In article >,
"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote:

<snipped cool recipe>

> BOB'S NOTES:
>
> 1. My recipe doesn't contain anchovies or Cognac, I put the capers on the
> side, and I use more parsley than Bourdain does. I usually use red onion
> which has been chopped, rinsed with cold water, and spun dry, but that's not
> set in stone: Sometimes I use scallions and/or shallots instead; sometimes I
> just use whatever onions I have on hand.
>
> 2. I serve the tartare with toast points, toasted slices of brioche, or
> toasted rounds of artisanal bread, but high-quality crackers will do in a
> pinch.
>
> 3. I have Dijon mustard and pickles on the side. Sometimes capers, too. And
> although it's nowhere near authentic, I usually have sliced serrano chiles
> and a "dipping bowl" of some kind of spice mixture, which varies according
> to my mood. It might be curry-based, it might be harissa-based, it might be
> dukkah-based, it might be chili-based, and so forth. I'd also provide a
> little mound of wasabi or horseradish if I were making this for somebody
> who's fond of those things.
>
> 4. I generally make tartare from tenderloin or filet mignon rather than from
> sirloin, and I *do* cut it by hand, though I use more of a slicing motion
> than a chopping motion.
>
> Bob

Thanks for posting that. :-)
I've stored it to my nutrution file...

I also cut it by hand but I prefer it "chunky" style and cut it into
small cubes. I use well trimmed, very lean shoulder or rump, or sirloin
if I find some that is not marbled. Raw, it's more tender than you might
think... but I doubt as tender as mignon. <lol>

I don't mix _anything_ with the meat, but instead, mix the raw egg yolk
and whatever other flavorings I want in a small bowl for dipping on the
side. I serve it with a small fondue fork.

My dip sauce is usually simple, just raw egg yolk, bragg's liquid aminos
(a wonderful and mild non-fermented soy sauce), worcestershire sauce, a
bit of lemon pepper, dried parsley flakes and maybe a pinch of garlic
powder.

Sometimes it's just raw egg yolk and a bit of salt. ;-)
The rich flavor of good beef can speak for itself, along with the rich,
free range eggyolks from my own birds...

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

Om wrote:

> My dip sauce is usually simple, just raw egg yolk, bragg's liquid aminos
> (a wonderful and mild non-fermented soy sauce), worcestershire sauce, a
> bit of lemon pepper, dried parsley flakes and maybe a pinch of garlic
> powder.
>
> Sometimes it's just raw egg yolk and a bit of salt. ;-)
> The rich flavor of good beef can speak for itself, along with the rich,
> free range eggyolks from my own birds...

A local sushi restaurant makes a wonderful beef sukiyaki which is a
wintertime favorite of mine. If you ASK, they'll give you a raw egg yolk
for dipping the morsels, but they don't give it by default because of the
widespread fear of salmonella. It does add a richness to the dish which is
welcome when it's cold and drizzly outside.

My local supermarket used to carry pasteurized eggs and I bought them
regularly, but they simply stopped carrying them one day. I went to the
trouble to fill out one of those feedback cards and actually got a call from
someone in their ordering chain. That person assured me that the store would
resume carrying those eggs in short order, but it never happened, and a
little investigation revealed that the brand wasn't continuing with
pasteurized eggs. Someone on this list told me that Trader Joe's carried
pasteurized eggs, but my local store didn't carry them. Again, working my
way up the corporate food chain, I discovered that no, those eggs had also
been discontinued. Now I can't find pasteurized eggs anywhere, and as a
result I've sharply cut back on the amount of mayonnaise I make (and eggnog,
later in the year).

Bob

In article >,
"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote:

> Om wrote:
>
> > My dip sauce is usually simple, just raw egg yolk, bragg's liquid aminos
> > (a wonderful and mild non-fermented soy sauce), worcestershire sauce, a
> > bit of lemon pepper, dried parsley flakes and maybe a pinch of garlic
> > powder.
> >
> > Sometimes it's just raw egg yolk and a bit of salt. ;-)
> > The rich flavor of good beef can speak for itself, along with the rich,
> > free range eggyolks from my own birds...
>
> A local sushi restaurant makes a wonderful beef sukiyaki which is a
> wintertime favorite of mine. If you ASK, they'll give you a raw egg yolk
> for dipping the morsels, but they don't give it by default because of the
> widespread fear of salmonella. It does add a richness to the dish which is
> welcome when it's cold and drizzly outside.

It sounds wonderful. :-)
The dangers of raw eggs are over-rated if they are sensibly handled!
Cooked egg dishes, sitting out in the hot sun for a few hours, are FAR
more of a danger!!!!!

The japanese place in San Antonio offers raw quail eggs as part of their
sashimi menu. They are good for dipping too!

