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Can I put a frozen roast in crock pot?
I was going to have pot roast tomorrow, but I've changed my mind and
would rather have it today. I moved it from the freezer to the fridge last night, so it's still mostly frozen. Can I pop it into the crock pot just the same? Will it thaw quickly and then cook about the same between now and dinner time? |
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>I wouldn't count on it. However, you can put it (still wrapped in the >plastic) in a sink filled with cold (not hot!) water Thanks! Glad I asked. Our microwave's defrost setting sucks. It always cooks the outside of the food, and leaves the inside frozen. |
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On Sat, 08 Oct 2005 15:11:19 GMT,
" <> wrote: > I was going to have pot roast tomorrow, but I've changed my mind and > would rather have it today. > > I moved it from the freezer to the fridge last night, so it's still > mostly frozen. Can I pop it into the crock pot just the same? Will > it thaw quickly and then cook about the same between now and dinner > time? Plan on more cooking time, so you'd better start immediately. http://www.crockpot.com/hints.html Cook recipes containing frozen meats for an additional 4 to 6 hours on Low, or an additional 2 hours on High. |
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jmcquown wrote:
> > > I don't like defrosting in the microwave, no matter what the setting. You > have to watch it too closely, depending upon the size of the item and the > power of the microwave. If you ever get a new oven buy a Panasonic. Our old oven (that cost $500+) died last year after a good run. Picked up a $70 Panasonic with "Turbo inverter" to replace it. Not only does the oven work much better than the old one the defrost is near perfect. It deoesn't cook the edges and uniformly thaws anything we have tried including tricky items like the leftover bagels that recover and seem just like before they were frozen (no hardspots or dry areas). > > I've got a 2 lb. flank steak defrosting in cold water. I should still have > time to marinate it in teriyaki with ginger, garlic, pepper, onion, a little > sherry and a dash of oil and get it on the grill before the sun sets  If> not, I'll just marinate it overnight in the fridge. This was a last minute > craving based on the nice weather. > > Jill > > |
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On Sat, 08 Oct 2005 15:11:19 GMT,
" <> wrote: >I was going to have pot roast tomorrow, but I've changed my mind and >would rather have it today. > >I moved it from the freezer to the fridge last night, so it's still >mostly frozen. Can I pop it into the crock pot just the same? Will >it thaw quickly and then cook about the same between now and dinner >time? Make sure to add a cup of mushroom soup and a quarter pack of dry onion soup mix. When replying by email please leave this signature intact. |
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On Sat, 08 Oct 2005 15:58:03 GMT,
" <> wrote: > > >>I wouldn't count on it. However, you can put it (still wrapped in the >>plastic) in a sink filled with cold (not hot!) water > >Thanks! Glad I asked. >Our microwave's defrost setting sucks. It always cooks the outside of >the food, and leaves the inside frozen. I've had good luck defrosting things using the Nathan's griddle. I suspect just about any fair-sized heavy-gauge aluminum sheet would work, given how well AL conducts heat. -- -denny- "I don't like it when a whole state starts acting like a marital aid." "John R. Campbell" in a Usenet post. |
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zxcvbob wrote: > wrote: > > I was going to have pot roast tomorrow, but I've changed my mind and > > would rather have it today. > > > > I moved it from the freezer to the fridge last night, so it's still > > mostly frozen. Can I pop it into the crock pot just the same? Will > > it thaw quickly and then cook about the same between now and dinner > > time? > > > I do that frequently with an electric roaster. A crockpot will take a > long time, so if you start it today it still may not be ready until > breakfast tomorrow. And it may not provide enough heat to keep it from > spoiling when it's half warm and half frozen. > > It might be better to put it in the oven at about 400 until it browns a > little, then cover it and turn the heat down to 300 and continue cooking > -- the reason being that the initial high temperature cooking will kill > the bacteria in the meat surface to make sure it doesn't spoil when the > outside is warm and the center still partially frozen. > > How was that for a non-answer? ;-) If you're going to go through all that... lighting the oven, dirtying a pan... may as well just finish it in the oven. Situations like this are why no one to date has ever convinced me that slow cookers are any more useful than an electric knife... although I did read once where someone bought an old slow cooker from the local Salvation Army store for $2 just so they could use it to serve hot wet finger towels... but then I hear-tell electric knives are good for slicing through styrofoam... so there you go, even-steven. Sheldon |
