Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Wed 01 Feb 2006 06:15:46a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Glitter
> Ninja?
>
> > Dan Abel > writes:
> >> cathyxyz > wrote:
> >>> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> >
> >>> > Never until reading it here have I heard of people
> >>> > going to a funeral anticipating what kind of food was going to be
> >>> > served, much less writing a review of it afterward, and even
> >>> > comparing it to a host of other funeral meals they've had.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks, Wayne. Someone finally understood what I meant.
> >>>
> >>> I guess if you read Usenet long enough, you'll eventually hear
> >>> everything. :-)
> >>>
> >>> Yup, a lot of BS from "big-headed" ignoramuses
> >
> >>This hurts me. I respect both of you, but I just can't agree. We all
> >>deal with grief in different ways.
> >
> > I agree. I know we are all entitled to our own opinions, but did
> > cathy (and Wayne) just call those who disagreed with them ignoramuses?
> > Maybe I misunderstood the context.
> > As for this particular review, the food was catered. I see nothing
> > wrong with a critique of a caterer's food, just because it was served at
> > a funeral.
>
> Where did you get that, Stacia? I didn't call anyone anything. I only
> expressed that I felt the discussion might be considered disrespectful and
> inappropriate.

I would guess it was because you "laughed" at MY remark about people on
Usenet in general being a bunch of ignoramuses. Sheesh. Everybody
around here goes on and on about all of us being entitled to our
opinion, but when we give it, they take umbrage! Not to mention
accusing people of saying (or meaning) things they didn't. I think I'll
borrow your old sig: Okay, I take it back, UN-screw you heh heh.
Cheers
Cathy(xyz)

On Wed 01 Feb 2006 06:46:47p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it cathyxyz?

>
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>> On Wed 01 Feb 2006 06:15:46a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Glitter
>> Ninja?
>>
>> > Dan Abel > writes:
>> >> cathyxyz > wrote:
>> >>> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>> >
>> >>> > Never until reading it here have I heard of people
>> >>> > going to a funeral anticipating what kind of food was going to be
>> >>> > served, much less writing a review of it afterward, and even
>> >>> > comparing it to a host of other funeral meals they've had.
>> >>>
>> >>> Thanks, Wayne. Someone finally understood what I meant.
>> >>>
>> >>> I guess if you read Usenet long enough, you'll eventually hear
>> >>> everything. :-)
>> >>>
>> >>> Yup, a lot of BS from "big-headed" ignoramuses
>> >
>> >>This hurts me. I respect both of you, but I just can't agree. We
>> >>all deal with grief in different ways.
>> >
>> > I agree. I know we are all entitled to our own opinions, but did
>> > cathy (and Wayne) just call those who disagreed with them
>> > ignoramuses? Maybe I misunderstood the context.
>> > As for this particular review, the food was catered. I see nothing
>> > wrong with a critique of a caterer's food, just because it was served
>> > at a funeral.
>>
>> Where did you get that, Stacia? I didn't call anyone anything. I only
>> expressed that I felt the discussion might be considered disrespectful
>> and inappropriate.
>
> I would guess it was because you "laughed" at MY remark about people on
> Usenet in general being a bunch of ignoramuses. Sheesh. Everybody
> around here goes on and on about all of us being entitled to our
> opinion, but when we give it, they take umbrage! Not to mention
> accusing people of saying (or meaning) things they didn't. I think I'll
> borrow your old sig: Okay, I take it back, UN-screw you heh heh.
> Cheers
> Cathy(xyz)

There were times, I believe before you began posting here, that I was
accused of being overly sensitive to what other posters said about me, but
I doubt any moreso than how some folks have reacted to what either you or
I have said in this thread.

You can never please everybody and, quite frankly, why should you try.
Any individual's opinion is as valid as the next, at least to them. I
give up!

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

Wayne Boatwright wrote:


> You can never please everybody and, quite frankly, why should you try.
> Any individual's opinion is as valid as the next, at least to them. I
> give up!

True. I'm off to bed... its 4am here, couldn't sleep tonight. Take
care.
Cheers
Cathy(xyz)

On Wed 01 Feb 2006 07:02:55p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it cathyxyz?

>
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
>
>> You can never please everybody and, quite frankly, why should you try.
>> Any individual's opinion is as valid as the next, at least to them. I
>> give up!
>
> True. I'm off to bed... its 4am here, couldn't sleep tonight. Take
> care.
> Cheers
> Cathy(xyz)

G'nite!

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

Margaret Suran wrote:
>
> There is such a thin line when it comes to something like this. When is
> something catered and when is it not? If I telephone Zabar's and order
> several platters of lox and herring and white fish and sturgeon, as
> almost all mourners in this neighborhood do, it is not considered a
> catered affair. If, on the other hand, I telephone the restaurant down
> the block and order hot and cold appetizers instead, it most likely
> would be considered a catered meal. A real difference or just a matter
> of semantics?


That's an interesting point. I hadn't thought about it before you
wrote, but if the family of the deceased, calls Zabar's and orders the
platters, then that strikes me as a catered funeral, and I don't care
for the idea. If friends of the family pick up a platter on their way
to the family's home, then that's not catering; that's just bringing
food, and I think it is very thoughtful. Whether the food is from a
deli, gourmet shop, or restaurant is irrelevant. (For those of you
about to point out that my distinction makes no sense, save your breath.
I was aware of it as soon as I wrote it myself.)


