I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island Sound)
and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned many in
the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if you
want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try and bite
straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and soy or
maybe a ponzu sauce.

It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.

--
Dan

On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island Sound)
> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned many in
> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if you
> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try and bite
> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and soy or
> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>
> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>
> --
> Dan

What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.

I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.

When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
lemon juice overnight.

After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.

I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
about two pounds each on my favorite size.

"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>Sound)
> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
> many in
> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if
> you
> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
> and bite
> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
> soy or
> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>
> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>
> --
> Dan

Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you never
see a Bluefish on ice in
a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh turning
an unappetizing "grey" hue.
My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he had
made sashimi from
fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
good".
And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
possibly in as little as a few hours.
One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
caught are usually caught in
great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on ice.
The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the fall
they feed feed very heavily
on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
humans don't eat it.
Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often so
oily that they they aren't worth eating.
If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size, as
you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments like
Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes out
and catches it themselves
(or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.
Musashi

John Doe wrote:
> On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>
>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island Sound)
>>and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned many in
>>the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if you
>>want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try and bite
>>straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and soy or
>>maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>
>>It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>
>>--
>>Dan
>
>
> What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
> or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>
> I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
> redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>
> When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
> lemon juice overnight.
>
> After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>
> I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
> about two pounds each on my favorite size.

If you remove the redline, its a very light flavor. I don't bother to
marinate in milk. We threw some dry rub on one filet and a garlin lime
on the other and grilled it.

We were hoping for Stripers, but blues where everywhere.

--
Dan

On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:

> On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island Sound)
>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>> cleaned many in
>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if you
>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>> try and bite
>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and soy or
>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>
>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>
> What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
> or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>
> I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
> redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>
> When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
> lemon juice overnight.
>
> After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>
> I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
> about two pounds each on my favorite size.

I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
stuff good.

I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of fish
is it really?
--
///---

Musashi wrote:

> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>>Sound)
>>and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
>>many in
>>the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if
>>you
>>want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
>>and bite
>>straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>>soy or
>>maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>
>>It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>
>>--
>>Dan
>
>
> Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
> First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you never
> see a Bluefish on ice in
> a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh turning
> an unappetizing "grey" hue.
> My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he had
> made sashimi from
> fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
> good".
> And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
> possibly in as little as a few hours.
> One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
> caught are usually caught in
> great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on ice.
> The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the fall
> they feed feed very heavily
> on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
> humans don't eat it.
> Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often so
> oily that they they aren't worth eating.
> If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size, as
> you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
> My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments like
> Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
> and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
> So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes out
> and catches it themselves
> (or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.

Yes, I was thinking it reminded me of aji.. I knew I should have brought
some ponzu sauce on the trip. These choppers were full of peanut bunker,
ralphed up several in the wet-well on the boat.

I've always found that removing the red parts of the flesh from any size
blue keeps it from tasting oily at all. The only problem I have with it
is its very flakey, so I have to bake or grill on tinfoil.

Next time I will definately serve up a plate of sashimi.. we just took
one bit as an experiement.

--
Dan

Gerry wrote:

> On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:
>
>> On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>>
>>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long
>>> Island Sound)
>>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>>> cleaned many in
>>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the
>>> flesh if you
>>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>>> try and bite
>>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi
>>> and soy or
>>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>
>>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>
>>
>> What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
>> or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>>
>> I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
>> redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>>
>> When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
>> lemon juice overnight.
>>
>> After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>>
>> I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
>> about two pounds each on my favorite size.
>
>
> I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
> Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
> stuff good.
>
> I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of fish
> is it really?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluefish

They put up a great fight, especially the larger ones. I was using my light
tackle with 10# test and having a good time with it.. no leaders so I lost a
couple of my lead-head shad lures. Oh well.


--
Dan

Musashi wrote on Mon, 01 Oct 2007 16:16:48 GMT:

M> My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the
same,
M> that he had made sashimi fromfresh caught Bluefish out by
M> Montauk and that it was in his words "quite good".

"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
??>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in
??>> Connecticut (Long Island Sound) and we hauled in a couple

??>> ??>> of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned many
??>> in the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily
??>> parts of the flesh if you want a mild tasting fish. So,
??>> while I was fileting it we decided to try and bite
??>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab
??>> of wasabi and soy or maybe a ponzu sauce.

I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
I've never tried it.

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton" >
wrote:

> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
> I've never tried it.

That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned out
mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of the
smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for them.
We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the remainder.

What method of smoking did you use on yours?

John wrote on Mon, 01 Oct 2007 10:13:48 -0700:

??>> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it
??>> was at Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house
??>> on his way home. It was very good broiled. I've generally
??>> found that much older bluefish is not to my taste unless
??>> it has been smoked when it can be delicious. Smoked
??>> bluefish might work as nigiri but I've never tried it.

JD> That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it
JD> turned out mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother
JD> and I took a bite of the smoked Blue at the same time and
JD> both of us looked directly at each other wondering if that
JD> awful taste and texture was the same for them. We both
JD> ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the
JD> remainder.

I didn't do the smoking; an enthusiastic fisherman friend did
using a fairly inexpensive smoker. I suspect you want to be
careful about the smoking temperature and, given my friend, the
bluefish was fresh when smoked.

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 16:16:48 GMT, "Musashi" >
wrote:

>
>"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>>Sound)
>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
>> many in
>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if
>> you
>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
>> and bite
>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>> soy or
>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>
>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>
>> --
>> Dan
>
>Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
>First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you never
>see a Bluefish on ice in
>a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh turning
>an unappetizing "grey" hue.
>My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he had
>made sashimi from
>fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
>good".
>And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
>possibly in as little as a few hours.
>One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
>caught are usually caught in
>great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on ice.
>The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the fall
>they feed feed very heavily
>on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
>humans don't eat it.
>Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often so
>oily that they they aren't worth eating.
>If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size, as
>you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
>My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments like
>Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
>and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
>So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes out
>and catches it themselves
>(or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.
>Musashi
>

about 15 years ago i had fresh mackerel - at the insistence of the
itamae. as i was still fairly new to sushi at the time, it didn't
occur to me to ask how he got it.

