Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes left and
right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I know that I can
always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in about 4 weeks. :~)

------------------------------------------------------------------

Grandma C's German Potato Salad

Ingredients:

2 quarts red potatoes, peeled
9 slices fried bacon
1 cup chopped onion
1/2 tsp. bacon drippings
2 Tbl. sugar
2 Tbl. flour
2 tsp. salt
1/8 tsp. pepper
1/2 tsp. celery seed
1 cup water
2/3 cup white or cider vinegar

Directions:

1. Boil potatoes, then slice when done and cooled. Set aside or put into a
bowl.
2. Take the chopped onion and cook over low direct heat using the bacon
drippings.
3. Mix sugar, flour, salt, pepper and celery seed together. Blend into
onion saute'.
4. When onions are wilted, pour in the water and vinegar. Stir mixture
until it boils for about 1 minute.
5. Pour onion and vinegar "dressing" over sliced potatoes. Crumble the
bacon slices over potatoes. Lightly fold everything in together.
6. Garnish with bacon, egg and/or parsley.

"kilikini" > wrote in message
. ..
> Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes left
and
> right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I know that I can
> always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in about 4 weeks. :~)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Grandma C's German Potato Salad
>
> Ingredients:
>
> 2 quarts red potatoes, peeled
> 9 slices fried bacon
> 1 cup chopped onion
> 1/2 tsp. bacon drippings
> 2 Tbl. sugar
> 2 Tbl. flour
> 2 tsp. salt
> 1/8 tsp. pepper
> 1/2 tsp. celery seed
> 1 cup water
> 2/3 cup white or cider vinegar
>
> Directions:
>
> 1. Boil potatoes, then slice when done and cooled. Set aside or put into
a
> bowl.
> 2. Take the chopped onion and cook over low direct heat using the bacon
> drippings.
> 3. Mix sugar, flour, salt, pepper and celery seed together. Blend into
> onion saute'.
> 4. When onions are wilted, pour in the water and vinegar. Stir mixture
> until it boils for about 1 minute.
> 5. Pour onion and vinegar "dressing" over sliced potatoes. Crumble the
> bacon slices over potatoes. Lightly fold everything in together.
> 6. Garnish with bacon, egg and/or parsley.
>
>

Ooops! Should be 1/2 cup bacon drippings for the dressing! I goofed.

kili

On Wed 17 May 2006 04:28:27a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it kilikini?

> Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes left and
> right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I know that I can
> always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in about 4 weeks. :~)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Grandma C's German Potato Salad

I love German potato salad!

--
Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
_____________________

Wayne Boatwright <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in
28.19:

> On Wed 17 May 2006 04:28:27a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it
> kilikini?
>
>> Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
>> left and right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I
>> know that I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in
>> about 4 weeks. :~)
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Grandma C's German Potato Salad
>
> I love German potato salad!

An aquaintance took me to a German restaurant in Oakland, CA.

I devoured the wienershnitznel, potato salad and red cabbage cole-slaw
and beer.

Viel Appetit und Genuß

Andy

Andy wrote:
I love German potato salad!
>
>
> An aquaintance took me to a German restaurant in Oakland, CA.
>
> I devoured the wienershnitznel, potato salad and red cabbage cole-slaw
> and beer.
>
> Viel Appetit und Genuß
>
> Andy

Guten Appetit!

Margaret Suran > wrote in news:xgFag.3185
:

>
>
> Andy wrote:
> I love German potato salad!
>>
>>
>> An aquaintance took me to a German restaurant in Oakland, CA.
>>
>> I devoured the wienershnitznel, potato salad and red cabbage cole-slaw
>> and beer.
>>
>> Viel Appetit und Genuß
>>
>> Andy
>
> Guten Appetit!


Danke.

Andy

Wan's arschel brummt
Ist herzel g'sund

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
> On Wed 17 May 2006 04:28:27a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it kilikini?
>
> > Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes left
and
> > right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I know that I
can
> > always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in about 4 weeks. :~)
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Grandma C's German Potato Salad
>
> I love German potato salad!
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
> ____________________


I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one. If you
do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are recipes with
mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in there! This recipe
is the real deal from my German grandmother Esther Berg Ciesemier. (Last
name used to be Ziesemeier.) Can't get more German than that!

kili

kilikini wrote:
> Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
> left and right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I
> know that I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in
> about 4 weeks. :~)
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Grandma C's German Potato Salad
>
> Ingredients:
>
> 2 quarts red potatoes, peeled
> 9 slices fried bacon
> 1 cup chopped onion
> 1/2 tsp. bacon drippings (corrected to 1/2 cup)
> 2 Tbl. sugar
> 2 Tbl. flour
> 2 tsp. salt
> 1/8 tsp. pepper
> 1/2 tsp. celery seed
> 1 cup water
> 2/3 cup white or cider vinegar
>
kili, when we talked yesterday you asked how this compares to my
grandmother's version. This is very much like it. (She also made a mayo
version which my dad preferred). In her vinegar version, the potatoes were
still hot, diced (not sliced) and everything was tossed together mixed in
and the potato salad was served hot. She never used cider vinegar.

