On 19 Nov 2005, Sheldon wrote:

>
> jmcquown wrote:
> > Elaine Parrish wrote:
> > > On Thu, 17 Nov 2005, Christine Dabney wrote:
> > >
> > >> Okay folks,
> > >>
> > >> We were chatting on the chat channel, and we started talking bout
> > >> butter beans. I grew up in VA, and I had them all the time. To me,
> > >> they are smaller than a lima, and a pale green. And they stay that
> > >> way when they are cooked. Boli agrees with this description of them.
> > >>
> > >> Others in the discussion say they are much larger, and tan. Or buff
> > >> or khaki colored.
> > >>
> > >> I have never seen butter beans like that...
> > >>
> > >> For those of you who know about butter beans, what is your
> > >> description of them?
> > >>
> > >> Christine
> > >>
> > >
> > > 'Round here, a butter bean is a big, plump, cream-colored, kinda
> > > half-moon-shaped (like the lima) bean about the size of an average
> > > thumb nail on a man
> > >
> > > The lima bean is a medium sized (about the size of the index finger
> > > nail), grass-green, plump bean. The sizes vary because all the beans
> > > (two, three, or four) in the pod don't mature at the same time. If
> > > picked very young, they can be as tiny as the tip of the little
> > > finger (much like the difference in size in "young, green peas" and
> > > regular green peas).
> > >
> > > The Fordhook lima is a large, plump, green, tougher-skin-than-a-lima,
> > > bean about the size of the butter bean above.
> > >
> > > Then there is a little (smaller than the lima) and more round than
> > > half moon thing that is light green and some are so light green as to
> > > look white and some can be a combination of light green and lighter
> > > green. We call this a butter pea (not a butter bean).
> > >
> > > There is also a brown butter bean, called a speckled butter bean,
> > > that is a tad bigger than a regular lima and is "speckled"
> > >
> > >
> > > The big, cream-colored butter beans aren't seen very often in stores
> > > around here. They
> > > come canned, but they are not good, because they are hard (or this has
> > > been the case with the only few brands I have ever found that offered
> > > them, which haven't been very many; Bush's comes to mind.). They come
> > > dried, but they don't reconstitute well and when cooked, the casing
> > > (the part that holds the soft insides (just like the insides of the
> > > lima bean) separates and the insides come out. Because they are soft,
> > > they just thicken the cooking water. The casing stays intact, but it
> > > is empty. So, they don't make a side dish like limas do. Of
> > > course, cooked with a little ham and poured over a bowl of cornbread
> > > dotted with raw chopped red onions or spring onions, this "soup" is
> > > mighty good on a cold winter's day.
> > >
> > > I have never seen them frozen. hmmmm
> > >
> > > We had them when I was a kid, but we grew them in the garden.
> > >
> > > Elaine, too
> >
> > I've never read a better description of butter beans! Thanks, Elaine! Yep,
> > Bush's makes canned large butter beens. I've never seen them frozen,
> > either. They are definitely bigger than even a Fordhook lima bean and are
> > tan/yellow.
>
> Couldn't have bean a more inaccurate description... once again for the
> IQ impaired, butter bean (hillybilly vernacular) is exactly precisely
> synonymous with lima bean. All beans are graded so naturally they can
> be found in various sizes, but size has nothing to do with anything,
> they're the same bean. With limas there are either babys or fordhooks;
> different type of lima. Either type can be mottled; hybridized.

Yes, Sheldon, I understand that, for the last 10 years, every time there
is a topic you wish to address, you run to the internet, Google, and copy
and paste what ever it says, and post it to the group. That's fine and
many times you impart some nice information - especially when you are in
your Dr. Jekyll persona. When you are in your Mr. Hyde persona, your
posts disintegrate considerably - usually to curse words and name calling.
We know you are doing the best you can with what you have to work with.
And, yes, you're the family pet - kinda like Cujo - and we love you.
Although, some days, I wish you could actually catch one of those cars you
chase.

Whereas, a "butter bean" may well be in the Lima family and may be a
variation, a "butter bean" is distinct from the commonly accepted green
lima bean, just as a Fordhook is different from the commonly accepted
green lima. The Fordhook is not just a lima bean that is left on the vine
to grow bigger. The butter bean is not just a little green lima bean that
has matured.


To say that a butter bean is "exactly precisely synonymous" with a lima
bean is to say that you have never eaten one. It is to say that Granny
Smith apples are "exactly precisely synonymous" with Red Delicious apples
because both are apples, or Ribeye steak is "exactly precisely synonymous"
with round steak because both are steak, or any of the other millions of
things that share a common name or category. Even a bell pepper, in its
different stages of maturity, is not "exactly precisely synonymous" with
its other stages.

