I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.

I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
weight loss.

I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
choices.

Carol

On Thu 29 Dec 2005 08:59:38p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel in dis
Dress?

> I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.
>
> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.

David and I are both launching back into Weigh****chers on Saturday. We are
both Type II diabetic and find that WW manages it well. Frankly, low carb
literally makes me sick, and I can't stay on it.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.

In article >,
Damsel in dis Dress > wrote:

> I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.


There's an alt.support.diabetes group.


> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.


There are lots of diabetics here, and most are happy to help, although I
for one can't help you with this particular diet.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:36:23 -0800, Dan Abel > wrote:

> In article >,
> Damsel in dis Dress > wrote:
>
> > I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> > as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
> >
> > I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> > weight loss.
>
> There's an alt.support.diabetes group.

Thanks! Maybe I'll try there. I'll Google first - some of the
support groups are pretty horrible.

> > I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> > choices.
>
> There are lots of diabetics here, and most are happy to help, although I
> for one can't help you with this particular diet.

Thanks, Dan. I've ordered the book in large print. It should be here
sometime next week. I'm having a dickens of a time trying to read
the normal print copy. So I have only a vague concept of the diet at
this point. It does seem a lot more do-able than Atkins was.

Good fats, good carbs.

Carol

On Thu 29 Dec 2005 10:43:48p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel in dis
Dress?

> On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:36:23 -0800, Dan Abel > wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> Damsel in dis Dress > wrote:
>>
>> > I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
>> > as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>> >
>> > I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
>> > weight loss.
>>
>> There's an alt.support.diabetes group.
>
> Thanks! Maybe I'll try there. I'll Google first - some of the
> support groups are pretty horrible.
>
>> > I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
>> > choices.
>>
>> There are lots of diabetics here, and most are happy to help, although I
>> for one can't help you with this particular diet.
>
> Thanks, Dan. I've ordered the book in large print. It should be here
> sometime next week. I'm having a dickens of a time trying to read
> the normal print copy. So I have only a vague concept of the diet at
> this point. It does seem a lot more do-able than Atkins was.
>
> Good fats, good carbs.
>
> Carol
>

There's also alt.food.diabetic


--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.

On 30 Dec 2005 06:50:03 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

> There's also alt.food.diabetic

Very true! Thanks for the reminder. )

Carol

On 30 Dec 2005 05:06:06 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

>David and I are both launching back into Weigh****chers on Saturday. We are
>both Type II diabetic and find that WW manages it well. Frankly, low carb
>literally makes me sick, and I can't stay on it.

James has nearly reversed his diabetes through exercise and healthy
eating, including plenty of whole grains and other healthy carbs. I'm
happy to hear that you found something that works for you, as well.

serene

On Thu 29 Dec 2005 11:19:13p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it serene?

> On 30 Dec 2005 05:06:06 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
> > wrote:
>
>>David and I are both launching back into Weigh****chers on Saturday. We
>>are both Type II diabetic and find that WW manages it well. Frankly,
>>low carb literally makes me sick, and I can't stay on it.
>
> James has nearly reversed his diabetes through exercise and healthy
> eating, including plenty of whole grains and other healthy carbs. I'm
> happy to hear that you found something that works for you, as well.
>
> serene

Thanks, Serene!

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu 29 Dec 2005 11:19:13p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it serene?
>
>> On 30 Dec 2005 05:06:06 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>David and I are both launching back into Weigh****chers on Saturday. We
>>>are both Type II diabetic and find that WW manages it well. Frankly,
>>>low carb literally makes me sick, and I can't stay on it.
>>
>> James has nearly reversed his diabetes through exercise and healthy
>> eating, including plenty of whole grains and other healthy carbs. I'm
>> happy to hear that you found something that works for you, as well.
>>
>> serene
>
> Thanks, Serene!
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright *¿*

You've heard me talk on and on about my f-i-l who has survived 2 different
cancers in the past 2 years. He has also had diabetes and was on
medication. He has been off medication for a few months now and is
controlling it by watching his food intake. Tho he is not following any
specific regimen -- he has a mind of his own -- but some of the preaching of
others has stopped some bad habits. I'm quite proud of him. And proud of
anyone that does something toward healthful living.
Dee Dee

On Thu 29 Dec 2005 11:54:36p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Dee
Randall?