--------
"any words spelled incorrectly are probably typing errors"

Dan Logcher wrote:
> Gerry wrote:
>
>> On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:
>>
>>> On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long
>>>> Island Sound)
>>>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>>>> cleaned many in
>>>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the
>>>> flesh if you
>>>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>>>> try and bite
>>>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi
>>>> and soy or
>>>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>>
>>>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>
>>>
>>> What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
>>> or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>>>
>>> I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
>>> redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>>>
>>> When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
>>> lemon juice overnight.
>>>
>>> After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>>>
>>> I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
>>> about two pounds each on my favorite size.
>>
>>
>> I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
>> Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
>> stuff good.
>>
>> I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of
>> fish is it really?
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluefish
>
> They put up a great fight, especially the larger ones. I was using my
> light
> tackle with 10# test and having a good time with it.. no leaders so I
> lost a
> couple of my lead-head shad lures. Oh well.
>
>
I'm jealous, I haven't been bluefishing in a while, and I'm also on the
coast of LI Sound in CT. I used to do it all the time when I was a kid,
but just don't have the time now. And the last time I went, about 3-44
years ago, we did more 'hanging out' than fishing. But you've inspired
me to go look for my rod now. And try out some bluefish sashimi....

--
HTTP://www.sushifaq.com/ The Sushi FAQ
HTTP://www.sushifaq.com/sushiotaku/ The Sushi Otaku Blog
HTTP://www.sushifaq.com/sushiyapedia/ Sushi-Ya-Pedia Restaurant Finder
HTTP://www.theteafaq.com/ The Tea FAQ
HTTP://www.jerkyfaq.com/ The Jerky FAQ
HTTP://www.omega3faq.com/ The Omega 3 Fatty Acids FAQ

Musashi wrote:
> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>> Sound)
>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
>> many in
>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh if
>> you
>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
>> and bite
>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>> soy or
>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>
>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>
>> --
>> Dan
>
> Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
> First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you never
> see a Bluefish on ice in
> a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh turning
> an unappetizing "grey" hue.
> My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he had
> made sashimi from
> fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
> good".
> And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
> possibly in as little as a few hours.
> One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
> caught are usually caught in
> great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on ice.
> The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the fall
> they feed feed very heavily
> on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
> humans don't eat it.
> Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often so
> oily that they they aren't worth eating.
> If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size, as
> you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
> My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments like
> Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
> and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
> So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes out
> and catches it themselves
> (or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.
> Musashi
>
>
Musashi... Would you mind sharing the Japanese word for bluefish with me?

--
HTTP://www.sushifaq.com/ The Sushi FAQ
HTTP://www.sushifaq.com/sushiotaku/ The Sushi Otaku Blog
HTTP://www.sushifaq.com/sushiyapedia/ Sushi-Ya-Pedia Restaurant Finder
HTTP://www.theteafaq.com/ The Tea FAQ
HTTP://www.jerkyfaq.com/ The Jerky FAQ
HTTP://www.omega3faq.com/ The Omega 3 Fatty Acids FAQ

War wrote:
> I'm jealous, I haven't been bluefishing in a while, and I'm also on the
> coast of LI Sound in CT. I used to do it all the time when I was a kid,
> but just don't have the time now. And the last time I went, about 3-44
> years ago, we did more 'hanging out' than fishing. But you've inspired
> me to go look for my rod now. And try out some bluefish sashimi....

I stayed at a friend's beach house not more than a stones throw from
the water where his boat was tied in Saybrook. We were out in the sound
within 15 minutes, nice and fast.

I'd love to do that every weekend if I could.. But it takes me almost
2 hours to get to Saybrook from Boston. Now I'm dying to get my own
boat.

--
Dan

"John Doe" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton" >
> wrote:
>
>> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
>> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
>> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
>> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
>> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
>> I've never tried it.
>
> That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned out
> mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of the
> smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
> other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for them.
> We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the remainder.
>
> What method of smoking did you use on yours?
>

I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought home
a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
mistakingly
used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried fish.
The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish itself.
I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine the fish then
air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the mental
note, I just
haven't gone fishing this summer.
M

"War" > wrote in message
...
> Musashi wrote:
>> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>>> Sound)
>>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
>>> many in
>>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh
>>> if you
>>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
>>> and bite
>>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>>> soy or
>>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>
>>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Dan
>>
>> Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
>> First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you
>> never see a Bluefish on ice in
>> a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh
>> turning an unappetizing "grey" hue.
>> My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he
>> had made sashimi from
>> fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
>> good".
>> And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
>> possibly in as little as a few hours.
>> One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
>> caught are usually caught in
>> great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on
>> ice.
>> The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the
>> fall they feed feed very heavily
>> on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
>> humans don't eat it.
>> Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often
>> so oily that they they aren't worth eating.
>> If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size,
>> as you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
>> My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments
>> like Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
>> and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
>> So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes
>> out and catches it themselves
>> (or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.
>> Musashi
>>
>>
> Musashi... Would you mind sharing the Japanese word for bluefish with me?
>

Sure but you won't be impressed.
Buruu fisshu. (bluefish).
That's what the Japanese people call them here in the NY area.
Fact is there are no Bluefish in Japan. Actually I think they exist only in
the Atlantic. There is a name "Amikiri" meaning net-cutter used by Japanese
commericial fishermen who must have run into it in the Atlantic.

