Read The Bible wrote:
> Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
> with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with
> all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
> perish, because they received not the love of the
> truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause
> God shall send them strong delusion, that they should
> believe a lie, that they all might be damned who
> believed not the truth, but had pleasure in
> unrighteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12
>
> And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto
> the beast, and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who
> is like unto the beast? Who is able to make war with
> him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking
> great things and blasphemies, and power was given
> unto him to continue forty and two months. And he
> opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to
> blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that
> dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make
> war with the saints, and to overcome them, and power
> was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and
> nations.
> |
> And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him,
> whose names are not written in the book of life of
> the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. If
> any man have an ear, let him hear. He that leadeth
> into captivity shall go into captivity; he that
> killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword.
> Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
> |
> And I beheld another beast coming up out of the
> earth, and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake
> as a dragon. And he exerciseth all the power of the
> first beast before him, and causeth the earth and
> them which dwell therein to worship the first beast,
> whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great
> wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven
> on the earth in the sight of men, and deceiveth them
> that dwell on the earth by the means of those
> miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the
> beast, saying to them that dwell on the earth, that
> they should make an image to the beast, which had the
> wound by a sword, and did live.
> |
> And he had power to give life unto the image of the
> beast, that the image of the beast should both speak,
> and cause that as many as would not worship the image
> of the beast should be killed.
> |
> And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and
> poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right
> hand, or in their foreheads; and that no man might
> buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name
> of the beast, or the number of his name. Here is
> wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the
> number of the beast, for it is the number of a man,
> and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
> Revelation 13:4-18
>
> If any man worship the beast and his image, and
> receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the
> same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God,
> which is poured out without mixture into the cup of
> his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire
> and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and
> in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their
> torment ascendeth up for ever and ever, and they have
> no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his
> image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
> |
> Here is the patience of the saints; here are they
> that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of
> Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto
> me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord
> from henceforth. Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may
> rest from their labours, and their works do follow
> them. Revelation 14:9-13

Amen and amen.

May GOD continue to bless the writing of HIS Word in these USENET
newsgroups, in Jesus' most precious and holy name.

Amen ! ! !

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull and feels compelled to post it all
over the web, even to a food site. Can he be any dumber I ask? Wonder what
he feels is the purpose of his dribble? Surely he doesn't think that he is
"saving" anybody does he? If there was any question in anybody's mind about
the negative effects of religion and the part it plays in mental illness we
need only to point to Andrew Chung.

Khubla
..
"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Read The Bible wrote:
>> Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
>> with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with
>> all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
>> perish, because they received not the love of the
>> truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause
>> God shall send them strong delusion, that they should
>> believe a lie, that they all might be damned who
>> believed not the truth, but had pleasure in
>> unrighteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12
>>
>> And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto
>> the beast, and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who
>> is like unto the beast? Who is able to make war with
>> him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking
>> great things and blasphemies, and power was given
>> unto him to continue forty and two months. And he
>> opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to
>> blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that
>> dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make
>> war with the saints, and to overcome them, and power
>> was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and
>> nations.
>> |
>> And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him,
>> whose names are not written in the book of life of
>> the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. If
>> any man have an ear, let him hear. He that leadeth
>> into captivity shall go into captivity; he that
>> killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword.
>> Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
>> |
>> And I beheld another beast coming up out of the
>> earth, and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake
>> as a dragon. And he exerciseth all the power of the
>> first beast before him, and causeth the earth and
>> them which dwell therein to worship the first beast,
>> whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great
>> wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven
>> on the earth in the sight of men, and deceiveth them
>> that dwell on the earth by the means of those
>> miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the
>> beast, saying to them that dwell on the earth, that
>> they should make an image to the beast, which had the
>> wound by a sword, and did live.
>> |
>> And he had power to give life unto the image of the
>> beast, that the image of the beast should both speak,
>> and cause that as many as would not worship the image
>> of the beast should be killed.
>> |
>> And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and
>> poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right
>> hand, or in their foreheads; and that no man might
>> buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name
>> of the beast, or the number of his name. Here is
>> wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the
>> number of the beast, for it is the number of a man,
>> and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
>> Revelation 13:4-18
>>
>> If any man worship the beast and his image, and
>> receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the
>> same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God,
>> which is poured out without mixture into the cup of
>> his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire
>> and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and
>> in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their
>> torment ascendeth up for ever and ever, and they have
>> no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his
>> image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
>> |
>> Here is the patience of the saints; here are they
>> that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of
>> Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto
>> me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord
>> from henceforth. Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may
>> rest from their labours, and their works do follow
>> them. Revelation 14:9-13
>
> Amen and amen.
>
> May GOD continue to bless the writing of HIS Word in these USENET
> newsgroups, in Jesus' most precious and holy name.
>
> Amen ! ! !
>
> Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
> cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
> cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
> during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq
>
> For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
> how the LORD has reshaped me:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo
>
> Prayerfully in Christ's love,
>
> Andrew
> http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8
>

