what did I do wrong?

On 1 Nov 2003 at 18:09, Stan J. Lefosi wrote:

> what did I do wrong?

You stored it too long?

Bread has a limited shelf life.

Like all things, bread gets old.

When bread ages, it succumbs to one of two enemies, mold and staling.
Sadly, most things that help prevent one encourage the other. Staling occurs
more rapidly in a dry environment, mold more rapidly in a wet environment.

A rule of thumb is "the longer it takes to make the bread, the longer it will
last." Long slow rises, with bakers yeast, poolish, sponges, or (best of all)
sourdough will tend to create a bread that lasts longer. The sourdough
organisms create chemicals that inhibit both mold and staling, at least for a
while.

The easiest answer is to eat your bread faster, bake less bread at a time, or
both. However, this is not always a realistic option.

If a loaf is more than you can eat in a reasonable amount of time, you might
be tempted to put the bread in the refrigerator. Don't do it! The temperature
and humidity of a refrigerator will cause the bread to dry out and stale very
quickly. It's better to slice the bread into serving sized pieces, separate them
with waxed paper, wrap the whole mess with foil and then a freezer bag and
freeze it. You can pull off serving sized pieces, heat them and serve them.

If your bread has staled, but is still unmolded, you can often re-heat the bread
and it will regain it's freshness, once. Try a 250F oven for 10 to 15 minutes.

A friend once suggested that storing bread on top of the refrigerator helped
keep it fresh. I have no idea what is going on, but it seems to help.

Finally, you can put the cut side of a loaf on a cutting board, and then cover
the rest of the loaf with a damp (not wet) cloth. This will keep the bread fresh,
and will help it develop a richer and more complex taste.

Hope this helps,
Mike
--
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"Stan J. Lefosi" > wrote in message =
om...

> what did I do wrong?

You let your bread get dirty.

(Stan J. Lefosi) wrote in
om:

> what did I do wrong?
>

Usually, excess moisture will cause bread to mold during
storage. Storing bread in a tightly sealed plastic bag is a
really good way to begin a study of mycology. Also, if you
bagged bread before the loaves have thoroughly cooled, then you
can expect to see mold in just a day or so. The cooling step is
important, since the loaves will still be gassing off water
vapor even after thay come out of the oven. This process will
continue until the loaves have completely cooled. That is why
breadboxes are designed to allow for good air circulation around
the loaves.

All of the foregoing is just conjecture and generality since you
did not give enough detail about what you are doing. So, my
reply is based on guesswork. Take it for what it is worth.

"Stan J. Lefosi" wrote:
>
> what did I do wrong?

nothing - it happens....

smells like a troll

S.

--
remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one
SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/

"Samartha Deva" > wrote in message =
...

> smells like a troll

That's where it's at at r.f.s. nowadays -- trolls overreacting to =
trolls.

---
DickA (not an exception)

P.S. Actually, Mike & Woody, spontaneous generation is out.
For instance, see =
http://www.accessexcellence.org/AB/B...eneration.html
The "dirty bread" theory so far is the winner.

On Sun, 02 Nov 2003 06:20:17 -0700, Samartha Deva
> wrote:

>"Stan J. Lefosi" wrote:

>> what did I do wrong?

>nothing - it happens....

>smells like a troll

>S.

You pot heads need to cut back. Paranoia is a symptom of excess
cannabis use (see below).

Normal people would not interpret that post as troll.

+++++
© Copyright of Telegraph Group Limited 2003.

http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...02/ixhome.html

Cannabis use causes 'hundreds of deaths a year', coroner warns
By Julie Henry, Education Correspondent

Britain's most senior coroner is warning that hundreds of young people
are dying in accidents caused by their prolonged use of cannabis.

Hamish Turner, the president of the Coroners' Society, said that the
drug, which is often portrayed as harmless, has increasingly been
behind deaths that have been recorded as accidents or suicides.