Jill

"kilikini" > wrote in
:

>
> "kilikini" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
>> left
> and
>> right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I know that
>> I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in about 4
>> weeks. :~)
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Grandma C's German Potato Salad
>>
>> Ingredients:
>>
>> 2 quarts red potatoes, peeled
>> 9 slices fried bacon
>> 1 cup chopped onion
>> 1/2 tsp. bacon drippings
>> 2 Tbl. sugar
>> 2 Tbl. flour
>> 2 tsp. salt
>> 1/8 tsp. pepper
>> 1/2 tsp. celery seed
>> 1 cup water
>> 2/3 cup white or cider vinegar
>>
>> Directions:
>>
>> 1. Boil potatoes, then slice when done and cooled. Set aside or put
>> into
> a
>> bowl.
>> 2. Take the chopped onion and cook over low direct heat using the
>> bacon drippings.
>> 3. Mix sugar, flour, salt, pepper and celery seed together. Blend
>> into onion saute'.
>> 4. When onions are wilted, pour in the water and vinegar. Stir
>> mixture until it boils for about 1 minute.
>> 5. Pour onion and vinegar "dressing" over sliced potatoes. Crumble
>> the bacon slices over potatoes. Lightly fold everything in together.
>> 6. Garnish with bacon, egg and/or parsley.
>>
>>
>
> Ooops! Should be 1/2 cup bacon drippings for the dressing! I goofed.
>
> kili
>
>

Add a sliced hard-boiled egg or two.


--
Untie the two knots to email me

A trillion here, a trillion there,
pretty soon you're talking real money.

> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one. If
> you
> do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are recipes with
> mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in there! This recipe
> is the real deal from my German grandmother Esther Berg Ciesemier. (Last
> name used to be Ziesemeier.) Can't get more German than that!
>

Growing up in Germany I've had both creamy and vinegar dressing. In the
southern parts it's common to use a mixture of broth, vinegar and oil. Bacon
is optional as are lots of other additions. Mayo or dairy-based dressings
are more common in the North.

So I'd say both are typical German but when I see "German potato salad" I
expect the (superior!) version made without mayo.

By the way, many German potato salad makers I've talked to swear that the
marinade must be poured over the potatoes when they are still hot which has
something to do with absorption of the marinade into the potato. Others
prefer using potatoes that were cooked the day before, go figure.

Really good with tarragon too...

Andrew

On Wed 17 May 2006 07:01:52a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it kilikini?

>
> "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> 28.19...
>> On Wed 17 May 2006 04:28:27a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it
>> kilikini?
>>
>> > Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
>> > left and right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I
>> > know that I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in
>> > about 4 weeks. :~)
>> >
>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > Grandma C's German Potato Salad
>>
>> I love German potato salad!
>>
>> --
>> Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬ ____________________
>
>
> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one. If
> you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are recipes
> with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in there! This
> recipe is the real deal from my German grandmother Esther Berg
> Ciesemier. (Last name used to be Ziesemeier.) Can't get more German
> than that!

I've added your grandmother's name to the recipe. I especially like the
proportions of the ingredients in this. Some German potato salads have a
dressing/sauce that is too much like the consistency of gravy. This looks
perfect and well-balanced for flavor and consistency. I'm really looking
forward to making it.

Do you have a preference for white or cider vinegar in this? I would be
inclined to use cinder vinegar.

--
Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
_____________________

On Wed, 17 May 2006 11:28:27 GMT, kilikini wrote:

> Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes left and
> right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I kno

I hate to say this Kili, but can only be two reasons:
1. Mom has some sort of age related dementia (not the least of which
is Alzheimer's)
2. She's not cooking much anymore and needs downsize her recipe
collection (toss recipes)
--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

On Wed, 17 May 2006 09:45:38 -0500, jmcquown wrote:

> kilikini wrote:
> > Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
> > left and right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I
> > know that I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in
> > about 4 weeks. :~)
> >
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Grandma C's German Potato Salad
> >
> > Ingredients:
> >
> > 2 quarts red potatoes, peeled
> > 9 slices fried bacon
> > 1 cup chopped onion
> > 1/2 tsp. bacon drippings (corrected to 1/2 cup)
> > 2 Tbl. sugar
> > 2 Tbl. flour
> > 2 tsp. salt
> > 1/8 tsp. pepper
> > 1/2 tsp. celery seed
> > 1 cup water
> > 2/3 cup white or cider vinegar
> >
> kili, when we talked yesterday you asked how this compares to my
> grandmother's version. This is very much like it. (She also made a mayo
> version which my dad preferred). In her vinegar version, the potatoes were
> still hot, diced (not sliced) and everything was tossed together mixed in
> and the potato salad was served hot. She never used cider vinegar.
>
My mom made a hot "german" potato salad (once) that I loved and
adored. She never replicated it - much to my dismay. If she used
vinegar (which she did) it was cider. Oh, man was that stuff GOOD!
--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