--Lia

Julia Altshuler wrote on 01 Feb 2006 in rec.food.cooking

> (For those of you
> about to point out that my distinction makes no sense, save your breath.
> I was aware of it as soon as I wrote it myself.)
>

But it does make sense...You spend the money, the time and decide what
food. Plus you deliver...All of this might not seem like much, but it does
lift a small burden off of the berieved. It is 1 less thing they have to
think about and either order or make, when they might not feel like doing
such.

--
The eyes are the mirrors....
But the ears...Ah the ears.
The ears keep the hat up.

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> J wrote:
>
> >
> > I've only been to a few funerals, but none were catered. Is this
> > something common in some parts of the world? When my grandfathers
> > and grandmother died, all the food was home-cooked and brought by
> > friends. Their friends brought enough food to feed us (my
> > family, including two teenage male athletes) for days. Catered food
> > at a funeral just seems... wrong. Is it common? If it matters,
> > I am from Northern Wisconsin. Lots of hotdishes at funerals. All
> > homemade by little old ladies. Not the Jam Mistress, but our own
> > Jewish old ladies.
>
> Is that not still catered? I remember when it was customary for people going
> to a funeral to take a plate of sandwiches, a casserole, some cookies, cake or
> something to a funeral. My wife's church caters funerals all the time. The
> women's group charges a set amount per person depending on whether they are
> having just tea and coffee or if it will include sandwiches, cookies and
> veggie plates etc.
>
> Personally, I think it is a bum deal for the ladies. They pay for the
> ingredients out of their own pockets. The women's group collects the money and
> uses it to buy things for the church. Like many organizations, it is usually a
> small group of members who belong to the group, so they are the people who are
> always having to provide the goods at their own expense and do all the work.
> My mother didn't mind doing it, but what did it for her was when there were
> leftovers and the family didn't want them. The same people who had paid for
> the ingredients and provided the labour were expected to take them home.....
> and to pay for what they took.

Hmmm, that's interesting. I believe that towards the end of my tenure
as Mrs. ChurchLady, our church assessed a fee for the Dead Spread. I
don't remember if the Circles provided the fixin's at that point or if
Millie went shopping for the ham and buns :-) I do recall other
occasions when calls would be made to the Circle leaders (a calling tree
thang) to contact their members with requests for hotdish or salad or
dessert for the post-service luncheon. It's just one of the things that
we did - it was one less thing for the family to have to think about at
a time when, Alex knows, they had PLENTY to think about! It was a
privilege to be able to help -- and these were our friends, besides. I
don't remember it as being an expensive thing to do, but I do believe
I'd take exception to paying for leftovers! LOL!!

Those were the days. Things are quite different now, I know.
Dual-income families mean that women no longer have the time to do those
kinds of things without stress. And I wonder if they'd have the
inclination even if they did have the time. I suspect that would be
reflected by the emotional investment they had in the church group. I
find it interesting how customs change.

Here's a recipe from Betty Crocker's Dinner For Two Cookbook - I used
this book extensively when I was a bride 40 years ago and it's handy
again now that the nest is empty. Or would be if I used recipes when I
cook. Ack! :-) This would be perfect for a Meen-a-soh-ta Dead Spread
in the 80s. I made it tonight - used the other half of the pound for
tacos for supper. I've other meals planned for a couple days; this may
go into the freezer for another occasion.


{ Magically and Mystically Exported from MasterCook Mac }

Macaroni Beef Saute

Recipe By: posted again to r.f.cooking by Barb Schaller, Dead Spread
Maven, 2-1-2006
Serving Size: 2
Preparation Time: 0:00
Categories: Entrees

Amount Measure Ingredient Preparation Method
1/2 # ground beef
1/2 cup uncooked elbow macaroni (I used about a cup of shells)
1/4 cup chopped onion
1/4 cup chopped green pepper (I used dehydrated and didn't measure)
1/2 clove garlic minced (forgot the garlic)
1/4 cup vegetable oil
1 can tomato juice (12 oz.) (about
1-2/3 cups) -- OK, I used a 28 ounce can of Red Gold Petite Diced
Tomatoes)
3/4 tsp. salt (didn't use it - doesn't need it)
1/8 tsp. pepper (forgot the pepper)
1 tsp. Worcestershire sauce (forgot the Worcestershire, too)

Saute beef, macaroni, onion, green pepper, and garlic in hot oil until
macaroni turns slightly yellow. Drain off excess fat. Add tomato juice
and seasonings; bring to boil. Cover and simmer 20 minutes. Uncover and
simmer for several more minutes or until sauce is reduced to desired
consistency. Makes 2 servings.

----------
Notes: Source: Betty Crocker's New Dinner for Two Cook Book, Golden
Press, New York, copyright 1964, by General Mills, page 93.

What'd I say about not using recipes?. . . <vbseg>


Per serving (excluding unknown items): 876 Calories; 85g Fat (86%
calories from fat); 20g Protein; 10g Carbohydrate; 96mg Cholesterol;
2167mg Sodium
Food Exchanges: 2 1/2 Lean Meat; 1 1/2 Vegetable; 15 1/2 Fat
_____
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-27-2006, The Best Dead Spread Yet

Mr Libido Incognito wrote:
> Julia Altshuler wrote on 01 Feb 2006 in rec.food.cooking
>
>
>>(For those of you
>>about to point out that my distinction makes no sense, save your breath.
>> I was aware of it as soon as I wrote it myself.)
>>
>
>
> But it does make sense...You spend the money, the time and decide what
> food. Plus you deliver...All of this might not seem like much, but it does
> lift a small burden off of the berieved. It is 1 less thing they have to
> think about and either order or make, when they might not feel like doing
> such.
>

This is nice if you know how many condolence visitors will come and
you are willing to supply one dish with enough servings for all and
there are enough others to do the same. Otherwise, it would turn into
a potluck affair, not something for a post-funeral meal. Also, some
Jewish people observe kosher laws and some dishes might not be
acceptable. For the Shivah, the period of mourning when more visitors
call and bring gifts of food, someone actually brought a shrimp dish.
It was easy enough to whisk it away and tell her that I would serve
it later, for dinner to the family, but I do not know what I would
have done if that dish had been standing on the table, among all the
Zabar's stuff.

