I was going to post this in part to give some life to this group,
but I am pleasantly surprised to see some new posts! Yay! So now
I will just offer this as a bad archaic recipe:

Chop Suey
Source: Afternoon Teas. Chicago: Armour & Company, 1905.

"This is in Chinatown a mixture of chicken livers, gizzards, fresh
pork, green ginger root and celery. For the Mandarin Tea try out
slices of canned Cervelat Sausage, and saute in the fat chickens’
livers and gizzards. Add a small quantity of green ginger root
and celery. When heated in the fat, add olive oil, vinegar,
boiling water, Worcestershire sauce, pepper, and a dash of spice.
Simmer for thirty minutes. Add a small can of mushrooms, half a
cup of French peas, and serve the mixture with the 'see-yu' sauce
which can be purchased at a Chinese grocery."


There is also a recipe for "Chow Min" that contains, among other
things, olives and paprika.

I am curious as to how easy it was to find Chinese grocery stores
in large US cities back then. And did non-Chinese tend to
frequent them?
--
Jean B.

"Jean B." > wrote in message
...
>I was going to post this in part to give some life to this group, but I am
>pleasantly surprised to see some new posts! Yay! So now I will just offer
>this as a bad archaic recipe:
>
> Chop Suey
> Source: Afternoon Teas. Chicago: Armour & Company, 1905.
>
> "This is in Chinatown a mixture of chicken livers, gizzards, fresh pork,
> green ginger root and celery. For the Mandarin Tea try out slices of
> canned Cervelat Sausage, and saute in the fat chickens’ livers and
> gizzards. Add a small quantity of green ginger root and celery. When
> heated in the fat, add olive oil, vinegar, boiling water, Worcestershire
> sauce, pepper, and a dash of spice. Simmer for thirty minutes. Add a
> small can of mushrooms, half a cup of French peas, and serve the mixture
> with the 'see-yu' sauce which can be purchased at a Chinese grocery."
>
>
> There is also a recipe for "Chow Min" that contains, among other things,
> olives and paprika.
>
> I am curious as to how easy it was to find Chinese grocery stores in large
> US cities back then. And did non-Chinese tend to frequent them?


I certainly isn't anything like our idea of authentic chinese is it?
Worcestershire sauce and olive oil? Truly a melting pot dish.

I seem to have quite a lot of old and ancient recipes on my PC. Are you
interested in them?

Tim W

Tim W wrote:
> "Jean B." > wrote in message
> ...
>> I was going to post this in part to give some life to this group, but I am
>> pleasantly surprised to see some new posts! Yay! So now I will just offer
>> this as a bad archaic recipe:
>>
>> Chop Suey
>> Source: Afternoon Teas. Chicago: Armour & Company, 1905.
>>
>> "This is in Chinatown a mixture of chicken livers, gizzards, fresh pork,
>> green ginger root and celery. For the Mandarin Tea try out slices of
>> canned Cervelat Sausage, and saute in the fat chickens’ livers and
>> gizzards. Add a small quantity of green ginger root and celery. When
>> heated in the fat, add olive oil, vinegar, boiling water, Worcestershire
>> sauce, pepper, and a dash of spice. Simmer for thirty minutes. Add a
>> small can of mushrooms, half a cup of French peas, and serve the mixture
>> with the 'see-yu' sauce which can be purchased at a Chinese grocery."
>>
>>
>> There is also a recipe for "Chow Min" that contains, among other things,
>> olives and paprika.
>>
>> I am curious as to how easy it was to find Chinese grocery stores in large
>> US cities back then. And did non-Chinese tend to frequent them?
>
>
> I certainly isn't anything like our idea of authentic chinese is it?
> Worcestershire sauce and olive oil? Truly a melting pot dish.
>
> I seem to have quite a lot of old and ancient recipes on my PC. Are you
> interested in them?
>
> Tim W
>
>
Are they things that would be hard to ferret out? I actually
collect antique cookbooks, recipe booklets, etc. (as well as
cookbooks in some other categories), so I don't have a burning
need--unless they are truly interesting.