>
> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Thu 29 Dec 2005 11:19:13p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it serene?
>>
>>> On 30 Dec 2005 05:06:06 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>>David and I are both launching back into Weigh****chers on Saturday.
>>>>We are both Type II diabetic and find that WW manages it well.
>>>>Frankly, low carb literally makes me sick, and I can't stay on it.
>>>
>>> James has nearly reversed his diabetes through exercise and healthy
>>> eating, including plenty of whole grains and other healthy carbs. I'm
>>> happy to hear that you found something that works for you, as well.
>>>
>>> serene
>>
>> Thanks, Serene!
>>
>> --
>> Wayne Boatwright *¿*
>
> You've heard me talk on and on about my f-i-l who has survived 2
> different cancers in the past 2 years. He has also had diabetes and was
> on medication. He has been off medication for a few months now and is
> controlling it by watching his food intake. Tho he is not following any
> specific regimen -- he has a mind of his own -- but some of the
> preaching of others has stopped some bad habits. I'm quite proud of
> him. And proud of anyone that does something toward healthful living.
> Dee Dee

Thanks, Dee. Honestly, we need the discipline of a program we can follow.
We were on WW for quite a while before David had his bypass surgery, but
haven't gone back since then. We know it's time! Our BG are pretty well
controlled medically, but we'd like to work ourselves away from the drugs.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.

On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:59:38 -0600, Damsel in dis Dress
> wrote:

>I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
>as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
>I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
>weight loss.
>
>I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
>choices.
>
>Carol

I've was on South Beach for several months this year, then fell off
the wagon. However, a couple of workmates were on it and swore by it.
One said she found it much easier than WW, as you didn't need to count
points. I found it pretty easy too.

The first two weeks are the hardest, when your choices are limited. It
widens out after that. It's nowhere near as limiting as Atkins and
there's a pretty good range of foods allowed.

After the New Year I plan to diet again. I haven't decided yet whether
to do SB again or WW.

Kathy in NZ

In article >,
Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> On Thu 29 Dec 2005 10:43:48p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Damsel in dis
> Dress?
>
> > On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:36:23 -0800, Dan Abel > wrote:
> >
> >> In article >,
> >> Damsel in dis Dress > wrote:
> >>
> >> > I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> >> > as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.

> >> There's an alt.support.diabetes group.

> There's also alt.food.diabetic

That sounds like a much better group. I just ran into:

misc.health.diabetes

also.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:36:23 -0800, Dan Abel > wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> Damsel in dis Dress > wrote:
>>
>> > I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
>> > as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>> >

I posted a fairly lengthy reply to your message in alt.support.diet.low-carb
(although you are correct that the majority seem to be Atkins). I find SB
very easy to follow -- basically, you should look at the list of "foods to
enjoy" and "foods to avoid" for Phases 1 and 2. I simply select from those
lists, and it has been exceptionally (after the first 2 weeks, which are
very rigid -- but sticking to Phase 1 really did eliminate my old cravings
for carbs). I also have diabetes, and SB has been a tremendous help to me.
As I explained in my other message, I have also eliminated *all* pasta,
flour, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (and that goes beyond SB but has had
a clear beneficial effect on my glucose readings, which are now always in
the "normal" range without any medication).

MaryL

> So I have only a vague concept of the diet at
> this point. It does seem a lot more do-able than Atkins was.
>
> Good fats, good carbs.
>
> Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.
>
> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.
>
> Carol

I'm not, but from the PBS 'Frontline' show I saw the other night about diets
it seems to make the most sense to me.

Oddly enough, the host of the show was the (then) little boy who played
Gilbert, from 'Leave it to Beaver' LOL In this show he talks about how back
in the 1950's everyone was encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
Remember those starving kids in China! Now he's looking for a diet that
will give him healthy choices and also satisfy the palate. It was an
interesting program. Check your local PBS listings to see if Frontline will
show it again.

Jill

jmcquown wrote:
> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>
>>I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
>>as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>>
>>I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
>>weight loss.
>>
>>I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
>>choices.
>>
>>Carol
>
>
> I'm not, but from the PBS 'Frontline' show I saw the other night about diets
> it seems to make the most sense to me.
>
> Oddly enough, the host of the show was the (then) little boy who played
> Gilbert, from 'Leave it to Beaver' LOL In this show he talks about how back
> in the 1950's everyone was encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
> Remember those starving kids in China! Now he's looking for a diet that
> will give him healthy choices and also satisfy the palate. It was an
> interesting program. Check your local PBS listings to see if Frontline will
> show it again.
>
> Jill
>
>

it's on again tonight at 3:30 am, in the Detroit area

--

saerah

http://anisaerah.blogspot.com/

"Peace is not an absence of war, it is a virtue, a state of mind, a
disposition for benevolence, confidence, justice."
-Baruch Spinoza

"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly
what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There
is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-Douglas Adams