After my husband's funeral, about fifty friends and relatives came
back to my apartment, with at least as many more trickling in later
on. I do not think that anybody could expect others to foot such a
bill, hundreds of dollars, nor think that in the time between the
services at the funeral parlor and the time we came back from the
short trip to the cemetery, services there and the trip back,
everything could have been purchased, arranged on platters (not that I
had that many) and been ready for us. My cleaning lady, Della and
three of my friends worked really hard to have everything ready in
time. While the trays were made up by the store, one of my friends
drove there and picked up everything. She forgot the bagels, all
twelve dozens of them and had to go back for them.

I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
(both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far more
private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in small
talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can imagine
this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends decide to
come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean well and
politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't see how
to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
have been there, please.


--Lia

Margaret Suran > wrote:
> This is nice if you know how many condolence visitors will come and
> you are willing to supply one dish with enough servings for all and
> there are enough others to do the same. Otherwise, it would turn into
> a potluck affair, not something for a post-funeral meal. Also, some

That's exactly what I mean. The funerals that I can remember
were effectively potluck affairs. The synagogue gave us a place
to hold them, and maybe the disposable plates/utensils, but that
was it. Our family couldn't afford a catered afair for hundreds
of people. Nor could anyone in the congregation. But everybody
brought what they could afford -- 99% home cooked. I ate
potato kugle everyday for a week after one of my grandpas died.
There was always more than enough food, although not necessarily
the largest variety. My mom's funeral beans are famous (homemade
baked beans that everybody loves).

Maybe potluck funerals are a symptom of my family's, eh,
working-class background. Or maybe it is a midwest thing.
We do love our hotdishes.

> Jewish people observe kosher laws and some dishes might not be
> acceptable. For the Shivah, the period of mourning when more visitors
> call and bring gifts of food, someone actually brought a shrimp dish.

LOL. Some jewish people observe kosher laws. My grandpa was a sailor,
and ate tons of shellfish in his days. But I get your point.
(well, maybe in your mind jews who aren't kosher aren't jews. call
us what you want. infidels? I prefer the term heathen, myself ;-)

> After my husband's funeral, about fifty friends and relatives came
> back to my apartment, with at least as many more trickling in later
> on. I do not think that anybody could expect others to foot such a
> bill, hundreds of dollars, nor think that in the time between the

Right, so everybody brings what they can. Nobody foots the bill.

> drove there and picked up everything. She forgot the bagels, all
> twelve dozens of them and had to go back for them.

Forgot the bagels!!!!

J

On Thu 02 Feb 2006 07:19:04a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Julia
Altshuler?

> I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
> general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
> future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
> way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
> (both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
> well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far more
> private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in small
> talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can imagine
> this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends decide to
> come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean well and
> politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't see how
> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
> have been there, please.

When my father died some time ago, we had exactly what you don't want,
hoards of friends and some family (our small family lived mostly out of
town). I wanted to make this as easy on my mother as possible, so ordered
finger food from one of our favorite restaurants, and also had a baked ham
with accompaniments, and some very good desserts. Honestly, I couldn't
wait until the last person left the house. We were exhausted and sad, and
we seriously needed some solitude and rest.

When my mother died several years later, I vowed that I would not repeat
this scenario. As it happens, the cemetery where my parents were buried is
quite large and has expansive facilities. The viewing and funeral service
was held in a lovely chapel on the grounds. Nearby, also on the grounds,
was a very "home like" banquet facility. We had a full meal catered there
with servers and someone to manage the entire thing. Timewise, it was
self-limited, and I didn't have to deal with a house full of people that I
wished would go home. We were able to go back home to peace and quiet to
be with our own thoughts, and nothing to clean up.

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

Julia Altshuler wrote:
> I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
> general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
> future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
> way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
> (both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
> well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far more
> private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in small
> talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can imagine
> this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends decide to
> come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean well and
> politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't see how
> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
> have been there, please.

It isn't just for you...it is for their own sake to comfort each other.
So do the gracious thing and allow them to congregate to share their own
grief in their own way, and when you've met your limit go to your room
and lie down. No one will begrudge you the privacy. You serve their
needs as well as your own. You might be surprised and receive some
comfort from their presence, their stories and memories of your parents
as well as getting to know people better that your parents enjoyed.
Sadly we sometimes hear the best stories only after their gone. Don't
miss your chance.
Goomba

Goomba38 wrote:

> You might be surprised and receive some
> comfort from their presence, their stories and memories of your parents
> as well as getting to know people better that your parents enjoyed.
> Sadly we sometimes hear the best stories only after their gone. Don't
> miss your chance.

