On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 19:00:28 -0500, The Cook >
wrote:

> Michael Odom's wife is on South Beach. He has posted some menus and
> recipes of things he made for her.

Thank you ... I'll look for them!

Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.
>
> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.
>
> Carol


Dh, DD, and I were on it last winter. Daughter lost 65 lb. and kept it
off. DH and I lost a bit but fell off the wagon hard when we went to
Hawaii in June. We are talking about getting back on.

I have the SBD book and cookbook as well as some carb counting guides.

Let me know if I can help.

gloria p

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 01:41:35 GMT, Puester >
wrote:

> Dh, DD, and I were on it last winter. Daughter lost 65 lb. and kept it
> off. DH and I lost a bit but fell off the wagon hard when we went to
> Hawaii in June. We are talking about getting back on.
>
> I have the SBD book and cookbook as well as some carb counting guides.
>
> Let me know if I can help.

Thanks, Gloria! MaryL and you are very generous. I look forward to
"working" with you both. Best wishes on your re-start. )

Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 04:32:11 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
>> I posted a fairly lengthy reply to your message in
>> alt.support.diet.low-carb (although you are correct that the
>> majority seem to be Atkins). I find SB very easy to follow --
>> basically, you should look at the list of "foods to enjoy" and
>> "foods to avoid" for Phases 1 and 2. I simply select from those
>> lists, and it has been exceptionally (after the first 2 weeks, which
>> are very rigid -- but sticking to Phase 1 really did eliminate my
>> old cravings for carbs). I also have diabetes, and SB has been a
>> tremendous help to me. As I explained in my other message, I have
>> also eliminated *all* pasta, flour, rice, potatoes, and added sugar
>> (and that goes beyond SB but has had a clear beneficial effect on my
>> glucose readings, which are now always in the "normal" range without
>> any medication).
>
> Thank you, Mary. It looks like you're the only person I can talk to
> in the other group who'll understand. I'm glad you're here, too. It's
> hard to lower your nasty fats when everyone around you is encouraging
> you to eat fatty meats, etc.
>
> I do thank you for the post you made in asdlc. I was thinking of just
> talking to you in e-mail, since the guidelines of Atkins and SBD are
> so different. I'll be in touch as I have questions.
>
> Can't wait for my large print book to arrive.
>
> Thanks again, Mary!
> Carol

I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and losing
weight. It might work but what are you doing to your arteries? Having two
parents who have had to have surgery for arterial blockages due to
cholesterol (and they weren't even *trying* to eat nothing but fat) it just
doesn't make sense. It does make sense to balance your diet and not eat NO
fat but not eat all fat.

Carol, while I was at the drug store waiting for a prescription I bought a
paperback copy of The South Beach Diet. Can't wait to read it and see what
it says.

I love vegetables but they must be cooked; you know me, I don't like salads
and cold food... and since my refrigerator died that isn't a problem! Of
course I'm joking, but I did have to throw a lot of stuff out. Yikes.

Anyway, can't wait for a good read and verification that what I've been
doing all these years is actually *good*

Jill

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 20:51:28 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:

> I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and losing
> weight. It might work but what are you doing to your arteries? Having two
> parents who have had to have surgery for arterial blockages due to
> cholesterol (and they weren't even *trying* to eat nothing but fat) it just
> doesn't make sense. It does make sense to balance your diet and not eat NO
> fat but not eat all fat.

I'm not sure which diet you're talking about. I've never, ever heard
of an all fat diet.

Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 20:51:28 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > wrote:
>
>> I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and losing
>> weight. It might work but what are you doing to your arteries?
>> Having two parents who have had to have surgery for arterial
>> blockages due to cholesterol (and they weren't even *trying* to eat
>> nothing but fat) it just doesn't make sense. It does make sense to
>> balance your diet and not eat NO fat but not eat all fat.
>
> I'm not sure which diet you're talking about. I've never, ever heard
> of an all fat diet.
>
> Carol

Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.

Jill

jmcquown wrote:

> The patting everyone on the back made it look like a public Alcoholics
> Anonymous meeting. The idea of "games" makes me think of those ridiculous
> things they made us do in Corporate America called "team building". Rah
> rah, shish-koom-ba stuff. Um. No, comment.


Yeah, that team building crapola - "Hey gang, are we ready for recess
or our milk and cookies or a nap!?" Sheesh...tawk about
infantilisation!


A friend of mine has had good success with WW, he's very good at
sticking to the plan. The meetings he says though can get to be a bit
of a bore (but then he's a flight attendant and can put up with
virtually anything lol...). Last year Princess Fergie (formerly know
as "The Princess of Pork") was in town shilling for WW and she
attended one of his meetings (a totoal surprise). She was very nice
and down - to - earth and she swears by WW so it must work okay I guess
;-)

--
Best
Greg

In article >,
"jmcquown" > wrote:

> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> > On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 20:51:28 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > > wrote:
> >
> >> I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and losing
> >> weight. It might work but what are you doing to your arteries?
> >> Having two parents who have had to have surgery for arterial
> >> blockages due to cholesterol (and they weren't even *trying* to eat
> >> nothing but fat) it just doesn't make sense. It does make sense to
> >> balance your diet and not eat NO fat but not eat all fat.
> >
> > I'm not sure which diet you're talking about. I've never, ever heard
> > of an all fat diet.
> >
> > Carol
>
> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.


That's quite an exaggeration. I could agree that it involves more high
fat meats than some other diets.

Of course, diets are a funny thing. There are the vegetarians who eat
fish and chicken. I believe that there are in fact people who say they
are on "Atkins" who see it as a license to eat all the meat and fat that
they want, without actually bothering to find out what the diet is about.

I've about given up on diets, not that I ever followed one. I took a
diabetes class some years back. We were supposed to eat carbs, lots of
them. They were on the bottom of the food pyramid, the basis of the
diet. So I took another class a few years later, when my blood glucose
went out of control. It was taught by the same teacher. Now it's low
carbs. So a student asks, just what *are* we supposed to eat? That had
her stumped. She finally blurted out, "vegetables!".

Now, I do watch my diet, but I just don't know what to believe.

What I finally hit upon was to walk three hours a day. Doesn't have
much to do with diet, but it seems to work. Besides, I really like to
walk.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:

> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> > On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 20:51:28 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > > wrote:
> >
> >> I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and losing
> >> weight. It might work but what are you doing to your arteries?
> >> Having two parents who have had to have surgery for arterial
> >> blockages due to cholesterol (and they weren't even *trying* to eat
> >> nothing but fat) it just doesn't make sense. It does make sense to
> >> balance your diet and not eat NO fat but not eat all fat.
> >
> > I'm not sure which diet you're talking about. I've never, ever heard
> > of an all fat diet.
>
> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.

Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
poultry, eggs, cheese.

Where did you hear that?

Carol

Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown" >
wrote:

> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.

Okay, I can't just let this drop (nothin' on you, Jill).

