My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
get her to try new things?

sam wrote:
> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is

you can put fresh fruit in yogurt
you can make a game out of wheat toast...

say..."nobody better not eat my toast"..turn your back and she will eat
it
just to play a game.

fresh turkey cut into child size forkable pieces (esp when you stop
buying the dinasours)
will taste wonderful! and better for her.

chicken nuggets, turkey nuggets, all that deep fried stuff...it can't
be good for her body while she is building immunities..that stuff...is
salty and greasy you know..

im not putting you down, I know children can be extremely persistent...
and I know...something is better than nothing.

Don't buy no more nuggets?

Children should eat what the parents are eating. Veggies, bread, a
little meat, mashed potatoes, a half slice of wheat toast, with a
little butter on it.

finger foods...fun stuff...she will also learn to appreciate meal times
as they can be time you spend with her.

Good Luck

Pick your battles - if you let this one go without putting up a fight, it
can be a problem for many years. When I worked as a server, I remember
telling a 50 year old businessman that the tomatoes for the burger were
served on the side to which he replied, "are you an idiot? I said I
didn't want to SEE tomatoes on my table." He then asked me to remove the
ketchup. When his food was brought to him (by another server) he exploded
that the tomatoes had "obviously been put on the plate and then removed
at the last second."

Sheesh.

1. Give the kid a variety (as was said above) of colors and textures, but
don't fall into the trap of custom making food forever. What is served is
served. My mother-in-law "lost" the battle and made 2 or 3 separate meals
each day to placate her husband and kids. It is so ridiculous that when
the family orders carry out, she has to stop at 3 different restaurants!
BTW, the "kids" are now 25-35 years old and still do this. They have so
many "food rules" that she even makes 3 different Thanksgiving dishes -
each kid gets their own veggie, meat and even pie!

2. Most "fussy children" learn about food as one of the few things they
can control. As a former server, bartender and schoolteacher, I think
food issues are more about power and control and less about taste than
you might think. Anorexia and bulimia have little to do with taste. You
are the parent - you decide what the kid will eat, not the other way
around.

3. One plan my mother implemented was that each child had one item they
never had to eat - no questions asked. This item could not be changed on
a whim and for most of the family, it was the same item for decades. (For
me, it was brussel sprouts - but I learned the error of my ways in
college)

4. Some kids are naturally lean, some are not. Some eat everything,
others are more picky. But, I have never heard of a child starving
because they were picky. My niece (age 4) frequently refuses to eat any
dinner at all, but will then snack on cookies and cereal all night. Her
mother complains "she never eats, I am worried about her health." Funny
thing, the kid isn't losing any weight. If you start feeding the child
only chicken nuggets (don't get me started) because "that's all they will
eat!" you are setting yourself up for a long, long battle.

Yes quite agree - It is about control - the kids are feeling out of
control.

I think if the parents tell them 'I'll control what you will eat, and
it must be done my way' might not resolve the issue.

And in the same way, when the parents cannot control what the kids eat,
the parents feel out of control of their kids, which will not resolve
the issue either.

The idea about letting the kids choose something they don't like and no
question ask is very useful!! We all change our tastes as we grow and
try new things.

I think it is about choice, if the kids can trust that the parent will
always let them choose, and will help them choose if they ask the
parents to, then they feel they are loved and so do not feel out of
control.

And that the parents can trust that the kids can learn to choose, just
like the brussel sprouts story, and trust the kids will ask if they
need help choosing, then there is no problem.

Thinking about it, this can be applied to everything in life.

This reminds me, a fond memory.

My family visited a temple. And they had vegetarian food. One of
those is sweet black seasame soup (it's sweet, black, and with
consistency like tomato soup)

Anyway, I was little then, looked at it, thought gosh, blo*dy hell not
gonna eat that! That black stuff!

My mum said, "you must at least try! Just one spoonful, and if you
don't like it, then you don't have to eat it anymore."

I was glad she said I didn't have to eat it if I tried and did not like
it! So I did, and I loved it!

"dee" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> This reminds me, a fond memory.
>
> My family visited a temple. And they had vegetarian food. One of
> those is sweet black seasame soup (it's sweet, black, and with
> consistency like tomato soup)
>
> Anyway, I was little then, looked at it, thought gosh, blo*dy hell not
> gonna eat that! That black stuff!
>
> My mum said, "you must at least try! Just one spoonful, and if you
> don't like it, then you don't have to eat it anymore."
>
> I was glad she said I didn't have to eat it if I tried and did not like
> it! So I did, and I loved it!
>

My son was the opposite, sort of. He'd eat ugly food just to get a rise out
of his mother, mostly. The first time I ordered mussels in a restaurant, she
did her usual "Yucky" routine. That was my son's cue to try a mussel, which
he'd never had before (age 4-ish). He then asked if he could have them all.
I ordered more. :-)

:-D

Sounds like an active and fun kid your boy. All the best!

