned when they are told there are
> no private phone lines, no internet access, no TV reception, in many of
> the small villages within 5 miles of town. I witness these assumptions
> every time a new batch of Americans shows up in town. It's amazing
> watching the show.
>
> Sandi
>

Why would anyone ~choose~ to live under such primitive conditions in a third
world country?

What am I missing?

---
Love like you've never been hurt
Live like there's no tomorrow
And dance like there's nobody watching

Sheryl Rosen wrote:

> Why would anyone ~choose~ to live under such primitive conditions in a third
> world country?
>
> What am I missing?

Perhaps the same types who like to go camping on vacay, while I like
room service when I'm on holiday?

Goomba38 wrote:
> Sheryl Rosen wrote:
>
> > Why would anyone ~choose~ to live under such primitive conditions in a third
> > world country?
> >
> > What am I missing?
>
> Perhaps the same types who like to go camping on vacay, while I like
> room service when I'm on holiday?

Also, many in the US actually live not much differently than as if they
were in a third world country, only they don't seem to know it...
always announcing how poor they are, always announcing how they
scrimp... of course it's *entirely* their *choice* yet they continue to
maintain an underprivileged life style, for whatever reason only their
shink could possibly know. Those who are born into a third world
country haven't much choice but anyone who chooses to move to and live
there obviously has some element of guilt in their psyche, and/or they
simply choose to forego certain creature comforts in lieu of recieving
much more value for their US dollars than had they remained in the
US... many US retirees move to Central America, a US pension can buy
quite an opulent life style, if they're in relatively good health
(typically medical resources aren't the best) and willing to forego
things like being able to buy the latest fashions... but they can have
nice homes, eat extremely well, even have servants (btw, a housekeeper
for a US family is a very enviable position, it ensures the
housekeeper's family will be tended to also, and is a somewhat
symbiotic relationship, ensuring a smooth transition for the US family
amongst the locals). But I really wonder about those born in and
living in the US *choosing* to live impoverished life styles, they seem
to really enjoy whining, I doubt they are too well wrapped.

Sheldon

Sheldon wrote:
> Goomba38 wrote:
>
>>Sheryl Rosen wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Why would anyone ~choose~ to live under such primitive conditions in a third
>>>world country?
>>>
>>>What am I missing?
>>
>>Perhaps the same types who like to go camping on vacay, while I like
>>room service when I'm on holiday?
>
>
> Also, many in the US actually live not much differently than as if they
> were in a third world country, only they don't seem to know it...
> always announcing how poor they are, always announcing how they
> scrimp... of course it's *entirely* their *choice* yet they continue to
> maintain an underprivileged life style, for whatever reason only their
> shink could possibly know. Those who are born into a third world
> country haven't much choice but anyone who chooses to move to and live
> there obviously has some element of guilt in their psyche, and/or they
> simply choose to forego certain creature comforts in lieu of recieving
> much more value for their US dollars than had they remained in the
> US... many US retirees move to Central America, a US pension can buy
> quite an opulent life style, if they're in relatively good health
> (typically medical resources aren't the best) and willing to forego
> things like being able to buy the latest fashions... but they can have
> nice homes, eat extremely well, even have servants (btw, a housekeeper
> for a US family is a very enviable position, it ensures the
> housekeeper's family will be tended to also, and is a somewhat
> symbiotic relationship, ensuring a smooth transition for the US family
> amongst the locals). But I really wonder about those born in and
> living in the US *choosing* to live impoverished life styles, they seem
> to really enjoy whining, I doubt they are too well wrapped.
>
> Sheldon
>
It's amazing to see how people that are born in this country, want a
pity party thrown at them and yet don't want to lift a finger.