Here is a german exchange recipe site.
I was taught to use chicken broth in german potato salad and was pleased
to see one of the recipes included that.

http://www.geocities.com/NapaValley/...ecipes/s1.html

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
> On Wed 17 May 2006 07:01:52a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it kilikini?
>
> >
> > "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> > 28.19...
> >> On Wed 17 May 2006 04:28:27a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it
> >> kilikini?
> >>
> >> > Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
> >> > left and right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I
> >> > know that I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in
> >> > about 4 weeks. :~)
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >
> >> > Grandma C's German Potato Salad
> >>
> >> I love German potato salad!
> >>
> >> --
> >> Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬ ____________________
> >
> >
> > I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one. If
> > you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are recipes
> > with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in there! This
> > recipe is the real deal from my German grandmother Esther Berg
> > Ciesemier. (Last name used to be Ziesemeier.) Can't get more German
> > than that!
>
> I've added your grandmother's name to the recipe. I especially like the
> proportions of the ingredients in this. Some German potato salads have a
> dressing/sauce that is too much like the consistency of gravy. This looks
> perfect and well-balanced for flavor and consistency. I'm really looking
> forward to making it.
>
> Do you have a preference for white or cider vinegar in this? I would be
> inclined to use cinder vinegar.
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
> _____________________


Well, that's what I asked my mom and she said she always made the recipe
with white vinegar, but I'd be more inclined to use cider. Try both (in
different batches, of course!) and see what you think is better. Honestly,
this recipe spoiled me for any other German Potato salad; if it's not my
grandma's, fohgettaboutit. :~)

kili

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 17 May 2006 11:28:27 GMT, kilikini wrote:
>
> > Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes left
and
> > right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I kno
>
> I hate to say this Kili, but can only be two reasons:
> 1. Mom has some sort of age related dementia (not the least of which
> is Alzheimer's)
> 2. She's not cooking much anymore and needs downsize her recipe
> collection (toss recipes)
> --
>

You nailed it on the second one, Barb. She's kind of going, well, I don't
have anyone to cook for anymore so I'll never need this again...... I call
her up for a recipe and she says she's tossed it. Some of my comfort foods
are now gone. It's a shame.

kili

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Wed, 17 May 2006 09:45:38 -0500, jmcquown wrote:
>
> > kilikini wrote:
> > > Sorry for the post, but my mom is tossing out my childhood recipes
> > > left and right (God only knows why!), so at least if I post this, I
> > > know that I can always Google it if I need it! And I'll need it in
> > > about 4 weeks. :~)
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Grandma C's German Potato Salad
> > >
> > > Ingredients:
> > >
> > > 2 quarts red potatoes, peeled
> > > 9 slices fried bacon
> > > 1 cup chopped onion
> > > 1/2 tsp. bacon drippings (corrected to 1/2 cup)
> > > 2 Tbl. sugar
> > > 2 Tbl. flour
> > > 2 tsp. salt
> > > 1/8 tsp. pepper
> > > 1/2 tsp. celery seed
> > > 1 cup water
> > > 2/3 cup white or cider vinegar
> > >
> > kili, when we talked yesterday you asked how this compares to my
> > grandmother's version. This is very much like it. (She also made a
mayo
> > version which my dad preferred). In her vinegar version, the potatoes
were
> > still hot, diced (not sliced) and everything was tossed together mixed
in
> > and the potato salad was served hot. She never used cider vinegar.
> >
> My mom made a hot "german" potato salad (once) that I loved and
> adored. She never replicated it - much to my dismay. If she used
> vinegar (which she did) it was cider. Oh, man was that stuff GOOD!
> --

Try this one. It can be served hot or cold, but I always liked it hot.

kili

Kili wrote about her mom tossing out recipes:

> She's kind of going, well, I don't have anyone to cook for
> anymore so I'll never need this again...... I call her up
> for a recipe and she says she's tossed it. Some of my
> comfort foods are now gone. It's a shame.

Kili, are you near enough to visit your mom and go through the recipes with
her to save those she wants to pitch but you want to keep? Or can you ask
her to send you the ones she plans to toss? When my husband died, and again
when I downsized my home, my daughters came and rescued some of their
favorites that I knew I'd not make again.

Felice

"Felice Friese" > wrote in message
...
>
> Kili wrote about her mom tossing out recipes:
>
> > She's kind of going, well, I don't have anyone to cook for
> > anymore so I'll never need this again...... I call her up
> > for a recipe and she says she's tossed it. Some of my
> > comfort foods are now gone. It's a shame.
>
> Kili, are you near enough to visit your mom and go through the recipes
with
> her to save those she wants to pitch but you want to keep? Or can you ask
> her to send you the ones she plans to toss? When my husband died, and
again
> when I downsized my home, my daughters came and rescued some of their
> favorites that I knew I'd not make again.
>
> Felice
>
>

I wish! I'm in central Florida and she's all the way up in Wisconsin. I
haven't seen my mom in years, actually. Before I moved to Florida a year
and a half ago, I was in Hawaii. Before that I was in California. Time has
its way of disappearing before you know it.

kili

On Thu, 18 May 2006 08:42:12 GMT, kilikini wrote:

> Some of my comfort foods are now gone. It's a shame.

