http://www.guardian.co.uk/food/story/0,,1804095,00.html

--> A collection of oils arouses little comment these days, (at
--> least three single-estate olive oils and a bottle of
--> Moroccan Argan are currently de rigueur) but extreme foodies
--> also collect solid fats. Pork, duck, beef dripping, rendered
--> pancetta trimmings, are all saved in little jars at the back
--> of the fridge. Sometimes at the end of the meal the host may
--> take a favoured friend over to view this little collection,
--> proudly pointing out the goose fat left over from Christmas.
--> Few civilians, with the exception of mass murderers, are
--> entirely comfortable with this disturbingly forensic
--> display.

--
Vielen Dank

"Adam Funk" > wrote:
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/food/story/0,,1804095,00.html
>
> --> A collection of oils arouses little comment these days, (at
> --> least three single-estate olive oils and a bottle of
> --> Moroccan Argan are currently de rigueur) but extreme foodies
> --> also collect solid fats. Pork, duck, beef dripping, rendered
> --> pancetta trimmings, are all saved in little jars at the back
> --> of the fridge. Sometimes at the end of the meal the host may
> --> take a favoured friend over to view this little collection,
> --> proudly pointing out the goose fat left over from Christmas.
> --> Few civilians, with the exception of mass murderers, are
> --> entirely comfortable with this disturbingly forensic
> --> display.

I get the feeling there are quite a few people who are not comfortable with
this "disturbing forensic display". Many people can't deal with raw
chickens, as the resemblance to a real living being is too much for them.
There are arms (wings) and legs... necks... hearts and livers. The inside
rib cage looks like something out of the movie "Alien". Beef steaks are
"safe", who would associate it with the back muscle of a cow? Or even
better, burgers... no resemblance whatsoever to part of a living being.

A lot of people make no connection between what they are eating and where it
came from. And they want to keep it that way. I guess they never gutted a
fish, cleaned a soft shell crab, etc. Even eating an already steamed blue
crab is probably too much... those squiggly white things inside are
intestines! ;-)

I should talk... even though I've done a lot, I've done far less than my
mother. I buy my chickens already "dressed" at the market. My mother saw her
parents chop the chicken's head off. My mother and aunt took the chicken
intestines and stretched them out to see how long they were. Not something
the average mom would let their kids play with these days.

Back to the original article... I do have a container of goose fat left over
from Christmas, and a bag with some chicken carcasses in the freezer. I'll
show them to favored friends... who have an interest in food.

--
( #wff_ng_7# at #verizon# period #net# )

"wff_ng_7" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:4Rdog.9270$Wh.4393@trnddc04...
> "Adam Funk" > wrote:
>> http://www.guardian.co.uk/food/story/0,,1804095,00.html
>>
>> --> A collection of oils arouses little comment these days, (at
>> --> least three single-estate olive oils and a bottle of
>> --> Moroccan Argan are currently de rigueur) but extreme foodies
>> --> also collect solid fats. Pork, duck, beef dripping, rendered
>> --> pancetta trimmings, are all saved in little jars at the back
>> --> of the fridge. Sometimes at the end of the meal the host may
>> --> take a favoured friend over to view this little collection,
>> --> proudly pointing out the goose fat left over from Christmas.
>> --> Few civilians, with the exception of mass murderers, are
>> --> entirely comfortable with this disturbingly forensic
>> --> display.
>
> I get the feeling there are quite a few people who are not comfortable with this "disturbing forensic display". Many people can't
> deal with raw chickens, as the resemblance to a real living being is too much for them. There are arms (wings) and legs...
> necks... hearts and livers. The inside rib cage looks like something out of the movie "Alien". Beef steaks are "safe", who would
> associate it with the back muscle of a cow? Or even better, burgers... no resemblance whatsoever to part of a living being.
>
I like to tie up chickens after I have stuffed them.
Is that wrong ?