M

"barry" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 01 Oct 2007 16:16:48 GMT, "Musashi" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
>>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>>>Sound)
>>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
>>> many in
>>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh
>>> if
>>> you
>>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
>>> and bite
>>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>>> soy or
>>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>
>>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Dan
>>
>>Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
>>First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you never
>>see a Bluefish on ice in
>>a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh turning
>>an unappetizing "grey" hue.
>>My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he had
>>made sashimi from
>>fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
>>good".
>>And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
>>possibly in as little as a few hours.
>>One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
>>caught are usually caught in
>>great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on ice.
>>The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the
>>fall
>>they feed feed very heavily
>>on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
>>humans don't eat it.
>>Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often
>>so
>>oily that they they aren't worth eating.
>>If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size,
>>as
>>you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
>>My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments like
>>Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
>>and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
>>So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes
>>out
>>and catches it themselves
>>(or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.
>>Musashi
>>
>
> about 15 years ago i had fresh mackerel - at the insistence of the
> itamae. as i was still fairly new to sushi at the time, it didn't
> occur to me to ask how he got it.
>

If I had to guess, I'd say that the itamae had fresh mackerel that he got in
to make Shime-saba.
You need sashimi-grade Mackerel to make Shimesaba.
M

"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
> Musashi wrote:
>
>> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long Island
>>>Sound)
>>>and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and cleaned
>>>many in
>>>the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh
>>>if you
>>>want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to try
>>>and bite
>>>straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>>>soy or
>>>maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>
>>>It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>
>>>--
>>>Dan
>>
>>
>> Interesting topic. The problem with Bluefish appears to be twofold.
>> First, the bluefish tends to lose freshness rapidly. This is why you
>> never see a Bluefish on ice in
>> a supermarket that doesn't look like it's 3 days old and the flesh
>> turning an unappetizing "grey" hue.
>> My local Itamae confirmed to me that his finding was the same, that he
>> had made sashimi from
>> fresh caught Bluefish out by Montauk and that it was in his words "quite
>> good".
>> And that he found that Bluefish very quickly become non-sashimi material
>> possibly in as little as a few hours.
>> One of the problems in this regard is that Bluefish, when they are being
>> caught are usually caught in
>> great numbers and few fishermen on partyboats put fish immediately on
>> ice.
>> The other problem with Bluefish is that starting in August and into the
>> fall they feed feed very heavily
>> on Menhaden (aka, Bunker, Mossbunker) whicih is a baitfish so oily that
>> humans don't eat it.
>> Because of this diet in the fall, Bluefish in the 10 lb + class are often
>> so oily that they they aren't worth eating.
>> If one is lucky enough to get a fresh caught bluefish of a smaller size,
>> as you were, I'd certainly do sashimi.
>> My own experience was that it reminded me a bit of Aji, so condiments
>> like Soysauce (or :Ponzu)
>> and Ginger would probably work very well, possibly better than wasabi.
>> So like Mackerel, Bluefish seem to be another fish that unless one goes
>> out and catches it themselves
>> (or knows a person who does) it's nearly impossible to taste as sashimi.
>
> Yes, I was thinking it reminded me of aji.. I knew I should have brought
> some ponzu sauce on the trip. These choppers were full of peanut bunker,
> ralphed up several in the wet-well on the boat.
>
> I've always found that removing the red parts of the flesh from any size
> blue keeps it from tasting oily at all. The only problem I have with it
> is its very flakey, so I have to bake or grill on tinfoil.
>
> Next time I will definately serve up a plate of sashimi.. we just took
> one bit as an experiement.
>
> --
> Dan

Some lemon and olive oil to make a Bluefish carpacio.
Some upscale Manhattan seafood restaiurant was doing
this. Never tried it though.
M

"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
> Gerry wrote:
>
>> On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:
>>
>>> On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>>>
>>>> I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long
>>>> Island Sound)
>>>> and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>>>> cleaned many in
>>>> the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh
>>>> if you
>>>> want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>>>> try and bite
>>>> straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>>>> soy or
>>>> maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>>
>>>> It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>
>>>
>>> What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
>>> or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>>>
>>> I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
>>> redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>>>
>>> When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
>>> lemon juice overnight.
>>>
>>> After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>>>
>>> I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
>>> about two pounds each on my favorite size.
>>
>>
>> I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
>> Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
>> stuff good.
>>
>> I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of fish
>> is it really?
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluefish
>
> They put up a great fight, especially the larger ones. I was using my
> light
> tackle with 10# test and having a good time with it.. no leaders so I lost
> a
> couple of my lead-head shad lures. Oh well.
>

Yes, pound-for-pound it's got to be the toughest fighting
fish and a real blast to catch.
No leader means more hookups, but alot of lost lures and rigs. I remember
being on bluefish partyboats and someone would yell "Bonito". So I'd quickly
get rid of the short wire leader since Bonito have great eyesight but the
Blues would just keep cutting my line nonstop.
M

Musashi wrote:
> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Gerry wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long
>>>>>Island Sound)
>>>>>and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>>>>>cleaned many in
>>>>>the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the flesh
>>>>>if you
>>>>>want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>>>>>try and bite
>>>>>straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi and
>>>>>soy or
>>>>>maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>>>
>>>>>It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
>>>>or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>>>>
>>>>I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
>>>>redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>>>>
>>>>When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
>>>>lemon juice overnight.
>>>>
>>>>After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>>>>
>>>>I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
>>>>about two pounds each on my favorite size.
>>>
>>>
>>>I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
>>>Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
>>>stuff good.
>>>
>>>I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of fish
>>>is it really?
>>
>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluefish
>>
>>They put up a great fight, especially the larger ones. I was using my
>>light
>>tackle with 10# test and having a good time with it.. no leaders so I lost
>>a
>>couple of my lead-head shad lures. Oh well.
>>
>
>
> Yes, pound-for-pound it's got to be the toughest fighting
> fish and a real blast to catch.
> No leader means more hookups, but alot of lost lures and rigs. I remember
> being on bluefish partyboats and someone would yell "Bonito". So I'd quickly
> get rid of the short wire leader since Bonito have great eyesight but the
> Blues would just keep cutting my line nonstop.