When I was on Atkins and lost 40 pounds my typical daily menu went
something like this:

BREAKFAST
Omelette OR
Plain yogurt sweetened and flavored with DaVinci coffee syrups
(sugar-free)

LUNCH
1/4 head of iceburg lettuce
Olive oil, red wine vinegar, and Italian seasoning dressing
Chicken breast, hamburger patty, etc.

DINNER
Steak, pork chop, chicken breast, etc.
Fill the rest of the plate with a huge mound of broccoli

SNACKS
Deviled eggs
Mozzarella cheese sticks
Beef jerky (sugar free)

I was eating way fewer carbs than what Atkins allows, because I was
trying to match my eating to the diabetes meds I was on. After I've
been on South Beach for awhile, and have fairly consistent blood
glucose readings, my doctor is going to adjust the meds according to
what I am actually eating.

Today I developed symptoms of a problem that some of us ladies get
when our blood sugars are too high. So, the hell with the party on
Sunday. I'm starting first thing in the morning.

Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > wrote:
>
>> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>>> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 20:51:28 -0600, "jmcquown"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and
>>>> losing weight. It might work but what are you doing to your
>>>> arteries? Having two parents who have had to have surgery for
>>>> arterial blockages due to cholesterol (and they weren't even
>>>> *trying* to eat nothing but fat) it just doesn't make sense. It
>>>> does make sense to balance your diet and not eat NO fat but not
>>>> eat all fat.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure which diet you're talking about. I've never, ever
>>> heard of an all fat diet.
>>
>> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.
>
> Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
> poultry, eggs, cheese.
>
> Where did you hear that?
>
> Carol

Sorry, I was being a bit snide about Atkins. Wasn't gospel or anything like
that but I watched that PBS special and they cooked eggs, sausage, bacon,
bacon, bacon! (do your dogs want to jump up right about now?! LOL) and
called it a heart healthy meal.

Jill

Dan Abel wrote:
> In article >,
> "jmcquown" > wrote:
>
>
>>Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 20:51:28 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I for one don't understand the concept of eating just fats and losing
>>>>weight. It might work but what are you doing to your arteries?
>>>>Having two parents who have had to have surgery for arterial
>>>>blockages due to cholesterol (and they weren't even *trying* to eat
>>>>nothing but fat) it just doesn't make sense. It does make sense to
>>>>balance your diet and not eat NO fat but not eat all fat.
>>>
>>>I'm not sure which diet you're talking about. I've never, ever heard
>>>of an all fat diet.
>>>
>>>Carol
>>
>>Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.
>
>
>
> That's quite an exaggeration. I could agree that it involves more high
> fat meats than some other diets.
>
> Of course, diets are a funny thing. There are the vegetarians who eat
> fish and chicken. I believe that there are in fact people who say they
> are on "Atkins" who see it as a license to eat all the meat and fat that
> they want, without actually bothering to find out what the diet is about.
>
> I've about given up on diets, not that I ever followed one. I took a
> diabetes class some years back. We were supposed to eat carbs, lots of
> them. They were on the bottom of the food pyramid, the basis of the
> diet. So I took another class a few years later, when my blood glucose
> went out of control. It was taught by the same teacher. Now it's low
> carbs. So a student asks, just what *are* we supposed to eat? That had
> her stumped. She finally blurted out, "vegetables!".
>
> Now, I do watch my diet, but I just don't know what to believe.
>
> What I finally hit upon was to walk three hours a day. Doesn't have
> much to do with diet, but it seems to work. Besides, I really like to
> walk.
>

what worked for me (though I am still 'overweight', because I like to
eat, and I no longer have access to workout equipment) was working with
weights every other day and getting in a half hour of cardiovascular
exercise every day. I quit drinking pop, cut out most of the sugar out
of my diet (not that hard when you cook from scratch really; just had to
lay off the cookies :> )and switched to whole grain products instead of
white. it took a year but I went from 225 to 160. I've gained maybe 10
pounds in the last 6 months, but I have not been as diligent about
portion control

--

saerah

http://anisaerah.blogspot.com/

"Peace is not an absence of war, it is a virtue, a state of mind, a
disposition for benevolence, confidence, justice."
-Baruch Spinoza

"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly
what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There
is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-Douglas Adams

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 04:20:57 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:

> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> > On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > > wrote:
> >
> >> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.
> >
> > Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
> > poultry, eggs, cheese.
> >
> > Where did you hear that?
>
> Sorry, I was being a bit snide about Atkins. Wasn't gospel or anything like
> that but I watched that PBS special and they cooked eggs, sausage, bacon,
> bacon, bacon! (do your dogs want to jump up right about now?! LOL) and
> called it a heart healthy meal.

Don't believe everything you see on television. For some reason,
these "documentaries" have always shown people eating massive amounts
of greasy, disgusting-looking foods while on Atkins. And they never
seem to show the huge salads and other conventionally healthful foods.

I did go through a great deal of bacon and heavy cream while on
Atkins. I Googled back and found my lipid results. I had one set
taken in November, before I ever considered Atkins. I started doing
Atkins at the end of January. And my lipids were re-checked in April.

This is the difference from November of 2002 to April of 2003:

Total Cholesterol from 195 to 167
HDL from 44 to 52
LDL from 117 to 91
Ratio from 2.7 to 1.7
Triglycerides from 168 to 121

I'm not scared of Atkins. I'd do it again, but I like the South Beach
approach of good carbs and good fats better.

Carol

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 04:20:57 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > wrote:
>
>> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>> > On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown"
>> > > wrote:
>> >
>> >> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.
>> >
>> > Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
>> > poultry, eggs, cheese.
>> >
>> > Where did you hear that?
>>
>> Sorry, I was being a bit snide about Atkins. Wasn't gospel or anything
>> like
>> that but I watched that PBS special and they cooked eggs, sausage, bacon,
>> bacon, bacon! (do your dogs want to jump up right about now?! LOL) and
>> called it a heart healthy meal.
>
> Don't believe everything you see on television. For some reason,
> these "documentaries" have always shown people eating massive amounts
> of greasy, disgusting-looking foods while on Atkins. And they never
> seem to show the huge salads and other conventionally healthful foods.
>
> I did go through a great deal of bacon and heavy cream while on
> Atkins. I Googled back and found my lipid results. I had one set
> taken in November, before I ever considered Atkins. I started doing
> Atkins at the end of January. And my lipids were re-checked in April.
>
> This is the difference from November of 2002 to April of 2003:
>
> Total Cholesterol from 195 to 167
> HDL from 44 to 52
> LDL from 117 to 91
> Ratio from 2.7 to 1.7
> Triglycerides from 168 to 121
>
> I'm not scared of Atkins. I'd do it again, but I like the South Beach
> approach of good carbs and good fats better.
>
> Carol

I have also had what I consider remarkably good results with SB. I do think
carbs were the culprit because I was never before able to achieve any
improvement at all. On the other hand, SB emphasizes *low* levels of
saturated fats, and I do feel much more comfortable with that (for health
reasons) than with the Atkins approach, even though many people have
achieved equally good results with Atkins. At one time, I had cholesterol
readings of 285 (HDL 90, LDL 240) and triglycerides as high as 486. Those
are obviously out-of-control readings. By contrast, my most recent test
showed cholesterol LDL of 89 and HDL of 40. Triglycerides were till
slightly above normal (I don't have my records with me and have forgotten
the exact number -- I think it was 152). I have been following SB since
June 2004 -- plus the modification I mentioned earlier of a *complete*
elimination of flour, pasta, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (including any
refined sugar products).