Could you possibly spend some time with her and try to recreate them?
I bet she would love to to it because she could spend some
mother/daughter "bonding" time with you. You're not a mom, so you
don't know how special those moments are - from a mother's POV.
--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

On Thu, 18 May 2006 08:42:59 GMT, kilikini wrote:

> Try this one. It can be served hot or cold, but I always liked it hot.


I will, thanks for the recipe!


--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

On Thu, 18 May 2006 15:34:31 GMT, kilikini wrote:

>
> "Felice Friese" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> > Kili, are you near enough to visit your mom and go through the recipes
> with
> > her to save those she wants to pitch but you want to keep? Or can you ask
> > her to send you the ones she plans to toss? When my husband died, and
> again
> > when I downsized my home, my daughters came and rescued some of their
> > favorites that I knew I'd not make again.
> >
> > Felice
> >
> >
>
> I wish! I'm in central Florida and she's all the way up in Wisconsin. I
> haven't seen my mom in years, actually. Before I moved to Florida a year
> and a half ago, I was in Hawaii. Before that I was in California. Time has
> its way of disappearing before you know it.
>
Get your adorable little butt to Wisconsin and be the daughter your
mom always dreamed you'd be, ASAP.... even if you have to walk there.

sf
whose mom died December '05
--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 18 May 2006 15:34:31 GMT, kilikini wrote:
>
> >
> > "Felice Friese" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > > Kili, are you near enough to visit your mom and go through the
recipes
> > with
> > > her to save those she wants to pitch but you want to keep? Or can you
ask
> > > her to send you the ones she plans to toss? When my husband died, and
> > again
> > > when I downsized my home, my daughters came and rescued some of their
> > > favorites that I knew I'd not make again.
> > >
> > > Felice
> > >
> > >
> >
> > I wish! I'm in central Florida and she's all the way up in Wisconsin.
I
> > haven't seen my mom in years, actually. Before I moved to Florida a
year
> > and a half ago, I was in Hawaii. Before that I was in California.
Time has
> > its way of disappearing before you know it.
> >
> Get your adorable little butt to Wisconsin and be the daughter your
> mom always dreamed you'd be, ASAP.... even if you have to walk there.
>
> sf
> whose mom died December '05
> --

I remember that your mom passed, Barb. Thing is, at the rate I'm going, my
mom better get her butt to Florida!

kili <-------- who's going through *major* health issues.

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 18 May 2006 08:42:12 GMT, kilikini wrote:
>
> > Some of my comfort foods are now gone. It's a shame.
>
> Could you possibly spend some time with her and try to recreate them?
> I bet she would love to to it because she could spend some
> mother/daughter "bonding" time with you. You're not a mom, so you
> don't know how special those moments are - from a mother's POV.
> --
>

Mom and I don't see eye-to-eye and never have. Hope your advice helps
someone, though! You're a good egg. :~)

kili

[copied in email to my mom]

On Thu, 18 May 2006 20:23:57 -0700, sf >
wrote:

>On Thu, 18 May 2006 08:42:12 GMT, kilikini wrote:
>
>> Some of my comfort foods are now gone. It's a shame.
>
>Could you possibly spend some time with her and try to recreate them?
>I bet she would love to to it because she could spend some
>mother/daughter "bonding" time with you. You're not a mom, so you
>don't know how special those moments are - from a mother's POV.

These days, I call my mom a few times a week, and at least once a
week, I set aside a good stretch of time for food talk. I ask her how
to make something she made when I was little, or I tell her about the
stuff I've cooked this week, or we just reminisce about going shopping
together. She loves that I care about keeping her recipes alive, and
I love the connection she and I have around food and hospitality. It
is because of my mother's example that my house is open to "strays"
and because of her that no one who comes to my home ever needs to
leave hungry. I am a very lucky person.

Thanks, Momma Duck.

Serene
--
Kissing Hank's Ass is 10 years old! http://jhuger.com/kisshank
My personal blog: http://serenejournal.livejournal.com
My new cooking blog: http://serenecooking.livejournal.com

On Fri, 19 May 2006 09:52:13 GMT, kilikini wrote:

>
> "sf" > wrote in message
> ...
> > On Thu, 18 May 2006 15:34:31 GMT, kilikini wrote:
> >
> > > I wish! I'm in central Florida and she's all the way up in Wisconsin.
> > >
> > Get your adorable little butt to Wisconsin and be the daughter your
> > mom always dreamed you'd be, ASAP.... even if you have to walk there.
> >
> > sf
> > whose mom died December '05
> > --
>
> I remember that your mom passed, Barb. Thing is, at the rate I'm going, my
> mom better get her butt to Florida!
>
> kili <-------- who's going through *major* health issues.
>
You alluded to having a health problem at one point, Kili... but I
didn't know it was so serious. Please take good care of yourself.