"dee" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> :-D
>
> Sounds like an active and fun kid your boy. All the best!
>

He's a monster! Until he was 3 or so, his mother could give him The Look if
he'd done something wrong. You know The Look, right? Well, one day, she gave
him The Look and for some reason, he found something funny about it and
fell on the floor laughing. She looked horrified. He had taken away her main
weapon in the war against naughtiness. No matter how serious she tried to
look, it made him laugh. :-)

Doug Kanter wrote:

> My son was the opposite, sort of. He'd eat ugly food just to get a rise out
> of his mother, mostly. The first time I ordered mussels in a restaurant, she
> did her usual "Yucky" routine. That was my son's cue to try a mussel, which
> he'd never had before (age 4-ish). He then asked if he could have them all.
> I ordered more. :-)

My son was like that too. He tried my calamari just so that he would tell his
friends he had eaten something disgusting. Once he tried it he realized how good
it was. He had always been easy to please. The only thing I can think of that
he absolutely refused to try was oxtails. Even when we was very young he was
easy to please. He especially liked fish, and few times when he balked at some
sort of flesh we told him it was fish and he ate it up. I had him at a friend's
bar before he was two and people were amazed that he was eating Buffalo wings,
hot, not mild.

One thing he did not like when he was young was steak. A friend suggested
cutting it into very thin strips. That turned out to be much easier for him to
chew.

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> Doug Kanter wrote:
>
>> My son was the opposite, sort of. He'd eat ugly food just to get a rise
>> out
>> of his mother, mostly. The first time I ordered mussels in a restaurant,
>> she
>> did her usual "Yucky" routine. That was my son's cue to try a mussel,
>> which
>> he'd never had before (age 4-ish). He then asked if he could have them
>> all.
>> I ordered more. :-)
>
> My son was like that too. He tried my calamari just so that he would tell
> his
> friends he had eaten something disgusting. Once he tried it he realized
> how good
> it was. He had always been easy to please. The only thing I can think of
> that
> he absolutely refused to try was oxtails. Even when we was very young he
> was
> easy to please. He especially liked fish, and few times when he balked at
> some
> sort of flesh we told him it was fish and he ate it up. I had him at a
> friend's
> bar before he was two and people were amazed that he was eating Buffalo
> wings,
> hot, not mild.
>
> One thing he did not like when he was young was steak. A friend suggested
> cutting it into very thin strips. That turned out to be much easier for
> him to
> chew.
>
>
>

Yeah...hot wings! Mine too, when he was little. What's with kids? I took
mine to a restaurant here that's famous for wings with names like hot,
catatonic, and wise guy specials (they give you a glass of milk with those
whether you ask for it or not). The friend with us ordered the latter, and
my son tried one, then another, and then his burger arrived and he quit the
wings. But, he liked them. No comment at all the next day about burning
exhaust issues.

In article .com>,
"sam" > wrote:

> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> get her to try new things?

It's often about control and power. Sometimes you need to give them
less control and power, and sometimes more. Kids will not starve
themselves to death. If you give them the choice of not eating anything
at a meal, and then refuse to feed them between meals, they will soon
find that eating is a good thing. You don't want to make a big deal out
of it.

Sometimes getting them involved in food prep can give them the control
they want.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

My 2 year old boy is one heck of a fussy eater, the best thing we found
so far was to limit the amount of food he takes between meals.

Good luck

Dan Abel wrote:
> In article .com>,
> "sam" > wrote:
>
> > My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> > yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> > get her to try new things?
>
> It's often about control and power. Sometimes you need to give them
> less control and power, and sometimes more. Kids will not starve
> themselves to death. If you give them the choice of not eating anything
> at a meal, and then refuse to feed them between meals, they will soon
> find that eating is a good thing. You don't want to make a big deal out
> of it.
>
> Sometimes getting them involved in food prep can give them the control
> they want.
>
> --
> Dan Abel
>
> Petaluma, California, USA

I've got a grandson that said he didn't like tomatoes when he was about
three - my daughter "convinced" him he was eating spaghetti and
"strawberries" and he would eat it.!!

sam wrote:

> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> get her to try new things?

Do you like to eat everything? Neither does she.

There seems to be this notion afoot that parents have to demonstrate
that they're in charge. That what they say goes and the kids have to
just go along and shut up...