Khubla wrote:
> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> > Read The Bible wrote:
> >> Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
> >> with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with
> >> all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
> >> perish, because they received not the love of the
> >> truth, that they might be saved. And for this cause
> >> God shall send them strong delusion, that they should
> >> believe a lie, that they all might be damned who
> >> believed not the truth, but had pleasure in
> >> unrighteousness. 2 Thessalonians 2:9-12
> >>
> >> And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto
> >> the beast, and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who
> >> is like unto the beast? Who is able to make war with
> >> him? And there was given unto him a mouth speaking
> >> great things and blasphemies, and power was given
> >> unto him to continue forty and two months. And he
> >> opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to
> >> blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that
> >> dwell in heaven. And it was given unto him to make
> >> war with the saints, and to overcome them, and power
> >> was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and
> >> nations.
> >> |
> >> And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him,
> >> whose names are not written in the book of life of
> >> the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. If
> >> any man have an ear, let him hear. He that leadeth
> >> into captivity shall go into captivity; he that
> >> killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword.
> >> Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.
> >> |
> >> And I beheld another beast coming up out of the
> >> earth, and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake
> >> as a dragon. And he exerciseth all the power of the
> >> first beast before him, and causeth the earth and
> >> them which dwell therein to worship the first beast,
> >> whose deadly wound was healed. And he doeth great
> >> wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven
> >> on the earth in the sight of men, and deceiveth them
> >> that dwell on the earth by the means of those
> >> miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the
> >> beast, saying to them that dwell on the earth, that
> >> they should make an image to the beast, which had the
> >> wound by a sword, and did live.
> >> |
> >> And he had power to give life unto the image of the
> >> beast, that the image of the beast should both speak,
> >> and cause that as many as would not worship the image
> >> of the beast should be killed.
> >> |
> >> And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and
> >> poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right
> >> hand, or in their foreheads; and that no man might
> >> buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name
> >> of the beast, or the number of his name. Here is
> >> wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the
> >> number of the beast, for it is the number of a man,
> >> and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
> >> Revelation 13:4-18
> >>
> >> If any man worship the beast and his image, and
> >> receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, the
> >> same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God,
> >> which is poured out without mixture into the cup of
> >> his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire
> >> and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and
> >> in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their
> >> torment ascendeth up for ever and ever, and they have
> >> no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his
> >> image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
> >> |
> >> Here is the patience of the saints; here are they
> >> that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of
> >> Jesus. And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto
> >> me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord
> >> from henceforth. Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may
> >> rest from their labours, and their works do follow
> >> them. Revelation 14:9-13
> >
> > Amen and amen.
> >
> > May GOD continue to bless the writing of HIS Word in these USENET
> > newsgroups, in Jesus' most precious and holy name.
> >
> > Amen ! ! !
>
> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull

I am not the OP.

> and feels compelled to post it all
> over the web, even to a food site.

USENET is not the web.

> Can he be any dumber I ask?

It is those who post to USENET thinking they are posting to the Web who
are lacking in intelligence.

> Wonder what
> he feels is the purpose of his dribble?

The LORD's purpose for my posting here on USENET is to inform.

> Surely he doesn't think that he is
> "saving" anybody does he?

No. It is LORD Jesus Christ Who saves.

> If there was any question in anybody's mind about
> the negative effects of religion and the part it plays in mental illness we
> need only to point to Andrew Chung.

Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes).

You will be in my prayers, dear neighbor whom I love, in Jesus' most
precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM.

Amen !!!

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
...
> Khubla wrote:
>> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message

[...]

>> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
>
> I am not the OP.

Irrelevant.

>> and feels compelled to post it all
>> over the web, even to a food site.
>
> USENET is not the web.