MaryL

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 04:20:57 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > wrote:
>
>> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>> > On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown"
>> > > wrote:
>> >
>> >> Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.
>> >
>> > Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
>> > poultry, eggs, cheese.
>> >
>> > Where did you hear that?
>>
>> Sorry, I was being a bit snide about Atkins. Wasn't gospel or anything
>> like
>> that but I watched that PBS special and they cooked eggs, sausage, bacon,
>> bacon, bacon! (do your dogs want to jump up right about now?! LOL) and
>> called it a heart healthy meal.
>
> Don't believe everything you see on television. For some reason,
> these "documentaries" have always shown people eating massive amounts
> of greasy, disgusting-looking foods while on Atkins. And they never
> seem to show the huge salads and other conventionally healthful foods.
>
> I did go through a great deal of bacon and heavy cream while on
> Atkins. I Googled back and found my lipid results. I had one set
> taken in November, before I ever considered Atkins. I started doing
> Atkins at the end of January. And my lipids were re-checked in April.
>
> This is the difference from November of 2002 to April of 2003:
>
> Total Cholesterol from 195 to 167
> HDL from 44 to 52
> LDL from 117 to 91
> Ratio from 2.7 to 1.7
> Triglycerides from 168 to 121
>
> I'm not scared of Atkins. I'd do it again, but I like the South Beach
> approach of good carbs and good fats better.
>
> Carol

Your statistics are phenomenal; but I was wondering since you had a good
'ratio' reading at the beginning, was the diet used only to lose weight?
Thanks,
Dee Dee

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 14:23:23 -0500, "Dee Randall"
> wrote:

> "Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > This is the difference from November of 2002 to April of 2003:
> >
> > Total Cholesterol from 195 to 167
> > HDL from 44 to 52
> > LDL from 117 to 91
> > Ratio from 2.7 to 1.7
> > Triglycerides from 168 to 121
> >
> > I'm not scared of Atkins. I'd do it again, but I like the South Beach
> > approach of good carbs and good fats better.
>
> Your statistics are phenomenal; but I was wondering since you had a good
> 'ratio' reading at the beginning, was the diet used only to lose weight?

No, it was for both weight and diabetes control. I ate so few carbs
it was ridiculous, because I was trying to keep my BGs in line. Now,
I'll be keeping track of my BGs and tell my doctor what kinds of
things I've been eating, and she'll adjust my diabetes meds
accordingly.

Breakfast today was a cheddar and fresh spinach omelette. I'll have a
monster salad for lunch. Maybe some Pollack for dinner, along with
some broccoli.

Carol

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 13:13:30 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

> I have also had what I consider remarkably good results with SB. I do think
> carbs were the culprit because I was never before able to achieve any
> improvement at all. On the other hand, SB emphasizes *low* levels of
> saturated fats, and I do feel much more comfortable with that (for health
> reasons) than with the Atkins approach, even though many people have
> achieved equally good results with Atkins. At one time, I had cholesterol
> readings of 285 (HDL 90, LDL 240) and triglycerides as high as 486. Those
> are obviously out-of-control readings. By contrast, my most recent test
> showed cholesterol LDL of 89 and HDL of 40. Triglycerides were till
> slightly above normal (I don't have my records with me and have forgotten
> the exact number -- I think it was 152). I have been following SB since
> June 2004 -- plus the modification I mentioned earlier of a *complete*
> elimination of flour, pasta, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (including any
> refined sugar products).

Boy, you HAVE done well! There are a couple of changes that I've read
so far that I just won't follow. There WILL be butter on my veggies.
And in the pan for omelettes. Only about a third of what I used on
Atkins. And I'll be happy when I can reach the point of eating open
face sandwiches. Multi grain at home, and whatever's available when
somewhere else. I can live without the pasta, rice, and potatoes.
Sugar is a no-brainer.

Carol

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 13:13:30 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
>> I have also had what I consider remarkably good results with SB. I do
>> think
>> carbs were the culprit because I was never before able to achieve any
>> improvement at all. On the other hand, SB emphasizes *low* levels of
>> saturated fats, and I do feel much more comfortable with that (for health
>> reasons) than with the Atkins approach, even though many people have
>> achieved equally good results with Atkins. At one time, I had
>> cholesterol
>> readings of 285 (HDL 90, LDL 240) and triglycerides as high as 486.
>> Those
>> are obviously out-of-control readings. By contrast, my most recent test
>> showed cholesterol LDL of 89 and HDL of 40. Triglycerides were till
>> slightly above normal (I don't have my records with me and have forgotten
>> the exact number -- I think it was 152). I have been following SB since
>> June 2004 -- plus the modification I mentioned earlier of a *complete*
>> elimination of flour, pasta, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (including
>> any
>> refined sugar products).
>
> Boy, you HAVE done well! There are a couple of changes that I've read
> so far that I just won't follow. There WILL be butter on my veggies.
> And in the pan for omelettes. Only about a third of what I used on
> Atkins. And I'll be happy when I can reach the point of eating open
> face sandwiches. Multi grain at home, and whatever's available when
> somewhere else. I can live without the pasta, rice, and potatoes.
> Sugar is a no-brainer.
>
> Carol

Watch out for the bread, even whole wheat or multi-grain. Use your meter
and test-test-test as you introduce different foods. Many people can eat
bread, but I have found that even a single slice of whole wheat bread will
cause spikes in my glucose levels. Therefore, if I want a sandwich I use
only Ezekiel bread (a flourless bread made from sprouted grains, available
at health food stores and a few groceries -- definitely not as tasty but it
does not cause spikes). On the other hand, I can eat old-fashioned oatmeal
(which many diebetics cannot), and fortunately I can quite a lot of fresh
fruit. We really do need to individualize our diets, and it is important
for diabetics to take frequent measurements to be sure about what is
happening to our bodies.