{{{HUGS}}}

--

Ham and eggs.
A day's work for a chicken, a lifetime commitment for a pig.

kilikini > wrote:

> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one. If you
> do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are recipes with
> mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in there!

Nonsense. I see I have to repost some of what I posted before... It is
ridiculous to call any dish (pan)-German, as implied by your all-caps in
"German Potato Salad" - there is no such thing, except in a very general
way. There was no such thing as Germany until 1871, the Holy Roman
Empire notwithstanding... not even a customs union until something like
1835. There was nothing more than a loose conglomeration of often
hostile mini-states with their own cultures and traditions. The recipe
you posted appears to be a version of some of Bavarian potato salads,
particularly those from the Franken region. Many other Bavarian salads,
particularly the Munich version, don't contain any bacon or other pork
products, but instead are prepared with a dressing made with broth, oil
and vinegar, and often also contain chives or pickles. Such versions
are also popular in the neighbouring Swabian and Baden regions. Moving
to the north, you will find mayo being used more often in potato salads.
Rhineland versions are made with homemade mayo. The versions to the
north and east of the Rhine may or may not contain mayo and are often
more complicated and made with a lot of additional or alternative
ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages, other meats,
herring, etc., often combining them. The salads everywhere are served
warm or cold, with 'cold' generally meaning room temperature. Those
with mayo are more often served cold - I've never seen a warm Rhineland
version.

Victor

On Mon 22 May 2006 02:47:59p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
Sack?

> kilikini > wrote:
>
>> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one.
>> If you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are
>> recipes with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in
>> there!
>
> Nonsense. I see I have to repost some of what I posted before... It is
> ridiculous to call any dish (pan)-German, as implied by your all-caps in
> "German Potato Salad" - there is no such thing, except in a very general
> way. There was no such thing as Germany until 1871, the Holy Roman
> Empire notwithstanding... not even a customs union until something like
> 1835. There was nothing more than a loose conglomeration of often
> hostile mini-states with their own cultures and traditions. The recipe
> you posted appears to be a version of some of Bavarian potato salads,
> particularly those from the Franken region. Many other Bavarian salads,
> particularly the Munich version, don't contain any bacon or other pork
> products, but instead are prepared with a dressing made with broth, oil
> and vinegar, and often also contain chives or pickles. Such versions
> are also popular in the neighbouring Swabian and Baden regions. Moving
> to the north, you will find mayo being used more often in potato salads.
> Rhineland versions are made with homemade mayo. The versions to the
> north and east of the Rhine may or may not contain mayo and are often
> more complicated and made with a lot of additional or alternative
> ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages, other meats,
> herring, etc., often combining them. The salads everywhere are served
> warm or cold, with 'cold' generally meaning room temperature. Those
> with mayo are more often served cold - I've never seen a warm Rhineland
> version.
>
> Victor
>

Nonsense, indeed, Victor. Neither Kilikini nor I live in Germany, nor do
you live in the US. In the US there is definitely a style of potato salad
known as "German Potato Salad", with variations, of course. You'll find
recipes with that title in many American cookbooks. It may not be
authentic, it may not be German, but it is what is known here, like it or
not.

It's probably not much different than "french fries" which are not French.
Still, we eat and enjoy them.

--
Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
_____________________

Victor wrote:

> The versions to the north and east of the Rhine may or may not contain
> mayo and are often more complicated and made with a lot of additional or
> alternative ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages, other
> meats, herring, etc., often combining them. The salads everywhere are
> served warm or cold, with 'cold' generally meaning room temperature.
> Those with mayo are more often served cold - I've never seen a warm
> Rhineland version.

I wish I'd seen that several days ago, when I had a jar of herring in sour
cream and I couldn't think of anything creative to make with it. I ended up
just putting it on bread.

Bob

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
> On Mon 22 May 2006 02:47:59p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
> Sack?
>
> > kilikini > wrote:
> >
> >> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one.
> >> If you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are
> >> recipes with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in
> >> there!
> >
> > Nonsense. I see I have to repost some of what I posted before... It is
> > ridiculous to call any dish (pan)-German, as implied by your all-caps in
> > "German Potato Salad" - there is no such thing, except in a very general
> > way. There was no such thing as Germany until 1871, the Holy Roman
> > Empire notwithstanding... not even a customs union until something like
> > 1835. There was nothing more than a loose conglomeration of often
> > hostile mini-states with their own cultures and traditions. The recipe
> > you posted appears to be a version of some of Bavarian potato salads,
> > particularly those from the Franken region. Many other Bavarian salads,
> > particularly the Munich version, don't contain any bacon or other pork
> > products, but instead are prepared with a dressing made with broth, oil
> > and vinegar, and often also contain chives or pickles. Such versions
> > are also popular in the neighbouring Swabian and Baden regions. Moving
> > to the north, you will find mayo being used more often in potato salads.
> > Rhineland versions are made with homemade mayo. The versions to the
> > north and east of the Rhine may or may not contain mayo and are often
> > more complicated and made with a lot of additional or alternative
> > ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages, other meats,
> > herring, etc., often combining them. The salads everywhere are served
> > warm or cold, with 'cold' generally meaning room temperature. Those
> > with mayo are more often served cold - I've never seen a warm Rhineland
> > version.
> >
> > Victor
> >
>
> Nonsense, indeed, Victor. Neither Kilikini nor I live in Germany, nor do
> you live in the US. In the US there is definitely a style of potato salad
> known as "German Potato Salad", with variations, of course. You'll find
> recipes with that title in many American cookbooks. It may not be
> authentic, it may not be German, but it is what is known here, like it or
> not.
>
> It's probably not much different than "french fries" which are not French.
> Still, we eat and enjoy them.
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
>