Usenet groups are posted on the web, moron. Ask Google. Not everyone
uses Outlook Express.

>> Can he be any dumber I ask?
>
> It is those who post to USENET thinking they are posting to the Web who
> are lacking in intelligence.

See above, you dolt.

>> Wonder what
>> he feels is the purpose of his dribble?
>
> The LORD's purpose for my posting here on USENET is to inform.

Why do you think that this is germaine to sci.med.cardiology, alt.atheism,
or rec.food.cooking?

How do you determine the Lord's purpose? Does he/she speak to you?

>> Surely he doesn't think that he is
>> "saving" anybody does he?
>
> No. It is LORD Jesus Christ Who saves.

Thus the quotes, moron.

>> If there was any question in anybody's mind about
>> the negative effects of religion and the part it plays in mental illness
>> we
>> need only to point to Andrew Chung.
>
> Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes).

Very convenient of them to say that. How very intolerant. Typical.

> You will be in my prayers, dear neighbor whom I love, in Jesus' most
> precious and holy name.

Save you ****ing breath. I speak for myself here, But I'm confident that
Khubla will agree.

> May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM.

Like Father Ignacio did to you?

> Amen !!!
>
> Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
> cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
> cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
> during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

**** off loser.

Andrew B. Chung, MolesteD/PaedophileD wrote:
<nothing worth repeating>


Worship the Unclechrist instead.


> Prayerfully in Christ's love,
>
> Andrew

I see you're *still* practicing necrophilia. That's just plain sick.


Bob Dog

-----

"Easily the biggest challenge facing the ID community
is to develop a full-fledged theory of biological
design. We don't have such a theory right now, and
that's a real problem. Without a theory, it's very
hard to know where to direct your research focus."
- Paul Nelson, creationist
and anti-science advocate

"Maybe he needs a new version of the Ten Commandments
-- George W. Bush's Ten Commandments:
Thou shalt not steal...votes.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's...country.
Thou shalt not kill...for oil.
Thou shalt not take grammar...in vain."
- Margaret Cho

wrote:
> Andrew B. Chung, MolesteD/PaedophileD wrote:
> <nothing worth repeating>
>
>
> Worship the Unclechrist instead.
>
>
>> Prayerfully in Christ's love,
>>
>> Andrew
>
> I see you're *still* practicing necrophilia. That's just plain sick.
>
>
If Christianity isn't a death cult, what's with the corporate logo?

--
David Silverman
aa #2208
Atheist for life.

Religion is a social contract between those who would rule us and those
who won't deal with their own shit.

wrote:
>
> Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> <nothing worth repeating>
>
> Worship the Unclechrist instead.

No.

You will be in my prayers, dear neighbor whom I love, in Jesus' most
precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM.

Amen.

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Geoff wrote:
>
> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Khubla wrote:
> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>
> [...]
>
> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
> >
> > I am not the OP.
>
> Irrelevant.

Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)

> >> and feels compelled to post it all
> >> over the web, even to a food site.
> >
> > USENET is not the web.
>
> Usenet groups are posted on the web, moron.

Not "all over the web."

> Ask Google.

Who is Google?

> Not everyone
> uses Outlook Express.

Correct.

> >> Can he be any dumber I ask?
> >
> > It is those who post to USENET thinking they are posting to the Web who
> > are lacking in intelligence.
>
> See above

Please do.

> , you dolt.

If you were secure in the truth, you would have had the strength to
resist the temptation of descending into namecalling.

> >> Wonder what
> >> he feels is the purpose of his dribble?
> >
> > The LORD's purpose for my posting here on USENET is to inform.
>
> Why do you think that this is germaine to sci.med.cardiology, alt.atheism,
> or rec.food.cooking?

This discussion seems to hold the interest of participants from all
three newsgroups.

> How do you determine the Lord's purpose?

Through prayer.

> Does he/she speak to you?

No.

> >> Surely he doesn't think that he is
> >> "saving" anybody does he?
> >
> > No. It is LORD Jesus Christ Who saves.
>
> Thus the quotes

"Let your yes mean yes and your no mean no." -- LORD Jesus Christ

> , moron.

Again, if you were secure in the truth, you would have had the strength
to resist the temptation of descending into namecalling.