Have you forgotten how things were when you were a child? How many
things you were forced to do? Did you like it?

In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it
was you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to
eat it again if you don't want to. So there has never been a contest in
our house. We saved our parental authority for those things that
represented a hazard to the kids.

When the kids feel like they can exercise some control over their world,
the relationship with parents is a lot smoother.

Pastorio

In article >,
"Bob (this one)" > wrote:

> In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it
> was you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to
> eat it again if you don't want to.

Opposite of our house. You don't have to clean your plate. You do need
to help us all have a pleasant dinner time. If you say "ick, I don't
like that" or similar you then need to eat it all for subjecting us to
your whining. If you say nothing, but ignore it and don't eat it you
will not be questioned nor forced to finish that which you do not like.
Rule applies to diners of all ages. Works well for us.


marcella

Marcella Peek wrote:
> In article >,
> "Bob (this one)" > wrote:
>
>
>>In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it
>>was you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to
>>eat it again if you don't want to.
>
>
> Opposite of our house. You don't have to clean your plate. You do need
> to help us all have a pleasant dinner time. If you say "ick, I don't
> like that" or similar you then need to eat it all for subjecting us to
> your whining. If you say nothing, but ignore it and don't eat it you
> will not be questioned nor forced to finish that which you do not like.
> Rule applies to diners of all ages. Works well for us.
>
>
> marcella


I was forced to eat too many things as a kid to make mine eat things
they say ick about - I was physically ill over several. I still won't
eat cooked carrots

Roberta (in VA)

In article <Qx9Ef.82513$4l5.20121@dukeread05>,
Roberta > wrote:

> Marcella Peek wrote:
> > In article >,
> > "Bob (this one)" > wrote:
> >
> >
> >>In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it
> >>was you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to
> >>eat it again if you don't want to.
> >
> >
> > Opposite of our house. You don't have to clean your plate. You do need
> > to help us all have a pleasant dinner time. If you say "ick, I don't
> > like that" or similar you then need to eat it all for subjecting us to
> > your whining. If you say nothing, but ignore it and don't eat it you
> > will not be questioned nor forced to finish that which you do not like.
> > Rule applies to diners of all ages. Works well for us.
> >
> >
> > marcella
>
>
> I was forced to eat too many things as a kid to make mine eat things
> they say ick about - I was physically ill over several. I still won't
> eat cooked carrots
>
> Roberta (in VA)

But we don't force anyone to eat anything. We just force them to shut
up about what they don't like. No whining, no problem. If, however,
you whine then the punishment is to have to eat it.

Easy.

marcella

Marcella Peek wrote:
> In article <Qx9Ef.82513$4l5.20121@dukeread05>,
> Roberta > wrote:
>
>
>>Marcella Peek wrote:
>>
>>>In article >,
>>> "Bob (this one)" > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it
>>>>was you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to
>>>>eat it again if you don't want to.
>>>
>>>
>>>Opposite of our house. You don't have to clean your plate. You do need
>>>to help us all have a pleasant dinner time. If you say "ick, I don't
>>>like that" or similar you then need to eat it all for subjecting us to
>>>your whining. If you say nothing, but ignore it and don't eat it you
>>>will not be questioned nor forced to finish that which you do not like.
>>>Rule applies to diners of all ages. Works well for us.
>>>
>>>
>>>marcella
>>
>>
>>I was forced to eat too many things as a kid to make mine eat things
>>they say ick about - I was physically ill over several. I still won't
>>eat cooked carrots
>>
>>Roberta (in VA)
>
>
> But we don't force anyone to eat anything. We just force them to shut
> up about what they don't like. No whining, no problem. If, however,
> you whine then the punishment is to have to eat it.
>
> Easy.
>
> marcella

heh - in that case I guess it would only take once or twice to figure
out that being quiet is a good thing

Not the same as sit and eat until you throw up at all lol

Roberta (in VA)

Marcella Peek wrote:
> In article <Qx9Ef.82513$4l5.20121@dukeread05>,
> Roberta > wrote:
>
>
>>Marcella Peek wrote:
>>
>>>In article >,
>>> "Bob (this one)" > wrote:
>>>
>>>>In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it
>>>>was you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to
>>>>eat it again if you don't want to.
>>>
>>>Opposite of our house. You don't have to clean your plate. You do need
>>>to help us all have a pleasant dinner time. If you say "ick, I don't
>>>like that" or similar you then need to eat it all for subjecting us to
>>>your whining.

"I don't like that" is whining?

>>>If you say nothing, but ignore it and don't eat it you
>>>will not be questioned nor forced to finish that which you do not like.
>>>Rule applies to diners of all ages. Works well for us.