In the past year, he estimated that cannabis was a significant
contributory factor in about 10 per cent of the 100 cases that he had
dealt with in south Devon, where he works.

Conversations with his colleagues led him to believe that the scale of
the problem elsewhere in the country was equally bad. "Cannabis is as
dangerous as any other drug and people must understand that it kills,"
said Mr Turner.

"From my long experience I can say that it is a very dangerous
substance. Increasingly it is mentioned not only as the first drug
taken by people who overdose, but also in suicides and accidental
deaths.

"It is an awful waste of young lives. People are trying the drug at a
very young age. Many go on to harder drugs and I am dealing with more
and more heroin overdoses. People can also suffer severe consequences
from the cannabis alone, however.

"Bereaved parents say to me, 'We didn't realise how dangerous it was
until it was too late, if only we had done something'. It is
heartbreaking."

Recent examples of the dangers of the drug cited by Mr Turner include
the case of James Taylor, a 31-year-old, who was found hanged in his
Torquay flat. The inquest heard that he had started smoking cannabis
when he was about 15 and was a habitual user. The drug was blamed for
the depression and mental health problems that later plagued him and
which led to his death.

Mary Taylor, his mother, said that there was no doubt in her mind that
cannabis had killed her son. "The cannabis made him paranoid from the
word go. He went from a good-looking, artistic, talented chap to
someone who did not trust anyone, not even his sister, who he was very
close to.

"Because of the damage the drug did to him he became more isolated,
more lonely and more depressed. The loveliest boy was destroyed by
this drug. I would never have believed that James would have acted as
he did when he took his own life.

"People who insist that cannabis is harmless are talking rubbish. We
had years of hell when James was on cannabis, and that was all he was
taking. Now he is dead and our family life has been devastated."

Cannabis also contributed to the death of Dragan Radoslavjevic, 42,
from Paignton, Devon. He died earlier this year after using a power
tool to drill a hole in his head. An inquest in Torquay heard that he
suffered from depression and relied on drugs such as cannabis and
heroin.

Mr Turner said that stronger varieties of cannabis - up to 10 times
more potent than those used in the 1960s - were now common, leading to
physical and mental problems in young people living in rural areas as
well as in cities.

The drug robbed young people of their appetite for life, the coroner
warned, with regular and prolonged use leading to panic attacks,
paranoia, psychosis, racing heart, agitation, an increased risk of
heart attacks and strokes, and even a tendency to violence.

"Cannabis is a mind-altering drug which has ravaging effects on the
brain," he added.

In another case, Ralph Hamilton, 27, from Torquay, died when the car
he was driving hit a bus in Totnes. Witnesses reported that he "looked
almost comatose" as he drove directly into the front of the
open-topped bus. Blood tests showed that Mr Hamilton had been taking
cannabis and the inquest heard that he was a regular user.

Other coroners also expressed concern about cannabis. Michael Gwynne,
the coroner for Telford and Wrekin, said that he feared that deaths
would spiral if the Government decriminalised the drug. "There is
clearly some evidence that cannabis is a contributory factor in
drug-related traffic accident deaths but, because of the problems with
toxicology, we are unable to state its full impact," he said.

"What the Government should not do is become more tolerant of the
drug; that would involve setting legal limits, and risk cannabis
becoming a major cause of road traffic deaths."

Veronica Hamilton-Deely, the Brighton and Hove coroner, said that
national figures supplied by coroners' offices showed that illicit
drugs, particularly cannabis, were increasingly present in victims of
road traffic fatalities. These statistics showed that in 2000, 12 per
cent of the 3,400 people killed in road accidents showed traces of
cannabis: a sixfold increase on a decade earlier.

The dangers of cannabis were highlighted in research published last
month, which showed a sharp increase in drug-related deaths. According
to the European Centre for Addiction Studies at St George's Hospital
Medical School in London, in 2002, British coroners cited cannabis as
the major cause of death in 18 out of 853 drug-related deaths. The
drug was also implicated in a further 31 out of 1,579 deaths involving
a cocktail of drugs.