>
> My local supermarket used to carry pasteurized eggs and I bought them
> regularly, but they simply stopped carrying them one day. I went to the
> trouble to fill out one of those feedback cards and actually got a call from
> someone in their ordering chain. That person assured me that the store would
> resume carrying those eggs in short order, but it never happened, and a
> little investigation revealed that the brand wasn't continuing with
> pasteurized eggs. Someone on this list told me that Trader Joe's carried
> pasteurized eggs, but my local store didn't carry them. Again, working my
> way up the corporate food chain, I discovered that no, those eggs had also
> been discontinued. Now I can't find pasteurized eggs anywhere, and as a
> result I've sharply cut back on the amount of mayonnaise I make (and eggnog,
> later in the year).
>
> Bob

Why don't you just make your own?

Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there is
very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
eggyolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
putting them away.

Yes, I did get salmonella once but it was from eating a raw egg that had
been slightly cracked so was contaminated. It was carelessness on my
part as I knew better.

I've eaten hundreds of raw eggs over the years as I actually prefer the
yolks raw, or mininally cooked.

And they seem to be easir to digest. ;-)


>
>
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote in message
...

>>
Now I can't find pasteurized eggs anywhere, and as a
> result I've sharply cut back on the amount of mayonnaise I make (and
> eggnog,
> later in the year).
>
> Bob
A poster wrote on October 5, 2005
>>>You can also sterilize egg yolks yourself. Heat them to 150 F (66 C)
>>>and hold them at that temperature for at least one minute while
>>>stirring, then cool them. I find that amount of heat does thicken
>>>them slightly but it hasn't been a problem for me.

It's detailed in a book you might
> enjoy called "Cookwise" by Shirley Corriher.

Can the poster give any particulars about what heat method and how one heats
the eggs to 150F and 'holds' them at 150F for one minute. I asked before,
but maybe the answer got lost.
Thanks,
Dee Dee

On Sun, 9 Oct 2005 09:20:32 -0400, "Dee Randall"
> wrote:

>
>"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote in message
...
>
>>>
> Now I can't find pasteurized eggs anywhere, and as a
>> result I've sharply cut back on the amount of mayonnaise I make (and
>> eggnog,
>> later in the year).
>>
>> Bob
>A poster wrote on October 5, 2005
>>>>You can also sterilize egg yolks yourself. Heat them to 150 F (66 C)
>>>>and hold them at that temperature for at least one minute while
>>>>stirring, then cool them. I find that amount of heat does thicken
>>>>them slightly but it hasn't been a problem for me.
>
> It's detailed in a book you might
>> enjoy called "Cookwise" by Shirley Corriher.
>
>Can the poster give any particulars about what heat method and how one heats
>the eggs to 150F and 'holds' them at 150F for one minute. I asked before,
>but maybe the answer got lost.
>Thanks,
>Dee Dee
>
Check Shirley Corriher's book "Cookwise."
--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

"The Cook" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 9 Oct 2005 09:20:32 -0400, "Dee Randall"
> > wrote:
>
>>
>>"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote in message
...
>>
>>>>
>> Now I can't find pasteurized eggs anywhere, and as a
>>> result I've sharply cut back on the amount of mayonnaise I make (and
>>> eggnog,
>>> later in the year).
>>>
>>> Bob
>>A poster wrote on October 5, 2005
>>>>>You can also sterilize egg yolks yourself. Heat them to 150 F (66 C)
>>>>>and hold them at that temperature for at least one minute while
>>>>>stirring, then cool them. I find that amount of heat does thicken
>>>>>them slightly but it hasn't been a problem for me.
>>
>> It's detailed in a book you might
>>> enjoy called "Cookwise" by Shirley Corriher.
>>
>>Can the poster give any particulars about what heat method and how one
>>heats
>>the eggs to 150F and 'holds' them at 150F for one minute. I asked before,
>>but maybe the answer got lost.
>>Thanks,
>>Dee Dee
>>
> Check Shirley Corriher's book "Cookwise."
> --
> Susan N.