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Sheldon wrote:
> zxcvbob wrote: > wrote: >> >>>I was going to have pot roast tomorrow, but I've changed my mind and >>>would rather have it today. >>> >>>I moved it from the freezer to the fridge last night, so it's still >>>mostly frozen. Can I pop it into the crock pot just the same? Will >>>it thaw quickly and then cook about the same between now and dinner >>>time? >> >> >>I do that frequently with an electric roaster. A crockpot will take a >>long time, so if you start it today it still may not be ready until >>breakfast tomorrow. And it may not provide enough heat to keep it from >>spoiling when it's half warm and half frozen. >> >>It might be better to put it in the oven at about 400 until it browns a >>little, then cover it and turn the heat down to 300 and continue cooking >>-- the reason being that the initial high temperature cooking will kill >>the bacteria in the meat surface to make sure it doesn't spoil when the >>outside is warm and the center still partially frozen. >> >>How was that for a non-answer? ;-) > > > If you're going to go through all that... lighting the oven, dirtying a > pan... may as well just finish it in the oven. I was talking about finishing it in the oven. (maybe that wasn't clear) However, an electric roaster is the way to roast a big and/or frozen hunk of meat if you don't want to use the oven. They are especially good for roasting turkeys. Bob |
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Oh my goodness! Absolutely NOT! You may not cook frozen foods in a
crock pot. The temperature danger zone for bacteria is above 40-degrees (F) and below 140-degrees. When protein-rich foods are in this zone, bacterial growth within those foods is exponential. It is imperative that foods move through this zone (when heating or cooling) as quickly as possible. You will be adding anywhere from 4 to 6 additional hours to the roast's cooking time, with most of those minutes being well within the danger zone. You will be hosting a bacterial feeding frenzy. -Ron |
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George wrote:
> jmcquown wrote: > >> >> >> I don't like defrosting in the microwave, no matter what the >> setting. You have to watch it too closely, depending upon the size >> of the item and the power of the microwave. > > > If you ever get a new oven buy a Panasonic. Our old oven (that cost > $500+) died last year after a good run. Picked up a $70 Panasonic with > "Turbo inverter" to replace it. Not only does the oven work much > better > than the old one the defrost is near perfect. It deoesn't cook the > edges > and uniformly thaws anything we have tried including tricky items like > the leftover bagels that recover and seem just like before they were > frozen (no hardspots or dry areas). > One day I'll buy a new microwave oven and will keep this in mind. Mine (Sharp) isn't that old; I bought it about 6 years ago. I still don't like it as well as the one I had in the 1980's; that oven could do anything. Wouldn't have surprised me if it walked into my bedroom and told me to get ready for work! Now I have a cat that wakes me up. She doesn't cook, though. Jill |
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jmcquown wrote: > George wrote: > > jmcquown wrote: > > > >> > >> > >> I don't like defrosting in the microwave, no matter what the > >> setting. You have to watch it too closely, depending upon the size > >> of the item and the power of the microwave. > > > > > > If you ever get a new oven buy a Panasonic. Our old oven (that cost > > $500+) died last year after a good run. Picked up a $70 Panasonic with > > "Turbo inverter" to replace it. Not only does the oven work much > > better > > than the old one the defrost is near perfect. It deoesn't cook the > > edges > > and uniformly thaws anything we have tried including tricky items like > > the leftover bagels that recover and seem just like before they were > > frozen (no hardspots or dry areas). > > > One day I'll buy a new microwave oven and will keep this in mind. Mine > (Sharp) isn't that old; I bought it about 6 years ago. I still don't like > it as well as the one I had in the 1980's; that oven could do anything. > Wouldn't have surprised me if it walked into my bedroom and told me to get > ready for work! Your new "Sharp" microave is kinda retarded... were it a "Sheldon" it would have got into bed with you and said "screw work"! hehe Sheldon |