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 04:32:11 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

> I posted a fairly lengthy reply to your message in alt.support.diet.low-carb
> (although you are correct that the majority seem to be Atkins). I find SB
> very easy to follow -- basically, you should look at the list of "foods to
> enjoy" and "foods to avoid" for Phases 1 and 2. I simply select from those
> lists, and it has been exceptionally (after the first 2 weeks, which are
> very rigid -- but sticking to Phase 1 really did eliminate my old cravings
> for carbs). I also have diabetes, and SB has been a tremendous help to me.
> As I explained in my other message, I have also eliminated *all* pasta,
> flour, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (and that goes beyond SB but has had
> a clear beneficial effect on my glucose readings, which are now always in
> the "normal" range without any medication).

Thank you, Mary. It looks like you're the only person I can talk to
in the other group who'll understand. I'm glad you're here, too. It's
hard to lower your nasty fats when everyone around you is encouraging
you to eat fatty meats, etc.

I do thank you for the post you made in asdlc. I was thinking of just
talking to you in e-mail, since the guidelines of Atkins and SBD are
so different. I'll be in touch as I have questions.

Can't wait for my large print book to arrive.

Thanks again, Mary!
Carol

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:

> I'm not, but from the PBS 'Frontline' show I saw the other night about diets
> it seems to make the most sense to me.

Same here. It's not nearly as restrictive as Atkins, as far as I can
tell. I want a sane eating plan for my diabetes, and this guy's
approach doesn't seem to create neurotic monsters because he doesn't
make you count anything. Just have normal meals within the allowable
range.

Carol

In article >,
Damsel in dis Dress > wrote:

> I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.
>
> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.
>
> Carol

Look around at the National Institutes of Health site - you can figure
out how to find it. I used their TLC plan for cholesterol reduction and
considerable weight loss. That plan, though, is not, I think, low
carbohydrate but I'd bet they've got something that is. Or check for
some other (appropriate) groups, either on Usenet or maybe Yahoo groups.
alt.food.diabetic ?
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 12-22-05

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu 29 Dec 2005 11:54:36p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Dee
> Randall?
>
>>
>> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> On Thu 29 Dec 2005 11:19:13p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it serene?
>>>
>>>> On 30 Dec 2005 05:06:06 +0100, Wayne Boatwright
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>David and I are both launching back into Weigh****chers on Saturday.
>>>>>We are both Type II diabetic and find that WW manages it well.
>>>>>Frankly, low carb literally makes me sick, and I can't stay on it.
>>>>
>>>> James has nearly reversed his diabetes through exercise and healthy
>>>> eating, including plenty of whole grains and other healthy carbs. I'm
>>>> happy to hear that you found something that works for you, as well.
>>>>
>>>> serene
>>>
>>> Thanks, Serene!
>>>
>>> --
>>> Wayne Boatwright *¿*
>>
>> You've heard me talk on and on about my f-i-l who has survived 2
>> different cancers in the past 2 years. He has also had diabetes and was
>> on medication. He has been off medication for a few months now and is
>> controlling it by watching his food intake. Tho he is not following any
>> specific regimen -- he has a mind of his own -- but some of the
>> preaching of others has stopped some bad habits. I'm quite proud of
>> him. And proud of anyone that does something toward healthful living.
>> Dee Dee
>
> Thanks, Dee. Honestly, we need the discipline of a program we can follow.
> We were on WW for quite a while before David had his bypass surgery, but
> haven't gone back since then. We know it's time! Our BG are pretty well
> controlled medically, but we'd like to work ourselves away from the drugs.
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright *¿*

Such good thinking, Wayne. I've worked my way out of a number of drugs in
the last year or so that were devastating to me. Good luck with WW.
Dee Dee

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 04:32:11 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
>> I posted a fairly lengthy reply to your message in
>> alt.support.diet.low-carb
>> (although you are correct that the majority seem to be Atkins). I find
>> SB
>> very easy to follow -- basically, you should look at the list of "foods
>> to
>> enjoy" and "foods to avoid" for Phases 1 and 2. I simply select from
>> those
>> lists, and it has been exceptionally (after the first 2 weeks, which are
>> very rigid -- but sticking to Phase 1 really did eliminate my old
>> cravings
>> for carbs). I also have diabetes, and SB has been a tremendous help to
>> me.
>> As I explained in my other message, I have also eliminated *all* pasta,
>> flour, rice, potatoes, and added sugar (and that goes beyond SB but has
>> had
>> a clear beneficial effect on my glucose readings, which are now always in
>> the "normal" range without any medication).
>
> Thank you, Mary. It looks like you're the only person I can talk to
> in the other group who'll understand. I'm glad you're here, too. It's
> hard to lower your nasty fats when everyone around you is encouraging
> you to eat fatty meats, etc.
>
> I do thank you for the post you made in asdlc. I was thinking of just
> talking to you in e-mail, since the guidelines of Atkins and SBD are
> so different. I'll be in touch as I have questions.
>
> Can't wait for my large print book to arrive.
>
> Thanks again, Mary!
> Carol

