In Springfield, Vt. in the 40's (and I believe continuing some decades
afterward) there were two Polish bakeries that made superb bread: a
light sour rye and a dark sour rye, very elastic crumb, sour, well
developed flavor.

I'm going to try to come as close to it as I can with a bread machine.
I'm not a completely inexperienced baker, and I am now sure that the
only ingredients were flour, water, salt and starter. The bread I
have had that is most like it was wheat bread, pain levain, from
bakeries in Herault, France. So it was more the method than the grain
used that produced the quality I want.

The ingredients I plan to use are rye flour, bread flour, gluten,
starter, salt, and water.

If anyone has ideas on how to do this in a bread machine, I'll be
grateful. I'm sure that kneading it sufficiently is important in
order to get the elastic crumb -- so, according to messages on this
newsgroup, I would have to stop the machine and knead it more than
once. Thoughts on total kneading time? Is it possible to overknead
it?

Tekla

Tekla,

frankly - I find your attempt blasphemous - trying to recreate a superb
polish rye you are referring to with gluten and a bread machine - this
is really painful!

Aren't you getting little round or square formed products from a bread
machine and was the original you try to approach in any way similar? You
probably know the answer.

Considering the fact that a major determining factor to the taste of a
bread loaf is the crust - how are you going to influence this with your
bread machine?

In any case, may I suggest that you first get the bread of your desire
together in the conventional way and once you have something very
similar to your satisfaction, try to do it with a bread machine, if you
still have any urge for it.

Now, for your kneading and handling considerations, maybe you want to
search on Google Groups under newsgroup rec.food.sourdough for the
phrase "I've been baking 100% Rye Sourdough for about 12 years" on Oct.
28 or 29, 2003 which fairly accurately describes the complexities you
will encounter.

Good luck with your bread machine attempt!

And - keep reporting, so we can learn from it.


Samartha


Tekla wrote:
>
> In Springfield, Vt. in the 40's (and I believe continuing some decades
> afterward) there were two Polish bakeries that made superb bread: a
> light sour rye and a dark sour rye, very elastic crumb, sour, well
> developed flavor.
>
> I'm going to try to come as close to it as I can with a bread machine.
> I'm not a completely inexperienced baker, and I am now sure that the
> only ingredients were flour, water, salt and starter. The bread I
> have had that is most like it was wheat bread, pain levain, from
> bakeries in Herault, France. So it was more the method than the grain
> used that produced the quality I want.
>
> The ingredients I plan to use are rye flour, bread flour, gluten,
> starter, salt, and water.
>
> If anyone has ideas on how to do this in a bread machine, I'll be
> grateful. I'm sure that kneading it sufficiently is important in
> order to get the elastic crumb -- so, according to messages on this
> newsgroup, I would have to stop the machine and knead it more than
> once. Thoughts on total kneading time? Is it possible to overknead
> it?
>
> Tekla

--
remove -nospam from my email address, if there is one
SD page is the http://samartha.net/SD/

Samartha,

Thank you. The thread you recommend on kneading with rye and
samartha.net give me a lot to think about, and I'll first try the
conventional way.

I never thought for a moment that I could recreate Springfield Polish
rye in a bread machine. My idea was to come as close to it as would
be possible in a bread machine -- which would be a very long way from
recreating it. Actually, I doubt greatly that even making it the
conventional way I will be able to get close to the bread of my
desire.

Tekla

Samartha Deva > wrote in message >...
> Tekla,
>
> frankly - I find your attempt blasphemous - trying to recreate a superb
> polish rye you are referring to with gluten and a bread machine - this
> is really painful!
>
> Aren't you getting little round or square formed products from a bread
> machine and was the original you try to approach in any way similar? You
> probably know the answer.
>
> Considering the fact that a major determining factor to the taste of a
> bread loaf is the crust - how are you going to influence this with your
> bread machine?
>
> In any case, may I suggest that you first get the bread of your desire
> together in the conventional way and once you have something very
> similar to your satisfaction, try to do it with a bread machine, if you
> still have any urge for it.
>
> Now, for your kneading and handling considerations, maybe you want to
> search on Google Groups under newsgroup rec.food.sourdough for the
> phrase "I've been baking 100% Rye Sourdough for about 12 years" on Oct.
> 28 or 29, 2003 which fairly accurately describes the complexities you
> will encounter.
>
> Good luck with your bread machine attempt!
>
> And - keep reporting, so we can learn from it.
>
>
> Samartha
>
>
> Tekla wrote:
> >
> > In Springfield, Vt. in the 40's (and I believe continuing some decades
> > afterward) there were two Polish bakeries that made superb bread: a
> > light sour rye and a dark sour rye, very elastic crumb, sour, well
> > developed flavor.
> >
> > I'm going to try to come as close to it as I can with a bread machine.