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MasturbaterChef wrote: > Oh my goodness! Absolutely NOT! You may not cook frozen foods in a > crock pot. The temperature danger zone for bacteria is above 40-degrees > (F) and below 140-degrees. When protein-rich foods are in this zone, > bacterial growth within those foods is exponential. It is imperative > that foods move through this zone (when heating or cooling) as quickly > as possible. That's not necessarily so with roasts, only the exterior is susceptible, the interior is sterile... were a roast first pan/oven browned, whether thawed or frozen, it should be perfectly safe to finish in a slow cooker... in fact I'd be far more leery of cooking a thawed roast in a slow cooker without browning it first, could take two whole days to properly thaw a roast, a very suseptible time. You're no kinda chef, you're not even worthy of being a scullery rat. Sheldon |
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Sheldon,
You are in sorry need of education! Perhaps you would care to explain to your viewers how it is that stuffed, raw turkeys are a source of danger? After all, your premise is that only exteriors are a source of trouble? Bacteria needs moisture, protein, a moderate to slightly acidic ph, and warm temperatures to breed. A crock pot (or turkey cavity) is an ideal breeding ground! |
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FrenchChef wrote:
> Sheldon, > > You are in sorry need of education! Perhaps you would care to explain > to your viewers how it is that stuffed, raw turkeys are a source of > danger? After all, your premise is that only exteriors are a source of > trouble? Bacteria needs moisture, protein, a moderate to slightly > acidic ph, and warm temperatures to breed. A crock pot (or turkey > cavity) is an ideal breeding ground! > The cavity of a turkey is an exterior surface; you are intentionally misinterpreting what sheldoon said. Also, the original poster was asking about a "pot roast", not a whole bird (especially not a stuffed one.) That being said, I don't know if a crockpot provides enough energy to heat the exterior of a roast out of the danger zone while the interior is still frozen -- or to thaw the whole thing quickly enough that it thaws and then moves out of the danger zone before the surface can spoil. The worst case is that the surface bacteria grow explosively and are then killed by the heat, but were active long enough to ruin the taste of the meat and *perhaps* produce heat-stable toxins. For example, staphylococcus toxin is heat-stable. Cooking frozen meat in the oven or in an electric roaster works just fine. A crockpot will do it too, but *might* not heat fast enough to be safe. I wouldn't even cook a stuffed turkey in the oven unless the stuffing went in warm-to-hot, and I'm not much of a germ-phobic. Best regards, Bob |
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zxcvbob wrote:
> That being said, I don't know if a crockpot provides enough energy to > heat the exterior of a roast out of the danger zone while the interior > is still frozen -- or to thaw the whole thing quickly enough that it > thaws and then moves out of the danger zone before the surface can > spoil. The worst case is that the surface bacteria grow explosively and > are then killed by the heat, but were active long enough to ruin the > taste of the meat and *perhaps* produce heat-stable toxins. For > example, staphylococcus toxin is heat-stable. Bob, I have no clue either but from your text, I'd love to see a time-lapse cartoon animation of it!  Thanks, -- Andy http://tinyurl.com/dzl7h |
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Andy wrote: > zxcvbob wrote: > > > That being said, I don't know if a crockpot provides enough energy to > > heat the exterior of a roast out of the danger zone while the interior > > is still frozen -- or to thaw the whole thing quickly enough that it > > thaws and then moves out of the danger zone before the surface can > > spoil. The worst case is that the surface bacteria grow explosively > and > > are then killed by the heat, but were active long enough to ruin the > > taste of the meat and *perhaps* produce heat-stable toxins. For > > example, staphylococcus toxin is heat-stable. > > I have no clue either but from your text, I'd love to see a time-lapse > cartoon animation of it! Look in the mirror. Sheldon |
