I've mentioned a few times in recent posts that I have been interested
in obtaining a charcoal fired brazier and kettle set. I've been
searching but having a bit of trouble finding anything online beyond
maybe three or four antique ones and none of which match the style I
was hoping for. I am looking for a cylinder brazier (it can be clay or
metal - NOT silver) and a kettle that has a more traditional kettle
shape meant to pour from (again clay or metal - no silver - is fine).
Many are the round braziers and round no-spout kettles. I have seen
them as I described above in use so I know they exist, I just cannot
find them and I'm not sure if it is a terminology thing that I am not
searching for the right name. Possibly the cylindrical brazier and
traditional kettles are not Japanese and therefore not furo gama, but
I am not familiar with another name. Hopefully someone here holds the
key.

Thanks,
- Dominic

in cup: Song Zhong Dan Cong

On 2009-01-03, Dominic T. > wrote:

> I've mentioned a few times in recent posts that I have been interested
> in obtaining a charcoal fired brazier and kettle set. I've been
> searching but having a bit of trouble finding anything online beyond
> maybe three or four antique ones and none of which match the style I
> was hoping for. I am looking for a cylinder brazier (it can be clay or
> metal - NOT silver) and a kettle that has a more traditional kettle
> shape meant to pour from (again clay or metal - no silver - is fine).
> Many are the round braziers and round no-spout kettles. I have seen
> them as I described above in use so I know they exist, I just cannot
> find them and I'm not sure if it is a terminology thing that I am not
> searching for the right name. Possibly the cylindrical brazier and
> traditional kettles are not Japanese and therefore not furo gama, but
> I am not familiar with another name. Hopefully someone here holds the
> key.

First off: be VERY careful about using a charcoal stove inside. I've
talked to people who say you should not do it at all. If you do it,
please make sure you have adequate ventilation.

If you mean the Chinese earthenware or metal cylindrical stoves
sometimes used in Chaozhou style gong fu, I think the Chinese name would
usually be something like lu2 tan4 (charcoal stove) or ni2 lu2 (clay
stove). I can't easily put in 8 bit characters here, so look them up on
nciku.com if you want to know the actual characters. They're basically a
smaller version of traditional Chinese cooking stoves.

Most of the ones I know of are intended to use with very small,
side-handled kettles.

See also http://teadrunk.org/viewtopic.php?id=45 and, to a lesser
extent, http://teadrunk.org/viewtopic.php?id=64, as well as
http://www.teachat.com/viewtopic.php?p=85055,
http://www.teachat.com/viewtopic.php?t=7206

if you're interested in these specifically. Some of these are available
pretty cheaply in China (like $5-10 US, maybe cheaper), but the quality
seems to vary widely, and it's not easy to order them directly at any
rate.

Wing Hop Fung (in LA) carries some (cheap-ish) stoves that may or may
not work - they are the right shape and have the right sort of grate,
but I believe it's the wrong type of clay, and I believe I've heard of
one cracking from using it with charcoal.

Imen of Tea Obsession sometimes carries the clay stoves, but they're
quite expensive (about $175 - $200 for the set), and are only available
sometimes.

Other than vendors who sell antique braziers for Japanese tea
ceremonies, those are the main two places in the west I know of that
sell tea-specific charcoal stoves (though you could use a camping stove
of some sort).

You might be able to get away with using one of the tiny square charcoal
stoves used for Japanese / Korean table-top grilling. The charcoal used
for this is also appropriate. The main thing that's tricky is finding
one that fits whatever kettle you're planning on using.

Lin's in Taiwan (their site hasn't been reachable recently) sells some
larger kettle / stove combinations, but I'm not 100% sure which (if any)
of them are suitable for using with charcoal rather than a candle or
alcohol burner.

There are a few people who might be able to assist you in ordering such
a set from China or Taiwan. A few are mentioned in the threads above.
Keep in mind that the ones suitable for using charcoal with tend to be
fairly fragile, and they're also heavy... this means that shipping one
will be expensive and risky.

w

On Jan 3, 6:20*pm, Will Yardley >
wrote:
> There are a few people who might be able to assist you in ordering such
> a set from China or Taiwan. A few are mentioned in the threads above.
> Keep in mind that the ones suitable for using charcoal with tend to be
> fairly fragile, and they're also heavy... this means that shipping one
> will be expensive and risky.
>
> w

Wow, thank you so much... very helpful and maybe I can now finally end
my quest. I won't be using it indoors so no worries, I'm an avid
outdoorsman and plan to use it while sitting on my deck that overhangs
the woods in my back yard. I also have plans to build a small outdoor
tea room near the woods which is where it will find a permanent home.
I'm more familiar with Japanese teaware (beyond the more common
Chinese standards) so I figured there was a Chinese version and more
availability than 60+ year old antiques priced in the thousands. I
don't mind spending for a quality product because it will get a lot of
use. I was hoping for the earthenware type. I'll have time to look
tomorrow, if I hit any snags I'll post a followup here.