The beans and peas I outlined in my post are all distinctly different in
texture and in taste and each comes from a seed that is different in size,
shape, and coloring. Having picked, shelled, and eaten them cooked fresh
from the garden, I can say that they are very different, whether they are
in the same botanical family or not. They are not stages of the little
green-colored bean we commonly know as a lima. One does not plant the seed
of the little green lima bean and get speckled butter beans as a
aberration. I've shelled too many of both.

All one need do is buy a can of beans labeled "lima" and a can of beans
labeled "butter beans" and pour them out into a bowl and look at them.
They are not "exactly precisely synonymous", IQ and hillbilly vernacular
notwithstanding. You said you bought two cans of butter beans and they
were awful. If you bought two cans of butter beans and opened the cans,
then you would have seen that they don't look at all like a can of beans
labeled "lima" (they don't taste the same, either). Is this how you drew
the conclusion that butter beans and lima beans are "exactly precisely
synonymous"? You read that "exactly precisely synonymous" part on the
internet. Then you bought two cans of butter beans and looked at them and
tasted of them, determined that they were awful. Did they look like little
green lima beans? Did they taste like little green lima beans? Had you
made the comparison, your answers would be "no". So you are saying that
you decided that your
eyes and your taste buds lied to you and that, because the internet said,
"exactly precisely synonymous", that must be the truth? Did you buy
Fordhooks, speckled butter beans, and butter peas, too, (and wax beans,
that you referenced) and decide that
what you see and taste is a lie, but what you read is the truth? Empirical
evidence should not be so lightly dismissed. It makes us too much like
the herd animals. Must have been your Mr. Hyde day. Logic has eluded you.

Butter beans (save Bush's efforts and perhaps a few other canners) have
gone the way of Creasy greens, Polk Salad, and cultured butter - probably
for the very reasons outlined in this thread, including the lack of an
sufficient way to preserve them. The lack of cultured butter is a mystery
to me, save it being an acquired taste.

If this reaches you on your Dr. Jekyll day, good for me. If it reaches you
on your Mr. Hyde day... sic, cujo, sic. I know your dealing the best way
you can.

Elaine, too













>
> Frozen limas/butter beans are readily available in most
> stupidmarkets... and many brands, from generic, to store brands, to
> name brands, to Birdseye.
>
> I recenty tried Bush's canned butter beans (bought 2 cans last week -
> on sale at half price - must be a new product promotional), just
> awful... but then again I don't care for any Bush's products... their
> beans are way over cooked and much too watery.... there are very few
> butter beans in those cans, it's mostly water, the beans are mushy and
> most are broken with their skins floating about like so many toenail
> clippings, and did I mention *salty*... Bush's products are also
> typically over priced.
>
> http://www.birdseyefoods.com/birdsey...yLimaBeans14oz
>
> http://www.foodsubs.com/Beans.html#lima
>
> lima bean = butter bean = Madagascar bean = wax bean Pronunciation:
> LIE-muh Notes: With their buttery flavor, lima beans are great in
> soups or stews, or on their own as a side dish. The most popular
> varieties are the small baby lima bean = sieva bean and the larger
> Fordhooks. You can get limas fresh in their pods in the summer, but
> many people prefer to use dried lima beans. Shelled frozen limas are a
> good substitute for fresh, but canned limas aren't nearly as good. The
> biggest downside is that lima beans are harder to digest than other
> beans. Substitutes: fresh lima beans OR fava beans (more flavorful)
> OR soybeans
> ---
>
> Sheldon Legume
>
>

Elaine Parrish wrote:
>
> Yes, Sheldon, I understand that, for the last 10 years, every time there
> is a topic you wish to address, you run to the internet, Google, and copy
> and paste what ever it says, and post it to the group.

You're lying already and it's only the very begining of your fercocktah
diatribe... there was no Google ten years ago... LIAR!

Educated folks cite varifiable references to back up their claims, have
you never read a professional journal... Elaine, you are obviously
uneducated.

<snipped mass verbiage>

You're incorrect in each and every instance.

Elaine, the fact that you need so much verbiage to say nothing, and
certainly nothing you can back up other than with your own hot air
proves you're truly a mental midget as well as having severe
psychiatric issues.

The only good reason for the the use of the expression "butter bean" is
to distinguish the six fingered southern trash from normal folks.

http://www.americanbean.org/BeanVarieties/Home.htm

Large Lima
Flat-shaped, white-colored beans
Smooth, creamy, sweet flavor
Also known as Butter Beans
Popular as a sidedish or added to soups and casseroles
---

Sheldon AKA penmart

On 19 Nov 2005, Sheldon wrote:

>
> Elaine Parrish wrote:
> >
> > Yes, Sheldon, I understand that, for the last 10 years, every time there
> > is a topic you wish to address, you run to the internet, Google, and copy
> > and paste what ever it says, and post it to the group.
>
> You're lying already and it's only the very begining of your fercocktah
> diatribe... there was no Google ten years ago... LIAR!

hehe. You are right. You didn't Google. You went to Archie and FTP'ed.
Then you progressed to whatever search engine was of the moment. I must
commend you on evolving. It's the only evolution you've made in ten years.