MaryL

MaryL wrote:
>
> "Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 13:13:30 -0600, "MaryL"
> > -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
> >
> >> I have also had what I consider remarkably good results with SB. I do
> >> think
> >> carbs were the culprit because I was never before able to achieve any
> >> improvement at all. On the other hand, SB emphasizes *low* levels of
> >> saturated fats, and I do feel much more comfortable with that (for health
> >> reasons) than with the Atkins approach, even though many people have
> >> achieved equally good results with Atkins. At one time, I had
> >> cholesterol
> >> readings of 285 (HDL 90, LDL 240) and triglycerides as high as 486.
> >> Those
> >> are obviously out-of-control readings. By contrast, my most recent test
> >> showed cholesterol LDL of 89 and HDL of 40. Triglycerides were till
> >> slightly above normal (I don't have my records with me and have forgotten
> >> the exact number -- I think it was 152). I have been following SB since
> >> June 2004 -- plus the modification I mentioned earlier of a *complete*
> >> elimination of flour, pasta, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (including
> >> any
> >> refined sugar products).
> >
> > Boy, you HAVE done well! There are a couple of changes that I've read
> > so far that I just won't follow. There WILL be butter on my veggies.
> > And in the pan for omelettes. Only about a third of what I used on
> > Atkins. And I'll be happy when I can reach the point of eating open
> > face sandwiches. Multi grain at home, and whatever's available when
> > somewhere else. I can live without the pasta, rice, and potatoes.
> > Sugar is a no-brainer.
> >
> > Carol
>
> Watch out for the bread, even whole wheat or multi-grain. Use your meter
> and test-test-test as you introduce different foods. Many people can eat
> bread, but I have found that even a single slice of whole wheat bread will
> cause spikes in my glucose levels. Therefore, if I want a sandwich I use
> only Ezekiel bread (a flourless bread made from sprouted grains, available
> at health food stores and a few groceries -- definitely not as tasty but it
> does not cause spikes). On the other hand, I can eat old-fashioned oatmeal
> (which many diebetics cannot), and fortunately I can quite a lot of fresh
> fruit. We really do need to individualize our diets, and it is important
> for diabetics to take frequent measurements to be sure about what is
> happening to our bodies.
>
> MaryL
I'll jump in here. I've been reading this thread for a while. I
don't have a problem with the allowable amount of bread, but mostly
white or brown. I can't handle the specialty breads (French, Italian,
etc.) I also have a hard time with fruits making my BG go sky high. I
usually eat watermelon when I can get it, but it's not been available
locally recently. I snack on sliced seedless cucumber now that I can't
get watermelon. As long as I stick to the allowable amount, I also
don't have a problem with potatoes or rice. I check 3 times a day,
before meals, so I know what I can have. My BG is under control, but
with meds. My A1C was fine until they lowered the guidelines. I wish I
could get off the meds, but no luck so far. I must get back to my
stationary bike...darn it.....Sharon

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 14:22:46 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

> Watch out for the bread, even whole wheat or multi-grain. Use your meter
> and test-test-test as you introduce different foods. Many people can eat
> bread, but I have found that even a single slice of whole wheat bread will
> cause spikes in my glucose levels. Therefore, if I want a sandwich I use
> only Ezekiel bread (a flourless bread made from sprouted grains, available
> at health food stores and a few groceries -- definitely not as tasty but it
> does not cause spikes).

I'll have to look for that. How "not as tasty" is it?

> On the other hand, I can eat old-fashioned oatmeal
> (which many diebetics cannot), and fortunately I can quite a lot of fresh
> fruit. We really do need to individualize our diets, and it is important
> for diabetics to take frequent measurements to be sure about what is
> happening to our bodies.

When I was experimenting (on the "diabetes educator's advice), with
having cereal for breakfast, they all (hot and cold) bumped my blood
sugar up 60 points.

Strawberries spike me, too. We'll have to see how this all works owt.

I'm having intermittent problems with the letter YEW working. So my
posts will probably look a little weird for awhile.

Carol

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 16:45:05 -0500, biig > wrote:

> I'll jump in here. I've been reading this thread for a while. I
> don't have a problem with the allowable amount of bread, but mostly
> white or brown. I can't handle the specialty breads (French, Italian,
> etc.) I also have a hard time with fruits making my BG go sky high. I
> usually eat watermelon when I can get it, but it's not been available
> locally recently. I snack on sliced seedless cucumber now that I can't
> get watermelon. As long as I stick to the allowable amount, I also
> don't have a problem with potatoes or rice. I check 3 times a day,
> before meals, so I know what I can have. My BG is under control, but
> with meds. My A1C was fine until they lowered the guidelines. I wish I
> could get off the meds, but no luck so far. I must get back to my
> stationary bike...darn it.....Sharon

Cucumbers make a great snack. And you can put toppings on them, using
them instead of a cracker.

Your experience with bread is encouraging. I hope I'll have the same
luck. I went for a long, long time without touching bread, so I don't
have a lot of difficulty skipping it. But there are times and places
where it would be nice to have at least a little. Waiting for the
first time I order an open face reuben here in Minnesota. I'll
actually do that at home, I believe.

Carol

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 16:45:05 -0500, biig > wrote:
>
>> I'll jump in here. I've been reading this thread for a while. I
>> don't have a problem with the allowable amount of bread, but mostly
>> white or brown. I can't handle the specialty breads (French, Italian,
>> etc.) I also have a hard time with fruits making my BG go sky high. I
>> usually eat watermelon when I can get it, but it's not been available
>> locally recently. I snack on sliced seedless cucumber now that I can't
>> get watermelon. As long as I stick to the allowable amount, I also
>> don't have a problem with potatoes or rice. I check 3 times a day,
>> before meals, so I know what I can have. My BG is under control, but
>> with meds. My A1C was fine until they lowered the guidelines. I wish I
>> could get off the meds, but no luck so far. I must get back to my
>> stationary bike...darn it.....Sharon
>
> Cucumbers make a great snack. And you can put toppings on them, using
> them instead of a cracker.

Great idea! I'm going to try this with some Laughing Cow Lite cheese -- a
low-fat spreadable cat that SB recommends.

>
> Your experience with bread is encouraging. I hope I'll have the same
> luck. I went for a long, long time without touching bread, so I don't
> have a lot of difficulty skipping it. But there are times and places
> where it would be nice to have at least a little. Waiting for the
> first time I order an open face reuben here in Minnesota. I'll
> actually do that at home, I believe.
>
> Carol

Since I know bread is a problem for me, I have learned to eliminate the
bread and only eat the "fixins" -- no matter where I am. For example, our
department had a pizza party recently. That's *literally* all they had!
So, I scraped the toppings off and ate that, but discarded the crust. That
certainly wasn't the most elegant meal I've ever had, but it wasn't bad --
and people were really interested because they had assumed that the crust
would be what I could eat and not the reverse. It was no doubt higher fat
than I prefer, but the carbs are the big problem for me. Likewise, I went
with friends to a restaurant recently, and I ordered steak and portabella
fajitas. However, I had the server leave off the tortillas, and I just ate
the "insides" on a plate, as one would with other steak dishes. As I said
earlier, I do think this has to be individualized to the needs of the person
involved (and that includes both glucose readings and emotional
involvement). For example, the "key" for me is to *never* deviate from
certain principles because I know from past experience that I could easily
trigger my old sweet tooth. As it is, I get along very well and do not have
any cravings. I recognize that for many people this would *not* be the way
to go. If a person sits around and is made to feel constantly deprived,
then no diet in the world is going to last very long.