My uncle came from Cuba (with a minimum education: grade 9) in 1961. 20
years later, through very hard work and brains, owned a restaurant (The
Clam Broth House in Hoboken, NJ, with nine dining rooms, 2 of them being
formal ones where Joe Franklin from the Joe Franklin show frequented,
Frank Sinatra's mother, just to mention a few regulars) as well as 3
buildings. His first night in the US was spent washing dishes in NY
hotels and sleeping in the NYC subway. He moved up in the ranks of the
restaurant business, and when he studied the owners of those
restaurants, he realized he could do the same or better.

And he's one of the most nicest people still alive. Just an example; a
guy from Uruguay that used to work for him at the restaurant told him he
needed 5000K to bury his mother. It was all a lie. Years later, he came
back crying to my uncle for a job, and my uncle gave him one, and
forgave him his debt. I think that encapsulates the type of guy he is.

In this country, if you work hard and use 1/10 of your neurons, you will
be able to live the American dream; and then some.

Rich

--




"But the very hairs of your head are all numbered."

Existence (Ancient Roman Palestine)






"Dum Spiro, Spero."

As long as I breath, I hope.

Cicero (Ancient Rome)

On Mon, 29 Aug 2005 23:14:51 -0400, Sheryl Rosen
> connected the dots and wrote:


~
~Why would anyone ~choose~ to live under such primitive conditions in
a third
~world country?
~
~What am I missing?

Excitement, adventure, peace and quiet, human interactions. My
husband's best friend joined the Peace Corps in his 40's, went to
Ghana, taught engineering (i.e. how to fix that 30-year-old truck),
met a lovely woman, married, and planned to return there to start a
fixit business.

Helping others, teaching someone how to "fish" so they can feed
themselves and their family, teaching school, and in the process
learning about yourself and how someone else from a different culture
views the world.

Humans didn't always have flush toilets, instant communications, or
brand new cars. It can be rewarding to learn how to live comfortably
on your own without all the things we take for granted.

OB cooking: In many TWCs, they have what amounts to a chimney stove
which is very economical to cook on.

maxine in ri

Sheryl Rosen wrote:

> Why would anyone ~choose~ to live under such primitive conditions in a
third
> world country?
>
> What am I missing?


Sandi and her spouse don't live under such primitive conditions from what I
gather, they live very well compared to many of the "native" population...

--
Best
Greg

On 29 Aug 2005 05:02:40 -0700, Sandi wrote:

>
> jmcquown wrote:
> > Gabby wrote:
> > > "rosie" > wrote in message
> > > ups.com...
> > >> airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
> > >> their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
> > >>
> > >> Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
> > >> thing driving the price of oil.
> > >>
> > >> I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
> > >
> > > Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
> > > evacuating the area.
> > >
> > > Gabby
> >
> > No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean they
> > are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens eruption, "I
> > won't leave, they can't make me".
>
> No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
> dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
> the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
> area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
> empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
> evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>
> Anyone else - like the tourists who think it's cool to stay - are fools
> who made the choice to commit suicide by hurricane. Because many
> Americans own cell phones, cars, have toilets, have electronics, they
> assume everyone in the world, including some of their fellow Americans,
> own the same. Too bad it isn't true.
>
> Sandi

Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.

sf wrote:

> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
> Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.



If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a good
while.

In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.

Imho,

Andy

"Andy" <q> wrote in message
...
> sf wrote:
>
>> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
>> Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.
>
>
>
> If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a good
> while.
>
> In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.

I was watching it on tv today. It is absolutely hellish

Ophelia wrote:

>
> "Andy" <q> wrote in message
> ...
>> sf wrote:
>>
>>> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
>>> Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.
>>
>>
>>
>> If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a
good
>> while.
>>
>> In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.
>
> I was watching it on tv today. It is absolutely hellish


Agreed!

As for the looters, imho, they should simply have their wrists broken on
sight as punishment to fit the crime!