I had a blue on, fighting it in and another came long and bit the line
thru.. damn! They also sliced up the silicone rubber shad lure I used
briefly. I tried rigging up some 40# mono as a leader, but I think they
could see it..

--
Dan

"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
> Musashi wrote:
>> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>Gerry wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long
>>>>>>Island Sound)
>>>>>>and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>>>>>>cleaned many in
>>>>>>the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the
>>>>>>flesh if you
>>>>>>want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>>>>>>try and bite
>>>>>>straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi
>>>>>>and soy or
>>>>>>maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
>>>>>or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
>>>>>redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>>>>>
>>>>>When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
>>>>>lemon juice overnight.
>>>>>
>>>>>After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>>>>>
>>>>>I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
>>>>>about two pounds each on my favorite size.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
>>>>Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
>>>>stuff good.
>>>>
>>>>I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of fish
>>>>is it really?
>>>
>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluefish
>>>
>>>They put up a great fight, especially the larger ones. I was using my
>>>light
>>>tackle with 10# test and having a good time with it.. no leaders so I
>>>lost a
>>>couple of my lead-head shad lures. Oh well.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Yes, pound-for-pound it's got to be the toughest fighting
>> fish and a real blast to catch.
>> No leader means more hookups, but alot of lost lures and rigs. I remember
>> being on bluefish partyboats and someone would yell "Bonito". So I'd
>> quickly get rid of the short wire leader since Bonito have great eyesight
>> but the Blues would just keep cutting my line nonstop.
>
> I had a blue on, fighting it in and another came long and bit the line
> thru.. damn! They also sliced up the silicone rubber shad lure I used
> briefly. I tried rigging up some 40# mono as a leader, but I think they
> could see it..
>

I've never used soft lures with Blues since even one fish can pretty much
destroy it. With diamond jigs (and variations),hopkins and other metals I
can get away mostly without any leader.
Bait fishing with fish chunks absolutely needs a leader
but a short one (say 3-4 inches) seems to be enough.
I 've had blues bite right through 40lb mono numerous times.
M

Musashi wrote:
> "Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>Musashi wrote:
>>
>>>"Dan Logcher" > wrote in message
...
>>>
>>>
>>>>Gerry wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>On 2007-10-01 09:10:47 -0700, John Doe > said:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Oct 1, 11:29 am, Dan Logcher > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I was out fishing with a friend this weekend in Connecticut (Long
>>>>>>>Island Sound)
>>>>>>>and we hauled in a couple of small sized blues. I've caught and
>>>>>>>cleaned many in
>>>>>>>the past, and I know you have to remove the red oily parts of the
>>>>>>>flesh if you
>>>>>>>want a mild tasting fish. So, while I was fileting it we decided to
>>>>>>>try and bite
>>>>>>>straight up raw. It was very good, could have used a dab of wasabi
>>>>>>>and soy or
>>>>>>>maybe a ponzu sauce.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>It had a bit of flavor but not very heavy at all.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>What a coincidence! I was just thinking about that very subject a day
>>>>>>or two ago and wondering if Blues would be good as sushi neta.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I've only eaten them cooked until now. I fillet them live, remove the
>>>>>>redline and put the fillets into a baggie and then icewater.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>When I get home, I put them into a marinade of milk with a little
>>>>>>lemon juice overnight.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>After that, I cook them any way I wish and they're always very tastey.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I only go blue fishing when the big ones are running. The fillets are
>>>>>>about two pounds each on my favorite size.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I haven't thought about Bluefish in 30 years. I use to live in New
>>>>>Jersey and we'd buy it fresh from time to time and holy moly was that
>>>>>stuff good.
>>>>>
>>>>>I haven't seen, heard or though of it since. Exactly what kind of fish
>>>>>is it really?
>>>>
>>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bluefish
>>>>
>>>>They put up a great fight, especially the larger ones. I was using my
>>>>light
>>>>tackle with 10# test and having a good time with it.. no leaders so I
>>>>lost a
>>>>couple of my lead-head shad lures. Oh well.
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Yes, pound-for-pound it's got to be the toughest fighting
>>>fish and a real blast to catch.
>>>No leader means more hookups, but alot of lost lures and rigs. I remember
>>>being on bluefish partyboats and someone would yell "Bonito". So I'd
>>>quickly get rid of the short wire leader since Bonito have great eyesight
>>>but the Blues would just keep cutting my line nonstop.
>>
>>I had a blue on, fighting it in and another came long and bit the line
>>thru.. damn! They also sliced up the silicone rubber shad lure I used
>>briefly. I tried rigging up some 40# mono as a leader, but I think they
>>could see it..
>>
>
>
> I've never used soft lures with Blues since even one fish can pretty much
> destroy it. With diamond jigs (and variations),hopkins and other metals I
> can get away mostly without any leader.
> Bait fishing with fish chunks absolutely needs a leader
> but a short one (say 3-4 inches) seems to be enough.
> I 've had blues bite right through 40lb mono numerous times.

I know.. funny part is the eel looking rubber ones were not damaged
but the shad one was trashed in one hit. Too bad, cuz I only had one
shad left and plenty of the eels.