My friend's son appreciated a story I told him about his grandfather after the
funeral. It was about running into "Al" about a year before he died. I asked
him how he was doing. Al's answer :

Well, I am doing pretty good for an old guy. I was just in to see my doctor
the other day and it went pretty well. You know, when men get old they have to
get their prostate checked. The doctor has to stick his finger up your ass,
and it's pretty uncomfortable. I was a little worried about, especially since
this new doctor is just a young guy and I have never been to him before. But I
have to tell you, this guy was pretty good. It didn't hurt a bit. I am trying
to figure out what he did differently. The old guy used to have be bend over
and then he'd put his left hand on my left shoulder and then use a finger on
his right hand. This guy must have been left handed because he had his right
hand on my shoulder. No, hold it. He had his left hand on my shoulder....
Come to think of it, that son of a bitch had both his hands on my shoulders.

In article >,
Julia Altshuler > wrote:
> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
> have been there, please.

You don't. The meal is always preceded by an invitation from the pulpit
or lectern or notice in the Order of Service bulletin. No notice, no
invitation, no announcement, no Dead Spread or reception. It might be
expected, but a word to a couple of your folks' old friends should get
the word out that there will be no such event.

A Dead Spread is probably the custom, and may likely be expected for its
opportunity to renew acquaintances and share fond memories of the Newly
Departed, but I don't this Miss Manners or Emily will hang you for
opting out. Not to worry, Toots!

And, please, don't anyone get your knickers in a bunch about
"opportunity to renew acquaintances" because the reality is that that IS
one of the reasons attend a funeral or memorial service. You see the
old neighbor from when you were a kid, exchange pleasantries about
mutual acquaintances; you run into the guy from the office where you
used to work when a former co-worker croaks and remember the others with
whom you both worked and find out what they're doing since the
reorganization and layoffs; you see your cousins who live in town but,
for whatever reasons, the only time you see them is at a family funeral
or wedding and remember when the Newly Departed Cousin used to always
try to tell you what to do when you were all children because they
could, by virtue of family seniority. Or thought they could. Or at
least tried to. That's just how it is. And then you all say, "Gosh, it
was really nice to see you again -- sorry that the circumstances aren't
happier -- and we should get together again soon, and not wait for a
funeral." And then you part ways, never seeing each other again until
the next common acquaintance or family member dies. Reality check.

(And if you really want to limit the number of mourners at a funeral, do
not place a public obituary in the local newsrag. There's no law that
says you have to.) Deal with that fallout when you're up to it. :-/
I hope you won't be planning services soon, Lia. Better than that, I
hope your folks have already done it on their own behalf. I'm thinking
about writing my own obituary. :-)
-Barb
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-27-2006, The Best Dead Spread Yet

On Thu 02 Feb 2006 12:58:10p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Melba's
Jammin'?

> In article >,
> Julia Altshuler > wrote:
>> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
>> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
>> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
>> have been there, please.
>
> You don't. The meal is always preceded by an invitation from the pulpit
> or lectern or notice in the Order of Service bulletin. No notice, no
> invitation, no announcement, no Dead Spread or reception. It might be
> expected, but a word to a couple of your folks' old friends should get
> the word out that there will be no such event.
>
> A Dead Spread is probably the custom, and may likely be expected for its
> opportunity to renew acquaintances and share fond memories of the Newly
> Departed, but I don't this Miss Manners or Emily will hang you for
> opting out. Not to worry, Toots!
>
> And, please, don't anyone get your knickers in a bunch about
> "opportunity to renew acquaintances" because the reality is that that IS
> one of the reasons attend a funeral or memorial service. You see the
> old neighbor from when you were a kid, exchange pleasantries about
> mutual acquaintances; you run into the guy from the office where you
> used to work when a former co-worker croaks and remember the others with
> whom you both worked and find out what they're doing since the
> reorganization and layoffs; you see your cousins who live in town but,
> for whatever reasons, the only time you see them is at a family funeral
> or wedding and remember when the Newly Departed Cousin used to always
> try to tell you what to do when you were all children because they
> could, by virtue of family seniority. Or thought they could. Or at
> least tried to. That's just how it is. And then you all say, "Gosh, it
> was really nice to see you again -- sorry that the circumstances aren't
> happier -- and we should get together again soon, and not wait for a
> funeral." And then you part ways, never seeing each other again until
> the next common acquaintance or family member dies. Reality check.
>
> (And if you really want to limit the number of mourners at a funeral, do
> not place a public obituary in the local newsrag. There's no law that
> says you have to.) Deal with that fallout when you're up to it. :-/
> I hope you won't be planning services soon, Lia. Better than that, I
> hope your folks have already done it on their own behalf. I'm thinking
> about writing my own obituary. :-)
> -Barb

I don't want a gravestone. All I want is a pair of stone hands clawing
their way through the turf, a hidden speaker yelling at people who come
too close to stop standing on me, and an epitaph that reads, "I knew this
would happen!"

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

"Melba's Jammin'" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> Julia Altshuler > wrote:
>> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
>> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
>> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
>> have been there, please.
>
> ; you see your cousins who live in town but,
> for whatever reasons, the only time you see them is at a family funeral
> or wedding>
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-27-2006, The Best Dead Spread Yet


Reading this reminds me of a funeral I attended of my grandmother's
sister-in-law back in the hills.
As my sister and I passed by, a couple of men sitting on the funeral parlor
porch, I heard one of them say, There goes the Wanstreet sisters. Wanstreet
is my grandmother's maiden name! They were probably happy to see and
identify us, even tho they were partly correct.
Dee Dee

Melba's Jammin' wrote:

>
> Macaroni Beef Saute
>
> Recipe By: posted again to r.f.cooking by Barb Schaller, Dead Spread
> Maven, 2-1-2006
> Serving Size: 2
> Preparation Time: 0:00
> Categories: Entrees
>
> Amount Measure Ingredient Preparation Method
> 1/2 # ground beef
> 1/2 cup uncooked elbow macaroni (I used about a cup of shells)
> 1/4 cup chopped onion
> 1/4 cup chopped green pepper (I used dehydrated and didn't measure)
> 1/2 clove garlic minced (forgot the garlic)
> 1/4 cup vegetable oil
> 1 can tomato juice (12 oz.) (about
> 1-2/3 cups) -- OK, I used a 28 ounce can of Red Gold Petite Diced
> Tomatoes)
> 3/4 tsp. salt (didn't use it - doesn't need it)
> 1/8 tsp. pepper (forgot the pepper)
> 1 tsp. Worcestershire sauce (forgot the Worcestershire, too)
>


Hah! This was served to us about twice a month in the Massachusetts
school cafterias but they called it "American Chop Suey" and they used
celery and omitted the green pepper, IIRC.

I've tried to make it a few times over the years w/o a recipe and now I
know what I was doing wrong--I was using an 8oz. pkg of elbows instead
of 1/2 cup and the proportions were never right (or I threw away a LOT
of cooked elbows!) Sometimes it pays to consult a recipe!

gloria p

Melba's Jammin' wrote:

> Hmmm, that's interesting. I believe that towards the end of my tenure
> as Mrs. ChurchLady, our church assessed a fee for the Dead Spread. I
> don't remember if the Circles provided the fixin's at that point or if
> Millie went shopping for the ham and buns :-) I do recall other
> occasions when calls would be made to the Circle leaders (a calling tree
> thang) to contact their members with requests for hotdish or salad or
> dessert for the post-service luncheon. It's just one of the things that
> we did - it was one less thing for the family to have to think about at
> a time when, Alex knows, they had PLENTY to think about! It was a
> privilege to be able to help -- and these were our friends, besides. I
> don't remember it as being an expensive thing to do,

You're right. It is not a terribly expensive thing to do. It is a good thing for
churches that there is a core of members that are willing to take on the work and
the expensive. The church is a part of their lives and its members a family of
friends (for the most part). So it is something that that they do for friends.
Were it not for that small circle of volunteers, the people who take advantage of
the situation would have to be paying some real money or do a lot of work for
themselves.

Wayne Boatwright wrote:

> I don't want a gravestone. All I want is a pair of stone hands clawing
> their way through the turf, a hidden speaker yelling at people who come
> too close to stop standing on me, and an epitaph that reads, "I knew this
> would happen!"

<LOL> Perfect...

Pastorio

Melba's Jammin' wrote:

> I'm thinking about writing my own obituary. :-)

Can you say those things in a family newspaper...?

Pastorio

On Thu 02 Feb 2006 02:43:55p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Bob (this
one)?

> Melba's Jammin' wrote:
>
> > I'm thinking about writing my own obituary. :-)
>
> Can you say those things in a family newspaper...?
>
> Pastorio
>

Perhaps more to the point, will there be enough room? :-)

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

"Bob (this one)" > wrote in message
...
> Melba's Jammin' wrote:
>
> > I'm thinking about writing my own obituary. :-)
>
> Can you say those things in a family newspaper...?

I thought hers was going into Midwest Tat's n Jams?

nancy

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> RNA Mueller wrote:
>
> > I don't know if that is a Canadian thing, or peculiar to your
> > wife's
> > church, or congregation or what, but I've never, ever heard of a
> > church group charging money to bring food to a funeral.
>
> The church charges no rent for the hall. It charges for a set fee per
> person for coffee, tea and juice. It charges another set fee per
> person for sandwiches, veggie plates and desserts . Those things are
> all provided by the members of the women's group. IIRC correctly it
> is $1.25 per person for drinks only or $4.25 for "the works".

Is this for _members_ of the church, or people who just show up
because they think they need to have a funeral at a church? I ask
because I've never heard of a church renting the parish hall for a
funeral. It is scheduled to be used if the family is going to use it
after the funeral, but no money is exchanged.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

Wayne Boatwright wrote on 02 Feb 2006 in rec.food.cooking

> When my mother died several years later, I vowed that I would not
> repeat this scenario. As it happens, the cemetery where my parents
> were buried is quite large and has expansive facilities. The viewing
> and funeral service was held in a lovely chapel on the grounds.
> Nearby, also on the grounds, was a very "home like" banquet facility.
> We had a full meal catered there with servers and someone to manage
> the entire thing. Timewise, it was self-limited, and I didn't have to
> deal with a house full of people that I wished would go home. We were
> able to go back home to peace and quiet to be with our own thoughts,
> and nothing to clean up.
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright o¨o
> ____________________
>

There is also the mater of "Stuff", Uncle joe would like the chest of
drawers as a keepsake, the neighbour is eyeing the stuffed fish on the
wall, People wanting to take this that and the other...that is very
disturbing as well...even if they mean well.

--
The eyes are the mirrors....
But the ears...Ah the ears.
The ears keep the hat up.