> >> If there was any question in anybody's mind about
> >> the negative effects of religion and the part it plays in mental illness
> >> we
> >> need only to point to Andrew Chung.
> >
> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes).
>
> Very convenient of them to say that. How very intolerant. Typical.

It would be your choice to covet the power of the truth.

> > You will be in my prayers, dear neighbor whom I love, in Jesus' most
> > precious and holy name.
>
> Save you ****ing breath. I speak for myself here, But I'm confident that
> Khubla will agree.

Sorry my choice to pray on your and Khubla's behalf bothers you so
terribly. Please forgive all my iniquities.

> > May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM.
>
> Like Father Ignacio did to you?

No.

> > Amen !!!
> >
>
> **** off loser.

Ouch. You may have at the other cheek.

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> wrote:
> >

snip

http://www.heartmdphd.com/ac.asp


http://mabletonga.ourlittle.net/News...s/ParadiseChat


http://www.thewellnessfoundation.com/


Voice: 678-524-4308 (if no answer, please leave message)
Fax: 404-699-8695


At Paradise Concepts
4419 Floyd Road
Mableton GA 30126
USA

wrote:

<snip>

>

FYI:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo


You will be in my prayers, dear neighbor whom I love, in Jesus' most
precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM.

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory,
cooking and nutrition that interest those following this thread here
during the next on-line chat (03/16/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> Read The Bible wrote:
>> Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
>> with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with
>> all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
>> perish, because they received not the love of the


This SHIT, in a Cardiology group, really ought to stop. No wonder this
guy is unable to get through hospital doors (except maybe as a psych
patient).

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
...
> Geoff wrote:
>>
>> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > Khubla wrote:
>> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>>
>> [...]
>>
>> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
>> >
>> > I am not the OP.
>>
>> Irrelevant.
>
> Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)

**** your lord.

>> >> and feels compelled to post it all
>> >> over the web, even to a food site.
>> >
>> > USENET is not the web.
>>
>> Usenet groups are posted on the web, moron.
>
> Not "all over the web."

With something as ephemeral as the WWW, "all over" is both
accurate and an exaggerative metaphor.

>> Ask Google.
>
> Who is Google?

Google is a god. Very powerful. Requires death sacrifice.

>> Not everyone
>> uses Outlook Express.
>
> Correct.
>
>> >> Can he be any dumber I ask?
>> >
>> > It is those who post to USENET thinking they are posting to the Web who
>> > are lacking in intelligence.
>>
>> See above
>
> Please do.
>
>> , you dolt.
>
> If you were secure in the truth, you would have had the strength to
> resist the temptation of descending into namecalling.

Wrong. I call you a dolt because you repeatedly make the same mistakes.

>> >> Wonder what
>> >> he feels is the purpose of his dribble?
>> >
>> > The LORD's purpose for my posting here on USENET is to inform.
>>
>> Why do you think that this is germaine to sci.med.cardiology,
>> alt.atheism,
>> or rec.food.cooking?
>
> This discussion seems to hold the interest of participants from all
> three newsgroups.

Nice assertion. Care to embellish?

>> How do you determine the Lord's purpose?
>
> Through prayer.
>
>> Does he/she speak to you?
>
> No.

OK, let me be more direct. How do you determine the Lord's purpose through
prayer?

>> >> Surely he doesn't think that he is
>> >> "saving" anybody does he?
>> >
>> > No. It is LORD Jesus Christ Who saves.
>>
>> Thus the quotes
>
> "Let your yes mean yes and your no mean no." -- LORD Jesus Christ
>
>> , moron.
>
> Again, if you were secure in the truth, you would have had the strength
> to resist the temptation of descending into namecalling.

You type sentances but they rarely have any meaning.

>> >> If there was any question in anybody's mind about
>> >> the negative effects of religion and the part it plays in mental
>> >> illness
>> >> we
>> >> need only to point to Andrew Chung.
>> >
>> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes).
>>
>> Very convenient of them to say that. How very intolerant. Typical.
>
> It would be your choice to covet the power of the truth.

Covet? Is that something you say on a regular basis? Regardless,
I don't covet anything of yours?.

>> > You will be in my prayers, dear neighbor whom I love, in Jesus' most
>> > precious and holy name.
>>
>> Save you ****ing breath. I speak for myself here, But I'm confident that
>> Khubla will agree.
>
> Sorry my choice to pray on your and Khubla's behalf bothers you so
> terribly. Please forgive all my iniquities.