These were 4-5lb blues.. so they probably wouldn't bite the 40lb.
I was really hoping for stripers though.. fun nonetheless.

--
Dan

On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> "John Doe" > wrote in message
>
> oups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton" >
> > wrote:
>
> >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
> >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
> >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
> >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
> >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
> >> I've never tried it.
>
> > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned out
> > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of the
> > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
> > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for them.
> > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the remainder.
>
> > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
>
> I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought home
> a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
> mistakingly
> used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried fish.
> The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
> Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish itself.
> I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine the fish then
> air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the mental
> note, I just
> haven't gone fishing this summer.

I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you doing
with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?

"John Doe" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> > "John Doe" > wrote in message
> >
> > oups.com...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton" >
> > > wrote:
> >
> > >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
> > >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
> > >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
> > >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
> > >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
> > >> I've never tried it.
> >
> > > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned out
> > > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of the
> > > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
> > > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for them.
> > > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the remainder.
> >
> > > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
> >
> > I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought home
> > a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
> > mistakingly
> > used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried fish.
> > The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
> > Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish itself.
> > I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine the fish
then
> > air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the mental
> > note, I just
> > haven't gone fishing this summer.
>
> I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you doing
> with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?
>

For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet brining is
soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then drying.
Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
smoking any kind of fish.
Musashi

On 2007-10-03 17:35:28 -0700, "Musashi" > said:

> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet brining is
> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then drying.
> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
> smoking any kind of fish.

You believe ALL smoking is preceded by brining?
--
///---

"Gerry" > wrote in message
news:2007100320005016807-somewhere@sunnycalif...
> On 2007-10-03 17:35:28 -0700, "Musashi" > said:
>
>> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
>> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
>> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
>> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
>> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
>> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
>> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
>> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
>> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
>> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
>> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet brining
>> is
>> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then
>> drying.
>> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
>> smoking any kind of fish.
>
> You believe ALL smoking is preceded by brining?
> --

No, not "ALL smoking" as that would include meats, cheeses, etc.
I specifically stated "smoking any kind of fish".


Yes, for "smoking any kind of fish", as I stated.
I never said "All" as is in meats, cheese, etc.

On 2007-10-04 07:45:55 -0700, "Musashi" > said:

>> You believe ALL smoking is preceded by brining?
>
> No, not "ALL smoking" as that would include meats, cheeses, etc.
> I specifically stated "smoking any kind of fish".
>
> Yes, for "smoking any kind of fish", as I stated.
> I never said "All" as is in meats, cheese, etc.

Brining cheese?!?

The limitation to fish was implied. I'm acquianted with neither
brining nor smoking and didn't know that they were related.
--
///---

"Gerry" > wrote in message
news:2007100407502175249-somewhere@sunnycalif...
> On 2007-10-04 07:45:55 -0700, "Musashi" > said:
>
>>> You believe ALL smoking is preceded by brining?
>>
>> No, not "ALL smoking" as that would include meats, cheeses, etc.
>> I specifically stated "smoking any kind of fish".
>>
>> Yes, for "smoking any kind of fish", as I stated.
>> I never said "All" as is in meats, cheese, etc.
>
> Brining cheese?!?
>

Ha..no need to brine cheese. Most cheese have salt in them already and
smoking cheese is treally just to add a flavor. But 30 minutes in a smoker
can turn a fairly boring piece of cheese into a pretty tasty treat.

> The limitation to fish was implied. I'm acquianted with neither brining
> nor smoking and didn't know that they were related.
> --

Smoking, drying, salting of fish all are connected in the their origin of
preserving fish.
Removing the water content out of the fish is the key, and in brining the
salt displaces the
water. That's why when you salt a piece of fish and let it sit the water
starts to comes out.

On Oct 3, 8:35 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> "John Doe" > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> > > "John Doe" > wrote in message
>
> > roups.com...
>
> > > > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton" >
> > > > wrote:
>
> > > >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
> > > >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
> > > >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
> > > >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
> > > >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
> > > >> I've never tried it.
>
> > > > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned out
> > > > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of the
> > > > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
> > > > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for them.
> > > > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the remainder.
>
> > > > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
>
> > > I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought home
> > > a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
> > > mistakingly
> > > used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried fish.
> > > The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
> > > Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish itself.
> > > I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine the fish
> then
> > > air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the mental
> > > note, I just
> > > haven't gone fishing this summer.
>
> > I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you doing
> > with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?
>
> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet brining is
> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then drying.
> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
> smoking any kind of fish.
> Musashi

Thank you so much for your description of brining. I've never done it
in my life.

What is a "pelicle"? When you air dry it, you do this in an open
container in your house, or how?

The way I smoke fish is to gut them while very fresh, wash the insides
out nice and clean, and simply put them on the smoker tray. I use
hicory or cherry wood and very low heat for an entire day. The fish
tend to be a slight bit dry, but very, very tastey. I guess it's more
of a dried, smoked fish the way I do it.

I'm looking forward to trying your method.

Thanks again!

"John Doe" > wrote in message
ps.com...
> On Oct 3, 8:35 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
>> "John Doe" > wrote in message
>>
>> ups.com...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
>> > > "John Doe" > wrote in message
>>
>> > roups.com...
>>
>> > > > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton"
>> > > > >
>> > > > wrote:
>>
>> > > >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
>> > > >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
>> > > >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
>> > > >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
>> > > >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
>> > > >> I've never tried it.
>>
>> > > > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned
>> > > > out
>> > > > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of
>> > > > the
>> > > > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
>> > > > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for
>> > > > them.
>> > > > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the
>> > > > remainder.
>>
>> > > > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
>>
>> > > I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought home
>> > > a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
>> > > mistakingly
>> > > used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried fish.
>> > > The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
>> > > Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish
>> > > itself.
>> > > I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine the
>> > > fish
>> then
>> > > air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the
>> > > mental
>> > > note, I just
>> > > haven't gone fishing this summer.
>>
>> > I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you doing
>> > with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?
>>
>> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
>> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
>> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
>> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
>> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
>> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
>> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
>> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
>> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
>> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
>> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet brining
>> is
>> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then
>> drying.
>> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
>> smoking any kind of fish.
>> Musashi
>
> Thank you so much for your description of brining. I've never done it
> in my life.
>
> What is a "pelicle"? When you air dry it, you do this in an open
> container in your house, or how?