--
Jean B.

"Jean B." > wrote in message
...
> Tim W wrote:
>>
>> I seem to have quite a lot of old and ancient recipes on my PC. Are you
>> interested in them?
>>
>>
> Are they things that would be hard to ferret out? I actually collect
> antique cookbooks, recipe booklets, etc. (as well as cookbooks in some
> other categories), so I don't have a burning need--unless they are truly
> interesting.
>

Now I look almost all of them are freely available pdfs and texts so there
wouldn't be a lot of point.

I might just idly post what I feel like when I have time.

Interesting hobby you have.

Tim w

Tim W wrote:
> "Jean B." > wrote in message
> ...
>> Tim W wrote:
>>> I seem to have quite a lot of old and ancient recipes on my PC. Are you
>>> interested in them?
>>>
>>>
>> Are they things that would be hard to ferret out? I actually collect
>> antique cookbooks, recipe booklets, etc. (as well as cookbooks in some
>> other categories), so I don't have a burning need--unless they are truly
>> interesting.
>>
>
> Now I look almost all of them are freely available pdfs and texts so there
> wouldn't be a lot of point.
>
> I might just idly post what I feel like when I have time.
>
> Interesting hobby you have.
>
> Tim w
>
>
Yes, I enjoy it. It is especially nice to see the things as I
sort and shelve them at the new house.

BTW, google has A LOT of cookbooks scanned. As far as online
books go, I started he

http://digital.lib.msu.edu/projects/...ml/browse.html

In fact, that helped guide my collecting for a while.

--
Jean B.

Sqwertz wrote:
> On Thu, 05 May 2011 20:23:11 -0400, Jean B. wrote:
>
>> Chop Suey
>> Source: Afternoon Teas. Chicago: Armour & Company, 1905.
>>
>> "This is in Chinatown a mixture of chicken livers, gizzards, fresh
>> pork, green ginger root and celery. For the Mandarin Tea try out
>> slices of canned Cervelat Sausage, and saute in the fat chickens¢
>> livers and gizzards. Add a small quantity of green ginger root
>> and celery. When heated in the fat, add olive oil, vinegar,
>> boiling water, Worcestershire sauce, pepper, and a dash of spice.
>> Simmer for thirty minutes. Add a small can of mushrooms, half a
>> cup of French peas, and serve the mixture with the 'see-yu' sauce
>> which can be purchased at a Chinese grocery."
>
> Chop Suey sure has come a long way since then.
>
> See Yu sauce I know as soy sauce. But live oil, vinegar, chicken fat,
> and Worcestershire sauce doesn't sound like an appetizing sauce.
>
> -sw

It sounds pretty odd to me. I don't think I am curious enough to
do such an experiment.

--
Jean B.

"Jean B." > wrote in message
...
> Tim W wrote:
>> "Jean B." > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>>
>>> ..... I actually collect antique cookbooks, recipe booklets, etc. (as
>>> well as cookbooks in some other categories), so I don't have a burning
>>> need--unless they are truly interesting.
>>>
> Yes, I enjoy it. It is especially nice to see the things as I sort and
> shelve them at the new house.
>

How old is old enough for you to be interested? very old? and I presume you
are american and in america, so these are American books mainly?

Just curious.

Tim W

Tim W wrote:
> "Jean B." > wrote in message
> ...
>> Tim W wrote:
>>> "Jean B." > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> ..... I actually collect antique cookbooks, recipe booklets, etc. (as
>>>> well as cookbooks in some other categories), so I don't have a burning
>>>> need--unless they are truly interesting.
>>>>
>> Yes, I enjoy it. It is especially nice to see the things as I sort and
>> shelve them at the new house.
>>
>
> How old is old enough for you to be interested? very old? and I presume you
> are american and in america, so these are American books mainly?
>
> Just curious.
>
> Tim W
>
>
Well, of course, if one collects US cookbooks, then there is a
limit on old because the oldest one came out in 1796. I doubt I
am going to get that. So probably early 1800s, as far as US
cookbooks go. But then there are the books from England that were
later published in the United States, and those are interesting
too. I don't actively seek those, but if I see them...