Thanks again!
- Dominic

On Jan 3, 6:20*pm, Will Yardley >
wrote:
> There are a few people who might be able to assist you in ordering such
> a set from China or Taiwan. A few are mentioned in the threads above.
> Keep in mind that the ones suitable for using charcoal with tend to be
> fairly fragile, and they're also heavy... this means that shipping one
> will be expensive and risky.
>
> w

Well, it seems that I've hit another wall. I did email Imen as it
still seems the only online source, and yes that was the exact one I
had seen used and wanted. Yellow/orangish (forgive me I am slightly
color blind) earthenware. If you or anyone here knows of or could
obtain and ship one of these I would be happy to work with you and
compensate the effort. I did find a Kamjove K-501 which is an alcohol
brazier and glass kettle set but again no sellers outside of alibaba,
it seems to be priced around $40-50 if I am correct.

Thanks,
- Dominic

On Jan 3, 2:15*pm, "Dominic T." > wrote:
> I've mentioned a few times in recent posts that I have been interested
> in obtaining a charcoal fired brazier and kettle set. I've been
> searching but having a bit of trouble finding anything online beyond
> maybe three or four antique ones and none of which match the style I
> was hoping for. I am looking for a cylinder brazier (it can be clay or
> metal - NOT silver) and a kettle that has a more traditional kettle
> shape meant to pour from (again clay or metal - no silver - is fine).
> Many are the round braziers and round no-spout kettles. I have seen
> them as I described above in use so I know they exist, I just cannot
> find them and I'm not sure if it is a terminology thing that I am not
> searching for the right name. Possibly the cylindrical brazier and
> traditional kettles are not Japanese and therefore not furo gama, but
> I am not familiar with another name. Hopefully someone here holds the
> key.
>
> Thanks,
> - Dominic
>
> in cup: Song Zhong Dan Cong

Jim had asked in a different thread that I post a link to the exact
brazier/kettle set I am speaking about and so that in case someone
spies one or has access to them I may still conquer my quest. So here
is the exact one I had hoped to find:
http://tea-obsession.blogspot.com/20...olive-pit.html

I don't need the olive pit charcoal (although that is fine too if
obtainable). I mainly just need the brazier and kettle.

If all hope is lost and no one can help I may just make my own metal
brazier or re purpose a charcoal chimney starter, but I'd still love
to find a kettle like the one in that set to use with it if anyone
knows where I could even find just that or a similar earthenware
kettle capable of direct heating. I've never tried to directly heat a
Yixing... I may have to get an inexpensive one as a guinea pig to test
with.

Thanks,
- Dominic

Another list I am on has had a lot of in depth discussion on water
lately. One of the parameters being debated is how fast the water is
heated. Is this the draw of the Brazier style rigs and olive charcoal?
To heat the water faster? And what effect does that have on the
ultimate brew?

Mike

www.pu-erh.net

On Jan 5, 3:17*pm, Mike Petro > wrote:
> Another list I am on has had a lot of in depth discussion on water
> lately. One of the parameters being debated is how fast the water is
> heated. Is this the draw of the Brazier style rigs and olive charcoal?
> To heat the water faster? And what effect does that have on the
> ultimate brew?
>
> Mike
>
> www.pu-erh.net

For me it is more of the tradition of it, I like to enjoy my tea in a
more "rustic" and old school manner. The idea is that just like bamboo
charcoal which people add to their kettles now with modern stoves/
kettles this original method of porous earthenware kettle absorbs some
of the effects of the charcoal which reaches the water also. The olive
pit charcoal is low smoke and I'd imagine from a hard wood so in
theory it would produce solid heat. I hear it is a PITA to get lit but
once cooking I'd think it to be similar to a gas range on medium to
high-medium heat, although the earthenware pot is probably a touch
slower to heat than a metal kettle on a stove. As you stated in your
discussion elsewhere speed is something debated but from my reading
too fast is not always best and unlike Puerh/red tea most of the teas
I drink do not need heavily boiling water with Dan Congs probably
being the neediest.

My guess is a bit of a softer brew ala Yixing as the outcome. My
personal reason is that to sit outside near the woods behind my home
and watch the real heat/fire boil my water while relaxing or
meditating is just about the apex I could hope for in my enjoyment of
tea... an extension cord and loud kettle just isn't the same Just
kidding but before I began this quest I had planned to use a cast iron
pot and a fire in my fire pit, but then someone mentioned the rusting
factor which I hadn't considered in my vision of days gone by.

- Dominic

On 2009-01-05, Mike Petro > wrote:

> Another list I am on has had a lot of in depth discussion on water
> lately. One of the parameters being debated is how fast the water is
> heated. Is this the draw of the Brazier style rigs and olive charcoal?
> To heat the water faster? And what effect does that have on the
> ultimate brew?

The fragrance of the charcoal and the clay from the unglazed pot do seem
to slightly improve the water.