> A lot of people make no connection between what they are eating and where it came from. And they want to keep it that way. I guess
> they never gutted a fish, cleaned a soft shell crab, etc. Even eating an already steamed blue crab is probably too much... those
> squiggly white things inside are intestines! ;-)
>
You're talking about the USA here, I guess ?
Because I've noticed that sad fact with American tourists. If there is no artificial
colour in the food, they won't eat it ...

> I should talk... even though I've done a lot, I've done far less than my mother. I buy my chickens already "dressed" at the
> market. My mother saw her parents chop the chicken's head off. My mother and aunt took the chicken intestines and stretched them
> out to see how long they were. Not something the average mom would let their kids play with these days.
>
I've shot, gutted and plucked pheasants. Does that count ?
Since this is rfc :
Always wrap the pheasant's breast in fat bacon before putting it into the oven.

> Back to the original article... I do have a container of goose fat left over from Christmas, and a bag with some chicken carcasses
> in the freezer. I'll show them to favored friends... who have an interest in food.
>
Buy some goose livers. Fry them in the fat with some pressed garlic, finely chopped
parsley and a little finely grint pepper.
Put them into little jugs. Put hugs unto fridge. Let it cool until solid.
Server with dark bread.
(Works also well with chicken livers).

Mahlzeit,

Michael Kuettner

"Michael Kuettner" > wrote:
> I like to tie up chickens after I have stuffed them.
> Is that wrong ?

Just as long as you don't torment them after you tie them up. I don't know
if being rubbed all over with butter afterwards is torture or some kind of
sexual turn-on... I guess it depends on the chicken's upbringing.

> You're talking about the USA here, I guess ?
> Because I've noticed that sad fact with American tourists. If there is no
> artificial
> colour in the food, they won't eat it ...

Yes, USA

> I've shot, gutted and plucked pheasants. Does that count ?

But you miss the best part... confirmation of whether the old saying
"running around like a chicken with its head cut off" is true or not!

My mother said based on first hand experience that it is true. My brother,
who raised a few laying hens, reconfirmed this for me sometime in the mid
1990s. He had no problem with the whole procedure of beheading, plucking,
drawing the chickens, but he just couldn't handle eating them. It's as if
there might be something wrong with them compared to shrink wrapped birds in
the supermarket. Well, in a sense that was true... they were "stewing hens"
at that point, and he had never cooked such a tough bird before. He gave
them to a neighbor who knew what to do with them.

--
( #wff_ng_7# at #verizon# period #net# )

"wff_ng_7" > wrote

> But you miss the best part... confirmation of whether the old saying "running
> around like a chicken with its head cut off" is true or not!

Mike the headless chicken says...well, nothing. He couldn't cluck
anymore.

http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/...recordid=54463

--oTTo--

"wff_ng_7" > schrieb im Newsbeitrag news:FYeog.8481$Wl.4018@trnddc01...
> "Michael Kuettner" > wrote:
>> I like to tie up chickens after I have stuffed them.
>> Is that wrong ?
>
> Just as long as you don't torment them after you tie them up. I don't know if being rubbed all over with butter afterwards is
> torture or some kind of sexual turn-on... I guess it depends on the chicken's upbringing.
>
I've just asked my chyk. She says it is torture, but rubbing with chocolate
would be OK.

>> You're talking about the USA here, I guess ?
>> Because I've noticed that sad fact with American tourists. If there is no artificial
>> colour in the food, they won't eat it ...
>
> Yes, USA
>
Greetings from Australia !

>> I've shot, gutted and plucked pheasants. Does that count ?
>
> But you miss the best part... confirmation of whether the old saying "running around like a chicken with its head cut off" is true
> or not!
>
> My mother said based on first hand experience that it is true. My brother, who raised a few laying hens, reconfirmed this for me
> sometime in the mid 1990s.
Well, I've seen some guillotined chickens but so far none have run.
There's also the legend about Stoertebaekker (famous pirate), who was
caught and condemned to death by beheading.
His crew was also condemned; they had to line up in two rows in front
of the Guillotine.
Like this :
-------G-------
M M
M M
M M
M M

The men he could pass _after_ being beheaded were free.
He freed most of them. A nice tall tale ;-P

> He had no problem with the whole procedure of beheading, plucking, drawing the chickens, but he just couldn't handle eating them.
> It's as if there might be something wrong with them compared to shrink wrapped birds in the supermarket. Well, in a sense that was
> true... they were "stewing hens" at that point, and he had never cooked such a tough bird before. He gave them to a neighbor who
> knew what to do with them.
>
Coq au vin was invented for those "stewing chickens".