>
> Educated folks cite varifiable references to back up their claims, have
> you never read a professional journal... Elaine, you are obviously
> uneducated.


hahahaha. That's a good one.

This is a newsgroup, my dear Mr. Hyde. The premise is that people come
together to share experiences. We all have access to the internet search
engines and to encyclopedias. We're not writing a scholarly paper here.
We're sharing experiences and empirical research.


Have you ever written a scholarly paper, Sheldon? I'm not trying to be
bellicose, Sheldon - just curious. You seem to put such stock in research
and cites, but you don't seem to have a personal body of knowledge or any
empirical research. You quote some very good information sometimes, but
you never seem to contribute any empirical information or personal
experiences relating to this group's topic. Admittedly, I usually skip
your posts these days because the fine Dr. Jekyll posts seem to be few and
far between the Mr. Hyde rantings. I don't care for your Mr. Hyde persona,
but have, and probably will, continue to defend your right to have it. You
said once, a long time ago, that you were an honorable man. I found that
to be true in Dr. Jekyll, but I don't ever see any honor in Mr. Hyde or in
Cujo, the devil dog. Is honor only a part-time endeavor?

You say that I am uneducated because I don't quote cites. Would you
consider a person educated simply because he/she quoted cites? I would not
make that assumption. It seems that you think educated people are better
than those that are not educated. Is that true?
Is one a better person if one holds a degree? And, better still if one
holds a higher degree? Is that the true measure of a man (or woman)?

In what field do you hold a degree, Sheldon? Again, I'm not trying to be
bellicose, just curious.

What if I held a degree, would your statements that using
cites would prove education and that I am uneducated because I don't cite
every post be false, and therefore, you'd be wrong? Would you then amend
your statement to say something else, which on its face, would invalidate
your original statement? Do you have a cite that supports either of your
statements? You can't talk about lima beans without a cite, because
"Educated folks cite varifiable references to back up their claims", but
you claim that " Educated folks cite varifiable references to back up
their claims" and that I am uneducated because I don't, without any cite
at all. So, which are you, Sheldon, educated or uneducated?



>
> <snipped mass verbiage>
<snipped>
>
> Elaine, the fact that you need so much verbiage to say nothing, and
> certainly nothing you can back up other than with your own hot air
> proves you're truly a mental midget as well as having severe
> psychiatric issues.
>

haha. Well, at least I can write excessive verbiage without running out of
vocabulary and resorting to paragraphs of curse words, gutter language,
and junior high tatics. So I'd say that in the world of mental midgets, I
am taller than you are.

"Nothing" often lies in the eye of the beholder.
When one has nothing with which to see, one often sees nothing.

I do defer to you on the matter of psychiatric issues. I've never known
anyone with as much first-hand, personal experience from the inside out as
you.


> The only good reason for the the use of the expression "butter bean" is
> to distinguish the six fingered southern trash from normal folks.

I encountered some of those kinds of people when I lived in North Alabama.
It was extremely odd to see people with six fingers or six toes or webbed
fingers. I've seen a few oddities in my life. I think my experiences with
six fingered southern trash served me well since I met you. Gross oddities
aren't always external.

Were you born with this Jekyll/Hyde personality or do you just play
one on the internet? I'm not trying to be bellicose, really, Sheldon. Is
it something you choose? If so, why? You've been so consistent over the
years, that it seems hard to believe it is not real. That must be a
difficult way to live. You seem so angry and defensive most the time.
I'm sorry for you.

Elaine, too

Sheldon wrote:
> Elaine Parrish wrote:
>
>>Yes, Sheldon, I understand that, for the last 10 years, every time there
>>is a topic you wish to address, you run to the internet, Google, and copy
>>and paste what ever it says, and post it to the group.

> The only good reason for the the use of the expression "butter bean" is
> to distinguish the six fingered southern trash from normal folks.
>
> http://www.americanbean.org/BeanVarieties/Home.htm
>
> Large Lima
> Flat-shaped, white-colored beans
> Smooth, creamy, sweet flavor
> Also known as Butter Beans
> Popular as a sidedish or added to soups and casseroles

<LOL> He didn't even read it. It says "large lima" not "Fordhook" or
"Baby" which he said, yesterday, were the only two types of limas. It
says "white-colored beans." Limas are green. The picture shows *white*
beans.

Bwah...

Pastorio

Very well expressed, Elaine.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
_____________________________________________

A chicken in every pot is a *LOT* of chicken!

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> Very well expressed, Elaine.

Lookin' to get in that hillybilly slut's pants, eh... you're as
ignorant.

Sheldon