I would be happy to answer questions by email (at least, based on my
experience -- I'm no expert). One negative reaction I had to the book is
that it has far too many "anecdotes," which cuts down on the amount of
instructive text. That's a minor criticism, though. I found lots of solid
information, and the diet has been very easy to follow. There are also some
very good recipes in the back of the book, and SB now has a "Quick & Easy"
cookbook that emphasizes ease of preparation/cooking and a limited number of
ingredients for each recipe. As I said earlier, just keep the "foods to
enjoy" and "foods to avoid" lists with you. Soon, they will be second
nature and you will carry the lists in your head. I haven't even had any
trouble eating out. I just watch for anything that's not on the diet and
ask for substitutions. For example, if pasta is a side dish, I ask for
steamed veggies instead. Likewise, I always ask for no croutons, and I
never eat the bread. However, I never ask the servers not to bring bread to
the table (a suggestion I read elsewhere) because that is unfair to other
people at the table. Yesterday, I ordered steak and portabella fajitas --
but I had the server leave off the tortillas and just ate the tortilla
ingredients as a platter dish. You do have to keep even that type of eating
to an infrequent occasion, though, because the sauces can be loaded with
hiddfen fats and sugars. Once I got past the first 2 weeks, I found that it
doesn't even bother me to have fresh bread at the table or to watch others
eat the type of sugary desserts I once loved. Omelets and salads become a
staple when traveling.

Most people on the low-carb newsgroup group don't believe in low fat (as you
said), but I feel much better about the SB approach than the Atkins approach
because SB emphasizes low-fat meats and cheeses. SB does recommend olive
oil, and I use that for salad dressings and for cooking stir fry dishes,
etc. -- in fact, I deliberately add some of that because it is supposed to
be heart healthy (not *too* much, though, because all fats contain the same
calories). If I want an *occasional* sandwich, I get low-fat deli meat
(such as the thin-sliced 98% fat-free prepackaged meats), and I use only
Ezekiel bread. That is a flourless bread made from sprouted grains, and it
does not cause any spikes in my glucose readings (unlike flour, where even
whole wheat bread caused problems). I must admit that it is rather
"cardboardy," so I only eat it toasted.

I still eat snacks (in fact, I find that I feel much better if I have
morning and afternoon or evening snacks -- it probably helps keep glucose
more level). However, my snacks now consist of such things as cottage
cheese with fruit, fresh strawberries and/or blueberries with some plain non
fat yogurt, nuts (good for you -- but again, don't go overboard because they
have quite a few calories), a handful of mini carrots and a slice of low-fat
cheese, an apple with a wedge of low-fat cheese Laughing Cow cheese (watch
for it and always keep some on hand -- it is highly recommended by SB, and
it will give you a low-fat "spreadable" cheese that you can use on veggies),
*once in a while* (very infrequent) I will have Ezekiel toast with peanut
butter, etc. I really like raw cauliflower -- I can eat unlimited
quantities of that, and it has a "nutty" taste and texture. I always had a
real sweet tooth, but I also love fresh fruit. So, that is now both my
dessert and some of my snacks. I do *not* add any sweetener, though (not
even the permissable artificial sweeteners because I don't want to
reactivate my sweet tooth). Fortunately, I *like* unsweetened fresh fruit,
so that is not a problem. I find that I don't even need to engage in
portion control. If I eat the right types of things, portions take care of
themselves. You are never supposed to go hungry on SB (unlike some diets).
If you are hungry, *eat* -- but eat the right types of food.

I hope some of this helps. Feel free to send email (remember, my addy is
valid except that you first need to "take-out-the-litter").

MaryL

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
>I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
> as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
> I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
> weight loss.
>
> I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
> choices.
>
> Carol

Follow-up to the lengthy messag I just posted: You can also go to the SB
web page and sign up for "The Daily Dish." They would like for you to sign
up for their *paid* newsgroup, but "The Daily Dish" is a free daily message
from SB that contains tips and often some recipes. In addition, there is a
newsgroup specifically intended to provide recipes for diebetics
(alt.food.diabetic). The recipes often are not as low-carb as I want, but
you can pick-and-choose.