G'day,

Michael "Bruce" Kuettner

"Michael Kuettner" > wrote

> Well, I've seen some guillotined chickens but so far none have run.
> There's also the legend about Stoertebaekker (famous pirate), who was
> caught and condemned to death by beheading.
> His crew was also condemned; they had to line up in two rows in front
> of the Guillotine.
> Like this :
> -------G-------
> M M
> M M
> M M
> M M
>
> The men he could pass _after_ being beheaded were free.
> He freed most of them. A nice tall tale ;-P

He had about 13 unlucky seconds to contemplate not being
connected to his body.

--oTTo--

"Michael Kuettner" > wrote:
> Well, I've seen some guillotined chickens but so far none have run.

Maybe it has to be done with a hatchet on a tree stump!

The only thing remotely close that I've seen myself involved blowfish. My
brother was cleaning several of them on the dock behind our summer house.
The meat in blowfish comes out as one rather nice big solid piece. He lined
these pieces of meat in a neat row next to him on the dock. They were moving
slowly back and forth, as if swimming. Rather frightening if one has a
problem with the connection between living things and food. I assume the
effect was similar to the classic frogs leg experiment.

> Coq au vin was invented for those "stewing chickens".

I would have known what to do with them. I was a bit disappointed that he
gave them away, but he does live a thousand miles away from me.

--
( #wff_ng_7# at #verizon# period #net# )

On Tue, 27 Jun 2006 18:40:37 GMT, wff_ng_7 > wrote:
>"Michael Kuettner" > wrote:
>> I like to tie up chickens after I have stuffed them.
>> Is that wrong ?
>
>Just as long as you don't torment them after you tie them up. I don't know
>if being rubbed all over with butter afterwards is torture or some kind of
>sexual turn-on... I guess it depends on the chicken's upbringing.

Doesn't it depend on whether you're using one feather or the whole bird, too?

Dave "and what if the chicken -wanted- to be tormented?" DeLaney
--
\/David DeLaney posting from "It's not the pot that grows the flower
It's not the clock that slows the hour The definition's plain for anyone to see
Love is all it takes to make a family" - R&P. VISUALIZE HAPPYNET VRbeable<BLINK>
http://www.vic.com/~dbd/ - net.legends FAQ & Magic / I WUV you in all CAPS! --K.

"Otto Bahn" > wrote in message
...
> "wff_ng_7" > wrote
>
>> But you miss the best part... confirmation of whether the old saying
>> "running around like a chicken with its head cut off" is true or not!
>
> Mike the headless chicken says...well, nothing. He couldn't cluck
> anymore.

They can still make a hissing noise though, almsot like they didn't approve
of being decapitated.

On 2006-06-27, Michael Kuettner (aka Bruce)
was almost, but not quite, entirely unlike tea:
> Put them into little jugs. Put hugs unto fridge. Let it cool until solid.

I put hugs unto my fridge all the time. I *heart* my fridge.

--
TimC
Probably best see a real doctor and not take too much diagnostic advice
from a bunch of sysadmins who consider the body a meat computer that
needs debugging. -- Anthony de Boer on possible nerve damage in ASR

David DeLaney wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Jun 2006 18:40:37 GMT, wff_ng_7 > wrote:
>
>>"Michael Kuettner" > wrote:
>>
>>>I like to tie up chickens after I have stuffed them.
>>>Is that wrong ?
>>
>>Just as long as you don't torment them after you tie them up. I don't know
>>if being rubbed all over with butter afterwards is torture or some kind of
>>sexual turn-on... I guess it depends on the chicken's upbringing.