The biggest killers were heroin, which was the major cause of death in
712 cases, and cocaine, which was the principal factor in 147 deaths.
+++++

On Sun, 02 Nov 2003 15:39:55 GMT, "Dick Adams" >
wrote:

>"Samartha Deva" > wrote in message =
...

>> smells like a troll

>That's where it's at at r.f.s. nowadays -- trolls overreacting to =
>trolls.

>DickA (not an exception)

Only it is not a troll. You need to stop snorting starter.

On 3 Nov 2003 17:23:31 GMT, Ignoramus17804
> wrote:

>I use regular plastic shopping bags.

Howdy,

Not a good idea...

Plastic bags made for food have different plasticizers (sp?) that are
appropriate for such use. Those made for storage or other uses are
typically much stronger, but at the expense of chemicals you might not
want to have in contact with things you would ingest...

HTH,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

"Ignoramus17804" > wrote in message
...
> In article >, Kenneth wrote:
> > On 3 Nov 2003 17:23:31 GMT, Ignoramus17804
> > wrote:
> >
> >>I use regular plastic shopping bags.
> >
> > Howdy,
> >
> > Not a good idea...
> >
> > Plastic bags made for food have different plasticizers (sp?) that are
> > appropriate for such use. Those made for storage or other uses are
> > typically much stronger, but at the expense of chemicals you might not
> > want to have in contact with things you would ingest...
>
> I am open to suggestions here... Maybe I should buy ziploc bags for
> that.
>
I'm not sure that that would improve matters. Try using Saran Wrap
(original kind) first. This is safer at higher temperatures.
Graham

On 3 Nov 2003 19:23:43 GMT, Ignoramus17804
> wrote:

>I keep my bread sliced in bags. I slice the whole loaf at once so then
>it is easy to take bread as needed. Using clingwrap or some such wrap
>would be impractical as we reach for bread a lot. However, using food
>greade ziploc bags may be safer from a chemical standpoint.

Hello again,

"Food grade" is the issue. With regret, I know nothing about the heat
issue, but experimenting would not be a costly matter, and the bags
have many other uses...

Also, I thought you put the hot (that is just from the oven) bread in
the bag. Now, I see that you slice it first. If it is just warm to the
touch the ziplocs will be happy.

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

On 3 Nov 2003 18:27:42 GMT, Ignoramus17804
> wrote:

>I am open to suggestions here... Maybe I should buy ziploc bags for
>that.

Glad (Dow Chemical) makes a cheap freezer bag with twist ties that is
substantial enough to hold bread. You will have to cut the loaf in
half if its too long.

Contrary to what people say, I keep my homemade bread in either the
freezer or the refrigerator. When it comes time to eat it, I zap it
very briefly in the microwave, which reconstitutes it. From there I
either make a sandwich or toast it with butter and garlic in the
broiler.

Ignoramus17804 wrote:
>
> In article <zwxpb.282339$6C4.144601@pd7tw1no>, graham wrote:
> >...
> > I'm not sure that that would improve matters. Try using Saran Wrap
> > (original kind) first. This is safer at higher temperatures.
> > Graham
> >
> >
>
> I keep my bread sliced in bags. I slice the whole loaf at once so then
> it is easy to take bread as needed. Using clingwrap or some such wrap
> would be impractical as we reach for bread a lot. However, using food
> greade ziploc bags may be safer from a chemical standpoint.


I re-use the plastic bags from my breakfast cereal. They had darned well _better_ be food-grade ;7 and I have a steady supply. It's usually not a good idea for me to use them twice for bread, so they tend to get retired to archery target stuffing after that.



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On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 17:22:38 -0500, Don Hellen
> wrote:

>Only if it will allow a hard-crust bread. I like a medium to
>hard crust, and I think early bagging makes the crust softer

Let it sit out for a day, then bag it. The crust should not be
disturbed then.