I think you need to look up the definition for "iniquity".

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

Your god does not exist and its provable.
Time to grow up now.

IS THERE A GOD?
Strong Atheism's answer.

A BASIC DEFINITION OF GOD.

The general overarching definition of god as per
the major religions of the world is:

A. God is personal, God has will and consciousness.
B. God has free will.
C. God is the creator of all.
D. God is omnipotent.
E. God is omnibenevolent.
F. God is omniscient.
G. God is that which nothing more powerful
can be imagined.

These are the basic attributes that can be claimed
for the god of orthodox Judaism, Christianity,
Islam, and Hinduism.

Omnibenevolence and omniscience are actually
logically derivable from the claimed attribute of
omnipotence and so aren't not truly independent
attributes, and may be considered special aspects
of omnipotence.

There are other attributes of god, that he is the
only such god, that he is is immortal and that
god has always existed that are not important
for this discussion and for now, can be ignored.
They are secondary arguments and are for the most
part not foundational or truly necessary, except
those that can be logically derived from the
attributes listed above.

A CLASS OF GODS

It is important to note here that this is a
definition not for a particular god, but an
entire class of gods.
Sub-theories about god are not important here.
Christianity claims one may attain salvation
only through Jesus, Islam claims the Christian
dogma that Jesus was the son of god is
blasphemous.

Ideas like this though, are of little importance
to the overarching and general claims made for a
personal, creator, omni-everything god. I have
coined a term, The Grand God of Grand Theologies
for this sort of god, this sort of theological
system of expansive claims for god.
Grand theologies are those theologies that have
adopted this class of god as their basic
attributes concerning the nature of god. But it
is important to remember here that what is being
discussed here is a class of gods, not particular
gods or specific gods.

THE FOUR GREAT THEOLOGICAL TRADITIONS

Again, Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism hold
to this basic Grand God and are typical Grand
Theologies holding to this basic class of god as
their basic definitions of what god is at god's
most basic level.

A big problem with this class of gods is, it
collapses rather easily into internal self-
contradiction.

THE PROBLEM OF EVIL.

The problem of evil was first written down by
Epicurus in about the third century BCE.

Today's formulation is:
A. God is defined as omnipotent;
B. and as omnibenevolent.
C. Evil exists.
D. God therefore, is not omnipotent as claimed.
E. Or God is not omnibenevolent as claimed.
F. Or god is neither omnipotent or
omnibenevolent.
G. Or god is not existant.

THE FREE WILL DEFENSE

The free will defense of the problem of evil goes
back to St. Augustine who popularized it. It is
still popular, and is championed most notably
today by Alvin Plantinga, but also by other
theologians.

God gave man free will. Man freely chooses to do
evil. Ability to do evil is less evil than
lacking free will.

THE FREE WILL DEFENSE DEBUNKED.

God has free will.
God is omnibenevolent, he has a good nature
incapable of doing evil.

A. If god can have free will, and a good nature,
this good nature is not allowed to count
against god's free will.
B. Nor is god's lack of ability to do evil
allowed to count against god's omnipotence.
C. Likewise, man could easily have a god like
free will and a god like good nature.
D. Inabilty then to do evil would no more count
against man's free will than it does for god's
free will.
E. If so, it also counts against god's free will
and god does not have free will as claimed.
F. If god does not have absolute and total free
will, thus free will is not a true necessity
at all.
F. If god is omnipotent and omnibenevolent, and
can give man a god like free will and a
god-like good nature incapable of moral evil,
god must do so or god is not moral, not
omnibenevolent.
G. Evil exists because he allows it to.

So free will does not exist, or it does and we can
have a god like free will and a god like good
nature. Either way, free will cannot explain away
the existence of evil. This free will defense
then, is a failed argument.

OMNISCIENCE VERSUS CREATORHOOD OF GOD

God is defined as creator of all in most
religions.
And god is claimed to be omniscient, all knowing.