MaryL

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, jmcquown wrote:

> In this show he talks about how back in the 1950's everyone was
> encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
> Remember those starving kids in China!

That is sooo true! We had to sit at the table until we finished every
scrap. You also need to remember that we were raised by people who
lived through the great Depression, so they had a different attitude
due to that experience.
--

Practice safe eating. Always use condiments.

sf wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, jmcquown wrote:
>
>> In this show he talks about how back in the 1950's everyone was
>> encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
>> Remember those starving kids in China!
>
> That is sooo true! We had to sit at the table until we finished every
> scrap. You also need to remember that we were raised by people who
> lived through the great Depression, so they had a different attitude
> due to that experience.

Yeah, but this is also the generation that showed films in school on how to
"duck and cover" under a school desk in case of a nuclear blast. Yeah,
huddling under that crappy wooden desk is gonna help. LOL

I have total respect for people who had to make do during the 1930's
American Depression. I've said here before, my father used to pick
dandylion greens for dinner. To this day he won't eat greens of any kind.
He calls greens "poor people's food". It reminds him of when they were dirt
poor. It's okay with me; I get his share of turnip greens

Jill

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > wrote:
>
>> I'm not, but from the PBS 'Frontline' show I saw the other night
>> about diets it seems to make the most sense to me.
>
> Same here. It's not nearly as restrictive as Atkins, as far as I can
> tell. I want a sane eating plan for my diabetes, and this guy's
> approach doesn't seem to create neurotic monsters because he doesn't
> make you count anything. Just have normal meals within the allowable
> range.
>
> Carol

It's funny you should mention counting. In the PBS show the host went to a
Weight Watchers meeting. He said it felt like a 12 step program except
about food. And you had to count every single thing you ate and document it
and OOOPS, don't go over in this category or you have to subtract from one
of those other food groups. Sounds too much like a math problem to me! And
I don't want to go to meetings <EBG>

Jill

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:31:39 -0600, jmcquown wrote:

> Yeah, but this is also the generation that showed films in school on how to
> "duck and cover" under a school desk in case of a nuclear blast. Yeah,
> huddling under that crappy wooden desk is gonna help. LOL

We also had bomb shelters.... as if we could hide there until the
radiation went away. More knowledge was acquired and now we know.
We still do duck and cover drills, except it's for earthquakes now.
--

Practice safe eating. Always use condiments.

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 12:36:33 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:

> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> > On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, "jmcquown"
> >
> > It's not nearly as restrictive as Atkins, as far as I can
> > tell. I want a sane eating plan for my diabetes, and this guy's
> > approach doesn't seem to create neurotic monsters because he doesn't
> > make you count anything. Just have normal meals within the allowable
> > range.
>
> It's funny you should mention counting. In the PBS show the host went to a
> Weight Watchers meeting. He said it felt like a 12 step program except
> about food. And you had to count every single thing you ate and document it
> and OOOPS, don't go over in this category or you have to subtract from one
> of those other food groups. Sounds too much like a math problem to me! And
> I don't want to go to meetings <EBG>

Yup, exactly. I read some of the book last night (I have trouble
reading normal sized print). I felt liberated, after following Atkins
a couple years ago.

Carol

"jmcquown" > wrote in message
. ..
> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, "jmcquown"
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I'm not, but from the PBS 'Frontline' show I saw the other night
>>> about diets it seems to make the most sense to me.
>>
>> Same here. It's not nearly as restrictive as Atkins, as far as I can
>> tell. I want a sane eating plan for my diabetes, and this guy's
>> approach doesn't seem to create neurotic monsters because he doesn't
>> make you count anything. Just have normal meals within the allowable
>> range.
>>
>> Carol
>
> It's funny you should mention counting. In the PBS show the host went to
> a
> Weight Watchers meeting. He said it felt like a 12 step program except
> about food. And you had to count every single thing you ate and document
> it
> and OOOPS, don't go over in this category or you have to subtract from one
> of those other food groups. Sounds too much like a math problem to me!
> And
> I don't want to go to meetings <EBG>
>
> Jill
>
>

I belonged to WW for awhile, and I had much the same complaints with it as
you mentioned. WW has been effective for many people, but I simply do not
like meetings and I absolutely *detested* the little games they play at most
WW groups. I had to keep an exact log of everything I ate and look up
points for everything. SB is much easier -- just keep a list (soon, I was
so familiar with the list that I didn't even need to carry a copy) of "foods
to enjoy" and "foods to avoid." Select from the "foods to enjoy." Pretty
simple, really -- and it has worked very well for me (in glucose readings,
cholesterol/triglycerides reduction, and weight reduction, plus I *feel*
much better).