> Doesn't it depend on whether you're using one feather or the whole bird, too?
>
> Dave "and what if the chicken -wanted- to be tormented?" DeLaney

Er, how do you tell if the chicken said the safeword? Their
vocabulary only gots the one word "cluck".


Dr. HotSalt

> Er, how do you tell if the chicken said the safeword? Their
> vocabulary only gots the one word "cluck".

Just keep watching to see if they drop the red scarf, silly........

R.

"wff_ng_7" > wrote in
news:FYeog.8481$Wl.4018@trnddc01:

> "Michael Kuettner" > wrote:
>> I like to tie up chickens after I have stuffed them.
>> Is that wrong ?
>
> Just as long as you don't torment them after you tie them
> up. I don't know if being rubbed all over with butter
> afterwards is torture or some kind of sexual turn-on... I
> guess it depends on the chicken's upbringing.
>
>> You're talking about the USA here, I guess ?
>> Because I've noticed that sad fact with American tourists.
>> If there is no artificial
>> colour in the food, they won't eat it ...
>
> Yes, USA
>

Bah, only a few here in the USA are so wussy. Ok, more than a
few, but not all...


>> I've shot, gutted and plucked pheasants. Does that count ?

I buy my meat from a butcher, in a shop where the carcasses
are hauled out, stuck on a hook and "rolled" into the shop for
whacking up while the ordered meats are being either wrapped
and weighed or fetched from a cold room and packed up.

You can watch them trim your meats if you want. And make
ground meats. I keep missing the sausage making, tho.

I haven't seen the killing, dehairing, skinning, etc part
though. Not sure I'd want to - not squeamish, just not
willing to spend that much time in pursuit of a good hunk of
old Bessie's spawn.

Does that count at all?

--
TeaLady (mari)

"The principle of Race is meant to embody and express the
utter negation of human freedom, the denial of equal rights, a
challenge in the face of mankind." A. Kolnai
Avast ye scurvy dogs ! Thar be no disease in this message.

"TeaLady (Mari C.)" > wrote:
> I buy my meat from a butcher, in a shop where the carcasses
> are hauled out, stuck on a hook and "rolled" into the shop for
> whacking up while the ordered meats are being either wrapped
> and weighed or fetched from a cold room and packed up.
>
> You can watch them trim your meats if you want. And make
> ground meats. I keep missing the sausage making, tho.

I've seen that thing with the carcasses (or portions thereof) being cut into
normal retail cuts. And it wasn't in a butcher shop. Years ago they used to
do that in full view at the supermarkets. I don't know the last time I saw
it, but it seems none of the major chains in this area are like that now. I
don't know how much goes on in the back rooms, out of the customer's view. I
believe a lot of the meat cutting has been moved offsite to regional
facilities, with perhaps only packing or labeling being done in the store
itself.

I do remember the meat grinders in the supermarkets too, out in full view.
Most of the ground meat was done ahead and packaged, but you could also ask
for a specific cut to be ground for you on the spot.

--
( #wff_ng_7# at #verizon# period #net# )

"wff_ng_7" > wrote in
news:a6uqg.1681$543.1089@trnddc04:

> "TeaLady (Mari C.)" > wrote:
>> I buy my meat from a butcher, in a shop where the
>> carcasses are hauled out, stuck on a hook and "rolled"
>> into the shop for whacking up while the ordered meats are
>> being either wrapped and weighed or fetched from a cold
>> room and packed up.
>>
>> You can watch them trim your meats if you want. And make
>> ground meats. I keep missing the sausage making, tho.
>
> I've seen that thing with the carcasses (or portions
> thereof) being cut into normal retail cuts. And it wasn't
> in a butcher shop. Years ago they used to do that in full
> view at the supermarkets. I don't know the last time I saw
> it, but it seems none of the major chains in this area are
> like that now. I don't know how much goes on in the back
> rooms, out of the customer's view. I believe a lot of the
> meat cutting has been moved offsite to regional facilities,
> with perhaps only packing or labeling being done in the
> store itself.
>
> I do remember the meat grinders in the supermarkets too,
> out in full view. Most of the ground meat was done ahead
> and packaged, but you could also ask for a specific cut to
> be ground for you on the spot.
>

If my local supermarket is any indication, they don't do much.
I can get some round ground into coarse lumps if I fuss, but I
much prefer to drive out to amish land and get good meat the
way I want without fussing.