A. God created the Universe and all in it.
B. God is omniscient, all knowing, he knows all
in the Universe and he knows the future of the
Universe and its contents.
C. If god creates a Universe, he will know that
in 13 billion years this Universe will have a
man named John Smith in it.
D. If John Smith is good and saved, or evil and
damned, God will know that.
E. As he knows that the Universe in its present
state will have a John Smith, god may then
contemplate the future state of Smith and
decide if he will tolerate an evil Smith.
F. If yes, Smith will be evil only because of a
specific personal and will choice made solely
by god.
G. If Smith is evil, then evil exists solely
because of a choice made by god. In fact all
moral evil done by creations of god will be
evil and do evil only because of personal and
willful creations of god allowing evil acts
to be done, by direct decision of god.
H. If evil exists in a world with an omniscient
creator god, it is solely and only because
god allows evil.
I. If evil exists solely because of personal
choices of god, god then is not as defined,
omnibenevolent.
J. Man and any other sentient being in such a
Universe cannot have any free will, not even
in principle. A Universe with a god that
creates all and knows all precludes free will
for all beings god creates in the strongest
possible manner.

The Grand God of Grand
Theology is thus self destroying, it is
incoherent and contradictory as a theory
and such a god is impossible.

THE SITUATION SO FAR.

1. A minimalistic class of gods is defined, this
Grand God has been defined here with as few
terms as possible.
2. The problem of evil dooms such a claimed god.
3. The attempted defense, free will is fatally
flawed. God's good nature and free will doom
claims free will makes evil necessary for man
to have free will.
4. Omniscience and creatorhood of god further
doom claims of god's omnibenevolence and
man's free will free will cannot exist for
man. All evil is the direct and knowing
creation of god contradicting claims of
omnibenevolence.
5. Since Free will for man is totally impossible,
free will cannot be a good quality, much less
necessary.

Here, the Grand God of Grand Theology has
collapsed. As has Grand Theology. As pointed out,
this destroys the claims and viability of an
entire class of possible gods, all secondary and
tertiary claims for such a god of this class also
fail, as do dogmas or secondary or tertiary
claims.

If a these Grand Gods cannot exist as defined,
specific gods cannot, nor can claims such as this
or that Grand God sent this or that revelation to
man or some prophet or did this or that.

God is thus disproven and is utter irrelevant
to anything real and existant.


***********






So you want to fight the Master!
First you must fight my brother Chang!

Cheerful Charlie

"Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
ps.com...
> Geoff wrote:
>> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > Geoff wrote:
>> >>
>> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> > Khubla wrote:
>> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> >>
>> >> [...]
>> >>
>> >> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
>> >> >
>> >> > I am not the OP.
>> >>
>> >> Irrelevant.
>> >
>> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)
>>
>> **** your lord.
>
> If HE realizes the possibility of a global earthquake on 03/29/06, you
> will know that the Christ Jesus is the KING of kings and LORD of lords.

"If HE realizes the possibility..."

Now there's a hedge for ya!

Care to specify what magnitude or minimum magnitude? Earthquakes happen all
the time, moron.

Geoff wrote:
>
> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Geoff wrote:
> >>
> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > Khubla wrote:
> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >>
> >> [...]
> >>
> >> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
> >> >
> >> > I am not the OP.
> >>
> >> Irrelevant.
> >
> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)
>
> **** your lord.

You remind me of the chigger that would shake its fist at an elephant
that looms overhead.

You will remain in my prayers, dear Geoff whom I love, in Jesus'
most precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM so that you will someday see
the following written on HIS thigh:

"KING of kings and LORD of lords."

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/23/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Al wrote:
>
> Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
> > Read The Bible wrote:
> >> Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
> >> with all power and signs and lying wonders, and with
> >> all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
> >> perish, because they received not the love of the
>
> This SHIT, in a Cardiology group, really ought to stop. No wonder this
> guy is unable to get through hospital doors (except maybe as a psych
> patient).

Sorry the Holy Bible bothers you so terribly. Please forgive all my
iniquities.

You will remain in my prayers, dear Al whom I love, in Jesus'
most precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM so that you will someday see
the following written on HIS thigh:

"KING of kings and LORD of lords."

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/23/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

wbarwell wrote:
>
> Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>
> Your god does not exist and its provable.
> Time to grow up now.
>
Through HIM all things have been and continue to be made. The LORD
exists. Everything He has made, including you, proves this.

> IS THERE A GOD?
> Strong Atheism's answer.

Without the LORD, nothing stands.

> A BASIC DEFINITION OF GOD.
>
> The general overarching definition of god as per
> the major religions of the world is:
>
> A. God is personal, God has will and consciousness.
> B. God has free will.
> C. God is the creator of all.
> D. God is omnipotent.
> E. God is omnibenevolent.
> F. God is omniscient.
> G. God is that which nothing more powerful
> can be imagined.