MaryL

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 14:22:46 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
>> Watch out for the bread, even whole wheat or multi-grain. Use your meter
>> and test-test-test as you introduce different foods. Many people can eat
>> bread, but I have found that even a single slice of whole wheat bread
>> will
>> cause spikes in my glucose levels. Therefore, if I want a sandwich I use
>> only Ezekiel bread (a flourless bread made from sprouted grains,
>> available
>> at health food stores and a few groceries -- definitely not as tasty but
>> it
>> does not cause spikes).
>
> I'll have to look for that. How "not as tasty" is it?
>
> Carol

Quite frankly, my first reaction was that I thought it tasted like
cardboard. I have now gotten used to it but greatly prefer to have it
toasted. When toasted, it's not too different from whole wheat bread (that
is, not as soft as white bread -- somewhat stiff texture, but the taste is
now acceptable to me). It may be just as well that I *don't* like it as
well as I used to like "real" bread because I'm not tempted to overindulge.
I used to like poached eggs on English muffin (somewhat like eggs Benebict
but without the sauce). Now I use a slice of Ezekiel bread for that
purpose. Again, it doesn't have the real English muffin feel to it, but
it's actually quite good that way because the egg creates a softer texture
(but definitely not mushy) in the bread.

MaryL

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 17:24:06 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

> Since I know bread is a problem for me, I have learned to eliminate the
> bread and only eat the "fixins" -- no matter where I am. For example, our
> department had a pizza party recently. That's *literally* all they had!
> So, I scraped the toppings off and ate that, but discarded the crust. That
> certainly wasn't the most elegant meal I've ever had, but it wasn't bad --
> and people were really interested because they had assumed that the crust
> would be what I could eat and not the reverse. It was no doubt higher fat
> than I prefer, but the carbs are the big problem for me.

You just gave me a great idea for the next time I order a pizza. Crash
almost always orders pepperoni. That's grease on top of grease. I'll
order a veggie pizza for myself - hold the mushrooms. I'm used to
eating just the toppings on pizzas. With Atkins, it never would have
occured to me to watch out for the fatty meat toppings, though. THANK
YOU!

> Likewise, I went
> with friends to a restaurant recently, and I ordered steak and portabella
> fajitas. However, I had the server leave off the tortillas, and I just ate
> the "insides" on a plate, as one would with other steak dishes.

I haven't done that yet, but I'd love to have fajitas sans tortillas.
They just cut into the taste of the good stuff in the fillings.

> If a person sits around and is made to feel constantly deprived,
> then no diet in the world is going to last very long.

Absolutely!

Lunch today: Iceberg lettuce, spinach, green onions, cilantro, and
shredded cheddar. And dressing.

Carol, adjusting slowly to a new mindset regarding food

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 17:28:24 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

Regarding Ezekiel bread:

> Quite frankly, my first reaction was that I thought it tasted like
> cardboard. I have now gotten used to it but greatly prefer to have it
> toasted. When toasted, it's not too different from whole wheat bread (that
> is, not as soft as white bread -- somewhat stiff texture, but the taste is
> now acceptable to me). It may be just as well that I *don't* like it as
> well as I used to like "real" bread because I'm not tempted to overindulge.
> I used to like poached eggs on English muffin (somewhat like eggs Benebict
> but without the sauce). Now I use a slice of Ezekiel bread for that
> purpose. Again, it doesn't have the real English muffin feel to it, but
> it's actually quite good that way because the egg creates a softer texture
> (but definitely not mushy) in the bread.

Ooooh! Poached eggs on cardboard! Just being silly. It sounds
pretty good. Do you I Can't Believe It's Not Butter between the bread
and the egg(s)? I'll try to get my hands on some of that bread after
moving into Phase 2.

This is cool. Food ideas without all the grease! LOL!

Thanks again,
Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:

>
>
> You just gave me a great idea for the next time I order a pizza. Crash
> almost always orders pepperoni. That's grease on top of grease. I'll
> order a veggie pizza for myself - hold the mushrooms. I'm used to
> eating just the toppings on pizzas. With Atkins, it never would have
> occured to me to watch out for the fatty meat toppings, though. THANK
> YOU!
>
> > Likewise, I went
> > with friends to a restaurant recently, and I ordered steak and portabella
> > fajitas. However, I had the server leave off the tortillas, and I just ate
> > the "insides" on a plate, as one would with other steak dishes.
>
> I haven't done that yet, but I'd love to have fajitas sans tortillas.
> They just cut into the taste of the good stuff in the fillings.

LOL you are like my wife. She eats the toppings off pizza and leaves the crust.
She goes into sandwich shops and orders a sandwich...hold the bread.

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 17:28:24 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
> Regarding Ezekiel bread:
>
>> Quite frankly, my first reaction was that I thought it tasted like
>> cardboard. I have now gotten used to it but greatly prefer to have it
>> toasted. When toasted, it's not too different from whole wheat bread
>> (that
>> is, not as soft as white bread -- somewhat stiff texture, but the taste
>> is
>> now acceptable to me). It may be just as well that I *don't* like it as
>> well as I used to like "real" bread because I'm not tempted to
>> overindulge.
>> I used to like poached eggs on English muffin (somewhat like eggs
>> Benebict
>> but without the sauce). Now I use a slice of Ezekiel bread for that
>> purpose. Again, it doesn't have the real English muffin feel to it, but
>> it's actually quite good that way because the egg creates a softer
>> texture
>> (but definitely not mushy) in the bread.
>
> Ooooh! Poached eggs on cardboard! Just being silly. It sounds
> pretty good. Do you I Can't Believe It's Not Butter between the bread
> and the egg(s)? I'll try to get my hands on some of that bread after
> moving into Phase 2.
>
> This is cool. Food ideas without all the grease! LOL!
>
> Thanks again,
> Carol

Actually, I don't use the I Can't Believe It's Not Butter. I use the
Fleishmann's spread that is made from olive oil and has no trans fats.
Olive oil is actually something that I try to incorporate in my diet.

MaryL

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 20:05:24 -0500, Dave Smith
> wrote:

> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>
>> MaryL said:
> > > Likewise, I went
> > > with friends to a restaurant recently, and I ordered steak and portabella
> > > fajitas. However, I had the server leave off the tortillas, and I just ate
> > > the "insides" on a plate, as one would with other steak dishes.
> >
> > I haven't done that yet, but I'd love to have fajitas sans tortillas.
> > They just cut into the taste of the good stuff in the fillings.
>
> LOL you are like my wife. She eats the toppings off pizza and leaves the crust.
> She goes into sandwich shops and orders a sandwich...hold the bread.