Unfortunately, I donut think the fnarrable parts of the above
are available in amish land, at least not to us yanks.

--
TeaLady (mari)

"The principle of Race is meant to embody and express the
utter negation of human freedom, the denial of equal rights, a
challenge in the face of mankind." A. Kolnai
Avast ye scurvy dogs ! Thar be no disease in this message.

On 4 Jul 2006 03:52:18 GMT, "TeaLady (Mari C.)"
> wrote:

>I buy my meat from a butcher, in a shop where the carcasses
>are hauled out, stuck on a hook and "rolled" into the shop for
>whacking up while the ordered meats are being either wrapped
>and weighed or fetched from a cold room and packed up.

Color me jealous. The butcher shop I used to frequent appears to have
changed hands, and it isn't an improvement. The other one similar to
what you describe is a half-hour drive from here.

--
"Danked," the past participle of "dank", is used to refer to someone
who replies to his own post on an online forum posing as another person
(see "Internet sock puppet") but forgetting to change his username . . . .
This was an act of stupidity meriting a name of its own, and because the hapless
contributor's username was Danks, the term "dank" or "danked" emerged.
-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danked

On Tue, 04 Jul 2006 13:32:54 GMT, "wff_ng_7" >
wrote:

>I've seen that thing with the carcasses (or portions thereof) being cut into
>normal retail cuts. And it wasn't in a butcher shop. Years ago they used to
>do that in full view at the supermarkets. I don't know the last time I saw
>it, but it seems none of the major chains in this area are like that now. I
>don't know how much goes on in the back rooms, out of the customer's view. I
>believe a lot of the meat cutting has been moved offsite to regional
>facilities, with perhaps only packing or labeling being done in the store
>itself.

You would be correct. Many of the large supermarkets receive pre-cut
hunks o' meat that they package and label.

I can't count the number of times that I've had to explain meat to the
jockey behind the "butcher" counter.

--
"Danked," the past participle of "dank", is used to refer to someone
who replies to his own post on an online forum posing as another person
(see "Internet sock puppet") but forgetting to change his username . . . .
This was an act of stupidity meriting a name of its own, and because the hapless
contributor's username was Danks, the term "dank" or "danked" emerged.
-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danked

Kevin S. Wilson > mumbled something about::

> You would be correct. Many of the large supermarkets receive pre-cut
> hunks o' meat that they package and label.
>
> I can't count the number of times that I've had to explain meat to the
> jockey behind the "butcher" counter.

Say, Kevins, I have a BBQ question for you (and I don't really to drag
another Dank into ARK, or I'd ask in the BBQ group).

I have been wondering about how well a smoked leg of lamb would work out.
Any experience with smoking such beasties?

I was thinking of making some yummy smoked lamb gyros.

--
"...The job is to seek mystery, evoke mystery, plant a garden in which
strange plants grow and mysteries bloom. The need for mystery is greater
than the need for an answer." - Ken Kesey

http://www.wiblovia.com - The Wiblovian Institute of Kibology

On Sun, 09 Jul 2006 21:37:30 -0500, Wiblur the Once
> wrote:

>Kevin S. Wilson > mumbled something about::
>
>> You would be correct. Many of the large supermarkets receive pre-cut
>> hunks o' meat that they package and label.
>>
>> I can't count the number of times that I've had to explain meat to the
>> jockey behind the "butcher" counter.
>
>Say, Kevins, I have a BBQ question for you (and I don't really to drag
>another Dank into ARK, or I'd ask in the BBQ group).
>
>I have been wondering about how well a smoked leg of lamb would work out.
>Any experience with smoking such beasties?
>
I find that lamb is best grilled at a fairly high temperature
(425-475), as it doesn't really benefit from the low temps and slow
cooking of true smoking. A good cut is a butterflied boneless leg of
lamb. Marinate for a few hours in olive oil, lemon juice, oregano,
salt and pepper. Some people add yogurt to such a marinade.