Goomba38 wrote:

> Julia Altshuler wrote:
> > I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
> > general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
> > future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
> > way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
> > (both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
> > well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far more
> > private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in small
> > talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can imagine
> > this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends decide to
> > come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean well and
> > politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't see how
> > to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
> > see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
> > exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
> > have been there, please.
>
> It isn't just for you...it is for their own sake to comfort each other.
> So do the gracious thing and allow them to congregate to share their own
> grief in their own way, and when you've met your limit go to your room
> and lie down. No one will begrudge you the privacy. You serve their
> needs as well as your own. You might be surprised and receive some
> comfort from their presence, their stories and memories of your parents
> as well as getting to know people better that your parents enjoyed.
> Sadly we sometimes hear the best stories only after their gone. Don't
> miss your chance.
> Goomba

It might be nice to mention the need for privacy and have another family
member pony up, or a friend to host a gathering. I think a person would have
to make it known that they couldn't emotionally deal with a pile of people.
That way the immediate family could pick up and leave when they wanted to. We
picnic'd for my mom & dad's gathering.
Edrena

Ranee Mueller wrote:

>
> > The church charges no rent for the hall. It charges for a set fee per
> > person for coffee, tea and juice. It charges another set fee per
> > person for sandwiches, veggie plates and desserts . Those things are
> > all provided by the members of the women's group. IIRC correctly it
> > is $1.25 per person for drinks only or $4.25 for "the works".
>
> Is this for _members_ of the church, or people who just show up
> because they think they need to have a funeral at a church? I ask
> because I've never heard of a church renting the parish hall for a
> funeral. It is scheduled to be used if the family is going to use it
> after the funeral, but no money is exchanged.

Well, that's the thing about it. It's basically for church members, but
anyone can take advantage of it. My father's memorial service was held at
my brother and sister in law's church. Other than weddings and funerals,
Dad hadn't set foot in a church for 40 years or so. We were given the
option of having a reception catered by the women's group but declined,
having at the house instead. However, my wife arranged for a post interment
service reception for my friend at her church. He belonged to the same
denomination, but attended a church in a nearby city when they lived in
this are. He had lived out of the country for 25 years or so. They also did
it for an elderly woman my wife knew who had previously been a member of
the church but had left it at least 10 years before she died.

As far as I understand it, it's not like anyone can come in and do it, but
it seems that so long as the church of the minister is involved in the
service you have the option to use the church hall and to be catered to by
the women's group.

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Ranee Mueller wrote:
>
> >
> > > The church charges no rent for the hall. It charges for a set fee per
> > > person for coffee, tea and juice. It charges another set fee per
> > > person for sandwiches, veggie plates and desserts . Those things are
> > > all provided by the members of the women's group. IIRC correctly it
> > > is $1.25 per person for drinks only or $4.25 for "the works".
> >
> > Is this for _members_ of the church, or people who just show up
> > because they think they need to have a funeral at a church? I ask
> > because I've never heard of a church renting the parish hall for a
> > funeral. It is scheduled to be used if the family is going to use it
> > after the funeral, but no money is exchanged.
>
> Well, that's the thing about it. It's basically for church members, but
> anyone can take advantage of it. My father's memorial service was held at
> my brother and sister in law's church. Other than weddings and funerals,
> Dad hadn't set foot in a church for 40 years or so. We were given the
> option of having a reception catered by the women's group but declined,
> having at the house instead. However, my wife arranged for a post interment
> service reception for my friend at her church. He belonged to the same
> denomination, but attended a church in a nearby city when they lived in
> this are. He had lived out of the country for 25 years or so. They also did
> it for an elderly woman my wife knew who had previously been a member of
> the church but had left it at least 10 years before she died.
>
> As far as I understand it, it's not like anyone can come in and do it, but
> it seems that so long as the church of the minister is involved in the
> service you have the option to use the church hall and to be catered to by
> the women's group.

I don't know how it works in Canada, but in the US, *somebody* has to
pay. I've been involved in church finances several times. Unless
*somebody* pays, then the church goes broke and closes. Buying and
running a church can be quite expensive.

One of the ways to offset the cost of the mortgage is to rent the
facility out. Unless managed carefully, this is a losing proposition.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

Dan Abel wrote:

>
> > As far as I understand it, it's not like anyone can come in and do it, but
> > it seems that so long as the church of the minister is involved in the
> > service you have the option to use the church hall and to be catered to by
> > the women's group.
>
> I don't know how it works in Canada, but in the US, *somebody* has to
> pay. I've been involved in church finances several times. Unless
> *somebody* pays, then the church goes broke and closes. Buying and
> running a church can be quite expensive.

Of course someone has to pay. The women of the group take turns making
sandwiches, cookies etc. They pay for the stuff out of their own pockets.
Someone pays the group for the food based on the number of people. The money
goes to the group, which in turn buys things for the church. It can get to be an
expensive proposition for those women if a lot of outsiders start showing up for
funerals, or when there is a series of very large funerals.

On Thu, 2 Feb 2006, Julia Altshuler wrote:

> I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
> general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
> future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
> way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
> (both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
> well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far more
> private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in small
> talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can imagine
> this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends decide to
> come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean well and
> politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't see how
> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
> have been there, please.
>
>
> --Lia
>
>

I totally understand what you are saying. Here, in the South, going back
to the house after the funeral is by invitation only.

Here, the food begins arriving at the house when the death is first known.
Generally, burial is 2 to 3 days after the death (depending on how early
in the day the death occurred and how far away family members are that are
coming in). The purpose of the food is to feed family members prior to the
funeral and then for several days after. It's not for any kind of "party".
It is to care for the family.

Friends come to the house with the food. Generally, a more
emotionally-removed relative or friend [or two or three] serves as an
in-house organizer for all the trafic.

The immediate family may or may not receive visitors, reitiring to a
different part of the house if and when they want to be alone or want to
receive a select visitor or two.