MaryL

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 11:48:13 -0600, "MaryL"
-OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:

> Follow-up to the lengthy messag I just posted: You can also go to the SB
> web page and sign up for "The Daily Dish." They would like for you to sign
> up for their *paid* newsgroup, but "The Daily Dish" is a free daily message
> from SB that contains tips and often some recipes. In addition, there is a
> newsgroup specifically intended to provide recipes for diebetics
> (alt.food.diabetic). The recipes often are not as low-carb as I want, but
> you can pick-and-choose.

Thank you very much for both posts. South Beach sounds much more
sane than the Atkins approach. I'll miss some of my fatty meats, but
I'm absolutely filled with joy at the larger list of acceptable fruit.
Open face sandwiches are no problem, either. I'd been used to eating
only the filling.

We've decided to skip over the chocolate covered cherries and caramels
that we'd been planning on making for Sunday, when Crash's daughter
and her other family come here for Christmas. <G> Instead, we're
making an apple pie and a cheesecake. Not perfect, but better choices
than candy.

So my serious dieting will begin after that. I've been signed up for
the Daily Dish for some time. I have over 100 of them in their very
own folder. )

Thanks so much, Mary. Did you get my e-mail?

Carol

"jmcquown" > wrote in message
. ..
> sf wrote:
>> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, jmcquown wrote:
>>
>>> In this show he talks about how back in the 1950's everyone was
>>> encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
>>> Remember those starving kids in China!
>>
>> That is sooo true! We had to sit at the table until we finished every
>> scrap. You also need to remember that we were raised by people who
>> lived through the great Depression, so they had a different attitude
>> due to that experience.
>
> Yeah, but this is also the generation that showed films in school on how
> to
> "duck and cover" under a school desk in case of a nuclear blast. Yeah,
> huddling under that crappy wooden desk is gonna help. LOL
>
> I have total respect for people who had to make do during the 1930's
> American Depression. I've said here before, my father used to pick
> dandylion greens for dinner. To this day he won't eat greens of any kind.
> He calls greens "poor people's food". It reminds him of when they were
> dirt
> poor. It's okay with me; I get his share of turnip greens
>
> Jill

My how things change:
For lobster lovers only (others won't care):

"It's interesting that lobsters have come to be regarded as a luxury food,
primarily eaten by wealthy people. Lobster as gourmet food is actually a
fairly recent phenomena. Lobsters used to be extraordinarily plentiful when
the settlers first came to North America. In fact, indentured servants in
the early colonies often had "lobster clauses" in their service contracts
specifying that they wouldn't have to eat lobster more than 3 times a week!"
From
http://zoneperfect.com/Site/content/...il.asp?id=5528
Dee Dee

"Damsel in dis Dress" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 11:48:13 -0600, "MaryL"
> -OUT-THE-LITTER> wrote:
>
>> Follow-up to the lengthy messag I just posted: You can also go to the SB
>> web page and sign up for "The Daily Dish." They would like for you to
>> sign
>> up for their *paid* newsgroup, but "The Daily Dish" is a free daily
>> message
>> from SB that contains tips and often some recipes. In addition, there is
>> a
>> newsgroup specifically intended to provide recipes for diebetics
>> (alt.food.diabetic). The recipes often are not as low-carb as I want,
>> but
>> you can pick-and-choose.
>
> Thank you very much for both posts. South Beach sounds much more
> sane than the Atkins approach. I'll miss some of my fatty meats, but
> I'm absolutely filled with joy at the larger list of acceptable fruit.
> Open face sandwiches are no problem, either. I'd been used to eating
> only the filling.
>
> We've decided to skip over the chocolate covered cherries and caramels
> that we'd been planning on making for Sunday, when Crash's daughter
> and her other family come here for Christmas. <G> Instead, we're
> making an apple pie and a cheesecake. Not perfect, but better choices
> than candy.
>
> So my serious dieting will begin after that. I've been signed up for
> the Daily Dish for some time. I have over 100 of them in their very
> own folder. )
>
> Thanks so much, Mary. Did you get my e-mail?
>
> Carol

I have been gone for the afternoon, and now I'm off to visit my mother in
the nursing home. I'll check my e-mail as soon as I get back and send you a
response.