Thanks, Wayne. Shoots, my recipe is from, actually, my great grandmother
who CAME from Germany. I'm calling it authentic. From what I understand,
it depends upon what part of the country you're from, North or South that
determines credibility. This is a South German recipe. Kind of like Hoch
und Sudt Deutsch.

kili

On Tue 23 May 2006 09:42:45a, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it kilikini?

>
> "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> 28.19...
>> On Mon 22 May 2006 02:47:59p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
>> Sack?
>>
>> > kilikini > wrote:
>> >
>> >> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one.
>> >> If you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are
>> >> recipes with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in
>> >> there!
>> >
>> > Nonsense. I see I have to repost some of what I posted before... It
>> > is ridiculous to call any dish (pan)-German, as implied by your
>> > all-caps in "German Potato Salad" - there is no such thing, except in
>> > a very general way. There was no such thing as Germany until 1871,
>> > the Holy Roman Empire notwithstanding... not even a customs union
>> > until something like 1835. There was nothing more than a loose
>> > conglomeration of often hostile mini-states with their own cultures
>> > and traditions. The recipe you posted appears to be a version of
>> > some of Bavarian potato salads, particularly those from the Franken
>> > region. Many other Bavarian salads, particularly the Munich version,
>> > don't contain any bacon or other pork products, but instead are
>> > prepared with a dressing made with broth, oil and vinegar, and often
>> > also contain chives or pickles. Such versions are also popular in
>> > the neighbouring Swabian and Baden regions. Moving to the north, you
>> > will find mayo being used more often in potato salads. Rhineland
>> > versions are made with homemade mayo. The versions to the north and
>> > east of the Rhine may or may not contain mayo and are often more
>> > complicated and made with a lot of additional or alternative
>> > ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages, other meats,
>> > herring, etc., often combining them. The salads everywhere are
>> > served warm or cold, with 'cold' generally meaning room temperature.
>> > Those with mayo are more often served cold - I've never seen a warm
>> > Rhineland version.
>> >
>> > Victor
>> >
>>
>> Nonsense, indeed, Victor. Neither Kilikini nor I live in Germany, nor
>> do you live in the US. In the US there is definitely a style of potato
>> salad known as "German Potato Salad", with variations, of course.
>> You'll find recipes with that title in many American cookbooks. It may
>> not be authentic, it may not be German, but it is what is known here,
>> like it or not.
>>
>> It's probably not much different than "french fries" which are not
>> French. Still, we eat and enjoy them.
>>
>> --
>> Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
>>
>
> Thanks, Wayne. Shoots, my recipe is from, actually, my great
> grandmother who CAME from Germany. I'm calling it authentic. From what
> I understand, it depends upon what part of the country you're from,
> North or South that determines credibility. This is a South German
> recipe. Kind of like Hoch und Sudt Deutsch.

Your family's recipe is authentic in my book, too, kili. Heck, I bet that
many people living in one part of Germany had no idea how something was
made in another part.

--

Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________ ___________

"How can a nation be great if it's bread taste like Kleenex?"

Julia Child

Wayne Boatwright <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> On Mon 22 May 2006 02:47:59p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
> Sack?
>
> > kilikini > wrote:
> >
> >> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one.
> >> If you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are
> >> recipes with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in
> >> there!
> >
> > Nonsense. I see I have to repost some of what I posted before...
[snip]
> > The recipe you posted appears to be a version of some of Bavarian potato
> > salads, particularly those from the Franken region.
[snip]
> > Moving to the north, you will find mayo being used more often in potato
> > salads. Rhineland versions are made with homemade mayo. The versions to
> > the north and east of the Rhine may or may not contain mayo and are
> > often more complicated and made with a lot of additional or alternative
> > ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages, other meats,
> > herring, etc., often combining them.
[snip]

> Nonsense, indeed, Victor. Neither Kilikini nor I live in Germany,

Eh, do you have a problem with reading comprehension? Kilikini may not
live in Germany, but she has very clearly indicated she was talking
about a particularly *German* recipe, coming from her *German*-born (and
presumably -bred) grandmother. Here is her text again, to jog your
obviously failing memory:

> nor do
> you live in the US.