We have "visitation" at the funeral home the night before the funeral. The
day of the funeral everyone shows up at the funeral home (or church) and
then afterward there is the trip to the cemetery. At the cemetery there is
a good bit of milling around.

Most people take a moment to pay final respects to the family. At this
time, the family will or will not extend an invitation to "come to the
house". It totally depends on the family.

Some people need to be alone. Some need the people around them. Some
families are half and half. So at the house, sometimes one will retreat to
another room, while another visits.

If you feel the need to have *your* closest friends around you, invite
them to the house. If not, don't invite anyone. If someone askes if you
want them to come back to the house, and you don't, just say that you need
to be alone.

Most people are going out of their way to try and be helpful. They'd
rather be at home and not dealing with the whole thing. It's difficult and
awkward. They aren't looking for a party.

Elaine, too

Mr Libido Incognito > wrote in
:

>
> There is also the mater of "Stuff", Uncle joe would like the chest of
> drawers as a keepsake, the neighbour is eyeing the stuffed fish on the
> wall, People wanting to take this that and the other...that is very
> disturbing as well...even if they mean well.

A family friend, who lived in the house next door to where I grew up, and
where my sister now lives, passed away last year. Gloria was a hoarder -
she had sooo much stuff, including lots of ornaments and knick knacks
etc. Her kids live all over the country - miles from home, so when they
came back for the funeral they stayed at her house, and as well as
organising the funeral were trying to clear the house so it could go on
the market.

After the funeral there was a gathering at the house (which is typical
here) - food and drink, stories about Gloria, and so on. And her family
asking that nobody leave the house without taking one of the ornaments
and such as a memento of Gloria, please!!!! <g>.


--
Rhonda Anderson
Cranebrook, NSW, Australia

Wayne Boatwright wrote:

>
> I don't want a gravestone. All I want is a pair of stone hands clawing
> their way through the turf, a hidden speaker yelling at people who come
> too close to stop standing on me, and an epitaph that reads, "I knew this
> would happen!"
>
<chuckle> Good one, Wayne.

--
Cheers
Cathy(xyz)

In article >,
Ranee Mueller > wrote:

> I don't know if that is a Canadian thing, or peculiar to your wife's
> church, or congregation or what, but I've never, ever heard of a church
> group charging money to bring food to a funeral. Even for weddings, the
> most was a charge for use of the dishes. People just organize for the
> occasion, or there is a ministry that is already organized to handle
> things like that and they do it.
>
> Regards,
> Ranee

I don't know about a charge for 'bringing' food to a funeral, Ranee, but
it is very common for a church to charge for *providing* such food - at
least around here, it is. And my (Lutheran) church was charging a
'plate fee' 20 years ago. That charge covered the purchase of the
vittles and the fixin's were prepped and served by The Church Ladies.
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-27-2006, The Best Dead Spread Yet

On Thu 02 Feb 2006 07:31:43p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Elaine
Parrish?

>
>
>
> On Thu, 2 Feb 2006, Julia Altshuler wrote:
>
>> I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
>> general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
>> future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
>> way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
>> (both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
>> well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far
>> more private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in
>> small talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can
>> imagine this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends
>> decide to come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean
>> well and politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't
>> see how to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I
>> don't see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
>> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
>> have been there, please.
>>
>>
>> --Lia
>>
>>
>
> I totally understand what you are saying. Here, in the South, going back
> to the house after the funeral is by invitation only.

That has always been my thinking, but my heritage is Southern.

> Here, the food begins arriving at the house when the death is first
> known. Generally, burial is 2 to 3 days after the death (depending on
> how early in the day the death occurred and how far away family members
> are that are coming in). The purpose of the food is to feed family
> members prior to the funeral and then for several days after. It's not
> for any kind of "party". It is to care for the family.

Exactly what I remember.

> Friends come to the house with the food. Generally, a more
> emotionally-removed relative or friend [or two or three] serves as an
> in-house organizer for all the trafic.
>
> The immediate family may or may not receive visitors, reitiring to a
> different part of the house if and when they want to be alone or want to
> receive a select visitor or two.
>
> We have "visitation" at the funeral home the night before the funeral.
> The day of the funeral everyone shows up at the funeral home (or church)
> and then afterward there is the trip to the cemetery. At the cemetery
> there is a good bit of milling around.

Same here.

> Most people take a moment to pay final respects to the family. At this
> time, the family will or will not extend an invitation to "come to the
> house". It totally depends on the family.

Again, what I remember.

> Some people need to be alone. Some need the people around them. Some
> families are half and half. So at the house, sometimes one will retreat
> to another room, while another visits.
>
> If you feel the need to have *your* closest friends around you, invite
> them to the house. If not, don't invite anyone. If someone askes if you
> want them to come back to the house, and you don't, just say that you
> need to be alone.
>
> Most people are going out of their way to try and be helpful. They'd
> rather be at home and not dealing with the whole thing. It's difficult
> and awkward. They aren't looking for a party.

It would appear that some are.


--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

"Julia Altshuler" > wrote in message
. ..
> I'm changing the subject from the food to etiquette after funerals in
> general. Thankfully I'm not asking for any specific moment in the near
> future, but this is something I've been wondering about. Is there any
> way NOT to have a bunch of people over after a funeral? My parents
> (both in pretty good health but still in their 80s) are well-known and
> well-loved in their community. They have LOTS of friends. I'm far more
> private and better in small groups. I'm capable of engaging in small
> talk and handling big parties, but I don't love it. So I can imagine
> this scene: After the funeral, all of my parents' friends decide to
> come back over to the house to comfort me. They all mean well and
> politely bring food. Except I don't want them there! I don't see how
> to keep people away from the funeral of their old friend, but I don't
> see why I should have to be social and displaying public grief at
> exactly the moment I don't want to. Insight and advice from people who
> have been there, please.