Thanks again. I found the book at the library. I'll pick it up when I get
to the 'big city.'
Dee Dee

On Sun, 9 Oct 2005 11:28:25 -0400, "Dee Randall"
> wrote:

>
>"The Cook" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sun, 9 Oct 2005 09:20:32 -0400, "Dee Randall"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote in message
...
>>>
>>>>>
>>> Now I can't find pasteurized eggs anywhere, and as a
>>>> result I've sharply cut back on the amount of mayonnaise I make (and
>>>> eggnog,
>>>> later in the year).
>>>>
>>>> Bob
>>>A poster wrote on October 5, 2005
>>>>>>You can also sterilize egg yolks yourself. Heat them to 150 F (66 C)
>>>>>>and hold them at that temperature for at least one minute while
>>>>>>stirring, then cool them. I find that amount of heat does thicken
>>>>>>them slightly but it hasn't been a problem for me.
>>>
>>> It's detailed in a book you might
>>>> enjoy called "Cookwise" by Shirley Corriher.
>>>
>>>Can the poster give any particulars about what heat method and how one
>>>heats
>>>the eggs to 150F and 'holds' them at 150F for one minute. I asked before,
>>>but maybe the answer got lost.
>>>Thanks,
>>>Dee Dee
>>>
>> Check Shirley Corriher's book "Cookwise."
>> --
>> Susan N.
>
>Thanks again. I found the book at the library. I'll pick it up when I get
>to the 'big city.'
>Dee Dee
>

I also found this site.
http://www.melindalee.com/printvers....dboileggs.html
Even tells you how to pasteurize them in the shell.

--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:

> Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there is
> very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
> eggyolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
> putting them away.

You're wasting your time with that bleach exercise. It's not the outside
of the shell that's the problem. Salmonella contamination is inside the
egg. Chickens are laying eggs with the salmonella already included.

But not very many of them. I've seen estimates from professional sources
that say the range is anywhere from 1 in 10,000 to 1 in 20,000. The odds
are very low.

> Yes, I did get salmonella once but it was from eating a raw egg that had
> been slightly cracked so was contaminated. It was carelessness on my
> part as I knew better.

Cracked eggs can be contaminated by outside bacteria entering the crack
and prospering. I don't ever use them. For anything. But it's probably
more an aesthetic judgement than bacteriological wisdom.

> I've eaten hundreds of raw eggs over the years as I actually prefer the
> yolks raw, or mininally cooked.

Minimally cooked, like to something over 150°F where it's still runny,
has killed any salmonella in there.

> And they seem to be easir to digest. ;-)

Personal judgement.

Pastorio

OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> The dangers of raw eggs are over-rated if they are sensibly handled!
> Cooked egg dishes, sitting out in the hot sun for a few hours, are FAR
> more of a danger!!!!!
>
> Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there is
> very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
> eggyolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
> putting them away.

Bleaching is a good thing since you raise your own... commercial
establishments disinfect egg shells too. And, yes, the fresher the
safer. It's also prudent to learn how to crack and release an egg
*efficiently*, all in one fell swoop... you don't want bits of shell or
unecessary contact between egg and broken shell... do not permit egg
shells to drain, it's far safer to discard what clngs to the shell
interior, it's less than 1% anyway.

> Yes, I did get salmonella once but it was from eating a raw egg that had
> been slightly cracked so was contaminated. It was carelessness on my
> part as I knew better.
>
> I've eaten hundreds of raw eggs over the years as I actually prefer the
> yolks raw, or mininally cooked.

---> http://www.aeb.org/Professional/eggsafety.htm

Sheldon

Bob (this one) wrote:

> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
>> Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there
>> is very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
>> eggyolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
>> putting them away.
>
> You're wasting your time with that bleach exercise. It's not the
> outside of the shell that's the problem. Salmonella contamination is
> inside the egg. Chickens are laying eggs with the salmonella already
> included.
>
> But not very many of them. I've seen estimates from professional
> sources that say the range is anywhere from 1 in 10,000 to 1 in
> 20,000. The odds are very low.
>
>> Yes, I did get salmonella once but it was from eating a raw egg that
>> had been slightly cracked so was contaminated. It was carelessness on
>> my part as I knew better.
>
> Cracked eggs can be contaminated by outside bacteria entering the
> crack and prospering. I don't ever use them. For anything. But it's
> probably more an aesthetic judgement than bacteriological wisdom.
>
>> I've eaten hundreds of raw eggs over the years as I actually prefer
>> the yolks raw, or mininally cooked.
>
> Minimally cooked, like to something over 150°F where it's still runny,
> has killed any salmonella in there.
>
>> And they seem to be easir to digest. ;-)
>
> Personal judgement.
>
> Pastorio


That 150 degree claim... does a three minute egg gets that hot? I'll
have to take it's temperature next time.