One problem with the really old books (by any definition) is that
they are apt to command a high price unless one finds those that
are not in the hands of dealers or which the dealers have been too
lazy to look at and price. So, my interest is tempered by my
ability to pay for them. In fact, I have read that such things
will be mostly in the hand of the rich, for the obvious reason.

--
Jean B.

There is an interesting vignette of 'eating Chinese ' in New York in
1888. See

http://tinyurl.com/3d6m7l6

It gives the ingredients for shop suey, but not the recipe. Again,
Worstershire sauce substitutes for soy - of which the author evidently
did not know the name.


On Thu, 05 May 2011 20:23:11 -0400, "Jean B." > wrote:

>I was going to post this in part to give some life to this group,
>but I am pleasantly surprised to see some new posts! Yay! So now
>I will just offer this as a bad archaic recipe:
>
>Chop Suey
>Source: Afternoon Teas. Chicago: Armour & Company, 1905.
>
>"This is in Chinatown a mixture of chicken livers, gizzards, fresh
>pork, green ginger root and celery. For the Mandarin Tea try out
>slices of canned Cervelat Sausage, and saute in the fat chickens’
>livers and gizzards. Add a small quantity of green ginger root
>and celery. When heated in the fat, add olive oil, vinegar,
>boiling water, Worcestershire sauce, pepper, and a dash of spice.
> Simmer for thirty minutes. Add a small can of mushrooms, half a
>cup of French peas, and serve the mixture with the 'see-yu' sauce
>which can be purchased at a Chinese grocery."
>
>
>There is also a recipe for "Chow Min" that contains, among other
>things, olives and paprika.
>
>I am curious as to how easy it was to find Chinese grocery stores
>in large US cities back then. And did non-Chinese tend to
>frequent them?

That IS interesting. I read that bit about Worcestershire Sauce a
bit differently. There is that blank, which may be soy sauce, and
it says whatever the blank is is the prototype of Worcestershire
Sauce.

Also, did you read far enough to see the segue into macaroni?
This is a good find.

Thanks!

Richard Wright wrote:
> There is an interesting vignette of 'eating Chinese ' in New York in
> 1888. See
>
> http://tinyurl.com/3d6m7l6
>
> It gives the ingredients for shop suey, but not the recipe. Again,
> Worstershire sauce substitutes for soy - of which the author evidently
> did not know the name.
>
>
> On Thu, 05 May 2011 20:23:11 -0400, "Jean B." > wrote:
>
>> I was going to post this in part to give some life to this group,
>> but I am pleasantly surprised to see some new posts! Yay! So now
>> I will just offer this as a bad archaic recipe:
>>
>> Chop Suey
>> Source: Afternoon Teas. Chicago: Armour & Company, 1905.
>>
>> "This is in Chinatown a mixture of chicken livers, gizzards, fresh
>> pork, green ginger root and celery. For the Mandarin Tea try out
>> slices of canned Cervelat Sausage, and saute in the fat chickens’
>> livers and gizzards. Add a small quantity of green ginger root
>> and celery. When heated in the fat, add olive oil, vinegar,
>> boiling water, Worcestershire sauce, pepper, and a dash of spice.
>> Simmer for thirty minutes. Add a small can of mushrooms, half a
>> cup of French peas, and serve the mixture with the 'see-yu' sauce
>> which can be purchased at a Chinese grocery."
>>
>>
>> There is also a recipe for "Chow Min" that contains, among other
>> things, olives and paprika.
>>
>> I am curious as to how easy it was to find Chinese grocery stores
>> in large US cities back then. And did non-Chinese tend to
>> frequent them?


--
Jean B.