MaryL

MaryL wrote:
> "jmcquown" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
>>> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, "jmcquown"
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm not, but from the PBS 'Frontline' show I saw the other night
>>>> about diets it seems to make the most sense to me.
>>>
>>> Same here. It's not nearly as restrictive as Atkins, as far as I
>>> can tell. I want a sane eating plan for my diabetes, and this guy's
>>> approach doesn't seem to create neurotic monsters because he doesn't
>>> make you count anything. Just have normal meals within the
>>> allowable range.
>>>
>>> Carol
>>
>> It's funny you should mention counting. In the PBS show the host
>> went to a
>> Weight Watchers meeting. He said it felt like a 12 step program
>> except about food. And you had to count every single thing you ate
>> and document it
>> and OOOPS, don't go over in this category or you have to subtract
>> from one of those other food groups. Sounds too much like a math
>> problem to me! And
>> I don't want to go to meetings <EBG>
>>
>> Jill
>>
>>
>
> I belonged to WW for awhile, and I had much the same complaints with
> it as you mentioned. WW has been effective for many people, but I
> simply do not like meetings and I absolutely *detested* the little
> games they play at most WW groups. I had to keep an exact log of
> everything I ate and look up points for everything. SB is much
> easier -- just keep a list (soon, I was so familiar with the list
> that I didn't even need to carry a copy) of "foods to enjoy" and
> "foods to avoid." Select from the "foods to enjoy." Pretty simple,
> really -- and it has worked very well for me (in glucose readings,
> cholesterol/triglycerides reduction, and weight reduction, plus I
> *feel* much better).
>
> MaryL

The patting everyone on the back made it look like a public Alcoholics
Anonymous meeting. The idea of "games" makes me think of those ridiculous
things they made us do in Corporate America called "team building". Rah
rah, shish-koom-ba stuff. Um. No, comment.

Jill

"jmcquown" > wrote

> The patting everyone on the back made it look like a public Alcoholics
> Anonymous meeting. The idea of "games" makes me think of those ridiculous
> things they made us do in Corporate America called "team building". Rah
> rah, shish-koom-ba stuff. Um. No, comment.

AHHHHH!! You gave me flashbacks, the words "team"
and "building" are not to be used next to each other near me!
(laugh)

nancy (eating bowties with sauce, meatball *and* sausage)

Nancy Young wrote:
> "jmcquown" > wrote
>
>> The patting everyone on the back made it look like a public
>> Alcoholics Anonymous meeting. The idea of "games" makes me think of
>> those ridiculous things they made us do in Corporate America called
>> "team building". Rah rah, shish-koom-ba stuff. Um. No, comment.
>
> AHHHHH!! You gave me flashbacks, the words "team"
> and "building" are not to be used next to each other near me!
> (laugh)
>
> nancy (eating bowties with sauce, meatball *and* sausage)

Wooo Hooo! Sounds good to me! Now, come help me build this stupid thing
with coins and sugar cubes; it's a team building exercise, doncha know

Jill

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 16:12:20 -0600, "jmcquown"
> wrote:

> The patting everyone on the back made it look like a public Alcoholics
> Anonymous meeting. The idea of "games" makes me think of those ridiculous
> things they made us do in Corporate America called "team building". Rah
> rah, shish-koom-ba stuff. Um. No, comment.

You belonged to Weight Watchers?

Carol

Damsel in dis Dress wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 16:12:20 -0600, "jmcquown"
> > wrote:
>
>> The patting everyone on the back made it look like a public
>> Alcoholics Anonymous meeting. The idea of "games" makes me think of
>> those ridiculous things they made us do in Corporate America called
>> "team building". Rah rah, shish-koom-ba stuff. Um. No, comment.
>
> You belonged to Weight Watchers?
>
> Carol

No, I was talking about what they showed on PBS on 'Frontline'. I *did*
have to go through ridiculous team-building routines for years. At one
point they blind-folded us, split us into teams and made us walk a line
without stepping off, with encouragement from my "team" on the opposite side
of the room. We had to accomplish this while carrying stuffed animals
without using our hands and don't step off the "line". Oh, and someone from
the "opposite" team was walking towards us at the same time, also being
encouraged by their team, and we had to get around each other. Without
stepping off the line. So it's like walking a tightrope on the ground.