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Sheldon wrote:
> Andy wrote: > > zxcvbob wrote: > > > > > That being said, I don't know if a crockpot provides enough energy to > > > heat the exterior of a roast out of the danger zone while the interior > > > is still frozen -- or to thaw the whole thing quickly enough that it > > > thaws and then moves out of the danger zone before the surface can > > > spoil. The worst case is that the surface bacteria grow explosively > > and > > > are then killed by the heat, but were active long enough to ruin the > > > taste of the meat and *perhaps* produce heat-stable toxins. For > > > example, staphylococcus toxin is heat-stable. How much heat and how stable? I've never heard that before. Do you have some more info? Now with Mad Cow disease, those prions are indestructible but that's another issue. That's scary. Even sterilization in an autoclave won't get rid of Mad Cow's prions. And about the notion that one must achieve a certain temperature for safety. That I often read. But I also read that one can cook those vacuum packs, sous vide cuisine, for, oh, how many 30 minutes at only 140 F? Yes, I'm not kidding, 140 Fahrenheit for turkey with 7% fat! Fascinating. But these are professional chefs whose careers depend on not killing the customers http://www.fsis.usda.gov/OPPDE/rdad/...try_Tables.pdf The USDA is a good resource and has worked out lethality tables for bacteria and certain cooking conditions. The fat level is critical for determining cooking time. Now how does one determine the fat level of a turkey? Vegetables don't have this problem. |
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replied to zxcvbob:
>> That being said, I don't know if a crockpot provides enough energy to >> heat the exterior of a roast out of the danger zone while the interior >> is still frozen -- or to thaw the whole thing quickly enough that it >> thaws and then moves out of the danger zone before the surface can >> spoil. The worst case is that the surface bacteria grow explosively >> and are then killed by the heat, but were active long enough to ruin the >> taste of the meat and *perhaps* produce heat-stable toxins. For >> example, staphylococcus toxin is heat-stable. > > How much heat and how stable? I've never heard that before. Do you have > some more info? Now with Mad Cow disease, those prions are > indestructible but that's another issue. That's scary. Even > sterilization in an autoclave won't get rid of Mad Cow's prions. He was talking about the toxins thrown off by the bacteria, not about the bacteria themselves. From http://www.nzfsa.govt.nz/science/dat...cus-aureus.pdf "Toxins are extremely resistant to heat. For example, the D time of enterotoxin B at 149°C is 100 min at an a(w) of .99 and 225 min at an a(w) of .90." Bob |
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Can I put a frozen roast in crock pot?
Bob Terwilliger wrote: > He was talking about the toxins thrown off by the bacteria, not about the > bacteria themselves. From > http://www.nzfsa.govt.nz/science/dat...cus-aureus.pdf > > "Toxins are extremely resistant to heat. For example, the D time of > enterotoxin B at 149°C is 100 min at an a(w) of .99 and 225 min at an a(w) > of .90." Thanks, that's a good URL. So the little poisons can be naughty. And all this time I thought the toxins were not too important. I gather from reading that PDF, it's the staph which is really deadly. Is that article saying the toxins are as deadly as wild growth of S. aureus? And S. aureus is a facultative anaerobic bacteria mostly? It's found in the mouths of humans but generally does not do much harm although it's gram negative and birds are gram positive so be careful when you kiss your pet birds! You can kill them theoretically with the S. aureus. At this point, someone will say cook your birds but I found it difficult to enjoy chicken around a white cockatoo parrot. Just seemed too close for comfort. In any event, the toxin is extremely difficult to kill so it would be nice if it were not that important in food poisoning. Can you give me some more clues on this? |
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