In my experience, it doesn't tend to heat the water quite as fast as
you'd think, but it is definitely faster than an alcohol burner, and
because the kettle is small, it reboils fairly quickly. Also, for the
same reason, you can boil just enough water for one brew very easily,
and it will be mostly fresh water. That said, most of the people I know
who use one tend to "feed" it water that's already hot, unless they're
in a very relaxed, patient mood.

Also, the act of tending the fire either enhances the experience or is a
total pain in the butt, depending on how you prefer to look at it. :>

w

On Jan 5, 12:17*pm, Mike Petro > wrote:
> Another list I am on has had a lot of in depth discussion on water
> lately. One of the parameters being debated is how fast the water is
> heated. Is this the draw of the Brazier style rigs and olive charcoal?
> To heat the water faster? And what effect does that have on the
> ultimate brew?
>
> Mike
>
> www.pu-erh.net

In my experience, slowly heated water results in a more
"even" taste of tea, while quickly heated water adds some
bite. It doesn't make as much difference as the method
of heating.

On Jan 3, 11:15*am, "Dominic T." > wrote:
> I've mentioned a few times in recent posts that I have been interested
> in obtaining a charcoal fired brazier and kettle set.

I joined this thread a bit late, but I've seen what I think is exactly
the sort of traditional stone tea brazier and kettle that you might be
looking for. Best Tea House Co, based in Hong Kong but with stores in
Canada and Japan, sells some very hard to find teaware, and the last
time I was in their Vancouver B.C. store stone braziers of this type
caught my eye. At the time I remember thinking that perhaps it would
be useful in trying T'ang dynasty style brewing per Lu Yu, but they
didn't have a wheel-style tea grinder in stock.

I couldn't find a working online store front, sorry to say, but if you
find yourself in the Vancouver or Hong Kong sometime...

On Jan 28, 5:13*pm, Iggy > wrote:
> I couldn't find a working online store front, sorry to say, but if you
> find yourself in the Vancouver or Hong Kong sometime...

Hey no problem, better late than never. Chou Zhou is actually more the
origin as far as I know, but I'm sure stone braziers and the like
existed before. Dan Congs especially tend to be the tea brewed this
way. I've seen the Taoist wheel grinders in use and it is interesting,
I've always looked for one as a cool decoration. I'd love to find
myself in either HK or Vancouver but I doubt I will see either this
year... especially HK. I'll see if I can find a phone number, I'll let
my fingers do the walking, thanks for the heads up though.

- Dominic

On 2009-01-28, Iggy > wrote:
> On Jan 3, 11:15*am, "Dominic T." > wrote:

>> I've mentioned a few times in recent posts that I have been
>> interested in obtaining a charcoal fired brazier and kettle set.

> I joined this thread a bit late, but I've seen what I think is exactly
> the sort of traditional stone tea brazier and kettle that you might be
> looking for. Best Tea House Co, based in Hong Kong but with stores in
> Canada and Japan, sells some very hard to find teaware, and the last
> time I was in their Vancouver B.C. store stone braziers of this type
> caught my eye.

I have seen one of the Lin's earthenware kettle / alcohol lamp sets
there (at the Richmond shop), but not a Japanese style brazier. They
will do mail order; the owner of the Richmond / Vancouver location has
email but doesn't use it much, so calling is usually better.

I put the phone # and some pictures of the shop at:
http://www.teachat.com/viewtopic.php?p=61618

BTH's main site is:
http://besttea.com.hk/
(warning; the second site will attempt to resize your browser window if
you don't have it disabled)

I did see a cool brazier with an electric heating element at Hankook...
similar to (though not as pretty as) these ones:
http://mattchasblog.blogspot.com/200...ier-style.html

I think you can get a normal Japanese style charcoal brazier at Japanese
antique stores.

w

On 2009-01-29, Dominic T. > wrote:

> Hey no problem, better late than never. Chou Zhou is actually more the
> origin as far as I know, but I'm sure stone braziers and the like
> existed before.

I could be wrong, but I think the style of brazier used in Japanese (and
old Chinese) tea ceremony way predates the Chaozhou stoves, probably by
at least 800-1000 years.

w

On Jan 28, 8:29*pm, Will Yardley >
wrote:
> On 2009-01-29, Dominic T. > wrote:
>
> > Hey no problem, better late than never. Chou Zhou is actually more the
> > origin as far as I know, but I'm sure stone braziers and the like
> > existed before.
>
> I could be wrong, but I think the style of brazier used in Japanese (and
> old Chinese) tea ceremony way predates the Chaozhou stoves, probably by
> at least 800-1000 years.
>
> w

Yes, I just meant the ones I was talking about in this thread... I'm
sure fire and kettle predates them all and then the concentration of
heat and specialized use slowly evolved into the chimney/brazier and
tea kettle. The earthenware/iron/metal split is the one I'd love to
learn more about. Because long after metal was common earthenware
continued on. I find that interesting because I have an aversion to
metal in my brewing, but I would consider an iron kettle if only it
wouldn't be rust in days.

- Dominic