A pelicle is the dry hardened crust or "shell" that forms over the fish
after it's been brined
and air dryed. Originally I thought it was merely "dried tissue" but someone
told me
that it had something to do with a change in the protein structure.
The pelicle traps the remaining moisture and oils in the fish during the
smoking process.

When I air dry the brined fish, I do it in the kitchen and I use a very
small fan to keep air moving
over it. Not "on it" but "over it".

> The way I smoke fish is to gut them while very fresh, wash the insides
> out nice and clean, and simply put them on the smoker tray. I use
> hicory or cherry wood and very low heat for an entire day.

Yes I use cherry, hickoy or apple. Usually about 8 hours in the smoker.

> The fish tend to be a slight bit dry, but very, very tastey. I guess it's
> more
> of a dried, smoked fish the way I do it.
> I'm looking forward to trying your method.

May I ask you, do you find your finished product in need of salt?
Also what species of fish do you use?

Musashi

On Oct 5, 10:54 am, "Musashi" > wrote:
> "John Doe" > wrote in message
>
> ps.com...

> > On Oct 3, 8:35 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> >> "John Doe" > wrote in message
>
> roups.com...
>
> >> > On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> >> > > "John Doe" > wrote in message
>
> >> > roups.com...
>
> >> > > > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton"
> >> > > > >
> >> > > > wrote:
>
> >> > > >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was at
> >> > > >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
> >> > > >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
> >> > > >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked when
> >> > > >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
> >> > > >> I've never tried it.
>
> >> > > > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it turned
> >> > > > out
> >> > > > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite of
> >> > > > the
> >> > > > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at each
> >> > > > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same for
> >> > > > them.
> >> > > > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the
> >> > > > remainder.
>
> >> > > > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
>
> >> > > I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought home
> >> > > a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
> >> > > mistakingly
> >> > > used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried fish.
> >> > > The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
> >> > > Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish
> >> > > itself.
> >> > > I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine the
> >> > > fish
> >> then
> >> > > air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the
> >> > > mental
> >> > > note, I just
> >> > > haven't gone fishing this summer.
>
> >> > I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you doing
> >> > with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?
>
> >> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
> >> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
> >> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
> >> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
> >> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
> >> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
> >> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
> >> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
> >> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
> >> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
> >> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet brining
> >> is
> >> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then
> >> drying.
> >> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
> >> smoking any kind of fish.
> >> Musashi
>
> > Thank you so much for your description of brining. I've never done it
> > in my life.
>
> > What is a "pelicle"? When you air dry it, you do this in an open
> > container in your house, or how?
>
> A pelicle is the dry hardened crust or "shell" that forms over the fish
> after it's been brined
> and air dryed. Originally I thought it was merely "dried tissue" but someone
> told me
> that it had something to do with a change in the protein structure.
> The pelicle traps the remaining moisture and oils in the fish during the
> smoking process.

That's very interesting. Do you use regular table salt? I found a very
good article about smoking fish at:
http://www.3men.com/allabout.htm

I understand how a pellicle is created and exactly what it is. I was
thinking it was a crust of salt, but it's really just a "skin" that is
formed because of the salt.

> When I air dry the brined fish, I do it in the kitchen and I use a very
> small fan to keep air moving
> over it. Not "on it" but "over it".

I got the impression from that article that even with a brine bath,
the air drying is needed and that a pellicle would form on the fish.
Am I going in the wrong direction here?

> > The way I smoke fish is to gut them while very fresh, wash the insides
> > out nice and clean, and simply put them on the smoker tray. I use
> > hicory or cherry wood and very low heat for an entire day.
>
> Yes I use cherry, hickoy or apple. Usually about 8 hours in the smoker.
>
> > The fish tend to be a slight bit dry, but very, very tastey. I guess it's
> > more of a dried, smoked fish the way I do it.
> > I'm looking forward to trying your method.
>
> May I ask you, do you find your finished product in need of salt?

Yes, however, I'm one of those people who love salt. I put it on
almost everything. A few years ago, a doctor told me after witnessing
my use of salt that I used as much in one meal as he did in a week. I
just love it.

> Also what species of fish do you use?

My favorite fish to smoke in the whole world is "Whiting", or Southern
Kingfish. It's size and type of meat is so perfect for smoking that it
turns out perfect each time and has a flavor that is truly awesome.

This is the same fish that I now use as sushi neta also. It's really
good. Now I'm going to try the brining method of smoking and that in
turn may be good as neta. Have you used any of your smoked fish as
neta?