GOD is also infinitely greater than all of our attempts to define HIM.

> These are the basic attributes that can be claimed
> for the god of orthodox Judaism, Christianity,
> Islam, and Hinduism.

The LORD is the source of all knowledge and wisdom.

> Omnibenevolence and omniscience are actually
> logically derivable from the claimed attribute of
> omnipotence and so aren't not truly independent
> attributes, and may be considered special aspects
> of omnipotence.

That is not what I discern.

> There are other attributes of god, that he is the
> only such god, that he is is immortal and that
> god has always existed that are not important
> for this discussion and for now, can be ignored.

Without the LORD, your opinions are meaningless (Ecclesiastes).

> They are secondary arguments and are for the most
> part not foundational or truly necessary, except
> those that can be logically derived from the
> attributes listed above.

That is not what I discern.

> A CLASS OF GODS
>
> It is important to note here that this is a
> definition not for a particular god, but an
> entire class of gods.

There is no other like LORD GOD Almighty.

> Sub-theories about god are not important here.
> Christianity claims one may attain salvation
> only through Jesus, Islam claims the Christian
> dogma that Jesus was the son of god is
> blasphemous.

Actually, the Holy Quran, guidance from GOD through the angel Gabriel,
who heralded the birth of Immanuel, identifies Christ Jesus as son of
Mary, prophet of GOD who possessed with power of the Holy Spirit.

In essence, the Holy Quran also proclaims that Christ Jesus is GOD the
Son because only the Son of GOD can have the power of the Holy Spirit.

Truth is simple.

> Ideas like this though, are of little importance
> to the overarching and general claims made for a
> personal, creator, omni-everything god. I have
> coined a term, The Grand God of Grand Theologies
> for this sort of god, this sort of theological
> system of expansive claims for god.

It would be your choice to make an idol for worship.

> Grand theologies are those theologies that have
> adopted this class of god as their basic
> attributes concerning the nature of god. But it
> is important to remember here that what is being
> discussed here is a class of gods, not particular
> gods or specific gods.

Because there is only one true GOD and HE is LORD GOD Almighty...

"I am the way, the truth, and the life" -- LORD Jesus Christ

.... this feeble attempt to prove that LORD GOD Almighty does not exist
fails.

"A house built on sand will not stand."

You will remain in my prayers, dear Charlie whom I love, in Jesus'
most precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM so that you will someday see
the following written on HIS thigh:

"KING of kings and LORD of lords."

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/23/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Geoff wrote:
>
> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> ps.com...
> > Geoff wrote:
> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > Geoff wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> >> ...
> >> >> > Khubla wrote:
> >> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> >>
> >> >> [...]
> >> >>
> >> >> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I am not the OP.
> >> >>
> >> >> Irrelevant.
> >> >
> >> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)
> >>
> >> **** your lord.
> >
> > If HE realizes the possibility of a global earthquake on 03/29/06, you
> > will know that the Christ Jesus is the KING of kings and LORD of lords.
>
> "If HE realizes the possibility..."
>
> Now there's a hedge for ya!

No.

> Care to specify what magnitude or minimum magnitude?

The vision was John's and not mine.

> Earthquakes happen all the time

Not global ones.

> , moron.

If you were secure in the truth, you would have had the strength to
resist the tempation of descending into namecalling.

You will remain in my prayers, dear Geoff whom I love, in Jesus'
most precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIM so that you will someday see
the following written on HIS thigh:

"KING of kings and LORD of lords."

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/23/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

<snip>
>> Sub-theories about god are not important here.
>> Christianity claims one may attain salvation
>> only through Jesus, Islam claims the Christian
>> dogma that Jesus was the son of god is
>> blasphemous.
>
> Actually, the Holy Quran, guidance from GOD through the angel Gabriel,
> who heralded the birth of Immanuel, identifies Christ Jesus as son of
> Mary, prophet of GOD who possessed with power of the Holy Spirit.
>
> In essence, the Holy Quran also proclaims that Christ Jesus is GOD the
> Son because only the Son of GOD can have the power of the Holy Spirit.
>
> Truth is simple.

And you are wrong. If "Christ" was identified as the "Son of God" by the
Quran, which was written by Mohammed, then why do Muslims, whose holy book
the Quran is, state that Christ was just another prophet, as was Mohammed
and the Messiah is yet to come?