It was like a really bizarre road sobriety test. And this was supposed to
make us all work better together as a team. How does that work? Someone
explain it to me, please. We could have been getting WORK done! LOL

Jill

Dee Randall wrote:
> "jmcquown" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> sf wrote:
>>> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 07:39:04 -0600, jmcquown wrote:
>>>
>>>> In this show he talks about how back in the 1950's everyone was
>>>> encouraged to eat, eat, eat... clean your plate!
>>>> Remember those starving kids in China!
>>>
>>> That is sooo true! We had to sit at the table until we finished
>>> every scrap. You also need to remember that we were raised by
>>> people who lived through the great Depression, so they had a
>>> different attitude
>>> due to that experience.
>>
>> Yeah, but this is also the generation that showed films in school on
>> how to
>> "duck and cover" under a school desk in case of a nuclear blast.
>> Yeah, huddling under that crappy wooden desk is gonna help. LOL
>>
>> I have total respect for people who had to make do during the 1930's
>> American Depression. I've said here before, my father used to pick
>> dandylion greens for dinner. To this day he won't eat greens of any
>> kind. He calls greens "poor people's food". It reminds him of when
>> they were dirt
>> poor. It's okay with me; I get his share of turnip greens
>>
>> Jill
>
> My how things change:
> For lobster lovers only (others won't care):
>
> "It's interesting that lobsters have come to be regarded as a luxury
> food, primarily eaten by wealthy people. Lobster as gourmet food is
> actually a fairly recent phenomena. Lobsters used to be
> extraordinarily plentiful when the settlers first came to North
> America. In fact, indentured servants in the early colonies often had
> "lobster clauses" in their service contracts specifying that they
> wouldn't have to eat lobster more than 3 times a week!" From
> http://zoneperfect.com/Site/content/...il.asp?id=5528
> Dee Dee

I have to think the first people to eat lobsters observed sea birds and
other animals (beavers, marmots, etc.) not afraid of water catching them and
eating them. Hence, they became part of our diet. Same thing with mussels,
clams, shrimp, etc. Why else would anyone think to eat something looking
like that? LOL

Jill

Wayne Boatwright > writes:

>Thanks, Dee. Honestly, we need the discipline of a program we can follow.
>We were on WW for quite a while before David had his bypass surgery, but
>haven't gone back since then. We know it's time! Our BG are pretty well
>controlled medically, but we'd like to work ourselves away from the drugs.

Best of luck! It's definitely possible. When my BP got too high I
was put on some pretty hefty drugs, because I was allergic to all the
lower-level drugs I should have been on. The pills I took were giving
me some serious side-effects I didn't enjoy. Exercise has allowed me to
get off the pills, at least for now, so I definitely understand where
you and David are coming from.

Stacia

On Thu, 29 Dec 2005 21:59:38 -0600, Damsel in dis Dress
> wrote:

>I posted to the low-carb group earlier, and it's looking pretty bleak
>as far as SBD activity there. It's pretty much an Atkins group.
>
>I'll be following the diet to control my diabetes, not primarily for
>weight loss.
>
>I'd just like someone I can talk to when I'm looking for healthful
>choices.
>
>Carol

Michael Odom's wife is on South Beach. He has posted some menus and
recipes of things he made for her.

--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

On Fri 30 Dec 2005 04:46:20p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Glitter
Ninja?

> Wayne Boatwright > writes:
>
>>Thanks, Dee. Honestly, we need the discipline of a program we can
>>follow. We were on WW for quite a while before David had his bypass
>>surgery, but haven't gone back since then. We know it's time! Our BG
>>are pretty well controlled medically, but we'd like to work ourselves
>>away from the drugs.
>
> Best of luck! It's definitely possible. When my BP got too high I
> was put on some pretty hefty drugs, because I was allergic to all the
> lower-level drugs I should have been on. The pills I took were giving
> me some serious side-effects I didn't enjoy. Exercise has allowed me to
> get off the pills, at least for now, so I definitely understand where
> you and David are coming from.
>
> Stacia
>

Thank you, Stacia. That's incouraging!

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.

On Fri 30 Dec 2005 05:03:59p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Wayne
Boatwright?

> On Fri 30 Dec 2005 04:46:20p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Glitter
> Ninja?
>
>> Wayne Boatwright > writes:
>>
>>>Thanks, Dee. Honestly, we need the discipline of a program we can
>>>follow. We were on WW for quite a while before David had his bypass
>>>surgery, but haven't gone back since then. We know it's time! Our BG
>>>are pretty well controlled medically, but we'd like to work ourselves
>>>away from the drugs.
>>
>> Best of luck! It's definitely possible. When my BP got too high I
>> was put on some pretty hefty drugs, because I was allergic to all the
>> lower-level drugs I should have been on. The pills I took were giving
>> me some serious side-effects I didn't enjoy. Exercise has allowed me to
>> get off the pills, at least for now, so I definitely understand where
>> you and David are coming from.
>>
>> Stacia
>>
>
> Thank you, Stacia. That's incouraging!
>

Make that "encouraging"! <g>

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.