No mercy,

Andy

"Andy" <q> wrote in message
.. .
| Ophelia wrote:
|
| >
| > "Andy" <q> wrote in message
| > ...
| >> sf wrote:
| >>
| >>> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
| >>> Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.
| >>
| >>
| >>
| >> If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a
| good
| >> while.
| >>
| >> In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.
| >
| > I was watching it on tv today. It is absolutely hellish
|
|
| Agreed!
|
| As for the looters, imho, they should simply have their wrists broken on
| sight as punishment to fit the crime!
|
| No mercy,
|

The situation is getting worse down there. Hard to believe that it is
possible in a western civilized city, that such lawlessness is taking over.
I thank God that I have never known such desperation that is causing this
type of behaviour. I sure hope these people get the help they need soon.

Debbie

On Thu, 1 Sep 2005 08:55:15 -0400, "Debbie" >
wrote:

>The situation is getting worse down there. Hard to believe that it is
>possible in a western civilized city, that such lawlessness is taking over.
>I thank God that I have never known such desperation that is causing this
>type of behaviour. I sure hope these people get the help they need soon.

I think a large part of the looting is simple desperation. If you have
not had food or drink for 2 or 3 days... As for the looters who are
going for greed - may they rot in hell.

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"

"Andy" <q> wrote in message
.. .
> Ophelia wrote:
>
>>
>> "Andy" <q> wrote in message
>> ...
>>> sf wrote:
>>>
>>>> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
>>>> Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a
> good
>>> while.
>>>
>>> In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.
>>
>> I was watching it on tv today. It is absolutely hellish
>
>
> Agreed!
>
> As for the looters, imho, they should simply have their wrists broken
> on
> sight as punishment to fit the crime!

One report says that the embankments built to keep the water out is now
keeping it in

"Ophelia" > wrote:
>One report says that the embankments built to keep the water out is now
>keeping it in

Not really. The water level in the city is now equalized with the
lake, which is a little bit above the river. If the embankments were
not there, the level wouldn't drop enough to make a real difference.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

On Thu, 01 Sep 2005 07:28:08 -0500, Andy wrote:

> Ophelia wrote:
>
> >
> > "Andy" <q> wrote in message
> > ...
> >> sf wrote:
> >>
> >>> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
> >>> Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a
> good
> >> while.
> >>
> >> In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.
> >
> > I was watching it on tv today. It is absolutely hellish
>
>
> Agreed!
>
> As for the looters, imho, they should simply have their wrists broken on
> sight as punishment to fit the crime!
>
> No mercy,
>
> Andy

Maybe there are looters who are out to make a profit, but I think most
of them are just trying to survive.

On Thu 01 Sep 2005 09:54:58p, sf wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On Thu, 01 Sep 2005 07:28:08 -0500, Andy wrote:
>
>> Ophelia wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > "Andy" <q> wrote in message
>> > ...
>> >> sf wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did
>> >>> leave. Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> If I had a year's supply of food and water, I'd still leave for a
>> >> good while.
>> >>
>> >> In practical terms, New Orleans is dead.
>> >
>> > I was watching it on tv today. It is absolutely hellish
>>
>>
>> Agreed!
>>
>> As for the looters, imho, they should simply have their wrists broken
>> on sight as punishment to fit the crime!
>>
>> No mercy,
>>
>> Andy
>
> Maybe there are looters who are out to make a profit, but I think most
> of them are just trying to survive.

Yeah, especially the ones with TVs and boomboxes, and no place to plug
them in. Get real, sf!

I certainly don't begrudge those taking food, baby formula, diapers,
medicines, etc., but really...everything else?

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

My doctor told me to stop having intimate dinners for four,
unless there are three other people.

sf replied to Andy:

>> As for the looters, imho, they should simply have their wrists broken on
>> sight as punishment to fit the crime!
>>
>> No mercy,
>>
>> Andy
>
> Maybe there are looters who are out to make a profit, but I think most
> of them are just trying to survive.