Are you always that presumptuous? I may not live in the USA now, but I
have lived there before, if only for a short time. Yet, in that short
time, and even though I was in no position finacially to go out to eat
more than a couple of times every few months, I did see and taste a
couple of "German Potato Salads" made with either mustard or mayo (but
not both together, if memory serves). What gives? Not that it matters,
obviously.

> In the US there is definitely a style of potato salad
> known as "German Potato Salad", with variations, of course. You'll find
> recipes with that title in many American cookbooks. It may not be
> authentic, it may not be German, but it is what is known here, like it or
> not.

And again, not that it matters in the least, you'll find recipes with
that title containing mustard or mayo just as easily - why, Kilikini
indicated as much above. Here are some links, as an example:

<http://www.askyourneighbor.com/recipes/043.htm> KATIE SCHROEDER'S
GERMAN POTATO SALAD (from General Motors Executive Dining Room -
1960's)... contains mayo and sour cream.

<http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/reci...D_9936_26990,0
0.html> German Potato Salad, Bobby Flay... contains mustards seeds.

<http://www.epicurious.com/recipes/recipe_views/views/20100> House &
Garden, February 1957, Eloise Davison... contains mustard.

<http://www.marthastewart.com/page.jhtml?type=content&id=recipe4908>
Warm German Potato Salad, Martha Stewart... contains mustard.

Victor

On Tue 23 May 2006 02:57:40p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
Sack?

> Wayne Boatwright <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Mon 22 May 2006 02:47:59p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
>> Sack?
>>
>> > kilikini > wrote:
>> >
>> >> I do too, Wayne, and I have never had a better recipe than this one.
>> >> If you do an online search for German Potato Salad, all you get are
>> >> recipes with mayo and mustard. Huh? That's not supposed to be in
>> >> there!
>> >
>> > Nonsense. I see I have to repost some of what I posted before...
> [snip]
>> > The recipe you posted appears to be a version of some of Bavarian
>> > potato salads, particularly those from the Franken region.
> [snip]
>> > Moving to the north, you will find mayo being used more often in
>> > potato
>> > salads. Rhineland versions are made with homemade mayo. The versions
>> > to the north and east of the Rhine may or may not contain mayo and
>> > are often more complicated and made with a lot of additional or
>> > alternative ingredients, particularly mustard, sour cream, sausages,
>> > other meats, herring, etc., often combining them.
> [snip]
>
>> Nonsense, indeed, Victor. Neither Kilikini nor I live in Germany,
>
> Eh, do you have a problem with reading comprehension? Kilikini may not
> live in Germany, but she has very clearly indicated she was talking
> about a particularly *German* recipe, coming from her *German*-born (and
> presumably -bred) grandmother. Here is her text again, to jog your
> obviously failing memory:
>

Quote:

>> > > This recipe is the real deal from my German grandmother Esther Berg >> > > Ciesemier. (Last name used to be Ziesemeier.) Can't get more >> > > German than that! >

Yes, I read what she wrote and I understood it the first time. I don't
think she was indicating that her grandmother's recipe was the *only*
recipe for "German Potato Salad".

>> nor do
>> you live in the US.
>
> Are you always that presumptuous? I may not live in the USA now, but I
> have lived there before, if only for a short time. Yet, in that short
> time, and even though I was in no position finacially to go out to eat
> more than a couple of times every few months, I did see and taste a
> couple of "German Potato Salads" made with either mustard or mayo (but
> not both together, if memory serves). What gives? Not that it matters,
> obviously.

It certainly does not matter at all.

>> In the US there is definitely a style of potato salad
>> known as "German Potato Salad", with variations, of course. You'll
>> find recipes with that title in many American cookbooks. It may not be
>> authentic, it may not be German, but it is what is known here, like it
>> or not.
>
> And again, not that it matters in the least, you'll find recipes with
> that title containing mustard or mayo just as easily - why, Kilikini
> indicated as much above. Here are some links, as an example:

No, it doesn't matter in the least. FWIW, there are probably as many ways
to make potato salad as there are people who make them, regardless of
their country of origin. I never said otherwise.

You stay in the US was probably not long enough for you to realize that
most USians would identify a recipe like kilikini's as a typical "German
Potato Salad". It's far more common than any other variation.

> <http://www.askyourneighbor.com/recipes/043.htm> KATIE SCHROEDER'S
> GERMAN POTATO SALAD (from General Motors Executive Dining Room -
> 1960's)... contains mayo and sour cream.
>
> <http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/reci...D_9936_26990,0
> 0.html> German Potato Salad, Bobby Flay... contains mustards seeds.

The previous link doesn't appear to work.

> <http://www.epicurious.com/recipes/recipe_views/views/20100> House &
> Garden, February 1957, Eloise Davison... contains mustard.
>
> <http://www.marthastewart.com/page.jhtml?type=content&id=recipe4908>
> Warm German Potato Salad, Martha Stewart... contains mustard.