Hey, she's eating more healthfully by doing that. Looks weird to
other diners, but hey ...

We went to Arby's the other night. The woman in front of me in line
ordered a turkey sandwich, hold the turkey and mayo.

Takes all kinds, I guess. <G>

Carol

On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 19:22:46 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

> Actually, I don't use the I Can't Believe It's Not Butter. I use the
> Fleishmann's spread that is made from olive oil and has no trans fats.
> Olive oil is actually something that I try to incorporate in my diet.

Ahhh, thanks! I haven't gotten far in the book yet, but I saw that he
mentioned ICBINB. Olive oil is better. How does it taste? I can't
remember the last time I ate margarine.

Carol

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Sat, 31 Dec 2005 19:22:46 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
>> Actually, I don't use the I Can't Believe It's Not Butter. I use the
>> Fleishmann's spread that is made from olive oil and has no trans fats.
>> Olive oil is actually something that I try to incorporate in my diet.
>
> Ahhh, thanks! I haven't gotten far in the book yet, but I saw that he
> mentioned ICBINB. Olive oil is better. How does it taste? I can't
> remember the last time I ate margarine.
>
> Carol

It tastes pretty good, but not like real butter. On the other hand, I had
been eating soft margarine for years -- something I thought was healthier
than butter, and now I discover that it may not be.

MaryL

Dan Abel > writes:

>Of course, diets are a funny thing. There are the vegetarians who eat
>fish and chicken.

"Meat" has traditionally been seen as beef and pork only. Fowl and
seafood aren't considered meat by many. I can see someone becoming what
is known as a pesco-pollo-vegetarian, and eating seafood and fowl, so I
don't know why you're listing it as something that's "weird".

>diabetes class some years back. We were supposed to eat carbs, lots of
>them. They were on the bottom of the food pyramid, the basis of the
>diet. So I took another class a few years later, when my blood glucose
>went out of control. It was taught by the same teacher. Now it's low
>carbs.

Diets are fads. You have to keep in mind that much of what we're told
is biased. The diet industry is a billion-dollar one which has to
constantly reinvent itself. A few years ago it was all about "fat
burners", and you couldn't watch a minute of television without seeing
ads for pills that supposedly burned fat or made it leave your body so
quickly it wasn't absorbed.
Of course, those pills didn't work, so the industry was ready to
embrace a new diet -- low-carb/Atkins. Now that low-carb has gotten
some deserved bad press, the new fad is high-priced pills with some
miracle ingredient that reduces stress-enduced fat (or menopause induced
fat, or whatever).
A few people have been bright enough to admit that each person will
need a different kind of diet. Andrew Weil's books, while focused on
vegetarianism, at least bring up good points about how no one fad diet
is going to help the entire human race.
Face it, we live in huge, sprawling cities and can't walk anywhere
anymore. Gyms are depressing and expensive. Fresh fruits and veggies
and lean cuts of meat (at least here) are more expensive than processed
canned stuff. Our jobs force us to work 50+ hour weeks, people with
kids are running everywhere for activities, there's our own hobbies we
want to engage in, and we often don't spend time cooking because we're
overwhelmed and tired. It's no wonder we're getting larger, yet thanks
to the diet industry, all we manage to do is make large people feel bad
about themselves. There's precious little common sense advice out there
at all.

Stacia

Damsel in dis Dress > writes:

>Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
>poultry, eggs, cheese.

>Where did you hear that?

The Atkins website, at least a few months ago, was very heavily
meat-based. So I can see where Jill got the idea.
2-3 cups of veggies a day would deprive me beyond belief. That's not
enough to cover my salad needs for the day!

Stacia
yes, I have salad needs

On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 17:44:55 +0000 (UTC), (Glitter
Ninja) wrote:

> Damsel in dis Dress > writes:
>
> >Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
> >poultry, eggs, cheese.
>
> >Where did you hear that?
>
> The Atkins website, at least a few months ago, was very heavily
> meat-based. So I can see where Jill got the idea.

She said all fat. Didn't acknowledge protein or carbs at all. That's
what prompted my response.

> 2-3 cups of veggies a day would deprive me beyond belief. That's not
> enough to cover my salad needs for the day!

2-3 cups of veggies is the minimum on Atkins. The sky's pretty much
the limit.

Back to South Beach. Breakfast is usually a nice omelette. I eat
large salads for lunch (usually including meat and/or cheese), then an
enormous pile of broccoli for dinner along with a serving of lean
meat. More variety will be added soon.

I can start introducing fruits after the first two week period - Phase
1. I can't wait for that first apple!

Carol

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 2 Jan 2006 17:44:55 +0000 (UTC), (Glitter
> Ninja) wrote:
>
>> Damsel in dis Dress > writes:
>>
>> >Umm, no. You're required to eat 2-3 cups of vegetables a day. Meat,
>> >poultry, eggs, cheese.
>>
>> >Where did you hear that?
>>
>> The Atkins website, at least a few months ago, was very heavily
>> meat-based. So I can see where Jill got the idea.
>
> She said all fat. Didn't acknowledge protein or carbs at all. That's
> what prompted my response.
>
>> 2-3 cups of veggies a day would deprive me beyond belief. That's not
>> enough to cover my salad needs for the day!
>
> 2-3 cups of veggies is the minimum on Atkins. The sky's pretty much
> the limit.
>
> Back to South Beach. Breakfast is usually a nice omelette. I eat
> large salads for lunch (usually including meat and/or cheese), then an
> enormous pile of broccoli for dinner along with a serving of lean
> meat. More variety will be added soon.
>
> I can start introducing fruits after the first two week period - Phase
> 1. I can't wait for that first apple!
>
> Carol

Stick to it! I've already described how well this worked for me. However,
I grew *very tired* of eggs and salads by the 7th or 8th day. It's worth it
to carry through, though. I also didn't start to lose weight by the end of
the second, as I had expected. A "veteran" South Beacher told me I *wasn't
eating enough.* That didn't make sense, but I did realize that I wasn't
eating nearly as large portions of veggies as SB calls for (I just wasn't
used to it). Once I began to rev up on the veggies, I also started to
weight. I did not go throught the "rapid loss" stage that some people have,
but that's okay with me -- I think a lot of that is just water. I lost on a
very regular basis, and that's what I really wanted. I wanted to lose
weight, of course, but I did this primarily for health -- and that has
succeeded in a big way. I hope you will have the same results.