PS: Congratulations on making the O-fishal List. That's great news!

--
"Danked," the past participle of "dank", is used to refer to someone
who replies to his own post on an online forum posing as another person
(see "Internet sock puppet") but forgetting to change his username . . . .
This was an act of stupidity meriting a name of its own, and because the hapless
contributor's username was Danks, the term "dank" or "danked" emerged.
-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danked

Kevin S. Wilson > wrote:

>On Tue, 04 Jul 2006 13:32:54 GMT, "wff_ng_7" >
>wrote:
>
>>I've seen that thing with the carcasses (or portions thereof) being cut into
>>normal retail cuts. And it wasn't in a butcher shop. Years ago they used to
>>do that in full view at the supermarkets. I don't know the last time I saw
>>it, but it seems none of the major chains in this area are like that now. I
>>don't know how much goes on in the back rooms, out of the customer's view. I
>>believe a lot of the meat cutting has been moved offsite to regional
>>facilities, with perhaps only packing or labeling being done in the store
>>itself.
>
>You would be correct. Many of the large supermarkets receive pre-cut
>hunks o' meat that they package and label.

Four of the major chains are represented here (Fred Meyer, Safeway,
Albertsons, QFC) and not one does that. (All three do however get
their meat as primal cuts in cryovacs.) Costco does the same.

>I can't count the number of times that I've had to explain meat to the
>jockey behind the "butcher" counter.

Bad luck for you or good luck for me - with the exception of the Fred
Meyer, all the grocery chains I list above have had outstanding
customer service locally.

D.
--
Touch-twice life. Eat. Drink. Laugh.

-Resolved: To be more temperate in my postings.
Oct 5th, 2004 JDL

On 11 Jul 2006 00:35:31 GMT, Terri > wrote:

>I just dried a bunch of greek oregano & sweet basil and vacuum sealed
>them. I wonder how far it would get in the mail if I sent a baggie of
>oregano to Wib?

All the way to his front door or until it is safely in his hand. How
else are they going to bust him?
--
"Danked," the past participle of "dank", is used to refer to someone
who replies to his own post on an online forum posing as another person
(see "Internet sock puppet") but forgetting to change his username . . . .
This was an act of stupidity meriting a name of its own, and because the hapless
contributor's username was Danks, the term "dank" or "danked" emerged.
-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danked

Kevin S. Wilson wrote:

> I find that lamb is best grilled at a fairly high temperature
> (425-475), as it doesn't really benefit from the low temps and slow
> cooking of true smoking. A good cut is a butterflied boneless leg of
> lamb. Marinate for a few hours in olive oil, lemon juice, oregano,
> salt and pepper. Some people add yogurt to such a marinade.

Ahhh lamb - A slight variation I came up with, that's became popular
(meaning I need to cook every holiday - which I enjoy):

Deboned lamb leg (do it yourself?)

Spend some time flattening it and really butterflying it...big surface
area. Cut down into the big muscles.

Massage all surfaces with:

GOOD olive oil
GOOD balsamic vinegar
Finely minced fresh garlic (sub: powdered garlic)
FRESH rosemary, finely ground (mortar and pestle)
Fresh ground black pepper
Salt

Retie the leg.

Hold/refrigerate 24 hrs

Roast to taste. I have a variety of tastes to satisfy, from well
(overcook to order) to rareish (the rested 2/3 of the roast). *I* shoot
for ~125F in-oven temp, and let it carry over while resting.