--
Andy
http://tinyurl.com/dzl7h

Andy wrote:
> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>
>>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there
>>>is very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
>>>eggyolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
>>>putting them away.
>>
>>You're wasting your time with that bleach exercise. It's not the
>>outside of the shell that's the problem. Salmonella contamination is
>>inside the egg. Chickens are laying eggs with the salmonella already
>>included.
>>
>>But not very many of them. I've seen estimates from professional
>>sources that say the range is anywhere from 1 in 10,000 to 1 in
>>20,000. The odds are very low.
>>
>>
>>>Yes, I did get salmonella once but it was from eating a raw egg that
>>>had been slightly cracked so was contaminated. It was carelessness on
>>>my part as I knew better.
>>
>>Cracked eggs can be contaminated by outside bacteria entering the
>>crack and prospering. I don't ever use them. For anything. But it's
>>probably more an aesthetic judgement than bacteriological wisdom.
>>
>>>I've eaten hundreds of raw eggs over the years as I actually prefer
>>>the yolks raw, or mininally cooked.
>>
>>Minimally cooked, like to something over 150°F where it's still runny,
>>has killed any salmonella in there.
>>
>>>And they seem to be easir to digest. ;-)
>>
>>Personal judgement.
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> That 150 degree claim... does a three minute egg gets that hot? I'll
> have to take it's temperature next time.

If you do, use the right thermometer. A normal quick-read won't do. They
take a reading along several inches of the probe, so if you just use the
tip, the reading will be inaccurate.

Salmonella is thoroughly killed at 145°, I threw in 150°F as a safety
margin.

"What is an adequate temperature to cook an egg?
Egg white coagulates between 144 and 149°F, egg yolk coagulates between
149 and 158°F and whole eggs between 144 and 158°F. Plain whole eggs
without added ingredients are pasteurized but not cooked by bringing
them to 140°F and maintaining that temperature for 3 and 1/2 minutes.
According to the FDA Food Code, eggs for immediate consumption can be
cooked to 145°F for 15 seconds.

"If the eggs are to be used in a recipe with other food items, dilute
the eggs with with liquid or other ingredients, such as milk, or sugar
(at least 1/4 cup liquid or sugar per egg as in custard) and cook the
egg mixture to 160°F, which will destroy harmful bacteria in a few
seconds. Adequate cooking brings eggs and other foods to a temperature
high enough to destroy bacteria that might be present."
<http://www.enc-online.org/f_a_q.htm>

Pastorio

Bob (this one) wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
>> Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there is
>> very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
>> egg yolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
>> putting them away.
>
> You're wasting your time with that bleach exercise. It's not the outside
> of the shell that's the problem.

Wait. You raise your own, right? In that case, I take that bleach
comment back. I thought that you were talking about commercial eggs.

Sorry.

Pastorio

> Salmonella contamination is inside the
> egg. Chickens are laying eggs with the salmonella already included.
>
> But not very many of them. I've seen estimates from professional sources
> that say the range is anywhere from 1 in 10,000 to 1 in 20,000. The odds
> are very low.
>
>> Yes, I did get salmonella once but it was from eating a raw egg that
>> had been slightly cracked so was contaminated. It was carelessness on
>> my part as I knew better.
>
> Cracked eggs can be contaminated by outside bacteria entering the crack
> and prospering. I don't ever use them. For anything. But it's probably
> more an aesthetic judgement than bacteriological wisdom.
>
>> I've eaten hundreds of raw eggs over the years as I actually prefer
>> the yolks raw, or mininally cooked.
>
> Minimally cooked, like to something over 150°F where it's still runny,
> has killed any salmonella in there.
>
>> And they seem to be easir to digest. ;-)
>
> Personal judgement.
>
> Pastorio

In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote:

> Bob (this one) wrote:
> > OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> >
> >> Honestly, if the shell is intact and you disinfect the shell, there is
> >> very little danger from FRESH, properly treated (refrigerated) raw
> >> egg yolk. I soak my eggs in a 10% bleach solution for a bit before
> >> putting them away.
> >
> > You're wasting your time with that bleach exercise. It's not the outside
> > of the shell that's the problem.
>
> Wait. You raise your own, right? In that case, I take that bleach
> comment back. I thought that you were talking about commercial eggs.
>
> Sorry.
>
> Pastorio

Yes, I do.
They are first cleaned of any gross dirt, then disinfected.

There are some folks on the poultry lists that argue this point with me,
but I've no intention of stopping it.

It also increased hatch rates when I used to hatch eggs. Fewer
"incubator bombs". <G>

Cheers!
--
Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

On Sat, 08 Oct 2005 23:16:39 -0400,
wrote:

>On Thu, 06 Oct 2005 17:20:47 +0200, Nathalie Chiva
> wrote:
>
>>Very small quantity of sour cream and olive oil, so yes, it's
>>relatively light. And most importantly, it has a light "feel", I can't
>>eat too much of the regular steak tartare (with ketchup and eggs), it
>
>Ketchup in steak tartare...I've never heard of such a thing. Is this some thing
>local/regional to Switzerland?

No, if you look up recipes on the web (at least the French ones) they
pretty much all mention it.

Nathalie in Switzerland