"John Doe" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> On Oct 5, 10:54 am, "Musashi" > wrote:
> > "John Doe" > wrote in message
> >
> > ps.com...
>
> > > On Oct 3, 8:35 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> > >> "John Doe" > wrote in message
> >
> > roups.com...
> >
> > >> > On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
> > >> > > "John Doe" > wrote in message
> >
> > >> > roups.com...
> >
> > >> > > > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton"
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > wrote:
> >
> > >> > > >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was
at
> > >> > > >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
> > >> > > >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
> > >> > > >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked
when
> > >> > > >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
> > >> > > >> I've never tried it.
> >
> > >> > > > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it
turned
> > >> > > > out
> > >> > > > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite
of
> > >> > > > the
> > >> > > > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at
each
> > >> > > > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same
for
> > >> > > > them.
> > >> > > > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the
> > >> > > > remainder.
> >
> > >> > > > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
> >
> > >> > > I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought
home
> > >> > > a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
> > >> > > mistakingly
> > >> > > used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried
fish.
> > >> > > The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
> > >> > > Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish
> > >> > > itself.
> > >> > > I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine
the
> > >> > > fish
> > >> then
> > >> > > air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the
> > >> > > mental
> > >> > > note, I just
> > >> > > haven't gone fishing this summer.
> >
> > >> > I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you
doing
> > >> > with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?
> >
> > >> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
> > >> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
> > >> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
> > >> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
> > >> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
> > >> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
> > >> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
> > >> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
> > >> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
> > >> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
> > >> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet
brining
> > >> is
> > >> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then
> > >> drying.
> > >> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
> > >> smoking any kind of fish.
> > >> Musashi
> >
> > > Thank you so much for your description of brining. I've never done it
> > > in my life.
> >
> > > What is a "pelicle"? When you air dry it, you do this in an open
> > > container in your house, or how?
> >
> > A pelicle is the dry hardened crust or "shell" that forms over the fish
> > after it's been brined
> > and air dryed. Originally I thought it was merely "dried tissue" but
someone
> > told me
> > that it had something to do with a change in the protein structure.
> > The pelicle traps the remaining moisture and oils in the fish during the
> > smoking process.
>
> That's very interesting. Do you use regular table salt? I found a very
> good article about smoking fish at:
> http://www.3men.com/allabout.htm
>

I use Sea Salt most of the time.
Sometimes I'll use Kosher Salt in which case
the quantity goes up a bit.

> I understand how a pellicle is created and exactly what it is. I was
> thinking it was a crust of salt, but it's really just a "skin" that is
> formed because of the salt.
>
> > When I air dry the brined fish, I do it in the kitchen and I use a very
> > small fan to keep air moving
> > over it. Not "on it" but "over it".
>
> I got the impression from that article that even with a brine bath,
> the air drying is needed and that a pellicle would form on the fish.
> Am I going in the wrong direction here?
>

I think you are right.

> > > The way I smoke fish is to gut them while very fresh, wash the insides
> > > out nice and clean, and simply put them on the smoker tray. I use
> > > hicory or cherry wood and very low heat for an entire day.
> >
> > Yes I use cherry, hickoy or apple. Usually about 8 hours in the smoker.
> >
> > > The fish tend to be a slight bit dry, but very, very tastey. I guess
it's
> > > more of a dried, smoked fish the way I do it.
> > > I'm looking forward to trying your method.
> >
> > May I ask you, do you find your finished product in need of salt?
>
> Yes, however, I'm one of those people who love salt. I put it on
> almost everything. A few years ago, a doctor told me after witnessing
> my use of salt that I used as much in one meal as he did in a week. I
> just love it.
>

After brining you may find no need to "add" abny salt to
your finished smoked product.

> > Also what species of fish do you use?
>
> My favorite fish to smoke in the whole world is "Whiting", or Southern
> Kingfish. It's size and type of meat is so perfect for smoking that it
> turns out perfect each time and has a flavor that is truly awesome.
>
> This is the same fish that I now use as sushi neta also. It's really
> good. Now I'm going to try the brining method of smoking and that in
> turn may be good as neta. Have you used any of your smoked fish as
> neta?

I have no experience with Southern Kingfish at all since it's not caught
locally
and it's not sold here either.
I have never used any fish I smoked as sushi neta and that, going back, has
to
do with the amount of salt I use. If I intended to use it for sushi I would
use far less
or perhaps no salt at all.
I am not aware of any smoked fish being used as sushi neta in Japan,
although
cold-smoked salmon does appear sometimes as nigiri.
However, I've had oshi-zushi (pressed sushi) using grilled mackerel and from
the taste I am certain
that smoked mackerel woud make excellent neta. If it won't sit on a nigiri
well, I'd
put it into a maki.
M

>
>
>

On Sat, 6 Oct 2007 17:36:54 -0400, "Musashi" >
wrote:

>
>"John Doe" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>> On Oct 5, 10:54 am, "Musashi" > wrote:
>> > "John Doe" > wrote in message
>> >
>> > ps.com...
>>
>> > > On Oct 3, 8:35 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
>> > >> "John Doe" > wrote in message
>> >
>> > roups.com...
>> >
>> > >> > On Oct 1, 3:28 pm, "Musashi" > wrote:
>> > >> > > "John Doe" > wrote in message
>> >
>> > >> > roups.com...
>> >
>> > >> > > > On Oct 1, 12:47 pm, "James Silverton"
>> > >> > > > >
>> > >> > > > wrote:
>> >
>> > >> > > >> I've only once had very fresh bluefish. Interestingly, it was
>at
>> > >> > > >> Montauk and the fisherman brought it to the house on his way
>> > >> > > >> home. It was very good broiled. I've generally found that much
>> > >> > > >> older bluefish is not to my taste unless it has been smoked
>when
>> > >> > > >> it can be delicious. Smoked bluefish might work as nigiri but
>> > >> > > >> I've never tried it.
>> >
>> > >> > > > That's interesting, James. I tried Blues smoked once and it
>turned
>> > >> > > > out
>> > >> > > > mushy. The same for Red Bass. Both my Brother and I took a bite
>of
>> > >> > > > the
>> > >> > > > smoked Blue at the same time and both of us looked directly at
>each
>> > >> > > > other wondering if that awful taste and texture was the same
>for
>> > >> > > > them.
>> > >> > > > We both ended up spitting out the one bite and trashing the
>> > >> > > > remainder.
>> >
>> > >> > > > What method of smoking did you use on yours?
>> >
>> > >> > > I know exactly what you are talking about. Last year I brought
>home
>> > >> > > a small bluefish (accidentally caught while fluke fishing!) and I
>> > >> > > mistakingly
>> > >> > > used wet brining. That's how they brine Aji in Japan for dried
>fish.
>> > >> > > The result after coming out of the smoker was a very mushy fish.
>> > >> > > Clearly I had miscalculated the high water content of the fish
>> > >> > > itself.
>> > >> > > I made a metal note to myself that next time I would dry brine
>the
>> > >> > > fish
>> > >> then
>> > >> > > air dry first before putting in the smoker. I still remember the
>> > >> > > mental
>> > >> > > note, I just
>> > >> > > haven't gone fishing this summer.
>> >
>> > >> > I've never done any "brining" of any type. What exactly are you
>doing
>> > >> > with the brining and why, how does it work and how is it done?
>> >
>> > >> For dry brining I use a mixture of salt and sugar.
>> > >> Sometimes I'll use brown sugar. I sometimes add
>> > >> herbs and spices, sometimes fresh cracked black
>> > >> pepper all depending on how I feel that day.
>> > >> For a whole fish I wrap it in aluminum foil and smother
>> > >> with the mixture. One day in the fridge and the salt will
>> > >> have displaced the water in the fish. Then I wash it all off
>> > >> and air dry to form a pelicle. Then into the smoker.
>> > >> I use trout, mackerel, butterfish for whole smoked.
>> > >> For non-whole fish I limit the brining time since the salt is
>> > >> absorbed much faster through the flesh as compared to skin. Wet
>brining
>> > >> is
>> > >> soaking the fish in a water amd salt mixture for several hours then
>> > >> drying.
>> > >> Either way, I was under the impression that this process was basic to
>> > >> smoking any kind of fish.
>> > >> Musashi
>> >
>> > > Thank you so much for your description of brining. I've never done it
>> > > in my life.
>> >
>> > > What is a "pelicle"? When you air dry it, you do this in an open
>> > > container in your house, or how?
>> >
>> > A pelicle is the dry hardened crust or "shell" that forms over the fish
>> > after it's been brined
>> > and air dryed. Originally I thought it was merely "dried tissue" but
>someone
>> > told me
>> > that it had something to do with a change in the protein structure.
>> > The pelicle traps the remaining moisture and oils in the fish during the
>> > smoking process.
>>
>> That's very interesting. Do you use regular table salt? I found a very
>> good article about smoking fish at:
>> http://www.3men.com/allabout.htm
>>
>
>I use Sea Salt most of the time.
>Sometimes I'll use Kosher Salt in which case
>the quantity goes up a bit.
>
>> I understand how a pellicle is created and exactly what it is. I was
>> thinking it was a crust of salt, but it's really just a "skin" that is
>> formed because of the salt.
>>
>> > When I air dry the brined fish, I do it in the kitchen and I use a very
>> > small fan to keep air moving
>> > over it. Not "on it" but "over it".
>>
>> I got the impression from that article that even with a brine bath,
>> the air drying is needed and that a pellicle would form on the fish.
>> Am I going in the wrong direction here?
>>
>
>I think you are right.
>
>> > > The way I smoke fish is to gut them while very fresh, wash the insides
>> > > out nice and clean, and simply put them on the smoker tray. I use
>> > > hicory or cherry wood and very low heat for an entire day.
>> >
>> > Yes I use cherry, hickoy or apple. Usually about 8 hours in the smoker.
>> >
>> > > The fish tend to be a slight bit dry, but very, very tastey. I guess
>it's
>> > > more of a dried, smoked fish the way I do it.
>> > > I'm looking forward to trying your method.
>> >
>> > May I ask you, do you find your finished product in need of salt?
>>
>> Yes, however, I'm one of those people who love salt. I put it on
>> almost everything. A few years ago, a doctor told me after witnessing
>> my use of salt that I used as much in one meal as he did in a week. I
>> just love it.
>>
>
>After brining you may find no need to "add" abny salt to
>your finished smoked product.
>
>> > Also what species of fish do you use?
>>
>> My favorite fish to smoke in the whole world is "Whiting", or Southern
>> Kingfish. It's size and type of meat is so perfect for smoking that it
>> turns out perfect each time and has a flavor that is truly awesome.
>>
>> This is the same fish that I now use as sushi neta also. It's really
>> good. Now I'm going to try the brining method of smoking and that in
>> turn may be good as neta. Have you used any of your smoked fish as
>> neta?
>
>I have no experience with Southern Kingfish at all since it's not caught
>locally
>and it's not sold here either.
>I have never used any fish I smoked as sushi neta and that, going back, has
>to
>do with the amount of salt I use. If I intended to use it for sushi I would
>use far less
>or perhaps no salt at all.
>I am not aware of any smoked fish being used as sushi neta in Japan,
>although
>cold-smoked salmon does appear sometimes as nigiri.
>However, I've had oshi-zushi (pressed sushi) using grilled mackerel and from
>the taste I am certain
>that smoked mackerel woud make excellent neta. If it won't sit on a nigiri
>well, I'd
>put it into a maki.
>M

The smoked Whiting has a very delicate taste and the flesh is firm for
slicing while still holding moisture in the fish.

It must only be a line and hook fish. I never see any on the sea going
boats. After 30 years of eating it, I never get tired of it. It's good
in all the ways a fish can be cooked, or not.

Thank you for all the information you've given me. I'll be trying
brining on the next batch of fish in my smoker.