And if the kid says "The reason I didn't eat that is because I don't
feel well," is that whining?

Interesting characterization of whining.

>>I was forced to eat too many things as a kid to make mine eat things
>>they say ick about - I was physically ill over several. I still won't
>>eat cooked carrots
>>
>>Roberta (in VA)
>
>
> But we don't force anyone to eat anything. We just force them to shut
> up about what they don't like. No whining, no problem. If, however,
> you whine then the punishment is to have to eat it.
>
> Easy.

Too easy. My note was more figurative than literal. The kids didn't
actually say "yuck." They indicated - typically when asked - if they
liked it, whatever it was. There was no whining because there was no
need to - no penalty accrued for stating the truth of their preferences.
It was matter of fact. I wanted to know what they liked or didn't like
for the next time I might want to prepare that food.

The other thing that grew out of that approach is that sometimes they
got to choose the food for some meals. They created the menus. Or they
chose the restaurants.

My parents were of the "clean your plate" school. I vowed that I would
never do that. The recurrent question for me was "How come it's ok for
adults to not eat when they don't like but kids have to?" So I wanted to
know exactly what their thoughts were about their food. I didn't force
them to shut up, either.

Pastorio

"Bob (this one)" > wrote in message
...
> sam wrote:
>
>> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
>> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
>> get her to try new things?
>
> Do you like to eat everything? Neither does she.
>
> There seems to be this notion afoot that parents have to demonstrate that
> they're in charge. That what they say goes and the kids have to just go
> along and shut up...
>
> Have you forgotten how things were when you were a child? How many things
> you were forced to do? Did you like it?
>
> In our house, from the day we brought them home from the hospital, it was
> you have to at least taste it. If you say "yuck" you never have to eat it
> again if you don't want to. So there has never been a contest in our
> house. We saved our parental authority for those things that represented a
> hazard to the kids.
>
> When the kids feel like they can exercise some control over their world,
> the relationship with parents is a lot smoother.
>
> Pastorio

There's a huge difference between getting your child to eat nutritionally
valuable foods and forcing them to eat anything. There's no need for force.
Simply stop continually offering turkey dinosaurs. I've yet to see the kid
that will starve themselves at 2 yrs old. Hunger will win, it always does.
There's also a big difference between limiting your diet to a single food
and not liking particular foods. My kids know that it is quite alright to
dislike a food, and have no problem saying so. They also know that they have
to try something before they can claim they dislike it.
I'm not saying you need to make every meal a battle of the wills, but this
is a 2 yr old child we're talking about, not 7 or 8. The awareness is quite
different. Making food fun and eating a pleasant experience goes a long way
at that age. Offering nothing but one food because you think it's all
they'll eat isn't doing anyone any favors. In fact, I dare say it's
hazardous.

kimberly

sam wrote:
> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> get her to try new things?
>
Just let her try whatever you are eating. That's what we do. Our toddler
will try almost anything... Some days she eats better than others, but
that's normal IMHO. Tonight we had chicken livers and she enjoyed them!
I was surprised, because she is not a big "meat" eater. We don't force
her to eat stuff she doesn't like cos we don't believe in that. But I
don't make "special" meals for her. She eats all sorts of fruit and
veggies, and enjoys to eat raw veggies when I prepare them. Try letting
her "help" you in the kitchen...our little one likes that... it might
encourage her to try new things.

--
Cheers
Cathy(xyz)

sam wrote:
> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> get her to try new things?

Offer her all types of foods in different sizes, shapes, colors and
textures. Offer her different "dips" to dip them in - ketchup, Ranch
dressing, mayo, etc. Sooner or later she will get hungry enough to eat
that whichis in front of her.

Do not pander to her whims, or you will end up in an endless power
struggle over food with your child. If my son (also 2) doesn't eat
his breakfast or lunch, you can bet he eats his dinner, because he is
hungry. Most of the time, though, he eats what I give him (and is an
excellent eater) because I have taken this approach with him from the
beginning. There are very few foods he won't eat. (And, BTW, I do not
give him any "character" foods as I see them more as playthings than
food items. My only exception to this is Goldfish-type crackers
(organic whole-grain version).

-L.

In article .com>,
"sam" > wrote:

> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> get her to try new things?

stop worrying about it. I was a fussy eater all through childhood. So
was my sister, but she was worse. Eventually we grew up to be much less
fussy, but healthy and happy adults.

Your daughter's fussiness may be just her way of playing a power game
with you. Don't play that game. If all she wants to eat is yoghurt and
turkey, then feed her that and eventually, she'll branch out to other
foods on her own.