ShadowWolf

ShadowWolf wrote:
> <snip>
> >> Sub-theories about god are not important here.
> >> Christianity claims one may attain salvation
> >> only through Jesus, Islam claims the Christian
> >> dogma that Jesus was the son of god is
> >> blasphemous.
> >
> > Actually, the Holy Quran, guidance from GOD through the angel Gabriel,
> > who heralded the birth of Immanuel, identifies Christ Jesus as son of
> > Mary, prophet of GOD Who possessed the power of the Holy Spirit.
> >
> > In essence, the Holy Quran also proclaims that Christ Jesus is GOD the
> > Son because only the Son of GOD can have the power of the Holy Spirit.
> >
> > Truth is simple.
>
> And you are wrong.

Not for the discerning.

> If "Christ" was identified as the "Son of God" by the
> Quran, which was written by Mohammed, then why do Muslims, whose holy book
> the Quran is, state that Christ was just another prophet, as was Mohammed
> and the Messiah is yet to come?

"'Be ever hearing, but never understanding; be ever seeing, but never
perceiving'" --LORD Almighty GOD (Isaiah 6:9)

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/23/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:


http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for
how the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:

> Geoff wrote:
>> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > Geoff wrote:
>> >>
>> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> >> ...
>> >> > Khubla wrote:
>> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
>> >>
>> >> [...]
>> >>
>> >> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
>> >> >
>> >> > I am not the OP.
>> >>
>> >> Irrelevant.
>> >
>> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)
>>
>> **** your lord.
>
> If HE realizes the possibility of a global earthquake on 03/29/06, you
> will know that the Christ Jesus is the KING of kings and LORD of lords.

Now you say "If" - yet you have been saying all along that "It will happen"
- this sort of trickery with words is something that the Pharisee, Saducees
and all others who had Christ condemned and put on the cross did.

You make yourself no better than them

Now - Get the behind me, Devil!

ShadowWolf

Barry OGrady wrote:
>
> On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 20:17:44 -0500, "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote:
>
> >Geoff wrote:
> >>
> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > Geoff wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> >> ...
> >> >> > Khubla wrote:
> >> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> >>
> >> >> [...]
> >> >>
> >> >> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I am not the OP.
> >> >>
> >> >> Irrelevant.
> >> >
> >> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)
> >>
> >> **** your lord.
> >
> >You remind me of the chigger that would shake its fist at an elephant
> >that looms overhead.
>
> You remind me of the loonatik that would allow his keepers to do anything to
> him because he was afraid of them.

Without the LORD, your thoughts along with the rest of your life are
meaningless (Ecclesiastes).

You will remain in my prayers, dear Barry whom I love, in Jesus' most
precious and holy name.

May GOD continue to draw you closer to HIS light so that someday you
will be able to read what is written on HIS thigh:

"KING of kings and LORD of lords" (Revelation 19:16)

Amen ! ! !

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/23/06) from 6 to 7 pm EST:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8

ShadowWolf wrote:
>
> Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD wrote:
>
> > Geoff wrote:
> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> ...
> >> > Geoff wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> >> ...
> >> >> > Khubla wrote:
> >> >> >> "Andrew B. Chung, MD/PhD" > wrote in message
> >> >>
> >> >> [...]
> >> >>
> >> >> >> Andrew reads something in his Buy-Bull
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I am not the OP.
> >> >>
> >> >> Irrelevant.
> >> >
> >> > Without the LORD, your opinion is meaningless (Ecclesiastes)
> >>
> >> **** your lord.
> >
> > If HE realizes the possibility of a global earthquake on 03/29/06, you
> > will know that the Christ Jesus is the KING of kings and LORD of lords.
>
> Now you say "If" - yet you have been saying all along that "It will happen"

No.

This remains an advisory and not prophecy.

Will be available to "glow" and chat about this and other things like
cardiology, diabetes, Bird Flu, the 2006 global earthquake advisory for
03/29/06, cooking and nutrition that interest those following this
thread here during the next on-line chat (03/30/06) from 5 to 6 pm EST,
LORD willing:

http://tinyurl.com/8w7uq

For those who are put off by the signature, my advance apologies for how
the LORD has reshaped me:

http://tinyurl.com/7mcuo

Prayerfully in Christ's love,

Andrew
http://tinyurl.com/rgsp8