Earlier today, I received this on an e-mail list:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
My SO's bro just got orders and will be deployed to NO tonight.
What is significant and not neccessarily reported in the news is that,
essentially he is leading his unit there to shoot to kill. Most national
guards are trained to do crowd control, or rescue; but his is specifially
running the tactical unit (Bortac). He said he would prefer to arm
his units with rifles (shots than will scatter a wide area) than machine
guns right now...but we will see what he would sign out from the arsenal
for his men...they are gonan stay for a month as told.

Apparently the gangs had taken over Metrodome, and started moving across
town to the nice rich area in NO. Let just say that most of the really
rich people in the south live in that area, and there are a lot of
Picassos being left behind....I do not think that this is just about
shooting someone who try to steal a TV from Walmart.

Tonight we were making satellite maps for her bro while he was back with
his unit preparing to board the cargo plane. My SO went to school in NO
and gave her bro all the tips he needed...(which gangs, which building in
which district to hide, which projects, which buildings has hidden medical
equipment..etc.)

This is going to be very messy before it will be OK again. NO will never
be the same. The Jesuit owned lands will probably be OK and restored, as
will the French Quarter, but the rest would probably be left to rot...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bob

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005, sf wrote:

> On 29 Aug 2005 05:02:40 -0700, Sandi wrote:
>
>>
>> jmcquown wrote:
>> > Gabby wrote:
>> >> "rosie" > wrote in message
>> >> ups.com...
>> >>> airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>> >>> their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>> >>>
>> >>> Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>> >>> thing driving the price of oil.
>> >>>
>> >>> I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>> >>
>> >> Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>> >> evacuating the area.
>> >>
>> >> Gabby
>> >
>> > No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean they
>> > are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens eruption, "I
>> > won't leave, they can't make me".
>>
>> No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
>> dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
>> the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
>> area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
>> empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
>> evacuate on their own is overwhelming.

If they decided to evacuate pittsburgh today, I'd be dead. I accept that
as one of the prices of not having a car. If someone says evacuate an
area now, are you going to wait until I walk an hour to get to your house?

I have friends in this city, but not many live nearby.

Lena

okay, so maybe I could hotwire a car. If only I knew how....

"Lena B Katz" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> On Wed, 31 Aug 2005, sf wrote:
>
>> On 29 Aug 2005 05:02:40 -0700, Sandi wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> jmcquown wrote:
>>> > Gabby wrote:
>>> >> "rosie" > wrote in message
>>> >> ups.com...
>>> >>> airlift people north ??? Are you kidding ? They can go north under
>>> >>> their own steam, there has been plenty of warning.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Gasoline prices will no doubt be impacted, this is only one of many
>>> >>> thing driving the price of oil.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I do hope all have gone to higher ground .
>>> >>
>>> >> Officials say there are tens of thousands who have no way of
>>> >> evacuating the area.
>>> >>
>>> >> Gabby
>>> >
>>> > No way? What, they don't know anyone with a car? Or does this mean
>>> > they
>>> > are being stubborn, as in the wake of the 1980's Mt. St. Helens
>>> > eruption, "I
>>> > won't leave, they can't make me".
>>>
>>> No Jill, it means many are poor and/or homeless urban inner-city
>>> dwellers who don't have cars or don't know people with cars. They are
>>> the elderly who don't drive and who don't have family members in the
>>> area who drive. They are the people with no choice but to stay. Your
>>> empathy, compassion, and respect for the elderly and poor who cannot
>>> evacuate on their own is overwhelming.
>
> If they decided to evacuate pittsburgh today, I'd be dead. I accept that
> as one of the prices of not having a car. If someone says evacuate an
> area now, are you going to wait until I walk an hour to get to your house?

Yep,
Dee Dee

On Wed, 31 Aug 2005 21:55:53 -0700, sf > wrote:

>Sandi - you're absolutely right. Those who could leave, did leave.
>Those who stayed either couldn't leave or were fool hearty.

"Fool hearty" was an interesting typo - their hearts *were* foolish,
but hindsight is always 20/20.

Dammit.

Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"