Of course, you should discuss your child's situation with a pediatrician
just to be sure she's well nourished.

"sam" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
> get her to try new things?
>

Stop giving her yogurt and turkey dinosaurs.
Seriously.
It cracks me up when people claim "My child will only eat.....(insert food
here)"
Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs. Feed your child a
variety of food and your child will eat a variety of food. It helps if you
eat a variety as well.
If you're not offering turkey dinosaurs, trust me, hunger will win out.

kimberly

Nexis wrote:

>"sam" > wrote in message
roups.com...
>
>
>>My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
>>yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
>>get her to try new things?
>>
>>
>>
>
>Stop giving her yogurt and turkey dinosaurs.
>Seriously.
>It cracks me up when people claim "My child will only eat.....(insert food
>here)"
>Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs. Feed your child a
>variety of food and your child will eat a variety of food. It helps if you
>eat a variety as well.
>If you're not offering turkey dinosaurs, trust me, hunger will win out.
>
>kimberly
>
>
>
>
I remember a conversation we had with the vet, who was obviously fed up
with the owners who complained to him that their dogs would only eat
filet steak and chicken breast! He wondered if they took the animals
into the butcher and let them do the purchasing....

Christine

"Nexis" > wrote in message
news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...
>
> "sam" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> My 2 year old daughter is a very fussy eater all she will eat is
>> yoghurts and turkey dinasours, has any one got any tips on how I could
>> get her to try new things?



The parent is ultimately the one responsible for the child - including their
nutrition. If a child wanted to play with knives, a parent wouldn't let
them for their own good. The same goes with food, just because a child
*wants* to eat nothing but junk - the parent should still -not let them- and
be responsible for their nutrition.

A lot of kids seem to think they should be able to eat only their favourite
foods. None of us eat only our favourites all the time - they're for the
special occasions. There's a huge range of foods between the favourites and
really hated.

Jen

"Nexis" > wrote in message
news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...

> Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs.....


What *is* a turkey dinosaur???

On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 13:10:13 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
> connected the dots and wrote:

~"Nexis" > wrote in message
~news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...
~
~> Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs.....
~
~
~What *is* a turkey dinosaur???
~

A pressed meat cutout that is shaped like a dinosaur, breaded and
fried. If you don't buy them at McDonalds where they are known as
chicken mcnuggets, they come in a freezer package. You take out as
many as you wish to serve, bake them in the oven until toasty, and
serve with various dipping sauces.

They're finger food, which makes them attractive to small children.

maxine in ri

"maxine in ri" > wrote in message
...
> On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 13:10:13 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
> > connected the dots and wrote:
>
> ~"Nexis" > wrote in message
> ~news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...
> ~
> ~> Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs.....
> ~
> ~
> ~What *is* a turkey dinosaur???
> ~
>
> A pressed meat cutout that is shaped like a dinosaur, breaded and
> fried. If you don't buy them at McDonalds where they are known as
> chicken mcnuggets, they come in a freezer package. You take out as
> many as you wish to serve, bake them in the oven until toasty, and
> serve with various dipping sauces.
>
> They're finger food, which makes them attractive to small children.
>
> maxine in ri
>

Teenagers, too. But, for a different reason. They're very busy watching TV,
and sticking chicken nuggets in the oven takes only 43 seconds.

maxine in ri wrote:

> On Fri, 03 Feb 2006 13:10:13 GMT, "Doug Kanter"
> > connected the dots and wrote:
>
> ~"Nexis" > wrote in message
> ~news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...
> ~
> ~> Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs.....
> ~
> ~
> ~What is a turkey dinosaur???
> ~
>
> A pressed meat cutout that is shaped like a dinosaur, breaded and
> fried. If you don't buy them at McDonalds where they are known as
> chicken mcnuggets, they come in a freezer package. You take out as
> many as you wish to serve, bake them in the oven until toasty, and
> serve with various dipping sauces.
>
> They're finger food, which makes them attractive to small children.

I thought that for small children, _everything_ was finger food!

--
Dan Goodman
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"Dan Goodman" > wrote in message
. net...
> maxine in ri wrote:
>> They're finger food, which makes them attractive to small children.
>
> I thought that for small children, _everything_ was finger food!

It is but it's not necessarily meant to be so.

Gabby

"Nexis" > wrote in message
news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...

> Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs.....


What *is* a turkey dinosaur???

"Nexis" > wrote in message
news:LXwEf.2406$MJ.1438@fed1read07...

> Children don't leave the womb demanding turkey dinosaurs.....


What *is* a turkey dinosaur???