--
Wayne Boatwright @¿@¬
_____________________

Wayne Boatwright <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue 23 May 2006 02:57:40p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Victor
> Sack?
> >
> > Eh, do you have a problem with reading comprehension? Kilikini may not
> > live in Germany, but she has very clearly indicated she was talking
> > about a particularly *German* recipe, coming from her *German*-born (and
> > presumably -bred) grandmother. Here is her text again, to jog your
> > obviously failing memory:
> >

Quote:

> >> > > This recipe is the real deal from my German grandmother Esther Berg > >> > > Ciesemier. (Last name used to be Ziesemeier.) Can't get more > >> > > German than that! > >

>
> Yes, I read what she wrote and I understood it the first time.

No you didn't, as was very clearly shown by your reply to me - which,
BTW, was nothing but an irrelevant snide remark.

> I don't
> think she was indicating that her grandmother's recipe was the *only*
> recipe for "German Potato Salad".

No one has been talking about her posting the *only* recipe for "German
Potato Salad". Are you trying to play games with me?

> You stay in the US was probably not long enough for you to realize that
> most USians would identify a recipe like kilikini's as a typical "German
> Potato Salad". It's far more common than any other variation.

So, I was right again - you were - and still are - being presumptuous...
this time about what I do and do not realise. And again, you are
showing that you have not read and comprehended that post of Kilikini's,
either, not to speak of my reply.

> > <http://www.foodnetwork.com/food/reci...D_9936_26990,0
> > 0.html> German Potato Salad, Bobby Flay... contains mustards seeds.
>
> The previous link doesn't appear to work.

It works.

Victor

Utter bullshit, Victor!

--

Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________ ___________

"How can a nation be great if it's bread taste like Kleenex?"

Julia Child

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
> Utter bullshit, Victor!
>
> --
>
> Wayne Boatwright


Wayne!

Dee Dee

"Dee Randall" > schreef in bericht
...
>
> "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> 28.19...
>> Utter bullshit, Victor!
>>
>> --
>>
>> Wayne Boatwright
>
>
> Wayne!
>
> Dee Dee

I sense some cultrual misunderstandings (re tone) that have led to bigger
misunderstandings about where the other person is coming from (having lived
in Germany and spent considerable time in North America/with North
Americans).

I think they both mean well.
>
>

"Jke" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Dee Randall" > schreef in bericht
> ...
> >
> > "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
> > 28.19...
> >> Utter bullshit, Victor!
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Wayne Boatwright
> >
> >
> > Wayne!
> >
> > Dee Dee
>
> I sense some cultrual misunderstandings (re tone) that have led to bigger
> misunderstandings about where the other person is coming from (having
lived
> in Germany and spent considerable time in North America/with North
> Americans).
>
> I think they both mean well.
> >
> >
>
>

I've read that there's a difference between North/East and South Germany.
All I did was post an authentic recipe from my great grandmother who came
from South Germany. I don't care for German Potato Salad with mayo or
mustard; I prefer vinegar/sugar based. I probably prefer it because I grew
up with it.

I didn't mean to start a flame war! Just posting a recipe so if I lose it
(again), I can find it via a Google search. I swear, Google is the best
tool to store anything on.

kili

"kilikini" > schreef in bericht
.. .
>
> "Jke" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Dee Randall" > schreef in bericht
>> ...
>> >
>> > "Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
>> > 28.19...
>> >> Utter bullshit, Victor!
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >>
>> >> Wayne Boatwright
>> >
>> >
>> > Wayne!
>> >
>> > Dee Dee
>>
>> I sense some cultrual misunderstandings (re tone) that have led to bigger
>> misunderstandings about where the other person is coming from (having
> lived
>> in Germany and spent considerable time in North America/with North
>> Americans).
>>
>> I think they both mean well.
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
> I've read that there's a difference between North/East and South Germany.
> All I did was post an authentic recipe from my great grandmother who came
> from South Germany. I don't care for German Potato Salad with mayo or
> mustard; I prefer vinegar/sugar based. I probably prefer it because I
> grew
> up with it.
>
> I didn't mean to start a flame war! Just posting a recipe so if I lose it
> (again), I can find it via a Google search. I swear, Google is the best
> tool to store anything on.
>
> kili
>
>

I wasn't referring to you, kili. I meant Victor and Wayne. I respect bith
and felt sad that they're arguing over what might simply be a
misunderstanding.

I'm happy you posted the recipe. I'd never seen a recipe for potato salad
using bacon before. Only the kunds described by Victor

When I lived in Germany, there was a lot of debate about "right" recipes for
potato salad. Most centered around the dressing (cream mayo style vs oil +
vinegaror broth). And around whether to serve them warm (the oil salads) or
cold (mayo style). The subject of north and south always came up. People
anjoyed the debate. They always knew which argumetns wre going to be used,
but they repeated them anyways. Liek a ritual

So I figure potato salad and right recieps are importatnt in Germany.