Find a friend - either one of yours or one of your parents - who you can ask
to "host" the after-funeral commiseration, and announce it at the end of the
service. ("So-and-so invites everyone to XYZ after services.") You may go
or not as you choose (just let the host know!)

If the funeral is held in a church, come back to the church after the
grave-side ceremony and have a 'dead spread' there. Again, you may go or not
as you choose.

When my great-uncle died last year, my father arranged for the family to go
to a VA hall, partly because my great-aunt isn't doing well, partly because
my father and his wife don't like having some family members (that would be
me) anywhere near their house.

People do tend to gather after a funeral, but there's nothing written in
stone that says it must be at *your* house, or even that you must host it.

My $.02 (Wayne, did you get that Paypal payment of my last $.02?)

Lisa Ann

"Mr Libido Incognito" > wrote in message
...

>> There is also the mater of "Stuff", Uncle joe would like the chest of
> drawers as a keepsake, the neighbour is eyeing the stuffed fish on the
> wall, People wanting to take this that and the other...that is very
> disturbing as well...even if they mean well.

Oh, don't even get me going on that! Probably the worst story I've ever
heard is after my father's father passed away, his sisters came back to the
house and stripped it of *everything* - including some of the kids' toys.
Keep in mind, my gramma was still living, just institutionalized. These 3
kids had lost their mother at Thanksgiving, their father at Christmas...and
all their possessions by New Years.

Which explains why I was 35 before I discovered my grandfather had sisters.

I dread having to deal with my brother when my Mom passes...I've asked her
to specify *everything* in her will, and hopefully she'll do it...but it's
gonna be ugly, regardless.

Lisa Ann

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
>
> I don't want a gravestone. All I want is a pair of stone hands clawing
> their way through the turf, a hidden speaker yelling at people who come
> too close to stop standing on me, and an epitaph that reads, "I knew this
> would happen!"

LOL - good luck finding a cemetery that will let you have such a grave
decoration! And if it's insisted that you have a "traditional" flat marker
or something...find someone who'll install a hinge on it that causes it to
fly up and hands reach out of it when someone stands at the foot - that
might make a good second choice.

Sometimes I think I want my epitaph to read, "Where am I, where am I going,
and why am I in this handbasket?"

Lisa Ann

Lisa Ann wrote:

> I dread having to deal with my brother when my Mom passes...I've asked her
> to specify *everything* in her will, and hopefully she'll do it...but it's
> gonna be ugly, regardless.
>
> Lisa Ann


Perhaps your mom could give you and your brother a few things that
either of you want now so he won't be squabbling with you when that
dreaded time comes. Another possibility is she have you both over and
make it plain who gets what and it's in the will.

Just a thought.............

On Fri 03 Feb 2006 03:08:31a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it"Wayne
Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> 28.19...
>>
>> I don't want a gravestone. All I want is a pair of stone hands clawing
>> their way through the turf, a hidden speaker yelling at people who come
>> too close to stop standing on me, and an epitaph that reads, "I knew
>> this would happen!"
>
> LOL - good luck finding a cemetery that will let you have such a grave
> decoration! And if it's insisted that you have a "traditional" flat
> marker or something...find someone who'll install a hinge on it that
> causes it to fly up and hands reach out of it when someone stands at the
> foot - that might make a good second choice.
>
> Sometimes I think I want my epitaph to read, "Where am I, where am I
> going, and why am I in this handbasket?"

LOL! I like that one!

--
Wayne Boatwright o¿o
____________________

BIOYA

On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 10:01:41 GMT, "Lisa Ann" >
wrote:

>"Mr Libido Incognito" > wrote in message
...
>
>>> There is also the mater of "Stuff", Uncle joe would like the chest of
>> drawers as a keepsake, the neighbour is eyeing the stuffed fish on the
>> wall, People wanting to take this that and the other...that is very
>> disturbing as well...even if they mean well.
>
>Oh, don't even get me going on that! Probably the worst story I've ever
>heard is after my father's father passed away, his sisters came back to the
>house and stripped it of *everything* - including some of the kids' toys.
>Keep in mind, my gramma was still living, just institutionalized. These 3
>kids had lost their mother at Thanksgiving, their father at Christmas...and
>all their possessions by New Years.
>
>Which explains why I was 35 before I discovered my grandfather had sisters.
>
>I dread having to deal with my brother when my Mom passes...I've asked her
>to specify *everything* in her will, and hopefully she'll do it...but it's
>gonna be ugly, regardless.
>
>Lisa Ann
>

If you are near, see if you can get her to not only specify, but take
pictures. A few years before my aunt died I took pictures of
everything that was of value. On the back we numbered the picture and
put the name of the person who was to get it. She also had a paper
that the lawyer had prepared where she listed items and people. We
then added the picture number. There was no way to get items mixed
up. She had also already given away a number of things that she no
longer needed.
--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974

Elaine Parrish wrote:


> If you feel the need to have *your* closest friends around you, invite
> them to the house. If not, don't invite anyone. If someone asks if you
> want them to come back to the house and you don't, just say that you need
> to be alone.


You put your finger on what's been bothering me the most-- this idea of
choosing the closest friends while letting everyone else feel like they
haven't been invited to the party. I'm glad to know that I needn't give
a party. Thanks to everyone who wrote.


--Lia