MaryL

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:

> I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.
>
> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.
>
> Carol

Carol, not sure if this will be of help to you but what the heck. I
think we eat in a healthful manner 99% of the time. I don't follow any
type of special diet but I am very particular as to what I will eat
since diabetes runs in my family and I am considered pre-diabetic. I
avoid *white* just about anything for the most part especially white
sugar but I will eat small portions of pasta made with white flour. I
avoid corn syrup too. Since I process most of our fruits, vegetables,
and quick meals, I can control the sugar, salt, and fat content. I
really don't do commercially canned/frozen anything as much as possible
because I feel most these things are too high in one or more of sugar,
salt, or fat. I'd say I make most of our bread and of that the majority
is whole grain or multi-grain but when I do use white flour it is
unbleached. We don't eat bread on a daily basis either but I'd say we
eat at least one serving of bread 3-4 times a week. I never developed a
sweet tooth so things like candies, cookies, and cakes have never been a
problem for me. While I make them once in awhile, I don't eat them
myself. I detest chocolate and don't drink soft drinks other than club
soda when my allergies are bad enough to make my ears itch. DH
occasionally drinks Pepsi but not on a regular basis. Our drink of
choice is filtered water. We have one cup of coffee in the morning and
I might drink a green tea or herbal tea throughout the day. We aren't
big on fruit juices with orange juice or apple juice occasionally but I
can tomato or mixed veggie juice each year. Most of this is for cooking
rather than drinking though. Occasionally I indulge in a white flour
product like homemade sourdough bread. Then I use unbleached white
flour. I avoid anything heavily processed aka commercially processed
with the exception of a few condiments that I don't make myself. My
main carb intake would be through fruits and vegetables of which I try
to get the recommended daily intake. Most of the time, fruits are raw
but veggies are either raw or cooked. My preferred way of cooking
veggies is steaming followed by grilling. I don't do chips or those
types of snacks but I do enjoy popcorn with real butter. I think some
of the low carb diets restrict popcorn though. I think the way we eat
really is more about balance than restriction AND for us we've eaten
this way ever since we've been married so it is just our lifestyle.
Antioxidants are good for you and tomatoes have not only antioxidants
but cancer fighting properties so I don't care for the diets that
restrict them based on their carb content. We eat a lot of tomatoes
year round. We eat a lot of salads as well with at least one green
salad daily. Alcohol is something we don't drink a lot of but we don't
abstain either. I like cooking with alcohol but these types of dishes
are not a regular part of our daily eating habits. Oh and we don't do
the fast food restaurant thing as in McD's. When we are on the road,
we'll stop and eat at an actual restaurant where we can make healthy
choices. As far as meats, we like all kinds leaning towards fish but DH
is really a beef fan. We try to keep the meat portions within the
nutritional guidelines but don't feel really guilty if we occasionally
indulge. Fried foods are a treat rather than the norm for us. I like
good olive oils for cooking. Being slightly underweight is better for
your body than being slightly overweight. I've been slightly
underweight all my life with the exception of being pregnant and even
then likely gained less than normal. As far as exercise, I really can't
do outdoor activities sometimes but I'm pretty active doing yoga three
times a week, walking when I can, gardening, and housework. I don't do
the sport thing. DH doesn't do yoga but is on the go a lot and he's
involved in a couple of sports even though he is at the desk a good
portion of the day. I can't remember a day where we've had a SOYADND
(sit on your ass do nothing day)! Neither of us smoke, smoking has
never been allowed in our house, and we really limit our exposure to
second hand smoke.

In your case though, it would be best to discuss your options with your
doctor and perhaps a nutritionalist. What is working for me/us might
not work for you and as I said, this has been our lifestyle since late
teens so my body is used to this way of eating.

My views on the low carb diets - they may or may not work depending on
how dedicated you are. After all, the low fat diets sure didn't works.
There have been some health concerns expressed. IMO, any diet that
restricts you so tightly on one type of nutrient is bound to fail. No
diet will work unless you make lifestyle changes that involve adding
regular excercise and moderation in what you eat on an ongoing basis. I
fully believe that diet can be used to help prevent or manage disease
BUT only with dedication to the full gamut of lifestyle changes. Good
luck with managing your diabetes. I hope some of these tips help you.

jmcquown wrote:

> sf wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, jmcquown wrote:
>>
>>
>>> In this show he talks about how back in the 1950's everyone was
>>> encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
>>> Remember those starving kids in China!
>>
>>That is sooo true! We had to sit at the table until we finished every
>>scrap. You also need to remember that we were raised by people who
>>lived through the great Depression, so they had a different attitude
>>due to that experience.
>
>
> Yeah, but this is also the generation that showed films in school on how to
> "duck and cover" under a school desk in case of a nuclear blast. Yeah,
> huddling under that crappy wooden desk is gonna help. LOL
>

My FM was in a nursing home towards the end of her life. She lived
through the great drepression. For the last four years of her life, she
whould make a chip dive under the bed anytime a plane went over the
building. It was heart breaking to watch! We can't even remotely begin
to understand what some of these people went through and how society
influenced their thinking. Heck, she never even watched colour tv until
she was in the nursing home. We lived in a very, very small
agricultural communitity where it was a huge deal when the local m&p
grocery store actually brought in frozen pizzas! I can remember stories
she told of when she first started school, she either walked or went by
horse & buggy. She went as far as third grade until her parents pulled
her out because she was needed at home. One of her sister's daughters
adopted a little German girl. The rest of the family had such a hatred
for Hitler they never did accept the little girl. One of her brothers
fought in WWI & WWII and until the day he died had remenants of shrapnel
in his head. There was a lot of bitterness over the wars and the
drepression but I'll tell you anyone going though that learned to cook
with a lot less than we have now. How many of us could put up with
those conditions today? No LOL at all.

> I have total respect for people who had to make do during the 1930's
> American Depression. I've said here before, my father used to pick
> dandylion greens for dinner. To this day he won't eat greens of any kind.
> He calls greens "poor people's food". It reminds him of when they were dirt
> poor. It's okay with me; I get his share of turnip greens

DH's dad refused to eat potato skins. He went through the war while
living in Holland. To him, potato skins were pig food. He just
wouldn't eat them yet some of the things he would eat was not all that
impressive to me. Talk about soup. He knew how to make soup that would
last a month and it likely cost next to nothing! His family was the
soup experts.
>
> Jill
>
>

Glitter Ninja wrote:

> Wayne Boatwright > writes:
>
>
>>Thanks, Dee. Honestly, we need the discipline of a program we can follow.
>>We were on WW for quite a while before David had his bypass surgery, but
>>haven't gone back since then. We know it's time! Our BG are pretty well
>>controlled medically, but we'd like to work ourselves away from the drugs.
>
>
> Best of luck! It's definitely possible. When my BP got too high I
> was put on some pretty hefty drugs, because I was allergic to all the
> lower-level drugs I should have been on. The pills I took were giving
> me some serious side-effects I didn't enjoy. Exercise has allowed me to
> get off the pills, at least for now, so I definitely understand where
> you and David are coming from.
>
> Stacia

Hey, I understand both of your decisions. I'd rather control anything
possible by diet rather than drugs and even for pain management
(something of concern right now) I use any natural, drug-free method
possible. Those drugs can really mess you up creating more than the
initial problem

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:

> Sat, 31 Dec 2005 00:10:56 -0600, "jmcquown" >
> wrote:
>
>
>>Atkins. It's basically all about eating fat and nothing but.
>
>
> Okay, I can't just let this drop (nothin' on you, Jill).
>
> When I was on Atkins and lost 40 pounds my typical daily menu went
> something like this:
>
> BREAKFAST
> Omelette OR
> Plain yogurt sweetened and flavored with DaVinci coffee syrups
> (sugar-free)
>
> LUNCH
> 1/4 head of iceburg lettuce
> Olive oil, red wine vinegar, and Italian seasoning dressing
> Chicken breast, hamburger patty, etc.
>
> DINNER
> Steak, pork chop, chicken breast, etc.
> Fill the rest of the plate with a huge mound of broccoli
>
> SNACKS
> Deviled eggs
> Mozzarella cheese sticks
> Beef jerky (sugar free)
>
> I was eating way fewer carbs than what Atkins allows, because I was
> trying to match my eating to the diabetes meds I was on. After I've
> been on South Beach for awhile, and have fairly consistent blood
> glucose readings, my doctor is going to adjust the meds according to
> what I am actually eating.
>
> Today I developed symptoms of a problem that some of us ladies get
> when our blood sugars are too high. So, the hell with the party on
> Sunday. I'm starting first thing in the morning.
>
> Carol

Hey Carol, here's a couple of my observations on your menu. I'd avoid
the flavouring for the yogurt since I like plain yogurt and I always
make sure it has active bacteria. I'd nix the iceburg lettuce in favour
of a lettuce with more nutrition - romaine, mesclun. A lot of times I
like just a splash of fresh lemon juice on salad instead of any kind of
dressing. Beef jerky should not have any sugar added so I'm not sure
where you are getting sugar free but would assume you are using a
commercial variety. Beef jerky is cheaper and quite easy to make in the
comforts of your own home using your oven and it tastes better too I
don't see a lot in the way of fruits, veggies, or fibre, so I'd be
increasing all of those.

~patches~ wrote:
> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>
> When I was on Atkins and lost 40 pounds my typical daily menu went
> > something like this:
> >
> > BREAKFAST
> > Omelette OR
> > Plain yogurt sweetened and flavored with DaVinci coffee syrups
> > (sugar-free)
> >
> > LUNCH
> > 1/4 head of iceburg lettuce
> > Olive oil, red wine vinegar, and Italian seasoning dressing
> > Chicken breast, hamburger patty, etc.
> >
> > DINNER
> > Steak, pork chop, chicken breast, etc.
> > Fill the rest of the plate with a huge mound of broccoli
> >
> > SNACKS
> > Deviled eggs
> > Mozzarella cheese sticks
> > Beef jerky (sugar free)
>
> Hey Carol, here's a couple of my observations on your menu. I'd avoid
> the flavouring for the yogurt since I like plain yogurt and I always
> make sure it has active bacteria.

But *I* don't like plain yogurt. LOL! I use Splenda-sweetened,
deliciously flavored "syrups." And I add them about one minute before
eating the yogurt.

> I'd nix the iceburg lettuce in favour
> of a lettuce with more nutrition - romaine, mesclun.

I do add romaine when I can afford it. Lately, I've been adding plenty
of spinach.

> A lot of times I
> like just a splash of fresh lemon juice on salad instead of any kind of
> dressing.

That sounds good! I'll try it!

> Beef jerky should not have any sugar added so I'm not sure
> where you are getting sugar free but would assume you are using a
> commercial variety. Beef jerky is cheaper and quite easy to make in the
> comforts of your own home using your oven and it tastes better too

We have a food dehyrator that we haven't used yet. I'd love to make my
own jerky, since most of the commercial brands use sugar. There's a
place online that does sell sugar-free jerky, but I know I can make it
at home at a fraction of the price.

> I don't see a lot in the way of fruits, veggies, or fibre, so I'd be
> increasing all of those.

The salads I eat are enormous. They fill a serving bowl. Like the
kind you serve mashed potatoes in. I eat either broccoli or spinach in
my omelettes, spinach in my salads, and a mountain of broccoli at
dinner. I buy it frozen, in 5 pound bags.

I also love sauteed cabbage. We're buying some tonight, as a matter of
fact. Raw, not sauteed. ;o)

As for fruits, South Beach is a lot more open-minded than Atkins. When
I complete my first two weeks, I can start eating an apple a day, if I
wish. And I wish!

Thank you for all your helpful tips. My next salad will have lemon
juice on it. )

Carol

~patches~ wrote:
> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>
> When I was on Atkins and lost 40 pounds my typical daily menu went
> > something like this:
> >
> > BREAKFAST
> > Omelette OR
> > Plain yogurt sweetened and flavored with DaVinci coffee syrups
> > (sugar-free)
> >
> > LUNCH
> > 1/4 head of iceburg lettuce
> > Olive oil, red wine vinegar, and Italian seasoning dressing
> > Chicken breast, hamburger patty, etc.
> >
> > DINNER
> > Steak, pork chop, chicken breast, etc.
> > Fill the rest of the plate with a huge mound of broccoli
> >
> > SNACKS
> > Deviled eggs
> > Mozzarella cheese sticks
> > Beef jerky (sugar free)
>
> Hey Carol, here's a couple of my observations on your menu. I'd avoid
> the flavouring for the yogurt since I like plain yogurt and I always
> make sure it has active bacteria.

But *I* don't like plain yogurt. LOL! I use Splenda-sweetened,
deliciously flavored "syrups." And I add them about one minute before
eating the yogurt.

> I'd nix the iceburg lettuce in favour
> of a lettuce with more nutrition - romaine, mesclun.

I do add romaine when I can afford it. Lately, I've been adding plenty
of spinach.

> A lot of times I
> like just a splash of fresh lemon juice on salad instead of any kind of
> dressing.

That sounds good! I'll try it!

> Beef jerky should not have any sugar added so I'm not sure
> where you are getting sugar free but would assume you are using a
> commercial variety. Beef jerky is cheaper and quite easy to make in the
> comforts of your own home using your oven and it tastes better too

We have a food dehyrator that we haven't used yet. I'd love to make my
own jerky, since most of the commercial brands use sugar. There's a
place online that does sell sugar-free jerky, but I know I can make it
at home at a fraction of the price.

> I don't see a lot in the way of fruits, veggies, or fibre, so I'd be
> increasing all of those.

The salads I eat are enormous. They fill a serving bowl. Like the
kind you serve mashed potatoes in. I eat either broccoli or spinach in
my omelettes, spinach in my salads, and a mountain of broccoli at
dinner. I buy it frozen, in 5 pound bags.

I also love sauteed cabbage. We're buying some tonight, as a matter of
fact. Raw, not sauteed. ;o)

As for fruits, South Beach is a lot more open-minded than Atkins. When
I complete my first two weeks, I can start eating an apple a day, if I
wish. And I wish!

Thank you for all your helpful tips. My next salad will have lemon
juice on it. )

Carol